1 24 74 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/6c729b5aec44637ef889f3972dbe9156.pdf b395d84017565b7ad43d5e69ec940394 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Fidencio Vasquez Jr. Interview Interviewed by Norma Gonzalez-Buenrostro June 18, 2016 Transcript NG: This is Norma Gonzales, and I'm here today with Fidencio Vasquez Jr., the Second, at the Hart Library in Hart, Michigan, on this day, June 18, 2016. This oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. Thank you for taking the time to talk with me today. I am interested to learn more about your family history and your experiences living and working in Oceana County. Can you please tell me your full name and spell it? FV: Fidencio Vasquez Jr. the Second. F-i-d-e-n-c-i-o V-a-s-q-u-e-z, no middle name, J-r, the Second. NG: Do you use any accents when spelling your name? FV: No. NG: Okay, thank you. Alright, so let's get started. Can you tell me where you grew up? FV: Can I tell you where I was born first? 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department NG: Yeah, definitely. You can tell me whatever you like. FV: I was born in Edinburg, Texas. NG: Alright. FV: My parents came across from Mexico and I was ten days old when I moved to Hart, Michigan. NG: Alright, what year was that? FV: 1955. NG: Nice. And you came to Hart when you were ten days old? FV: Yes, I lived in Crystal Lake. NG: Oh okay, is it far from Oceana County? FV: Right outside of Hart. It'd be north of Hart about three miles by Crystal Lake. NG: Alright. FV: I live down the road from there. NG: So why did your parents move to Hart? FV: Back to where we came… that’s when my parents left Texas - Edinburg - we moved to Hart. I lived outside of Hart until grade school there. NG: Did your parents have a reason to move to Hart? Were they seasonal workers? Did they have- did they pick any...? FV: Well, they started working at a farm right near the area where we lived, which was like a half a mile from Crystal Lake in that area. They worked for a farm that had cherries and that's where they started. And my parents bought a house right there, just a little ways from Crystal Lake. NG: Alright. Do you remember going to the farm yourself at all as a child or was it just your parents that went? FV: No, I remember. I have some pictures. I forgot to bring them other pictures of me and my brother getting new bikes, my second older brother. I had another brother. My first brother was named Fidencio Vasquez, Junior. He was born in 1946, or ‘48, one of the two. And he died at two months from a tumor in his mouth. I never got to meet him. And then in 1952, my second brother was born. He was named Fernando Jesus Vasquez. And then they had me and they named me after my first brother. It's kind of different because I wished that they would name my second brother Fidencio. NG: You got that opportunity. FV: Yeah, I got the opportunity. NG: That's good. 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department FV: Yes. And I remember, I have a picture at home that me and my brother are sitting on bikes. I was probably seven, eight. And I knew what kind of place we were living at and what my parents were doing. They worked for farmers right in that area- for one farmer. NG: Do you remember the name of the farmer or the name of the...? FV: The name was Mr. Hare. And that's the only farmer that I know that owned that area land was cherries, apples, that they, whatever, picked or planted. It's pretty much what I can remember of that. NG: Did you ever pick yourself? Did your parents ever bring you to the farms and...? FV: Well, my dad's mother, she used to take us with her two daughters and her son. I remember being there and this picture right here, that's my dad's mom. My grandmother, I grew up with her, too. She used to take me with her son and me. We used to go to different states like Ohio to pick strawberries. NG: No way! FV: When I was little. NG: Oh, did you like going to the farms with your grandma? Was it fun? FV: Yes. NG: Yeah? FV: Because I just wanted to go, so she took me. NG: That's good. So, can you tell me more about what your parents did for the farmer? Did they go ahead and till the land or did they just pick? Did they stay with that farmer every year or did your parents move on eventually? FV: Oh, they probably planted trees by hand and picked cherries and apples and peaches, probably. Those are probably the only three kinds of fruit that I can remember being around that area when I grew up. And then I walked back and forth to grade school every day, my brother and me, Fernando. NG: Did you go to school here in Hart? FV: After the school...the school burned down. It was made out of stone. You know, all grades went to this school. There was a basement and an upstairs. And I think it burned and then they were building. So, my parents bought... we moved to Hart when I was twelve on State Street in front of the fairgrounds. NG: Yeah, right around here. FV: Yeah, I was twelve years old when my parents bought a house in… [music begins] NG: Oh, I can go ahead and pause it. FV: Okay. 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EB: So, we were talking about the house that your parents bought on State Street. What year was that when you guys bought the house? FV: It would have been [nineteen] fifty-five, sixty-two. NG: And it was very close to the fairgrounds you mentioned, right? FV: Yes. NG: So, you saw the whole fair, and every year you saw how it built from there. Can you tell me a little bit more about that? How the fairs progressed? FV: Yeah, I used to go there all the time and I loved the fair. I was a regular, kind of. And I played all the games that were cheap. And when I was old enough, I don't know when, maybe when I was anywhere between twelve and fifteen, I helped put up some rides. NG: So, you worked for the fair? FV: Yes. NG: Is it run by the city or is it an outside organization? FV: It was run through the- what’s it called? Agricultural Council or something, you know? NG: Right, yeah. FV: There's a name for it. NG: Alrighty. So, it's like the Agricultural Organization... FV: ...Organization, yeah, and they would set up all the rides and I would go. It was… things were really cheap back then. I had so much fun. NG: How cheap? Do you remember any prices from back then? Like ten cents? FV: Ten cents, maybe five cents - real cheap. NG: So what kind of rides did they have back then? FV: Scrambler fairgrounds, Tilt-A-Whirl, the carousel with horses... NG: The merry-go-round? FV: The merry-go-round. Different kinds of rides, I don't know what all the names of them are but... NG: That's alright. So, you said that the agricultural organization put that together. Was there any of the produce that they would showcase at the fair? FV: Yes, they had different buildings for different things. Horses, rabbits, pigs, lambs, cows. And they had a commercial building with a lot of the fruits that people grew. They had different farmers come in, put up their own little displays of everything, and arts and crafts kind of with their kids. How the kids learned in 4-H. How the kids learn how to bring up their animals. And everybody had their own little animals. It's very neat. 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department NG: Did you ever join the 4-H? FV: Never did, no. I just enjoyed going to it every day. NG: That's good. So what else can you tell me about growing up in your… you mention your teenage years. Did you go into the farm working yourself, or did you move away from that? FV: No, I went into the farm work. I was, well, as it says in that paper. My mother worked for a nursery called Hawley’s Nursery. This is very important for you to look at, too. This is... I made this in nineteen... this gentleman picked me in nineteen ninety-eight. His name is right there. He was introduced to me through one of my cousins out of Muskegon; he worked for the Muskegon Chronicle. NG: Okay. FV: He made the story on how I preferred the farm work. Between when I was ten and fifteen… well, I was a newborn. Because, well, it says in the paper: I was ten days old, even though I moved here, my mom worked for this nursery named Hawley’s Nursery. They grafted trees to produce fruit. And my mother carried me in a basket when I was a newborn. You know, I still lived out of town. They'd quit working for that farmer and my dad went into truck driving, or working in a factory… working in a basket factory in Shelby Basket factory. I remember going with him. He worked at night. He ran a machine that made different blueberry boxes, strawberry boxes. And I remember as a kid going with my dad to work and then later… well, when I was born, I guess my mom carried me first before I went to work with my dad. And my mom worked there for forty-five years. And I think I worked for… there was an area farmer right next to the nursery I was working on. His name was Monroe Piegels [?]. He had the land just down the street. I worked on the farm doing disking, mowing grass, learned how to trim trees, and worked at Hawley’s Nursery. The whole Vasquez family pretty much ran this Hawley’s Nursery. He had great big orchards of trees and all my aunts and uncles were grafters. And then after you graft a tree, on your hands and knees. You know, you're on your hands and knees, my mom was a grafter. You know you use… they cut up… my uncle used to go cut off these limbs like this and cut the leaves off where the bud would produce the fruit tree. NG: Right. FV: And my mom would cut the line like this and cut that little butt off with a knife and slip it into the tree, and then the person behind her would tie it with a rubber band really fast. And I would go behind with this little bucket and this little lantern in it... kerosene lantern with a bow on top and you put wax in it and you carry it with a paintbrush. After you graft them, put tape on them, you have to seal them. So, I did that until I was fifteen. NG: And after that, did you move on from there and go to a factory or another farmer? FV: I have a history of working with farmers. On the west side of Oceana County, I started out at Hawley’s Nursery and then Bob Ryder [?], Jack Hare [?], Lewis Claudie [?], Richie Rider [?], and on and off now for the last seven, eight years for Joe Daley. I learned how to drive a cherry rollout. It’s a long machine. NG: Okay. FV: And the tarps, you pull the tarps out, they're maybe twenty feet wide, each one. Twenty, twentyfive feet. The machine was probably fifty feet long, the machine was. And I would drive it with a tractor 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department up to the tree to the center of it, and I'd release the levers so the tower would come out and they'd put it around the trunk of the tree. And then there's another man with a machine that would drive up to the tree and shake the tree so the cherries would fall off, and I would reel it in with a conveyor belt going, and the tank was in the back. So, I learned how to do that for seven years, on and off lately, and I still work there. But after I was fifteen, I started working for Gale’s IGA. NG: Oh, okay. That one right here. No way! FV: Uh huh, yeah. NG: How was it back then? FZ: It was pretty neat, yeah. NG: What did you do at IGA? FZ: Well, I worked in the grocery department. NG: Okay. FZ: And I worked for Mr. Gale - Mr. Gale's father - to help him unload the truck. I'd be in the back working with him alone. They had rollers for the man up in the truck, putting stuff on the rollers, and we'd stack it in piles, empty the truck, and open boxes and price them. Priced everything and hauled out to the aisles and we'd stock. And I did a little bit of everything there. I even learned how to work in produce. They had a freezer storage there where people would come in, rent lockers. And I worked in the produce department and I helped clean floors. And well, I don't know what year it was… where the laundromat is right now, that was the grocery store and Gale’s insurance agency was next to it, this little office. And then down the road, Mr. Gale bought...there was houses on that property. He bought most of the houses and little by little, he built a new grocery store. I think it was ten years later, maybe? Somewhere in there? Or maybe not even ten years later, maybe five years later, he built a new grocery store. NG: Is that the new one that we have now? FV: Yes. That whole place was the store. That whole building was the grocery store. And they had the meat department in the back, our stockroom was in the back, and the freezer department had storage where people come and rent lockers to put their… buy meats and, you know, or they buy like cows or something. And then it came in packages and they'd bring it there and put them in a storage room in the freezer. And then little by little as that store was getting built, I was helping in there, once in a while. And then I worked in the grocery store and then when the shelves were up, they moved all the groceries. We did it by cart, carrying anything that was on the shelves and go to stock them in the new store. So, it was kind of neat, you know. Work here, work here and make sure to bring over here. So, when the store was... as they were working on it, we were stocking shelves, little by little before they opened it. NG: Right. FV: And I also helped work inside, do some different jobs when they were building floor with Irwin Gale's son, Dennis Gale. And it went from there. And I worked there ten years. I was twenty-five. And then I wanted to go to Texas with these friends of mine that were almost like my family, my other mom 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department and dad. So, I went to Texas for a year to Lubbock, Texas, and I worked there at a gas station and I worked in a garage changing tires and running U-Haul trucks and trailers. I worked there for one year. NG: And then you came back to Oceana…? FV: Because I missed my parents. So, my dad and my uncle were working for Oceana Canning of Shelby, they were truck drivers and they were coming to Lubbock, Texas, to bring a load of canned cherries. And I asked my dad, can you go ask Mr. Gale if I can have my job back? Then he called me and he said, “Yeah, you can.” And so, I was excited to come back home. I missed my parents. NG: That's good. FV: Yeah, yeah. NG: So, when you came back you got your old job back? FV: I got my old job back. NG: That's great. FV: And I worked there until 1990. Twenty years. NG: That's good! FV: And then I went… okay, let me see. Yeah, after that, I worked for Bob Ryder [?], who was a fruit farmer. He had many different kinds of fruits: apple, all different kinds of cross-breed apples, peaches, apricots, nectarines, which you don't find much around that apricots… maybe nectarine trees, now they're getting more popular. And I would pick every other day and go to the farmer's market every other day. We had two markets, one in Grand Rapids and one in Muskegon. I worked at both of them. NG: You would sell the produce that you picked the day before? FV: Yeah, we'd spot pick the trees. Spot pick, get the good stuff, number one grade and then we had a number two basket. You know, you buy, you can buy expensive stuff or you can buy cheaper stuff. I learned how to do that. NG: That's good. So, you have a lot of skills with agriculture and you're very educated on how to run farms and stuff. FV: Yeah. NG: That's great! FV: Yeah. And I resigned in 1990. And, I had a friend that was living in Grand Rapids after he got out of college. And I needed a job and I didn't want to do any more fruit farming or anything, I wanted to get some kind of... something different. He was a hotel manager for… he worked at, like, a Holiday Inn when he started and then he was working for another hotel when I went down there from 1990 to ‘95. I was working in the summer for Mr. Ryder [?]. He's in here, too. His article is in here with mine. [paper ruffles] There he is right there. This is a truck, it was like a beer truck with the sliding doors and we put shelves in it to put all our fruit in. We could put four hundred and fifty baskets on both sides. And these apples were already sorted. 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department NG: Okay, for like the grade A? FV: And we'd take them from the orchard onto the flatbed truck and we'd put them right on the truck and get more baskets and go get some other stuff, other kind of fruit, and load up the truck. Every other day we did that and the front. That's... NG: Yeah, that's my uncle! FV: …your uncle! I talked to him about this paper the other day. NG: Yeah. FV: I said, “Do you have that paper?” He goes, “I don't think so, but I remember it.” And I was going to bring it down and show it to him. NG: Yeah, maybe we can have a copy of that, too. This is really cool. I recognized him for a second. FV: Yeah, he was my dad's friend. NG: Really? FV: Yeah. NG: Small town. [Laughter] FV: And in the front of the article, this brings down what I did. This is when I started working for him. That was me. I had long hair. That's my mom. I worked there, too, even before I went to IGA. They turned...they sold the nursery to four buyers that bought all this acreage and they turned it into a golf course as my mom was still working there. NG: Oh, okay. FV: You can see in the background that they were making grass parts and it was getting smaller and smaller and smaller and the smallest orchard was the field, or they were doing grafting still. It was getting smaller and smaller and smaller. And then it just...everybody just...there was no more work. NG: Is this golfing field the golf…? FV: The Colonial Golf Course. That whole nursery, that whole area goes all the way back to the highway and all the way back to McDonald's. That was all fruit, all fields. NG: Really? No way. FV: And he had fields out by Round Lake. Big, long fields, almost a half mile long and all my aunts... twenty-seven hundred trees in each row and by knee, on their hands and knees doing all this grafting. And then later, they would take them out of the ground and put them in great big containers and bring them into a nursery, and they'd size them with a grater, the trunks, and then tie them in bundles and then they’d bury them in the ground in rows, side by side. And people would come buy them in the spring when it was time to plant them. NG: Okay. 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department FV: Yep, long story short, from there to there. So, let's go back. This is what I preferred after I got out of working at Gale's IGA in 1990. I worked for Bob Ryder [?]. NG: And then when did you finally stop going to the… you said you still continue to... FV: Yeah, I continue. I was working for my friend. He hired me. He worked in like a... he was a clerk but he moved to another hotel. He was a banquet manager. Rent banquets… had sliding doors and this great big, it's like a hall, you know, sliding doors. And I started working in the restaurant as a busboy. NG: Okay. FV: And then I moved up into the banquets department and I learned a lot there. I worked a half a year there in the winter, and then I come back, work half a year on the farm for five years. I went back and forth. NG: That's good. And you continue… you mentioned before that you continue to do that now. So, do you do that currently right now or are you…? FV: No. I worked for Bob Ryder [?] until 2000. NG: Okay, so sixteen years ago. FV: I was there from 1990, I worked for him for ten years until 2000. And then I did a little bit of farm work on the side, a little bit, you know, until I got a real job. I got into laborers union. My office was out of Battle Creek. One of my friends was Fernando's best buddy. He was working for the paper mill in Muskegon, as I recall. It's not there no more. But that's where I started working as a laborer, working in a power plant. My brother and me did. He's like twelve, fifteen years younger than me and we got jobs there. And we're so excited, you know, I was working for a job that was paying eight dollars an hour when I left. Well, when I was working in Grand Rapids, you know, they paid a little more over there and more than farming of course, and then I got into the laborer’s union, which I worked for part of West Michigan from top to bottom. The office would call me and tell me to go, well, you got to go to the paper mill for so many weeks, or you work for different contractors and you do different things and you go there and work depending how many days, weeks or months. And after you finish one job, they can relocate you to another one to a different place. NG: Did you like that moving around? FV: Yes! NG: It was fun. FV: Because I worked and there was a power plant in Muskegon - that one with a big tower. I worked there [loud noise] and then one at a paper plant in Manistee. I worked way down in Irons, Michigan in a generating plant they were building. I worked for different contractors and did different types of work. I did scaffolding. For people to get up on, to do their work, I had to put everything together. So that was really exciting. I did that for… I resigned four years ago. NG: Wow, so what do you do right now? FV: I just work, I'm disabled and I work for farmers. One farmer and I work for a friend - handyman service. 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department NG: Okay. FV: I paint, we do odd jobs, and I work for the fairgrounds - Parking Supervisor - with my friend that was working there. Well I was even working there for a while. I was a maintenance man. Then I wanted to quit so I gave the job to one of my friends. He's been there fifteen years and I've been helping park cars for seven years and now I'm pretty much just a volunteer. I want to get out and do things for the community. NG: That's good. That's really good. FV: Yeah. NG: So, you work so much with… did you start a family of your own at some time? FV: Never been married, never had any kids. NG: Alright. Well, I think...is there anything else you'd like us to share with the research program? I mean, we got a lot, but is there anything else you'd like to mention? FV: Well, like…? NG: Any advice for a young person who might listen to this recording who lives in Oceana County? FV: Well, if you like to work, just keep working. Do what you want to do. And if you can do it, do it. NG: Definitely. FV: And I know I'm getting a little older now. I can't work as hard as I used to, but I still keep on moving and I keep busy and, you know, whatever you'd like to do, keep doing it or just change from job to job. Don't stop, just… NG: Definitely. FV: ...keep yourself happy. [Laughter] NG: Thank you so much! Well, thank you so much for your time and for sharing your memories with me. And I believe this concludes our interview. FV: Okay, thank you. NG: Thank you! 10 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f380cbb2234dde816be2e5ae8987261d.mp3 07cbf47fee293cb84448c0ca531f3516 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Vasquez_Fidencio Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Vasquez, Fidencio Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Vasquez, Fidencio (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Fidencio Vasquez, Jr., the second. Interviewed by Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Fidencio Vasquez, Jr., the second, was born in Edinburg, Texas in 1955. The son of two Mexican immigrants, Fidencio and his family moved to Hart, Michigan when Fidencio was ten days old. Throughout his life, Fidencio worked for many different businesses throughout Michigan, including the local Hart fair, many fruit farms, grocery stores, and labor services. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Gonzalez Buenrostro, Norma (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Fruit growers Agricultural exhibitions Grocery trade Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/71e9632e1b150334afa77bc6e2bbb15f.pdf b3abd0bec030a9575c347b5a35931039 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Larry VanSickle Interview Interviewed by Walter Urick June 18, 2016 Transcript WU: My name is Walter Urick, and I'm here today with Larry VanSickle and I'm in the Hart Library in Hart, Michigan on this Saturday, June 18th, 2016, for the purpose of obtaining the oral history of the VanSickle family. This oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. Larry, I want to thank you for taking the time to talk with me today, and I'm interested to learn more about your family history and your experiences living and working in Oceana County. So why don’t we just start out by you stating your full legal name. LV: My name's Larry Kent VanSickle. WU: And when were you born and where were you born? LV: I was born right here in Hart on January 10th, 1943. WU: And your parents' names? 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: My parents were Lloyd and Maxine VanSickle. WU: And Lloyd VanSickle, at the time of your birth, was about how old? LV: I'm thinking, twenty-five, probably somewhere in there. WU: And your mom, Maxine? LV: She was three, four years younger, so she was twenty-one, twenty-two. WU: And what was your mother's maiden name? LV: Maxine May. WU: M-a-y? LV: M-a-y. Her parents were Max and Maude May… Maude (Weirich) May. WU: Okay, and in terms of siblings? LV: I have two brothers: one older, Norman, and one younger, Garth. WU: And Norman was born…? LV: Norman was born on January 27, 1941 - he's the oldest one. And Garth was born on June 27, 1944. WU: Okay, and in terms of your parents’ background and education and work… your father, what type of work did he do? LV: Well, he did carpenter work here, there, and yonder. And he was a… he had an electrician's license. He did most of that work part-time; he liked that kind of work. His full-time job, he worked for Michigan Employment Security Commission as a Farm Labor Specialist. He did that for thirty, thirty-five years; that's what he retired from, so that was his main employment. WU: In terms of growing up, physically, where was your household? LV: Where I grew up? WU: Yes. LV: I'm living in the same house where I was born. WU: Alright, describe it. LV: Our address is 2491 East Polk Road. It’s in Elbridge Township, right kitty-corner across from the Elbridge Community Church. And my dad bought that piece of property in 1941. WU: How large a piece of property is it… acreage? LV: At the time... there were one hundred and twenty acres at the time… is what he bought it that time. WU: Okay. LV: Since then, I bought that, you know, after we got married in 1965, I bought that from him. 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Alright. WU: Now that acreage and I'm taking you back to when you were a kid, you know, you're growing up, were there farming activities on that acreage? LV: Yes. WU: Okay. LV: And not to the extent they are nowadays, where when I was a kid, we had probably ten cows and we milked them cows and we didn't sell the milk, sold the cream, had a cream separator separating the cream and the skim milk. We had some hogs and fed that to the hogs. Almost everybody back then had animals. WU: So, you had hogs. You had, obviously, dairy cows. Any other animals that…? LV: We grew up with a couple of horses, we had a couple horses. WU: You didn’t have chickens or things like that? LV: Well, I think we might have had just once in a while there was a chicken or two around, but nothing that... it was all, basically, you know, we had chickens if you needed to have chicken for Sunday dinner. He was outside waiting for you. [Laughter] WU: But, so as a youngster, you've got cows. I assume you had various farm chores that you had to do as you were growing up. LV: We did. WU: Just sort of describe what life was like. LV: Well, we had one after we got rid of the cows that was milking, we kept one cow so we could have our own milk. And course, it was us boys’ job to milk that cow. Twice a day we had to milk that cow and take the milk up to the house and Ma put it in the refrigerator. And that was the milk that we drank. And then in the summertime, we’d take that cow and lead her out someplace where there's grass and tie her up and she can sit there all day... WU: That was your lawn mower. [Laughter] LV: And make a circle and eat the grass. And I remember, I didn't think my brothers were sharing enough in the milking chores, and so I barked and I argued with Dad a little bit about maybe they ought to do more milking. That probably wasn't the right thing to do because then I was one hundred percent milker [laughter]; because I barked, then I got the job. [Laughter] WU: So, before you review… sized down to one cow, how old were you... LV: When that happened? WU: ...when the downsizing occurred? LV: I probably was… probably ten. 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Okay, what I'm trying to understand here is, say, between ages of four to ten, when you have ten cows, what was your role with those ten cows... if any? LV: I think as I remember, we had to feed them and, of course, clean the barn. WU: Alright, so you remember cleaning, you remember feeding LV: Yep, we had to do that and at that time Dad had a milking machine. So, them cows were milked with a milking machine. WU: Alright, so you did have a milking machine at that point? LV: Yep. WU: And that milking machine… were you able to operate that machine? LV: I don't think so, no. I don’t recall. WU: Okay, so as a seven or eight-year-old kid, they didn't ask you to do anything like that? LV: No, we was good pooper scoopers and we could do the feeding. And we had to climb up in the silo and throw some silage out. WU: Now, in terms of getting rid of the waste and so on or the manure, were you able to sell that to other farmers or use it for fertilizer LV: We used it for fertilizer. WU: On your own farm? LV: Yep, and we got, you know, at a pretty young age, we learned how to drive the tractor. WU: Well, that's where I was leading to… trying to understand: what did you do as a kid, to make that work? LV: At that age… and then, of course, we had to make hay and we did that. We didn't have bale hay; we did it all loose hay. And so, we had hay loaders - the people behind the wagon - and they would gather the hay up and put it on the wagon. And Dad usually had the job on the wagon, so one of us guys had to drive the tractor. And I remember driving the tractor when nowadays it wouldn't be acceptable. WU: Right. LV: But we had to stand on the clutch with both feet in order to even stop the thing… WU: [Laughter] LV: ...we weren’t heavy enough. [Laughter] WU: Those were the good old days! [Laughter] LV: [Laughter] So it wasn't...no, it wasn’t very safe, if you look back at it. Sometimes Dad had to jump down off of the wagon and come up and get the tractor stopped, if we needed to have it stop. But he was, you know, we didn't get into situations that we were going to get in trouble, but still, it was something you [?]. 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Well, your father clearly is working outside the home, I mean, he's working… so really, he’s a part time farmer… LV: Yeah. WU: ...almost a hobby farm. LV: Yeah, he was part-time most of the time. He was... that was evenings and weekends. I think his intent was to be more full-time. But sometimes you’ve got to have a job someplace to generate some revenue. And so, he got into that job that he ended up retiring from and it turned out to be a pretty good job. And so, all of his hobbies and farming and stuff… and of course, once we got old enough so we could do something, then we would have a list of duties in the morning when he went to work, especially in the summertime. And we could accomplish that in the daytime while he was gone. WU: Oh, from a family history standpoint, your dad's parents - your grandparents - do you recall their…? LV: I recall the ones on my mother's side a little bit better because on my dad's side, I was only three years old when his dad died… WU: Okay. LV: ...and I was only maybe ten when his mother died. And of course, back then, everybody was somehow tangled up in agriculture of some description. And on my mother's side, her dad, that's what he did was farming. WU: Now your father and his… your grandfather. Do you know what country they came from or how they got here, so to speak? LV: Well, it's Pennsylvania Dutch, is what it is supposedly. And the VanSickles came from Marengo, Ohio, up here. Now, I'm not sure what foreign country their ancestors come from. WU: Well, they're Dutch, they're probably from the Netherlands or something. LV: They’re from the Netherlands, but supposedly the heritage is Pennsylvania Dutch. Now, technically, I don't know what that means, but that's basically… yeah. WU: Yeah, but they settled, I mean, your grandfather was not... was he an immigrant? I guess that's what I was trying to understand or was he a first generation American? LV: I'm thinking he probably... I don't think he was an immigrant. WU: Okay. LV: I think he was probably first generation American. That would be my guess. And I don't know, I don't remember any of them talking about that. WU: Now, did your mom work outside the home? LV: She did not work outside other than she was a licensed beautician. WU: Oh, she was? 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: And so, she... actually, she did it right in the house. I can remember somebody getting a permanent one over suppertime and we’d be there fixing hair and just having supper. But then the rules that regulate that kind of stuff didn't allow that anymore. WU: Sure. LV: And so, when we got married, they built a new house and Dad made a special beautician parlor in the basement for her… WU: So, she could... LV: ...so she could do that. And they added its own entrance and so they could grow. They could do that. So, she... I don't know if she ever did that full-time. You know, it was always kind of off again and again. WU: Well, in terms of your childhood, you grew up out in Elbridge Township, I assume. LV: Yep. WU: And you went to, what, the Elbridge School? LV: No, back then it was Elbridge Township had six rural schools. And so, I went to... WU: Wait, stop. You’re telling me Elbridge Township had how many rural one-room schoolhouses? LV: Six. WU: Really? Boy, that's throwing me a little bit. I would not have guessed that. So, there's six one-room schoolhouses within that six acres… or six square miles? LV: Yep. WU: Okay, well... LV: I think I can name them! There was the Shaw [?] School, which was on the corner of 144th and Polk. Sales [?] School was on Harrison Road part way toward Walkerville. Zeder [?] School was on the corner of 128th and Tyler. May School was on 144th and Filmore. Houcks [?] School was on 128th south of Tyler and Sackurader [?] School was on 116th and Polk. WU: So which school did you have? LV: I went to Shaw [?]. It was a mile away from my house. WU: And so, you got to school, walked back and forth? LV: Walked most of the time, yep. When we was... I graduated in eighth grade from that school. The following year, they opened up the new Elbridge School. In 1957, the Elbridge School opened… WU: That consolidated… LV: ...that consolidated all six of them schools, so they had one Elbridge School… WU: Basically, across the street from you. 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: Yeah, almost. Just kitty-corner, yeah. But I never got to go there because I come to town the year that they opened that and I never got to go to the new high school in town because our class was the last class to graduate from the old high school. WU: Well, you did the last semester. LV: No, no, I never got in there. My brother did. Garth got in there because the class of ‘62 with the first class to graduate from the new high school. WU: I'm getting you mixed up with Garth right now. LV: Yeah [laughter]. WU: Mainly because… LV: Garth was in with John. WU: Yes. And that's why I'm confused, because my brother graduated that year. Well, now when you're a kid...let's keep you in the Elbridge area for a little bit before we get you into high school. Do you remember any of the kids other than your own siblings that you hung out with and the things that you did or any stories that you care to…? LV: Well, we used to play with Jack and Lane Tate. They grew up right across the street from us and then the Amstutz boys were kind of kitty-corner across the field. Buzzy Amstutz - I’ll call him, Ken - or his name is Ken, they called him Buzzy. And then Larry Amstutz, who passed away a year or so ago. And, yeah, we would get together with them mostly and once in a while south of us were Melvin and Raymond Burmer [?]. And they were all part of our school down there, so we used to play with them once in a while. WU: Is there anything that you'd like to share, for the record, any humorous things that have happened or something? Some childhood memory that comes to mind? LV: Well, I don’t know if it’s humorous or not, but we used to go down in the woods and have BB gun fights and play cops and robbers, and we had a BB gun, you know, and lucky somebody didn't… WU: Get hurt! LV: ...get hurt. And Buzzy Amstutz had a real good arm on him. And so, there were some guineas they’re like a duck or turkey - but something like that. And so, he figured, by golly, we’ll... maybe we can get one of them, cook it up to eat it. So, he threw a rock at them, knocked it out of the tree, and so we had a little fire and cooked that guinea. [Laughter] WU: That had to be an unusual experience! LV: Just normal stuff that kids do, I guess. WU: So, you finish your elementary school and they opened the Shaw [?] one-room schoolhouse. Any special memories of teachers during your elementary years and one that really stands out in your mind? LV: We had June McClellan who was the teacher for a while and she lived just north of us. And in the wintertime, we’d walk… she'd walk to school and the roads would have too much snow on them and she'd walk to school with us, we’d all walk to school. Once you got to school, you had to build the fire, 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department because at that time when we were smaller, there was no fuel furnace or nothing in that area, there was a wood pot-bellied stove that you had to… it was a teacher’s job to build the fire. And there was probably fifteen kids in the whole school, all grades. And so, for the most part, there was only one person in my grade with me and some kids were in the grade all by themselves. And but, I know she... several times in the wintertime, she’d walk with us, and teachers got paid peanuts, you know, back then, dedicated to it anyway. WU: Right, and I suppose as you got older, you might even have to help build the fire... LV: Oh, yeah. Yep. WU: ...and carry the wood in. LV: We had to do that. WU: And maybe even make sure things were okay before you left the building so it wouldn’t burn down. LV: Well, that was basically the teacher's responsibility, but she would ask for somebody to help and we’d do that. WU: Okay. Now, as a kid, I'm getting you in the twelve-year-old area or so, did you work on any other farms besides your own, harvesting crops or anything like that? LV: Well, we did. When we got to be old enough that somebody could think we could pick up a bale of hay. We had some neighbors, they was...[?] was their name. The [?] neighbors, they were Barbara and Elsie, and they was there by themselves and they was farming for their brother was going to do the farming but he drowned up at School Section Lake. His name was Frankie [?]. And so, we’d go down and help them haul hay. And, you know, just a seasonal deal… two, three days a week kind of deal. We’d help them with that and then when we got a little bit older, my uncle was Keith Clark, and I can remember hauling hay for him for a month when he got sick of it because he made a lot of hay. WU: And that was a long job. LV: That was. WU: A hard job. LV: Yep, that was. And then we’d get all dirty and sweaty and then at night we'd go down to Evans Lake. There was a little spot there where you could get in there and get cooled off. It seemed to be fun, anyway. WU: Did you ever get involved in harvesting, like cherries or some of the crops? Pickles? As a kid? LV: We didn't have to harvest them ourselves. Well, we had… Dad had five acres of cherries… WU: Oh, did he? LV: ...and a couple acres of peaches. And so, as a kid, we had to pick them peaches and help… we had to thin them. And then when the cherries come around, we had to pick. WU: And that's back in the handpicking days. LV: Yep. 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Okay, were you able to pick... how many acres of cherries did you say? LV: He had five acres of cherries. WU: Were you able to just do that, pick that? LV: No. WU: Or did you have to bring in people? LV: He brought in people to help. WU: Okay, and the type of people that showed up? LV: Well, back then, as I recall, all the while I was growing up, my dad would grow a few pickles and the help we had were... I don't know what the right terminology is, they were colored people. WU: Alright. LV: From Arkansas. WU: Okay, so they were African-American people from Arkansas. LV: Yeah. WU: Would this be several families? LV: No, there would be maybe one family or five or six people. There was one man in particular that I know my dad had sent him a bus ticket to get him up here. And he helped because Dad grew a few potatoes, too. So, he’d help pick pickles and then he helped us when we was hauling hay. We needed somebody up in the haymow, to move it all around because it was all loose hay, and he would do that. WU: But he had no family? He just came up by himself? LV: Well, he had some friends. He had a girlfriend, I think, in Arkansas, because he could not read or write, and so at whatever age I was - ten, twelve, thirteen, somewhere in there - I would write these letters for him. He would tell me what he wanted to say and I’d write a letter and send it to the lady in Arkansas. And then when she’d write back, I’d read it to him because he couldn't read or write. In fact, there was a time there when he was probably when I first got in high school, he didn't come anymore. He was getting old. Well, prior to that, my dad worked on trying to get him social security and couldn't even prove he was born, you know, he was… WU: There was no record of him. LV: So finally, they just picked a spot and said, we think you’re so old and so they sent him a check. WU: He finally managed to get into the system. LV: Yeah, he got his Social Security. Probably never paid anything in, I don't imagine. I don't know. But no, he wasn't. He was born in Bogalusa, Louisiana - I think is what it was. They tracked that somehow or another. He was... his parents were slaves. But he was... I got along good with him, you know. WU: And apparently he was a good worker. 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: He was a good worker. And we had an old house right across the driveway - we’ve since tore it down - from where we lived. And I know every night after supper, Ma would fix a plate of stuff and we would take it over to him. He could cook himself, but she felt sorry for him, so she’d always fix a plate. WU: Get him some home cooking so he didn’t have to do it himself. Well, that's got to be a vivid memory, especially writing a letter for a fellow. LV: Yeah, that was... I thought it was kind of neat at the time. I was probably twelve or thirteen and, not to get off on the subject, but when I was in high school - I think I might have graduated - right after I graduated high school, I made up my mind I wanted to find that guy. WU: Oh, did you? LV: So Butch [?] and I, Butch was a good friend of mine. WU: Sure. LV: So, we got in the car and went to Arkansas and like that we found him. WU: Oh, did you? LV: We found him, he was still alive. We had some addresses from… I don’ t know where I got the addresses. We followed somebody else first. And Butch, he didn't want to get out of the car, you know, because we were right downtown. Everybody was black. And so, I would start knocking on doors looking for this guy. WU: What city in Arkansas? LV: West Memphis. WU: Yeah, you're just in the state of Arkansas, but you’re in West Memphis, which is a tough area. LV: Yeah, sure. But this, of course, had been fifty years ago now. But I found him and when I asked him if he'd ever been to Michigan, he looked at me and he recognized me, you know, and I had changed a lot. WU: Sure. LV: He sat there in the chair. He sat there and he always smoked a pipe. He just wasn’t doing nothing. But we just took him a whole truckload of old clothes and I don’t know what all. So, we gave him all that stuff. And so that really made my day… WU: That’s great. LV: ...because he was...I really liked him. And I was at an age, you know, where we were friends and I helped him. He has since passed away. WU: Well, I'm going to move you into high school now. Obviously, you're still living at the farm, but now you're coming into Hart, Hart High School. And what year did you graduate from Hart, then? LV: ‘61. WU: So, you're with the class in 1961 and during high school, are there any special activities that you recall that you enjoyed or were involved in? 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: Well, I was in the band. That was something that I was in. WU: What instrument did you play? LV: I played the trombone. WU: You were a trombone player, okay. LV: But of course, you never did any of that. Well, we took lessons, I guess, maybe a couple of years before we came to high school. But back then, because we was out there, you know, you come to high school, no money, and so I always dreamt about playing football. And so, I went out for football and, of course, I didn't know nothing about what they was doing. You know, the kids in Hart, they knew the coach. And I was just an outsider and so I didn't do very good at that. I went out for, I think, one year. And then I didn't do it anymore. WU: Okay, so you played a little football. You got involved in band. LV: Yep, band. And my senior year I ran track and I wish I had done that sooner because I kind of liked that and I could run! WU: Are we talking distances or sprints? LV: No, like the quarter mile. WU: The quarter mile. LV: Yeah, I could do all right with that. WU: Well good. And so, in high school, you graduated in 1961 and from there what was your next step? In education or work or whatever? LV: Well, I was, of course, working all the time. But I went to Michigan State, short course. Back then they had... there were just eight weeks, eight weeks in the fall, eight weeks in the wintertime - that was your short course and you do that for two years. And then you got a certificate and you could pick whatever you want. You can study horticulture or you could study pigs or you could study cattle or just all kinds of different things. I don't think they even have that program anymore. They’ve got ag. [agriculture] tech or something; it's kind of a four-year deal. So, I just took that short course. WU: Alright. So, you took the short course and were you working during that period of time? LV: Well, I was starting to farm a little bit on my own. And then summers right after I got out of high school, I had a job working in the pickle station in Shelby. Heinz had a pickle station down by the sawmill and so during pickle season, which, you know, lasted July through middle of September, I would work down there helping. We had to grate pickles and handle bushel crates of pickles and that kind of stuff, so I did that. WU: Now you graduate, you finish your short course. And what year would that have been? LV: Let me see. I think I actually took three years to do it. The first year I only took one eight-weeks in the middle of winter. The next year I took eight weeks and then the following year I took the total to finish it. So, I think it must have been sixty-three or four. 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Somewhere along the way you got married. LV: That was ‘65. WU: Alright, so after you finish the short course, you get married. Your wife's maiden name was? LV: Scofield. WU: Okay, and just talk about your family a little bit. You have how many children? LV: We've got four kids. WU: That's what I thought. LV: Yep. WU: Just name them. LV: Well, Lon’s the oldest one. And then Lance is the second one. Lynn is a boy - he's the third one. And then Carma’s the last one. Lon was born in ‘67, Lance in ‘68, Lynn in ‘72, and Carma in ‘74. WU: And your wife's first name is? LV: Carla. WU: And it's spelled? LV: C-a-r-l-a. WU: Okay, and she worked outside the home for a period of time, did she not? LV: Yeah, she was all about nursing. WU: That’s what I thought. LV: And she did that right out of high school. She worked over here at the Oceana hospital; most of the years that she worked was over there. And then when that closed, she worked for Mercy Hospital in Muskegon, and she worked a little bit up at Ludington, and then she did home health through the Health Department. District Ten Health Department or District Five Health Department at that time had home health. And so, she worked doing that until she retired. WU: Well, now we have you married. I'm trying to take you through this maybe ten, fifteen-year period of your life from ‘65 to ‘70… or that being, what, ‘65 to ‘80, a fifteen-year period. You became a full-time farmer eventually, is that correct? LV: Yeah. WU: And just for the historical part, help me understand: where you started it and how did it expand and what you got into, in terms of the type of crops and so forth? LV: Well, when we started, I took over what Dad had. WU: That's what I thought. 