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Veterans History Project
Clare Yenor
(00:56:59)
(00:10) Background Information
•
•
•
•
•

Clare was born on a farm in Michigan on March 8, 1921
They later moved to another small town in Michigan where his father was a butcher and
owned his own grocery store
Clare’s father’s appendix ruptured and he died when Clare was just 7 years old
His mother tried to continue running the store for a while, but she was also taking care of
four children
Clare graduated from high school in 1939 and began working on houses

(5:30) Enlistment
•
•
•
•
•
•

Clare enlisted in the Army in April of 1942
He was inducted in Detroit and then sent to Fort Sill, Oklahoma for training
They were marching, following orders, and training in rough terrain
There were many men there from Michigan and the rest were from the South
Clare went through basic training for the first couple of weeks and then went through
artillery training
They trained altogether for 13 weeks

(12:30) Transferred
•
•
•
•

Clare was later transferred to the 215th Field Artillery Battalion and they began training
with gliders at Fort Bragg, North Carolina
Clare was part of the first unit to get involved with glider planes during WWII
He spent 1.5 years training in North Carolina
During that time he only had one week leave to come back to Michigan, but at that point
he did meet the woman who would later become his wife

(17:25) Nebraska
•
•
•

Clare was part of a cadre that was sent to Nebraska to work with the 82nd and 101st
Airborne Divisions
They were training other officers to work with gliders; how to land and carry supplies
Clare worked with C-47 transport planes, loading supplies and jeeps

�• He then began working with a heavy artillery unit
(22:00) Traveling Overseas
•
•
•
•
•
•
•

Clare was shipped out of the US right after D-Day in a Liberty Ship from New York
The ship was already slow on top of the zig zag course they had to take to avoid
submarines
They landed in England and then traveled to La Havre, France where they waited for
supplies
Clare was part of a reserve artillery unity of the 3rd Army, answering to General Patton
There were many damaged buildings in France and not many civilians around
Clare had some time on leave in Paris; he visited the amusement park and went to a
burlesque show
He bartered with American cigarettes and stayed in a nice hotel

(26:45) Continuously Moving
•
•
•
•
•

Clare’s unit continuously moved all over France and had to sleep in foxholes
Three men died the first night because they were not sleeping in their fox holes
Clare was the chief of section of a gun section and felt like he was a baby sitter
He did not like his job of keeping track of and watching all the other men
He was also in charge of watching over the ammunition corporal

(32:20) Battle of the Bulge
•
•
•
•

Clare was working with very large and loud artillery that could blow one’s ears out
Sometimes they were ordered to fire at will and others they used a timing device
They were working in the Ardennes Forest during the winter and it was very cold; none
of the men have been given the proper winter attire
They were continuously moving and attacked by Germans, who were very fast and
accurate

(38:30) Traveling through the Ardennes
•
•
•
•
•

There were many trucks and other vehicles traveling through the Ardennes carrying guns
and equipment
Many got stuck and could not make it through the icy terrain
Their guns would never freeze up, but they did have to be careful cleaning them
Clare was with the first group to cross the Rhine after the engineers had built pontoon
bridges
He expected lots of resistance, but faced almost none

�(44:55) German Soldiers
•
•
•
•

Most of the German soldiers were just ordinary people that had been forced to fight, but
the SS were very strict and greedy
The SS looked better fed, trained, disciplined, and equipped
After the war most of the German citizens avoided the American soldiers
Clare traveled around Germany in trucks moving German POWs

(49:35) The End of the War
•
•
•
•
•
•
•

The government was dividing up men to be sent home based upon how many points they
had earned
Clare had very few points because he had no dependants and did not get wounded
Clare was in Austria when he heard that he could finally go home
He was sent back to France and left on a ship from Marseille
They took a Liberty Ship home and the ride was much nicer than the one to Europe
Clare was discharged shortly after arriving back in the US
He got married that April and worked for Consumers Energy for 30 years before retiring

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                <text>Clare Yenor was born in 1921 and lived on a farm in Michigan. He enlisted in the Army in April of 1942. Clare went through basic training in Oklahoma, and after that began artillery training with the 215th Field Artillery Battalion. The 125th was one of the first groups to begin training with glider planes during WWII. Yenor later trained the officers of the 182nd and 101st Airborne Divisions to work with the gliders. He was then assigned to a heavy artillery battalion attached to the 3rd Army in Europe, participating in the Battle of the Bulge, the crossing of the Rhine, and the occupation of Germany and Austria. Photographs, certificates, and medals are addended to the interview outline.</text>
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                    <text>Grand Valley State University
Grand Valley State University Veterans History project
Interviewee‟s name: Kevin Yeomans
Length of Interview: (01:17:25)
Date of Interview: November 16, 2017
Interviewed by: James Smither
Transcribed by: Madison Vander Lugt
Interviewer: “So we're talking today with Kevin Yeomans of Jenison, Michigan, and the
interviewer is James Smither of the Grand Valley State University Veterans History
Project. I start us off with some background on yourself and to begin with, where and when
were you born?”
I was born in Grand Rapids on September 30, 1986. I stayed in West Michigan for my childhood,
moved around a bit. Comstock Park, Grandville, Wyoming, Kentwood.
Interviewer: “What was your family doing for a living when you grew up?”
My mom did daycare out of our home pretty much my whole life. The only time she took a break
from that was when she was pregnant with my sister and she worked for a company doing some
secretarial work. I grew up with the house full of kids and always running around and playing so
yeah.
Interviewer: “Okay, was your father around, or?”
Nope.
Interviewer: “Not there, okay.”
Single mother…
Interviewer: “Just your mom and doing all that, okay. Where did you go to high school?”
I ended up going to high school from Grandville and that's where I graduated from in 2004.
Interviewer: “Alright, now what do you remember about 9/11?”

�Oh man that's…that for me will definitely be something I'll always remember. I mean, I was
sitting in... I can't remember if it was my freshman year or my sophomore year. Okay, I was in
German class and the principal comes over the intercom and you knew something's up right away
and he's like, hey everybody please turn on the TV, go to the news, and like he...news comes on,
there's these burning buildings, there‟s smoke billowing out and I didn't know much about the
twin towers before then. Um, but just that was definitely a huge, huge moment. Cool, kind of just
ground to a halt, you know? You go home and talk to my mom and I was only 11, 12...13?
Somewhere around there. I didn't really understand the whole significance of everything. I knew
it was big but I didn't understand all of it.
Interviewer: “Okay, so when did you graduate from high school then, it was..? (00:02:33)
2004.
Interviewer: “2004, alright. At that point had you decided you were going to go into the
military or how did you wind up going in the service?”
Uh, for me growing up the military was definitely always an option; my great-grandfather served
in the Navy during WWII. My grandfather, he served in the Army kind of in between Korea and
Vietnam. He served in Germany. He always had great stories to tell. Um, I realize now that he
had great stories to tell because he was in a different era of the Army.
Interviewer: “Right.”
And then between that was just my cousin and I would always talk about growing up. So then the
time came, would have been, would've been my junior year. I kind of said like this is where I
want to go. I just, I wasn't a good student at all in high school. Um, so my seventeenth birthday I
was in MEPS. Sign the paperwork and then my whole senior year, just like ready to get done and
go.
Interviewer: “You were in maps?”
Uh, MEPS so Military Entrance Processing…I can't remember what the acronym was.
Interviewer: “So basically you're going at this point, you're taking the test, or...just
preparing so that once you graduate then you go in?”
Yeah.
Interviewer: “Okay. Now, why the Army?” (00:03:50)

�You know. I looked around, I never looked at the Air Force, but Marine recruiters never seemed
to be there. It was just different mentality and I thought it had really come down to the Navy and
the Army. And then my grandpa had served, my great grandfather had served in the Navy and my
grandfather's experience in the army that kind of attracted me to those two. But like I said, I
wasn't a great student, I didn't really want to do more school, and that's kind of what the Navy
recruiters were pushing. Like, hey so you can come work on nuclear electric reactors. We'll send
you to school for the next four years in the Army. I'm like, I want to be an adventurer. I want to be
on the ground. They're like, we can do that. So they gave me what I wanted, and that's kind of
why I went there.
Interviewer: “Alright, so where did they send you for basic training?”
Uh, Fort Benning Georgia. Yup, so I did the one station unit training. So instead of doing,
because I was infantry, so instead of doing basic training and then another separate training for
whatever my specialty was. It was just 15 weeks of getting yelled at and tired and and physical.
Interviewer: “Alright, now the whole basic training process is something that's familiar to
people of older generations but not necessarily to new ones. I mean, you see things on
movies or television here and there so take us through that. What actually happens; you
arrive at Fort Benning and what do they do with you?” (00:05:06)
Oh goodness, so I got to Fort Benning…I kind of start like leaving home. I remember being
thrown up to the security station, saying goodbye to my mom and then…I still wasn't nervous. I
still knew the recruiters and knew all that but then bus comes, picks you up and it could be to
Lansing or Detroit but I don't remember where. Maybe I'm mistaking that for when I went to
Lansing to sign up too. It's been awhile since I've thought about that.
Interviewer: “[But they brought you to the airport and walked you down?]”
I don't really exactly remember how I got out of Michigan but I remember getting to Atlanta and
then Drill Sergeant showing up to pick you up. And like by that time, by myself really served
probably the first time in my life really off on this journey by myself. Drill Sergeant come pick
you up and they're not mean, but they're not friendly at the same time. They're slowly getting you
used to like what it's going to be like. Then you get brought to Fort Benning, sitting there in like a
processing center for, I don't remember if it was couple days or for the couple weeks now. And
then get to start to know a few guys and then you all split off and go to your training units and
then get to your training units and get off the bus there. That's when you start getting really yelled
at.

�Interviewer: “Okay. So what does the actual, take us through the training process. Would
they do it in sections with different things or was it all rolled together pretty much for you?”
(00:06:45)`
Um, I mean it was definitely like different events that stick out but it was just kind of a
progression. I think the biggest part is getting there, getting used to the guys, and then you start
slowly getting to know the different things. Then they slowly add another thing like like, okay
you've been carrying around this empty rifle for so long, let's go to the firing range today and use
it and start to get used to some of those things that are. But just slowly pulled in new things and
try to build that unit cohesion, understanding how things work. (00:07:22)
Interviewer: “Okay now were you down there in the summer?”
Um, I would‟ve been there in the fall.
Interviewer: “So you had a few months after you finished high school before you actually
report for duty.”
Yeah.
Interviewer: “Alright, now what kind of physical shape were you in when you went in?”
Better than I am now but not as good as I was. I think when I graduated high school I was
probably a hundred and sixty pounds, scrawny. And then by the time I got out of basic training,
definitely much better shape, put on some weight. I want to say I was probably around 175. So
definitely had some muscle where before I was, didn't have much. I could run but that's about it.
(00:08:04)
Interviewer: “Alright, and how easy or hard was it for you just to adjust to the life of the
Army?”
Um, I don't really think it was too hard. You know, in the beginning just I opened myself up and
said here we go. Um, especially when you're lower enlisted, I mean. You get told where you got
to be and you got one uniform to wear. So as long as can show up on time and do what you're
told, you don't have to think a lot until you start getting to, you know, other situations and things.
(00:08:34)
Interviewer: “Alright, now what size unit were you training with; about how many guys
were with you?”

�Oh goodness um 40, 50 maybe.
Interviewer: “Okay, so basically a platoon that you're with. Alright, now among that group,
were there people who had a lot of trouble?”
There was definitely a few guys that, I wouldn't say a lot of trouble, but definitely came from
probably rougher backgrounds than I did and that kind of pushed back on some things and had a
little more adjusting to do than I did.
Interviewer: “Alright. Now, what level of discipline were they exercising at this point? I
mean, you have the stories of, you know, the older eras, you know, that started beating
people up and doing all kinds of things like that. I mean, through what level of discipline
was really being exercised there?”
You know, I think I grew up watching the movies and seeing the Full Metal Jacket and different
things like that. I don't know it wasn't, it didn't seem like it was that tough. As long as you
did what you're told, showed up, woke up, shaved your face. I never had too many difficulties
with it but, I mean, there were separate conversations had when somebody was screwing up. You
know like, hey, it's 3 o'clock in the morning and we're still up because of you. We're going to
make sure that we adjust..
Interviewer: “Okay, there is that kind of group discipline thing that goes on and you make
the other guys - kind of toe the line through it. Okay, so now over the course of your 15
weeks here so what kind of main things do you spend your time doing? (00:10:18)
I mean, exercise every morning, training, studying. I feel like the beginning part you had some
more classroom stuff for your just getting to learn some of the language. getting to some of the
weapon systems, learning basic patrol base techniques, how to set up a patrol base, how to
especially how to walk strategically so if something does go happen you don't all die at once.
Um, just kind of just pulling in really basic knowledge on how to be an infantryman.
Interviewer: “Okay, now the time you're doing this you knowing we were already in Iraq
and in Afghanistan did you have a sense of any of that training was sort of geared toward
those places?
You know, with basic training it was really just basic [reference] task, you know, like
how to not be an idiot. You know, keeping your head on a swivel. You know, how to work as a
team so that when you showed up to your unit you weren't completely useless.