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: And we had a little piece of asparagus, not very much. And we had five acres of cherries and he had some cattle. WU: Cattle, not cows? LV: No, they were beef cattle. And, you know, they’re something to sell for meat. And so, I expanded that a little bit. I remodeled the barn and put up a silo and I made kind of a feedlot so I could feed more cattle. And so, we did that. And then we planted more asparagus. We ended up… we planted more cherries, too. But we ended up in… I don't remember the year now, it might’ve even been up to ‘90. That cherry market wasn't any good, for several years there it wasn't any good and so we got out of that. WU: But did you do all this on the… how many acres did you...? LV: I bought one hundred twenty-eight acres from my dad. WU: Alright. So, you have one hundred twenty-eight-acre farm and all the activities are on that hundred and twenty-eight acres? LV: Well, in ‘72 I bought small crop. WU: Okay. LV: In ‘72, I bought... actually I bought one hundred sixty acres. I bought what the neighbors had across the road. They had two forties and then east of the old Shaw School. I bought what Edmond [?] used to be down there and he had seventy-nine acres and so we bought that. WU: So basically, you bought two eighties. There’s your hundred sixty and you had a hundred twentyeight or so to start with. So, with those new purchases, did any crops come with it? LV: No, there were no permanent crops on there. WU: Okay. No orchards and things of that nature? LV: No. But in about 1974, Jerry Brandel talked me into growing pickles and we had grew up growing a few pickles so it wasn’t foreign to me, I knew something about it. WU: Now, how many... did you have a couple of acres of pickles? LV: When we grew up? WU: Yeah. LV: Well, I think Dad maybe had ten acres. WU: Oh, really? LV: And then these people that came from Arkansas, they picked the pickles, too. WU: They picked the cherries and they picked the pickles. LV: And part of our job was at the end of the day, go out and gather up the pickles. And then there was a pickle station. Jack Liebovitz had a pickle station by Twin Bridges. Bob Blackmer… Abe Rafelson was 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department buying pickles at the Blackmer store. And at that time, Stokeley’s was even buying pickles over on Taylor Road. [?] was buying for Stokeley’s; he was buying pickles back then. WU: So, there's a good market for pickles. You decided maybe you ought to go that route. LV: Well, and then Jerry Brandel was... he had hooked himself up with Heinz with some pickles. And so, we tried that and we did that for... WU: Well, when you say tried that, give me an idea, what type of acreage did you…? LV: I think the first go around we planted twenty, twenty-five acres. WU: Alright. LV: And then, of course, you got to get help, gather up the help, you know, to pick it. So, we did that and then we... WU: Well, let's talk about that. How… where did you get your help? LV: Well, I think we got them out of the employment office or Jerry Brandel might’ve had an extra family. I'm not sure. WU: We’re talking about migrant type folks would come up? LV: Migrant type people, yep. And at that time, we did not have any housing and so we rented a [?] house right next to us. It was migrant housing. And so, we rented that from them for the pickle season. They didn't need it until later for the Christmas trees. WU: Pickle season starts about when? The picking part of it. LV: It's usually the last week of July. WU: Okay, and it runs until? LV: It runs until the middle of September, probably. WU: Okay, so you’ve got… LV: Six weeks. WU: ...five, six, seven weeks of… maybe eight. LV: Depending on the weather, yep. WU: And it's all hand harvested? LV: All hand harvested, yep. WU: And in terms of putting together pickles, obviously you need the ground that can support pickles. And the mechanics of getting a pickle crop in? Why don’t you just describe it briefly. LV: Well, you got to have a planter to plant the seed. So, you’ve got to have a planter that'll do that. And then back then, there was no chemical weed control for them. So, we had to make sure you cultivated and then we used the same migrate people to do them and hoe them, usually twice. And so that’s not a 14 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department cheap task to do that. And pickles grow pretty fast because from the time you plant them until you start harvesting them, it’s usually forty-five to fifty days. So, it happens pretty fast. But you got to, you know, depending on the year we didn't have any irrigation. So, you’ve got to depend on Mother Nature to give you the water you need. Sometimes they do and sometimes they don’t, so that's the way that works. But we did eventually expand as we got into the late ‘70s. In ‘78, we built our first migrant camp, and so then we had housing that we could use and so we grew more pickles. And then in ‘82, we built another building. And so now we've got housing for seventy people. And so, we expanded the pickles; at one time we had one hundred and fifty acres when we were going at it. WU: Alright, so at the peak of the pickle part of your career as a pickle farmer, so to speak, you had a hundred and fifty acres. LV: Yeah, and that was probably mid ‘80s, somewhere in there. WU: Now, during that period of time, you needed how many people to help you harvest the crop? LV: Well, we staggered our plantings when we got into it awhile so we could actually… and the seed changed so we ended up with some seed that don't last as long. So, then we started picking them maybe only five times and that would be done. And then we’d go to the next field. And so, I think the most people we ever had probably was around eighty that were picking. We housed some and then we had some that we didn't house that were coming to work. WU: Sure, and how did you get these pickers? LV: It was mostly word of mouth, you know, people that had been there. And of course, when the pickles were in their heyday, we didn't have the volume of asparagus in the area that we have now. WU: Okay. LV: And so, pickles were the crop that the migrants were waiting for and that was where they were going to make their money for the summer. That whole thing has changed now. So that was... and then back then, we gave the people half the crop and, of course, that was it. And of course, as you well know, there was a lawsuit over that kind of activity. And so now you've got to pay all of these benefits on everybody and so it's not economically feasible anymore. WU: So, basically, the rules and regulations of the IRS and government authorities pretty much put that kind of business out. LV: And there's machines now that do most of it. WU: So, you need a lot of capital to buy the machine. LV: Oh, yeah. But you don't need the physical labor to do it. And I'm not sure that the generation of people we have now would want to do… you know, that’s just terribly hard work. WU: Yeah. LV: And I don't think the generation of people we have now would buy into that. WU: So, besides pickles and some cherries, any other crops? Of course, you talked about beef already. 15 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: Well, we’ve always grown corn and we grew it sometimes to sell some. And we had corn. We've pretty much always had some beef around there. WU: So, you needed hay, so I assume you had some of that. LV: We had a little bit of hay and corn. And then in the middle, I think in the ‘80s somewhere we started growing cabbage and cauliflower. And that was in conjunction with the pickles. And it kind of fit because most of the labor needs for that were after the pickles were done and we had labor and so we could harvest the cauliflower and the cabbage after that. WU: You were basically the administrator of all the farm activities. LV: Yeah. WU: And I assume you had to do a certain amount of the physical labor, too? LV: Yeah, I did. WU: What other… did any of your family follow in your footsteps and help you with the...? LV: Well, while our kids were growing up, they all helped. That was part of living there and that's what you do. And they all picked asparagus. Our daughter was not very happy about doing that, but she did. And then, a few years there when we didn't have many cherries, but we had equipment to harvest them and then we did some custom harvesting. And so, the boys all helped. WU: So, this would be you and the boys would go out and…? LV: Well, we had to hire some people besides, but me and the boys could run the machinery and it took some, you know, some labor. We had a harvester - you had to put a tarp out under a tree and somebody had to do that. So, we did that for a few years and then we… WU: So, that’s custom harvesting, basically. LV: Yep, we did that. WU: Would you do that just in Oceana County or did you go outside the county? LV: No, pretty much Oceana County. We went up to Ludington once and did some, but no, we didn’t get any farther away than that. Some guys did. Some guys used to go all over the place. But now we… well, we had as soon as the cherries got down, we had the pickles and sometimes they overlapped. And I know there was a couple times that we were shaking cherries and they were picking pickles at the same time and we had to go after the shaken cherries. We had to go and gather up all the pickles and do something with them. WU: This is sort of an open-ended question, but what are some of the best things about being a farmer? If you had to talk about some of the positive things about being a farmer, what would you say? LV: Well, I think the one that comes up first is that you’re kind of your own boss, the lifestyle of just being outside and out and about - that's attractive to some. I think being your own boss, I guess, you can go and come as you please and you can watch whatever you do, make that you’re growing something and you get self-satisfaction that “hey look here, this is what I did and now it's working.” And of course, the contrary, if it didn't work, so you're trying to sort out why it didn't work. But that's probably that and 16 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department it's an awful good place to raise kids. And I know that even any people looking for help, if the kid shows up there and says they've been on a farm, he’ll get the job before somebody else does just because they learn how to work by being there. WU: The work ethic that you're able to pass on to your… LV: Well, and I can have a twelve or thirteen-year-old do something for me. Nobody else can hire anybody that age. You’ve got to be family or you can't do it. So, there's knowledge, responsibility, and all kinds of stuff that you learn when you're able to start doing that. If you've got to wait till you're eighteen before you can do that, you know, that's tough. Some of the mold has already been made. [Laughter] WU: Well, that's an interesting comment. And it says a lot about our culture of today and how we got there. LV: Oh, yeah. WU: Well, being a farmer, bring me up to date with your activities now. Have you sold off some of this acreage or are you still quite active? LV: We aren’t growing pickles anymore. All we have now is we're concentrating more on asparagus. WU: How many acres of asparagus? LV: We've got about a hundred and twenty-five acres of asparagus. WU: Okay. LV: We've got about thirty acres right where I live that we're going to replant. We took it out here a couple of years ago. And so, our goal is to hover around a hundred and fifty if we can get there. WU: So that's your goal, to have all one hundred and fifty acres of asparagus. LV: Four years ago, we formed an LLC with my son, Lance. WU: Okay, so you and your son. LV: And so, that started out me eighty percent, him twenty. Every year, we're changing that, so this particular year we're fifty/fifty. Next year, he’ll be fifty-one, I'll be forty-nine, and that's the way it will continue. WU: So, he eventually is going to end up owning it. LV: Yeah, he's working into it, except for my wife and I still own all the property. WU: Okay. LV: The LLC just owns the equivalent. WU: It’s sort of the operating company… LV: ...operating entity. WU: And so, you can still charge rent to the operating entity to get...to keep... 17 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LV: So, I can generate some revenue because in the type of work that I've done all my life, the part that's missing is a big pot of retirement funds. And quite often in agriculture, that happens unless you once in a while - another plus to being farmers - once in a while, maybe once in your lifetime or twice, it'll hit and you'll have something that'll be worth something. WU: Yeah. You're talking oil or gas? LV: Well or even a crop of cherries. A lot of guys around have had a crop of cherries and they was worth something and it kind of yield them up. And asparagus has done that for some people, too. And of course, you've got to be sharp enough to know it when it happens and not squander it all. Anyway, so I don't have much of a retirement package, so I need to generate some rent off the land or do something, you know, so I can. WU: But your comments are very typical of a lot of growers and farmers in our area. LV: Yeah, I’d have a good retirement package if I sold out. WU: Well yeah - you’re land rich. LV: Yeah, if I sold out I... you know, I'd be good. But then my son wants the farm and of course he can't afford to pay what I could get for it if I sold it to somebody else. WU: Sure. That’s the way it is. LV: That’s just the way it is. WU: And so, the only way they are able to keep the farm going is to work out a program like you have with your son. So, encourage them to get involved and then eventually they'll be taking your place. LV: Yeah, that's kind of what the idea is. WU: Well, maybe this is too personal, but I'll throw it out anyway. What do you like to do to relax? Are there any special activities? LV: You know, that's another weak point for me. You know, I don't really have any hobbies. And I guess the part that I've done for several years - it's relaxing to me - is I participated in community. I was on the School Board for twenty years. That kind of gets your thought process to be on to something else. I was a County Commissioner for sixteen years; I really enjoyed that. That kind of gets your mind doing something different than what you've been doing. But I don't golf, I don’t… WU: You’re not a hunter necessarily or a fisherman? LV: Are you wondering, as kids we used to do that stuff, but no, I could fish, I suppose. WU: But it isn't anything on your bucket list necessarily to do. LV: No, uh uh. WU: As a farmer, I don’t know if you're able to do much traveling? LV: Well, we don't. What we've done here for I think three or four years now is I've got two brothers and so we try and spend a week or two together every summer and do something. A couple of years ago we went to Branson, spent a week in Branson. And last year we went down to Nashville and spent a week 18 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department down there. And so that's kind of enjoyable to do that. But I'm not… we have a cabin up across the straits that my dad and his brother built way back in the late ‘50s. And of course, both of them are gone and so it's the next generation that has ownership of it. And so, it's our family and my dad’s brother's family are the owners of the cabin. And my brother Norman keeps track of the cabin as to who is going when. And so, you know, once a year we try to go up there. WU: What's it nearby? What town is it nearby? LV: It's about twenty miles west of St. Ignes, little town of Brevort. WU: What’s the name of it? LV: Brevort. It's just a little bitty town. If you know where the Cut River Bridge is on US-2, it's back east of that. WU: Okay. LV: It’s right out in the woods. My dad used to go up there hunting when he was young and his brother did, too. And so, they bought an acre. And in 1957, ‘58, they built a little cabin. And for several years it didn't even have inside plumbing or bathroom, had an outside thing. And so, they fixed it up now so that it's more convenient. And so that's kind of fun to go up there and used to be the place to go and the phone wouldn’t ring while you’re there. Well, now these darn cell phones! [Laughter] WU: I know it. You can't have the peace and quiet you used to be able to enjoy. Well, from your perspective: farming has changed a lot during your lifetime. LV: Oh yeah, for sure. WU: And how would you describe the changes? What have you seen that's different in farming today than what it was when you were eighteen years old and twenty years old? LV: Well, the onset of electronics. You know, computers and cell phones and all that stuff. And then a lot of farmers are hooked up on... they’re doing GPS mapping of their fields. So, you can… if you got one spot that needs something extra, you can treat it that way; there's all of the suppliers of farm chemicals and fertilizer have people that are capable of coming to do that for you. And then you've got to have specialized equipment to buy fertilizer and it'll only apply it where you need it. It won't apply it... so everything's all GPS soaked in. So that's the technology that has really changed. The public's demands for where their food comes from has changed. Because we take fresh asparagus to Todd Greiner [?] to pack, he sells it to Meijer, Wal-Mart, wherever it goes. And so, then buyers require what we call a gap audit, generally accepted practices from a third party that have to come in and perform an audit. And they look at everything that we do, how we manage the land, how we manage manure, how we deal with our water and just what the source of the water is. And we have to have the water analyzed to make sure it's fit for what we're using it on and how we handle our chemicals and make sure that we don't put down more fertilizer than we need, make sure we're testing and doing all that stuff. And then every field has to be named, numbered, or something for traceability. So, if I take some asparagus down to Todd Greiner [?], he ships it to Walmart in Ohio someplace, and then if somebody gets something bad, they can track it right back to my place or anybody else. And so that's the public demands for stuff. And that's not all done yet. There’s more sophisticated audits and 19 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department then a voluntary deal that we do as Michigan Environmental Assurance Program, which they call MEAP, that we go through an audit by somebody from the conservation district. They'll come out and then we get a sign to put it in the front yard that says we’re MEAP verified, which tells everybody that, yes, we're paying attention... WU: ...to all these details and regulations. LV: All these details and all these regulations we’re abiding by them. And when I first started doing any of that, you know, I was more of a person that kept stuff in my head and you can't do that anymore. Everything is you’ve got to document, document, document and for the gap certification that we have, we've got a manual that's about that thick. We bought the manual from somebody that knew how to put one together, because when this first came about, wow, what are we going to do here? And so, we bought one from a guy that does auditing and you’ve got policies for everything that happens. There's a policy if somebody cuts their finger, there's a policy in there as to how you deal with it. And if you're out in an asparagus patch and you come up to where a deer has been out there and defecated, you've got a… there's a policy as to what you do with that. WU: That’s amazing, okay. LV: And so that's how more complicated it is now than what it used to be, because they're so concerned about E. coli, salmonella, all of these kinds of things. And I think, it's just my thought that, you know, the kids are being raised too clean. You know, we were raised playing out in the dirt and we’d have a sandwich - we never washed our hands - we were playing in the barnyard. We're doing all that stuff. And so, I think we built some immunities. WU: Okay. LV: I don't think people are building immunities now because they're… they won't let their system have a chance. WU: They’re too sanitized. LV: Too sanitized, I think. And so, the minute that something comes along that can cause them a problem, it does. And more so than when we were growing up. WU: That's an interesting observation. LV: But I may not be right. WU: Yeah. LV: But it just seems like, you know, every place you go, there's a sanitizer, you know, to keep you clean. But anyway, its consumer driven. Most everything that farmers do now is consumer driven. Animal rights people, they're all around, you know, where they’re growing these confined chickens in a cage. Well, the animal rights people got a hold of that and now they've got to redo it and make the cages bigger because the chickens are too crowded. And yeah, there's a lot of regulations and concerns that show up that are... I don't know if they're in the best interest of anybody. WU: Well, the technology and the social media out there is just a different world. LV: Yep. 20 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: And so, you know what's going on in all these different states and places through that medium. LV: Oh yeah. WU: Well, I want to wrap this up in just a few minutes, but you have... do you belong to any organizations that speak for farmers? LV: I belong to the Farm Bureau. WU: So, Farm Bureau is... LV: That's the only one that I… WU: ...that you belong to at least and you work with them or that represent agriculture. And of course, you've already talked about that you’ve been a County Commissioner, you've been involved in a lot of community affairs; as a result, you’re on all kinds of subcommittees and task forces. And I applaud you for all that activity. When someone listens to this tape or reads the transcript that eventually will be made of this twenty-five, thirty years from now. What would you most like them to know about your life and our community right now? So, anything special? LV: You know, I've always had trouble with goals. You know, setting something, and then when you get… and working towards it and then happy, happy, happy when you get there. And I guess maybe I'm not that good of a visionary to know where that ought to be. I kind of stumble through as I go. So, I don't know. I probably if I was to go through life again, I might do some things different. You know, you're always... hindsight is always twenty/twenty, but I'm pretty happy with what I've done. I'm proud of myself for my participation and the activities that I've participated in, the community service. And I'm confident that I've done a good job of it. But I guess history will have to determine whether that was correct or not. WU: Well, you've played a big role in the history of this community, and I'm sure it's well documented through our local papers and in all other types of public publications, so to speak. Is there anything that you would like to say, the part of this interview that I may not have even asked you about? Was there anything special you'd like to say? LV: I think you've pretty much covered, you know, our family history and what we've done as a farm. I think that's... I can't think of anything that you haven't covered. WU: Well, thank you for your time, Larry, and for sharing your memories with me. And this concludes our interview. Thank you very much. 21 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/a03819dca95f2477d8104b8e1e8f823b.mp3 db5486b30c6b4ed1911836bdd8fdea5b Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_VanSickle_Larry Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource VanSickle, Larry Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource VanSickle, Larry (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Lawrence (Larry) VanSickle. Interviewed by Walter Urick on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Larry VanSickle was born in Hart, Michigan in 1943 and grew up on a one hundred and twenty acre farm located on East Polk Road, which he later purchased from his father upon getting married in 1965. His family is of Pennsylvania Dutch heritage and each of the generations were involved with agriculture. Larry graduated from Hart High School in 1961 and then attended Michigan State University. After marrying his wife in 1965, he became a full-time farmer by taking over his father’s farm, and later focused on farming his one hundred and twenty-five acres of asparagus that will one day be taken over by his son. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Urick, Walter (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Dairy farmers Pennsylvania Dutch Michigan State University Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/c722ea729681a3aef4d6402c0f781069.pdf becb709cedcc1ebe4a9a4705e7c17b0f PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Jerry Spencer Interview Interviewed by Walter Urick June 18, 2016 Transcript WU: My name is Walter Urick, and I am here today with Jerry Spencer at the City of Hart Community Center in Hart, Michigan on June 18th, 2016, for the purpose of attaining the oral histories of the Spencer family. The oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. Jerry, thank you for taking the time to talk to me today. I am interested to learn more about your family history and your experiences living and working in Oceana County. So, let's just start out with some easy questions. State your full name, Jerry. JS: Jerry Gene Spencer. WU: And Spencer is spelled how? JS: S-p-e-n-c-e-r. WU: Now, when were you born, Jerry? 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: April 9th, 1932. WU: And where were you born? JS: In Hart. WU: And your father's name? JS: Eugene. WU: Spencer? JS: Spencer. WU: And your mother's name? JS: Leona McKee. WU: Alright, Leona McKee. McKee was her maiden name, is that what you’re telling me? JS: McKee was her father's name. And then her mother moved her up from Grand Rapids and she married Charley Schultz. WU: Okay. When you use the name McKee, is that part of the McKee family of Pentwater? No relation? JS: No relation to my knowledge. WU: Well, your dad at the time of your birth was about how old? JS: I would guess about twenty, twenty-two, maybe. WU: Okay, and let's talk a little bit about... well, before we talk about your parents, did you have siblings? JS: No, I was the only child. WU: Okay, well, let's back up then to your parents. Start with your dad, in terms of what he did for a living. Describe it as best you can. JS: He, my dad, farmed his whole life on our farm. That is still... not farming anymore, but it's still located just outside of Hart. WU: And that's part of the industrial park now? JS: Right. WU: When your dad was farming it, can you describe the acreage, for example? JS: The base farm only had thirty-six acres, but my grandfather - his dad - had purchased probably farms in the county that probably they had two to three hundred acres altogether. WU: Alright, well, then you're taking me back to another generation - your grandfather - and what was his name? JS: Edward. 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: So, we have Edward Spencer and you grew up on a thirty-six-acre farm, is that what you're telling me? JS: Yes. WU: Okay, well, let's just talk about that thirty- six acres for a little bit. What type of farm was it? What type of crops or activity was it? JS: It started out when my dad was a child - it was a dairy farm, kind of. WU: Really? JS: Back then they didn't have many, maybe ten or twelve cows that they milked and then they eventually turned into all fruit. WU: And when you say fruit, what type of fruit? JS: We had a little bit of everything. We had sweet and sour cherries, apples, plums, peaches, pears. WU: How many acres do you think were in an orchard situation? JS: The whole farm was an orchard. WU: Really? Except, obviously, for the house and the barn. JS: Except for the house and the barn and what used to be the barnyard and stuff like that. WU: So out of the thirty-six acres, would it be fair to say you probably had at least thirty-two, thirtythree? JS: I would guess, in that area. WU: Of tillable or producing land. JS: Of tillable property, producing land. WU: Now, talking about your father. I know that he died relatively... JS: At forty-nine. WU: So, when he was forty-nine, he died. What were the circumstances? JS: Heart attack. WU: That's what I thought. JS: He had one when he was forty-four, another one when he was forty-six, and one when he was fortynine. And that got him and he... back then they couldn't do anything. WU: Right. JS: He was on a blood thinner and that was all. He couldn't work, he couldn't do anything those five years. WU: Alright, so the last five years of his life he basically was disabled. 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: He just sat in the house. WU: Oh my. Well, it must have put a little pressure on you and the rest of the family. JS: I was going to college and just got out of college at that time. So, I never went to the service because right at the time I got a call to go for my army physical, my dad had a heart attack and I was the only breadwinner of the family at that time. So, I got a farm deferment... what they called a farm deferment at that time. WU: We’ll revisit that in a moment. Right now, trying to get a feeling for your dad, what he did. When he was healthy, basically, he was a farmer, that’s what you're telling me? JS: Yes, that’s all he did. WU: And he did the dairy farm and the yearly part? JS: Yes, and then it switched to just beef cattle. WU: To beef cattle? JS: For a while and then they eliminated all the livestock and just went strictly fruit farming. WU: Now, was he in partnership with his dad, your granddad? JS: Yes, he was in partnership with my grandfather, Edward, and they had leased - oh my gosh, I don't know - outside of our farm, they had bought a farm up a road called the Sturge Farm, and that was twenty acres, I think. And they had a farm over to Mears on Round Lake and they farmed all of them. WU: So, your dad... was Marshall Spencer a part of that or was…? JS: He was...no, he was... Marshall was my dad's brother. WU: Right. JS: Younger brother and Marshall went to New York and farmed for a few years and then came back to Michigan and bought a farm out east of Hart. WU: Okay, so that was separate… JS: Separate, yep. WU: That wasn’t part of… JS: My dad was the only… they had, my grandfather, they had four boys and three girls. And my dad was the only one that stayed at home and farmed. WU: Okay. JS: So, when my grandfather died, when my dad got the home farm and then that's still there. WU: Now, your mom, did she at least in your formative years, your early years, did she work outside the home? JS: She worked at Stokely’s [?]. 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Okay, seasonal work? JS: Yeah, in Fruitland [?], that they had in Hart. WU: And if this may be a hard question to answer, but when you think of your dad, what do you think he was most proud of having done in his life? JS: I don't know, except I know he was a very generous person and trusted everybody. My dad said if there is somebody - and him and my mother, I know, used to get in big growls [?] over it because he would loan anybody anything that they wanted. And so, my mom would say, well, you're never going to get that back. And my dad would say, well, maybe not. We don't need to worry about it. And so, I would think that, you know, I looked at him as for that, that he was… WU: Very generous. JS: Very generous and very trusting. And I know he always told me, he said, “if there's somebody that don't trust people, then he can't be trusted.” My dad always went in that philosophy so… WU: That's a good line. That's a good philosophy, really. JS: So, my dad was easygoing; my mother not quite as much. WU: Well, speaking of your mom, I'll ask you the same question I asked about your dad. Is there anything special in her life that she was very proud of? JS: I can't think…. I know she did a lot of work with the church and at [?], you know, they... well, you're familiar with the congregators that they had… WU: Yes. JS: And that probably was something that she would be proud of… WU: Being a part of that women's society group in the church. JS: Yeah. WU: Well, I’m going to back up now and take you through your childhood, your education, and so on. You've already told me you were born in, what, ‘32? JS: Thirty-two in Hart Hospital. WU: Thirty-two in Hart… in the old Hart Hospital. Actually, that was the real old Hart Hospital, before the new one was built. JS: Correct. WU: And so, I am assuming your education was all through the Hart Public School system? JS: Hart Public Schools and then I went to Michigan State. WU: Well, let's back up and keep you on Hart schools for a little bit. So, you went through the Hart schools. You graduated with the class of? JS: Fifty. Nineteen fifty. 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Nineteen fifty from the Hart… and at the time you were living at the home place here, just west of the fairgrounds, more or less. JS: Correct. WU: And let's talk about your childhood a little bit. Do you have any real vivid memories from your childhood concerning maybe the friends that you had or the activities that you participated in? JS: Oh, I had friends. You know, Jack Osten-Sacken, back in elementary school, was out at our place almost every weekend. And of course, he didn't… his father lived in New York, so he kind of adopted my dad as his dad. WU: Sure. JS: And he always talked about that. And in high school, I didn't go for sports because I was too small. So, I was what they called the manager then and I got to wash all the football uniforms and polish the footballs, pack them for the games and stuff like that. And so anyway, it was a lot of fun. At the time, you don't think so, but when you look back on it, it was a lot of fun and good times. WU: And made you part of the teams and the coaches. JS: Oh, yeah. WU: In those years, as I recall, as a young boy, those were some real good athletic teams for Hart. JS: It was, yeah. We went to the quarterfinals in state when my junior year and we won the conference, I think, all four years that I was in high school. WU: I think it was the semifinals, wasn't it? JS: Was it the semifinals? WU: Yeah, you got beat by Kalamazoo, St. Augustine. JS: St. Augustine, an all-boys school. WU: An all-boys school before they changed the rules. JS: Yeah. WU: So, I think that school had something like three hundred boys and... JS: We had like one hundred and fifty. WU: And you had one hundred and fifty. See, so basically what they started doing, any school that had three hundred boys would be treated as if they had six hundred kids and they would not be playing in class C. But that's an aside to this interview. [Laughter] That’s something that even upsets me as I think about… JS: Back then, yeah. WU: But you mentioned Jack Osten-Sacken. Did you have any other reasonably close friends as a kid, so to speak? 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: I had Don McLennon and Dick Curtis. Dick and I probably was real close; Dick lived with his grandparents and we did a lot together all through high school and after high school, even, until we both got married. WU: Yeah, unfortunately, Dick, was... JS: Yeah, got killed with a freak accident. WU: Freak accident, yeah. I'm sorry. I remember reading about that, hearing about that. JS: Working for the city and a utility pole, well, that's when they were building the new hospital. WU: Right. JS: And he had climbed up on a pole and it wasn't planted in the ground and it fell and killed him. WU: Now, as a child, I assume you have a lot of farm-type chores. Is that a correct assumption on my part or…? JS: Yes, when you grow up on a farm, you’ve got to go home after school and do some things. And back when we had cattle, I’d just feed them the grain and stuff. And then, of course, after we got rid of the cattle, it was spraying. And I had to drive for the sprayers when I could, when I was home on Saturdays. Every Saturday we were spraying and I got a nickel a tank, I can remember, for driving the tractor. And I was so little at that time, when I first started, I don't know, probably five, six years old that I couldn't turn corners. So, my dad... but I could keep it straight down the rows. So, when we would come to a corner, my dad would climb down off the sprayer, between the sprayer and tractor, and grab the wheels and turn the corner and hit it back, then jump back up on the spare. WU: So, your dad would be doing the spraying. You were basically driving the tractor that pulled the sprayers, is that what you're telling me? JS: Right. WU: And you're spraying all kinds of, what, cherries? JS: Cherries, apples, peaches, plums, pears. WU: Well, at that point, you… JS: At that time, they sprayed by hand. They didn't have power sprayers. WU: Sure, so that's why it was a two-person job, is what you’re telling me. But even taking you back into maybe junior high or maybe fifth, sixth grade, did you have cattle that you had to deal with in those early years? JS: I never had to do much with the cattle. WU: You didn't have to. You didn't have to worry about getting up and milking them? JS: Oh no, I didn't have to do that. WU: Well, you got lucky then. Alright, so your orchard experiences and the orchards came along, about what stage of life were you? Were you in junior high or…? 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: Let me see. I can remember, we were all in orchards in… ‘44...that would be ‘54… probably about the time I was in high school. WU: That's when you switched... JS: From cattle to fruit farming. WU: Cattle to fruit farming. Okay, and of course, that takes a while to get the trees planted and get them turning [?] and producing. But when you use the language fruit farm, you know, are we talking not only your thirty-odd acres and some of these other properties as well? JS: Yeah, most all the other properties we had were properties that had orchards on, that the people that owned them didn't have the equipment and couldn't take care of them. So, like, we would maybe take care of it, spray it and harvest it and get half or… WU: Get a percentage of the crop. JS: ...a third or a percentage of the crop. WU: Okay. JS: Yeah, that's how that worked. WU: So, you would end up helping out on these leased places. JS: Right. WU: And the farm, the other farm that you and your dad, well, your dad and his father purchased also. JS: Yeah. WU: Well, backing now into your educational background. You've obviously graduated from Hart High in 1950. Let's go forward. I know you went to college. Just indicate what was going on in your life and what... where you went on to school and what type of program you've gone into. JS: Well, I went to Michigan State the first year. First year I was there, I had picked Pomology, which is the study of fruit, because I was familiar with that. And I didn't feel it was challenging enough, so I switched to Ag. [agricultural] engineering and I don't know if that was too challenging or what. And then I switched back to Ag. mechanics. And then my last year - I went five years - my last year, I taught labs and in some of the Ag. courses for professor, as well as going to school. WU: You were a teaching assistant then? JS: Yes, just an assistant in the labs, yeah, helping out. And then I graduated in ‘55. WU: From Michigan State with a degree in? JS: A B.S. WU: A B.S. degree, a Bachelor of Science degree. In what field? Agriculture? General…? JS: My degree was in...it come from the School of Natural Science and Resources and I came home then and farmed and I farmed probably for... 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: I'll get to that in a little bit. JS: Okay. WU: I want to keep you sort of in the educational part because, in fact, I even want to take you back to Hart High. Was there any particular teacher that helped you, that you were really close to or had some real fond memories of? Let's do it at either the elementary or high school level, either one. JS: Oh, in elementary, I can remember Mrs. Northrup. Well, I don't know. WU: That would have been about the third grade. JS: Yeah, third or fourth grade. Fourth grade, nope, fourth grade I was in the Critic [?] Room, which was where the... back then, they taught kids to teach school. They didn't have to go to college. WU: Oh, that's right. JS: And they had a Critic Room… they had fourth and sixth graders. WU: This is called Oceana Normal or something like that in order to get country school teachers certified. JS: And so, they taught us, they took kids out of the fourth grade and the sixth grade and put them in what they called the Critic Room. And then those young people wanting to be teachers would teach us… WU: ...would practice on... JS: Yeah, would practice. WU: Well, that's interesting. I hadn't heard that before. So, I know various people who ended up being school teachers in these one room schoolhouses and part of their education was they'd have to come right down to Hart Public Schools. And so, they were practicing and they were being critiqued and they were being taught how to be teachers. Is that it? JS: Right, and that's what that room was for. WU: And you were part of that guinea pig class? JS: Yeah, I don't know how long they had that. I know I was in it in the fourth grade. I don't think they had it because I can remember where the room was. And when I was in high school, it was gone. WU: It was gone, yes. JS: It was the sixth-grade room then or something. I don't remember. WU: Well, you mentioned Mrs. Northrop. Once you go into high school, any particular teacher? JS: Mr. Sheehan [?], probably. WU: He was the math teacher. JS: He taught math. And he was very strict, but I get along really good with him. WU: He was demanding. 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: He was demanding, yep. But you learned a lot in his class and of course, then the coaches, because I was the manager, Mr. Swanson and Jack Epenstall [?], whose names are familiar to you I’m sure. WU: Sure. JS: And Jack, we get to see Jack almost every year in Florida. He's… of course, Swanson passed away back… I went to his funeral back probably ten years ago. WU: Yes, so those were the men in the school system that influenced your life, at least, or people you could relate with. JS: Yeah. WU: Well, from a college standpoint, were there any Oceana County kids that you either room with or got rides with or…? JS: Uh, I drove back and forth and, yeah, Gene Robinson. WU: Oh, Gene, okay. JS: Harley Hodges, Rich Hodges, Don McClennan. And we were all going to State at that time and we rode back and forth together on weekends or when we came home. WU: In terms of living arrangements, did you live with any of these folks or…? JS: No, I lived in the same dorm the first year down there. And then I moved out of a dorm into a co-op house because it was a lot cheaper. WU: That's what I did when I went to college! I ended up in a co-op house, so I guess we had a similar experience. JS: Yeah, and then we had to... in the co-op house, I know we worked… you had to put in six hours of work a week and they had certain jobs you could do. And I got to be Steward. I was Steward, for they made me be Steward for a whole year, which we had to do all the ordering of the food and stuff, which was a good experience. WU: Sure. JS: Then I worked at the campus press as a freshman for two years, two nights a week. I went to work at 1:00 in the morning and you had to work until you got the paper out, what they did was printed the State News. And I started there as a kid that sat at the end of the press and we had a counter and maybe two hundred papers would go to this dorm and two hundred would go to this dorm or something. We had to bundle them up and set them aside for delivery. And then the freshmen quit. And the woman that owned it asked if - Harley Hodges and I was working there - asked if we go in the press and Harley said yes. So, we knew nothing about it, but we soon learned. And so, then we got to be pressman, which we were in the big bucks, and we got a dollar seventy-five an hour for running the press. WU: And so, were you still in the co-op or were you out of the co-op? JS: I was in the co-op. The co-op was only a block from where the press was. WU: So, you still did the work of the co-op. You were making money on the side. 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: I made enough work on those two nights. I'd end up in the spring with more money than I started with in the fall. WU: One way to work your way through college. JS: It didn’t cost then, you know, tuition was only forty-seven fifty a term. WU: Yeah, was that a class or the whole thing? JS: That was for ten weeks for the whole thing. WU: So less than fifty dollars! You could… JS: ...was tuition. WU: That was your tuition. JS: Yeah. The only other expense was books and... WU: Sure, and your own living. JS: It cost us a hundred and twenty-five dollars a term for room and board in the co-op. WU: Yeah, those days have long gone, financially. JS: Yeah, so you're talking about five hundred dollars a year… WU: ...to go to school. JS: ...outside of books. WU: Right. Well what I want to do now is talk a little bit about after college and you start your life's work, so to speak. Can you just sort of take me through that? You graduate from college and I'm not sure if you're coming home to farm or if you're moving from there into other types of work? JS: I came home to farm because my dad was unable to do anything then, and so I farmed. WU: So, this would be nineteen fifty-five? Fifty-six? JS: Nineteen fifty-five, fifty-six. And let me put an age bracket with that. Let me see, my dad died when he was forty-nine, which was in fifty-nine. My dad died in fifty-nine, so then I farmed and gave my mother a share of the farm, fair share of the profits, and took care of the farms. And then in fifty-nine, 1959, I got married and, let me see, then I went to work for FMC Corporation and I think I was thirtyfour so that would have been. WU: Alright, let's just back up. Let's take the nineteen fifty-five to fifty-nine portion of your life. There's four years there. Your dad, at this point, is not able to do anything. JS: Nothing. WU: But your grandfather had passed on by then. JS: Yes. WU: Alright. 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: He passed on when I was in… when did he pass on? I can't exactly remember, but when I was in college. WU: Alright. So, at this point, you were basically it in terms of running the local family farm, so to speak, plus any of the leased farms. JS: Right. WU: How did you handle that? That's more than a one-man job. What did you hire people or how did that work out? JS: Basically, no, I had, once in a while, I had... well, I had to have people help trim the orchards. WU: Alright. JS: And I hired a couple of people from Walkerville. WU: Are we talking about local folks or migrant? JS: Yeah, Ed Lathrop and [?] Brumley was my main pruners. Those guys were really good, a lot better than I was. And then if I needed help in the spring, Albert [?] - you probably remember Albert used to work for me? WU: Yeah, he graduated with me. He was a little old for our class. JS: I'm sure. [Laughter] But Albert used to work for me when I needed help doing anything, spreading fertilizer, picking up brush or whatever. Albert, I could always depend on him. WU: Then in terms of harvesting these crops? JS: That's the best years of my life. And we had, back then, of course, we didn't have mechanical harvesters. WU: Right. JS: We had pickers. Our pickers come up all the way from… well, most of our pickers came from Arkansas and Missouri at that stage of my life. And nice families and I really enjoyed them. WU: Are these with Hispanic backgrounds or were these…? JS: These weren’t, these were all Southern people. WU: Caucasian folks or…? JS: Yes, and then it switched. Well, that's a little bit later, if you wanted to go into it later. WU: Yeah, let’s just talk about... JS: That was just the [?] experience. That's where the pickers came from was Arkansas and Missouri for us. WU: Arkansas. How did you find them? 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: You know, I don't know. They just showed up and they'd show up and say, “do you need help?” And we'd say, “yeah.” And we had buildings for them to live in. Of course, the buildings are still there and they’d stay for the harvest and go back. One family particularly back then I can still remember; Woods their name was. Johnny Woods and I, the year I graduated from college, they went on then down to southern Michigan and picked apples. And when I graduated from college that year, I went down and stayed with them in a little shack. We used to… our pastime at night was watching mice run around and picked apples with their family. And that was an experience and a half. I always wanted to make the fruit circuit and see what it was like, but I decided that it wasn't that much fun. WU: So back in those early days, you're telling me that people would migrate from the South? It probably was hot; they wanted to get into cooler climates. Their backgrounds, did they… what did these folks do back in Arkansas, any idea? JS: Yeah, well I could carry this family. Well, no, that's a family that we got a little bit later. Woods’, I don't know what they did for a living. I do know that my wife and I was married back several… oh, probably this happened about twenty years ago. Three o'clock in the morning, I got a telephone ring and I wondered who in the world would be calling me. And his daughter was five years old when they picked cherries for us. And she got thinking about us in California and might have been drinking or something and called us at three o'clock in the morning. WU: [Laugher] Midnight, there! JS: I hadn’ t seen her for... she was probably in her thirties then or something. So anyway, that was those early years that those people came. Then later on it switched, of course. WU: How many people would it take to harvest the cherry crop? JS: We had probably about forty, counting the kids. WU: About forty, counting the kids all out there picking. And did they all stay on your place or…? JS: Yeah, but we had a few local people that picked probably maybe ten. But other than that, the rest of them all stayed there. WU: Well, just for the historical aspect of it, take me through a typical cherry-picking day. What you would be doing and what time would the day start? What would you have to do to be ready to get moving that day? JS: Usually the night before you'd get cherry lugs out and scattered where they could get them without going too far from their trees. The pickers had rows and I wasn't out there when they started because my pickers used to go out and wait for it to get light enough so they could see the cherries and then they'd start picking probably five o'clock in the morning. And when I'd get out there, I'd go around and pick up the cherries that they had picked. WU: Now, you'd be driving a tractor with a trailer? JS: We had a little skid on the back, no wheels on it, just like a stone boat. And we'd pile the lugs on there. And I usually had a high school kid that helped me do that. And so about ten o’clock, eleven o’clock in the morning, we'd have a load. We’d haul all our cherries in a pickup. We'd have eighty, ninety lugs of cherries. 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Okay, so let’s back up. You had to get those eighty or ninety lugs of cherries out of the orchard. You did that by driving around and picking them up from where these families were working and they would actually stack them. So, you only had to go to a certain pile. JS: They might have like four lugs - it’d depend on the number of cherries - you might have four lugs in this stack, maybe two or three down the row, they'd have six or eight lugs stacked up. WU: You’d pick them up, put them on the skid, drag them to where the pickup was. JS: Right and set them on the pickup, load them on the pickup. WU: And then where would you go with that load usually? JS: We delivered several places: Stokely’s, of course would be one, Fenton’s in Mears was another one, Hart Cherry Packers downtown at that time. And we depend and we just delivered all of them. WU: So, the first all that you took in would be about what time? JS: Probably about ten to eleven. WU: Alright. Somewhere between ten and eleven, you drive to whatever cannery you're going to that day and it would be weighed in and… JS: ...they’d dump the cherries, put your lugs back on the truck… WU: And then you’d weigh out? JS: ...take them back to the orchard and scatter those lugs out and then turn right around and gather up a load. And about two o'clock in the afternoon, we’d take in another load. WU: That would be your second load. JS: And then we’d come back, we'd scatter those out and the pickers would quit usually around four thirty or five o'clock, and we’d gather them and then take them in after supper, usually, someplace. WU: So basically, you're making three runs to the canneries? JS: That’s what I did, three trips a day. WU: Three trips a day and then that last trip that might take you a little while because everyone's coming in at the same time and you've got to get in line, as I recall. JS: You’d take those… I’d take those back out to the farm and dump the lugs off at the orchard and then come back up to where the farm buildings was and by then the pickers, most of the pickers, would be sitting around visiting. And so, I’d go out and we'd sit and visit for a half hour or an hour and go to bed. WU: In terms of paying the pickers, did you do that…? JS: On most Saturdays. WU: Every Saturday you would… that’d be payday. JS: I'd be paid cash. 14 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Oh, you paid cash, not checks. JS: No, and most of it we gave out tickets, little tickets. For each lug, they'd get a ticket. And when it come Saturday, I'd go out Saturday afternoons after I got the cherries in from the morning and we’d pick till noon. I’d go out in the afternoon with a bundle of money and pay them what they wanted. And some of them wanted just enough money to buy groceries with. And in fact, that's what most of the families did. And so sometimes I didn't take that much money. And then when you got done picking for the year, then they'd turn in the rest of their tickets and they'd take that money and go back home usually. And with some families, I guess that's pretty much the money that they had from down there. I know they used to pay… they had what they called burial fees that they had to pay to take care of their burials, and they would use that money to bring them up to date and then live on down there. So, it was fun. I enjoyed those… I enjoyed the pickers. WU: Do you remember what you were paying per lug? JS: Back then, it was about fifty cents. WU: That’s what I thought. And so, you would have… did they get a punch card or was it just a ticket per lug? JS: Just a ticket. Yeah, it was about an inch by two inches. WU: And it was a ticket that they could not duplicate or…? JS: I never thought about it. WU: You were trusting. JS: I don't think they ever did duplicate them, to my knowledge. But I suppose in this day and age, somebody would. WU: Certainly, with the technology. JS: But back then, they didn't even think about it. WU: In terms of getting the tickets, you were telling me you picked up six lugs here and eight lugs here. When did they… did you give the tickets every day, at the end of the day? JS: I’d give them to them as you picked up the cherries. WU: Oh, so as you picked up the cherries… JS: If you had four lugs, I’d give you four tickets. WU: So, someone... you would actually hand the tickets to one of the pickers there? JS: Right. WU: So, they'd see you coming and you would be... whoever you hired might be loading them up while you're… JS: ...giving out tickets. 