�Interviewer: “Okay, alright. so you get through the training part now what do they do with
you?
For me, after the basic training period got done I went to airborne school. So that was
four weeks long and that was still in Fort Benning, Georgia.
Interviewer: “Okay, now, what does that actually consist of?”
That was definitely a nice little reprieve; you had a little more freedom. Could leave base after
training was done but it was still pretty similar like show up, doing your exercise in the morning,
and then for the first few weeks you go to a hangar and they start.to teach basic task of essentially
alright if your parachute goes out this is when you pull your reserve and this is how you do a
parachute landing fall and kind of basic task and then, I can't remember if it's the last week or the
third week that you start doing jumps, but then you get to go up in the airplane and jump out of an
airplane. (00:12:23)
Interviewer: “Did they do a thing where you were jumping off of the tower or something
like that in between because I feel World War II thing…”
They still had the towers, we didn't get to do that. I can't remember if it was, I think it was
broken or there was something of the day we were going to do it, if I remember correctly, the
weather or something was off. so it was like well we're not doing it this time like we're just going
to the airplane.
Interviewer: “Alright, so what was that first jump out of an airplane like?”
Oh man, I don't remember if it was my first time jumping out. I was, I never remember being
nervous. I was more excited and I think one of the memories that sticks with me the most is
there's only one jump and it was while I was in airborne school that I got to be the first person
in the door and you're sitting in the door and you're just a ball of energy and you're looking out
and you're looking down at the ground and you can see the ground but you're still somewhat
separated from it and it's exhilarating. So like, I couldn't tell you if I got slapped on the butt, or if I
just heard the word “go”, if I saw the green light go off, or what it was, but I just remember
Like looking and then all of a sudden like I'm out the door and there you go. And then you see the
parachute kind of tug open. While you're 800 feet up in the air our basic training was probably a
little bit higher. it would seem like it would take a while but there's so much going on in the air
that just like, alright don't run into that guy, don't run into that guy, get rid of your rucksack,
alright am I tangled. And before you know it, you're hitting the ground. (00:13:48)

�Interviewer: “Alright, now, were there problems with people getting hurt when they
landed?”
Uh, for our basic training we did have a woman die, so.
Interviewer: “Wow.”
Yeah. That was a tough one. and we had a few guys that kind of stepped out after that. But never
heard the final word on the investigation on what happened, if she had gotten a cigarette roll with
her parachute; so if her parachute was deploying, if something happens, so if it just kind of, but
still a streamer. She never pulled the reserve. So yeah that kind of halted for the rest of that day
and then the thing with the military is, I mean the mission has to go on. So the next day those of
us that continued were back in the airplanes jumping out again. I think it was like the first time in
20 years that somebody had died in airborne mission. (00:14:46)
Interviewer: “Okay, so now you get through all of that. Do you now get assigned to a unit or
do you have other training or what happens?”
No. After airborne school I was done. I got sent to my unit. I got sent to the 82nd so that was one
thing that when I joined up I wanted to do it and wanted to jump out of airplanes. It would be,
everybody's, well most people have heard of the 82nd and the 101st airborne and stuff like that.
But I didn't have a slot so, um, kind of go back. I remember there's me and one other guy in basic
training that had to compete for that slot. I'm thankful that I got it. My knees and my back aren't
so appreciative now, but. it was, I mean, it was a different mentality at the 82nd.
Interviewer: “Now isn't parachuting kind of an obsolete skill? I mean does the military still
use it very much?”
I don't know if I'd say obsolete. I mean, I never did a combat jump. I know there's like one or,
I shouldn't say numbers. I know there were, there was at least one combat jump that happened in
Iraq to secure airfield. I mean it's just a matter of, you know war is definitely changing. You see
101st is a lot more of the, the fast roping things like that, but I don't know. You can definitely see
it being abused, be able to get a ton of guys, you know, to an airfield in the middle of
somewhere where you can't get ground troops there right away. (00:16:11)
Interviewer: “Okay, but in the meantime, when you're with the 82nd, which particular unit
within the 82nd were you assigned to?

�So I was with, now I'm going to forget my Company now that I got to say it, but I was with the, I
believe it was with Bravo Company 2/505, so the 2nd Battalion 505th Parachute Infantry
Regiment.
Interviewer: “Alright, now when you go and join the units, what kind of reception do you
get?”
Again, it wasn't like what I expected, you see the movie, you get the hazing. That might have
been cracked down a little bit, but I don‟t know. But I wasn't welcomed with open arms and hugs
and high fives but this is your unit, you get dropped off standing at the CQ desk, and I can‟t
remember what that acronym means at the top of my head but you're standing there waiting and
they take their time to come get you. I can‟t remember if it was my squad leader or my platoon
sergeant that came and got me. I‟m guessing it would have probably been my squad leader, comes
gets me, starts showing me around. People will look at you and they look you up and down and
kind of measure you up and move on. Don't say hi, here‟s your room, here‟s your roommate, this
guy is going to square you away, you know, you be at formation the next day, whatever that is.
(00:17:30)
Interviewer: “Now what was the unit doing generally, or was its assignment at the time that
you joined it? Was it just in-base hanging around, or?”
Yeah, so with the 82nd...I‟m probably going to mess things up. It‟s been awhile since I‟ve said it.
There was three different training cycles; there was division ready force one, on which we were
on call. So one of the things of the 82nd is we could be anywhere in the world in 24 hours. so
there was always, I can‟t remember if it was a brigade or a battalion that was always on division
force one. So those were always a tough few months because you‟re not supposed to go
anywhere, you‟re not supposed to drink (we never drank), and just be ready to go. And then you
had a heavy training cycle where you‟d be out in the field a lot and doing missions and training,
whatever that may be. And then you kind of have like a slower few months where either you‟re
going home on leave or you‟re doing some classroom training or doing some other maintenance
stuff within the unit, things like that. (00:18:32)
Interviewer: “Okay, now, had your unit before you joined it, deployed either to Iraq or
Afghanistan?”
Yeah, I‟m trying to remember what the last deployment was before I got there, but there was
definitely, some of guys that I had served with had gotten deployed both to Afghanistan and Iraq,
I don‟t remember the time frame. I know a couple of my buddies had gotten there at the tail end
of the Afghanistan deployment and then had deployed to Iraq…?

�Interviewer: “So there were at least some people who had been someplace at that point in
the unit.”
Yeah
Interviewer: “Now, do you think they had gone as a unit or had they been in other units and
then just reassigned to your Battalion?”
There was definitely a lot of guys that had been in that unit. There was a few that had come from
other units
Interviewer: “Alright, so now you're with them and then, now, where is the division based?”
(00:19:28)
So that‟s going to be Fort Bragg, North Carolina. So Fayetteville which, I don‟t know if a lot of
people know of Fayetteville, but I think it's relatively in the middle of North Carolina.
Interviewer: “So there's not a whole lot of built-up stuff around it otherwise.”
No
Interviewer: “It‟s a very large base, it‟s got a lot of space. So, now when you're doing the
training, is this where you're doing a lot of the practice jumps and this kind of things? Is
that a regular thing to do or do they do that just occasionally?”
Yeah. I feel like we did a jump every few months to stay proficient. by the time I left the 82nd I
had 15 jumps. Yeah I remember getting back from. getting back from Iraq and if you hadn‟t had
15 jumps before the deployment, they were making you do remedial training. So you had to go
through this whole like month-long course. So I just squeaked by that I had to go and mess around
with that. (00:20:26)
Interviewer: “Alright, now, so in that period there, you‟re at Fort Bragg for like a year or so
before you deploy?”
Yeah
Interviewer: “„Cause you go in in „04 and you‟re taking the rest of 04 to train.”
Yup, so I got to my unit sometime in „05 and then we deployed in August, September…? Yeah so
fall time frame of „06.

�Interviewer: “Okay so you got. you‟re still there at Fort Bragg, so what was daily life like at
Fort Bragg during that period?”
Daily life; I mean, wake up at six, some days you‟re still drunk, some days you‟re hungover.
Usually still pretty tired no matter what it is. And you go down, get in formation, do your morning
routine and then usually off at around, usually ran every day and then come do push-ups, sit ups,
maybe a rough march, whatever it may be. Go back, cleanup, eat breakfast, report to the
Headquarters, and then see what the daily tasks were and then go out from there. With the 82nd,
when we were in the, when we weren‟t heavily training, I mean, a lot of times we were out there,
out of work fairly early so we could go, hang out, relax and then that way when we were in
division ready force one or in the heavy training cycles, the men, the guys with families were able
to spend some time with them. And then took the younger of us that didn‟t have families were
usually started drinking. (00:22:14)
Interviewer: “Okay, now was that on-base or off-base, or? Were there clubs on base that
enlisted men go to?
There wasn‟t really any clubs on base that we went to. I‟m sure, I mean there was the officers‟
club and things, but I mean, we usually just drank in the barracks or we‟d go off post and there's a
few little watering holes that we liked to go to.
Interviewer: “Okay, now were you paying any attention to kind of what was going on
overseas or keeping track of where or when you might go somewhere?” (00:22:44)
I figured we‟d just get told, I mean. You know, I was lower enlisted so I just did my job. I showed
up in the right uniform and, you know, made sure I had my hair cut and looked the part, and just
did what I was told. And they would tell me when I was going to go and what I needed to do.
Other than that, I just…
Interviewer: “Alright so how much in advance of the deployment do you get notified that
you're going to go?”
So before our deployment they had told us that, “Alright we‟re going to deploy”. So we kind of
started getting ready, then right before we had a leave scheduled, they said, “Nevermind. It‟s
cancelled, it‟s off” So that wasn't surprising. Before we deployed to Iraq, we had actually
deployed to New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina so that's kind of what happened then, they‟re
like, “We heard the news that this is happening. Word came that we might go.” So like we were
going and then we‟re not going, and then we‟re going again and then we‟re not going. And the
news says we‟re going, so like “Hey, we must be going”. (00:23:53)

�Interviewer: “Well, talk about the Katrina deployment. So you go to New Orleans
after the hurricane, so what did you do there? What did you see?”
So for Hurricane Katrina, that‟s definitely another one of those memories that will stick with me
for awhile because I had, I haven‟t told my wife this story yet, but I had met a girl, I had gone
when I went on leave, one of my buddies from New York had met a girl. So she had come down
because we had a four-day weekend scheduled. We were going to see if this was something we
wanted to explore or if it was something that “it was nice to meet ya” but she had come down, got
there early Friday morning so we help my buddy move and we kind of have the night to
ourselves, kind of talking, getting to know each other. Get the call in the morning, “hey, get to
work „cause you‟re on division ready force one. We are deploying to New Orleans.” Alright so
we grabbed our bags, we go. We‟re gone all day Friday and we have our bags packed. I remember
building the pallet of our rucksacks and things like that and watching some of my buddies getting
on the airplane to go to New Orleans and sitting there with a couple other NCOs and [things like
that]. You‟re just sittin‟, waitin‟ and we‟ll be on the next plane to go. And all of a sudden we see
these guys coming off the airplane and we get a call like, “hey, get the rucksacks off. We‟re not
going. So we roll back into my buddie‟s apartment late that night, I can‟t remember if it was 11 or
1. So I potentially come home, see this girl, talk for a little bit and the just pass out. And, again
the next thing, I mean the next day I think it was like we start doing some things, like. “hey, get
back into work, we‟re really going this time.” So that time we really did go. Packed our bags, got
on the airplanes, got to Hurricane Katrina. One of the things they kept telling us was like, “Make
sure your rucksacks are full of water like we don't care if you got enough clean underwear but we
don't know how much good water there is. We don't know when we'll get clean water.” So we‟re
carrying around, I mean, ginormous, heavy rucksacks, load up on the plane. As soon as we get off
the plane to get to the airport there is just pallet upon pallet upon pallet of clean bottled water–so
we were prepared but thankfully we didn‟t have to like ration our water for the next couple weeks.
Got from the airport, shuffled around. Ended up getting put up on the Coast Guard base there in
New Orleans. Somebody pointed one of our guys, like “that‟s” your building, clean it up, make it
your area. So we spent the first couple days just making the area where we could live. Potentially
just set up some tents and “alright, this is where we‟re going to live for a while” Did that for a few
days, and kind of did the hurry-up and wait for them. We‟re sittin‟ there for a second like alright,
now what are we gonna do. Then finally we got connected and like “alright, we‟re going to go out
on missions. We‟re going to hook up with…” I think we ended up hooking up with a couple
Coast Guard guys. And they keep telling us “don‟t get in the water, the sewage. Don‟t get in the
water.” So I remember at that time they had made me a temporary radiotelephone operator for my
platoon sergeant. So I‟m following him around, we get the little rubber, zodiac boats. Get that in
the water and Coast Guard guys jump in and start pushing it away from the little, low island of
actual dirt we had and I look at him cause we‟d just been told for days “don‟t get in the water” he

�looks back at me and just goes *shrug*. Starts walking in the water so we got wet right away and
then just ended up patrolling on boats for that the first part of the day. (00:27:54)
Interviewer: “So what was the point of all that?”
We were going out and just looking for people that were stuck in their homes
Interviewer: “Okay.”
Saying like “hey, we can get you back to dry land and we‟ve got some stuff set up. Some people
were like “thanks but no thanks” and then I remember there was a couple other people that we
were able to get back and get to dryland get some aid. End of that first day, I remember there was
a guy and his dog that we got and that one stuck out for me that day. But, just kind of looking
around and, I mean you‟d see just houses flooded. I remember one that will stick in my mind is
there was like a wrought iron fence where somebody had left their dog that it looked like the dog
had been trying to squeeze through and had got his hind-end stuck in the fence and drowned that
way. There was definitely things like that but then after the end of the first day, I mean kind of
soggy and wet and tired. We‟d load the zodiac boats back on the trailer and we had one last one to
go, bunch of us trying to get it on top of the stack. We couldn't quite do it so I go around the back
of boat and I push up and I was just, a wave of the sewage water washes over me. It‟s in my
mouth and you're like oh man, but thankfully I was one of the first guys to get shower. I was
probably 1 of 2 guys that got shower that night. And then we slept the night, and then kind of
went back after the next day. Just kept going through, seeing if we could help people. Another
memory that will stick in my mind for that day, or for that week is, I‟ll tell a sad one first and then
I‟ll tell the happiest one. I remember going into the, not the Superdome or whatever it was, a big
coliseum… (00:30:00)
Interviewer: “Well Superdome was yeah that‟s what they used as kind of a big
concentration area.”
So yeah I remember walking in there, and that it smelled rancid. It was...it looked like a different
country. It looked like something you wouldn‟t see in America. I remember seeing like dirty
diapers there's crap on the wall, human crap on the walls and there were blood smears on the
walls, there‟s like rotting food. It was like something you‟d see in a horror movie. It was just,
whatever went on in there wasn't good for those people. So by the time you went through there, it
was emptied out, and they had been brought to other aid shelters. And now that I‟m talking about
it I‟m remembering more and more memories. So like we went through there, there was nobody
still in there, we got out as fast as we could. On another patrol, I mean, one the reasons we were
brought in was because of looting and things like that. So, you know, we weren't walking around
with loaded guns, but kind of, we were prepared if anything did happen. So we‟re walking