15 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: ...giving out tickets. So that was done simultaneously and that was your record and it was up to them to hang on to them. You didn't even keep a record. JS: I didn't keep a record, no. WU: You didn't write down, “Smith had so many and Joe had so many”? JS: No, I had no idea at the end of the week how many they had. WU: And, well, you knew how many tickets you had to start. JS: I suspect that they, you know, if somebody runs short of money and needed two or three dollars, they'd probably go to one of the other families there and say, “Do you have any money? I’ll give you these.” So, I think they probably switched tickets back and forth sometimes. WU: That didn't bother you. JS: No, that didn't bother me a bit. But that's how we paid back then. And this would have been in the sixties, probably, fifties and sixties, and then our pickers all changed after that. WU: Alright. Well, let's talk about that, the change in the type of folks that… JS: For us, the family in Arkansas and Missouri that was coming up - and once you had them, they came every year - couldn't come anymore. And I had a couple, an elderly couple, the last name was Kreals [?]; they were from Alabama. And he had a son, Johnny, with a big family, and he had a son-in-law called H.B. Holland. And so, they all came up and then I had a family from Florida - our pickers basically came from Alabama and Florida. And in Florida one year, all our pickers came from the same town in Florida. WU: And they were Caucasian? JS: Yeah, all Caucasians. We had one of the couples, he was a janitor at the hospital and his wife was a nurse. The other one was a blacksmith in the town. The other one was a district manager for the Whataburger stands in Florida. And plus, he ran the stand at Busch Gardens, Whataburger. It was like a McDonald's. And they’d come up, he took his vacation and it was nice. They all knew each other. Every Sunday they'd have a picnic at Crystal Lake. They all take a dish to pass and go over there and swim and have a picnic, all our pickers together. And it was just one big happy family. And that was… but H.B. Holland, I remember he had two daughters and two sons and him and his wife, and they had to pick him and his wife had to pick - twenty lugs a day. And one of his sons had to pick sixteen. The other one had to pick ten and his two girls, they had to pick fourteen. And when they got that amount of cherries they could quit. They were done for the day. Sometimes they were done at two thirty, three o'clock in the afternoon. I’d come back from my afternoon load and, particularly him, he'd be sitting in the shade in a chair with a beer, enjoying life. And he said, “I really like this.” He said, “I don't have a worry in the world up here.” He said, “the only worry I have is where my next row is.” He said, “I have nobody calling in that they can't show up for work today.” WU: Well, you were very fortunate then, you had people… JS: Nice families. WU: They were nice families, they were very functional, and they were basically trying to finance their own vacation, it sounds like. 16 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: This was their vacation. They got out of the heat... WU: They got out of the heat, they came up and picked cherries, and made a little money to finance it, maybe a little extra to take home. JS: A funny thing, just last week I come home and my wife said, “you got a telephone call you have to make and it'll take some time.” And I said, “who is it?” She said, “I'm not telling you.” And I said, “come on, you got to tell me before I call.” And she said, “you’ll know, when you call.” So, I called this number and my wife had written it down. And this woman answers. She said, “Well, Jerry says that this is Judy Kreal [?]. And she was thirteen and they picked cherries for us. And that was the last year they picked for us was ‘73. And she says, “whenever any members of our family get together,” she says, “all we talk about is the fun times we had at Hart, Michigan.” And she says, “I pull it up and I see the farm buildings are still there.” And she says, “we had to call you.” And she says, “I'm trying to get a couple of my brothers and sisters, we’re going to fly up and we want to visit you this summer.” So, I don't know if they'll make it or not. WU: Well, that's amazing. But that tells you the close relationship you had. JS: Well, she said, “my daddy made us work so hard when we were up there.” She said, “we’d think we hated it.” But she says, “when we look back on it,” she says, “it was the best time of our life.” She says, “on Saturday mornings, all those pickers let their kids... what they picked Saturday mornings was theirs. They got the money for that.” And she says, “my daddy,” she said, “Saturday mornings let us have the money.” She reminded me of that, which I knew. And she says, “we had our own money for the first time in our life that we could do what we wanted to with.” And she says, “we had so much fun and everybody was so nice to us. We just love you and your kids.” And I was probably on the phone with her for an hour and then she sent on Facebook a picture of her to Joany, our daughter, because I don't have Facebook or anything. And I tell you what, I certainly wouldn't recognize her. But then she was a thirteen-year-old girl in ‘73. WU: Some years have gone by. [Laughter] JS: But we still maintain communication with them. In fact, Judy and I, three years ago when we went to Florida, we met a cousin of hers and her mother who used to pick for us that laked in Florida for lunch one day. WU: Well, moving back then to your farm and your dad passed away and now you're into the ‘60s. You were married what year? JS: Fifty-nine. WU: And you married whom? JS: Judy Pangburn, my next-door neighbor. WU: So, she's a gal right from the community and you were married and your family… you had how many children, Jerry? JS: Three. Two girls and a boy. WU: And their names are? 17 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: Jennifer Purdy now and Jeff Spencer and Joany Small. WU: Okay, and Jeff, do recall what year he was born? JS: He was born in [nineteen] sixty-one. WU: Alright. JS: And Jenny was born in [nineteen] fifty-nine. Jeff was born in [nineteen] sixty-one. Joany was born in [nineteen] sixty-four. WU: Okay, so those are your three children. Then we sort of ended up with you back on the family farm. But I know for a fact you didn’t stay there. JS: Right. WU: Can you help me with that transition? What happened in your life that caused you to leave the family farm, so to speak? JS: I was contacted by fellow, John Roth, from Fremont who worked for FMC Corporation in Ag. [Agriculture] chemical business, and they were looking for salesmen for this area. And he asked me if I'd be interested. I thought about it and thought, yeah, that’d work out okay. So, I took care of the farm nights and stuff for probably three or four years or maybe longer than that. And my wife took care of the harvesting in the summer, picking up the cherry lugs and hauling them. Except at night I would take in the last load usually for years. And then moving on from there, later in life, I had an uncle who was a warehouse manager at Stokely’s and he retired. And then he came out and did the spraying and stuff on my farm, did all the work and he and I basically harvested the fruit then and then I retired, what, twenty-three years ago. Then I sold the farm to the city. WU: Sure, let's go back to your starting a new career. You're a sales person. JS: Yeah. WU: And you're selling for? JS: Ag. Chemicals. WU: Ag. Chemicals. JS: Fruit growers only; we weren't in the row crop business. WU: Alright, so you're dealing with… so you’re selling fruit chemicals. Does this require you to be visiting farms or…? JS: We were a service-oriented company. We sold directly to the growers. We sold through service. If you had a farm, I’ll use Fox’s as an example, because they were one of my biggest customers. I went through their orchards every week, and in their case, made recommendations on what they should be using. I knew the number of tanks that it took to spray each crop that they had. I ordered to spray material. They would set it right on their farms for them. And told them when they should use it. And that's how we did that. That was a lot of service. 18 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Alright, so physically you would be there. You would look at the leaves on the trees, make a determination on… JS: What they needed. WU: What they needed, based on what you actually saw. JS: And we’d try to recommend the material. I always tried to recommend material that was the most economic for them that would still do the job. WU: So, and you’re using your background from your college days. I assume you had lab facilities that you could send stuff into? JS: Well, yeah, Extension, too; Michigan State was good, but we had... what was I going to say? I lost my train of thought here. The service part was we were the only company that really serviced orchards like that. We got a little more for our chemicals, but we could save you money during the year, too, and what you used and in products like that. So, and once you got a customer, he was yours. So, yeah, you pretty much had job security. And then I worked for them for twenty-two years. WU: Let's just leave it with them for a few moments. I'm trying to understand the regional area that you covered. So obviously, Oceana; were you beyond Oceana County? JS: Oceana, Mason, and Newaygo Counties. WU: Alright, those were the three counties that you would have picked up clients, visited their orchards, and made recommendations. JS: Right. WU: And would that be a year-round job or was this more or less a seasonal? JS: It was a year-round job. Over the summers, of course, we were busy. The winters you spent at shows, putting on meetings for growers… WU: Educational-type meetings. JS: Educational-type meetings for any new products that were out, going over them. WU: And educating yourself, I assume you had to go to conferences and so on. JS: Right. If you are in a business like that and I suppose it was the same with you, too. You learn from this grower that has a problem and you find out how it works for him. So, then you know, the next guy and you learn really from the people you’re calling on, too. WU: Sure. Well, apparently you worked twenty-three years for this company. And then what happened after that? JS: They sold our sales group; we worked for FMC Corp. and they had two divisions. Our division, which was called the direct sales - we sold directly to growers -and then they had a Fairfield division because FMC also produced a lot of chemicals. We had our own chemicals and this division sold chemicals to distributors and other dealers. And so, they decided that to get rid of the direct sales force because there was friction always between us because they would want to sell a dealer and the dealer would 19 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department say, well, you were out in the field selling growers; I’m not buying your stuff. And so, they sold us and we were purchased then by Conagra Foods, which was grower service in Michigan. And I worked for them. I told them I'd work five years and then I was going to retire and I did. And they hired me to mesh the FMC sales force in with theirs. They never really worked out that good. We were a service-oriented company with FMC, and they weren't. They were strictly sold on prices and… WU: ...pushing their product. JS: ...pushing their products. And our salespeople didn't like that. However, the five years I was there, we only lost one salesperson and the year I left everybody quit from FMC that they had. So, and now they're working for all other companies. WU: Yeah, so basically, you had a twenty-three plus five or twenty-eight-year career in sales and service to the agriculture community. Oceana, Mason, and Newaygo. Is that sort of a fair, quick summary? JS: Yeah, I had the same territory all those years. WU: Well, after you retired, did you continue on with any type of work for…? JS: Well, we still had the farm. WU: Okay, so now you're back to doing farming. JS: Yes. WU: And you continued to do that up until the time you sold it to the city? JS: Sold it to the city, right. WU: Okay, what year was that? Do you remember when the sale was made? JS: Boy, I don't. WU: And that was for the industrial park purposes. JS: Yes. WU: You retained at least the home place and the barn, is that correct? JS: I retained the frontage. WU: Okay. JS: Well, my mother, in the meantime, remarried and the house was separate. And I sold the buildings and I didn't... I sold everything to the city so they could annex it. WU: That’s right. JS: And then I had five years to buy the frontage back, which I did. And then, of course, I sold, you know, where Rennhack’s [?] is. And we still got the rest of it. WU: Alright, so you still own...what? JS: The farm buildings and, well, about four acres, probably. 20 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: You still own four acres there. Well, of course, farming has changed a lot during your lifetime. What do you see are special challenges that farmers face today? JS: I think probably they're big; they, you know, they keep buying and expanding and I was never... not my way of going, I guess, or everybody that does it seems to come out doing well. But I, because of that, you know... WU: The corporate farm way is what's happening. JS: ...is what's happening. And I don't know if it's good or not. I still think, you know, I always said, “give me forty acres, something that your family could take care of. And if you could sell most of your stuff retail, you could make a really good living.” And farming’s a good way of life. I don't know, there's just something about… I used to just enjoy driving through the orchard, spraying at night and watching the fruit grow and on the trees. It's a good feeling. WU: Just being part of God's Earth, so to speak. JS: Regulations - it's changed so much. Regulations on chemicals, what you can use, what you can't use, when you can use it. And some of it’s fine and some of it is stupid. WU: It just makes it more difficult to do your life's work. JS: Yeah. WU: Well, Jerry, I know you've been very involved in the community and I think its part of your oral history. Why don't you just briefly state some of the organizations you've participated in and taken a leadership role? JS: Oh, my gosh. WU: I know, it's a long list. JS: Well, I was starting out back when I was in the business, I guess, they had a biology club - and I think they still have one, I don't know - that we got started and that was for fruit growers. And then I became a Commissioner, County Commissioner. WU: Oceana County Commissioner? JS: Oceana County Commissioner. WU: Right. JS: And I said at the time when I got it, I said, “oh, when I get to be seventy, I'm done.” And I did ten years and I resigned. WU: So, for ten years, you're a commissioner. JS: I was commissioner. I was on... in the meantime, then I was a member of the District Health Board. District Health Five and then District Health Ten and through all that turmoil. And a member of the Health Board, when we built the District Health Building out here. WU: The Malburg [?] building. 21 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: ...in the Cooney place, you know, and I was on the Workforce Development Board for Muskegon and Oceana County for years. Then after I was on as a business person, first I was on as a county... to represent the county, Oceana County. But then when I resigned from being a commissioner, Paul Roy, who was the head of it at that time, said, you’ve got to stay on our board. So, I said, “but I can't.” And he said, “yes, you can.” So, Jack Cheever [?], he said, you’ve got to have a business. So, I said, “well, I don't really have one anymore. I'm retired.” So, he said, “well, get one.” So, I went to Jack Cheever and I said, “Jack, can I be a consultant for you?” Jack said, “any day of the week,” he said, “you certainly can.” I said, “okay.” So, then they listed me as a... because the state of Michigan, if they would check, they listed me as a consultant. WU: Alright, so for what organization? JS: The Workforce Development. WU: Oh, Workforce Development. Okay, I missed that. JS: Workforce Development for Muskegon and Oceana Counties. We were together; still are, kind of. And so, but I finally got off of that. I'm still… I'm chairman of the City Planning Commission. I'm on EDC, Executive Board of Directors. I'm on the local Emergency Planning Committee Board. Yeah, so, I'm still involved enough to... WU: Well, I commend you for all your service. JS: You have to keep busy. WU: Sure, so that’s what you're doing in your retirement days: you're a volunteer, you serve on a lot of these boards. Jerry, when someone listens to this tape, which they'll be able to fifty years from now. But what would you most like them to know about your life and maybe the Hart community? Is there anything special that you would like to say? JS: Well, I was born and raised in Hart and never left. When I worked for FMC, they wanted to move me out east and give me a big territory. And I turned them down. And I know… well, you know, Fred Reilly? WU: Yes. JS: I worked with Fred, I worked under Fred when I was first hired here. And Fred said you shouldn't do that because he said they'll never, you know, it’ll really hurt you in the long run, you know. So, then it's a year after that, Fred got offered a job out east, the same job I was offered a year before, and he took it and they eliminated him a year after that. And so, I was glad I didn't do that. But no, I was born and raised in Hart and it's a good community to live in. And I think especially the last ten years, it has become more progressive. And I can see a lot of good things that's happened the last ten years. And I think there'll be a lot of good things happen in the future. WU: Any special advice you'd want to give a young person who may listen to this tape? JS: Not particularly, I think you just have to do what you think you should be doing and stick to your guns. And I don't know, other than that, things will fall in place for you if you work hard. WU: Is there anything else that you would like to share that I may not have asked you about? Something that you might want to make a record of? 22 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JS: It seems like you've covered things pretty good. WU: Well. JS: I think the most enjoyable part was - in the fruit business, anyway - it was, of course, we came up with… we had a shaker, but it was a limb shaker, which is one of the first shakers that came out, but that eliminated pickers. And I kind of miss that era; that was fun when you had families come up. And apples; I had a Spanish couple that picked my apples for a few years and, boy, they were good. They still stayed in the area. They, I think, now work for Tim Tubbs. I run into them every once in a while. They were… WU: They're not migrants anymore. They live in the… JS: They live here year-round. WU: And do you remember their names? JS: No, I don’t. WU: Okay, well, I just want to thank you, Jerry, for your time and for sharing your memories with me. And this concludes the interview. Thank you very much. JS: Thank you. You did a good job. 23 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/34173090a508e2ef3773523bb978c562.mp3 6456720df95745ed7ac0a5aa55aa1145 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Spencer_Jerry Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Spencer, Jerry Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Spencer, Jerry (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Jerry Spencer. Interviewed by Walter Urick on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Jerry Spencer was born in Hart, Michigan in 1932, as the only child of a farming family in Oceana County. He grew up on a thirty-six acre dairy and fruit farm that was passed down the generations from his grandfather. He graduated from Hart High School in 1950, studied Agricultural Engineering and Agricultural Mechanics at Michigan State University, and later married and worked at FMC Corporation before serving as a County Commissioner for Oceana County. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Urick, Walter (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Fruit growers Michigan State University Agricultural engineering Agricultural mechanics Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/b64d4505d42db2ebb99537979c3b8c11.pdf 5d497eaad098b7e503a6fba2a49b0361 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department John and Wilma Riley Interview Interviewed by Alan Moul June 18, 2016 Transcript AM: This is Alan Moul and I'm here with John Riley. That's J-o-h-n R-l-e-y… WR: R-i… AM: R-i-l-e-y. And Wilma, his wife, W-i-l-m-a. And the date is June 18th, two thousand sixteen. And this is part of the oral history being collected and its part of the Growing Community Project through Grand Valley. So, we're going to talk today about the Riley history in Oceana County and growing fruit, vegetables, Christmas trees, whatever they would like to talk about. So, John, I guess, where do the Rileys start in Oceana County? And how did they get here, maybe? Or what are you remembering about that? JR: My grandparents came from Alpena area and established what we call the home farm. And my son lives there now. And I have a place up on the hill just adjoining. AM: From Alpena then. JR: Yeah. 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AM: Now, were they farmers there or purchased the farm or what? WR: No, they had emigrated from Canada. AM: Oh! WR: Both his grandparents and also his grandmother's parents came from that area. AM: Okay. WR: They came first to Alpena to work in the lumber business and then moved to Mears and his grandma and grandpa were Richard and Clara Isabel Riley [?]. And they, first of all, became managers of the old hotel that was there in Mears. AM: Okay. JR: At the railroad station. AM: Was that in town there? WR: Yes. JR: There was a branch that went to Pentwater and there was a triangle there and one went to Hart and they were able to turn the engines around. You had to have a triangle to turn them around. AM: Well, sure. Yeah, okay. WR: His grandmother, who was always known to us as “Bel” or Isabel [?], her parents were Alexander and Caroline Henderson. And the original home farm that John referred to was purchased by Richard Riley and Isabel from her parents. AM: Okay, so that would have been originally Henderson's then. WR: Yes, in the deed. AM: Now how far back does that deed go? WR: It would have been in the late eighteen hundreds and I can't give you an exact date on that. His uncle, Bill, was born in Alpena. And I think that the year of his birth was eighteen ninety-three. So, it would have been shortly after they came from Alpena and lived there in Mears. AM: And so that's how they started farming then? They started on that piece of ground. JR: Yes. AM: How many... was that a forty [acre farm] or was that? A lot of the farms were quite small back then. JR: It was a forty. AM: Okay, yep. And did they grow fruit or what did they do? Do you know? JR: We've always been known as a fruit farm. And of recent years, twenty years ago we got into asparagus. Other than that, it was all fruit. Cherries are our main crop, apples, a few peaches, which none of us like. 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AM: [Laughter] I’m familiar with that. JR: It takes a lot of [?], they have fuzz that itches. AM: It does. [Laughter] And the fair is going on at the same time. WR: But, we like to eat them. AM: Oh yeah. [Laughter] So then you started farming… now, you yourself, when did you come into the picture then? I mean, did you work on the farm growing up, as a kid and all? JR: Oh, yeah. AM: Always been on the farm. JR: Oh yeah. AM: Okay. WR: His father, Clayton Riley, took it over when his dad died. His dad died very suddenly in nineteen twenty-seven, just before John was born and his parents then moved to the home place to be with Grandma Riley. And then eventually Clayton and Flora became the owners or managers, anyway. His grandmother held the title to the lands until after her death. They managed and everything was under their care but she was still owner of the property, which is interesting. AM: Okay. JR: She didn’t want to let loose. AM: Didn't want to give up control, huh? That’s understandable. JR: And she didn’t control anything, but that was her security, I guess. AM: Yeah, mentally, anyway, it was yeah. So how many brothers did you have? JR: Two brothers and two sisters. AM: Okay. JR: There were three boys and two girls. AM: Okay. Did they all farm then? JR: No, I’m the only one that... AM: You were the smart one that stayed on the farm. JR: You said it! [Laughter] AM: We all know all the jokes about how much money does it take? You know, you farm till it's gone and all that. [Laughter] So then you continued, probably, to… unless you've got like a timeline that you want to go through? WR: No, no. This is just about the Hendersons. 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JR: Everybody that owned the farm expanded, you know. AM: Right. Okay, yeah. WR: It was interesting, just recently - and I read this in an old copy of the Mears News - and it tells that the owner of the piece of property that we now own and live on, a part of the farm was sold to a man named Mr. Pike. And Swift, in his little paper, said, “I presume,” something to this effect, “I presume that when Mr. Pike finishes this transaction that he will call it Pike's Peak.” AM: [Laughter] Up on the hill, huh? WR: Yeah, yeah. And it's, to this day, it's still called the Pike Place. AM: So, did land… did you refer to pieces of land by names like that? Like today we… I know we had them on our farm. JR: Every piece of property had to have a name because when you went to the field, you had to know where you were going. And often they took the name of the people you bought from. AM: We had some “by the rock.” There was a big rock. “By the rock” or “north of the woods.” But you're right, usually the previous owner or… because we tried doing a number system one time and there were too many numbers, you couldn't remember them all. WR: Right. AM: So, yep. Let's see, so what do you… you served in World War Two, right? JR: Yes. AM: So, at some point you went off to that and then how did the farm carry on while you were gone then? JR: Well, it was still in the family farm. And my dad and mom farmed it and I went to the service right after school so I hadn’t really gotten started in it. AM: Okay, so you were nineteen or so. JR: Yeah. When we came back, then we… I decided to farm and started there. AM: Did you have hired hands or migrants or Mexican helpers or what did you have at that point? I know on our farm there was a lot of Southern workers. JR: Yeah, we had Southern people and we had housing for them that was a bear shelter. AM: Sure. Wouldn't pass now, would it? JR: No, no, no, no, no. In fact, the house where we live was one of the houses that the pickers lived in. AM: Okay. WR: But not the house that we live in now. JR: The site. 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WR: Yeah. AM: Okay, there’s pictures here. WR: ...of some when they were still picking cherries by hand. I found these last night and this is John and one of the older people. What was the older man's name? JR: Mr. Hilt. WR: Mr. Hilt, yes. And he had his own little part of the… he lived in one of the old buildings here at the farm. I brought that picture because it shows the old buildings at the farm. AM: Now, how many migrant workers do you think you had at the peak… would you have had harvesting cherries? JR: We never picked; most of my life, we’ve mechanically harvested. We had a crew, though, that came in and picked and they hauled them over to the plant in Hart - the Stokely plant. AM: Sure. JR: And they brought their people with them. AM: Crew leaders with big trucks, like with a canvas top. I remember that, barely, but I do remember that. JR: And then, from then on, the Labor Department got in it and every year we had to make improvements. And we have quite nice labor housing now. AM: Right, sure. WR: At one time, after his father died - John's father, Clayton, died - and I can remember doing the payroll and it was for over sixty. AM: Okay. WR: But that was, originally, when a family would come they would all pick under one name. And that built up Daddy’s Social Security. AM: Sure. WR: And then, you know, the government regulations changed. And then we had to use the name of every individual. AM: Right. WR: But we weren't long in that because then we went to mechanical harvesting. AM: Yeah. Now you had - when you did start mechanically harvesting - you had a Friday shaker, right? JR: Yes. AM: Okay, and that was two frames that came around the tree and there was a conveyor. We had a different kind, so I'm having trouble remembering exactly. But everybody kind of chose the one that fit their farm and the one they liked the best. 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JR: It had two inclined planes that got most of the cherries, some went over the edges, but they went down to a conveyor and the conveyor went from there, right into the cherry tank. AM: Okay, what year do you think you started? Did you put cherries in water before you mechanically harvested at all? JR: No. AM: Never did. JR: No. AM: Okay, just when you took them to the plant and dumped them in the big tanks. JR: Yeah. AM: Okay. And I remember the long lines with the juice running everywhere from the lugs. JR: Yes. AM: You could hardly walk across the trailer because it was so sticky it would just pull your shoes off, almost. [Laughter] And then, so we started mechanically harvesting then and so you could cover more ground. I mean, now you could plant more acres. JR: Yeah. I don't know how many pickers we’d need to have now to take care of the one shaker. And we’ve got two. AM: Now they have a wraparound... JR: Yeah. AM: ...shaker that shakes the trunk, yeah, a one man... JR: An upside-down umbrella, I call it. [Laughter] AM: Right, yep. Was there any backlash from the migrants when the shaking started because they were kind of losing their part of their season, anyway. JR: There was incidents around but we never had any. AM: Okay, good. JR: They would go out and slit the canvases and there wasn't much of it. AM: More frustration probably than anything, I think. JR: Yeah. AM: Tell me a little bit about the people you did have working for you. I know some people formed relationships with the people and became good friends and is there any memories you have of that? Any specific people or…? 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JR: No, not really, because my uncle, Bill, my dad's brother, had a crew leader and we didn't have a crew because we had enough help that we handled the distribution, throwing the boxes off and picking them up and hauling them to the factory. AM: So, you didn't interface with the people a whole lot then? Not like a crew leader would. WR: Remember Mr. Hilts and Vern, they came every year. JR: Over years, yes, they came. That's when we handpicked. WR: Yes. AM: Did you ever visit any of them… JR: Yes. AM: ...in their homes in the south? JR: Mr. Hilts in Muskegon, we have been there. AM: Oh, he was in Muskegon? WR: Yeah, he’s from Muskegon. AM: Okay, so there were local people, too, that drove up and worked? JR and WR: Oh yeah. JR: And we had a cabin for him. AM: Okay. JR: He was almost part of the family. AM: Sure. It was a different time. JR: Yep, and when he went home, when I was a little boy, I cried. He was a storyteller and I’d go out and he’d sit and puff on his pipe and tell about the woods and he worked for the lumber company, lumber camp. AM: Sure, okay. So, then your kids, Mark and Daniel, the boys, started farming with you then. And when would that have been? WR: When, well, actually we got our first shaker - the Friday - when Mark was still in high school. In fact, he was fourteen years old the first summer that we had the Friday. JR: We had to weigh it down so he could see over it - tilt it - it was, you know, flexibility. But he would walk on his tiptoes all summer peeking over that thing and it had limb shakers at that time. AM: Yes, I remember that; we had one a different style. Do you remember, did the first shakers… I seem to remember seeing one that was on a harness, a guy carried like a chainsaw on an arm - very lightweight. But was there something like that or am I imagining? JR: No, there were those that somebody that had a few acres. 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AM: Okay, and they didn't last long. JR: No, no. WR: They were limb shakers. JR: A lot of work and you had to catch them on something canvas and dump them into a box. AM: And it was an idea in the beginning, wasn't it? It was somebody's idea, other than hand picking. [Laughter] Yeah, there's all the old stories of all the broken ladders and my brother and I were talking the other day about the nine foot. They always wanted a nine-foot ladder. Well, you didn't want to give many of them out because they’d stand on top of that and pretty soon you'd hear “crack” and down they'd go. And I just remember that we’d have to fix the nine footers. JR: We had six and eight, most of them. Two or three tens. But, the top step was quite big, was quite large, and that was quite comfortable to stand on. AM: As long as you could hold a branch. JR: Yeah. AM: Yeah, never let them do it today. WR: Yeah, I can remember in my day picking cherries that I could position that ladder so I could get up there and sit on that top board and pull the cherries to me, you know, to drop into the bucket. AM: How many lugs could you pick in a day? Do you remember? WR: I think my top picking was fourteen lugs in one day. AM: Wow, those were what? Twenty-two, twenty-four-pound lugs, something like that? WR: And I think it was like over four hundred pounds. AM: Okay. WR: I made one time [laughter], but that was because I picked under the authority of an older brother who took no mercy... AM: No. WR: ...on me at all. AM: Get to work, huh! WR: Yeah. AM: Older brothers can do that, I guess. JR: But one of the interesting things when we were kids, we had a five-gallon milk can and we put trays of ice in that and we had to carry that around, people to people… AM: ...to give them drinks. JR: ...down the row to give them a drink. We had a dipper. 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AM: Yep. [Laughter] JR: And we had one guy that he chewed tobacco and a lady who lived in Pentwater, they drove in every day and she got that dipper and she got around and drunk from the handle where nobody else could do it. I said, “that’s funny, you drink just like the guy next door!” She spit it out and carried her water from then on. AM: [Laughter] I remember my dad taking jugs of half frozen… he’d freeze it and then he'd fill the top with water and take it out and they wouldn't drink it. They said, “well, just throw it under the tree over there. It's too cold. It'll make us sick.” They wouldn't drink that ice water. They'd let it warm up. It was just strange to me. JR: I never heard that. AM: What other memories do you have of those days of more hand labor, you know? JR: Well, when we had to pick up the lugs right under the tree, there'd be a stack of six, seven to ten, maybe; if it was a family, twelve, fourteen. And we would pick up three at a time with a handle and we’d put our knee under it and grab it right underneath. And we always paid for the pounds, so we had to weigh each one. AM: Okay. I think that was quite common. I know Munger did that a lot and he had a lot of cherries, I guess. JR: And we had to set the scale back to the weight of the lug. AM: The empty log. JR: And every night my mother would average it out and we would either come up a little high or a little short. We had to set the scale back the next day to compensate. She wanted to pay the right amount. AM: Okay, yeah. JR: You know, you could gain a pound on every lug, you know, but she was very conscious… AM: Very honest about it. JR: ...very conscious. AM: It's kind of like getting wet apple boxes back when you took dry ones in. You lose money every time. So, let me ask you, what asparagus… you said you got into asparagus. What year would you say? JR: Boy, I don't know. WR: The kids were still in high school. AM: Late, late ‘60s or early ‘70s? Okay. WR: It was just a small field that was next to where Mark lives now. AM: And where did you plant... what fields did you plant? And how did you decide where to plant your asparagus? 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department JR: Well, you decide... we wanted to plant cherries. That was our number one goal. We’re cherry farmers and then apples where it was suitable. And that was our main [crop]. We never was into peaches much, a little bit, but not much. AM: I seem to remember a story about... was it Amber Gems that everybody wanted and then they didn't want them all of a sudden? Was that the one? JR: That was the first [?] that came out. But they had a red pit cavity and then when they processed it, it turned brown. AM: Okay, that was the demise of them then. I know a lot of guys planted them and then turned right around pretty much and took them out. But I guess that's one of the risks of… JR: Well, you never know. Almost every fruit variety has a bad point, yeah. AM: Nowadays, with all these new apple varieties that are so expensive that you have to buy - I don't know how it works - shares in a... [End of Audio Recording] 10 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/94e6fad574a994073ed8552568469adf.mp3 30ca668f513b5a041e805c61b5f2618a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Riley_John_and_Wilma Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Riley, John Riley, Wilma Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Riley, John and Wilma (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with John and Wilma Riley. Interviewed by Alan Moul on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. John Riley was born in Hart, Michigan in 1928, as the grandson of two Canadian immigrants. He grew up on their family farm and was a lifetime fruit grower in Oceana County. He graduated from Hart High School in 1946 and went straight into the U.S. Army Service after school, before marrying his wife of 67 years, Wilma Riley. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Moul, Alan (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Fruit growers Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/920bb8cbede8bc3a9b09c0199d25c8f4.pdf d9dffa756dc753846e7763b83aab870b PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Esther Moul Interview Interviewed by Alan Moul May 26, 2016 and May 29, 2016 Transcript AM: This is Alan Moul, I'm here with Esther Gilliland Moul, who happens to be my mother. The date is May twenty-sixth, two thousand sixteen, which happens to be my anniversary. This oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project for Oceana County. And I'm going to have my mom talk about her earliest memories and the first Gilliland's in Oceana County. Mom? EM: Thank you! My plan is to tell the early and the transitional history of our Gilliland family farm, which ended by being a centennial farm in Hart, Michigan. Since history is my hobby and because I have inherited and gathered far more information than can be told on tape, I want everyone listening to this to know that they can certainly find much more detail, both genealogy and history, because I am currently writing our family history with a lot of detail. And that will be at the Chadwick-Munger House, headquarters of the Oceana County Historical Society. AM: Could you spell your name for us so we make sure we get it right? EM: Esther, E-s-t-h-e-r. A lot of people leave out that “h.” May, M-a-y. Gilliland is G-i-l-l-i-l-a-n-d. And then my married name is Moul, M-o-u-l. AM: Okay, thank you. Alright. AM: Okay. EM: Harvey (H-a-r-v-e-y) Hunter (H-u-n-t-e-r) Gilliland, my great-grandfather - great-great-grandfather was the first Gilliland in Oceana County. He moved here from western Pennsylvania in 1873 with his wife, Martha, two daughters, Clara and Elizabeth, and a son, my grandfather, Clayton, who was six years old at that time. He also brought with him his mother, Mary. He had formerly been working on the Erie Canal as a driver on the towpath. But the Erie Canal was going out of favor because the railroads were coming in and I assume that that could be what prompted him to leave that occupation. I also think that he probably had a connection to the Garwoods [?] who were already here in Oceana County, that may be who prompted him to move here. There was a Mr. Garwood, who was a blacksmith, and the Gillilands and the Garwoods [?] were closely related in western Pennsylvania where he came from. My great-great-grandfather rented farm property out south of Hart, near what we call now Star Hill. And my grandfather, Clayton, and his sister started attending the little rural Van Wickle School. They moved into town after the kids graduated from the eighth grade. And great-great-grandpa Harvey was a wheelwright and he also did building moving. He was also involved in community affairs. He was an avid hunter. Everybody talked about how he had to go hunting and fishing every year. He lived on two lots in Hart. And it is amusing to me that now I'm living in an apartment overlooking Hart Lake and he's buried right at the top of the hill overlooking Hart Lake, overlooking his... what he called his fishing hole. And that was at his request; he wanted to be buried over his fishing hole. AL: Alright. 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EM: Harvey's daughters eventually married local men, but they moved out of Michigan, but my grandpa, Clayton, stayed and decided to be a farmer. He bought the first twenty acres of our farm in 1889 and built a small house and then married a lovely girl, Mary Trommater, from Elbridge in 1891. Sadly, Mary died in pregnancy. I'm sure he was grief stricken and there are several silent years that we know nothing about. I have many of Mary’s keepsakes that were in an old trunk in our attic. But eventually he got a new lease on life and in 1894 he married Rose Moore, a local girl who was a housekeeper for a local businessman. And she was the daughter of John Moore, who was in the sawmill business out east of Hart. Then in 1909, both of Clayton's parents died, and so he inherited his father's building tools, moving tools, and for a while he would move buildings or rent out the tools. He also began to plant fruit trees on his twenty acres. And it's interesting, instead of planting a whole orchard like we do now of one variety, he would plant one or two trees of many varieties, trying out to see what they liked, I guess. And one of those trees is still standing in the front yard, the old russet tree. He also planted several sweet cherry trees and some pear trees. EM: I was born in 1931 in a snowstorm. They tell me that the doctor had a hard time getting there; he had to wallow through the drifts, but my dad held the lantern. They didn't have electricity and he was quite at ease because he'd held the lantern for delivering calves in the barn many times, so it didn't seem to faze him. Our house was a wood frame house. We call it - for places of reference - we call it the North House, which is gone now. There was no indoor bathroom. There was a water tank upstairs. The pump at the well outside, there was a gasoline engine that pumped and it would pump the water up to that water tank upstairs and then it would go by gravity drainage down to the kitchen sink. So, there was very little water pressure. I remember we had kerosene lamps and I can remember when the phone came; we finally got our first telephone and I remember when electricity - the REA [Rural Electrification Act] - finally came. And I was expected as a good farm girl to pick fruit in the summertime, which I did not like. I ran barefoot through the orchards and I loved to collect rocks and play with pretty flowers and things. I wasn't much interested in working, but if I wanted to earn a bike, I had to. I got very tan. I enjoyed the outdoors a great deal. I loved to climb trees. My mother always had a big garden and did lots of canning. The folks went to market in Muskegon, usually three times a week during the productive summer months, and that was a lot of work, getting things packed up one day and then spending the next day on the market and hoping to sell everything, so you didn't have to come home wondering what to do with the leftovers. AM: Did you go down and come back the same day? EM: Oh yeah, we went early in the morning while it was still dark and usually could leave by 2:00 or 3:00 in the afternoon. We sold not only to the local people in Muskegon, but to the stores. The stores would come and they'd look over all the farmer's wares and see which farmer they could get the best price and the best product. And I still remember some of the names of the stores in Muskegon. Balkan's [?] was one that regularly bought from us and we actually became good friends. AM: Now, at this point, you had a vehicle, right? You had a car? EM: Yes. They moved up first to a model A and then a little pickup truck. AM: Okay. 