�around; we've got our uniforms on, got our berets on, we‟re walking. We‟re not walking in a
group, but we‟re walking like a military unit. So there‟s a guy here on this side of the road, a guy
here on the other side and staggered the whole way down. I'm in the middle with my platoon
sergeant and I‟ve got this huge radio on with a huge antenna sticking out my back. And we start
walking up to this checkpoint and I‟ll never remember, I mean I'll never forget, this cop like sees
us coming like puts his hand on his gun and like “Stop! Who are you? Stop! Who are you?” and
my platoon sergeant looks at me this time and is like “Is this guy serious?”. He didn‟t say that out
loud but he kind of looks at me and “We‟re with the Army…?” and like the cop puts his gun
away then he gave us, he gave my platoon sergeant and I a little tour of New Orleans and it was
one of the most surreal moment of my life. So we‟re driving through and trying to get the lay of
the land and he‟s like “Here's this statue” like giving us a tourist like of so-and-so jazz musician
and like “Oh, there's the dead body” and keep driving on and kind of just weird stuff like that. It
was just tourist things you know like “oh, we got somebody here” and very weird experience. So
we got done with that. went back home at the end of the night and kind of just went through that
grind over and over again. (00:32:47)
Interviewer: “So how long did you stay down there?‟
Months, three weeks? I'm not sure on the time frame. It‟s one of those moments in my life where
it's just like the days kind of blended into one another so there's different moments highlighted but
I couldn‟t tell you if we were there for...we were there for more than a week but If it was two
weeks, three weeks, a month, I don't know.
Interviewer: “So you were keeping pretty long days and you're out there walking
around a lot so you get kind of pretty well worn out. And did you have, I mean Coast Guard
station, did you have actual bunks and things to sleep in or were you just..”
No, no bunks they just gave us a little place where we could set up camp and where we set up
camp.
Interviewer: “And there you were, alright so you come back from that and how much of a
gap was there you think between that deployment and actually going to Iraq?”
I feel like that was pretty quick turnaround, I mean, I feel like we got back, kind of got a few
things done and started to prepare to deploy. So yeah we got back Floyd [?]. “ Hey, you‟re
deploying” then getting ready to go home, “oh you‟re not deploying” So I‟d go home, come
home. I got my nipples pierced and like “Oh, we‟re not deploying!” Seemed like a great idea at
the time.
Interviewer: “Okay.”

�Um call all my friends, family, tell them I‟m not deploying. Get back to base...oh by the way, we
really are deploying so not going to have a fresh wound going into a foreign country so took the
nipple rings out, called my family and friends, said “hey, we are deploying some time within the
next few months.“ (00:34:38)
Interviewer: “Alright, so now what is the actual deployment processing? Do you go
anywhere else to train or to prepare you for being in Iraq first or did they just load you up
at Fort Bragg can send you overseas?”
Oh yeah. We went down to Louisiana to do, I can‟t remember the acronym they used for it but we
went down there for like a month and did some training and that was more focused on the
situation in Iraq so got some guys that were recently back and talking about different things on
like how to look for IED 's. You know, trying to set situations to get used to the different culture
which, I mean, you can‟t get used to it until you‟re there but getting used to people walking
around and women walking around with their faces covered and just different things like that.
Interviewer: “Okay, so there is some [special] orientation or something because you really
haven't had any specialized training at this point that was geared toward the Middle East.”
No, not especially. I mean like as a weeklong training course a lot of that's just, you know, the
guys that been there already trying to teach us what they've learned and building that unit
cohesiveness and just. You know, our training activities were definitely more geared towards
what was going on in Iraq but, there's nothing like we did in Louisiana before then.
Interviewer: “Okay, now do they have people who were sort of playing Iraqis or whatever?
Did you get the practice encountering civilians or things like that or were they just telling
you about that stuff?”
No, in Louisiana they do, I mean...you're interacting with civilians, but I mean, it‟s just another
private dressed up in , you know, different type of clothing. So, I mean, some of those guys
that were playing the civilians hadn‟t actually been there, so they‟re, you‟re doing your best to
create the situation and, you know as best as you can. (00:36:40)
Interviewer: “Alright, so now what's the actual process for getting into Iraq?”
Get on a plane, fly, I can‟t remember if we stopped in the states, but we flew to Germany, layover
there. Get back on the plane; we‟re only there for a hot second. They didn‟t want us there for too
long. Back on the plane and then flew into Kuwait. Fom Kuwait we took some tour buses. I can‟t
remember...I remember getting on the tour buses like driving through Kuwait and you‟re trying to

�take as much as you can in; there‟s light and it‟s dark. But then like driving through the desert on
these tour buses and nothing the pictures I‟ll look at occasionally, but we got stuck! Well you‟re
driving through a big beach so like this big tour bus gets stuck in the middle of the desert. We all
pile off the tour bus and we just sit there and wait till another tour bus comes to pick us up and
hopefully that one doesn't get stuck. I don‟t remember how long that trip took but eventually we
got to where we needed to be. And yeah, I can‟t remember if we...I doubt we took the tour buses
all the way to Tikrit but there's a gap in my memory between the tour bus and how we got to
C.O.B. Speicher. I don‟t know if we got into another military base and took a quick flight, but that
sounds right. But eventually we ended up at C.O.B. Speicher in Tikrit.
Interviewer: “C.O.B. Speicher?”
Yeah, command operating base…?
Interviewer: “Okay.”
Goodness, i don‟t remember what the acronym actually stands for. Something operating base.
Interviewer: “Okay, command operating base makes some sense; it has a “c” to start with.
And now, were there other units based there that you were joining or was this kind of you
were taking it over or what was the deal?”
So C.O.B. Speicher was actually a really big base. It‟s actually an airfield, an Iraqi Air Force or
Army airfield before the war so it‟s pretty built up. There was all sorts of different units there, but
for my company, because we were so far spread that our company was detached and attached to
an artillery unit. We‟re not really using, well at that time we weren‟t really using a lot of artillery
in Iraq so we were kind of tasked with being the infantry unit for that whole area of operations
and doing our best to train the artillery guys on, essentially how to do more infantry tactics. How
to, you know; do route secure, how to do security for high-value people and yeah, that‟s kind of
what we were tasked with for that area. I don‟t remember the name of the Artillery unit we were
attached to but that was a pretty big base. (00:39:45)
Interviewer: “Okay so are you going off the base a lot and into the surrounding area, or are
you staying on the base, or what's happening?”
No, we definitely tried not to stay on the base; too many rules. But we did a few different things.
There was the provisional (00:40:05] reconstruction team that was working with the local
government and local officials to try to build some stability and structure and then also to
negotiate like, this is my understanding so it might not be perfectly clear, I didn‟t get told
everything, but “We‟ll give you this money but it's for this” and then kind of following up and

�doing our best to make sure they use the money for what it was given to them for. And this would
kind of build relationships. And then, for that we just, we‟d convoy out of the base, bring them to
the governance building, set up a perimeter and then full security for however long they were
going to talk to you for that day. Just sit there and talk and try not to be complacent or take your
eyes off them, make sure nothing happens. (00:40:55)
Interviewer: “How long was the deployment?”
The deployment ended up being 15 months, so we were part of the surge that kind of happened
towards the end, so we got extended for three months.
Interviewer: “So you initially go out there through the surge, hasn't started yet, now was
there much hostile activity going on?”
In our area it was relatively quiet, I mean there‟s still guys taking potshots at us and trying to
blow us up. But, I mean, I feel like our area was fairly quiet for the time we were there.
Interviewer: “What impression did you have of the Iraqis themselves?”
I mean, what I tell everybody is, I mean yeah there‟s people that didn‟t like us, it's a different
culture but, you know. I am more than. more positive than ever that 98/99% of people, all they
want to do is, you know, put a roof over their heads, feed their kids, and have their kids lead a
good life. I mean, that was most people that I ran into over there. There was definitely, it's a
different, very different culture. Different level of there‟s very open corruption. I guess just... they
don't try to hide it very much. And, wasn‟t healthy to become the police chief. I know one of the
guys that we were working with at the time got killed in his driveway and like the guy before him
got killed in his driveway. There was Iraqi police checkpoints where there was times we would
find an IED and we‟d find the wire and we‟d go follow it back and “Oh, it‟s an Iraqi police‟s little
checkpoint box” and “Oh! we had no idea!” or it‟d be a house that was 50 feet from where they
were stationed, [sure he didn‟t] (00:42:43), so I mean there's mostly good people but there is
also some different stuff.
Interviewer: “Okay, well did you see much of the Iraqi military or are they someplace
else?”
Yeah, we did do some interactions with the Iraqi military. One of things is after, I don‟t remember
if it was three-months, I don‟t remember if it was six-months into our deployment, but we lost
some of our friends. So what we did is after that was one of the areas that we were operating in,
to secure the area more, we set up a patrol base. And that patrol base ended up being in the Iraqi
Army compound. So they gave us an old warehouse that we set up shop in and then we just kind

�of worked with them to do security and do different training missions. That was definitely a big
part of our goal was to train these guys so they‟re confident and competent and could kind of
takeover their own stuff. (00:43:43)
Interviewer: “Okay, and how did that go?”
It was a mix. You know, it came, coming from our unit in our military where it was more
established and there‟s a different level of discipline. I mean, I don't, it seems like there was some
guys that were in the Iraqi Army that were just there because there's no other jobs. There
definitely wasn‟t the same level of discipline but there were also some really good guys. The
name escapes me at the time, but one of the colonels in the Iraqi Army that we work with was
really solid dude and was trying to build it up and like both were kind of men that we looked for
to hopefully build on what he was able to do and keep getting them stronger.
Interviewer: “Now would you do a lot of patrolling in built-up areas or towns and villages
or were you a lot in the countryside, kind of where were you?”
I was both so I mean Tikrit was definitely a bigger city and we did definitely patrolling through
there and then on the other side of the river there was, I‟m not going to say the names right but Ad
Dawr and Hujamah [?](00:44:53). They were two little smaller towns. I don‟t...I think Hujamah
was a little bit north and that was kind of, seemed almost like an apartment block
and then you got Ad Dawr to the South which had...was more like a small town, small city kind of
feel but there‟d be other times where we get some information they say like “There‟s this bad guy
out here, gotta go check these houses”. So I‟ll never forget that we had a really good Lt that prior
to this said “Yeah, that was really solid”. I remember sitting there and like getting ready to go
somewhere and our Lt would point like we gotta go that way. You‟d look that way and you‟d see
nothing but desert so you‟d end up driving for “x” amount of hours and all of a sudden you‟d
come up to this little compound that seemed to be in the middle of nowhere and go knocking on
doors. Yup so there was definitely a good mix of being in the city to being in the middle of
nowhere.
Interviewer: “Ok so just as to reference, “L” “t” refers to lieutenant?”
Yes.
Interviewer: “Ok so he‟s your platoon leader basically?”
Yup.

�Interviewer: “Okay and then we go ahead and we‟re knocking on doors. So you're
searching houses, you‟re trying to find somebody?”
Yeah, so there‟s, I mean there was two kinds knocking on doors that we did where we‟re actually
knocking on doors and talking with people or other times where we would do a raid where we
were kicking in their doors cause we suspected, you know, some bad guys were there. (00:46:22)
Interviewer: “And were there rules for how you went about doing that?”
Yeah, there was definitely rules of engagement, so I mean, I served with good guys who didn‟t
want to kill anybody unless we had to. So I mean, that‟s the thing, you never know how good
your intelligence is. So I mean, there‟s times you‟d be, you‟re going to these homes, I mean, so
sometimes you have to be thoughtful because you're going to a home with these kids. There‟s
definitely one house in particular I remember going in and the front of the home had this big
metal door. So whenever you‟re going to do a raid on a house you want to be in it quick before
they know you‟re there, but we didn‟t get in that house very quick. So we got a sledgehammer
and a crowbar and hit the door and *gong* like the whole neighborhood had to be awake. So like
by the time we got in the house, everybody's just on high alert. We get in to the first room and
there‟s one of the older ladies of the house that‟s just, she‟s losing her mind crying, you know she
thinks there‟s someone there to take out her family. So we see her and then out of the corner my
eye I see somebody come out of her room or something like that so turn and there was just a kid
there so I‟m like “What the heck is going on?”. So I mean, you always had to be careful when you
did something like that. (00:47:52)

Interviewer: “Okay if you're going to a place where you‟re not breaking down the door,
what was the procedure? If you actually knock on a door and expect someone to open it,
what was going to happen or how would you behave?”
Usually for those kinds of ,missions I was more on the periphery like watching, making things
happen.
Interviewer: “Okay.”
It would be my lieutenant with our interpreter that would you know, go knock on the door the
interpreter would talk with them and then just like “Hey, we‟re looking for these people or we‟re
looking to do this…” you know trying to build some relationships. A lot of the stuff that Iraqis
would've been done more through, like groups. So they have the sheikhs (00:48:40) that are
overseeing like a group of people. That was really key if you could get the sheikh on your side
and work with them. You‟d see a lot less roadside bombs, you‟d see a lot less people shootin‟ at

�ya whereas the U.S. (00:48:55) in particular is very friendly that you‟d be a little more laxed on,
you know, making sure people weren‟t tryin‟ to kill ya.
Interviewer: “Alright and so during the time you were there, there were parts, there were
areas in Iraq where there was a lot of violence and there were a lot of IEDs, there was a lot
of trouble and Al Qaeda resistance and things like that. And that brought on sort of the
whole surge strategy and the idea and principle that involved having small units kind of
going out in the community and staying out in the community and securing different areas
which would expose you to more attacks but also directly confronted enemy fighters. But
another piece of that was also figuring out who the local power brokers were and connecting
with the sheikhs and trying to give them things that they wanted in exchange for their help.
Now in the area that you were in. how did the surge strategy play out? What aspects of that
did you see?” (00:49:50)
For us, I didn't see a lot of change. I think we were kind of already doing that so we didn‟t see any
more units come into our area at the time but definitely was, you know, it was a lot of work with
the local government like, “Hey we‟re nice, we‟re not trying to rule over you. Don‟t blow us up,
please.” You know, what are your problems? Just like you said, if we could avoid getting blown
up or doing anything like that we really try and do that. So yeah, that was one of the reasons we
set up the patrol base too was we realized that being on C.O.B. Speicher we were on the other
side of the river and there‟s this whole, you know, whole other area that we had to go into and be
a part of that we weren‟t [...] (00:50:36) on the ground, we couldn‟t do security.
Just getting over to that area took a day because we drove slow. You‟re not driving at 80 miles an
hour, you‟re driving at like 25, 30. So we set up that so we could be in that area and be a part of it.
(00:50:51)
Interviewer: “Now did your unit take any casualties while you were there?”

Yeah, we lost my one buddy that was coming back from the patrol base back to C.O.B. Speicher
one day. We were just driving back, saw some different IEDs, some of our guys got out of the
trucks, followed the wires back to the shack and just all of a sudden you just hear this *boom*
and he was gone. We had another guy that had just got to our unit. He actually shipped over to us
in Iraq, I mean he was maybe eight-, he had to be eighteen if he was deployed with us. He‟ll never
be the same. He‟s not dead but he‟s not himself anymore. So that was a tough one. He was a kid
too that never felt like talking with him and talking with some of the other guys that
were with him on the rear deployment, the guys that stayed back to make sure we‟re getting
everything we need and stuff they squared away at home. It seems that he was pushed by his dad
to go in. So like his dad pushed him, he wasn‟t like “Oh, I‟m ready and happy to be here”. Good
guy, would've been happy to serve with him for years but you know for him to be in country for

�like maybe a week and that's it. You know, that‟s something that‟s tough to talk about. I‟ve talked
about it a few times it's gotten, I don't break down crying anymore but that‟s something I‟ll
remember for the rest of my life. That‟s something that pushes me to be better so.
Interviewer: “But, on the whole were incidents pretty rare, were you actually hit, or would
you hit IED 's that wouldn‟t do very much damage or did you just not get that many?”
We definitely got a few, I couldn‟t tell you all the numbers. Personality, I was blown up three
times. There‟s definitely a couple that stick in my mind that happened to me personally. One was
I just got back from mid-tour leave and we were driving down the service road and, I was driving,
and we hit an IED. You know, thought I lost another friend. Thankfully, he was alright. We didn‟t
lose anybody but by that time in the war and where we were at we were driving around a normal,
small tank. The Humvees had so much armor plating added to them and
A big glass armor windows that we could take a lot of damage. But yeah, I remember “Chris,
Chris, are you alright?” and finally he‟s like “Yeah” and just... *gestures / sigh of relief* He was
fine.
Interviewer: “So the IEDs those would normally be while you were in vehicles they would go
off or would you get any even while you were on patrol?”
We didn't, I mean, we lost my one friend because they had dismounted but a lot of the stuff we‟d
hit would be set up to get us on the roads when we were driving. One thing that we had talked
about, the Louisiana training, and one of the questions they ask is how would you identify like
what would be out of place and I‟d say “well, trash on the road”. And they- I remember the guy
stopping us and saying like, “In America, yeah you‟re not going to see a lot of trash in the roads.
If you see like a big garbage bag or something it can be out of place. In Iraq, that's not going to be
the case”. And it‟s true, I mean, there was trash all up and down side of the road so it wasn't as
easy as saying, “Oh, like hey, there‟s this bag of trash, what could that be?” It was, you know,
there could‟ve been a pile of trash that was already there that they put something over and the
roads had been blown up so many times that there might be a pothole that was fixed and you're
used to it. Well, they might pick it up and put a new bomb in that hole and then all of a sudden,
“Oh hey, they‟re blowing us up, again”. I don‟t know if I answered your question fully.
(00:54:54)
Interviewer: “Yeah, so basically there is a certain amount of stress or tension there
whenever time you go out. There‟s a prospect that something could happen even if most of
the time it doesn't. But you said you got blown up three times so were you just in vehicles
that got hit with IEDs each time?”
Yeah. yeah the second time, the other time that I really remember was I would‟ve been in the gun. We
were driving back after a night raid. Driving back to base and then all of a sudden just...I don‟t remember

�hearing the noise. I remember all of a sudden being pushed back and like not being able to see for a second
and you‟re like, “What in the hell just happened?” And then I was in the rear of the truck so like I‟m trying
to get my gun back in working order in case you're going to try to start shooting at us next. You know.
trying to get the gun going, we‟ve got a flat tire, it just happens like that. You know, I remember thankfully
we were in the armored humvees because we get back and there‟s a piece of metal that was probably about
*gestures* that long and about that thick that was stuck in the glass that had it been a little bit higher, had
it been going a little bit stronger, I wouldn‟t be here talking to you today.
Interviewer: “Okay aside from IEDs did you, I mean, actually have much other kind of enemy
contact or was it just that or did like...were you ever in a base, for instance, that got hit with a
mortar round or anything like that?”

I mean C.O.B. Speicher was so big that when we were there...if it happened it usually wasn‟t
close to us. Patrol base never really got hit. The one benefit of being the only infantry unit
in the area was that the guys there are paying attention and watching. So I think that they realize
like who was a well-trained infantry and who were the artillery guys. So I mean, they didn‟t seem
to mess with us a lot that we had a different mentality that if you shot at us what we were going to
do next. I remember the one day that we did kind of have like a little ambush or whatever set up
on us. I‟m sittin‟ with a gun in the Humvee and we‟re just doing our normal routine; check in at
the different checkpoints and I making a jelly cracker, and we got another guy out pulling
security. So I‟m like going to get this ready and snack on it while I‟m watching and get my jelly
cracker ready, sit down, my seat breaks, bust my butt and I was kind of sore, trying to like rig up
my chair again so I can sit. And I had my little swing or whatever you want to call it and the next
thing you know you hear shots coming in and you‟re like “Alright, what‟s going on?” At that
moment it seemed like it took a while but same time it's almost over and done. That was the day
that we had, I don‟t remember what the guy‟s rank was but, he hadn‟t been outside the wire too
many times so he‟s out taking pictures and kind of wandered off by himself a little too far and he
got saved by his body armor. That‟s one of the things that we had received before going over,
with some little side pouches that protects us and he got hit right there. Another guy we were
with, frickin‟ fool, ran out and dragged him back so thankfully neither of them got killed. But
yeah, just little stuff like that. Usually they pop shots at us. (00:58:33)
Interviewer: “So there was an individual sniper and then fire a couple of shots and then
vanish or would you get a more...did you ever get a more extended firefight at all or…?”
No they never took us on head-on, I mean, they couldn‟t have.
Interviewer: “Okay, now you said that you‟re there, in principle your deployment would've
been at most a year, like normally?”
Yeah, it‟s supposed to be 12 months.

�Interviewer: “Yeah, okay [we know the deployment] (0058:59) gets extended, what‟s the
response in the unit when you find out you're staying?”
I mean, we weren‟t happy about it but it wasn't a complete morale killer. I think the toughest part
were for the guys who had families. They had gone on leave really early. So I had a buddy that,
we had only been in country like 3 months before he took his leave so I mean he‟s going to go a
year without seeing his wife and kid. That was really tougher for me, I didn't have, I mean I had
family but I was a single guy and no kids waiting on me so. And I was one of the last people to
take leave so I kind of take the risk on the other end. I mean, I think I was only supposed to be in
country three more months by the time we left with them. It worked out for me because I took it
at the end so.
Interviewer: “Alright, now did you have a sense that you were making any progress or did
things seem to be the same when you left as they were when you got there?”
You know, as lower enlisted, I didn‟t see everything. Hopefully we made a difference in some
people‟s life but it‟s going take more than us staying there for a few months or a few years. And
It‟s If we‟re trying to change something- If you want to do big things, it takes a big amount of
time. Like we talked about with the surge, to win hearts and minds and to become a part of the
communities, can‟t do that here. So I didn‟t feel like we made some big changes. I think we
helped hopefully add some stability for hopefully the good people that were in the area to start
cleaning things up and put some infrastructure in but, I mean It‟s just you can‟t build relationships
in just a year. Especially when they‟ve seen it for the last six. They know that you're going to be
gone in “x” amount of months and then somebody else is going to come in and they‟re going to
have to restart the conversation. Started to make a big change doing things like that. (01:53:00)
Interviewer: “Alright, so now you‟re finishing your deployment kind of late in „07; now
how much time did you have left on your enlistment at that point?”
So we got back in November-ish and I think I had about a year, a year or so left on my enlistment.
So, got back, I was thinking about reenlisting. I enjoyed the infantry, I enjoyed jumping out of
airplanes but at that time I realized there was more I wanted to do. I wanted to do some more,
thinking kind of stuff, looking at military intelligence or whatever that might be. So I was in the
process of getting my security clearance squared away, I found out “Hey you‟re being shipped off
to Fort Hood”. I tried to protest. So the difficulty there is I didn‟t want to go. I wanted to start this
next phase of my career, but if you decline an order they would‟ve let me stay but then I couldn‟t
have reenlisted. So I tried to like “Well I don‟t have the required time”. You‟re supposed to have
like two years left on your contract or something like that, and they‟re like “Oh, we‟ll waive it,
don't worry about it”, like “okay” so off to Fort Hood I went. And then that's when I realized that,
I mean, there‟s a lot of good guys that serve there and I don't want to diminish them or what

�they‟ve done but there was a different mentality in the 82nd. There was a different level of
discipline and the things that I saw that when I got to Fort Hood that, just my time to be done.
Interviewer: “Now what unit was Fort Hood?”
That would‟ve been unit of the First Cavalry. I didn‟t get too attached, by that time I was just
disillusioned. I realized this wasn't going to be the rest of my career that, you know, I was just a
cog in the machine. It‟s a great thing the Army has a overall huge organization that‟s hard to run
but it just wasn't for me and I was ready to be done. (01:03:09)
Interviewer: “Alright, now let‟s backup again a little bit. Are there other incidents or
memories or impressions from the time in Iraq that kind of you...stand out for you that you
haven‟t brought into the story here yet?”
Oh goodness, no that‟s the one thing, like sittin‟ here today like when we talk about New Orleans
or things that kind of you remember then talk about Iraq there‟s different things. There's always
different war movies and things like that and I remember seeing Jarhead after I had deployed and
not the greatest movie but there's one moment where he‟s talking about his time deployed, the
character, and he‟s like “ It‟s like 99% you do nothing and then there‟s just 1% of just craziness”
And that‟s exactly what it‟s like, you‟re just...there's so many days and hours and time for just
sittin‟ in the middle of the desert staring at nothing I felt like and then there‟s these brief little
moments of craziness that get highlighted. You know, there‟s good moments and bad moments
you can know the guys that, for me it was all guys that served next to. You know, you‟re sharing
memories and you know, just doing little things. Whether it‟s you know, you found a way to
sneak a little booze into camp and you know you‟re having a drink and you‟re trying to let loose a
little bit but not too crazy and also not get caught so you don't have a whole, you know searchlight
on your unit. Just little moments like that. (01:04:39)
Interviewer: “What kind of, actually something we should‟ve gotten into earlier, what kind
of living facilities do you have, I mean when you're on C.O.B. Speicher for instance? You
know are you setting up barracks or things like that or were you just sleeping in bags,
or…?”
Oh man, by the time we got to C.O.B. Speicher, that place was a resort. They had a Burger King
and a whole bunch of other junk that you could go to. A big ol‟ chow hall and that was always
nice coming back from our month-long patrols and our whatever it would be and you‟d come
back in dirty and you‟d have this chow hall guard telling you you can‟t come into the hall because
you‟re dirty. You just look at him like “We will roll through you right now”. We‟ve been out for a
week, we‟re dirty, nasty, we understand it but we‟re hungry. We could roll through the chow hall
and you‟d get pizza, chicken, and whatever the hell else you wanted, that was definitely a resort.