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EM: Yeah. Like I say, a lot more detail in what I'm actually writing that will be available for people to read at the Historical Society because there's so much detail. When we lived in the North House, as I've mentioned, my mother’s sister, Alice, who was a polio victim and had to walk with crutches and braces, came to board with us part-time because she was a bookkeeper at Hawley’s Nursery just down the hill on the corner where the... AM: The King funeral home. EM: ...the funeral home is now, yeah. But Hawley’s Nursery was a big nursery in the area; supplied the farmers with most of the fruit trees and ours. And they had a daughter, Ruthie, and Ruthie and I played together a lot. EM: I'm thinking more about the basement of the north house, how my folks, probably great grandpa, helped them, insulated the north end of it in the basement, and that became a storage room, it was well-insulated, and they would store apples in there. And then that was used for a packing shed. Back then, fruit was shipped out of the depot in Hart to heaven knows where, I don't remember. Also, it went by boat from the early days from Pentwater and later days from Ludington, but there was a lot of shipping of fruit for quite some time. Another thing that I just thought about was the indoor market in Muskegon. Most of my memories are of the outdoor market in the summertime, but there was a winter indoor market. So, I think we probably took some of our apples there in the winter and that was not at the same location, and I just can't remember where it was. But I know there was an indoor market and I remember vividly that I didn't like to go because we had to get up early in the morning and stay most of the day to sell the fruit. And so, my mother taught me all kinds of little games and poems and read books to me and anything she could do to entertain me. So, some of those things I used on my grandkids and later life because my mother taught me so many of those little things that stayed with me. AM: So, you would sit there with your produce and sell it and then pack up what was left and come back home? EM: Yep. AM: Okay. EM: I'm guessing that on the way back we probably stopped at my dad's sister's places; they lived in Whitehall and Rothbury and probably gave some leftover fruit. That would be like my parents and my grandpa to want to do that, and I know that periodically we did give them fruit. So, I would guess that the leftovers probably went in that direction. AM: I remember Grandpa, I always couldn't figure out why Grandpa had the worst stuff in the house to eat. And I would ask him, “Grandpa, why do we have all these bruised and wormholes [apples]? And he said, “Well, the good stuff, I sell at market.” So, we ate the bad stuff. EM: That's right. Okay, my grandma, Rose Gilliland, died in nineteen thirty-nine. So, I'd like to say some of my memories about her because sometimes when my folks went to market, they'd let me go and stay with grandma. And grandma had a Victrola and that was a real new thing. There were no record players back then; it was a Victrola where you had to wind it up and play these old records. And so, she would 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department play her records for me and they were mostly really just records. Her favorite one? I'll think of it in a minute. She also... I have vivid memories of her sitting on the basement steps, washing and polishing eggs and putting them in the carton to sell. And like I said, she didn't go to sell her eggs. She went to trade and she'd come home with something in exchange for the eggs. “I Need Thee Every Hour” - that was Grandma's favorite Victrola song. She played that over and over again for me. AM: I've got a question: being that they bartered, was there ever any... do you ever remember any discussion or disagreement over what they were going to barter and bring home? Or did Grandpa always have the final say? EM: I don't remember anything like that. The one vivid memory I do have is of Grandpa starting out of the yard with a model egg to go to town and grandma discovering that he'd forgotten something. And she screamed and screeched and tried to get him to stop and she could not make him hear her. She did not have a delicate voice. [Laughter] I loved my grandma very much, but it was hard for me to see her suffer with cancer. And oftentimes, then at that time, they would send me over to the other grandma's house in Mears - Grandma Auger’s house in Mears - to stay because it would be too hard for me to watch my grandma in bed going downhill until she died. On the day she died, I got sent across the road to the Walkers, our neighbors, the Walkers, to have supper with them and they were good friends. They had five kids and they were my playmates. And Ethel Walker had made scalloped potatoes and I loved scallop potatoes, but I got one bite in my mouth and she had used pepper and my mother never used black pepper. And I choked and coughed and I remember how I wondered what in the world was wrong with those potatoes. But those are my memories of my Grandma Gilliland for her short life. AM: And what was her first name again? EM: Rose. AM: Rose, okay. EM: Rose, yeah. AM: One more thing about the Garver School. For a more comprehensive story of the school, I've written a little booklet, “Once Upon a School.” So, it’s at the Munger House headquarters; it can be read there. Now about our neighbors across the road, the Walkers across the road from my grandparents. Mrs. Walker was a Hasty and Sherman Hasty was her father. And he's the one that built our fruit picking ladders. We want to be sure and mention his name here. He was well-known. He moved into town in later life. But I wouldn't be surprised that he had something to do with the building of my grandfather's house because he was a builder. Also, Vern Walker, who lived in the house next[door] with his wife, Ethel Hasty Walker; Vern Walker was a farmer, too, there at the place. And he and my dad, one year at least, rented a good-sized truck and 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department packed up fruit and went to the Benton Harbor market. Benton Harbor was a big fruit market, and together they went to the Benton Harbor market. I don't remember that they did it more than one year, but they might have. But the Walkers were our good friends. I do remember an incident while we were still living over at the north house when we had a terrific thunderstorm. And my parents were very worried and we had big beech trees in the front yard. And I remember lightning struck a beech tree that night and you could smell - I called it sulfur - I don't know what it was, but I remember the awful smell and how worried that my parents were. Well, when children know that their parents are worried, they are doubly worried. And I remember I was afraid of lightning for years and years afterwards. And I think I was married before I finally could enjoy a good thunderstorm. EM: I may have already said, I don't know, in nineteen thirty-nine, my grandma died and it was a logical thing for us to move around the corner to live with Grandpa, to take care of the farm with him. My dad had already been spending all his days over there anyway working and so it was just logical. So, funny thing is I have no memory of us packing up and moving because I had been spending so much time there with my mother who was taking care of Grandma, that it just seemed logical for us to just be moving right on in. I remember the time of her funeral, how we went down the hill on 72nd Avenue to the cemetery, and how there was an odor of chicken feathers - burnt chicken feathers - in the air because there was Archer's Hatchery on that road and it had burned and oh, what a horrible smell - burnt chicken feathers. And I identify that time of her funeral with that fire. I said we moved around the corner to the house; I need to say that the house was double in size from when Grandpa had first built it because about nineteen twelve or so, as the kids were leaving home, as is often the case, he added onto the house and made it what it is still standing today. A much larger house. In nineteen eleven, the barn was built and my mother, who was living in the neighborhood just at that year, said she remembered coming over to play with Dorothy Gilliland and there was a pile of lumber waiting for the barn to be built. And here again, I never thought to ask who built that barn? I have no idea. It could have been a barn raising. I just don't know. Be sure to ask the questions that you can get answers to while your family is still living because you’ll have many regrets about the things that you don't know and wish you'd asked! AM: Now, did you mention anything about the kids were all leaving after getting out of school and now you had no one to pick the small fruits that they were growing? EM: Right, up until that time they had picked their own fruit, done their own harvesting along with relatives, the girls, my grandpa Clayton's sisters, Dorothy and LaVange [?] and Phyllis would come maybe for a day and pick. And maybe they had friends that would want to pick and so you could get local help. But as they increased the size of the farm and by the time my dad and mother and I moved around the corner to live with grandpa, they were starting to look at more acreage and eventually did add quite a bit to the farm. And so, labor became an interesting problem. AM: Now, we looked at the farm drawings and saw that they had strawberries, raspberries...currants... 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EM: You can bet those came out when the kids left home. [Laughter] They didn't have their help anymore, so nobody wanted to do that kind of labor. And so, then he started planning fruit trees in earnest. There's a story I think my grandpa told me himself that Dr. Munger, who is known in Hart, used to be known as the Cherry King. He had more acreage than anybody at one time of tart cherries. That he and my grandpa, who were friends and I imagine my grandpa went to him for doctoring, as they would call it. He said, “how are your cherries doing, Clayton?” And my grandpa said, “doing pretty well, doing alright.” And Dr. Munger says, “I think I'll plant some cherries.” [Laughter] Makes a good story. Well anyway, he ended up being the primary cherry grower in Oceana County at one time. EM: I'm coming up to when I was about nine years old, and so these memories are going to be from that vantage point, nine, ten, eleven years old. So, I remember how, of course, as we… AM: ...it would’ve been around 1940. Yeah, as we got more acreage, more fruit coming into bearing, we had to have more labor. And so, like I said, we took cousins, neighbors and anybody that wanted to help. And one cousin, Doris in particular, loved to pick fruit. She was tall and I can still see her standing on top of a nine-foot ladder with only the tree branches for support, picking away, singing away. She loved it and she boarded with us in the summer to do that. And she was quite artistic and she loved to draw pictures of what she was doing. She came several years, as I remember, earned her school money that way, clothing and books and so forth. So right about that time, we were getting rid of our horses and cows. We had one team left, Dick and Nell, and out of deference to Grandpa Clayton, they still kept them and he'd do a little bit of cultivating with the two horses. And when it came haying time, because we still had several cows, and the horses needed hay. And when it came haying time, we had rented pastureland down the hill. That would be where my son Cal lives now in that field to the south. We would go in and get that hay, cut that hay, and I can remember the horses bringing in the hay up the hill. One of my favorite pictures of myself is standing on top of that load of hay. I used to love to just sit and watch the process of unloading the hay, how the horses would pull the ropes to raise the hay fork full of hay and swing it over into the hay mound and let it drop. And it took quite a while to unload the load of hay and then go back and get another load. AM: How they could back that wagon up, the horses would back it up. EM: Yeah, I loved to watch my grandpa hitch up the horses, too. I'm so glad that I have those memories because they're gone now. Kids don't see those kinds of things on farms unless they go to a museum farm. So, I'm glad I have those memories of haying time on the farm. I had older cousins who would come and stay summers with my parents, but they were soon drafted into the army. So there went some of our good help. There were local people, as I’ve mentioned, that would come and work. Teachers often liked to work on the farm in the summer because it gave them summer employment. Ivan Robinson was our old standby. He painted our house one summer and did other odd jobs around the farm. 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AM: Didn't he end up being the principal of a school or something? EM: I think he might have; he was a teacher, yep. There were people we called drifters and I suppose maybe they were alcoholics. They just had that kind of temperament where they were just passing through and just wanted to earn a little bit of money and they would work and we hired some of them. We didn't have to house them at all. And by the way, back then there were no housing laws, no restrictions. If somebody wanted to come and pitch a tent in your yard and pick fruit, that was all right. We had young girls just with new driver's licenses that drove across the state to camp under our walnut trees in tents, and they became lifetime friends. They’d have parties in the barn at night and we just became really good friends. One man in particular, I think he just stopped in to see if we needed help and he became a family friend for many years. His name was Harlan, H-a-r-l-a-n, Parrish. He and his wife Mae came and we called him “Shorty.” He was a short man and he was the best hired man my dad ever had. He would do anything. He dragged the tractor. Oh, yes, we'll have to talk about the new tractor. He would, you know, whatever the day called for, he was up for it. And we housed “Shorty” in the barn and they didn't mind. They curtained off an area and we had an old bed with a mattress and a place to wash up. And of course, all the accommodations, bathroom accommodations were just outdoor privies at that point. And so nobody minded. It wasn't until the government agencies got involved and put restrictions on the farmers that things had to change. But people would start to come up from the south and people would come from Oklahoma and Arkansas. And you never knew where your help was going to come from. That was risky business to hope that there would be enough help to get your crop off. But it always worked out and there were good years and bad years. Some years there would be a heavy frost and you'd say, well, maybe next year will be a good year. So, talk about being in the gambling business. It sure felt like it, but things seemed to always work out. EM: I don't remember the year - but it's written down, so you can find it if you want to know - that we got our first tractor. It was a Caywood and that's an unfamiliar name now, but we were so proud of that tractor. And I remember how my dad practiced with that tractor and how he had to use it to pull a loaded truck up the hill and he was so proud that he was able to do that. Also, the name Eva Doedy [?] comes to mind, Eva Doedy [?] was a nurse at the Hart hospital and she was a corker, she loved to work and she loved the outdoors and she took her vacation and came and picked cherries every year. She’d take a bucket of water and put it at the bottom of her cherry tree and she'd wash her hands after she got through with every tree and she just treated it like a true vacation. And then I was reminded that in later years, she came back and helped my mother and me can cherries in the summertime. She truly loved farm life, and she was willing to spend her vacation time outdoors. AM: It sounds like in those years there was a lot more community involvement in the farms that just kind of was natural, which we are losing now, that doesn’t happen. EM: There was a saying by the businessmen in town, “if the farmer has a bad year, so do we.” The farmer couldn't buy the new couch or his wife couldn't get her new coat or whatever. Or the farmer couldn't buy a new truck or whatever. The economy was… everyone affected… everyone's success affected somebody in the community. 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AM: What are your memories of tourism, as far as it related to the farming community in the [nineteen] forties? EM: People came through to the sand dunes, I remember the sand dunes, that was a big drawing card. People came just to see them and to climb on them. And there were little cabins. And now that people all had cars and were traveling, resorting was a big thing. I think that's some of what got my Grandpa and Grandma Auger to start their canning business, was for the resorters that came and just, oh, they just “oohed and aahed” for all the fruit over here and wanted to take some back with them. I'm moving into my teenage years now, and I'm remembering that the government was making jeeps, used army jeeps available to farmers to use in place of tractors if they needed a good utility vehicle, they could do some light farming with Jeeps. AM: This was before World War Two? Must have been World War One surplus? EM: No, this was World War Two… in the middle of the... or at the end of the war, I’m not sure. But I remember writing to school with the Walker kids across the road because they had bought one of the Army surplus jeeps and we could go through the snow in the wintertime when other kids couldn't get there. I remember the Normandy invasion talking about World War Two now, we were very deeply involved in listening to the radio, which we had a radio now and that was a big deal because we had cousins Harold and Norman Hoxton in the war and we kept track of the movement of the troops. And I remember sitting on my dad's lap with the map out in front of us watching, listening to the H.V. Kaltenborn [?] and other announcers talking about the Normandy invasion and were just really caught up in what was going on. At the school, the men were, of course, all going into the service and our high school principal was a woman that was quite new. Mrs. Frost was our high school principal, and one day she got up to the study hall and announced that we would all be collecting milkweed pods for the Kapok preservers for the army. And she brought the house down when she said, “the bags are in the office.” Well, back in those days us kids would call anybody in authority that we didn't care too much for an “old bag.” You know, so she said, “the bags are in the office,” but we yeah, we went out and harvested milkweed pods. We also went out… they would let school out for kids to go out and help with emergency crop harvest. I remember how I got my Social Security number and my dad and mother got theirs at the same time. The cherry harvest was on and the canning factories were getting plugged up with product and they couldn't handle it fast enough. So, they would tell the farmers, “don't bring us anymore for a while, come in and help us.” So, the farmers and their families would have to go in and help. But I remember I was on the sorting belt. My dad was emptying lugs into the water and I don't remember what my mother was doing, probably sorting. And that's how we all at the same time, my mother and dad and I got our Social Security numbers to help out. But the biggest excitement at that time, nineteen forty-four and five, were the German prisoners of war that were made available. They had captured them and brought them over here. And rather than just warehousing them, they put them to work. And according to the Geneva Convention, they were to be treated humanely. And we wanted to show that in America, we treat our war prisoners humanely. And so, we gave them work to do and whereas our troops were not always being treated humanely. Anyway, 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department we could sign up, a farmer could sign up for needing so many prisoners and my dad would take the pickup truck and go to the fairgrounds where they were housed in tents and pick up his quota for the day and a guard with a gun would come along and he was supposed to stand watching the prisoners at all times, but he would get very bored. And so, he would put his… lean his gun up against the tree and go to work, too. But it was interesting, as a teenager looking out at those men, I didn't feel like they were the enemy. They were there to help us. They were friendly, it was just different. They would kind of wave at me and smile. But we weren't supposed to communicate back and forth. And I couldn't talk German anyway. AM: Now, were there any Japanese prisoner of wars or do they stay on the West Coast? EM: No. AM: I'm not aware whether they helped or not. I think they were pretty much warehoused, it was a different situation. EM: No, I think so. They were in the internment camps. Yeah, no these were just... now there were at the same time some Jamaicans and some other people who came through that we'd never had before. It was kind of a trial period, they just took anybody they could get because the good men were gone. AM: And did they ever do any scrap metal drives just to scrap metal, scrap rubber, scrap paper. Everything went to the war effort. Even now, when I go down the expressway and I see where somebody's tire has blown apart and lying alongside the road, I have this urge to get out and pick it up because that's what we did. You just saved everything. Everything was rationed: sugar was rationed, tires were rationed, gasoline was rationed. But the farmer didn't have it so bad because the whole world, the soldiers, the troops depended on what the farmer could raise. And so, the farmer had to have what he needed to produce. So, we had what we needed. Interview Day Two – May Twenty-Ninth AM: This is Alan Moul, and I'm here with Esther Gilliland Moul. And this is a continuation of our tape from May twenty-sixth and today's May twenty-ninth. So, we're going to continue where we left off. EM: Well, I think we left off about when I was graduating from high school in nineteen forty-eight, I was a country girl headed for the big city. I wanted to be a nurse and my dad had said, “well, why don't you just go down to Muskegon, to Hackley Hospital?” And my mother wisely said, “she needs to get away.” And I've always been grateful that she had the foresight to send me to the big city. I left with several local girls for Oak Park, Illinois, West Suburban Hospital School of Nursing affiliated with Wheaton College, and was there for the next three and a half years. EM: I really, really loved Chicago. I loved to get on the elevator and go down and explore. Looking around the architecture, the buildings, the opportunities, things I'd never seen before. I really enjoyed it and I enjoyed the nursing experience, too. My boyfriend back home, Leonard Moul, M-o-u-l, had another year of high school to finish. And we kept in touch some, but gradually through the years when I was there, we kind of lost touch until the end of my training. 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department My parents were doing quite well on the farm and they started going to Florida in the winters and taking my grandparents, my grandpa Gilliland and my mother's parents with them. And that was nice, they had some freedom to travel. And with the new gales [?] in Hart, they took some pretty extensive trips to California and Texas and quite a bit in the southwest. And in nineteen forty-nine, I came home on vacation and found that my father had bought his first new car, brand new car, a forty-nine Kaiser. He was so proud of that - it was the first totally new car he'd ever had. So, I guess they were doing quite well with their farming, over the years they were gradually adding more acreage. Leonard would come up from Comstock Park and visit his sister in Shelby, Dr. Hasty's wife Beverly, and do yard work for her, and then he also did some carpentry work. That's where he learned to do carpentry work, was with Burmeister Builders out of Shelby. He graduated in nineteen forty-nine. In nineteen fifty-one, I graduated from nurses training and my folks gave me a bus trip to Florida and then I rode home with them. I went back to Oak Park and worked for a few months just to say that I had worked as a graduate nurse in my home hospital for a little while. But by then I was engaged to Leonard and we were beginning to plan a wedding. We were married in September nineteen fifty-two. Started out with a little house trailer in the driveway of my new sister and brother in law, Mark and June Dorn. Leonard was working at Sackner Products in Grand Rapids and I started working at Butterworth Hospital. Times were good. AM: Now, he was a machinist, is that correct? EM: He became a machinist. When he first started there, he drove a Hi-Lo and loaded trucks and they loved him because they said he could load a truck semi faster and better than anybody. But then he gradually moved up and became a machinist. He's also in the Michigan National Guard's. Deer hunting was big, big… hunting of all kinds was big with him. And he and his brother in laws had tented in the Upper Peninsula, and were making plans to buy some property up there and build a cabin. So, one of the first things I got to do was camp out and go deer hunting. I did it to please him, not because I had any desire to kill any animals. I took my gun with me. I learned how to shoot it, but I never killed a deer. But it was a nice vacation experience. This was before the Mackinac Bridge was built. So, we sat in long, long lines and my sister in laws would pack wonderful sandwiches and pies and things. And so, we ate while we sat and waited to go across the bridge. As I said, we were living in a little house trailer, but we wanted to get some land and Len, with his carpenter skills, wanted to build a house. And his boss at Sackner Products very conveniently gave him his house plans and so we used his house plans to build our first house. We bought two acres on Division Avenue just about a couple of miles from Walton and Donna Moul’s place; they lived on Six Mile Road on Division Avenue. Leonard started right away; as soon as we bought the property, we moved the trailer up there and started right in with the plans to build our house. And I was still working, so we were doing alright. I think we were each making about four thousand something a year. We still took our vacations to deer hunt. Grandpa and Grandma Moul were still living. They came over and watched the progress of the house. And I have a picture of Grandpa Moul driving a nail in the siding on the house. And he was so proud to be able to do some little thing that showed he was interested. But 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department sadly, he died in nineteen fifty-five and Leonard had to teach Grandma Moul how to drive. She had never driven a car, so he did - he taught her how to drive. EM: Back in Hart on the farm, my dad and mother seemed to be doing well, enjoying their winters and traveling and we were so involved in building our house, we weren't paying much attention to what was going on, on the farm back in Hart. So, we weren't thinking about their future very much. But, they certainly every year were getting one year older and wondering who is going to take over. I think my dad had always wished for a son, but that never happened. So, I remember at one time he mentioned that the house and farm across the road was for sale. Well, we sure weren't interested because we didn't want to live that close proximity to my parents. Didn't think that would be a good idea and we weren’t thinking about moving anyway. But we got our house built on Division Avenue and discovered in the process, we had to put down a very, very deep well. And we didn't like the water at all because we had... it was so hard that we had to buy a commercial water softener and that water tasted terrible coming out of that commercial water. We just didn't like it at all. Then some other houses started going up around us and that troubled us a little bit because we had envisioned living out in the country without too many neighbors. And so, we started looking around a little bit. And I'm getting ahead of myself because in nineteen fifty-six, I discovered I was pregnant, and so I thought, well, I should be getting more domesticated and I needed to make some curtains for the baby's bedroom. And so, we were looking at a sewing machine in Grand Rapids and when we got home, the sky began to get really dark and strange and I had never seen that kind of weather. And the upshot was we saw our first tornado and Leonard had to go out with the National Guards and help with that. My neighbor down the hill and I got to stand in our living room window and watch the tornado go through, and that was pretty exciting. AM: When would that have been, like, May of nineteen fifty-six? EM: Yeah, yeah. AM: Around Easter you said, wasn't it? EM: I think so. AM: So earlier. EM: Yeah, the sky turned all yellow, just like a dandelion, it was just yellow. You never saw anything like it. Our friends, Ruth and Ron Bullis [?] lost their trailer in the storm and ended up building a house, becoming our neighbors. Anyway, in October, Alan Lee was born and I stopped working at the hospital. Soon after, I found out I was pregnant again and Bradley Ray joined our crowd. By then, we were really disenchanted with where we were living and started looking around a little bit at property. And we still took our vacations up north, went fishing up... by then, the guys had built a cabin on some property in the Upper Peninsula outside of Munising and we took vacations up there. And Leonard still went deer hunting, and I did too, because Grandpa and Grandma Gilliland were only too happy to have a couple of boys come and stay with them. And that was nice that they were accommodating. 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Then in nineteen sixty-one, February, Calvin John was born and, in the meantime, Leonard was helping Marv [?] down the road build a house, so he was getting plenty of carpenter experience. We did some looking around and found some property on Rogue River and bought a couple acres there and decided that we would move. But we had to sell our house and we didn't have too much trouble. Some people in Grand Rapids wanted our house and we just traded houses. They bought our house, so we bought theirs, and ours was much more expensive than theirs, so we did alright. Moved into Grand Rapids just in time for Al to start kindergarten. Do you remember that? AM: Not really. EM: No, you don’t remember Riverside Elementary School? AM: I remember James Street... EM: Yeah, that's where we lived on James. AM: ...walking home. EM: Past a dog, remember you had to walk past that scary dog? AM: An old dog in the yard. EM: Then, to complicate things, my dad called again and said, there's another farm for sale down the hill and a nice big house and property, fruit trees and you've got some boys coming along. You might be interested now. And we decided maybe we were, if we're going to have boys to raise. Why not on the farm? So, we had already committed to building a house on the river, which we did. We lived in Grand Rapids in town for a year and then moved out to our house on the river and lived there just a short time. Joel came along in the fall of... no, he was born in June. AM: June, [nineteen] sixty-three, EM: Sixty-three and then the fall of [nineteen] sixty-three, I got a phone call from my mother-in-law that President Kennedy had been shot. And Al remembers that quite well because he was in school. AM: Yep, one of the few things I remember about down there. EM: It was pretty traumatic. Brad started kindergarten there and Al was in first grade. Dr. Hasty and his wife, Beverly, in Shelby bought our James Street house when we needed to sell it and rented it and that helped us out considerably. So that got us out of downtown and out on the river. The kids did enjoy living on the river. We could swim in the river and Leonard could play baseball in Rockford and that was fun. It was between Rockford and Sparta; the kids were in the Sparta school system. So, in June, nineteen sixty-three, Leonard started coming up to the farm and working on weekends with my dad to see what there was that he needed to learn and help him out. In Easter time of nineteen sixty-four, we made another move up to the farm and thankfully another person came along that wanted to buy our house on the river. Leonard's boss bought our house down there. So, we... except for I guess we kept one acre which we later sold to him, and the boys started at Garver School here in Hart. AM: It must have been kind of a big switch because I know the house on the river was a lot nicer and brand new compared to the house you moved in on the farm. It was an old farmhouse with plaster falling off. 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EM: It was very old, very old. But we had no qualms about it because by then we understood what a builder Leonard was and so we had plans right away. We drew our own plans to build a house and live in the old house and build a house in front of it and move the old house out to use for farm labor. AM: You actually built your house behind the one that was there. EM: I said in front, didn’t I? AM: Yeah, behind. EM: We built it behind. AM: And when you built it, you could walk from one to the other with a plank... EM: Out the back door of the old house and the front of the new house. And Uncle Norman Johansen, my uncle, came to visit one time, looked out our picture window and the old house hadn’t been moved yet. He was a dry comedian. He looked out and he said, “it ain’t got much of a view.” We always had a laugh about that. Now we need to talk about farm labor. My dad had been buying small pieces of property and so there were up to over one hundred acres, I'm sure, by then. And so, he needed more help and he would pick up local help, but that wasn't going to be good enough. And people were coming from the South, but that wasn't enough. And there was a new system of help called the “crew leader system,” where a leader would gather a group of people from Texas or wherever they came from, and he would be responsible to oversee them, and they were usually young single men. And so, we got started… my dad got started using that system of labor for the harvest time. AM: There weren't many rules back then as to what he could or couldn't do, so there was a lot of... EM: No, there weren’t housing restrictions. People could sleep in the barn, which they did in chicken coops, in… AM: Tents. EM: ...tents, old houses. Yeah, there were virtually no rules. AM: And the crew leader, some of them anyway, charged their workers for taking them to town, for buying food, things of that nature. So, it was pretty loose. EM: When we remember one name in particular, Eliseo Salazar. Good man, I think he treated his people fairly. I don't know if it was the same ones that came back year after year or not, but he was a very nice man. AM: Now, he was from the valley, right? In Texas? EM: I don't remember AM: Alice, I believe they were from Alice, Texas. And then Donna and Far and those were some of the names that people were coming from down there. EM: Leonard right away got connected with the Michigan State Extension office in Hart and started taking classes, short course classes in agriculture because a lot of things he needed to learn. He could 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department learn from my dad first hand, but this brought him up to speed on the latest farming practices and put him in touch with the county agricultural agents that could help him decide what to plant and… AM: Spray. EM: And spray and things. It was really good for him. And he in school, he never had been a good student and didn't particularly care about learning. And so, this was something new for him. And he applied himself very well and did real well. EM: So, I guess in summary, I'll just say that it looked like we were here to stay and the boys were acclimating into school and farm and we were even looking at more property and life was looking pretty good. And I think, Al and Brad, our memories intersect here, and I think they can take it on from their vantage point of what it was like for them as they were young growing up on the farm. 14 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f6c491f5a798b275d0fa2468ba173f87.mp3 28d0d6efee3317b277a4a7526ec6f596 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Moul_Esther Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Moul, Esther Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-05-27/2016-05-29 Title A name given to the resource Moul, Esther (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Esther M. Moul. Interviewed by her son, Alan Moul, on May 27 and 29, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Esther May Gilliland Moul was born in 1931 into a farming family located in Hart, Michigan. Her great-great-grandfather was the first Gilliland in Oceana County dating back to 1873 and the Gilliland family farm became a centennial farm in Hart, Michigan. She holds many memories of her life growing up on the farm: how they received their fruit trees from Hawley Nursery, stories of Dr. Munger who was known as the “Cherry King,” and life during World War Two. Esther graduated from high school in 1948 and went on to pursue nursing in Oak Park, Illinois at the West Suburban Hospital School of Nursing which was affiliated with Wheaton College. She married Leonard Moul in 1952 and worked at Butterworth Hospital in Grand Rapids while starting a family there. They later relocated their family to the fruit farm across the street from her parents in Hart, Michigan and were able to raise their sons with the same agricultural traditions that were a part of their family’s heritage. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Moul, Alan (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Fruit growers Nursing Oak Park (Ill.) Wheaton College (Ill.) Butterworth Hospital (Grand Rapids, Mich.) Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f41b739477588872d2d0e1f05288c9f1.pdf 56a086a73e81d0288bc1628322cae080 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Estevan Luevano Interview Interviewed by Andrew Schlewitz June 18, 2016 Transcript AS: Alright, this is Andrew Schlewitz, and I'm here today with Estevan Luevano in the Hart Public Library in Hart, Michigan, on the eighteenth of June 2016. This oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. So, thanks, Estevan, for taking the time to be interviewed. EL: No problem. AS: So, can you, for the record, say your full name and then spell it? EL: Okay, my name is Estevan Luevano. It is spelled E-s-t-e-v-a-n, Luevano L-u-e-v-a-n-o. AS: Okay, do any of those letters have accents? EL: No. AS: No, you don't use it. So where were you born? 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EL: I was born in San Juan, Texas. AS: San Juan, Texas. Okay and what county is that in Texas? EL: That's Hidalgo County. AS: Hidalgo, okay. Is that where you grew up as well? EL: Yeah, part of my life, yes. AS: Okay, so where did you go from there then? You said part of my life. EL: Yep, we're migrants. We traveled ever since I remember. We used to travel from Texas to Michigan and back to Texas. Then one year we traveled from Texas to Michigan to Iowa, Iowa to Texas. AS: Wow. Can you remember that year? EL: Uh, no, I was like maybe ten, eleven years old. AS: When were you born? EL: I was born in nineteen sixty-seven. AS: Okay, how many people are in your family? EL: It’s my dad, my mom, three brothers, and two sisters and me. Eight of us. AS: Were you in the middle there? EL: I'm the oldest of the boys… AS: The oldest of the boys. And your two sisters then? EL: My sisters… one of my sisters is the oldest, then me, then my brothers, then my little sister. AS: Okay. Did you have other family around you? EL: Yes. We came up from Texas with my grandpa and my uncles and one of my uncles came from Florida down here. They went to Florida instead of Texas. AS: Okay, where are your parents from? EL: My parents are from Texas as well. AS: Okay, so would you say you're like third or fourth generation Chicano? EL: I don't know because my grandpa and grandma were from Texas, too. AS: Okay, so you've been there a long time? EL: Yes. AS: Many generations. EL: Yes. 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AS: What are your family members' names, like your father and mother? Siblings? EL: My father is Hilario “G” Guadalupe Luevano. And my mother is [?] Luevano. AS: Okay and then your siblings? EL: My older sister is... her real name right now is Irman Holsa [?]. AS: Okay. EL: And then my brother, Hilario Guadalupe Luevano Junior, and then my other brothers, Sylvester Luevano and then Hector Luevano, and then my little sister, Elise [?] Luevano. AS: Okay. What was your grandpa's name? EL: My grandpa's name was Tereso [?]. AS: Tereso [?]. And what are your most vivid or starkest, clearest memories of childhood? EL: Well, my grandfather used to have a business, semi business. AS: Oh. EL: A truck driving company. It was Luevano and Sons. And that's the reason he decided to migrate this way, because he used to do all of the oranges and fruits in Texas. Well, somebody told him that over here they had pickles and cherries and, you know, all that kind of stuff, too. So, he decided to come over here to try it out and he brought two semis and one two-ton truck with them. And then they liked it, so they started coming up here. AS: Okay. EL: And then they worked for Chase Farms and Miles Chase asked him if they knew any more people they can work with, you know, work in the fields for them. So, he started asking people around over there and started bringing people in and people started coming with my grandpa because there were people they would charge people to bring him over here. My grandpa never charged nobody. He said, do you want to come in here? Well, I don't think my truck and my car make it here so we don't make it. We stop and fix it because my uncles were mechanics, my dad, my uncle Greg, everybody's a mechanic. So, he said, “if you break down the road, we stop and fix it or we put it on top of the semi. AS: Did that ever happen? EL: Oh yeah, sometimes we stopped and fixed the car and, you know, at the rest area. We used to come from Texas… this over here. It's kind of funny because I go to Texas and I can make it in thirty-six hours with, you know, with sleep and stuff. Or if I don't want to sleep, you know, straight at twenty-four hours or whatever, but we used to last four days to get here because that's how many people were in the back, the two semis were in front and then the two-ton truck, then all the cars behind it. AS: So, how many people would go? I imagine it started out with a few. And then by the end…? EL: By the end, there was like fifteen cars behind the trucks. AS: Wow. 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EL: That's how many people would come with my grandpa. And the reason why, because, you know, other people would charge people to bring them over here. And my grandpa said, as long as, you know, you can make it over, just come behind me… AS: Follow me. EL: ...follow me. And my grandfather stayed in the back and then somebody broke down and he, you know, passed all the semis and go off the road and the semi driver, you know, my uncle knew when my grandfather passed him, that something happened. So, they’d all stop and see what happened. And then the semis would go to a truck stop and the rest of them are going to the rest area and the trucks will get fuel and stuff and wait for the people, you know, for all the other people to get there. AS: So, you always stuck together. EL: Oh yeah. Whenever my grandfather led and he let nobody, you know, break down; my dad and my uncles would fix it. You know, if they couldn’t fix it, they’d find somewhere to put it on top of one of those semis. And then they would bring it to Michigan and then drop it and then they'd fix it here, you know. But if they could fix it on the road, they would fix it on the road. AS: What time of year did you leave for Michigan? EL: We were here just for… we’d get here and we never picked asparagus. We always picked just strawberries, cherries and pickles, and we never picked apples. And then we would take off because the trucks had to be there for the orange season and all that stuff for down in Texas. And one year, after the pickle season, we went to Iowa. AS: What did you do in Iowa? EL: Well, you know, we didn’t take the semis out there, you know; we didn’t take the trucks. The trucks decided to stay that year. All the trucks stayed here and my uncle ran them here. You know, Chase [?] had a lot of, you know, he said, “you buy a freezer, you know, refrigerator trailer. You’ve got work all year round.” So that's when my uncle, Denny [?], and my uncle, Greg [?], decided to stay here and run the trucks and bought a refrigerator trailer for the truck for one of them. He started driving for a trade farm, and then my dad would come over here and drive a truck and we would go out in the fields. My dad would go drive the truck for my uncle or for my grandfather. AS: So, your uncle settled here? EL: My uncle settled here. AS: Okay. Have you settled here? EL: We settled here in nineteen eighty-one. My dad decided, you know, at first, we stayed two years in Texas because of school. He knew we weren’t getting a real good, you know, education because we're going back and forth with him. Matter of fact, well I’m going to say it anyways. I don't know how to read real good or spell real because of that. Because back then, like, the teacher didn't care, you know, they just passed you. AS: Oh, really? EL: Yep. 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AS: What's that called? Social promotion or something like that. EL: They just wanted… because you're a migrant and they just want you to be at the school at that day for the count. AS: For the county, yeah. EL: And, you know, when I grew up, I grew up after I got out of school, I worked, you know, and I did my homework when I got home, but, you know, didn't study very much. AS: Yeah, plus your year was chopped up. EL: Yeah, and then we stayed there two years and then my dad was in Texas and then come over here and then my dad had a good job, but then he started having problems with their… because he was a good truck driver. So, the company he was driving for bought a brand-new truck and trailer and gave it to him and the people that were there, they had more years there, kind of got mad because he got the brand-new semi. So, they started doing stuff to the truck. Then my dad had a nervous breakdown. And then my Uncle Phil said, “I don't know what you're doing over here. There's trucks over here you can drive.” So, my dad decided, “well, I'm going to go over there for vacation” for a couple of, you know, the doctor told him to take a couple months of vacation. So, he took three months of vacation. We came up here and we worked in the fields and he drove a truck for my uncle. And then that was in 1981 when he decided to stay here. So, I've been here since [nineteen] eighty-one. I graduated in [nineteen] eightysix... AS: Okay, from Hart High School? EL: Nope. From Walkerville High School. AS: Walkerville, okay. So, the first time you came up here, what did you think? EL: Well, the first time we came up here, I was too little to remember, but when we were younger, you know, nine, ten years old, we used to go help my mom, you know, in the pickles, you know, to pick pickles and stuff. We were not working. We just out there in the fields, you know, playing around. But at the age of thirteen, that's when we started picking pickles and stuff, you know, in the young age and ever since then, till I graduated. You know, since thirteen until I graduated. And then during the wintertime, we lived so close to the factory at Chase’s that I would get home and Miles would pick me up and say, “hey, do you want to work?” He picked me up and would take me. He’s the one that showed me how to drive a forklift. I never knew how to. You know, I was fourteen years old and he showed me how to drive a forklift. And then he would pick me up every time and I would drive a forklift. Okay, so I'd be unloading trucks out in the skill building and stuff. AS: So, like taking out the pallets and stuff? EL: Yep. AS: So, you picked and you drove a forklift. Did you have any other jobs? EL: Yes, well, I took the vocational center. I went to the vocational center and graduated high school. And I took diesel there because my uncle had trucks and my dad. And then from there, you know, Miles wanted me to drive trucks, you know. So, then my uncle said my dad decided to sell everything and I said, “why are you selling everything? I want to drive the truck.” And my uncle says, “you want to drive 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department the truck for real? I'll set you up with somebody, my brother out of Hesperia and you can drive a truck for me. If you like it, we’ll buy a brand-new truck.” But the reason that my uncle sold everything is because my dad couldn't drive anymore. He had an accident with a semi. He had an accident in a vehicle and he was not the driver. It was my brother driving. And somebody t-boned him and didn't stop at the stop sign and my dad got hurt pretty bad. Matter of fact, he's got some of his nerves are pinched, some of his vertebrae are pinching his nerves in his neck. But they want to do surgery because he's allergic to the anesthetic, he has diabetes, and he's got a heart murmur. AS: Oh, no. EL: So they told him that no, they won’t operate on him. He’s losing feeling on his arm and that's the arm that he's shifted gears and he says, you know, “I don't want to drive like that because I might have an accident and I don't want to kill somebody in an accident.” So, he stopped driving. AS: So, what year then did you start to drive the truck? EL: At an early age because my uncle and my dad showed us how to move the truck where my dad parked it, so we could put fuel in it. So, I was like sixteen, seventeen years old. I can move it, back it up, and that's it, because that's all he let us do. [Laughter] But, you know, and Miles, when I graduated, I was nineteen, he said, “hey, I want you to get in that truck and go to Paul’s” - his son’s place. So I drove it all the way to Paul’s and Paul would be waiting there for me and he said, “okay, now back it up here.” So, I’d back it up and I thought I was going to get something. I would back it up there and he’d say, “you did good. Now go back.” And it was about eight or ten miles away from the plant, you know. AS: So, they are like testing you? EL: Yeah, they were, you know, so I would drive it back. And then a friend of mine, his dad is Jerry Frick, they own Walkerville Well Drilling, and they knew I graduated from the vocational center for a diesel mechanic. And one day they came over there to Chase and Jerry offered me a job working on the trucks. And I couldn’t let that go because at that time, I was only getting like five-fifty an hour at Chase Farms. And when Jerry showed up, he says, “I'll pay you ten dollars an hour at my place.” And I couldn't refuse from five-fifty to ten dollars an hour. AS: Sure. EL: So, I said, “well, let me give Michael two weeks’ notice before I move over there.” He said, “I'll let you do that.” When I went and talked to Miles, Miles wasn’t here. He was in Belize because they were trying to buy land over there, too, for producing over there... I don't know what. And I told Michael, “Miles isn’t here, but I'm talking to you. I would like a raise because all the forklift drivers - I've been here more than the forklift drivers - and I'm working at the Brown garage, working on trucks, working on this mechanical work on the forklift and stuff like that. And I'm only getting five-fifty [dollars an hour]. I know they're getting eight, eight-fifty an hour. I would like to go up to eight ninety-five an hour.” And he said, “well, I just gave you a raise. Yeah, a twenty-five-cent raise.” But them guys had been here less than I'd been here and they’re getting paid more money. And he said, “well, I already give you a raise.” I said, “well, I'm going to give you a two-week’s notice.” He said, “well, you don't have to. You can leave right now if you want to. AS: Wow. 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EL: I think he thought that I was kidding. I wasn't. And I said, “okay, Friday will be my last day.” And Friday was the next day; that happened on a Thursday. So, I loaded up my toolbox and my tools on my truck. And that Friday he said, “are you leaving?” And I said, “you told me I could go. I’ll see you later.” And then I started working for Walkerville Well Drilling on that Monday, I started on Monday. And then when Miles came back from Belize, he went and ordered a pipe cutter and I'm the only one in the shop that he asked me, you know, how to use the pipe cutter and stuff. And I said, “yeah, I used it over there at Chase, you know, I know how to use it.” Okay, come here, link this link and Miles was coming to pick it up. So, when he came and picked it up, they called me in the shop, “hey, I put it in his trunk.” So, I went and put it in his trunk. He was waiting for me outside and said, “how come you couldn’t wait for me to get back?” I said, “because I talked to Michael and Michael said he would not give me a raise.” He said, “well, if I was here, I would give you a raise. I would give you what you wanted, but come back and I'll give you what you wanted.” I said, “well, they’re paying me more money here than what I wanted over there. They’re paying me ten dollars an hour here.” And he said, “well, I can't pay you that much, but I would like you to come back.” And I said, “well, I can’t. I already got obligated to work here.” So, I stayed there for five years with Walkerville Well Drilling, and then my friend, you know, he knew I was a mechanic and stuff, he said, “hey, they’re hiring mechanics over here.” I said, “where?” He says, “North American Factories in Whitehall [?].” I said, “I got a good job getting paid ten dollars an hour.” He said they paid fifteen over here. So, the only way I could make an application there is to go to Michigan Works and they had a test for me to do and stuff. And I did that and I didn't think they were going to call me because I didn't. I didn't think I did good on the test. I must have done good on the test because they called me for a job interview. I went over there for the job interview and he asked me why I wanted to quit Walkerville Well Drilling. And I said, “well, it’s more money. I've been there five years and I never got a raise, you know?” And he says, “well, if you get hired in here, it'll be twelve ninety-five. And then I have two years or less than that and if they think that you learn everything and you can get top raises. Fifteen ninety-five.” And I said okay. “We’ve got to start you from the very beginning, we just can't throw you in as a mechanic.” I said, “okay, and how much does that pay?” Fifteen ninety-five, mechanics get paid more than that.” So, I said, “well, if mechanics get paid more than that, I should start working here and maybe I can make it into a mechanic.” So, I did the interview, I didn't think they were going to hire me and they called me. They said, “I want you to come to work Monday.” And that was on Wednesday. So, on Wednesday morning, they called me Wednesday morning before I went to the other job and I told Jerry, you know, “I got a job offer at this other place.” And he said, “well, I don't want you to leave, so we can talk about what they're going to pay me.” And he said, “I can't do that.” And I said, “well, Friday will be my last day.” So, Friday was my last day. And I wanted to give him a two-week notice, but the other job wanted me on Monday and I couldn't lose that opportunity and I'm glad I didn’t. I've been in my job for twenty-one years and I'm getting paid twenty-four sixty an hour as a mechanic. AS: As a mechanic. How long did it take you to become a mechanic there? EL: It took me five years to become a mechanic, but I'm glad I did it, because after I became a mechanic, I became a Journeyman and they sent me to school for welding, for everything they wanted me to go to school for. You know, I struggled at school because, you know, my spelling wasn't very good and my reading wasn't very good. But I still passed the classes and I got my certificate for the Labor Board, and 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department I'm a Journeyman and I can work on equipment - heavy, heavy machinery. And it took me a while to come to days, but I'm on the day shift. I'm third in seniority in maintenance. And when my group leader ain’t there, I’m the group leader. AS: So, it was a good move? EL: It was a good move, yes. AS: Where do you live now? EL: I live in Hesperia. AS: In Hesperia, okay. EL: I moved from Walkerville to Hesperia in [nineteen] ninety-two when I bought my first place. And I wasn't married, so, you know, a single white trailer house with a garage was okay. And then later on, you know, I got married. AS: When did you get married? EL: I got married twice. AS: Okay. EL: First I got married and it didn't work out. It lasted not even a year. We got a divorce. And then a couple of months later, I met my wife and we starting going out. She's from Mexico. She's from… where do you call it? She's from Mexico and she's from Oaxaca, Mexico. AS: Oaxaca? EL: Yeah, and we started going out. And at first, she came over here with her sister from Houston and her sisters came over here with her boyfriend and they came from Houston, but he had brothers in Washington. His family was in Washington. They stayed here for two years. I went out with my wife, went out with her for a year and his brothers told them to move to Washington and they were going to move to Washington. And I didn't know what to do because she was going to leave. So, at that time, I didn't know if I should propose to her because I had just gone through a divorce a year ago, you know, and stuff like that. I didn't want to go through it again. But I'm glad I told her not to leave [laughter] because we've been married ten years. AS: Do you have children? EL: Yes, well, first my little daughter was born and then we lost one. She had a miscarriage and she called me in the bathroom; I went over there and I'm like, wow, I never seen anything like it. It came out like a little egg, like it was still in the pouch, it came out. And he was about an inch and a half long, the baby. And you can see his little feet, little arms like, you know, in the fetal position. But he didn't have his face. No eyes, no nothing like, you know, like it was just starting to develop. [?]: Sorry to interrupt, guys, but I just got a phone call. Make sure you get your picture taken across at the community center before you leave. I didn’t want anyone to forget. AS: Alright, thank you. 