�You‟d go back to, they call them CHUS, I don‟t know if I ever knew what that acronym was,
something housing unit. There‟s like a single, wide trailer split in two and three guys were in a
half and it had air conditioning and then one of the guys I served with, he was from Guam.
So that's definitely a tight knit community that we were able to...I say we, I just followed him
around and carried stuff. Santiago, went to some of his family that had been prior [?] deployed.
We had a satellite hooked up so we had some TV and we had an Xbox like that was, that was not
a hardship duty while we were at C.O.B. Speicher, but then when we did our time out in patrol
base Woodcock that, that was definitely a warehouse where we had some showers and we had to,
you‟d lose water pressure sometimes. So like you‟d lose power because somebody in the power
plant was trying to give us grief. So then our lieutenant would call up to the company command
and this company commander would call up and somebody would have to go out and give the
guys at the power station a little trouble. (01:06:41)
Interviewer: “Did you have contact with home? Did you have e-mail or Internet or anything
like that?”
Oh yeah, when we were on patrol there on C.O.B Speicher they had a little phone hut set up so we
could call and there were Internet stations but because we had Santiago's connections that we had
little satellite Internet in our room. Wasn‟t always fastest but I mean you‟d do some emails and
certain things like that. I can‟t remember all the different lower restrictions and I don‟t remember
emailing a lot while I was over there. I'm just, I think that‟s something they kept a pretty tight lid
on just for security reasons.
Interviewer: “So little different world from one that involves written letters and that kind of
thing”
Yeah.
Interviewer: “Alright, anything else out of the Iraq period that you want to bring into the
story?”
No, I think, you know, the biggest things that I wanted, you know I look at and I talk with people
about Iraq is that, you know kind of like I mentioned that this long-term change and its a lesson I
learned in my life that if you want to do big things you got to dedicate a big amount of time. No
matter where we‟re at in the world, there‟s good people. I mean there‟s very few people that want
to go out and murder, kill, and massacre people and rule the world. I truly believe that there's
good people and that's how we‟ll make a difference is by building those relationships, having
those conversations and building a better world. (01:08:11)
Interviewer: “Okay, so now we‟re going to go back. So you‟ve gone, you‟re at Fort Hood,
you‟ve basically decided, okay I'm going to get out. I guess one other thing there was when

�you come back from Iraq, do they do any kind of debriefing for you or do they talk to you at
all about transitioning back to being in the states? Or do they kind of just bring your back
and leave you to your own devices?”
It's a little bit of both. They get back and that‟s one thing they talk about, especially to the guys
that had been deployed and then had successful marriages that watching out for the guys that had
deployed for the first time. That they've been through it and watching out because you don‟t have
to deal with, there‟s a lot of stuff you don‟t have to deal with when you‟re deployed. You don‟t
have to deal with the kids crying so like, making sure that those guys are doing well and that's not
necessarily like big Army but that's just the guys in your unit taking care of each other. You do
get kind of put on a month lock down where you‟re not supposed to go on leave or anything, keep
everybody pretty close to home. There‟s a couple times I almost got in an accident, even after I'd
been home for a while because when we were in Iraq, we owned the roads. We weren‟t ever
going fast but, stop line didn‟t matter. We‟d put on our sirens and you‟d stop or you stopped. So
there‟s a couple times that I come up to an intersection, quick, brief, make sure nobody's coming,
all of a sudden I blow through a red light. There‟s a couple times that I had some close calls. They
try to keep you close to home and give you that chance to kind of reintegrate but there‟s nothing
like the one step programs just like you‟re here, you're staying close until this time period.
(01:10:00)
Interviewer: “So once you decide that you are going out and you're not reenlisting and so
forth, is there an exit process?”
Yeah, there‟s definitely lots of red tape. Just had some good friends that had kind of told me
beforehand like, you‟re going to have times where you get your records and you got to bring your
records from one place to the other. before you do that make a copy for yourself because it's if
you talk to other men and women that have tried to get their military records or health records
from the military after they‟re out, it's an absolute nightmare. So you get given this checklist, you
go to this briefing and then you just start checking stuff off a list; turn in your old uniform, turn in
your rucksack, check and somebody signs off. You just walk around with your little folder and go
“Here you go”, sign, check, okay I‟m good. Like, oh I gotta do this, Just go through the whole
rigmarole. There‟s that one day really, the one last stamp and put it down and they stamp it and
like, “yay, I‟m free!”
Interviewer: “Alright, so what do you do after you get out?” (01:11:06)
For me, I got out of the military „09. I got in my Jeep and I drove straight back from Texas. I had
a friend come down and ride with me but just straight trip back home to Grand Rapids, Michigan.
Got back and my original plan was to kind of take a second. I was fortunate that I had not used all
of my leave so I got a good chunk of change from that and had saved up a little bit of money. I
was going to take some time off and go to school right away. That didn‟t happen because I got

�home and at the time I was 23, all my friends by that time are either finishing up college or with
their careers so it wasn‟t like before I left where it‟s like “Hey, its Tuesday at noon, you want to
go do something?” You know, I‟m sittin‟ there living with my mom going “do do do do doo”
(melodically) and started ended looking for a job and I end up working with DT energy, so the gas
company here in Michigan. I worked for them in Muskegon doing meter reading and loved the
job. I would've stayed there for the rest of my career there; good guys, good company, they took
really good care of me, but then ended 2010. That‟s when I found out about that post 9/11 G.I.
Bill. So that kind of got me to go back to school. It was still a tough decision, you know, like
knowing that I would‟ve had a good life but the post 9/11 G.I. Bill with them paying tuition
directly to the school, giving me a book stipend and giving me a housing loan, so I didn‟t have to
worry about going to school full time and working full-time. Went back to school. That would‟ve
been 2011 that I started. Started off at Grand Rapids Community College, figured things out there
again and then started at Grand Valley in 2012, 13, whenever that was. Graduated from Grand
Valley in 2015 and then that's when I was a student there is, they pushed me to do internships and
ended up doing an internship at the March of Dimes and that‟s when I figured out that‟s where I
needed to be was in the nonprofit sector. I loved...the part about the army that I really loved was
service and that's what I found being back in nonprofit sector so that's what I do now. I work for
nonprofits and I raise money so we can do great things. (01:13:31)
Interviewer: “Alright, now you had mentioned that you had not been a particularly good
student in high school and things like that. Did you become a better student somewhere
along the way or how or when does that happen?”
Yeah, I think definitely realizing that, you know, the plans I had in high school, that‟s not tough. I
mean, that definitely helped a lot. Like I've been through things that will serve me for the rest of
life that I can just be like, meh, it‟s not so bad. I‟ve got a roof over my head, my bills are paid,
and I‟ve got food in my belly, so I‟m doing alright. I think the military was definitely a big part
for me in those experiences I had. You know, I had a lot of good guys that pushed me to do good
things, in the military and outside. So I think for me, going back to community college kind of
helped me figure it out. You know, I thought, “I'm 24, I know what I'm going to do.” I didn‟t have
a clue what I was going to do going back to college, so that gave me time to figure out. Didn‟t
have the greatest GPA leaving community college, but then going to Grand Valley, they allowed
me to start over with a fresh slate. That was kind of my moment of realizing where...you know,
when I joined the military, there was always the option that I could come home, when I joined DT
energy there was always the option that I could quick go back or do something else, well now
after having my life experience in being at Grand Valley there wasn't like...if Grand Valley
doesn't work out I can just go back and work at DTE. Like. I could try and get back in there but
there was no like, what's next. Like, I've fully dedicate myself something. So having that
realization then having my experience of like, “This isn‟t so bad! You show up, you write some
papers and you just pay attention and do what you need to do.” It‟s not so bad. (01:15:21)

�Interviewer: “So some of...so you are taking things out of that Army experience that you
now get to apply in the rest your life or at least gives you that sort of perspective on things.”
Oh yeah, there‟s days I hate to admit it, you know, there‟s kind of the...I don‟t know what the
right word for it is but the stereotypical guy, “Oh when I served…” you hear those guys when
you‟re in and you‟re like, “Yeah, sure”. Now I‟m to that point now I'm like realizing all these
things I learned about working for a company, setting strategy, setting goals, staying focused and
kind of how to organize, and sometimes just little things that I don't realize. One of things that
when I was in was I was always required to carry a notebook and pencil with me. Well now that
I‟m back in the corporate world and you talk with people when you‟re out and about, stuff comes
to you at random moments, having a notebook and a pen, and sometimes its a cell phone now, it
serves you well and you don't lose track of things. So there's things big and small that I‟ve taken
from and sometimes I'm like that guy, “Well when I was in... “ or “I learned this from the Army”
and it‟s like, it‟s a fine line.
Interviewer: “But it really did make a difference in terms of helping you become the person
you became.”
Yes
Interviewer: “Alright.”
That‟s one thing that I've talked about to some of the younger men and women that come and ask
me questions is, there's guys that I served with that came in saying, “The Army will change me”
and that‟s not, the right mindset is “The Army gave me the opportunity to change myself. I was
able to leave home, I was able to break out of that box that was already built around me” and say
like “Who do I want to be?” and “There's all these people that don't know me so I can be this
man” and that's the greatest expenses that I‟ve been able to take away is, I was able to become the
man I wanted to be.
Interviewer: “Alright, well thanks for good stories and thank you very much for coming in
and sharing.”
Thank you, Jim.

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                    <text>Grand Valley State University
Veteran’s History Project
Vietnam War
Michael Yocum
Interview Length: (01:38:51:00)
Early Life / Training / Pre-Vietnam Service (00:00:33:00)
 Born in Seattle, Washington and raised in the Mount St. Helens area
(00:00:33:00)
 Joined the Air Force right out of high school; when testing to get into the military,
his test score was a seventy-five, only ten points above the lower limit
(00:00:43:00)
 Only two services had jet aircraft, the Air Force or Navy (00:01:25:00)
o Yocum had high ranking relatives in the Navy and he did not want to run
into either of them and the Navy would not guarantee him what he asked
for (00:01:35:00)
o The Air Force gave him a signed contract that he would he asked for, so
long as he passed their school, which he did (00:01:53:00)
 Going into the Air Force was the only way that Yocum was going to get to work
on jets because they had none of the technical schools at the time (00:02:08:00)
 Signed a six month delayed enlistment but he forgot to read the final line at the
bottom, which said, “Or to the needs of the service” (00:02:26:00)
 Command called the recruiter and told him to pick up Yocum and get him down
to Portland, Oregon to ship out (00:02:48:00)
o Portland was a major military processing center, everybody except Coast
Guard went through and was where recruits had their physicals and
received their assignments (00:03:01:00)
 Yocum’s assignment was Lackland Air Force Base, San Antonio, Texas
(00:03:23:00)
 Boot camp was a lark because Yocum was an athlete and in good physical shape
and although it was a lark, there still was discipline and the men learned to be
military (00:03:48:00)
 After boot camp, he want to Amarillo Air Force Base for training as a jet aircraft
mechanic (00:04:18:00)
o They also had heavy aircraft at the base and Strategic Air Command
(SAC) tried to get him to switch but Yocum said “no, he wanted fighters,
not bombers” (00:04:33:00)
o When in school, he had a contract saying that he would not get certain
things (00:04:49:00)
 In training, he worked on trainer aircraft, aircraft that for some reason were not
flyable, but were good for someone to learn how to repair them (00:05:11:00)
o Some of the parts were wore out due to the number of times they had
come on and off (00:05:29:00)
o Would go through sections, beginning with a basic section – the
aerodynamics of the aircraft, and moving up (00:05:34:00)

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o There was both classroom and practical training (00:05:54:00)
Started training on the F-80, the first jet aircraft in the Air Force inventory and he
also worked on the F-100 and the F-101 (00:06:28:00)
Completed training in Amarillo and was then assigned to Glasgow Air Force Base
in Montana, a SAC base (00:07:14:00)
o Fighter mechanics did not have good SAC appetites (00:07:28:00)
o Yocum was assigned the job of transient alert, taking care of the planes
coming into the base, i.e. non-base aircraft (00:07:39:00)
 Most were fighters coming in from the West Coast headed east or
vice versa (00:07:46:00)
o The base was out of the way but a perfect drop-off spot (00:07:54:00)
o Was at Glasgow for approximately eighteen months (00:08:01:00)
o Worked twelve hours on and then thirty-six hours off (00:08:13:00)
 They had to have crew that was alert and ready to go on when
needed; like a fireman, many hours of twittling their thumbs then
instant action (00:08:24:00)
o One of Yocum’s jobs was taking out the “follow me” truck and bringing
in the B-52’s drag chutes, which weighed six hundred pounds
(00:08:43:00)
o Had an excellent group to work with and they got along well
(00:09:07:00)
Then went to RAF Bentwater in Great Britain (00:09:13:00)
o Learned quickly that in Europe, when they mentioned a Sunday driver, he
moved away from the driver because it referred to a driver that could
afford to only drive one day a week (00:09:20:00)
o One time, another guy went to the beach, became too tired and tried to
return home the next day and he and Yocum went up opposite sides of a
hill and they both ended up in Yocum’s lane (00:09:36:00)
 They crashed and Yocum had fourteen major fractures of the face
and lower jaw (00:09:53:00)
o Yocum was in the hospital for two months (00:10:11:00)
 The Air Force had to send him to a civilian hospital because they
did not have the proper equipment on the base or the time to get
him to the better hospital at Leighton because he was so injured
(00:10:19:00)
o Dr. Gay, the surgeon who worked on Yocum, specialized in facial
reconstruction and when Yocum arrived, Dr. Gay came in to check on
another patient and ended up picking to work on Yocum, saying that he
was the doctor’s to work on (00:10:37:00)
o He had to sit on the gurney because when they would lay him down, the
bones would move, causing pain; two police officers tried to do it at the
accident site and Yocum “threw them about twenty feet” (00:11:12:00)
o Dr. Gay really put his face back together and Yocum only lost two teeth in
the accident, although because of the accident, through the years, he has
slowly lost his teeth (00:11:33:00)

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Could not have a facial injury and he does not get into situations
that made an injury possible, including riding horses (00:11:55:00)
o The Air Force made checks on him, including sending a specialist, but Dr.
Gay would not sign off on until he believed Yocum would be safe to go
back (00:12:35:00)
 The Air Force could not have gotten him the same quality of care
at Leighton because they did not have the same quality of surgeons
(00:12:51:00)
 Dr. Gay rebuilt his face to the point that someone could not tell
Yocum had been in an accident and the only way to tell was to
look at pictures from before and after the accident (00:13:05:00)
o When he got out of the hospital, he was given light duty for six months
and not allowed to even go into a hanger, for fear that he might fall, so he
worked on tech orders i.e. filing the changes (00:13:19:00)
From Great Britain, he went to Maxwell Air Base in Montgomery, Alabama,
which was strictly an officer’s training base (00:13:59:00)
o Still worked transient alert, although now he had twenty four hours on
then seventy two hours off and one day off a month, meaning he had a
seven day period when he did not have to report to duty (00:14:21:00)
o Spent off time having a blast and when he was there, he volunteered for
Vietnam, but they turned him down three times before they allowed him to
go (00:14:44:00)
o The air base had a federal penitentiary on one side, so the base was locked
down several times whenever someone got out (00:15:04:00)
o Had no issues with officers and staying at Maxwell caused him to look at
officers as persons, rather than as entities (00:15:22:00)
 Once a month, they had a code-seven fly into the base, a full
colonel or above, for conferences and everyone else they parked in
the “outback 40” and took care of them when they could
(00:15:34:00)
o That was the one time he saw a real F-80, who came in from Mexico with
guns loaded and rockets armed and they had to call an Army missile base
to send someone down to dearm the aircraft; the aircraft turned out to be
an original 1950’s model aircraft (00:15:55:00)
The Air Force turned down his Vietnam requests because they did not want to
have to replace him; they had somebody good and they tried to hold on to him
(00:16:51:00)
o He knew he would have to go to Vietnam so instead of being grabbed and
given non-volunteer status, he wanted volunteer status (00:17:01:00)
From Maxwell, he spent three months at Clovis Air Force Base in New Mexico
training on the F-100 aircraft and from Clovis, he went to Phan Rang Air Force
Base in September, 1967 (00:17:14:00)
Not everyone in a squadron went to Vietnam at the same time; they started with
the ground crew, then the NCOs to train the ground crew and then the officers
(00:17:41:00)

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On most aircraft, to change a tire, they would slide the main wheel over the brake
but on the F-100, they put on the main wheel then slid in the main brake, attach
the hydraulic system, and bleed the hydraulic system (00:18:08:00)
o A main tire change on the F-100 took and hour and a quarter of work, but
when working on the F-101, twenty-five minutes and Yocum was done
changing the tire (00:18:28:00)
Taking the aft section off the F-100 to fix the engine was difficult; most aircraft
allowed the engine to drop out, but with the F-100, they had to take the tail
section off (00:18:42:00)
The F-100 was the first of the serious dedicated fighters, including afterburners
(00:19:04:00)
o Afterburners were a kick in the butt when the pilot wanted to move, but
they used copious amounts of fuel, so if a pilot used afterburners, he used
them with caution (00:19:29:00)
The crew Yocum worked with got to the point when they did an aft section off,
people thought is was a Chinese fire drill (00:19:49:00)
o Yocum’s first job was to get onto the back of the aircraft and put the
engine hanger until the others pinned the engine so it would not roll out of
the aircraft (00:20:12:00)
o Another one of Yocum’s jobs was breaking loose the four nuts that held
the aft section on and once the repair was complete, Yocum’s job was to
torque the nuts back into place (00:20:38:00)
 Took three thousands foot pounds (one hundred and forty four inch
pounds to a foot pound) to torque the nuts back into place, whereas
an average car tire requires sixty to eighty inch pounds to be
torqued (00:21:01:00)
Was at Clovis to learn the F-100 and its inner sequences and to get him over to
Vietnam, where he could be working and training at the same time (00:21:47:00)

Vietnam Deployment (00:22:05:00)
 Flew on a commercial aircraft leased to the military on an eighteen hour flight in
a packed 707 aircraft (00:22:05:00)
 Passengers were all military personnel because Cam Ranh was the dispersal point
in Vietnam and when they deplaned in Cam Ranh, they divided up amongst the
different services (00:22:25:00)
 Getting into Cam Ranh was stepping into a sauna bath; high moisture and high
heat, but he was used to it from growing up where he did on the upper West Coast
(00:23:00:00)
 At Phan Rang, he was assigned to the 352nd Attack Fighter Squadron, which was
flying F-100s at the time (00:23:43:00)
o Nothing on the base except F-100s and OV-10’s, an observation aircraft
used to drop markers on Charlie for the F-100s to attack (00:23:51:00)
 While a Phan Rang, five or six times, they loaded daisy cutters, a thousand pound
bomb with a sixteen foot fuse in front (00:24:16:00)

�

o The bomb would explode two inches off the ground, leaving no hole but
destroying everything above two inches for a five hundred to one thousand
foot radius from the impact point (00:24:32:00)
o Bombs would destroy anything but was used mainly to create landing
zones in the jungle for helicopters (00:24:49:00)
o One time while he was there, they had a high priority to get create some
landing zones (00:25:02:00)
 They knew a North Vietnamese Army Group was in the jungle
somewhere and the Air Force ended up finding them
serendipitously (00:25:10:00)
 The spot the Air Force had chosen to drop the daisy cutters was
directly in the middle of the Army Group, leaving nothing much
but a sponge job (00:25:20:00)
From Cam Ranh, he took a C-131 out to Phan Rang (00:25:56:00)

Phan Rang (00:26:06:00)
 Good sized base, although today would be considered a medium sized base, with
an emergency runway built with planking at the starting of the base and a concrete
runway and taxiway (00:26:06:00)
 Had three layers of fencing, each one covered with razor darts and tm wire, which
would cut through even a leather glove (00:26:33:00)
 They also had Army troops at the base and they would wake up at night when the
Army stopped firing the 105s because when it was silent was when they worried
(00:26:56:00)
 One of the first things the enlisted men in the squadron did was look at their
bunker and decided it was not safe (00:27:08:00)
o They sat, designed, and built a new bunker which could take a 105 round
direct hit and not collapse (00:27:26:00)
o They tore down the old bunker and proceeded to build a new bunker
(00:27:43:00)
 Took two 50 gallon barrels, welded them together and filled them
with sand and on each side, they had two layers of sandbags and an
openings they filled with sand (00:27:46:00)
 Covered the roof with old planking and did the same thing with the
sandbags (00:28:18:00)
 Planking was a honeycombed landing strip designed to be
dropped in a place so a plane could land (00:28:32:00)
 Coming under fire was not common but it happened enough to make them realize
that they needed some kind of protection (00:28:56:00)
 They had a new base commander come in about four or five months following the
Tet offensive and they received a mortar hit on the base (00:29:07:00)
o At the time, Charlie did not have a base line, making it difficult to pinpoint
attacks on the base and during the attack, the new commander got on the
AM radio and gave Charlie a complete hit report (00:29:24:00)

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o The others drove an APC down to the command center, put the
commander into it, drove the APC onto a C-131 and flew the commander
out of county (00:30:21:00)
o Charlie had no base line to attack the base, not allowing to move their
artillery and although the commander was trying to calm people down, he
just used the wrong entity to do it with, the unsecure AM radio
(00:30:57:00)
o The base was hit a more frequently following the incident (00:31:36:00)
Incoming fire was mostly mortars (00:31:41:00)
o The enemy tried rocket attacks but whenever they would launch the
attacks, the Air Force would have something hitting the launch sites and
shooting the rockets out of the air (00:31:48:00)
They could go off base from seven am to six pm (00:32:02:00)
o They had three men from New York who decided to get haircuts at 5:00
and miss curfew and all three ended up dead (00:32:13:00)
o If they were off base and it was after six, they were dead (00:32:42:00)
They had civilians working on base and if they worked on base after six pm, they
stayed on base all night and were released in the morning (00:32:58:00)
Vietnam was his best time ever in the service (00:33:18:00)
From Vietnam, he went to Mountain Home Air Force Base in Idaho and ended up
going to another tech school (00:33:28:00)
o At one point, Yocum had a disagreement with an NCO and Yocum gave
“him a physics lesson” (00:33:40:00)
 They were on the second floor of a building and they did not have
landings to go down to the first floor and the NCO told Yocum to
do something non-military, which Yocum took affront to
(00:33:53:00)
 The NCO kept giving Yocum bad reports and one night, he ticked
Yocum off too much and Yocum leaned him over the side of the
staircase then slammed him against the wall (00:34:10:00)
o A week later, Yocum was in another tech school (00:34:33:00)
Every base came under attack during the Tet Offensive (00:34:51:00)
o The enemy had tunnels between the second and third row of fencing out
(00:34:55:00)
o First row was the base perimeter then thirty feet out was the second fence
and another thirty feet out was the third fence (00:35:02:00)
o The army forces defending the base dropped a mortar round directly into
the tunnel (00:35:25:00)
Everyone was on high alert for all the entire Tet season, meaning sixteen hour
days on the line, not including personal time (00:35:37:00)
o Normal day was twelve hours a day, six days a week, although sometimes
they went up to fourteen (00:35:58:00)
o They would get exhausted but would be refreshed by the day off
(00:36:10:00)
The actual attack on the base did not last long because they had 105 artillery and
the infantry and no enemy made it onto the base (00:36:28:00)

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The enemy tried to bombard the base, but this was before they had the base line
(00:37:16:00)
o They had an Army construction unit on the base, which fixed any
problems to the point that the enemy could not tell what had been repaired
and what had not (00:37:22:00)
o They knew that Charlie sent people in on base as workers but there was
not a way for them to tell where the rounds had impacted (00:37:53:00)
In thirty days, they had a turnover of the entire squadron from bottom to top
(00:38:30:00)
o They had ten days to get the bottom troops used to the situation, then on to
the NCOs and finally the officers (00:38:38:00)
o The officers did not come in with a completely green unit; the others were
not ripe, but they were not green either (00:38:57:00)
After being in the military for eight to ten years, he could not go to a place
without running into someone he knew (00:39:41:00)
o The military is a very big small town and the longer Yocum was in, the
more he knew, both jobs and people (00:39:53:00)
Was at Phan Rang from 1967 to 1968; arrived at the end of his fifth year of
service and left at the end of his sixth year (00:40:12:00)
In the 352nd, they worked with munitions people; they did not specify only doing
specific jobs (00:40:34:00)
o When the munitions people were loading the .50 caliber guns, they would
tell Yocum readings on instruments around them so that he could do
service on them (00:40:48:00)
o They worked as teams, splitting each group in half and working on two
planes at once (00:41:28:00)
o One time, some high ranking officers had to have combat time and at the
appointed time, the planes from all three bases squadrons were not ready;
within thirty minutes, the 352nd planes were locked, loaded, and moving
out (00:41:47:00)
The 352nd had a much higher performance level than the other two squadrons on
the base (00:42:19:00)
o They did not have turf, saying that only a certain man could do a job; if a
job needed to be done, then they did it what they could (00:42:21:00)
o The enlisted men decided serendipitously to work together, instead of
against each other (00:43:12:00)
o Munitions had arrived a month before the mechanics; they changed units
by months so that there was always crews on hand (00:43:32:00)
o There was nothing wrong with doing something you could do to help
someone get the job done quicker, which was the whole idea behind
working together; the work had to be done, either singly or together, so
why do more work than necessary (00:43:54:00)
o The major and the captain in the squadron allowed the men to continue
working together; there was no animosity as long as the job was being
done 100% correctly (00:44:27:00)

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o They worked as a unit, half mechanics / half munitions to get one plane
done (00:44:46:00)
The pilots were a separate group of people; they would come in whenever the
plane was ready in an air-conditioned van (00:45:05:00)
o The ground crew would assist in prepping the aircraft, starting it,
marshalling the plane out, and sending it on its way (00:45:17:00)
o The Air Force is easier about contact between an officer and an enlisted
man but there is still a line dividing them; the two sides got along and got
to know each other, but they did not fraternize with each other
(00:45:45:00)
 The officers did not go to the NCO club and vice versa
(00:46:09:00)
Normal week was twelve hours a day, six days a week, then up to fourteen hours
a day, six days a week, then seven days a week and when it really got bad, it was
sixteen hours a day, seven days a week (00:46:27:00)
o There was always at least two time period groups overlapping each other;
the new group would talk with the old group to figure out what was
happening and once everything was going well, the old group would go
back (00:46:42:00)
The planes had been built in the late 1950’s and had done their time, but Yocum
saw things that dispelled the myth that the aircraft could not do something; i.e. an
F-100 with a two foot diameter hole in the wing that should not be able to fly, but
the pilot managed to land the plane on ground successfully (00:47:12:00)
o When they had unload the equipment from it, what was left of the airplane
was hauled over to the fire pits for the firefighters to train on
(00:47:55:00)
o One time, he was running a Deuce and a Half truck to start up an aircraft
when another Deuce and a Half caught fire and Yocum attempted to haul
the plane to safety (00:48:15:00)
 Another man, seeing what was happening, swung a cable and
dislocated Yocum’s ankle (00:48:30:00)
 Yocum believed he was dead because they had napalm and antipersonal bombs on the plane (00:48:53:00)
 They had to send someone running after Yocum to catch him
(00:49:56:00)
Yocum did things in Vietnam that under normal conditions are physically
impossible to do, including a standing high jump of twenty four feet
(00:50:02:00)
o A stray bomblet was coming towards a group and when it impacted, it did
not explode; they could hear crickets because there was nobody around,
they had all somehow gotten out of the way (00:50:19:00)
o They had twenty-four foot tall steel walls, which Yocum cleared and then
flattened his body down (00:50:43:00)
They had a pilot that they hated because he was guaranteed one main tire change
whenever he landed (00:51:08:00)

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o One time, an enemy plane fired an HE 20 mm shell that went up the intake
and lodged in the instrument panel in front of the pilot (00:51:23:00)
o The rounds were made to explode upon impact and if the pilot landed
rough, then the round would explode; the pilot ended up landing smooth
(00:51:59:00)
o The munitions crew dearmed the aircraft, the ground crew took the canopy
off and took the seat out (00:52:39:00)
o Yocum told the men working on the instruments that they had a choice:
they could go in an disconnect all the instruments or Yocum could go in
and cut everything eighteen inches back (00:52:50:00)
 The instrument panel was held in with thirty-six spring snap locks
and Yocum had to make sure that the locks did not snap, or the
round would explode (00:53:21:00)
o Yocum ended up freeing the panel, hooking wires from a crane to the
panel and getting off the plane before gingerly moving the panel out with
a wire (00:53:58:00)
o They built a thirty-six diameter sand bag pit and buried the panel plus a
quarter pound of C4; the explosion nearly lifted the panel back up
(00:54:20:00)
o When they wanted the instruments, Yocum took what was left in a box
plus a letter saying it was combat damage and gave it to supply
(00:54:43:00)
Went once to Bangkok (00:55:36:00)
Was going to go to Japan but they had an alert and they canceled all leaves
(00:55:39:00)
o They had to fly planes up near the Vietnamese border and by the time they
were done, he did not have enough time to take the R&amp;R (00:55:53:00)
Going to Bangkok was nice because he could relax; he did not have to worry
about the bad guy being one or two chairs over (00:56:14:00)
They were always nervous when they initially left the base (00:56:26:00)
o Yocum had a pineapple hand grenade thrown into his lap; it did not go off
and Yocum is still trying to figure out how he put his body through a steelrimmed hole smaller than his body (00:56:34:00)
o With the right incentive, you could do almost anything (00:56:55:00)
o Yocum had been off-base, downtown, getting on a “putt-putt” cab to
return to base when a grenade came in, bounced once and when it hit
again, it exploded (00:57:02:00)
o The Vietnamese would take a bicycle and pack the frame with C4; three or
four pounds of C4 would go off against the wall, so that the blast would
come out into the street (00:57:40:00)
They were always in non-combat situations, although they did receive some
combat situations; their main job was to make sure that the grounds guys had
airplanes ready for them to use (00:58:16:00)
Information on the success of the mission the crew participated in was classified
(00:58:57:00)