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EL: And seeing that, you know, upset me a little bit. AS: Sure. EL: And upset my wife a little bit, but, you know. They told us he was going to live because two days before that, she started bleeding and we went to the hospital. And they told us that the baby was not in the... where it’s supposed to be. It was in the tube. It was growing in the tube. And that's how come it only grew that much because, you know, that's how far it could grow in the tube and then it decided to... she started to have labor pains that day and she didn't know why. But that's why, because the baby was coming out. But, you know, we tried again and we're blessed with Stellan [?] Jr. and he's five now. AS: Okay, and what's the first child's name? EL: My first child is Yasmine [?] Marie Luevano. AS: It's my granddaughter's name, too. EL: And my son is Estevan Luevano, Jr. And then my wife wanted another one, so we tried and she couldn’t. We didn’t know why she couldn’t get pregnant. So, we went to the doctor and the doctor told her the monthly cycles are lasting too long. That's how come you can't get pregnant. They should last only five days. And my wife was, well, they were lasting like fifteen, twenty days. So, they told her that the best thing they can do, you know, for her for that. And then they found out that her gallbladder was bad, too. So, they said, “well, we can go in there and take your gallbladder out and then go in there and burn the blood cells that make you, you know, go to her monthly cycle.” And my wife said, “well, we wanted to have another baby, but we couldn’t have one.” And they said, “I don't think you can have another baby.” Okay, so we made the appointment in two months to go do surgery because they told us she couldn’t get pregnant. The day of the surgery, we walked in the hospital and [?] stayed with the kids, and they put everything… they started everything, put in her I.V. on and they didn't start, you know, putting her to sleep because the doctor was still in surgery for another patient. So, you know, they just prepped her up to get her ready. She was already hooked up to everything. But they had to check her blood and check her hearing before the surgery. Then the lady that put her to sleep came in there and said, “hey, I need to talk to one of you guys outside.” So, the head nurse went outside and talked to her and she came back in there and started unhooking everything. I'm like, “What? What are you doing?” “Well, the surgery isn’t going to happen today.” I said, “why?” He said, “your doctor is going to be here to tell you why.” Then she went outside and they told her, yeah, you can tell them why. So, she came in and said, “well, they told us that we can tell you why - she's pregnant.” What do you mean she’s pregnant? The Doctor told her she couldn’t get pregnant. “Well, she's pregnant. We don't know how long, but she's pregnant.” AS: Wow. EL: And then that's when my son was born - the other one. And so, you know, it was a blessing of God, so I name him Isaiah Christian Luevano. So, he's one and a half right now. AS: He's one and a half. So, you have Yasmine, who's how old now? EL: Yasmine is nine. 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AS: Nine. And Estevan Junior is five. EL: Five. AS: And then Isaiah is one and a half. EL: One and a half. And we would have had another one between Junior and, you know, only two years apart, not even, you know, but, you know, at that time it didn't happen. But we’re glad with the other two. My son was a miracle. That's what the doctor said, when the doctor showed up, actually told me she couldn't get pregnant. He said, “it must be that God wanted you to have another one.” So, he says surgery is not going to happen today until the baby's born and then you've got to wait three months before we can do surgery. So that's what happened. The baby was born and after three months my wife had surgery. AS: What's your wife's name? EL: Marguerita [?]. AS: Marguerita [?]... EL: Her real name or her? AS: Yeah, her real name or prior to getting married to you. EL: Her name is Marguerita [?] Contaros [?]. AS: So, she's from Oaxaca, but she's not from an indigenous group. EL: What’s that? AS: She's not from [spanish language]? EL: What do you mean? AS: So, in Oaxaca, there are a lot of [American] Indians. I don't know if she was… EL: I don't know if she is. She looks and, you know, my friends told me that because he went to the ruins up in Oaxaca, one of my friends at work. And when she met my wife, she said, “she looks like the Indians from over there. Is she Indian?” I said, “I don't know - we don't talk about that.” I know she lived in a small town, you know, and you can see mountains and hills there. But I don't know if she’s Indian or not. I haven’t even asked her that question. But, you know, and she said... one time I did ask her...yeah, I remember that because my friend told me and I asked her and she said no, but she don't know if her grandfather or her relatives are or not. But she said no. But to me, she said, “I don't know.” [Laughter] AS: Okay. Other people that you've said you ran into from Oaxaca, have you… are the other Latinos or Latinas, are they mostly from Mexico or have you run into Guatemalans or other Tejanos up here? EL: Well, when I used to come, you know, I don't know where they're from. I used to go to the dances, they had Spanish dances here a lot. I’d just go to dance and I never asked girls where they're from and stuff. I just knew that were you know, they talk Spanish and some of them talk English. I never asked them. AS: Okay. 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EL: All the people that I meet now, because I'm married to my wife, they're all from Oaxaca and they're all from her town and that's where we go visit, you know, some other times. Because they're the people that are still in Michigan that know her because, you know, they migrate in the state here and they’re from Oaxaca. They live in Shelby, some live in Hart, some live in Ferry and stuff. And they know my wife because they know my mother-in-law and stuff. And they all know each other because they’re from the same town. AS: Interesting. EL: You guys can take… I’ll show you some pictures of my father-in-law and mother-in-law from Mexico in their hometown. AS: So, they still live in Oaxaca? EL: Yes, my father-in-law and mother-in-law still live in Oaxaca. And her sisters, all her sisters and her brothers - they’re from Oaxaca. But we go visit them, not every year, but every other year, you know. Like one year, two years ago, my sister-in-law called her and said, “I'm getting married.” From Washington, the one that was living here with her, that she lived with her for two years here and “I'm getting married, I want to be here to be my maid of honor. And I want my other sister to be here for, you know, further, you know, to stand up in the wedding. And I want you guys' husbands to be the groomsmen.” And I'm like, “we should go.” We start planning, you know, because she told us there was like three years before she was going to get married. So, I was saving money and stuff. And then that year, my wife was pregnant. She goes, “we need a bigger house.” So, we started looking for a bigger house and we found that the same year we went to Washington. Well, she says, “we can’t buy the house and go to Washington.” And I said, “don't worry about it.” I had money saved up just to go to Washington, but we also had money saved up to buy a house. And the good thing about it is that because I had a single-wide and there was a lot of foreclosures out there, the government had a thing that you can buy a house with no money down. And I didn't think I was going to fall into that because we had the house. But the lender says, “you fall into that because that ain’t a house. You got a title with that trailer house, right?” And I said, “yeah, I’ve got a title.” It ain’t a house; you need a deed to have a house, not a title. So, he told me, “take pictures of the house, take pictures of the rooms, and write me a letter why you need a bigger house.” Because there's only two bedrooms and we had two kids already and one on the way. So, I told my sister that she can do that for me. So, she wrote me a letter why and everything, and I took the letter to him and signed it. And then, I took the title of the trailer house - what year it was and stuff - and I passed the application. He says, “you can get any house. No matter what, no money down.” You know, no money down, no closing cost, nothing. And that’s how come we got the house. And then we said, “well, we can’t go to Washington.” And I reserved plane tickets because we were going to fly and then she canceled them. You know, she [?] and I said, “yeah, we do. We’ve got this money. I'm going to resort [?], you know, resort it with a credit card and we pay it, you know, when we get our income taxes. “No, no, no, no.” So, I went to work and she called the company and canceled the flight. When I got home, she goes, “I canceled the flight.” Why you do that? “Because it's too much money, we're not going. I called my sister and we're not going.” So, I called her sister and said we're going. So, she said, “I'm going to expect you here.” And I said, “yep, we’ll be there. She canceled the tickets, but I'm going to drive.” It’d be cheaper for me to drive. So, I didn't have them, I had two more days left for vacation, so I took them two. We already had the vacation to go to Washington, but if I was going to fly, not drive. 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AS: Right. EL: So, I had two more days of vacation left that I could schedule. And I took them and I left and I took them two days and they gave them to me. And there was two more days so we had to leave. I told the wife, “you better pack.” She goes, “why?” I said, “we're going.” She said, “no, we’re not!” We’re going. I said that “your sister wants you over there and all your family, all your sisters from Houston are going to be there, your brother from Houston, their brothers from Houston. It's like a family get-together. I guess your family from Oaxaca can’t be there. You can't see your family over there because you can't go to Mexico, but you can see your family that live here.” And how long has it been that we haven't gone to Texas? I said, “for three years. I haven’t seen my brother and sister for three years. How long have you not seen your sisters in Washington?” “For five, seven years,” she said. We're going! And she said, “no, we’re not.” Yes, we are - you better pack. I already took the two days that it's going to take to get there on the road off. And I says, “we’re leaving, my day starts this day, we’re leaving… after I get out of work, we leave on that day. I get home at four o'clock, we're leaving at four o'clock.” AS: So, the whole family went? EL: She didn't believe me, she packed and everything. And we got there and she said, “where are we going to leave the dogs?” I said, “don't worry, I got all my sisters and my little niece is going to take care of them. I already talked to her.” “No, we’re not going.” So, we started putting everything in the truck, we took the dogs over there to my sister's and we left and when we were there, she was so happy to be there and she said, “well, I told my sister not to buy the dress.” And I said, “well, we can buy one on the way over there. Just tell her to send you what color.” And she didn't find the same color that, you know, almost, but she stood up in the wedding. And I think she had a good time with her because then she hadn’t seen her aunt for fifteen years. She saw her aunt because her aunt is over there in Portland, Oregon and it's only two hours from Irvington. AS: I was going to ask, yeah, where in Washington? I grew up in Oregon, spent a lot of time in Washington state. EL: You know where Portland, Oregon... you know, Arlington. Arlington is on Highway-Five. AS: Just up north then of…? EL: Yeah, it’s over there by Port Washington [?]. AS: So, below Tacoma? EL: It’s called Arlington. It's got like a port, like the ships come in there and it's like, I don't know, like a port for ships and stuff because the companies are over there, they definitely like fish. So, they're fishing like a fishing factory. They’ve got fish factories, they got single factories. And that's the only thing they’ve got there: saw mills and stuff at that place. But we went over there and we had a lot of fun and all of them took days off from work. And we all, for two days, we went to Portland, Oregon, to her aunt's house. And then from there we went... man, that's beautiful. Portland, Oregon is beautiful. She took us to… her cousin took us to a rose garden over there. AS: Oh, the rose gardens, yeah. EL: The rose garden is beautiful. It's just beautiful. 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AS: What time of year? I'm sorry. EL: This time right here. Right now. AS: In June? EL: We left in June and we had to be over there by June the eighth. And we left here on June the fourth after work or June the fifth after work because my wife didn't think we were going to make it. We got there on June the eighth, so it was a Saturday, I think it was. Yeah, June the eighth, I think it was. And we got there at three o'clock in the morning in Washington that day that my sister was getting married. And she said, [?], so we slept. And then I couldn't sleep because there was a whole bunch of racket upstairs, you know, they had… we stayed at my sister-in-law’s, but, my sister-in-law's husband, her future husband, brought Mariachis upstairs when they were singing and they were, you know, and I told my wife, “what is going on upstairs?” Because we were in the basement, sleeping in the basement. Well, my future brother-in-law brought Mariachis because that's what they do in Mexico. When somebody gets married, the groom brings chocolate and donuts to the wife's parents house. But my parents are not here, so they brought it here to my sisters. I went upstairs. They had homemade chocolate, you know, chocolate for drinking - hot chocolate - homemade hot chocolate. And then they had buns from Mexico, donuts and then they had [?] they had for breakfast and stuff. And I couldn't sleep. So, I went upstairs and they were singing, Mariachis were singing and stuff. And I'm like, wow, you know, I never been to a… over here, you just get married, you know, a celebration. Then they all left and my wife started getting dressed. And my wife said, “we haven't slept hardly, it's too much excitement. I can't sleep.” So, we went to the wedding, to the reception at nine o'clock at night. And I can't keep my eyes open. I fell asleep in the chair for two hours, then I woke up. She was like, “do you want to go back?” I said, no, “we're good. I slept for two hours. We're good.” So, we stayed there till almost one o’clock in the morning. And then went, “I know we can go. We should go there. We can go now.” But then I said I didn't want to go. She goes, well, “thank you for bringing me now,” because she didn't want to go. And I think we're going to have the money to do it, but we had the money to do it because of my loan, I didn't have to have the closing costs or not because we passed that government loan, they call it, like I said, I don't know what it was. AS: What are some of your best memories and some of your worst memories about living here? EL: Like a good one was the trip to Washington. Well, being here, the best memory is when I met my wife. I mean. Sheila, I never, you know, I was married to a Takana [?]and they're a lot different, they're more… the culture's way different, you know, so it's an example of a difference, the way we talk. When I was talking to my wife, my wife would look at me and start laughing as I don't know, what are you talking about? I don't have the slightest idea what you're saying. So, what do you mean because you're Spanish and you're talking differently, and I talk and we talk like a sliding Spanish and they talk to write Spanish, and you don't say this, you say like this. All my life, I've been saying things, but now I talk with her in my life, I talk the correct way now and when I’m with my brother-in-law and my sister in law, I don't laugh at me anymore when I talk to him, because I first when they started talking, when they looked at me and started laughing and looked at what it's trying to say and my wife would tell him what I was saying, you know, and they don't do that anymore. But, you know, that's the best time. I met her and we had kids, and at first, you know, I was like...I never grew up. I would party, go to Spanish dances, you know. All my money was gold, like to drink and I'm going to spend it and going to Toledo, Ohio, to see the theaters and all that and stuff like that going, you know, spending money doing that. And I never 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department had nothing. You know, I was just the house and the car. I always had a brand-new vehicle all the time because I was single, but never, you know, I always party. Then my first wife was the same way. So, you know. And we didn't get along because she would take off and then come back, you know. And I thought we were married. I said, you know, “you should tell me where you're going and stuff” and she’d get mad. And you know, that time she got mad and took off. Then I didn't see her for a month. Because she was mad at me. And when she came back, I said, “well, this ain't going to work, you can just leave for a month. Don't know where you are and you know well you don't like it while living [?] all over again.” That's when I filed for divorce. Because marriage is a lifetime, it's a commitment, not the way you're doing it. I don't want that. You know, if you want to do, you know, party and do whatever you want, you can do it without me. Because part of the time, I don't know where you are at? You know, and I don't need that. And then, when we were divorced, and then when I met my wife, it was, you know, the culture's way different. Like I say, their culture is way, you know, she doesn't bring…. It's way different, I mean, this culture, you know, our culture here and being our people and our culture in Mexico is different. And that's come to me as my life goes along because, you know, I was at that time, you know, I was thirtysomething years old. I'm forty-nine years old. And I got that one and happy, I'll tell you something. But, you know, I mean. And at that time, I was thinking about settling down; I didn't want to party anymore. I didn't want to go to dances. I just, you know, I would see my brothers, my sisters, especially my brothers. You know, they got married young and their kids were growing big. My brother, you know, I went visiting my brother, but he's got a house here and his daughter staying there and he goes all over working in construction and working hard. He works for a company out of Holland. They work in hospitals and stuff, and they go all over the United States working in a hospital. And I’ve got nieces that, you know, my brother younger than me and I got nieces, they're twenty-one, twenty-two years old and already grown up. And there’s one, you know, one Christmas. I went to Christmas and, you know, I started realizing, I need to settle down. My nephews and my nieces are fifteen, sixteen, and I need to get settled down, and that's when I decided, you know, when I got married with my first wife, I thought I was going to be settled down. That was what she wanted to continue her life the way it was. And I was I was not going to do that, you know, anymore. I had quit drinking and stuff she did. And she wanted to, you know, be liberal or what you want to call it. I couldn't handle that. So, I told her, you know. This only lasted, you know, we were together for a year and marriage, you know, I thought marriages are going to change it, but it didn't. It made it worse. So, we were only married three months and I decided, you know, this is, I can't have you going like that. I'm going to work and then come back, you know, the next day on a Friday because you had Saturday and Sunday off. You know, she didn't come back until Friday and wouldn’t come back till five, six o'clock in the morning. When I was with friends from work party, you know, there's a phone call. I can't handle it. I married my wife. That's one of the cultural differences; we got along great and I was ready to settle down and we’ve got to trust each other, no matter what I think, we have that. We mean I've been here waiting for you with me, where I you and this one, you know, I can go to my work, come back. And I love to work, we talk about work, we talk about, you know, the kids are you know, where we differ. Yeah. AS: Does your wife work? EL: No. 14 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department AS: Okay. EL: She does. She wants to work, but we're trying to get her papers and it's been difficult. She's not documented and it's been difficult for us because they denied our part because my job, you know, for me to have what I got and for us to have the help we got, I’ve got to work overtime. And they know me there at work. They don't ask nobody because they really know what they're going to say. They come to me and say, “You want to stay here, you want to come in early tomorrow?” And I go in early and they deny my pardon, they call it, because they told me I make too much money and I can afford for her to be over there. But they don't understand how much over time I've been working. Because of her, she wants to work. I would want her to work too, you know, to help us out, you know, but the lawyer said she couldn't work. She couldn't drive. You know, we don't get caught working. Don't get caught driving because there's a penalty on your account because of paperwork, because of what's going on. So, she thinks that I don't want her to work. But it ain't that I don't want her to leave. You know what I mean? Because she... they also told her that if she gets caught, they can send her back to Mexico or whatever. And I don't want her to, you know, I don't want the kids to go to that, you know? AS: Sure. EL: And she doesn’t understand that. But, you know, right now she's understanding why but at first, it was kind of hard for me and her because she thought I don't want her to work. She said, “no, you don't want me being, you know, get my own money.” It ain't that, this is what the lawyer said, it isn’t that I didn't want you to work or do that, but. And for us to have the house we got and the kids and stuff, I got to work that overtime and I work a lot overtime. You know, last week I worked fourteen hours overtime. This week, guys, I work for hours of overtime, and so the government is saying you make too much money. For now, I make too much, I make too much money that I can afford for her to live in Mexico and have my household here and still send her money to live off of. Because I worked a lot over time, they think that they think that the money I make throughout the year, that's the money I make all year, every year, and that ain't the case. And this year I'm going to prove it, because this year we got bought out from another company. We got bought out from Harverson [?] one. The company that bottomed out is Harbourfront Walker International. Now, the company is not North American Factories anymore. This year changed name to Harverson Walker International and they don't want to. Over time, they took away the overtime, not necessarily overtime, but there's still overtime. Sometimes because of the vacation, people got to vacation and stuff to get done. So, during the summertime, that's when I get the overtime. During the wintertime, I don't get overtime. And they're going to see that this year because that's when they bought us last year at the end of the year and at the beginning of the winter. And we didn't work no overtime when their time started and worked overtime right now. So, then we had a bonus every month and the whole year bonus. Don't give us a bonus anymore. So that's what they were looking at, too. You know, I get they didn't know, how do I get paid? They were just saying, you know why he's making sixtyseven thousand, eight, you know, a year. But they don't know that. I was working a lot of overtime, you know, six, seven days a week sometimes. You know, yeah, and the lawyer once said it's going to be a new law coming out and then he wants me to say, you're not making any money. I said, I'm not making overtime and I’ll say I'll be probably in the forties, forty-five or something, not in the sixties anymore, not sixty-nine. Seventy thousand, I'm not going to be making that anymore. And you told me why...I said, well, honest and then necessary overtime, they took our bonus away. So, you're not going to see that I would get a thousand dollar bonus a month, just like another paycheck, you know, it's like another 15 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department paycheck because the government takes forty percent off that. Yeah, because it's another tax bracket. Because of brackets, because it's a sentence, not a word. You know, it's like a center for you. The government don't look at that, they don't look at your... you know, over there and see how much you work, and they just see that he makes as much money in a year. You don't know why you're making that much money in a year. You don't want me to. And that's what they should look at, the people there and, you know, the judges and stuff. You know, how can we make so much money over time? But I just hope they change and we can find the paperwork and because I got to redo everything again, I started from scratch because I denied everything. And now we have to start like the lawyers and we have to start from the beginning and see if you could. So, they're talking about the money. I don't make the money anymore. I mean, you know, I'll be in the forty-five this year. Yeah, you know, not seventy, over seventy down. AS: Does your wife speak any English? EL: No, she don't. AS: What about your kids? Are they growing up speaking English? Spanish? EL: Both my kids are bilingual. AS: So, your oldest daughter is already in grade school and she's in third grade. EL: Third grade. AS: And then your middle son is in kindergarten. EL: Kindergarten because my daughter was born in February and September is the deadline. So, I can't put her in school until, you know, she has to be five years of September, the deadline. So, she was going to be five that year. But I couldn't put her in school because the time was like she had to wait another year to go to kindergarten or to preschool. And so, did my son. He just turned five in October, and he's going to kindergarten and then he's going to be the same way because he was born in September 2001 and September 12th, that's the deadline. He was born September 21st. And then he’ll have to wait to turn five years old to go to preschool right, then in kindergarten he is going to turn six years old. But it's okay. And then all three of them are bilingual and they’re barely talking. But he speaks Spanish directly. You know, my son talks a lot of English to me, but with my wife, he talks Spanish. And when we had a teacher’s conference and the teacher asked me and my wife said, “do you know how to talk in Spanish? “And so, she tells me, you know, it's interesting. Why do you think, I told her, you talk to your mom in Spanish, oh, that's what that is, Spanish. So, it's just so natural to me. Yeah, I say you talk Spanish to your mom. So, it is teaching, I know what to expect. But yeah, he taught Spanish to me by the time he talks English to mom, his mom, but she is learning English by my kids, so she understands it, she can read it, she don't know what she's reading, but she you know, that's the good thing about it. They are not a very good reader. And she can read it to me how she can pronounce the words very good. But I understand what she's saying and I can, you know, you know, relate, you know, to stuff. You know, I don't know the words and stuff. And in English, all I'm doing, I'm using the words in Spanish. So, when she tells me that in Spanish, I'm telling you in English, but she tells me that and how are your kids learning to read in Spanish where they just talk and understand English talk and understand. My daughter loves to read. I didn't know one time I went to bed and I'm like, I'm here and stuff like. I was talking why she stopped. You will you will find out for a lot closer to her over get the door open a 16 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department little bit and I see a little light coming from open the door, turn the light on. She's underneath the covers with her flashlight reading a classic. I think a lot of kids have done that and say, what are you doing? She goes reading, I go to bed. I said, no, you can read. She goes like me before I go to bed. That makes me go to sleep. I love it. She does that every night, reads something with the little flashlight. So sometimes I have to tolerate it. If you need better batteries for your flashlight. And I said here, just keep them in your room and then she already knows how to change them and everything. So, then I got her little lights that’s got that clip. No, no, it's a light that it's instead of twenty-five lumens or whatever you call it, it's like sixty, so it's a little brighter. I got one of them and she loves it. Thank you for the light. I would like, you know, to know what she reads every night, every night. And I could hear you talking at night. I really know that a couple of nights there, I'm like, let's talk. So, Yasmine, I thought maybe she started her sleep or something. One night I said, man, she's talking like she's reading something and you go check and my wife already knew what's going on. I wanted to act and she was reading. So, she likes to read. At school they get a little piece of something. Every month during the winter time, she got one little piece of fruit because she read a whole bunch of books. She likes reading. So, my son is a different story. You know, you don't know how to read in preschool. You don't pick up a book and read or not, I think it's going to be like me. He likes mechanical stuff. I'm working on stuff where I go outside to the garage. He goes outside to the garage with me. And what is that? What is this? What is that for? What is this used for? So, I show, you know how to use it to stuff some. And he said, we got to fix the bike, what to do, and I help him to fix this and that. And he surprised me this year. He says that I need a bigger bike. I said, no, you don't. Yes, I do. You don't. Your bike, it's good. No, I need a bigger bike and I need to take the training wheels off. It had training wheels on, but bigger than the one he had, he can barely put his feet down like he is too tall. You know, I can do it now. That's what happened with the little one. I would get stuck like those that take the training wheels off. I didn't want to, but I took them off. I mean, it surprised me. We took off all around the house and stuff. And I'm like, I can't believe that Yasmine didn't do that. She had the training wheels until she was like six or seven years old. He's only five, we need to take the training wheels and he took off with his bike and he's bigger and he barely can put his feet down as it is. And I got to see it all the way down, you know, all the way it can go down. And he says, you know, one time you fall off the bike, I'm like, so he can yeah. It's because I have been on my tiptoes. I lost the footing. I think I said, well, get the other one and I put the seat on it. No, I want this one. And he rides and he rides that bike every day. Now after he got out of school, and I said, what are you doing out there? And like I said, he's out there on his bike. Yeah, he's out there every day. And he wakes up, he goes out there, gets his bike, riding his bike all day. AS: Apart from family life and your work, are there other kinds of things that you do in town? EL: Yes, I'm a proud member of the Knights of Columbus. I didn't know what it was at first when I was married to my wife, with my wife here. One day a friend of mine said, you know what we're doing tonight? I said, well, what is that? He said, Well, I'll bring Mr. Mason with me and we can talk about it. His name is Jim Mason from Fremont. He came and talked to us at St. Gregory and I said, well, I'll try the way he talked to Mr. Mason. I mean, just look at Greece this year. Yes. Mr. Mason talked about the nights when he talked about the nights. It was like, you know, it was like a great thing to do. The way he talked, you know, when Hector told me about it, I don't want to do it. So, I wouldn't bring Mr. Mason. But when he talked, he was the one that convinced me, you know, OK, I've been in the knights for five years. And I'm a fourth-degree knight. You know, they go by degrees, they go first degree, second degree and third degree in fourth degree and fourth degree night. I do the [?] with the fourth degree. 17 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department And I like it because it gives me something. To do one, you know, sometimes they have, like breakfast and stuff and that's my time for me. I tell the wife, I said, I'm going to help, you know, help out there. And I come and help and I go back home. She told me how much money you guys make and, you know, stuff like that because, you know, we make money, too, for charities. And I tell her stuff that's done all the time alone for me because the rest of the time I spend it with my kids. There was a time that I was spending too much time doing because I was a great knight. I don't know, what a great knight, you know, great knight is your… the council is your council. You're the one that makes the meetings. You're the one to send letters to your council members. You're the one that makes the decisions for them. It's like being like a president. And it's like you got a president and vice president for a company. That's what it is. The grant like, you know, does all that where the money is going to where you know, and you got your assistant knight. You got your treasurer, you got here. So, it's you know, and it was getting to be too much, you know. And then the kids got baseball stuff, you know, practices and Girl Scouts, Boy Scouts. And my son just wants to be a Boy Scout and we're trying to get them in Boy Scouts. And he plays football. You get, you know, stuff like that. My daughter plays it and she's been trying everything. And I think she wants to do baseball, basketball, and volleyball and not football. Yes. You know, she liked football, but, you know, she's a girl. So, football, soccer or no football. Football where they call it Football Americano. AS: Right. EL: But, my son wants to play that. So, I put them in and he sees Yasmine being in Girl Scouts. You've been in Girl Scouts and since she started, if you want. You know, since we went there, we asked her if she wanted to be a Girl Scout in first grade. She was going to first grade and she likes it. And Junior sees her going, like, they go on trips, they go on camping trips and stuff like that. He says, I want to do that. Then I want to be in Girl Scouts. I say, you can’t be a Girl Scout. And they’ve got Boy Scouts. Oh, they do the same thing as Yasmine. Go on trips and go on camping trips and soccer. He likes camping. We go camping sometimes. I went back in the day and my wife doesn't like camping. But, you know, I once had just gone a couple of miles away from home, you know, we can do that at home. And I said, you don't understand this. Can you keep away from home, you know, just for a couple of days? You know, it's like she don't like it, but the only way she's going to go to Europe or something or like Ludington and stuff, you know, they were far away from home, but we try to do it here in the Hart. It's too close to home. I don't understand going camping. But she does understand the kids like it, so they must love camping, fishing, we go fishing, camping together and I take my daughter, she loves fishing. You know, I used to party a lot, and when I decided to settle down, I picked up fishing with my cousin Roy. We used to go fishing in Ludington. And that was, you know, that was my time away from work, to go fishing. I was working third shift, I would get out and he worked at [?]. And he said, I might take a day off Friday. I said, well, Friday is my last day and I get out at seven o’clock in the morning. I said, I'll meet you at your house at eight o’clock. Okay, so I will get out of work, and that was my last day of work, you know, and before I used to go party, and I’d go to the bar and all that stuff. Now it's time for me to settle down. So, I go fishing with my cousin and then, you know, what time you get out of work? And it's about five o’clock and said, well, we got a couple hours to go fishing. I'm going to be at work. And we go to Ludington and I got to drop you off and I got to go to work. So that's what we do. I sleep at home, get up, get all my equipment ready, and wait for him to get out of work. We go fishing up the [?]. I come back and drop him off at work so I can go home. Sometimes they say, well, just meet me at home. So, I'm home. Now, wait a minute. You know, I'll get there before you always get 18 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department there before. One time I got there and I thought you said you were going to [?}, so I left early and then he had an accident and he messed up his back. He doesn't work there anymore. Matter of fact, he can’t be seen very much because his back. I went to my little nieces, his daughter's graduation party and says he's still fishing. I said you should come pick me up one time. I said, well, I thought you didn't want to fish. Come sit down and kind of stand up. Well, he says I can do a little bit more now, but not very much, he said. But we can still go fishing. So, I have to call him up. I didn't know his number. You know he changes it. Yeah, I had his own phone number, but then he got a cell phone and I didn't know his number. A couple couple of days ago, it was last Saturday. Now we've got his number. Give me your phone number on it. Call me when we've got to go fishing. My wife called me to say where I left that because I thought I might be home by one or twelve [o’clock]. AS: I just have a couple more, quick questions and we can wrap it up and we can take you over to get your picture taken. We can give you a copy of this. And if you wanted to give us some pictures or you could send them. AS: So, this interview is going to be archived, it's saved for years and years, and so if you think of somebody fifty years from now listening to this. What's one thing that you would want to say to them? That really matters about your life here? EL: Life in Michigan? AS: Yeah, or maybe your life growing up first as a migrant settling here, something like that. EL: And I don't think I would have this opportunity when I got in Texas, so I talked to my cousins over there in Texas and they earn a lot less than I do, you know, but the cost of living is a lot less over there. But the job I got, I don't think I'll find anywhere else. I mean, in order have a job like that and like it is very slim and I like where I work at because of the people that work there, but the president and the president of the company are nice people, you know, not the people that bought us out because I don't know them. But the people there in the plant itself are like a big family. I mean, if something happens to somebody, like an operation. My friend's wife had cancer and fortunately she died about a couple of weeks ago. But we all had… a hat goes around people for money in there and it all goes to get a car and everybody finds it and it goes to the person because the medical bills are pretty expensive, that stuff. And our insurance company is not a Michigan insurer or insurance. Now, we had good insurance, but they took it away from us and they gave us insurance from Pennsylvania. And I don't know, is it different over there or whatever is here in Michigan? They don't cover hardly anything. But, you know, I like working there, and I don't think I would get an opportunity to go to a place like that and get on with the people, get along with your supervisor, get along with the company manager and, you know, stuff like that. I don't know. And there is a place around like that. I mean, ever since I worked there, I felt at home because the people are just, you know, they reach out to people and. And I like working here. AS: Is there a mix of Anglo and Latino workers there? EL: No, well, at first, there were African-American, Latino and Americans. But throughout the years, I'm the only Hispanic that works there…. African-Americans, their only used to be four of them. The other one, the other two retired, one quit, and there’s only one left and the rest are Americans. So there's only two of us, the one African-American, one Hispanic. Yeah, and there's no racial stuff going on, 19 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department nothing. They're just like, you know, you're the president of the company who walks around and, well, how are you doing? You know, all the kids now, they don't talk about it when they talk to you. You know, when he's walking around first thing or, you know, out of his mouth is, how are you doing? I was a kid, you know, stuff like that. Not that, you know, you don't talk about work or anything, you know, and then you talk to him about the kids and stuff and he and all the kids down there, they're pretty grown already. You know, I've been there twenty-one years. And, you know, people think, how people are going to act or who, you know, who's nice, who's not. But mostly everybody is, you know, a good person. They're working. AS: Well, to finish up anything else that you'd like to share that I haven't asked you about? I don't know whether you want me to talk about it, maybe? AS: How do you feel like you've gotten your story out, you feel like if somebody else listens to the story, they’d have a pretty good idea of this guy's life? EL: Well, I don't know, I just know that, when we were younger, it's kind of hard because going from Texas to Michigan, it's kind of hard because, you know, you don't… you only knew a couple of people at school, and there's always problems in school because, you know, you're new here and people didn't like you here. Then when you go to Texas while you were a part of the problem, the school first started for you or it’s not your problem there to me. So, it worked both ways. You know, it doesn’t matter, you know, people say there's racial stuff. It don't matter where you go, you know, it's got to be, like I said here, because I was the only Spanish guy here at school in the high school in Walkerville, you know, and then over there is because you didn't start the school year when they started, you know, and they're your own race, you know, you want me to be like, hey, you know, and then over here the same way, you know, that's where I come from. That's why when Miles would come up and say, you want to work, go to work and hang around with anybody, you know, I'd rather go work than, hang around with people. The people used to be wrong, you know? Yeah, and over there in Texas, we got home. My grandfather had cattle and some cattle, not very much. And my uncle and we get home and [Inaudible] be waiting for us a long time. Let's go cut some grass for the cows and stuff and we'd help out, you know, water. The cow will take food, too, you know, and hang around my grandfather. That's what I miss most about my time when my grandfather died, as part of me died because I used to hang around my grandfather a lot when we used to do a lot of stuff because my dad was a truck driver, he was never home, but my grandfather was there for me. AS: Alright, very well. Thank you for that. Thanks for your time and for sharing your memories with us. And that concludes the interview. 20 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0ced52a717bdf0a73f834c4bf75bcc52.mp3 e86599ee104bd66ffc7b3d1a9104f268 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Luevano_Estevan Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Luevano, Estevan Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Luevano, Estevan (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Estevan Luevano. Interviewed by Andrew Schlewitz on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English and Spanish language. Estevan Luevano was born in San Juan, Texas in 1967 as the son of two Mexican parents who migrated to Michigan for work each year. Throughout his life, he and his family were a part of the agricultural heritage of both places, and they settled in Michigan in 1981 and decided to stay. Estevan graduated from Walkerville High School in 1986 and studied diesel engines at the vocational center, which later helped him as he started his career as a semi-truck driver for his family’s business and later working as a mechanic. He ended up moving to Hesperia, Michigan in 1992 where he bought his first home and later started a family. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Schlewitz, Andrew (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Migrant agricultural laborers Farms Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/a66e078944717745ebbb1b2e38288e40.pdf e8cd485d67e09f97f8e7b239d09ba103 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Edward and Gretchen Hawley Interview Interviewed by Nora Salas and Paul Kutsche June 18, 2016 Transcript NS: Melanie got this water for you. I don't know if you wanted some coffee or something. EH: Well, I don't like bottled water. NS: Uh oh. EH: So, I do not want the water. NS: Okay. EH: And I don't think I need any coffee right now, so I think we'd better go ahead... NS: Okay. EH: ...with what we need to do. NS: Sounds good. Yes, well, we have some questions, but of course, you know, it’s up to you, also, what direction you want to take things. We do need to say a couple of things right at the beginning just so we 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department get it on the recording. And then if the recording were ever separated from the records, for some reason in the future, they would be able to know who was here and what they did, et cetera. EH: Alright. NS: Okay so, and we'll have to put your name in, too… when we say the interview name. EH: Anyway, should I say… this is what I thought I would say at the beginning here… NS: Okay. EH: ...if it would work in. Do you want me to say it here now or? NS: Well, right, maybe right after I say our names and the dates and such. So, this is Nora Salas and... PK: Paul Kutsche NS: ...and we are here today with... EH: Ed Hawley NS: ...Ed Hawley at the Hart… PK: City Hall [laughter]. NS: ...City Hall? EH: Well, it’s a Commons. Don’t they call this the Hart Commons, back here behind the City Hall? NS: Yes. EH: I think. NS: Yes, in Hart, Michigan and today, which is June 18th, 2016, this oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. Of course, thank you for agreeing to come and be interviewed and talk with us today. And we are interested in talking more about your family history and your experiences in Oceana County. Before we go into this, can you please state, again, your full name and spell it? EH: Yes, my name - well, if you want the whole thing - is Edward Adair Hawley. E-d-w-a-r-d A-d-a-i-r H-aw-l-e-y. NS: Sounds great. EH: OK. NS: Why don’t you go ahead? EH: When the topic for today first appeared in the Oceana Herald Journal, I knew that the Hawley Nursery and Fruit Farm is an important part of that history. I also knew that there are only four of us left with personal experience of that history. The other three are my sister Martha Ann Piegols, my nephew John Hawley, and my niece Joann, who with her husband David, own and operate the fruit farm. My 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department sister always defers to me in things like this and she has a conflict today anyway. Well, Saturday is the busiest day of the week for the other two and their businesses. So here I am ready to share what I can. NS: Awesome, thank you. So, we have questions... we don't have to go by these questions, especially if you get started on a particular topic… EH: Oh, I have a bunch... NS: ...or you want to have your own things. Why don't we start with what you brought, I think would be better. EH: Okay, well, I went in yesterday - no, Wednesday - to the Chadwick Munger House, office of the OCGHS. And they were pointing out to me that on their curb lawn, there is a cherry tree that was given by my father, Monroe Hawley, to Dr. Munger and he still... he finished his practice but was still living in the Munger House. And that tree still blooms every year and has cherries every year, so that is a connection. And then another connection that might be missed. This book that I have brought with me is a history of the Robinson and Hawley families by Duane Robinson, who was a cousin of mine and the family connection goes back to the Hart High School class of 1907 because Morris Robinson and he was a Morris who spelled Morris: M-o-r-r-i-s, but my dad is a Maurice and he spelled / it’s spelled: M-a-u-r-ic-e. The connection is that in 1892, my grandfather, who had just graduated from an institution then known as the Michigan Agricultural College in East Lansing, and his brother, who Harry Edward Hawley came from Ganges, much further south down near Fennville, up to Oceana County, and leased eightyseven acres because there was a railway track that kind of angled and made a boundary of it that was owned by the Hubbard family. And they leased this farm from the Hubbard family and began the Hawley’s Nursery and that was in 1892. My Uncle Ed, we called Uncle Ed... I just sent a big email off to the Robinson family members who live out in Seattle, Washington - another long story that I need to tell - and but that Morris Robinson went to Hart High School and my men in our part of the family call him “Uncle Ed” stayed up here and rented a house on the same road that this eighty-seven acres was on. And his daughter, Hazel. Oh, this is my wife Gretchen… [?]: ...who wants to come and add to the story. NS: Okay, we need a chair. [?]: I will get one for her. NS: Gretchen, did you sign the release form at the beginning? GH: No, I didn't expect that I would be doing anything. NS: Do you want to say something? Maybe you should sign it just in case you need to sit to interject. GH: Okay. NS: Because I think if you interject and you haven't signed it, I think we might have to try to edit you out or something and it could get really complicated. [?]: OK, should I take her back out there to do that or bring it in here? NS: Just to the beginning station where… what’s that young woman's name? 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department [?]: I don't know. NS: I don't know either. [Laughter] [?]: [Laughter]. Okay. NS: Then we would, of course, welcome you to come in. GH: Oh, thank you. Thank you. I’ll sign... NS: Yes. PK: Good morning. I’m Paul Kutsche. Remember we met last year? GH: We did. PK: And this is Nora Salas, who is conducting the interview. NS: Hi, I'm sorry, what's your name? GH: I'm Gretchen Hawley. NS: Gretchen. Hi, Gretchen. PK: Oh yes, Mrs. Hawley. GH: Yeah. NS: Yeah, I got that part. [Laughter] GH: Fifty-eight years this summer. NS: Oh, my goodness. GH: Well, of course, we started late, that’s really amazing. [Laughter] PK: By the way, the two of you have Michigan State in common. Dr. Salas got her Ph.D. in History, was it not? NS: It is true, yes. PK: From Michigan State. PK: Your fellow alumni. EH: Oh, an alum. Mine is also... NS: Oh, really? EH: ...but that was much longer ago. NS: Well, yes. 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: Specifically, in nineteen forty-three. I think I have that right. So, but I...and it was a strange situation because it was wartime and I was studying for the ministry so I had a deferment for that purpose. And I felt because all my friends were going into the service or were conscientious objectors, that I should since I had this deferment, that I should get to college as fast as I could. Well, all these friends were in danger one way or another. And so, Michigan State had a requirement that you could only take twentyone credit hours and, from the time of Pearl Harbor, I began to do that in order to get through as fast as I could. And also, being the school it was - MSC, as it was when I was there - had a requirement that you could only take twenty-one credit hours in a semester, or not, a quarter because they were in the quarter system. And so, I was trying to do that, but also, we had ROTC and that was a credit and a half. And so, I wound up taking twenty and a half credits each semester and goes right through the summers. And then I was going on from there to Chicago Theological Seminary on the University of Chicago campus by Rockefeller Chapel. And I should remember his name - began with a “K” - my History major professor. Oh, I suddenly relaxed for my last term since they would not let me take twenty-one and a half credits. PK: [Laughter] EH: “No, you can’t do that, you have to go to summer school.” So, they gave me a blank sheet of paper, they let me stand in line for graduation, but I had to write one more paper. So, I… ten o'clock on a Saturday morning, I went in with my last paper and left it on my history professor's desk and went out and hitchhiked to Chicago with everything that I needed on a backpack. And amazingly, the University of Chicago and Michigan State were on exactly the same schedule, so I arrived on a Saturday evening and on Monday morning I took my first course at eight o'clock in the morning in seminary. So that was my transition and how they could be on exactly that same term schedule. And also have an intensive sixweek summer school divided in half was amazing, but that's what happened. PK: Did you happen to be a contemporary in the seminary with Duncan Littlefair, who became… EH: No, I know Duncan Littlefair from Grand Rapids, but he was in divinity school and I was in Chicago Theological Seminary, which were a part of a federated faculty and this gets so complicated. PK: Oh, I see. That, of course, has nothing to do with the project… [Laughter]. PK: Since I’m a member of Fountain Street Church, I was curious whether… EH: Yeah, well, that's right. I certainly knew Duncan Littlefair, but that was the connection. He was younger than I. NS: Before we go too much farther, Gretchen, just in case you do have something to add, at the beginning you missed the part where we ask people to state their name and spell it. Just in case, at some point in the future the written record were to be separated from the recording, then people would always know who was here. So, if you could do that, that would be really helpful. GH: Alright. I'm Gretchen Hawley. G-r-e-t-c-h-e-n H-a-w-l-e-y. And I'm Ed’s wife. We were married on the Fourth of July, nineteen fifty-eight. NS: Thank you. Easy day to remember. 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department GH: I was a town girl and I married a farm boy. PK: Which town? GH: Lowell. PK: Oh! NS: So, one of the first questions on here… we’re moving around a little bit, but... Ed, you grew up here in Hart, right? The relationship with the nursery? EH: Well, on a farm outside of Hart. NS: The seventy-eight acres? EH: Yes. Yeah, eighty-seven. NS: Sorry, yeah. It says, “tell us about where you grew up, some of your most vivid memories from childhood.” EH: Okay. Well, I, believe it or not, can...I have a memory of my sister's birth. There was no hospital in Hart or Shelby at the time I was born, which was in 1923, and my sister was born two and a half years later. But our doctor, who was Dr. Nickelson, a contemporary of Doctor Munger's, the house where his office is still down here on Main Street. And he… when my mother went into labor, he sent a midwife out to help deliver the baby. And I don't remember when that happened to me. But I was aware enough as a two-and-a-half-year-old because we had bedrooms upstairs separated by just a passageway. Same house is still there in Iona now. But anyway, I have this distinct memory of my… my bed was by my parents' bed, but when she went - my mother went - into labor, they put me in the back room, of course, but I still remember that the midwife came and when I went back in, I was shown this new baby sister that I had and I am always amazed how things like that can somehow stick in our heads. But I do feel I… PK: Were you the oldest? EH: What? PK: Were you the oldest? EH: I was the oldest. PK: Uh huh. EH: And then we have another sister, Lucy, who is five years younger than Martha Ann. So, she was born in the hospital; by then, an old building that had been a family restaurant down by the… well, kitty corner from Ace Hardware, down there was the hospital and it had a big front porch. And another memory I have was my grandfather had appendicitis and went to the hospital and died at the age of sixty-two. And I can remember going down and, as a child or children, Martha and I weren't allowed to go into the hospital, but the big plate glass window from when it had been a house was in the same room that my grandfather was in, and we could stand on the porch and wave to him from outside the window of the hospital. So those are some ancient memories, but I don't know we need to go into them 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department with the Holly Nursery because I do want to get to the...specifically, the Holly Nursery part of this. And aren’t we supposed to be doing this out there or at this time or what’s the schedule? NS: To try to scan that stuff? EH: No, no, I’m not worried about scanning. We can do that… GH: No, you do it all here, Ed. EH: We do this all here? NS: Where you talk about it? EH: Oh, yeah. NS: The nursery? EH: Oh, okay. NS: Yeah. We can, if you want to go in that direction we can do that, but there's a couple of questions too. We don't have to do all the questions, though. EH: Okay. I definitely want to get into the Holly Nursery part of it. NS: Yes. Yeah, so we can go ahead and do that if you want to. And then afterwards, they have a couple of stations set up to scan the documents that you have there. So, if you want to take them out and talk about them then... if that's what you wanted to do. EH: I have one question about this, and that is about copyright, because this book, which I would very much like to get a lot of into the Historical Society record, is... I think has a copyright by… I can’t recall his name, my cousin. NS: Robinson? EH: Well, he's the author of this thing. GH: Duane. EH: Duane, yeah, Duane Robinson. And so… NS: I think we have to ask Melanie. EH: He’s gone and when I got into this, I remembered. Let me go back to give this part of the history, to get the Robinson / Hawley connection and why this is that way. Because Morris Robinson went to Hart High School and my uncle Ed’s daughter, Hazel, also went to Hart High School. I had thought they were in the same class, but they weren't. That's where they got to know each other. And they got married and Morris went on to get a law degree at Ann Arbor, to the University of Michigan, and then went to work for Sears Roebuck. And Sears Roebuck sent him out to Washington State and that's where he never really practiced law because he was too busy selling Sears products, I guess. [Laughter] 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: But I suddenly realized, having looked at this, that Duane finished this in 1974 and that some of us who are still living ought to update it. Well, he had five kids and so I sent an email off to all of them yesterday saying that it suddenly struck me that some of us needed to bring this up to date while we’re still around. And I don't think they’ve… well, I haven't heard back from any of them yet. And there's a son who was a rather famous jazz musician. Well, a cousin of mine. So anyway, I hope that some of us will be willing to bring it up to date. And I can't imagine any of them would object and probably would never know anyway if I had some of us stand... PK: What is the date of the copyright, Ed? EH: What? PK: What is the date when this is copyrighted? NS: Because the law is different depending on when the copyright was. GH: It just says 1974. PK: Oh, so the copyright may still be enforced. NS: We can... I think that when we get to the part of scanning it, if we ask Melanie then… EH: Okay, NS: ...we can see what she has to say. Is there a copy of this in the historical society? EH: No. NS: Okay, just for your family? EH: I wish there were and I don’t know if there’s any loose copies around, there might be now because some family members may have died and their offspring have no interest it, but I'm not sure of that. Ideally if the whole thing could be in there... GH: We need to get it. We have a copy at home and this one at the cottage. EH: No, this is Steve's. GH: Oh, no, that's the one I took out of our bookcase. EH: Oh, it is, okay. This... we have it then; one in each place. PK: Well, of course, you know that you're at liberty to deposit this with the historical society, quite apart from scanning it. EH: Yeah, okay. PK: Whether it's, you know, whether the copyright’s enforced or not. NS: Yeah, especially if you fear later it might not be preserved, you know, down the line, then that could be a good idea. Sometimes people save a lot of things and then, you know, not everybody saves it after they're gone, unfortunately. 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department PK: It's awfully hard for families to keep things and let them get destroyed. And I'm right in the middle of it in my family. So, if I may, I urge you to… if you have a spare copy to deposit it with the historical society… NS: Think about it. PK: ...then if you want to update it, there's no reason you can't do that. Then they might eventually have two versions. The earlier and the later. All the better. NS: Yeah. Sometimes families, even if they want to preserve it, though, you know, the basement floods or something, you know, things are accidents. People move, lose track of things. PK: Well, I've been desperately trying to keep family records together, and I find that little bits of paper just sort of wander off. And so, the earlier they get deposited in a place that professionally can keep them the better, I think. NS: Now, what's this one that you have there? Is this about the nursery? EH: Indirectly. This is my dad here in the picture. And I made copies of this yesterday. And the historical society has one already so… GH: They copied that, you’re saying. EH: No, but was one thing, well I guess, we found. NS: So, this nursery… EH: Yeah. NS: ...when your family worked on that, what can you tell? What do you think is really significant? What do you remember about it? EH: Well, the fact is that a high percentage of all of the fruit trees in Oceana County and up and down the west shore of Lake Michigan were originally produced and sold by Hawley’s Nursery - the Hawley Nursery is the correct name. And so, in order to have the trees to sell, we had to get rootstock from someplace out in Oregon or Washington state, I'm not quite sure which. And then someone in March of each year, we'd have to have a field where they would plant all of this rootstock. And then come August, some of us - including me and a lot of kids from high school and all of my relatives of roughly the same age, my cousins - all crawled on our hands and knees up and down fields all over this county, because my dad needed fresh ground not to do this on the same field every time. So, he would lease land all over the county, really. And then send us… we had some very experienced and very fast and good budders [?]. But the technique was - having cut off the tops of these and dropping the root stock - was to... the budder [?] would go down the aisle and make a cut in the rootstock, and then he'd have a bundle that my dad would have or somebody going out into the orchards where there was fruit, true to name on a tree, and cut off a stick of buds. And as he crawled down, the person crawled down the aisle, pulled one out from behind and made a slip behind it, kind of a pointed slip. And then he would cut like this and slide that down into the rootstock. And then some of us would crawl along behind with a specific length of rubber band and wrap that up tightly. And then it would be left until the next spring when that bud 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department would sprout and grow. And I think it was usually a year later when those were dug out of the ground and sold to farmers. And I was intrigued just a year ago now that a friend, a near contemporary of mine in high school, Todd Novles [?] died and he had written his own obituary and he spent his adult life basically over on the other side of the state. But he wanted his obit[uary] because he would come over, he had a cottage… his family had a cottage on Pentwater Lake and it’s still in the family. And so, Tom, when he wrote his own obituary, and wanted one in the Oceana Journal, what he talked about in his obituary was how he crawled up and down the aisles budding [laughter] or tying rather behind the budder. PK: Does this then produce hybrid stock? EH: What? PK: Does this produce a hybrid, the rootstock plus what's going in? EH: No, the root stock… GH: ...it doesn’t influence it. EH: ...it doesn’t influence it. PK: Oh, it's merely the host! EH: Yeah. NS: It’s like grafted together. GH: Yeah. PK: Okay. NS: What kind of fruit was it? EH: What? NS: What kind of fruits? EH: Basically plums, pears, cherries - I think I’m onto five - and peaches… PK: And apples! EH: And apples, yeah. But then we always had I think usually just one quince among all of these. But and so those were all true to name and the people that bought them would be confident that they would be producing the same kind of peach or apple. My dad said it was, so… NS: Do you think it changed over from when you were smaller till later? Like, what kinds or different varieties? EH: Well, they were intended to be fewer and fewer. My sister still has in her house a catalog from the Hawley Nursery from something like 1907 that lists at least twenty-five different varieties of - I think it's 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department nearer a hundred different varieties - of all five of these. And because not all of them were sold commercially, that list got smaller and smaller as the years went on down to maybe forty varieties. NS: What do you think was the most biggest change from when it first started until now? EH: Well, the biggest change is that small nurseries like this were gradually forced out of business by the big commercial ones. What’s the one down in Kansas… near Kansas City? I should remember. Starcrow's [?] is one, but there are several of these that have pretty much forced all of the smaller nurseries out of business. PK: Hawley Nursery no longer is in business? EH: It's no longer in business. The fruit farm is because David and Joann Rennhack operate the fruit farm… live on and operate the fruit farm and have the Rennhack store now down across from Hansen’s where they sell all of their stuff. PK: Rennhack inherited or bought your business? EH: They inherited it; Joann is my niece so… PK: Really? EH: Yeah. PK: Wonderful family. EH: So, and Martha Ann… technically, Martha Ann and I are the inheritors in that generation, but Martha Ann passed hers down to Joann, and then Joann married David, so that's the connection there. NS: Do you remember roundabout when that stopped being able to be a nursery and went more to just the fruit farm part? EH: Yeah. John Hawley who his… my dad was Monroe Hawley. And then he had a brother, Morris, who died in the flu epidemic in the First World War in 1918. And then there were three girls in that family. And then my uncle, Herb, who has two daughters and a son, John, who's still… and John kept the nursery going for quite a while and had a place over on Polk Road for a while. But he and his wife were living in what is now the clubhouse for the Colonial Golf Course over on 72nd here. And that was a fruit farm which John also inherited when his dad died. He had kept it going because Herb wanted it to keep going, I think. And so, John took out all the fruit trees and made a golf course instead and he now is the manager of the golf course. And that's where Gretchen went to see if he had any Hawley Nursery stuff. GH: He didn’t, but he said hello. [Laughter] NS: When did the golf course go in? EH: What? NS: When do you think the golf course went in? EH: I think it's fifteen years ago, roughly, I'd have to… 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department PK: There was a restaurant there also for quite a while, was there not? GH: Well, there still is. PK: Oh, still is? That’s still running? GH: Inside Herb’s… that was the Herb Hawley house, that's the clubhouse. PK: You mean that beautiful, beautiful house there? GH: That was Herb’s house. EH: Before that, we always think of it as the Russell House because the original owner of that land, the man who built the house, was Judge Russell and Russell's Creek flows through and down and eventually into Hart Lake. And my uncle, Herb, bought that from the Russell family after Judge Russell died, and then he and Lucille, well, they built a smaller house for themselves and had John and Sandy living in the other house, in the big house. But Herb and Lucille are long gone. There was almost an even thirteen year difference between my dad and Herb, and then I’m about thirteen years beyond that. There’s all these girl children in between. NS: And this is ‘52 and this is your dad? EH: Yeah. NS: And it says he was a nursery man. EH: Yeah. NS: And he had the nursery through maybe the [nineteen] sixties, seventies or longer? EH: Well, he had… he and Herb together had the nursery. And then John took over when both of them were gone... NS: And he still had the nursery. EH: ...and he still had the nursery. NS: And then part of it became a golf course. PK: How many acres of trees did the Hawley Family have at the maximum, would you say roughly? EH: Well, there was that original eighty-seven acres, and then my dad bought what we called the Turner Farm across the street, across the road from that original property. And the reason he bought it is the man that did these wonderful postcards and note cards for the historical society just died a few weeks ago. PK: You don't mean Ed Ricketson, do you? EH: I do. PK: Oh! 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: Yeah. Because he worked on all those cards and I read his obit[uary] and didn't catch the fact that that’s whose obit[uary] I was reading, somehow. But, yeah, it was Ed Ricketson. And anyway, where was I going with that? [Laughter] PK: How large the enterprise was… EH: Oh, yes! And the reason for the Turner Farm. And that is that my mother grew up in Adrian, Michigan, which is down close to Toledo... closer to Toledo than any other sizable place. Anyway, she’s from Adrian. She went to Adrian College, then she got a master’s degree from the University of Michigan, and then she got hired to come up and teach high school in Hart. And it happened my dad's sisters were in her classes and dad, my grandfather, had been in… no, now we’re with my dad. My dad was in the Second World War and was with an army unit that went over to France. GH: Well, that would be the First World War, Ed. EH: Oh, my memory is... GH: [Laughter] NS: It's okay. EH: ...playing tricks on me. GH: It is. PK: There wasn't much time between the First World War and the Second. It’s easy to conflate them. NS: He met your mom, then, when she was at the school? EH: Yeah, that's right. This is the First World War, as Gretchen says. And so, my dad, Monroe, had missed going to Europe because he had scarlet fever, and the unit went without him, but he got discharged then after the armistice and came back to Hart. And his sisters had Doris Hawley as their teacher and she said they liked her very much and thought that they should introduce her to their brother. And so, one of the funnier stories about that is that he began dating Doris at his sisters’ encouragement and it was in the middle of the winter for them when this was happening and he had a sleigh and a horse. And so, he took her out in the winter with lots of rogues [?] for this ride in the sleigh and the horse knew the way and they got acquainted with each other as they went. And he suddenly realized to his embarrassment that the horse had turned in at the driveway of the girl that he had dated before. [Laughter] GH: The horse knew the way. NS: It seems like the sisters overruled the horse, though. GH: [Laughter] Yeah. NS: The horse had an opinion about this, too, I guess. [Laughter] EH: He made some kind of excuse, which I probably once knew, but no longer. 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department [Laughter] PK: Well, they got married anyway! [Laughter] EH: Yeah, right. [Laughter] GH: Dorris' maiden name was Adair and that's Ed's middle name. PK: Now, all this had something to do with the growth of acreage because that's where we started from. EH: Oh, yes, the Turner Farm. The original farm was in the Gulliver [?] School District. One of the things that - oh, what was it - the man we were just talking about produced is a card that there were one-room schools that sometimes got expanded to two rooms all across the county that served grades one through eight. And I just signed off this morning to a friend of mine that's helping me write my memoirs, because right where we're sitting here in the bottom center of that card, there's a picture of a building that ran from up here all the way back to the playground at the back down there that’s above Courtland Street, where I went to school from kindergarten through senior in high school and all in the same building. And so, and then it has pictures of several of these country schoolhouses on that same... GH: Yeah, but the reason your dad bought the Turner farm? EH: Yeah, oh, that's where we were going was that my mother was still teaching in high school. And so instead of us kids having to walk up the road half a mile to the Garver [?] School, which our neighbor kids did have to do because Dad bought the Turner Farm across the street, it was in the Hart District. And my mother was still teaching in Hart, so she could take us into Hart School and we could go to a single-grade classroom because he was paying taxes on that property. PK: How big was Turner Farm? EH: Turner Farm, I think - it’s been expanded some - but I think initially it was pretty much a standard ninety-acre quarter section. PK: So, all together then you had at that point maybe one hundred eighty acres or so? EH: Something in that neighborhood. And then they bought some other additional that was beyond that, too. NS: And maybe, you said before, maybe leased some other? EH: Huh? NS: You said before, maybe leased some other lands sometimes? EH: Oh, yeah, almost every year. For example, one year I can remember he’d leased land out in Elbridge Township in what had been the American Indian Reservation. Gretchen grew up in Lowell and Cobmoosa, who was a chief of one of the Indian nationalities, actually lived in Lowell in a regular house. She’ll correct me if I'm wrong. GH: [Laughter] EH: But then because the federal government decided that they should give these people some of their historical land, they made this Indian reservation; all of Elbridge Township, originally, was American 14 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Indian. And so Cobmoosa decided that he should come up because he was a chief of his people, he should come up and live on that land. And his log house is now down in the Hart Historical District down here. But I can remember when it was still out in Elbridge Township and my dad had rented probably something like twenty acres across the street from it for budding. So, for about three weeks in August, we would take lunch and go over. By then, no one was living in the Cobmoosa house. But we would have our lunch over there and then go back to crawling up and down the aisles across the street. And then eventually they carefully took it apart and reconstructed it down here in the historical district. GH: Before you did budding in high school and all, your dad hired you kids to hang out in the orchards. EH: [Laughter] Oh, I knew she wanted me to tell this story. GH: [Laughter] EH: Child labor. GH: [Laughter] EH: And this is when Martha Ann and I and our neighbor kids - the Nickleson girl and a boy, we were roughly the same age - that played together. Dad had a cherry tree that was out in the orchard with lots of other cherry trees, but that bloomed about a week earlier than the others. And as soon as it would have fruit on it, the Cedar Waxwings would all come in to eat the cherries off the tree. So, my dad offered us a nickel a day - the four of us - if we would go out and play under these trees to scare the Cedar Waxwings away. So that is child labor laws [laughter] were being violated for a nickel a day. NS: What about the other… aside from the important job that you all did when you were kids, were the other people who worked for your dad and worked for the nursery… where did they come from? High Schoolers? EH: I hope Walter has lined up... because the house that Martha Ann and I were born in, I still own, but it’s kind of… my dad just pulled it out of the farm when it went over to the Rennhacks and eventually it has to get back into their hands. But I'm renting it currently to Tommy [?], who works at the La Fiesta restaurant and her brother now runs it or her father. But that family all came up in the summer to work on my dad's... on the nursery and the fruit farm for my dad. As did a, for example, this is sometimes forgotten, a white family from Alabama who were also part of this migration of people that went around picking crops and that white family whose name will come to me and should eventually, stayed here in Hart and of course, because they learned the nursery and fruit business, were doing some of the same things on their own. And that same thing was true with Tommy and her family and that family named her brother now inherited from her father, who was the original one who came up and worked seasonally, is down in the valley between the golf course and Polk Road and he keeps the place up beautifully. And so, we have that connection also with the history of Mexican ancestry people who have now settled here. And I think Walter has him on schedule to be a part of this. PK: Ed, a couple of people whom I interviewed, particularly Floyd Fox and Velo Burmeister, both of whom were in their mid-nineties when I interviewed them... 15 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: And Floyd is still around, I think. PK: Yes, he is. I understand he's still healthy, as a matter of fact. EH: That’s right. I go to Shelby Church and he's five years older than I am. PK: Still driving his own truck, as a matter of fact. EH: Yeah, right. PK: Well, each of them told me the succession of waves of pickers started, as you have already told us, with the kids in the family. EH: Uh huh. PK: And then they moved on to different categories. With the Latino pickers, they were all Mexicans to start with, were they not? EH: Yep. PK: Came in... EH: Well, no, some of them were Texicans, actually, that they were born in Texas, but of Mexican ancestry. PK: But they were of Mexican ancestry, not Honduran or Guatemalan or Puerto Rican. EH: No. PK: Can you give us an idea of the succession of categories of people who picked and otherwise worked on your family's acreage, starting with the family and then… NS: When you were a kid, did they hire people outside the family to work? EH: I think so. NS: Do you remember? PK: And who were they? I don't mean their names, but were they other Anglos or were they? EH: There was... I don't ever remember any black families. PK: Oh, blacks did not pick for you. As you know, they did for other families. EH: Uh huh. There was one black family and one black man, Gabe Crocket [?], and one black family, the Reeds [?], that lived in Hart when I was a small kid. But how they got here… they were just here. Oh, but I think the Reeds had to have probably come up from Muskegon and probably did start working. But my memory, because at one point they lived in the Garver School District and there were two girls - Fanny and I'm not sure I can remember their name - and i think two boys. But there was a time when they were living in the Garver School District and would walk past and further to the north because they would walk past our house and the Nichols [?] house to go up to Garver School. And Fanny had a great voice and was a wonderful singer. And Estelle, I think, Estelle was mentally challenged and she kept being left behind so she'd be much bigger than the other kids in her class, but Fanny, Mrs. Nichols [?] 16 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department would invite them to come into her house. She had a piano and she would get Fanny to sing. And I remember as small kids, they were somewhat older than we were. We would be fascinated by listening to her sing. GH: But they never worked in the orchards for your dad? EH: No, I don't think they ever worked for my dad, but they were here and Gabe had the house in Hart and I know right where it is, still. And he was a very short man. He probably was only five [foot] two [inches] or something like that. And he allowed himself to be the butt of people's jokes at the county fair. But I remember the men coming up to him and pinning prize bull or something on his collar and he would just smile and go on. PK: But he didn't work for you? EH: He didn't work for us. PK: You mentioned a family from Alabama. EH: Yeah. PK: They were white people. EH: They were white. PK: And you remember when that would have been? What decade, at least? EH: That would have been in the late 1930s or early 1940s. PK: Now, as you know, they were great, at least one, maybe two prisoner of war camps here for Germans. EH: There were. PK: And they worked for a lot of people. Did they work for you? EH: No, I don’t think they did. I remember walking by there on our way back and forth from school because one of them was just south of what is now Polk Road, which wasn’t then called Polk Road, I don’t remember what it was. But I do remember that they were there, but they didn't... I don't think Dad ever had any of them working on the farm. PK: Well, then was the Vasquez family the first of the Latino families who… EH: I think so, yes. PK: That would have been when? 1950s, perhaps, or? EH: Better ask Tommy or her brother. Let me think, it was earlier than that in the 1940s, probably. NS: During World War Two. EH: What? NS: During World War Two, the federal government had a program where they brought workers from Mexico directly. Sometimes they called them “braceros.” 17 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: Oh, yeah. NS: And they were mostly all men. They were supposed to be all men, not families. EH: Yes. NS: Do you remember them coming? EH: Not to Michigan, but I remember them coming to California and how they... NS: Were you in California? EH: Oh, the folk singer had this... John Denver had the song, I think… NS: Guthrie? EH: ...which would be later. NS: Guthrie, maybe? GH: Not John Denver. EH: Who was it? GH: Woody Guthrie? EH: Woody Guthrie. It was Woody that had this… PK: John Denver would be flattered to be compared to Woody Guthrie. EH: Yes, Woody Guthrie had this… oh, I thought I could sing the words to that song even about being forced to go back to Mexico. NS: Yeah, that continued for a while until 1964 for that program. EH: Yeah. NS: And then it ended, so yeah. PK: Did you help the Vasquez family get started in the restaurant business? They're so successful now that it's very interesting to a lot of people how they made the transition from migrant laborers to solid members of the commercial community here in Oceana County. Was your family instrumental in helping them make that transition? EH: Well, I don't remember any specific instances of it, but just the fact that they knew they’d always have employment on the nursery or the fruit farm. It gave them, I think, the stability to be able to develop their talents along that line and create their marvelous chips that are now probably even more the part of the business than the restaurant. [Unknown]: Slide past. I’ve got to use the restroom. NS: [Whispers] It’s okay. [Unknown]: Sorry about that. 18 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department NS: Sorry, so you mentioned some people who came to work from different places. EH: Uh huh. NS: And then sometimes high schoolers would come and you would go when you were in high school and when you were younger. How were those people recruited, especially who came from other places? How did they find out? Or at first, you know, like, they get in their car in Alabama and how do they end up at the Hawley’s? EH: I'm not sure I know, they just appeared! [Laughter] NS: Well, after a while, they must… they came back year after year. EH: Yeah. NS: Right? But if a family decided not to come back, then you needed more people to replace them. How would they… how would your dad or other family recruit people? EH: I think we would say to the ones already here, “do you know anybody else?” And they would then say, “well, yes, there’s so-and-so, and I'll tell them.” So, that's how that would happen. NS: Do you know what time of the year when they would arrive? Usually? EH: Usually, I think in June. I doubt that any arrived much earlier than that, but I would need to think about that more to be sure. A lot of them had a routine that would then eventually take them down to Florida to pick tomatoes after stopping in New York State to do something or other. So, it was a big circle, Texas, and maybe with the stuff in Missouri on the way to Michigan, I'm not sure about that but… it was Missouri or Iowa, but. PK: Did any of the… well, how many Mexican pickers did you have at one time at the maximum, do you think? It wasn’t just one family, I'm sure. EH: Oh, boy. I think John Hawley is the one that really could answer that better than I. PK: Do you happen to know, to remember...? EH: Once I finished high school, I was here so little. John was on the ground all the time, so he would be a better person to ask. PK: Do you recall whether any of them moved into supervisory positions, at least field bosses or managers or anything other than the pickers on the ground? I know that's fairly rare, but I do know of a case or two where somebody who started picking ended his career managing. Chico Longoria, for instance, who worked for the Fox’s for a long time, whose obituary appeared in the Herald Journal last year, was a conspicuous case. Are there any such people who worked for the Hawley’s? EH: Oh, well, the Vazquez’s, of course. PK: But were they in a managerial position for you or is it only after they left Hawley to go on their own? EH: Well, as I say, when I graduated from high school, which was 1941, I do not recall, but after that, I just wasn't around enough to be aware because I was going straight through school. 19 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department NS: After school, after you went to school in Chicago, too, then what did you do? EH: What? NS: After you went to the school in Chicago, then what was the rest of your life? EH: Well, the first thing that happened... NS: How did you end up back here in Hart? EH: The first thing that happened is that once the war was over and I no longer had this compulsion to keep going to school, I had in 1946, I had connections with what our denomination called the Congregational Christian Service Committee. And Jim Flindt, who was on the staff of the big congregational church in Madison, Wisconsin; Jim was also on the board of the Congregational Christian Service Committee. And the congregational churches in Great Britain - and we did have an international congregational organization - were completely closed down, their theological schools, during the war and with the bombing and everything going on. And the tradition had been that young people who were studying for the clergy in Great Britain would go into various inner-city programs to work with kids and youth and children, and that just completely shut down. So once the war was over and the seminarians were going back to school. [Cough] Well, I may need… well, all right. [Inaudible] They recruited seminary students from here to go over to Britain for a year and work in these places. [Cough] And Jim Flindt knew me from the Pilgrim Fellowship, which was the youth group of the congregation. [Cough] He asked me if I would like to go and I jumped at the chance to do something besides study. And so, in September of 1946, I got on the Queen Mary - which was still a one-class ship at that point because it had been a troop ship during the war - and went to Great Britain and wound up at the Crossway Central Mission in South London, near what is still called the “Elephant and Castle,” which is the name of a pub in Southwark. And the New Kent Road connects up with the Elephant and Castle and Crossway Mission was at New Kent Road. Bill Martin, W.B.J. Martin, who was a Welshman who had been working in London inner city in the height of the bombing over on the East Side and somehow got through all that. He was then the minister and that building after the old city missionary [?] had a tower that had three apartments in it… maybe two apartments. But anyway, Bill Martin and his wife, who is also an ordained minister, were on the one floor and the caretaker who lived on the top floor - the last name was Vassie (V-a-s-s-i-e) - and they would come to me and they had a spare room. So then, as it turned out, for two years I lived with the Vassies on the top floor. And so, there are lots of connections with that. I'm not sure how far we’re going in terms of Hawley’s Nursery now but... NS: Well, but then you were in London and then, for two years, and then… EH: Yeah, I was at Crossway Mission for one year, but stayed with the Vassies because I had been national president of the Pilgrim Fellowship, which was the youth organization for the congregational 20 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department churches in this country. And the Congregational Union of England and Wales had a youth division and decided they wanted to have something similar in Great Britain. So, they asked me to stay a second year and travel around to all the different counties and meet with the youth of the churches in those areas to help them form. That was the pattern of Pilgrim Fellowship. Each different confluence had its own organization so that was the connection there and was fantastic because… oh, and in between these two things was the Second World Conference of Christian Youth, which was held in Oslo, Norway. And I had been doing the work at the Crossway Mission and their work with the youth program really wasn't going to start, so I had that summer fairly free and because each of the denominations had people that would go to this Second World Conference of Christian Youth, and I was closer so, at least, I think it was easier for them to make me one of them because it wasn't going to cost as much to get me there from London as it was from New York City or California or someplace or Hawaii. And so, I did, I was able to spend two weeks there and again, these marvelous connections. And this is certainly a long way from where we started. The Congregational Churches Worldwide had the foresight to call a pre-Oslo conference, which was held at… there was a Congregational College at Cambridge University, and they got Congregationalists from all over the world to come together for a week there. And one of the people who came was Russell Chandran from the Church of South India, and he was from Bangalore. Russell and I not only got to know each other at the meeting in Cambridge, but when we got to Oslo, that program was divided up with small groups. And he and I wound up in the same group for two weeks in Oslo. So, we got to know each other quite well and he eventually came to do some additional study. He and his wife, Vicki, from South India, came to Chicago Theological Seminary, which was my seminary. By then, I was the minister of the interracial and bilingual church on the west side of Chicago and the… NS: What church in Chicago? EH: It was the Warren Avenue Congregational Church. It no longer exists, though. It merged with the Presbyterian Church on the next corner. And the building now is a Black Baptist Church and it’s still there. But that was another marvelous experience because… EH: Oh. NS: It's OK. EH: Is it okay? GH: Well, you've gotten far afield. NS: You find all kinds of things. PK: So, you went with the merger? EH: Yeah. GH: But you were in Chicago then, not Oberlin. PK: And Bruce, as you know, went with the congregational holdout. 21 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: Over to the church, yeah, there’s still a Continuing Congregational Church out in Grand Rapids, isn’t there? PK: Mayflower. EH: Mayflower, yeah. PK: One of my relatives went there, the rest of them stayed at Park [?]. I'm happy to tell you they still went together for Christmas. EH: Oh, good. [Laughter] Well, that’s amazing. PK: And we almost overlapped in London, apparently; I arrived in London in September 1949 and went to work for the United Press and stayed there until 1951. But you had already left by then, had you? EH: Yeah, but I came back in the summer of [nineteen] fifty-one for the Festival of Britain. PK: Oh, how wonderful! EH: And also, to direct a World Council of Churches work camp in Deptford south of the river and which was one of the stranger work camps anyplace because the minister of this church... PK: An inner-city slum work camp, huh? EH: Yeah, it was decided that the building should be restored. But they had once had a much bigger piece of land and had a graveyard outside. And way back in history, they had brought all the bones from the graves outside into the basement. And when the minister decided he wanted to restore the building, he had to get to the foundations and all these bones were down there. So, our work camp and the kids from Germany and Denmark, World Council of Churches people from all over, a German guy and I were co-directors of this, where our whole job was getting these bones out from around the foundations that had to be supported. PK: What did you do with the bones? EH: Nothing ever came of it, in terms of actually getting the building changed. PK: What did you do with the bones? Did you throw them in a pile? EH: No, we were reburying them, but away from the pillar, we had to get the pillars cleared so that they could be reinforced to hold up the rest of the building. GH: So, they're still there; the bones are just relocated? EH: They were the last I knew! But I have not kept up with that. [Laughter] EH: I don't follow bones around. PK: You know, there’s something that struck me: are we sort of freewheeling now or do you have a part of this you want to get back to? Because I think Ed and I are sort of going way past Oceana County. NS: Well, you've discovered new things now, connections that you didn't know before. 22 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department PK: Yeah, but I don't want to interfere with the core. NS: It doesn't have to follow a linear path, necessarily. I think that might be kind of hard for us to… PK: Well, I think Ed’s getting tired and I’m getting tired. NS: Yes, that could be. EH: Didn't Walter have other people that you're supposed to be interviewing lined up? NS: Yeah. I think… are there things you wanted to talk about that you didn't get to yet? Before you came, are there things you said, “Well, I'm going to…” because I don't want that to be missed out. EH: Well, let me look at my notes. I’ll tell you what I wrote down. NS: I don’t want him to leave not having talked about things he wanted to talk about. I doubt most people got to all of these questions. EH: This is pretty peripheral, but it's interesting how, again, things come together because Duane Robinson, who put this book together… I had to come up here to do a lot of interviewing and, of course, Duane, having been part of this branch from Seattle or West Seattle from our family, had come here knowing that his dad, Morris Robinson, was from here. And at that point, when he came, Ivan Robinson was still living and was on a farm just south of the farm that Martha Ann is still living on, and she and I grew up on kind of on top of the hill. And all of his family, Duane had talked to them and had listed by name in the book all of the Robinson family members that were living right in our neighborhood here in Oceana County. I broke the femur in my hip two summers ago and wound up in the Oceana County Medical Center. And there was a man there… actually, two people that relate to this and I'll get to the other one, maybe two. We’re a little more back to what we originally were aiming at anyway. And I discovered that one of them who was a patient then in the medical center was named Manley Robinson. And he and I would eat lunch together while I was in there rehabbing from my hip. And I eventually thought that I'd better go look at this book. And sure enough, here was Manley’s name and Ivan… Duane had interviewed Ivan and he listed all his brothers and who they were and where they were. So, again, I copied out of this book that page where Manley’s name appeared and I was able to produce it for him at the medical center. And he was so pleased and amazed he actually had his name in print. PK: [Laughter] That’s great. EH: He’s gone now, too. But, I’m glad before he went, he knew that he was remembered. GH: Have you interviewed any of the families that are here now that worked in the orchards who came up from Texas? PK: I decided when Andy Schlewitz came up and interviewed a number of people who worked in the orchards, that I would carve out something. At that time, nobody else was doing that, they were interviewing the growers. So, I have not interviewed any pickers. GH: When we were married in ‘58, the Hawley’s were still tapping all those old - well, now they're really old - maple trees along 72nd Avenue and to make maple syrup. 23 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department PK: Oh! GH: And so those trees… PK: Well, those are sugar maples then? GH: Uh huh, those are all sugar maples. PK: That's a pretty big industry in Oceana County. GH: And they had, what was it called where you boiled the… EH: An arch is what we called it. GH: An arch. And they had the big pans that are about twice the size of this table. And they’d use old... PK: That’s where they boiled the sap down? EH: Yeah, right. GH: They’d use old wood from the orchards, trees that were cut down, to keep the fires going. And Ed was showing me this arch where the syrup was... EH: We’d have the big pan... PK: So, your family was in that business, too, then. EH: Well, it wasn’t a business. We were just doing it for ourselves. PK: Oh! EH: Yeah. NS: Home use. PK: You didn't put your label on…? EH and GH: No, no. EH: No, it was all canned by my mother and we… PK: I wondered where maple syrup came from. GH: It takes a lot of sap to make the maple syrup. And those trees are still there, but no longer tapped. But it was in that arch that you presented me with this engagement ring. EH: Oh, that’s right! GH: And I didn't fall into the fire. [Laughter] It was a great surprise. PK: How many gallons of sap… [Inaudible] [Laughter]. GH: I don’t know. Yes, but besides that, did your mother can a lot of fruit or not? EH: Yes, we had that whole basement… well, you've been down in the basement. 