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o “Don’t ask, don’t tell”, even if they knew the officer; if they asked, then
the officer had to report them (00:59:01:00)
They knew quite a bit about the actual war because Phan Rang was the in-country
R&amp;R location of the 1st Infantry Division, the “Big Red One”, as well as a base
for Australians using the B-57 (00:59:17:00)
o They had sources of information; including the military newspaper, Stars
and Stripes, and some radio programs (00:59:44:00)
o They did not know which operations they were supporting; that
information was strictly “need to know” (01:00:18:00)
Another memorable moment was when “Puff” came online (01:00:51:00)
o “Puff” was an armed C-47; an old C-47 changed into an AC-47 by placing
gatling guns transversed through the fuselage (01:00:58:00)
o At night, they could watch as a red arch went from the plane to the
ground; only every fifth round caused the red arch, indicating a
tremendous rate of fire (01:01:17:00)
 Take a football field, including end zones, and divide it up into one
foot squares and within three minutes, every square would have a
bullet in it (01:01:50:00)
o The firing sounded like a buzzsaw (01:02:17:00)
o They could see the plane in action because they knew where to look; at
night, they would look in a specific area (01:02:27:00)
o “Puff” would land at Phan Rang to get serviced before returning to their
main base; one of the planes that came in was older than Yocum, the
frame had been built in 1942 (01:02:49:00)
o When they went up to the C-119 and AC’d them, they became a nasty
aircraft; when these planes came online, they gave “Puff” to the
Vietnamese to use (01:03:23:00)
 The aircraft carried two 75 mm recoilless rifles in the tail, four 20
mm gatling guns, and another pair of recoilless rifles
(01:03:43:00)
 The planes could attack from the side or the tail and Charlie hated
them because they could not hear the planes (01:03:59:00)
o If the planes spotted Charlie, the whole area was saturated (01:04:08:00)
o The C-119 was just coming in when Yocum was leaving but he knew
about them (01:04:18:00)
Anybody worth his salt had a hundred day calendar; as soon as he hit a hundred
days, he had the calendar up and was marking it off (01:04:31:00)
o Near the end, everybody was packing up and getting ready to go while
waiting for their replacement body and as soon as someone’s replacement
arrived, the first person left because they did not have enough bunks for
two groups (01:04:49:00)
They did the replacements in a steady enough flow so that there were no problems
(01:05:07:00)
o In the last ten to twenty days of their time, the Air Force would bring in a
group of ten to twenty guys and twenty guys from the base would leave;
some men left before Yocum and some left after (01:05:14:00)

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o The replacements had to be trained and shown what to do (01:05:45:00)
o Yocum does not know what happened to the 352nd after he left, although
he knows that it was deactivated (01:05:48:00)
In a war zone, you were either the best or the worst; there was not mediocre
because they did not have time to be (01:06:00:00)
o The men he worked with were the best group of guys he had ever been
with and although he cannot hardly remember any of the names of the
men he served with, he does remember what they did there (01:06:12:00)
While he was recovering from his dislocated ankle, he was placed temporarily in
charge of non-powered equipment (01:06:24:00)
o The position was supposed to be temporary but the man Yocum served
under received an emergency, had to return to the United States and
Yocum stayed in the position for the rest of his tour (01:06:36:00)
o Yocum eventually got payback (01:07:00:00)
 He had ordered thirty-six rolls of three inch wide reflective tape
but instead he got three rolls of thirty-six inch wide tape
(01:07:09:00)
 The tape was non-returnable, so whenever someone needed to put
a number on their vehicle, they would have to barter with Yocum
(01:07:25:00)
 Yocum eventually had the best spray guns, compressors,
etc., because every piece needed a number on it
(01:07:36:00)
 He even ended up with a cargo container to lock his stuff
up in, when before he had just a wood shack (01:08:01:00)
o He wanted to get back to working on planes but he did not because there
was no one able to take over the position (01:08:23:00)
o They flew a man in when Yocum had forty-five days left so that Yocum
could show him the ropes (01:08:31:00)
Returned to the United States September, 1968 (01:08:55:00)
o Any time someone transferred, they had the opportunity for leave, so long
as they had the time and they could borrow time, but only up to fifteen
days (01:09:01:00)
o Yocum had been in country for twelve months without leave, so he earned
thirty days worth of leave (01:09:12:00)
o Came back and landed in Seattle and on his leave, he circumvented the
United States; did not complete the last six hundred miles of the trip,
although he completed it later when he had a new car (01:09:24:00)
Following his leave, he reported to Mountain Home Air Force Base in Idaho; he
lived six hundred miles west of the base and on a three day leave, it took him ten
and a half to eleven hours to get home (01:10:16:00)
College kids had changed their attitudes towards soldiers, thanks largely to inept
politicians (01:10:55:00)
o The one guy that Yocum thought he could trust was Walter Cronkite, but
he turned out to be one of the worst; people trusted his word and he lied,
which really upset Yocum (01:11:05:00)

�



o Yocum had to be careful when he was around college towns because the
students would go after anything military and those who went to Vietnam
paid the price and never received a welcome (01:11:35:00)
 They went out and did what they had to do and the students had no
right to criticizes them (01:12:02:00)
o Walter Cronkite would cherry pick the news scenes to show what the
soldiers were doing, both good and bad, although the soldiers did more
good than bad in comparison to the news (01:12:08:00)
 They helped with building schools and tried to interact with the
local people, but the news portrayed them as gunning down
everyone they saw and blowing everything up (01:12:24:00)
o Yocum felt bad for the little girl in the famous napalm photo but Charlie
was there and he always hid behind the civilians (01:12:46:00)
o They had places that they could not attack and this was where Charlie was
(01:12:59:00)
 Charlie had an old temple which served as his munitions storage
but the Air Force could not attack it (01:13:05:00)
o When they stopped the B-52 raids, they had Charlie broken if they had not
stopped the raids; once Charlie figured out the Air Force would only go so
far, Charlie knew they had the Air Force (01:13:24:00)
o Presently the politicians are not micromanaging as bad as they did during
Vietnam but there is still political micromanagement (01:13:45:00)
 Let the military do the job it was trained to do; if the military had
its hands tied, then they could not do the job as well (01:13:51:00)
Like World War II, the military had to go in and decimate Vietnam and then let
the country rebuild (01:14:26:00)
o They had to go in and win the war first, then go in and do the politics; do
not go in and do the politics while fighting because it would cause the
military to lose (01:15:12:00)
o He sees World War II and the veterans are not angry, the Korean war and
how the veterans were a little angry, and finally Vietnam, were the
veterans are angry because they were punished for not doing the job and
not being allowed to do the job (01:15:57:00)
o The soldiers did not have the ability to make decisions (01:16:26:00)
One thing he wishes they had back in Vietnam was the A-10 attack fighter; the
ground crews love it and the pilots love it because they are well-protected
(01:16:32:00)

Post-Vietnam Service (01:17:08:00)
 Was discharged from the Air Force in 1980 (01:17:08:00)
 Starting at Mountain Home, he was an aircraft mechanic and this was where he
had the disagreement with an NCO (01:17:18:00)
o Air Force policy was to separate the men, so they sent Yocum to test
school and the NCO was not allowed to reenlist because soldiers had to be
given the invitation to reenlist or they would not be able to reenlist and
they would have to request retirement (01:17:30:00)

�








o Yocum knows a man who was discharged for twenty-six years without
retirement because his son did something illegal overseas (01:17:57:00)
If a soldier’s family does something wrong, then the soldier loses his enlistment,
which was what happened to Yocum (01:18:15:00)
o Yocum fought his discharge and managed to get to Jimmy Carter’s desk
(01:18:44:00)
o He was not scheduled to be reviewed until January 27th but on the day
before Thanksgiving, he was told he only had six days to leave the base
(01:18:48:00)
From Mountain Home, he went to Germany, where he served for four years;
originally was to be three years but the after their eighteen month party, their time
was extended another twelve months (01:19:19:00)
o Was at Bitburg Air Force Base, the Air Force Base that President Reagan
flew into (01:19:56:00)
o There was a controversy because the news media portrayed the President
as he was going to lay flowers at an old SS cemetery, when in reality, he
had to go past the cemetery to even get out of the base (01:20:29:00)
o Excellent base to serve at; got to know his ex-wife, who he married and
brought over to the United States (01:20:49:00)
From Germany, he went to Griffiths Air Force Base in Rome, New York, where
Woodstock II occurred (01:21:02:00)
From Griffiths, he and his wife lost a child and so the Air Force reassigned him to
an Air Base in Spokane, Washington (01:21:17:00)
o He and his wife had another child and Yocum received orders in 1976
sending him back to RAF Bentwater (01:21:34:00)
He should have known something was wrong with the troubles he was having, but
he did not and when he found out, he exploded (01:21:47:00)
o Personal information that destroyed his career (01:21:58:00)

Post-Military Life (01:22:13:00)
 When Yocum was discharged, he was angry and although he is still upset, he is
not angry because the Air Force did what they had to do (01:22:13:00)
 Upon discharge, Yocum did not look for work and instead tried to get medical
because he messed his back up when he was stationed at Griffiths; he bent over
and ripped every muscle in his spine (01:22:33:00)
o Over time, the pain has gotten worse and although he does the exercises
that he can, he is limited (01:23:01:00)
o The injury makes him unhireable because he is not able to do simple tasks,
such as stand for two hours or lift his back (01:23:09:00)
o It took him seven years of non-government funded therapy to get over his
anger (01:23:47:00)
 Married his second wife just before his discharge in November of 1980
(01:23:52:00)
o He did not plan to be reviewed until late January or early February of the
next year when all of the sudden, he was discharged (01:24:02:00)

�








His second wife had a job that she worked at and Yocum kept up doing odd jobs
but he could never keep anything permanent (01:24:28:00)
o Finally, in 1985, Yocum was able to go back to school (01:24:37:00)
o Normally, with the trade he had chosen, Yocum would have gone to an
electronics school (01:24:45:00)
o When Yocum graduated, the major electronics companies, including IBM,
released a lot of their experienced technicians, making it difficult for an
untrained person, such a Yocum, to find a job (01:24:52:00)
His second wife is from Michigan and her parents live around the Crystal Lake
area (01:25:17:00)
He and his wife have two sons: the oldest son has been in the Air Force for ten
years and loves it and the youngest son recently married at the time of the
interview (01:25:33:00)
Yocum is still trying a few things to work out his problems and he has to dig
through records to prove what he has claimed, including civilian X-Rays that
show he does have problems in his back and hips (01:25:47:00)
o Every so often, he hears a click and his legs become rubber because a
nerve is being pinched in his back and no signals go to his legs
(01:26:18:00)
o Yocum does not count on much anymore, which contributes to his anger
at the Air Force and although he receives a small pension for his face, he
believes that the Air Force owes him a lot more (01:26:47:00)
He learned quickly in the military that it was all or nothing and there is no inbetween (01:27:07:00)
His time in the Air Force gave him a lot of knowledge, which he tried using but
because he had no college degree, it was difficult (01:27:55:00)
o One time, he went to an interview and told the interviewer to point out
something that he needed to be more productive; Yocum went in and fixed
one of the man’s slower production lines, making it more productive
(01:28:09:00)
o The man ended up hiring a college graduate and not hiring Yocum
because he did not have a college degree; Yocum told the man off, which
turned out to not be a smart decision (01:28:46:00)
o He showed the man what he could do and that he was not a dummy, just
because he did not have a piece of paper to hang on his wall; that had been
his job in the service, to keep production running smoothly (01:29:14:00)
o He loved doing the job, but management viewed the service as a burn-out
field; he went in and either became a cinder or a piece of steel and most
become cinders (01:29:48:00)
 The men were under stress because the top was always looking
down and the bottom did not like what they were doing and the
men were the center of the target (01:30:06:00)
 As long as Yocum did his job, nobody knew, but if he failed,
everybody knew (01:30:23:00)
o The men did not mind the problem although they did have some men who
were afraid to make a move, lest they upset someone (01:30:33:00)

�








o Twice in eleven years, Yocum had to go to his commander, both colonels
and after doing non-verbal communication, he was told to leave
(01:31:01:00)
Presently, civilians and the media are treating the soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan
better, but they are still not treating the soldiers right (01:32:13:00)
o Yocum is happy to see that when they come back, there are happy crowds
and not agree crowds, although the crowds are mostly the soldier’s
relatives; anyone that is bad is kept away; during Yocum’s time, the
people would get right into his face (01:32:19:00)
o When his son returns, people see him in his uniform and they know who
he is (01:33:01:00)
 He did four years of ROTC at Central Michigan, which was a
shock because Yocum did not recommend it, although the son used
him as a source for military protocol, which gave him a two rank
increase upon his graduation (01:33:04:00)
 Makes Yocum proud because until the son is ready, he will not
take the test to move up in rank (01:33:38:00)
 He has seen too many men burn out to the point that they cannot
do their job (01:34:46:00)
Try to get into a good field, but do not count on the field being the same when
you get out of school (01:35:30:00)
Do not reject the chance to go to school (01:35:58:00)
o Yocum would love to go back to school (01:36:10:00)
One time, when he was in a class, the teacher made Yocum assist the other
students (01:36:66:00)
o In the military, anyone over an E-5 takes classes to learn what they can do,
what they cannot do, what they need to do, and what they should never do
and they receive this training yearly (01:36:43:00)
If Yocum ever does go back to school, he never has to take the general education
classes (01:37:14:00)
He had wanted to switch over to accounting because he liked numbers
(01:37:30:00)