24 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department GH: Oh, that’s right. EH: Remember, we had all those cupboards of things she’d canned that would be used during the winter. NS: But when you were a kid, she still worked at the school? EH: Well, not too long. NS: Just a little? EH: Long enough to get us established going there. But I think by the time I was in second grade, she had stopped teaching and was just homemaking, but we were still going. And of course, often we would walk to town to school and walk back on the railroad tracks. And that was always a challenge to try to walk on the rail and not fall off as we were walking home from school. GH: The tracks that are now the Rail Trail? EH: The tracks that are now the Rail Trail. GH: Okay. PK: Which run right through what I think of as the Rennhack... EH: What? PK: The Rail Trail runs right through the… what I have always thought of as the Rennhack orchards, right? EH: Uh huh. GH: Yeah, those were the Hawley… PK: Which were the Hawley orchards. GH: Uh huh. Those were the Hawley orchards. PK: Your niece is married to a Rennhack? Or is her maiden name Rennhack? EH: No, that’s her married name. PK: She's a Hawley who married a Rennhack? EH: No, she’s a Piegols. Because she’s my sister Martha Ann Piegols… Martha Ann Hawley Piegols’ daughter. So, her original name was Piegols and now it's Rennhack. PK: May I drop your name the next time I'm there? GH: Absolutely! [Laughter] EH: Well, certainly. PK: They're wonderful people. EH: Yeah, we agree. 25 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department PK: I’m all done; are you all done? NS: We can be; it's kind of up to you. I could ask you, frankly, I could sit here and ask you both questions all day. [Laughter] NS: All day. But I think that, you know, there's a limit to what you can... I could think of more and more. It's up to you. GH: I remember something that has to do tangentially with the orchards and apparently what they produced and financially. And that is that when we went to East Africa with our World Board and I had a baby three months after we got into Tanzania, they had to... they flew over to visit their new granddaughter. And I remember Monroe Hawley saying that he did that because he had a good apple crop. So that was an apple trip financed by the apple crop. And then when we moved up six years later to Nairobi, they decided to come again and he said that was a plum trip. EH: Oh, that's right. I had forgotten that! [Laughter] PK: Did you hear echoes of that rhythm from other families? I'll give you an example, but I'm wondering if… well, let me tell you the example and you can tell me whether you have other examples. I interviewed Barbara Bull and Barbara Bull, as you know, is an alumna of Mount Holyoke College. Her younger sister is an alumna of I don't know what, but at any rate, it’s not one of the seven sisters. And I said to Barbara, I said, “your sister is a brilliant pediatrician, I believe. Now, how come you went to Mount Holyoke and she went to some state school?” And Barbara's answer, just like that, was: “because we had a very good cherry crop the year I went to college.” And you're echoing that. GH: Uh huh. PK: Do you find that with other picker families, excuse me, other grower families, too? That, of course, your income is so totally dependent on the weather and other things you can't control that there must be an enormous variation from year to year. EH: Yeah. PK: Whether you can go to East Africa or wherever. GH: Yes, they make two trips over. He also went to horticultural meetings in England - Monroe did. PK: And were those on the years that there were good crops? GH: I expect they would have been, but I don't know. And the horticulturalist from England that he met there came and visited the Hawley Nurseries here. PK: Really? GH: In fact, you're still in touch... EH: Well, Duane is, anyway, with one of the families because they’ve had kids come over and work on the farm. The man that Dad knew was the editor of a gardener magazine in England. Thought I would have the name of it come to mind, but it didn't. And so, I think he had come to the States first and 26 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department somehow met Dad at a meeting. And then they got to corresponding and so that got quite to be back and forth and went on to the next generation. That's the son of the man that my Dad knew that Joann keeps in touch with and who we've been over to visit and had their kids come over or a kid come over and spend the summer working on the farm. GH: So, there's an international exchange that goes on. PK: I thought I was all done, but I guess I'm not because each of you and Gretchen have just touched on something that surprised me very much. I’m, as you know, I'm only a summer person here, but I was brought up on the shore of Lake Michigan in Ottawa County at Port Sheldon. And I expected when I bought my cottage thirty-two years ago, and I expected when I bought it, that the citizens of Oceana County would be people whose worlds were very small, very circumscribed by just the local environment. And I was surprised the very first year and have been surprised ever since repeatedly by the breadth of connections in the world of people in Oceana County. And do you think… have you just told me what the answer to this dilemma in my mind is? That it's because of commercial and agricultural missions and visits, do you think that’s what really is essentially behind it? GH: And going to conferences over in England and all. And I remember Monroe saying none of the apple varieties in England were what he grew here. They were all different. PK: Well, you probably noticed that there is an unusual - I think it's unusually high - student exchange between families in Oceana County and families abroad. Is this part of… do you think that this mood for wanting such exchanges was set by these earlier...? GH: I don't know. PK: And of course, I don't know whether it's higher than it is in other countries in Michigan now, because I left Michigan when I was sixteen years old and didn't come back until I was seventy, so… [laughter]. GH: Oh, my. PK: I don’t know what’s happened in the meantime. GH: I remember when - I don't remember the year, but - when the cherry pickers first… the picking machines first came in, that Monroe, very excitingly, had us watch how they operated. EH: The shakers. GH: The shakers... that picked all the cherries at once. Not the sweets, they still had to pick the sweets by hand. Is that right? EH: Yeah. GH: But the tarts, they could use the shakers and they’d come down in a curtain of red down to a canvas. NS: Was he happy with how it worked? 27 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department GH: Well, the old orchards, when the trees would be shaking, the old branches would go flying. You had to be careful not to get hit. But now they're planting the orchards and with shakers in mind because that's what they use. And so, you don't have the old twigs hitting you on the head when they use them. And of course, the trees now are much shorter than they were. And they had three-legged ladders that the pickers used. And you can still see some of those around because they could fit under the tree. They had the regular ladder with a third leg. PK: Are those sweet cherries still picked by hand? Even now? GH: I don't know, are they? EH: I think so, but I'm not sure about that. GH: Well, during the last few years, didn't you and your sister have to pick cherries and leave the stems on because he got more money for them if they were on the stem? EH: Yeah, that's true. GH: Yeah. NS: I guess one of the questions that was on there, too, that some of what you had said does remind me of, I wonder if we might get to it a little bit, is your dad and some of the other people went to meet with other horticulturalists, maybe trade varieties or talk about different techniques or even find out about the cherry picker machine shaker thing. Did they participate in different organizations that were for nurserymen or growers or farmers? EH: There’s a Michigan Horticultural Society that meets every December and usually in Grand Rapids, I think, maybe in other places. And Dad was always active in that. And he and my mother would plan to go down to Grand Rapids. We had, well, my sister, Ruthie, was down there anyway, so they had a place to stay. And they would spend those three days in Grand Rapids for the Horticultural Society meeting. And Dad was the one who went to the meetings, and my mother and Ruthie did whatever they wanted to do. I'm going to mention one more thing that's on my list, and it's not really very direct, but we would... because the nursery actually had a southern branch that my uncle, Ed - all of his side of the family called him Harry, I never quite figured out why - he was Uncle Ed to all of us, but he was Grandfather Harry on that side. But anyway, his wife, I was a little embarrassed when we would go down because Uncle Ed would have some areas for budding patches and we would go down to spend maybe four or five days in his budding patches. And it was always an adventure because he’d put us all in the back of the truck and, of course, no seatbelts or anything and then drive madly down these country roads to where we were going to be working that day. PK: Where was that? In southern Michigan? EH: Fennville. PK: Oh. EH: He, actually, his... PK: You mentioned Ganges. 28 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: Well, originally Ganges is where our family came from. PK: That's right on the lake, isn’t it? EH: Right on the lake, that's right. In fact, Dad showed me the house once that I think I remember correctly. There was a river or big creek or something that empties into Lake Michigan and just on the south side of that creek is the house he said is the family house, but I don't know if I could go back and find it. PK: I hope that house is still in the family because lakefront property at that latitude is worth an awful lot of money. [Laughter] EH: We have kind of shirttail relatives who live in a house in Douglas County that is south of where the road got washed out many, many years ago. But they don’t have lakeshore property, but they are part of a common area of homes that do have access to Lake Michigan. And they're trying to sell their house now, and even though the lake is so high and there's so much erosion, just the fact that they're hoping to visit us next month. And he's a very skilled jazz musician. PK: Oh, wonderful. EH: But they're trying to sell their house and it's tied to the fact that there is this lake access, even though it's down a lot of steps to get there. NS: So, what you wanted to tell us about going to the farm in Fennville? EH: Oh, yeah. The connection is that Uncle Ed's wife was a Plummer - her family name was Plummer. And I didn't know that until later. I had stayed with her, but what her maiden name was never came up. And when I finally learned it, I realized that I lived in a co-op house at Michigan State and one of the other members of that co-op house was also a Plummer and probably we had some kind of an indirect connection there with the two families. But then Charlie Spencer was [inaudible] but Uncle Ed's grandson still was when he was living. And he died maybe fifteen years ago, so fairly recently, and his second wife had land on the west side of Fennville. The train to Grand Rapids goes through his land, basically, by Fennville. And so, he had that connection and we had stopped to see him, at that time we were in Chicago and driving back and forth and stopped to see Charlie. He always wanted me to meet his wife's daughter, Ginny, who we would never quite stay long enough. He’d tell her to come. But she's the one now we’re going to be meeting on the Fifth of July, when they head up to a jazz event up in Leelanau County and they’ll come by to see us. PK: Excuse me, see you later. NS: Yes, I think we might be wrapping this up here. EH: Yeah, well… NS: I’ve tired you… we’ve tired you both out, I think maybe. [Laughter] Thank you. GH: ...quite far afield. 29 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department EH: Oh, I did… I copied out and these are from the book and not the memorial society. This page and a little bit here are the Hawley… and there was one strange… I may try to talk to Walter about this, because it gives my grandmother's maiden name as Render. NS: Mm hmm. EH: But it was actually Bender. NS: Oh, it's not correct. EH: So, somebody couldn’t read somebody’s writing, obviously. NS: That happens sometimes. EH: In fact, it goes on here later to talk about her brother, Jim, and calls his name Bender. GH: Are you leaving that with her? EH: No. NS: Well, let's go over to the place where they have the scanning machine. EH: Okay. NS: And we can talk to the woman who might know about the copyright thing you said earlier and see what they have to say. EH: Okay. NS: I don't know, but I'm going to make sure I'm not supposed to say anything at the end. NS: Thank you both for your time. I’m supposed to say… GH: He's so excited about doing this. NS: Oh, thank you. I'm supposed to say, officially, this concludes the interview. EH: Okay. 30 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/a8c8a7bd816438fe21727bff5eccef2b.mp3 f25b14434abd191b9ea0af332a1f4d17 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Hawley_Edward_and_Gretchen Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Hawley, Edward Hawley, Gretchen Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Hawley, Edward and Gretchen (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Edward A. Hawley and Gretchen Hawley. Interviewed by Nora Salas and Paul Kutsche on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Edward Adair Hawley was born in Hart Township, Michigan in 1923. He graduated from Hart High School in 1941, followed by Michigan State University in 1944, and a joint degree from Chicago Theological Seminary and the University of Chicago in 1949. Edward married his wife, Gretchen Hahn Hawley, in 1958 and was a part of the family business known as Hawley Nursery, which played an important role in the agricultural heritage of Oceana County and was responsible for producing a high percentage of all the fruit trees in the county and the west shore of Lake Michigan. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Salas, Nora (interviewer) Kutsche, Paul (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Fruit growers Nursery growers Michigan State University Chicago Theological Seminary University of Chicago Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4d45004f5d39d1d2ac503ca35680bb03.pdf c3eae841389cc2cb653aef9182731e47 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Carl Fuehring Interview Interviewed by Alan Moul June 18, 2016 Transcript AM: This is Alan Moul and I'm here with Carl Fuehring. Carl, I’m going to ask you to spell your name. CF: Alright. Last name is spelled F-u-e-h-r-i-n-g. AM: And today is? CF: The eighteenth. AM: The eighteenth of June 2016. This is an oral history project being collected with a grant from Grand Valley. It's called the Growing Community Project. It's about Oceana's agricultural history, growing and migrants and the whole works. And I'm glad Carl is here today. He's going to tell us about what he remembers and knows about his operation, his family and Mears, Michigan, and we'll go from there. So, Carl, start us out with how you guys got here and what you remember. CF: Alright. Well, Al, thank you very much for inviting me to this program. I think it's important for the future generations to have an idea of where the ancestry of our county came from. My parents met and were married in Chicago after the war, the Second World War. My mother escaped Nazi Germany and was brought over by the underground. And my father and his parents were born here in Chicago. Anyway, the story goes that my grandparents always wanted to be farmers, and so he weaseled and wiggled and connived with some of the other people in downtown Chicago because he was a maître d’ at a hotel to get a piece of property in. And the first property he got was in northwestern Wisconsin and they went up there and darn near froze to death as well as starved because it was pretty barren. So, he came back to Chicago and complained to the realtor. The realtor says, I'll trade you sight unseen for a piece of property on Crystal Lake in Hart Township here in Oceana County. So, by train, they moved their belongings up, hired a team of mules as the story goes, and they dragged their meager belongings out to a ramshackle house that was on Crystal Lake. They didn't have any farm to speak of at that time. It was a sandy, weed-infested corner of the earth. Well, Dad - my father, Rudolf - started the farm with picking strawberries and he had down in a wet area because he didn't have irrigation. You’ve got to realize this is back in the ‘30s. He had strawberries and he picked strawberries and peddled them to Hart. And as they say, that’s the rest of the story. From then on, my father and his brother, who was in the Merchant Marines, eked out a living doing strawberries, some cherries, some apples and some pears. My Uncle Carl was a good builder, house builder, and so he decided that that would be a way for him and he left the farm and moved to the Shelby / Stony Lake area. My father and mother, whose name was Margaret, proceeded then to develop some cherry orchards. In the meantime, things were tough. And my dad, as well as a neighbor who lived at Crystal Lake by the name of Eugene Cooney, got into cutting Christmas trees and they would go up to the Manistee National Forest and cut the ends off the big tall trees and bring them back, hang them out in our garage, my father's garage, and my mother would decorate them with tin foil and so forth. And I remember as a little kid in the Willy’s Jeep taking twenty-five of these trees to Grand Rapids or Muskegon for fifty cents apiece, selling decorated Christmas trees. So that is how Rudy and Eugene got started in the Christmas tree business. They realized there was a market for domesticated trees, so the 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department two of them started planting Christmas trees. So now we've got cherries. They had a few apples and Christmas trees. And that was the mainstay of the operation that started. AM: Can I stop you really quick? CF: Yep, please. AM: Were they the first in the state to do the Christmas trees? CF: Yes. AM: OK. CF: Those two guys were the first to start that. And Dad was the first president in the Christmas Tree Growers Association. And it was pretty simplistic back then. Nothing as sophisticated as we have today. Obviously, today's problem is that the artificial tree is decimating the live tree business. Well, Rudy amassed a lot of acres, almost fifteen hundred acres at one time because it took a lot of acres for Christmas trees. In the meantime, he also developed, as well as his neighbors, who your grandparents and your parents did in around the Crystal Lake area. This is in Hart Township, cherries. And we started the cherry business, I can remember as a kid harvesting them with a group called the “Braceros.” And the government allowed these Mexicans and many of them were Indians to come in and help pick, hardworking. And the only thing that I distinctly remember that was the fun part since I was a little kid is we didn't have what today's worldview and I have housing for our people. They had tents, army surplus tents, and we had a city. AM: This would have been in the late ‘50s maybe or early ‘60s? CF: Yeah, it would be in the ‘50s. AM: OK. CF: Yeah, I was pre-teen then. Yes. And I didn't know that these kids were Mexicans or Braceros or whatever they were. We just had a good time. And from early morning to late at night, we hung out. No shoes, a pair of shorts, short shorts, and no shirt. And we ate together and we had a good time. Things started to change in the labor business at that time. And we got labor then from Louisiana. And I don't know, Al, if your folks did or not, these were all Blacks coming up here. And that was the first time in my life that I realized there were different races and we had these different races, different ethnic backgrounds, different work abilities put in our field at the same time. An education, as you and I both handled buckets and pails and ladders and all the things that were required back then. Plus, one picked good branches off a tree and the other one… oh yeah, it was an education. We’ll leave it at that about. The next part that I remember on tart cherries happened behind my father's shop and a guy by the name of Friday, what was his first name? Dave? Powell? AM: Down southern Michigan? CF: Down southern Michigan, had developed a limb shaker. Well, Dr. Monger had... AM: Was it Paul Friday? CF: Could have been Paul Friday… sounds like it. Anyway, he had developed a mechanical means of shaking the cherries off the trees. And the first shakers were nothing more than this mechanical arm 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department attached to a tractor and it would grab a limb and shake it violently. And they had tarps and totes or something under a tree… AM: Wooden boxes? CF: Wooden boxes that they collected them in. I know Russ Robbins ran it the first year and it completely demolished the tractor and he lost - I don't know how many - pounds of weight because this thing just vibrated. Well, the outfit that Friday had brought up to our farm was self-propelled, which meant that he had cobbled up a couple axles off of a Chrysler or something. And the canvas was... it was all mounted on these - how do I put it politely - contraptions? AM and CF: [Laughter] AM: Were these the incline catch frames? CF: The Friday incline… yes. AM: OK. CF: With the Friday Limb Shaker, the Friday Girdler. And it was a matter of about three years or four years and everybody that had one was losing their orchards because it girdled the branches. And we didn't know that at the time. But the thing that bothered - or not bothered, but I remember about the whole thing - was we were harvesting cherries with this new machine right alongside the people that were picking by hand. And I can distinctly remember seeing them in the trees, watching this go by them, and that was the end of their way of life. AM: Yeah. CF: Yeah, it was kind of surprising. Today, it means more to me than it did back then. AM: Did you ever hear of any vandalism of machines? I know I heard of a few, maybe the one year, and then after that it was kind of all over. CF: Yeah, and it was a sporadic thing that happened. Some of the crews were… well, that was the end of their income, you know? AM: Sure, sure. CF: And that's how they picked. Today, we still have handpicked fruit and handpicked asparagus. I don't know how much longer it's going to be with the advent now of the new minimum wage. If anybody's done any simple math, it's humanly impossible to do a piece rate and make minimum wage. So, the next advent after that was all of us, including your folks, we got the new trunk shaker and that was another mechanical device. And now, matter of fact, we're back to the incline plane again. The... I don't know if it's a better idea, but the salesman thought so. [Laughter] So we harvest the cherries. Asparagus… I started planting asparagus when I was a teenager, single bottom plow. Martha Washington crowns produced a good, sweet, big asparagus, but today's marketers want a standardized spear. We have most of our acreage in asparagus, but the biggest issue we have, as well as your farm and all the other neighbors in our neighborhood - what's going to happen harvest-wise with the labor situation? Twenty years from now, it's going to be interesting if they even still have asparagus here in this country. So those two and Christmas trees. The Christmas tree that we started with was the Scotch Pine, and it was a very reasonably priced, fast-growing tree, not a lot of shipping required, but as America grew and got a 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department little more tasteful and demands, they wanted the trees sheared and that's a way of shaping a tree. And as a youngster, I remember having a pair of huge scissors that we'd cut the tree, which took a lot of effort. So, they had to come up with a different way. And a neighbor of ours thought that maybe a good sharp knife would work. Well, he went and bought some butcher knives. Now, these are these five- and ten-pound meat cleavers, will scare the bejeebers out of you! AM: Take your leg off! [Laughter] CF: Well, as you swung that baby, you couldn't stop it and down she'd come. We knew almost instantly that it did a beautiful job, but it would kill somebody or cut their leg off. So, the next thing we came to was a beef carving knife. And most of them came from Germany, had good steel, was flexible. You could still buy the same brand a knife today. They're about fifty bucks a piece now, but that's what we shear with. In today's world, everybody has automatic equipment and we are using, just like you do around your house. It's like a weed whacker, except instead of a string on the end of it, we have a square metal blade and they can very successfully shear a Pine tree. And a quarter of the time they can with a knife, they have a better perspective because they're standing away from it. And guess what? They don't cut their knees all to heck. [Laughter] So, anyway. AM: Which makes OSHA happy. [Laughter] CF: Well, God help us. AM: We don’t want to get into that. [Laughter] CF: We try to avoid MIOSHA or OSHA or we try to keep the guys as safe as possible and we do use leg irons, which is a piece of tin wrapped in canvas that they carry on their leg in case they slip and whack themselves. But I could show you twelve stitches over here that I got. So anyway, that gives a brief overview of what our family's farm did as well as the whole neighborhood. Why don't we just stop for a brief second here and… Alright, we took a little break there. The next section that we talk about is how our farm evolved and got all this work done labor-wise. When I was a youngster around the house, we had chores to do, no livestock, but we had chores to do around the home. But the two of us, I had one brother, and it was the deal that we could get our homework done and then we could go out and play. And God forbid, if my grandkids do it at the age of seven and eight, we were driving a tractor, not exactly safety-approved tractors. And all your folks and we had hand clutches, mechanical springs, a seat that was a stamped-out piece of metal, hot, terribly hot, dirty, dusty. But guess what? It got the job done. So as a youngster, I grew up watching other teenagers and young adults work on the farm. And when I came back from Michigan State, I went and got my degree and I thought… AM: In horticulture? CF: No, I never took an Ag. [agriculture] class the whole time I was down there. AM: OK. CF: I really wanted to get away from it and get into something else. And I decided to go into Administration Teaching and School Administration. So, I'll just give you a little quick synopsis on how I got from that to farming and then I'll get back to the labor. My father died when he was ninety-three, 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department when he was in his late fifties and I was just back from Michigan State and I had a comfortable job. I was a school administrator. We had a young family. It was Christmas. And my dad said, “What do you plan on doing in the future?” And I said, “Well, we're teaching and I've got a good career there.” And he says, “I'd like to retire.” He says, “Why don't you come back and work for me a couple of years?” Well, I was mid-twenties and he lived another forty years and I still work him. [Laughter] AM: [Laughter] CF: I don't know if he ever thought that he was supposed to retire in there. That generation of my dad and Burmeisters and Brandles and the Trommaters and the O'Reilley; once they were in it, they farmed until they died. Well, the other story on labor might be a little more interesting: is since I was young, energetic, I knew a lot of other young people in the area and most of them were about ten, twelve years younger than I was. But they needed jobs. Back in those days, there wasn't that many McDonald's or city jobs that we had around here, and most of the kids wanted to earn something that would give them some money, as well as that they would be able to see the practical purpose, because that was about the only industry we had in the area was Ag. related. So, we had over a period of time and I looked back on this between two and three hundred teenagers, and I've got their names and all the hours they were… AM: The old check stubs? CF: The old check stubs... that worked for us and these guys would come out after school, just like you did with your family. There was about eight of them that I can remember very distinctly, and we would pick - from three thirty until dark, if had to - asparagus fields. Twenty-five… never give it a blink. If I asked my grandson today to go pick asparagus, he's not a laborer. He just drives equipment, so. But we did everything: we planted the asparagus, we planted Christmas trees. This mechanical device, the shaker that we had, we shook the trees with that. We thought we were pretty hot stuff. It was a team effort. I don't know, Al, how many you had, but in our group with one roll out, we were, I think, about eight or ten guys and we ended up putting mattresses in the barn because we would start at five, fivethirty. And for them, most of them didn't have a driver's license. So, they, at night, the folks would take them home or somebody would take them home. They would shower and eat. And pretty soon they would all wander back and dead tired. So, we'd sleep there and I'd go down and wake them up. About seven, seven thirty, my wife would have amassed a huge breakfast and everybody ate; it didn't matter what you had, you ate. And then we worked the full day, maybe nine o'clock at night and started it all over. Did this for three weeks straight. But everything, Christmas trees, were all harvested with these young guys. Your neighbor, Mark, he worked; Rich De Ridder. [?] AM: If I remember right, you developed a real sense of camaraderie doing it, too. I mean, the guys were kind of like a team. CF: It was; it was a team. And I know that my son and his friend, Tim Tubbs, nobody could beat the Tubbs. That was just the way it was. Well, there was several days there that one summer that we were getting a hundred tanks in eight hours. And Dwight would go right over and tell him Tim, you know, yeah talk about… [laughter]. AM: Now, we’ve got to get a hundred and one, right? 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department CF: You guys are slackers. [Laughter] But everything was done until about, I would say, two thousand five or six. And pretty soon there just wasn't any high school kids. Not that they weren't available. It's just there was other jobs opened up. We have this huge resort area here. Why do you want to go out and drag a tarp when you can stand out at a concession stand with cute little girls and air conditioning and pop; it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out. [Laughter] AM: [Laughter] That's genetics, man. AM and CF: [Laughter] CF: Yeah, well, that's why we only have Hispanics working on our farm. And I would dare say that the younger generation is really missing out on the training. I have had… two years ago, I had the example, we went to a family wedding and this young man came up to me, now he's pushing fifty? And he said, “Mr. Fuehring” and I looked at him, I says, “What do you mean, Mr. Fuehring? That's my dad.” Well, he said, “You don't remember me, I'm Kurt.” I says, “Okay, it's been a while.” Well, he’d moved to California and he said he just couldn't handle it, staying home here anymore. There was really no jobs for him. So, he went to California and his first day out there, he got a job as a laborer digging a trench for underground gas lines. And he said, “I started that early morning and by noon I was in charge of the crew.” And he said, “Two weeks later, I was a foreman on that crew.” And today he's got several of these units that he directs. And he brought his son here from California who was a teenager, just like he was when he worked for me. And he says, “I want you to meet the guy that showed me how to work.” And Al, you know, this is a fact. You've got many relations and many friends and you worked all different kinds of businesses. These young men and women, anywhere they went they were successful because they worked on these farms. They knew how if something had fallen down or broken or tripped or... grab it, fix it, do it. Don't stand there. I feel, like I said, kind of sorry for the next generation. They have no incentive, so grab a kid and put them to work. [Laughter] AM: Yeah, exactly. CF: …if they could. I’ve got to tell you a little short story here. I'm starting to bore everybody. I had a neighbor, Mike Fenton, great kid, strong as an ox, and the guy could do anything. Well, he had two friends. One of them now works for the United States government in some military capacity, and the other one works here in the state. And they were both very, very sharp young men in computers. Well, I hollered at the two of them in the shop one day to change the tire on a baler. This is an outfit that wraps Christmas trees. And a few minutes later, I came out of the office and here they are on their hands and knees, laying alongside this thing, looking at this machine. Well, Mike came walking in. And I said, Mikey, show those two Einsteins how to change a tire. You know, they could write a computer program. So, Mike showed the boys how it's a simple thing, changing a tire, you know. AM: They wanted to redesign the tire... CF: Redesign, reinvent the wheel - you bet. CF: Well, what we've got a tangent on here is old versus... ways and new ways of horticultural practices. And what we had talking about briefly with the microphone off was what varieties are coming up in like Christmas trees or fruit and so forth, and the costs, different costs of putting them in. We'll start with the last one that Al and I were talking about, Christmas trees. In today's world, it's very difficult to sell fresh Christmas trees. The costs have increased because our input costs have increased. But the 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department American public is extremely fussy and they're not tolerant of new ways in trees. One of them is that they want the newest, the best, the fanciest, the cutest. And that would be the Fraser fir, which was developed in North Carolina to try and compete with our Douglas fir. We have two varieties of the Douglas fir: the regular [?] and then the white Concolor fir and we can grow them around here, but they require a huge amount of hand labor. Now, the Concolor fir, Noble fir in Europe, they - the public in Europe, Germany, France and so forth - do not have a tree, a sheared tree, it's a wild tree. And I've seen this several times. I was taking lots of pictures when I was over there trying to show my customers they don't need to shear them. They have a very natural tree. Here in the United States, there's a few markets that people will sell us out of a thousand trees, maybe ten or twelve naturals, but they've got to have this cone shape. To get a tree started today in the ground, anywhere from 15 cents to 50 cents to plant it. And then on a Douglas fir, you've probably got ten or twelve years before you could even harvest. In that time, you've got shearing, you've got to keep the bugs away, you've got fertilizer. It's very expensive. And the return is diminished because the popularity of live tree. We're going through a change here; we've got to have the artificial tree and they are gorgeous. And you've got to realize both spouses are working. They leave the house in the morning. If they have children, those are gone. Nobody's there to water the tree. When they come home at night, they have to prepare a meal. And if they then had to go pick up pine needles or water a tree, pretty soon this is just way too much work and there's a lot of allergies with them. So, I'm not trying to not sell Christmas trees, but it's a fact of life. Now, back to what you and I do the best is planting fruit trees. And we were looking at a picture here that's going to be in this that his grandfather had when I first started and I'm not as old as his grandfather was when this picture was drawn. We would measure... physically measure out an orchard and plot it and steak. If we had a thousand trees, we had a thousand stakes in that orchard where every tree went. And then they would, originally, with these high school kids, I went out and the first job we would do and it would take a week to do it on that one block by my house, is we physically dug the holes. We didn't have a mechanical auger. That was a big invention or improvement, I should say, as we'd go out and dig those. Today... AM: Until you hit a rock. CF: Until you hit rock and then you had to dig everything out. Yeah, and then what are you going to do because this rock is huge and that's where a tree's supposed to be. In today's world, you pick out where you want your first row at the distance apart from each other. And I don't know how to do it, my grandson does. You program this into this computer and the tractor drives a straight row. We can plant four thousand trees in eight hours easy. And I think they're in better than the other way. Varieties, now you get into the fun, you want them blue, green, yellow, white, every apple. How many would you guess varieties you could have? A couple of hundred? AM: Easy. CF: Yeah. With all the different rootstocks. It's the same with cherries; not so many, but we've got choices of rootstocks. You got an investment, I'm going to throw some numbers out, you tell me how far off I am. On a regular tart cherry, in today's world, by the time I get it in the ground and this is a five eighths inch diameter tree with a wrap on it. I've got ten bucks into that tree. Is that about right? AM: I would say. 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department CF: Alright, now the good stuff starts. [Laughter] You’ve got to - and I haven't until I saw the results that my neighbor was doing - you’ve got to put irrigation in. The mechanical part of irrigation is a dollar a tree. If you couldn't get away with it. What really kicked me down was it had to be done, but I guess the way I did it was kind of dumb, is I told the guy to drill a well and I got the bill after it was in. [Laughter] Oh, mercy. This is not my grandfather's two inch well. [Laughter] Yeah, very high tech. So, you've got another thirty, forty thousand dollars. Now on these high-density apples that your neighbor and my neighbor has put in, you can have twenty-five, thirty thousand dollars I think in an acre of just the trees. Then you've got the irrigation, the trellis, deer fence. I think [?] block out here, I think that fifteen acres was almost four hundred and fifty thousand dollars. AM: Those are the... CF: SweeTangos. AM: SweeTangos. CF: Yeah. AM: You know… CF: That’s a lot of [?]. AM: Well, and that's a big, big risk. And we've seen it go south and there goes your... well, it takes the money away from other stuff that's making money and pretty soon you’re… CF: Yeah, and we haven't talked about the tractor, the special little tractor, because you can't have a regular size orchard tractor, you've got to get one of those. And that with a cab is about what, sixty-four thousand, if I remember right. The sprayer... Mark just got a PTO sprayer to fit down that and that's thirty-five thousand. The engine drive, the same thing is seventy-two grand. And we haven't got an apple one yet. Yeah. AM: I used to get a kick out of the neighbors who weren't in farming, many of them were then, but now they see your truck go around the corner with fourteen tanks of cherries and they've seen the paper and it says they’re thirty-five cents a pound this year and they know there’s a thousand pounds in the tank and they think, man alive, there goes fifteen grand of cherries. CF: You rich farmers. Yeah. That's all. And they've got this all figured out before you even talk with them how much you've made on this thing. But they have no concept of the eight years that that cherry tree is in the ground before you can shake one cherry. Every year it's got to get fed fertilizer. It's got to get pruned. It's got to be sprayed. That's what we're just finishing now. AM: What would you tell somebody that wants to get into farming? A young person that maybe is a sharp business person, hardworking, but thinks they want to farm. What would you tell them? Could you even do it or what would you tell them? CF: Marry the boss's daughter. [Laughter] Well, you know, that's a very legitimate good question. And it would be very pertinent to this thing that's going on today. First off, I don't believe if this person were... let's start over. If this person was not connected, family-wise or marriage-wise, to somebody in an existing farm, the chances of that person getting into or succeeding would be zero or less. The purchasing of the property, first of all, is one or renting or leasing it; if it was profitable, that farm, the 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department payments, depending upon the year, you probably couldn't make payments just off of that farm, you have to have some other collateral. Equipment, I'm going to say something, Alan, you throw your sense in there. Without being a spendthrift and having to buy all brand-new stuff, just to go in and get stuff that's operating and not junk. I don't know if you could do it for under a million dollars. Tractor, sprayer...a cab tractor today and a sprayer engine drive is a hundred and fifty thousand dollars. Mower twenty thousand. The trucks, the wells, everything. AM: The harvester that sits there eleven months out of the year. CF: Yeah. [Laughter] That's kind of discouraging to the young person. They had a program and I don't know if Michigan State still has it or not. But they used to have a program for that person that was not a son or grandson or had an uncle or something, that they would team up with elderly or older farmers that would like to retire but don't have any way of transitioning this farm. This is what, Fred, how Fred got started with the farmer north of Hart, because he was from Hart. He didn't have anything to do with farming. AM: Fred Tubbs? CF: Fred Tubbs. AM: Really. CF: And he - and I don't know the farmer's name - he was well known and he befriended Fred. And Fred was a very strong, willing guy and he was a quick learner. But… AM: I think more of this is going to have to happen. I talked to Brad, who's connected with going out and procuring fruit. And one of the questions that was given to him was ask the growers how they are going to pass down their farms and who's even interested in farming coming up. And I think he told me almost 50 percent have no one coming up or to transfer to. What's going to happen? Big concern here. CF: Yeah, there’s two avenues for these farmers: sell out to a neighbor and that guy gets bigger and bigger, bigger, which is what my neighbor is doing. He's got three sons, I guess, and they've tripled in size. A normal man, that was a one-horse operation. Yeah, you have basically two choices: either sell out to somebody or have somebody come in that you could work with. It's a huge undertaking on both parts because the older man, that's his retirement. And if the young farmer can have a successful operation and give him some payments, but if you have a bad year or let's say the guy is - how do I put this nicely? He's not attentive to what he's doing and he blows a crop. Now they're both out and this elderly man would have a huge financial risk at hand. Yeah, it would be very tough. I don't know if the other interviewees would be given that question, but I think that would be interesting to see what other kind of answers you get. AM: Yeah. What do you think about the - this is shifting gears here - the quality of the land itself? Now, I've seen a lot of pictures in the past. The trees were bigger. Are we depleting our soil or do you think we're doing a pretty good job of being a husband and, you know, of keeping it… passing along in good shape? CF: Most of the young commercial farmers, I think, are extremely attentive to what they're doing. There are a few farms in the area within a few miles that lack the husbandry; they just haven't fertilized, they are depleting it. Yeah, you can drive by and the leaves are going, yeah. Yes, there is problems on certain 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department things. Most, in today's world with the pressure of watching out for what's going on. I have this asparagus tour to think about and they come up and that is just about the second or third question every time. What are you doing to the soil? Are you putting on pesticides? What kind of fertilizers are using? What are you doing for safety? Fifteen years ago, nobody would have even thought about it. But in today's world, if you as a farmer aren't paying attention to what you have, boy, you're in deep trouble. I don't see how you can't. AM: It's almost difficult to get loans and get financing if you're not doing good practices, too, isn't it? I mean, they’ve pretty well got you locked in now. CF: Oh, yeah. I just keep telling the guy from the bank any time he wants to come out, I got a cushion for him to sit on the picker. [Laughter] AM: [Laughter] Well, I'll speak just for real briefly. We'll wrap this up. CF: Alright, Sir. AM: What do you think in general about farming life? You know, there's a lot of different ways to be raised, to be brought up. I've got my own feeling on it. But what do you think about the rural life and being brought up on a farm? What's it done for you? And what do you… what are the strengths to it? CF: Well, that's about a six-hour discussion. [Laughter] You know, at my age, and I'm a tad older than you are. AM: Tell me how old you are. CF: I'm seventy-three. AM: OK. CF: And I have had a good life, I've had the opportunity to live in the city, I've had an opportunity to work in a city, I had the free choice to make decisions, what I wanted to do. I am very thankful at the life that I have had and that I have chosen. You're, no matter what, you're always envious of some friends that have done something different. And I wished that I would have had the opportunity to do some other things, not different careers, but just some other opportunities. But just like you, Al, we picked and choosed and we did and stuck with it. For me and my personal lifestyle, I really enjoy the rural area, but it is a lifestyle. You have to realize that when there has to be something done, you do it. And if there's a party in Muskegon or somewhere else and you have to get a spray on, that's just tough. I don't know if the younger generation realizes that because everything we do, we see the direct results. AM: You’ve got skin in the game, CF: You got skin in the game. The mentality of the rural people - and I deal with this all the time because I'm on a township board - a lot more common sense, down to earth, and I think they are closely related to what God gives you, God can take away and we’ve got to watch what we've got. They don't fritter away life's things; they enjoy it. It's just, my wife and I were discussing the other day the lightning storm that came in. We turned all the lights off and we sat for an hour and a half watching the lightning storm. I have some other friends that we talked to and my God, they were just having a canary because of this lightning and they couldn't go out and the TV wasn't working. And I'm thinking, you know, that's one of the pleasures that you have going out on the patio and just no TV, no radio, just listening to it rain. Now, 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department maybe I'm committable. I don't know, probably depending on who you're talking to, but those are pleasures that you get from appreciating the lifestyle... AM: Yep. CF: ...we’re in and where we are. AM: We're blessed. CF: We sure are. Well, Al, I really want to thank you for stopping by the other day and inviting me. This has been a pleasure. AM: Thank you, for sharing. I think future generations are going to enjoy listening to this and shaking their heads and laughing at the old guys anyway. [Laughter] CF: [Laughter] Well, you're not old, but it's always been a pleasure talking with you. AM: Okay, this is Al Moul. I don't know if I even said that in the beginning of doing the interview. And this is my neighbor, Carl Fuehring, and I appreciate him coming in. So, thanks, Carl. CF: Thank you. 11 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4b572b97806912d780f8216d02d73985.mp3 395e70734a0c2fbd0834fe0536331aac Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Fuehring_Carl Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Fuehring, Carl Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Fuehring, Carl (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Carl Fuehring. Interviewed by Alan Moul on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Carl Fuehring was born into a fruit and Christmas tree growing family in the Crystal Lake area of Hart, Michigan. He spent his youth helping around the farm and later went on to study Administration Teaching and School Administration at Michigan State University. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Moul, Alan (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Fruit growers Christmas tree growing Michigan State University Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/944be5d9d5b24b7a826ff449d3b1fffb.pdf 7645257c4b9ecb261a34ba25a5fcc804 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Ralph Dold Interview Interviewed by Walter Urick & Kimberly McKee June 18, 2016 Transcript KM: We're all set. WU: My name is Walter Urick and I'm here with Dr. Kim McKee. We're here today on this June 18th, 2016, in the city of Hart Community Center at Hart, Michigan, for the purposes of obtaining the oral history of the Ralph Dold family. And obviously, Ralph is present today. And this oral history is being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. Ralph, I want to thank you for taking the time to visit with Dr. Kim and myself today. We're both interested to learn more about your family history, your experiences living and working in Oceana County. And so, we'll start out with some easy questions and we'll work from there. First, when and where were you born? RD: I was born in Detroit in 1931. WU: The exact date of your birth is? RD: November 13th, Friday. That's what started the… [laughter]. 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: [Laughter] Friday, the 13th. Well, tell me a little bit about your parents, their names? RD: I had real good parents. Frank Xavier didn't like that middle name. Frank was my father and Magdalena was my mother. They both came from Illinois. Father was a carpenter and of course, from [?] farming. He grew up on a farm and my mother grew up on a farm. My dad was a first-generation immigrant and my mother about the second generation. WU: From, what...? RD: Germany. WU: All right. RD: There's a clutch of Dolds in Freiburg, Germany. WU: Really, the Black Forest area? RD: [Laughter] Yeah. WU: Very familiar with it. RD: My [?] owns the brewery. WU: We have relatives in the Black Forest. So, your dad and mom were first generation Americans? RD: My dad was first generation, my mother the second generation. WU: Now, apparently you were born in Detroit. RD: Born in Detroit, East Side. WU: And your dad was a carpenter? RD: Yeah. Except at that time there wasn't much building going on because we had a phenomenon: The Depression. WU: Right. What about your mom? Was she working outside the house? RD: No, she never did that part. Dad thought that was not proper. Figured if you had to have your wife work, you were a poor excuse for a man. [Laughter] WU: Did you have any siblings? RD: Yeah, I have a sister who is still alive and two brothers. One brother died last year. Ninety-four. My sister is ninety-three now and still going strong. So, we're long livers. And one brother died of a heart attack fifteen years ago, so. WU: Well… RD: Detroit, that was a nice place when we lived there. I mean, it turned into a high crime area later, but... and now it's turning into a brownfield, about everything was torn down. WU: Well, I want to talk about your childhood or try to get you to talk about your childhood a little bit. Were you raised in Detroit? 