�</text>
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                    <text>Grand Valley State University
Veterans' History Project
David Yonts
Vietnam War
1 hour 26 minutes 59 seconds
(00:00:15) Early Life
-Born in West Virginia in February 1950
-Came from a family of coal miners
-When he was nine or ten months old his family moved to Kentucky
-Grew up in Kentucky
-Attended school in Kentucky
-Met his wife when they were in high school
-Got married when she was still a junior in high school
-Got a job working with cars
-Graduated from high school in 1968
-Had a job at a Studebaker dealership in high school
-Went to work for his uncle at his uncle's Texaco station
(00:01:54) Getting Drafted
-Married for one year when he got drafted on August 31, 1969
-Wife came home from work and he told her that he had been drafted
-Given ten days to report for duty
(00:02:53) Knowledge of the Vietnam War
-Didn't know a lot about the Vietnam War
-Heard stories about soldiers coming back from Vietnam
-Knew that he didn't want to go fight in Vietnam
-Didn't know the politics of the war
(00:03:39) Basic Training
-Went to Fort Knox, Kentucky for basic training
-Went from Ashland, Kentucky to Fort Knox by bus
-Arrived at Fort Knox at dusk
-Greeted by a private first class screaming at the recruits to get off the bus
-Assigned a place to sleep
-Next day given a haircut, a quick breakfast, vaccinations, uniforms, boots, and clothing
-Took an entire day to get processed
-Most of the recruits were from Kentucky, West Virginia, and Michigan
-In retrospect understands why basic training was done the way it was
-Drill instructors were trying to break down individualism
-Teaching them discipline and to follow orders
-Learned not to be flip with superiors
-Taught to work as a unit
-Help each other and think as a group rather than as an individual
-Received weapons training
-Did well with rifle training
-Wonders if that led to him getting assigned to the infantry

�-Only had two or three recruits that had to start basic training over
-Some men were physically and mentally unfit to be soldiers
-Completed basic training anyway
-Majority of men were capable of being soldiers
(00:10:59) Infantry Training
-Sent to Fort Ord, California for Infantry Training
-Company commander was a Ranger in the 101st Airborne Division
-Meant that he was assigned to the 101st Airborne Division
-Training lasted eight weeks
-More physically demanding than basic training
-Learned how to rappel out of helicopters
-Received more weapons training
-Learned how to read maps
-Went through simulated Vietnamese villages
-Knew then that he was going to get deployed to Vietnam
-Went on a lot of marches
-Not allowed to go off base until the seventh week of training
-Only thing to do was to go into town and drink
(00:14:55) Assignment to Fort Hood
-During seventh week of Infantry Training he learned that his wife was pregnant
-Wanted to go home, or at least stay in the U.S. until his wife gave birth
-Talked to a chaplain who talked to David's superiors
-Granted a deferment and assignment to Fort Hood, Texas until his wife gave birth
-Worked in the motor pool at Fort Hood
-Daughter was born on May 6, 1970
-Able to talk to his wife on the phone
-Went to the PX and bought some celebratory cigars
-Same day that his daughter was born he received orders for Vietnam
(00:17:35) Deployment to Vietnam
-Given three and a half weeks of leave home before being deployed
-Got to see his wife and his baby daughter
-Felt like a part of his heart was torn out knowing he might die in Vietnam
-Took a lot of pictures with his wife and daughter
-When he was in Vietnam he sent a lot of voice recordings back to her
-Went to California and boarded a plane
-Stopped in Alaska and picked up more military personnel
-Flew to Japan
-Flew on a chartered American Airlines jet
(00:20:03) Arrival in Vietnam
-Landed at Saigon
-Went through an in-country orientation process
-Explained the assignment process
-Did it backwards alphabetically, so his name was the fifth one called
(00:21:05) Assignment to the 101st Airborne Division
-He was assigned to the 101st Airborne Division operating near Phu Bai
-Flew up to Phu Bai in a C-130

�-Gto to Phu Bai on July 1, 1970
-Received more in-country orientation
-Cultural awareness training
-Told by one sergeant to shoot first and ask questions later
-In theory, U.S. troops only shot at someone after being shot at
-In reality, if you waited to shoot you would probably get killed
-Got assigned to Alpha Company of the 2nd Battalion, 506th Infantry Regiment, 101st
Airborne
-He had already received air assault training in California, so he didn't need to go through
SERTS
-Note: SERTS: Screaming Eagle Replacement Training School
-Joined Alpha Company on July 7, 1970 at Camp Evans
(00:24:35) Siege of Firebase Ripcord Pt. 1
-Note: Since July 1, 1970 the North Vietnamese had been attacking Firebase Ripcord
-On July 8, 1970 he went into the field to join Alpha Company
-Boarded the third helicopter out of Camp Evans that day
-Told that he would be dropped off at Firebase Ripcord and A Company would go
there
-Couldn't go directly to A Company because they were in a firefight
-Remembers the countryside going from green and vibrant to brown and war torn
-Thought the firebase didn't look too bad
-Immediately assigned to a foxhole on the perimeter with three other soldiers
-The three other men had been in the field and told him the situation
-Heard a lot of small arms fire around the bottom of the hill Ripcord was on
-From July 9 - July 23 (fall of Ripcord) they were under siege
-He never got into the field
-Assigned to a bunker on the perimeter at night
-First night on the perimeter he didn't sleep
-Set out land mines at night
-The next day they were turned around so the explosion would go toward the
bunker
-North Vietnamese had gotten that close without being detected
(00:30:13) Firebase Ripcord-Details
-Ripcord was on the top of a hill
-Tactical operations center (TOC) was at the top of the hill in the middle of the
hill
-Artillery batteries surrounded the TOC
-Farther down the hill was the perimeter consisting of bunkers and foxholes
-Each bunker was 20 to 30 feet apart
-Perimeter was 30 feet away from the bottom of the hill
-Bunker dugout was the size of a king size bed
-Wood made a roof over the dug out
-Sandbags went on top of the wood
-Each bunker was manned by four men
-A trench went out to a collection of foxholes in front of the
bunker

�-Called the bunker the "house" and the foxhole "his porch"
(00:33:30) Siege of Firebase Ripcord Pt. 2
-Bombardment of Ripcord got more intense as July went on
-Heard movement beyond the perimeter
-Ordered not to fire because it might be American soldiers and not Vietnamese
-Took a lot of mortar fire
-His bunker never took a direct hit
-A lot of shells landed around his bunker though
-Later in July they took more small arms fire
-Had a nearby bunker that served as their latrine
-Couldn't go to the bathroom without worrying about getting hit
-Only went if he absolutely had to go
-Got resupplied by helicopters during the siege
-Helicopters would fly in, quickly drop off supplies, then fly out as fast as they
could
-On July 18, 1970 a Chinook helicopter was shot down and crashed into an ammunition
dump
-If the hill was a clock, the helicopter crashed at 3 o'clock and he was at 7 o'clock
-Initially thought a B-52 accidentally bombed the firebase
-Ordered to stay in his bunker and stay down until all of the ordnance had cooked
off
-Learned to stay aware, understand that he could get killed, and to look out for himself
-Heightened security and put two men on watch instead of just one man
-Noticed more Cobra gunships operating around Ripcord
-Escorting the "Loach" recon helicopters onto and off of the firebase
-On the morning of July 21 things got even worse
-Started to seriously consider that he might not survive the battle
-Bombardment got even worse
-Late on July 22 they saw more enemy movement
(00:41:55) Fall of Firebase Ripcord
-On the morning of July 23 he actually saw North Vietnamese soldiers beyond the
perimeter
-On July 23 he received word that Ripcord was going to be evacuated and destroyed
-Upset that they were just letting the firebase fall rather than stand and fight
-Saw Lieutenant Colonel Lucas get mortally wounded by a mortar shell
-Throughout July 23 men were getting pulled off the hill
-Told that the bunkers to the left and right of his would go first, then his bunker would go
-Had to decide the order of men in his bunker to get evacuated
-Pulled straws and he was the third man to go out
-Still doesn't know if the fourth man made it out
-Had to leave all of his gear and personal possessions behind except for his rifle
-Boarded a helicopter with two other combat capable men and two wounded soldiers
-Remembers the gunners laying down suppressing fire as they took off
(00:48:22) Regrouping &amp; Going into the Field
-At Camp Evans learned that Alpha Company had been hit and lost a lot of men
-Received more replacements

�-He tried to help the new replacements adjust to Vietnam
-He was supposed to be a squad leader, but got assigned to the M60 machine gun instead
-Didn't want to be on the M60 for too long because it drew too much attention
-Once A Company had enough men they returned to the field
-Pattern was this: go to the field, make some contact, then retreat from the field
-Didn't understand why they retreated from the field
-Learned later that the U.S. was pulling out of Vietnam
-Became the radio-telephone operator (RTO) for Captain Chuck Hawkins
-Called in rations, medical evacuation, and supplies for the company
-Hawkins explained that the Army didn't want a repeat of Ripcord
-That's why they didn't stay in the field for too long if they made contact
-Assigned to be the RTO for a new company commander
-He told David that if he stayed in the field two extra weeks he would make him
sergeant
-Declined because he didn't want to risk getting killed
-After Ripcord, A Company took 10 to 15 casualties
-Some of them were accidents
-Remembers one new man from the Industrial Midwest (Illinois, Michigan,
Indiana, etc.)
-David tried to watch over him and protect him
-Landed on an old landing zone
-Never should have used an old LZ
-Most likely being watched or booby trapped
-David got off the helicopter and ran down to the tree line
-New man followed him and tripped a land mine
-Killed instantly
-Only found a boot and his glasses
-Army listed him as missing in action (MIA)
-Angered him because the man was dead, not missing
(00:59:32) Life after the War Pt. 1
-As of 2015, despite hardships, he and his wife are still married
-Had four children
-After the war had a quicker temper and his family went through a lot because of his
PTSD
(01:00:40) Interactions with the Vietnamese
-While in the rear they could go into Phu Bai, so he saw some Vietnamese civilians
-Had a Vietnamese interpreter known as a chu-hoi
-Meant that he was a Viet Cong soldier that defected to South Vietnam
-Didn't interact with many civilians
-At the time he hated all of the Vietnamese, but now he regrets feeling that way
(01:01:55) Reflections on Service Pt. 1
-Has no desire to return to Vietnam or see the remains of Firebase Ripcord
-Doesn't want to relive the war
-Also doesn't want to step on an unexploded land mine near Ripcord
-It wasn't always bad in Vietnam, there were some good times
-Feels that sometimes you just had to laugh to deal with the stress

�(01:02:55) Downtime &amp; R&amp;R
-Got to see Bob Hope in Phu Bai
-Men from the field were allowed to sit in the rows closest to the stage
-Thankful to Bob Hope for doing those shows for the troops
-Saved his R&amp;R for the end of his tour in Vietnam
-Able to see his wife in Hawaii
-It was a good R&amp;R
-Got to spend a week together
-Difficult to leave his wife again
-Took some comfort in the fact that the war was coming to an end
-Drank a lot when he was in the rear
-Refreshing to go on R&amp;R, but strange to go back into the field so quickly
(01:07:25) Leaving Vietnam &amp; End of Service
-Left Vietnam on June 15, 1971
-Told he'd be placed in the inactive reserves because he had less than six months of
service to do
-Flew from Vietnam to Japan to Alaska to Washington
-Outprocessed and discharged in Washington
-Given a ticket to fly home to Kentucky
-Strange to think only a week ago he had been carrying a rifle in Vietnam
-Told to travel in civilian clothes to avoid harassment
(01:09:26) Treatment of Veterans Pt. 1
-Son served in the Army for 20 years
-Deployed to Iraq three times
-Made sure that every time his son came home he had a big welcome home party
-Didn't want his son to go through what he did upon coming home
-When he came home he was ostracized by the public for being a Vietnam veteran
-One woman accused him of killing children
-Blames some of the harassment on other Vietnam veterans
-They came home and talked about raiding villages and executing civilians
-As a result of that, people thought all soldiers did that
-For most veterans it was difficult to get a job
-Fortunately he still had a job with his uncle at the Texaco station
-Only 21 years old when he came home from Vietnam
-Barely old enough to vote and buy alcohol
-Treated like a war criminal despite being so young and not being a war criminal
-People asked his wife why she stayed married to a Vietnam veteran
(01:12:52) Life after the War Pt. 2
-Continued to work with cars after he came home
-Eventually got a job at an Oldsmobile dealership
-Moved to Florida in 1982 and worked for a dealership there
-Started his own car repair business in Florida
-It was successful and he sold it
-Went into used cars sales
-Owned a used cars lot for 12 years
-Helped with a friend's security business

�-Had a contract with a hospital
-Got him a job at the hospital as the security director
-Led to him getting interested in medicine and becoming a nurse
-Hospital paid for him to go to Nursing School
-Got into a motorcycle accident in 2007 and retired from everything after that
(01:15:14) Readjusting to Civilian Life
-Worked 70-80 hours a week
-Didn't understand why he worked so much until after the motorcycle accident
-Realized that he worked so much to distract himself from the war
memories
-Got treatment for PTSD through the VA
-Took a year of classes with other Vietnam veterans
-Advised to file for PTSD compensation and Agent Orange compensation
-70% physical disability and 30% psychological disability
-Diabetes, neropathy, and hypertension from stress and chemical
weapons
(01:19:36) Reflections on Service Pt. 1
-Sees the Vietnam War getting repeated through the Iraq War and the War in Afghanistan
-Government's reluctance to compensate those veterans for their sacrifice
-Politics getting in the way of giving treatment to veterans
-Believes the psycholoigcal effects of Vietnam will continue for years, if not generations
-The indirect effects will last for the spouses and children of veterans
(01:23:05) Treatment of Veterans Pt. 2
-Has just started wearing a Vietnam veteran cap
-Still gets negative reactions from people, but it has gotten better
-Actually receives thanks from people
(01:24:24) Reflections on Service Pt. 2
-Leadership abilities
-Respect for people
-Accountability for his actions
-Would serve again if called and would go to Iraq with his son if he could
-Willing to fight for the country and rights if necessary

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Boring, Frank</text>
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