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department RD: Yeah, up until nineteen forty-six I lived in Detroit. WU: So that would have made you fifteen years old or thereabouts. RD: Yeah, that's right. WU: Let's just briefly go through that period of your life. RD: You know, I can remember, like I said, it was the Depression. I can remember things about like four or five years old. You start remembering things and I remember that it was awful hard to find money. Of course, unemployment and market collapse didn't mean much to a five-year-old, you know. WU: Were you're living in a group home of sorts or a single family…? RD: No, it was a… we had our own home. It was a red… of course, houses were close together. You know, I could reach out like this and touch my house in the neighbor's house. [Laughter] WU: But it was a single-family home? RD: Yeah, single family. WU: And east side of Detroit. RD: Yeah, and I went to school at Stevens Elementary School, which has recently been torn down, and they must have ran that right under the ground because it was old when I was going there. So, they got their full use out of that building. WU: So basically, at least through an educational standpoint, you were a city kid up until age fifteen or so. RD: Yeah, that's right. WU: Did you have any reason to go into the countryside during the summers and so forth? RD: My dad was tired of the city and, you know, the neighborhood was going to pot already anyway. And so, I figured, you know, it would be better out in the country, be better for me. And well my brother was already gone from home by then. Yeah, and so we moved out to White Lake area, which is west of Pontiac. WU: Okay, White Lake, west of Pontiac, not the White Lake that I’m thinking of. RD: No, not this one. I think there's probably a couple more. I went to Huron Valley School [?] consolidation. And it was in the process of consolidating with all the usual complaints and what have you. I have a history of going through consolidations. When I got work in New York, they were going through a consolidation, the same complaints. And when I got here, they were consolidating. Same complaints. [Laughter] WU: Before you moved out of Detroit, just since we’re doing sort of an oral family history, are there any special childhood memories that you had that you'd like to share with us or with whoever might be reading or listening to this years from now? RD: Well, like I say, the Depression was going on. Our playground was the alley and we had our own games: Duck on the Rock, you played with tin cans, and Tippee, that you played with broomsticks. And 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department then one of the things was trying to kill rats [laughter], the sport of kings. So, they had big garbage containers. There was a four-family flat next door, and they had a big garbage container, and you dump the garbage in the top and then they shoveled it out the other end onto a garbage... city garbage truck. So we would throw a match in the top and get stuff burning and the rats that were in there had to make a break for it. And then we threw rocks at them. [Laughter] WU: So those are some of your vivid childhood memories. RD: [Laughter] Kind of a warped childhood. WU: But so, you finished… what, you must have been about a sophomore in high school when you left Detroit? RD: I was a... finished half of the ninth grade because Detroit went... they ended one half the grade in the spring. And the second half, you know, they had… WU: And then you had a November 13th birthday, which put you in a little different category, I guess. RD: So, when I got out to Milford, I finished the ninth grade at Milford and then tenth played football. And it wasn't very active in the social life because we lived about nine, ten miles from Milford. WU: But you were living on what... was this a home or was it a farm? RD: We had... it was about like an acre of land and we built a house there. I helped my dad build. He was a carpenter, so. WU: So, you build your own home or your dad did? RD: Yeah. WU: With help from you and your brother or whomever. RD: Yeah, and so that was a good experience for me. Yeah. WU: Did you have any… RD: We had some chickens. WU: ...animals? That’s what I was alluding to. RD: But nothing very... much bigger than that. WU: You didn't have a cow… RD: No, no. WU: ...or a horse or anything like that? RD: We did have a big garden. We grew just a lot of stuff. WU: And basically, for home consumption? RD: Yeah, basically for home consumption. WU: Like what do you remember? 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department RD: Potatoes, of course. And I used to keep cabbage at the root cellar. One of the things, and this kind of goes back to the German background. One of the things my folks always had on hand was honey. Bought a sixty pound can of honey every year. So, Germans like honey. WU: Did you get into the bee business or anything at all? RD: No, we could buy it. And, of course, the other thing we always made was sauerkraut, you know, so... I still make sauerkraut once in a while. WU: So, those are some of your childhood memories of living at home? RD: Of course, White Lake, because we were on the lake we spent a lot of time in the water. WU: And you're talking about swimming and…? RD: Swimming and fishing. But swimming a lot, four hours a day swimming or something. WU: During the summer months. RD: Yeah. WU: So, you graduate from high school in what year, Ralph? RD: [Nineteen] forty-nine. WU: And at that point? RD: I started at Michigan State that fall. WU: Okay, and you went to Michigan State for any particular? RD: Crops and soils. Went there for four years WU: What caused you to pick that? RD: Well, I was interested in growing things. We had the garden and I guess I just and I had won a scholarship; I was in the FFA in high school. WU: So, in high school you were active in the FFA. You were active in trying to grow crops like the natives and whatnot. RD: So, I majored in Crops and Soils and it was pretty uneventful for four years, I guess, just doing what everybody does. I had fairly good grades - three-point-four average, I think. WU: And you graduated what year, you said? RD: Graduated in [nineteen] fifty-three. Graduated in June, went active in the service and... WU: So right out of Michigan State, you end up in the service. What branch of the service? RD: After basic, I was an officer ROTC. WU: You were in ROTC at State, correct? RD: Yeah. 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Okay, and so now you're in what branch of the service? RD: Army. And so, I went through basic in the officer’s course for a few months and went to Germany. And I was ammunition supply officer for a Berlin command and I didn't do very much because we were within the city, you couldn't shoot anything very big without disturbing people. And so, like I say, it was pretty easy, a little bit of small arms and grenades and a few things like that. But mostly we just sat on it and… WU: ...had it ready to go if you needed it. RD: Well, yeah, we wouldn't have lasted long if the flap went up because we were surrounded [laughter]. They could’ve put up a division against every platoon, we wouldn't have been there very long. WU: So, your service, is this a couple of years or? RD: Two years, yeah. And then got out of service, went to work in New York for the Cooperative Extension Service. KM: In New York City or? RD: Oh, Chenango County, New York. KM: Could you spell that? RD: C-h-e-n-a-n-g-o. KM: Okay. RD: The pill works [?], Norwich Coracle Company [?]. Truckloads of Aspirins. [?] WU: Tell me, help me understand, what part of the state of New York that was? RD: That would be Southcentral. WU: Largest town that I might be familiar with? RD: Binghamton is just a little south of us. KM: Okay. RD: Syracuse was quite a ways north of us. Hamilton was just a little ways north. KM: Okay. WU: Well, that helps. So, now you are working for the state of New York? RD: It's a combination thing, a combination of Chenango County and the state; a good deal like they have it set up here. WU: So, it's the extension service? RD: Cooperative Extension Service. Actually, I was hired by Cornell, somebody at Cornell. 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: So like Michigan State is sort of the college that keeps our programs going here. Cornell University was doing the same thing in the state of New York, is that a fair…? RD: Yeah, it's their agricultural college. And I was there a couple of years and I kind of wanted to get back to Michigan and I had a chance to come to work in Hart. WU: Well, now let’s wait because I've lost track of the Michigan connection. In fact, I'm not so sure we've made it yet. RD: Just the fact that I was from there. I was from there. I was from Michigan. WU: Oh, Michigan. I was thinking of Hart. KM: So, what year did you come back to Michigan? RD: I came here in nineteen fifty-seven and that's why I think I'm a relatively recent arrival. Why am I having anything to do with the history? [Laughter] RD: But so, I arrived here, Bill McClain, you probably remember... WU: Oh yes. RD: ...County Agent. I was a 4-H Agent here for - I can’t even remember - until sometime in the nineteen sixties. And I don't know if I was ever really very good as a 4-H agent. I don't know that I really did a super good job. WU: Before we go much further, I want to make sure I understand the transition. True, you grew up in Michigan? RD: Yeah. WU: But you had no connections with Hart, Michigan? RD: Not up until I arrived. WU: Or Oceana County, is that true? RD: Yep. WU: So, then you're working in New York, you're gaining experience working with the agriculture community. RD: Yeah, 4-H. WU: And Bill McClain, who was… was he the County Extension Agent at that time? RD: He was the County Extension Agent. WU: How did you even find out that there was an opening? RD: Michigan State had a locator service. 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: I see. So, that's how you heard that there's a possibility in Oceana County for a 4-H agent. You obviously applied; this is how you showed up in Oceana County. Was that a quick summation of it? RD: Yeah, that’s about right. WU: Now, were you single or married at that time? RD: I was single at that time. WU: Okay, and the year was nineteen fifty-seven that you showed up? RD: Right. WU: A year I remember well. That's the year I graduated from Hart High School. RD: So anyway, Bill McClain was the County Extension Agent. Bob Hopkins, who you probably remember… WU: …very well. RD: ...was District Horticultural Agent. And Barbara Culver was the Home Agent. WU: Barbara Culver, okay. RD: I fixed that, I married her! [Laughter] RD: And we didn't quite make it to our forty-fifth anniversary before she died. WU: Well now help so I understand her background. The builder Culvers, is that…? RD: No connection that I know of. WU: No connection. Okay, well I know enough about your background that it made me wonder: is that how you got into electricity? But that’s another subject. RD: No, that’s different... WU: Yeah, let's not go there yet. [Laughter] WU: Alright, so we have you in Hart. You're working with Bill McClain and you're working with the 4-H folks. RD: Right. WU: And in that situation, at least help us understand, what 4-H was doing at that time and how it was working with agriculture? RD: Well, and at that time there were a lot of 4-H clubs that were Dairy clubs. We had a lot of small dairies at that time and they've sort of faded, you know. But anyway, so we had...well, the kids had all kinds of projects from rabbits and gerbils up to cows, you know, and a big thing was trying to develop 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department leadership in the kids. And we had some bookkeeping projects; when they had like a cow, how much they put in and how much they got and so forth. WU: Yeah, keep track of everything…what you fed them... RD: Yeah, a little basic economics. WU: Okay. RD: And I went on, I can't even remember just exactly when I quit, but Charlie Halbert hired me for Farm Bureau services, selling farm supplies but a commission if I sold buildings. Pole buildings were getting big then because farms, like I say, the small farms were fading out of the picture and the big [?] were coming in, they needed big machinery and expensive machinery. So, we got to have big open buildings to store that stuff in and handle it. That’s where pole buildings came in. WU: Okay, so at this point you’re in Oceana County and we talked a little bit about the 4-H program. I know 4-H and the county fair was one big… RD: Oh, yeah. WU: Just briefly describe how 4-H and the county fair sort of work together and what the kids were trying to accomplish at that stage? RD: The kids, of course, it was a lot of exhibits, still is. You know, probably most of the exhibits are 4-H. Of course, like I said, the kids had projects and the county fair was the culmination. You know, if you had the grand champion or so forth, a feather in your hat and so forth. But that hasn't changed much, I guess, it’s still about the same thing. WU: Well, now do you remember the year that you started to work with Charlie and Farm Bureau? RD: It must have been about [nineteen] sixty-one. WU: Okay, now were you married at that time? RD: Yeah, by then I was, I think. WU: You had married Betty by then? RD: Been married about a year. That was another thing, being a 4-H agent and being married was kind of a conflict because we had to be out for meetings on so many evenings. WU: Never home, indeed. RD: Well, and that didn't go over very good. So, Barb didn't like that idea. I didn't either. WU: Excuse me, it's Barb. Did I call her Betty? RD: Barbara. WU: It’s Barbara, yes. So then, I can say that I went to work with Charlie at Farm Bureau. And it wasn't very long before I stopped selling just about everything except buildings, the first year or two I sold a few buildings. And before we got done, well, first of all, I had three crews running. Before long, we were building - I don't know how many by then - and that was keeping me busy, but it was fun work. 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Was the Farm Bureau doing that? Or was this Buildings Plus? RD: No, they didn't exist yet. WU: Okay. RD: Yeah, and then Harry Lynch came to work for me - you remember Harry. WU: Very well. RD: Okay, so there were two salesmen and he was well acquainted up around Custer so we could get our business up there. And like I said, the first year it was one or two buildings. Before long it was a hundred and fifty. WU: Where is it? I am being called to start another interview. RD: Yeah, go right ahead. KM: I’m going to finish... WU: ...and she's going to take you through the rest of your oral history and get a chance to work with you on some of those issues. So, excuse me, I'm very pleased that you're willing to share all this. RD: So, like I said, we had a lot of pole buildings going. Harry Lynch came to work for me. And then by that time, we had five building crews going and one of the crew leaders sprung off and became our third salesman. KM: So, around what year was this? RD: Well, it went up until about all through the [nineteen] seventies. And we had some big projects: the bowling alley out north of town was one [laughter]. Like I said, big buildings and the city maintenance garage and so forth. That's a big one, but a lot of them were just... a lot of thirty-six-point-forty-eights because they would hold a Friday cherry shaker. KM: Oh, okay. RD: So, we built a lot of farm buildings and a few commercials. So, this went on, had a little debate with the building inspector on one, and then we had a big hassle with the electrical inspector. We had a hog house going, a big one, and just before the pigs are due to arrive, he came in and said, you're not meeting the electrical code. The Michigan legislature accepted the bill - the agricultural bill - from the building, from the electrical bill. I said, “we don't have to have that.” They says you do. Well, the owner was getting peeved, he says, if that building ain't ready by the time the pigs get here, I'm going to put half of them in your basement and the other half in the electrical inspector’s basement.” [Laughter] So, okay, we complied with the law. Even though we weren't supposed to, we did it real quick. That bill cost us about thirty-five hundred bucks. So, after the dust had settled, I called down to the State and found out I was right. We didn’t have to send the supervisors a bill for thirty-five hundred. KM: Did they ever pay you back? 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department RD: They said, “we won't pay.” Pretty soon I got a call from a prosecuting attorney. I go up there with all my books and he says, “don't even open your book.” He says, “you're right.” But the supervisor still wouldn't pay. I said, “you will pay!” They said, “okay, we'll see you in court.” So, I sued the county. [Laughter] KM: Did you win? RD: I collected, but not the full amount; that attorney caved in. So anyway, the building business went on and in nineteen eighty we could begin to see Farm Bureau Services was making some bad decisions, big mistakes. This company is teetering. So, we had one fellow in our crowd there, Les Sieber [?], who was good with legal things. He went and we started to set up a corporation called “Buildings Plus.” KM: Okay. RD: And thought we'd have that on the shelf if Farm Bureau collapsed. We never got it on the shelf; Farm Bureau collapsed. They just wanted to get rid of the building business, they wanted to get rid of everything. So when we opened the doors of Buildings Plus, we had a hundred thousand dollars’ worth of sales! They just gave it to us. So, Buildings Plus went on pretty good and went on quite successfully. KM: And so, you only had the one partner? RD: Oh, there were ten of us. KM: There's ten of you? RD: ...in the corporation. Les Siebert [?] shot himself, not because the corporation, I know he had bad family problems. We had one of the members die, and so forth. We’d have them over [?], they would get paid off if they retired or quit or whatever. KM: Sure. RD: And this went on until Charlie, as manager - the manager before - he retired, got paid back and I took over as manager. KM: So, do you remember what year that was? RD: It was nineteen eighty-seven and I stayed manager for about seven years and retired. KM: Okay. RD: Yeah, and the company then, I don't know, some bad decisions were made or whatever. They collapsed. Not because I left [laughter], but the company collapsed and this just left me all alone. Oh, I should go back a little bit. The electrical business. KM: Yes. RB: Okay, after that practice with the electrical on that hog house, that kind of t’d [ticked] me off and I said because, “this guy is going to have us have to have a license to screw in a bulb; by God, I’ll become an electrician.” KM: So what year did you become an electrician? 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department RD: Well, it takes time. So, we fudged a few figures because I’ve done some electrical work. And I don't know, it must have been sometime in the [nineteen] seventies, I went down and took an exam to be… the Journeyman’s exam, which I passed. And then I waited two years and then I was eligible for the Masters, which I did. And we were doing pretty good electrical business before long. We had two electrical crews working, the buildings we built and others, I mean... KM: So how many building crews did you have at that time? So, you had the two electrical crews and? RD: Two electricals and I think about five buildings. We went up, at maximum, I think we had about fiftytwo employees then. KM: Okay. RD: Because we had a bookkeeper because, of course, computers arose, which I'm not much of a bookkeeper to start with and with a computer, forget it, you know? [Laughter] But she was good. So okay, we went through several before we got one that was really good. And we had a receptionist and had some people at the counter because we also did retail sales. And so, I went over the electrical business, so that's kind of fun. I enjoyed that. KM: Okay. RD: So, after I retired, I still got a little electrical work. Let’s see, Barb died. That was eleven years ago. Yeah, about eleven and a half years ago, and, you know, the first while after she died, that house was awful empty. So, I did a lot of work. If I remember right, I did about thirteen thousand dollars’ worth of electrical work just on the side. KM: Oh, wow. RD: And I wasn't trying to do, you know, just whatever came along. But anyway, so I stayed in that until about... I ran out of gas, so I just got to where unfortunately I'm not as strong as I used to be. I’m slow; I can't charge people for working like that. So, I don't do much of anything anymore. KM: So, then you retired and you said nineteen ninety-four from Builders Plus? RD: No, no. About two thousand two, I think. KM: Two thousand and two, okay. And then that's when you started the electrical? RD: Well yeah, we've been doing electrical for about... KM: Well, I mean… RD: Buildings Plus had electric crews. KM: Sure, but you had been working and doing stuff at Buildings Plus until two thousand two. RD: Yep. KM: And then you started to take on more electrical. RD: I just did electrical on my own. Buildings Plus was still doing electrical at that time, they were still operating under my license. 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department KM: Okay. RD: Which last January I let all my licenses go. I didn't want to pay the bill for them because I can't do the work. KM: Sure. RD: And I'm kind of proud of the fact that a lot of the people that we started at Buildings Plus went on to do electrical work, including the line superintendent for the city hired. Oh, you know, and a lot of the people that we got started in the building business went on. I feel good about that. We got people started out on good things, you know. KM: That's great. RD: So that's about it. KM: Well, let's go back in time because we talked a lot about what you did in terms of work, but you got married? RD: Yep. KM: And so, when you first arrived in Oceana County, what was it like? What was it like to be in Hart, at that time? RD: Oh, it was a lot different and it was different socially. We had many more migrants then because cherries were picked by hand and they were all thought of - the term “Latino” hadn’t become involved they were Mexican. Probably most of them were. And they had the Mexican fiesta downtown. Of course, downtown was a different looking place due to several fires. Some buildings disappeared, some were rebuilt. Some got the top floors knocked off. You know, they were… so the landscape changed a little bit. And, like I say, the small farmers who were good fellows and all that, nice people, but dairy is very time consuming. You're stuck fourteen hours a day if you can do the chores in two hours and that's got to be oppressive. And so, the small dairies went out and the dairies that remained were big enough to where they could have many people. You didn't have to be there all the time. And then the shift came to… we always had asparagus, it was always big stuff and of course, there’s a lot more now and the tree fruits, of course, but then we started in with the truck crops like carrots, squash, pickles... cucumbers. People always laugh, they aren’t pickles until you pickle them. [Laughter] RD: So, yeah, we had a lot more of the farm crops. I mean, like corn, especially corn. KM: Okay. RD: We had, well, some very fortunate years where the corn belt had a terrible drought and we didn’t. And so, and of course, I always was familiar with cherries and like I say the “tree foods” were always big. But, yeah, Hart changed a lot, like working at Farm Bureau still had the old feed mill. People brought in grain and had it ground and mixed and so forth. Well, one of our electric projects was rewiring that and we pulled the old feed mill out and junked it. 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department KM: Okay. RD: It no longer, I mean, nobody does that anymore. KM: What year was that? RD: I can’t tell you for sure. KM: Decade? RD: Huh? KM: What decade? RD: Oh, it must have been probably early middle [nineteen] eighties, maybe? KM: Okay. RD: No, wait a minute. Yeah, it would have been about the middle [nineteen] eighties. KM: So, when you first moved here before you got married, did you live in sort of downtown Hart or were you further out? RD: I rented a room over here for about, oh, six to eight months. And then I built a garage to live in until I could build a house; that didn't work out too good. I couldn't get a well, so we jacked it up and moved it and got a well where we moved it to. And that was the house that Barbara and I started; it was real small. KM: So where did you move the house? RD: Over to the west side of town. KM: The west side of town? RD: Originally it was on the east side. KM: Okay. RD: Yeah, you know this business about you're supposed to be able to be the guy that divides the water with the… you know, goes along with… the stick dips when he goes [?]. KM: Yes. RD: We had two of them, one who was sort of an amateur with the stick and one [?] who was supposed to be super at it. They laid out this van [?] of water. They drilled six holes, three holes up. None of them had water. I had a hole three hundred and eighty feet deep and no well. I paid half price at that time. KM: Sure. RD: So, it was still darned expensive to find out there wasn't water there. So anyway, we moved it over and they got a good well there, so they're still going. And I say that was the house that Barbara and I had when we got married. It wasn’t very big. And so we went along pretty good. We adopted a baby. 14 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department KM: Okay. RD: That was okay. The adoption agency said it was pretty small, so by the time we said we're going to adopt a second one, they said you’ve got to have more room. So, we built the house we’ve got now. KM: Okay, and where is that still on the west side? RD: South of town on top of the hill. And I pulled off some of the guys from my crews and got the thing framed in and we did a lot of work ourselves. Of course, we hired the plasterer. We hired some work, we hired a lot of the work. Fortunately, we had some money on hand and could finance the thing. Still kept the small house. KM: So what year did you move to the second house? RD: Well, it must have been about fifty years ago. That would make it when? Sometime in the [nineteen] sixties. KM: Yes. RD: Because the first baby we adopted is fifty-one now. KM: Okay. RD: And that went on. Then we adopted another one who he lives here in Hart and adopted a girl. And if we were to be sure we could get another girl, we would have tried adopting a fifth one. But the agency says, you know, enough already. KM: What agency did you go through? RD: Catholic Social Services. KM: Okay. RD: You could guess by my mother's maiden name or first name, Magdalena. KM: Yes. RD: Who else? [Laughter] RD: So that, of course, kids went through the whole school system here at Hart and I think they all got a pretty good education. I think Hart’s got a good system here, yeah. But, I say there's been a lot of change in Hart and I think, you know, one of the things kind of impressed me. Like I say, the little farmers went out and of course, land became so valuable, farmers had access to credit now. And most of them knew how to do what [?]. I'm really impressed by what some of the young farmers are doing. I mean, this is computerized and controlled by satellites. You know, we are a long way from what I know about. And yeah, they go across the field in the fertilizer, putting on more or less fertilizer because the satellite up there is telling it what to do. So, like I say, this is kind of beyond my scope. KM: So, do you have any memories besides the ones you've shared about living at Hart? 15 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department RD: Oh, I have to think about that a little bit. Well, I knew a lot of interesting people. You know, when you were doing building work, you met people. Oh, I knew Walter, here, you're from fixing his sprinkler system, which was an annual occasion, it seemed like. [Laughter] And his garage door operator. You know, you just met a lot of... went to a lot of interesting places. KM: Okay. RD: And some are more interesting because they were pleasant and some are more interesting because they were unpleasant. KM: Sure. RD: Yeah, you know, some of the places you did work, you put your boots on to go in. KM: So, you mentioned one of your children still lives in Hart? RD: Yeah, Gregory, my youngest boy. KM: Okay. RD: He lives in Hart. He works on a farm and he has worked in industry, too, but he likes to work on a farm. And my daughter lives in Whitehall, so that's not too dreadfully far away. But she did six years in the Air Force before. And my second oldest son did four years in Germany. Unfortunately, the oldest boy wanted desperately to get into the Coast Guard, but he could only see with one eye, he was blind in one eye and they wouldn’t take him. And the youngest boy, would have tried to get into the service, but he has had seizures and they won’t let him in. They’re pretty picky. KM: So, do you think one of the reasons why they wanted to go into the service was because you were in the service? RD: I think it was just expected that people did about then. You know, I mean they had the draft; it was Vietnam and we still had the draft running. KM: Sure. RD: So, you joined, I think maybe Mark was drafted. I can't remember. KM: Okay. RD: Anyway, you know, I went in ROTC and if I hadn't, I'd have been drafted. KM: So, and I forgot to ask you this earlier when you were talking about your parents, since your dad was first generation and your mom was second generation German, did you grow up speaking any German? RD: I wish I had; they both spoke German whenever they wanted to talk about something they didn't want us to know. [Laughter] But I should’ve learned German then. KM: Okay. RD: My uncle spoke German; I should have. I couldn't recognize things in German when I got to Germany. But Germany is like here, there's a lot of difference between South Germany and North Germany. You know, just like Georgia… 16 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department KM: Sure. RD: ...and New England. KM: Okay. RD: Where did you come from? Are you…? KM: So I'm adopted. I was adopted from South Korea. RD: Oh, okay. KM: Yep, and I grew up in western New York actually. So, I grew up in Rochester. RD: Oh, yeah. Rochester is in the Lake Plains region. KM: Yes. RD: That's the fruit growing region for New York. KM: Yes, it is. RD: That's kind of an interesting background. You ought to put something… [laughter]. KM: So, did any of your children get into building then? You mentioned your one son did a little bit. RD: He worked with us at Buildings Plus for a little while. KM: Oh, okay. RD: He didn't get along the best… he isn’t a person that works good with other people. But we were building at that time a big structural steel building and he was good at that because he wasn't afraid of heights. KM: Oh wow, okay. RD: So, you know, he could get up there. And I had a couple of people that were very good at heights, you know. One guy, whether it was three feet off the ground or thirty - it was all the same. You could walk around then, so, you know. And it's kind of sad. He comes to our church now and he's got Alzheimer's disease and you think, boy, how able he was and now, you know, it's kind of sad. KM: And so, what do you think of Hart today? RD: I think Hart’s doing good. You know, the buildings are up. Well, they're having a little trouble keeping some of them occupied. But, you know, the town is in good shape. We don't have a slum. Well, we don’t have a slum area or anything like that. They keep the streets up nice, the town looks good, and I think Hart's doing very well. And which is pretty hard to do in small town USA because your businesses can't compete with the big box stores. So, it's just hard to keep a business going in Hart, supermarkets, that type of thing - food. 17 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department But we had a very good clothing store here, Powers [?], and they had to shut down; they couldn't compete. I really hated to see them go because they were really helpful. And well, we’ve got one hardware store left in town. We had two or three. Of course, again, the same thing - how do they compete? KM: Yeah. RD: But I think Hart is keeping the town looking good and reasonably prosperous for a small town. I think they're doing good. KM: Okay, so remember that this interview will be saved for a long time. RD: Oh, okay. KM: So, when someone listens to this tape fifty plus years from now, what would you like them to know about your life and community? RD: I don't know; I don’t know what they'll be interested in then. KM: Well, what do you think is... from all of your fifty some odd years living in Hart, what do you think is something that you want people to remember? RD: I think I’d like them to remember some of the people here that I think were so good. Some of the people in our church that I always thought were so remarkable. One of the farm families out here, Helen Gilliland, and I think everybody ought to remember her. She was such a remarkable woman; not that she had years of college, but, boy, she was intelligent. I don't know, I guess, I think some of the people that built things up here or some of the farmers that established. I think Greiner Farms out here that started processing their own fruit and have grown very large. Todd Greiner out here… around here, when you say Greiner, that doesn't narrow it down very far - there’s a lot of them. KM: Okay. RD: But anyway, Todd Greiner did the same thing, build up a very successful business. Yeah, I think they ought to remember people like that and how much they did. I suppose you ought to remember some of the politicals. Yeah, we've had, I think, some outstanding mayors and some not so outstanding. KM: So, can you give me an example of maybe an outstanding mayor? RD: So, I’m trying to think. I think Harry Lynch did well, the guy that was a salesman for us. I think, I can't pick out… of course, I'm not in the city. KM: Sure. RD: But I think, you know, I can't pick a particular one, but I think they've done a good job with the town. KM: Okay. RD: And then, of course, you also have city managers. And I think the one we’ve got now - oh, I ought to know his name. I'm getting old, I don't remember a thing like that. 18 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department KM: That’s okay. RD: We had some that I thought were really poor, but hey, I wasn't paying their wages so I guess I shouldn't say too much. [Laughter] KM: So, do you have any advice to a young person who may be listening to this tape? RD: I guess my ID's are pretty outdated, but I think people ought to look for getting into a job that produces a tangible result. Everybody is producing printouts and pictures and games, but I think we ought to go back. We ought to have some engineers and we ought to have tradesmen. KM: Okay. RD: Boy, it is hard to find people who can take the blueprint and build something out of it. I mean, you know, polymer sheet metal workers, mechanical contractors; the ones that are here do very well. KM: Yes. RD: But it's hard to find people to do that. And kids aren't interested in it. They want to do things that are to do with computers and what have you. So, I think… well, I guess what I thought is they ought to look into the trades. KM: Okay, and then is there anything else that you'd like to share that I have not asked you? RD: I think we've covered an awful lot. [Laughter] I think you’ve got it. KM: Alrighty, well, thank you so much for your time and for sharing your memories with me. 19 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/abf077a2a53c54c7afd9dce147755bed.mp3 fefc2059101959bdad91a7bd497128d7 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Dold_Ralph Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Dold, Ralph Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Dold, Ralph (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Ralph Dold. Interviewed by Kimberly McKee on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Ralph Dold was born in Detroit, Michigan in 1931 as the son of first and second generation German immigrants. His childhood was spent in Detroit during the Great Depression before moving to Milford, Michigan for high school. Ralph later attended Michigan State University and majored in “Crops & Soils” after being a member of the Future Farmers of America while in high school. After graduating from college and serving in the army, he relocated to Hart, Michigan in 1957 where he served as the 4-H Agent and later worked for Farm Bureau Services. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource McKee, Kimberly (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Detroit (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Farms Farmers Future Farmers of America Michigan State University Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/89178933013f4019c6fdb8ff257d0b69.pdf cb5031c1aa558df4d19712edcad28135 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Larry Byl Interview Interviewed by Walter Urick June 18, 2016 Transcript WU: My name is Walter Urick, and I'm here today with Larry Byl. We're at the Hart Area Library in Hart, Michigan. The date is Saturday, June 18th, 2016. And the purpose for this meeting is to obtain the oral history of the Byl family. The oral history’s being collected as part of the Growing Community Project, which is supported in part by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Program. Larry, I just want to thank you for taking this time to talk to me today. I'm interested to learn more about your family history and your experiences living and working in Oceana County. Now, your full legal name is what, Larry? LB: Walter Lawrence Wesley Byl. WU: And your date of birth and place of birth? LB: Date of birth is March 7th, 1957. And the location was Grand Rapids, Michigan. WU: Now, do you have any siblings? 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LB: I have three brothers and one sister. WU: Would you name each one for me? LB: Sure. The oldest was Margaret, followed by Paul, me, brother John, and then Tom. WU: And let's talk about your parents for a few minutes. Your father's name? LB: My father's name is Peter Byl. No middle initial or no middle name. And my mom was [?] Byl WU: And her maiden name? LB: Her name. Her maiden name was Westers. WU: Tracing the background of your parents and may get you to your grandparents… LB: Yep. WU: Sort of describe, as best you can, how your family eventually ended up in Oceana County and where did we start? LB: Sure. WU: In the Netherlands or some other part of the world? LB: Sure. I'm going to go way back because I think you might find it interesting on my mother's side, if you go back far enough, back when Napoleon was the ruler in France, they conscripted soldiers, including a fellow from Algeria, which would have been a great-great-grandfather of mine. And he, I'm going to say, abandoned… he didn't see eye to eye with Napoleon, so he deserted them, Poland's army, before Waterloo and went to Holland because the Netherlands was one location that accepted people regardless of race and religion. While his name, they couldn't pronounce it, so they called him France, which is French [?], which means outcast. So, my grandmother's maiden name was [?]. And so I come from a varied background. He obviously fell in love with a Dutch woman and they got married. And my dad's family came from the northern part of the Netherlands called Friesland. And in Friesland, they're known as either farmers, predominantly dairy farmers, because there's a lot of grass there or they were known as a fisherman. So, my dad's family came and they're also known as being hardheaded. So, my mom and dad actually didn't meet until 1948 in a boat coming from the Netherlands to the United States. And I'm going to give you a tiny bit of background to that. My dad's family was farmers and my mom's family... my grandfather was a Christian school principal and he moved around to several different schools. Well, you have to understand, during World War II, Germany occupied the Netherlands for about five years. So, my parents were both in their early teens during the war, which would have been a horrible time. And so, they both knew what it was like to live under martial law. And also, they knew what it was like to not have food all of the time. My parents, my grandparents, this would be my dad's mom and dad, their farmhouse on January 1, 1945 was accidentally bombed by the allies. What would happen is the Canadians and the Americans and the British would fly into Germany and if they had any bombs left over, they would look for opportunities to let those bombs go. And it just so happened, my grandparents lived fairly close to a railroad track. So, they let the bombs go and they missed the railroad tracks and accidentally hit my dad's house. So, for six months to a year, they had to live with another family. They were able to salvage the bricks and rebuild a smaller house like the typical Dutch. But you have to understand, they had nothing. I mean, they had two cows, I think, at the time of 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department the war. And the night that their house was bombed, one of the cows was killed and taken away. So, but, I never heard my grandparents complain. But in 1948, they had an opportunity. A man by the name of George Welch, who was the mayor of Grand Rapids, was visiting the Netherlands. And he was doing that because he was, I believe, the president of the United States Mayors Association. And he was looking at the rebuilding of Europe at that time. And one of his business partners was a lady by the name of Margaret de Groot. George Welch and Margaret de Groot owned a newspaper in Grand Rapids and she owned a farm just east of Grand Rapids in the Rockford/ Lowell area, and she was in need of some crop farmers to share... to work that farm and share the crops with her. So, my dad's family, when they met George Welch, they set up an interview and within three or four weeks, they went through all of the process. And because their house had been bombed by the Americans, they were put on a fast track to come to America. Well, my mom had just finished college in the Netherlands and she came to the United States to spend six months with some of her [?] family members who were... WU: Can you spell that name? LB: No, I cannot. WU: All right. I know the recorder/ transcriber is going to have difficulty with that, but continue on. LB: It starts with [?]. WU: [Laughter] LB: And they... she went to Chicago to stay with some cousins for six months because she really had a traveling bug. So, she had finished her college and she met my dad's family on the boat. So that's how my mom and dad met. WU: Was your dad on that boat, too? LB: My dad actually had flown to America just before the rest of the family because my dad had an invitation to join the Dutch army and fight in Indonesia, which was seeking independence. And they said if you leave now, you do not have to join the Dutch army and fight in the jungles of Indonesia. So, my dad was already over at the... what we call the Marcadia Farm, and that would be the farm located at 992 6 Mile Road, Rockford, Michigan. And that's where my mom met my dad because my mom enjoyed my dad's family. And when she went to Chicago, they said, well, gosh, you're close enough. Why don't you spend a month over there? Because she always enjoyed rural living. And this got her out of Chicago for a month. Well, she fell in love with my dad, but what happened then was she had to go back to the Netherlands because she applied for a permanent visa and they said that there's a quota. We only allow so many Dutchmen in the United States at any one time. So, she had to go back to the Netherlands for two years. She did and just about the time her two years was over, my dad, this would be 1950, had an invitation to join the U.S. Army and fight in Korea. So, my dad was in the U.S. Army, but instead of being stationed in Korea, he was stationed in Germany because he knew German, Dutch, English, and he was a medic there in Germany with the U.S. Army. So needless to say, my mom then came to America and she actually worked with my grandparents on the farm at Rockford for two years until my dad got out of the army. So, they got married and within the next seven years had five children. WU: Now, the farm in Rockford, as best you know, what type of crops or what kind of farming activities were involved that your dad apparently had to participate in or... 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LB: My grandfather and father were both dairy farmers from the time they were little. This was... we considered it a huge dairy farm. There were between 30 and 32 cows that they milked. And it was a pretty modern farm with all of the tractors and they raised most of their own crops. And it was a wonderful place to live. My mom, on the other hand, hated the idea of being tied down twenty-four hours a day, seven days a week. My mom loved to travel and explore, so she convinced my dad because my dad took over that farm when my grandparents, after working the farm for five years, had saved enough money to buy their own farm. She convinced my dad to let her go back to college with five little kids at home and she went to Calvin College because that was very close and also because they could read the Dutch transcripts from her college days in the Netherlands. So, they gave her about two years credit and over the course of the next five or six years, she got her teaching degree from Calvin College. And in about 1966, they purchased an eighty-acre fruit farm in the western end of Oceana County. WU: How did it happen that they got to Oceana? Was there a story behind that or is it just they found it somehow? LB: Now, how did they find… did they run out of gas as they were heading up north? I think it came down to they asked friends from their church. Many of the Dutch, especially the Dutch, they came to America, go to either... either went or currently attend Reformed and Christian Reformed churches. And that's been the case from about 1860 on. And so, I'm sure my parents were talking with other friends in church and they were put in touch with some friends in New Era Reformed Church. And one of the first area farmers that they met was Gord Vanderslice’s parents. And there was a farm for sale. There were several. One was in Ferry Township and one was in Benona Township. The one in Benona was owned by an estate of Pete Burmeister and they looked that over. They asked Mr. Vanderslice to look it over and he said, wow, a lot of blow sand and it's not the most productive, but it was pretty. There were a lot of old apple trees. My parents didn't realize the old apple trees weren't necessarily an asset, but it had peaches and sweet cherries and they could see a future. And more importantly, my mom could see that she wouldn't be tied down to the farm seven days a week. WU: Did away from the cow situation. LB: The cows, where you had to milk twice a day every day. And so, my parents, I told Mrs. de Groot they had purchased their own farm. So, there actually was an auction sale and the equipment on the other farm was sold and the cattle were sold. Other than my dad could not get away from cattle altogether. So, when they moved to Oceana County, my dad brought one cow with him. Now you'd have to realize how much milk one cow produces. Even with five kids and with cousins staying with us most of the summer, that cow was producing so much milk that my dad would make buttermilk. Well, you make buttermilk by taking sour milk and churning it. That was a lot of work. My dad, actually, and mom had an extra washing machine, so they used that extra washing machine to churn the sour milk and turn it into buttermilk. And then there's a dish. It's called [?]. And I'm sorry, Walter, I can't spell that either. But [?] is a Dutch buttermilk pudding. And I just remember when I was ten years old having [?] for breakfast, lunch and supper. And to this day, I can't stand it. And so, that's how my parents got started here. And within the following two years, between 1966 and ‘68, they purchased another hundred acres of agricultural land from a neighbor by the name of Leo Dzur, D-Z-U-R, and Leo was an immigrant from Germany, and he had two daughters who had both moved out of the area and it was time for him to 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department give up farming. So, that's how my parents got really started. And my mom, true to her word, started teaching that fall the year that we moved here. WU: Where did your mom teach? LB: My mom taught in Ferry’s school for the first two years and then moved to Shelby’s school, where she taught for seventeen more years. WU: Did she teach actually at Shelby or out at Benona or? LB: She taught right at Shelby itself. WU: And what... LB: Fourth and fifth grade. WU: So, she was the fourth and fifth grade teacher. LB: Yes. WU: That's quite a story. So now, let's see, you had an eighty-acre farm and a one-hundred-acre farm. LB: Yes. WU: So now your dad is in charge of one hundred and eighty acres, correct? Did that... all I want to do is briefly trace the farming experience of your father before we go further. Did he acquire more land or was one hundred and eighty acres basically his farm? LB: My dad was able to, over the next ten years, acquire another forty acres at the end of Shelby Road and Scenic Drive and another 40 on Woodrow Road next to the Dzur farm. And that was pretty much it until my oldest brother, like a lot of farms, the oldest son stayed on the farm and farmed with their father. My brother Paul went to Michigan State University for a two-year Ag. degree, and when he took over then fifty percent ownership, they acquired some additional land after that because obviously farming became even more mechanized as more modern sprayers, faster tractors and things like that. WU: OK, so basically, he had probably over three hundred acres that they actually owned. LB: Yes, by 1975 he had three hundred acres that they owned. WU: So, he had about three hundred acres they actually owned. I don't know if he went out and leased property? LB: He did not. WU: Okay, so what I'd like you to describe is the type of farming activities that were involved in this three-hundred-acres. I'm not sure if it was asparagus, cherries or the whole nine yards. You sort of describe it. LB: Yep. And, Walter, if it's okay, I might describe a little bit, too, us boys, the Byl boys, because there were four of us, from time to time, we could work for a neighbor by the name of Vernon Bull, who was one of the pioneer food processing and growers from Casnovia, who bought a second operation in Oceana County next door to my dad. And over the course of thirty years, when my dad would try and buy a farm, invariably Vernon would be there and once in a while they'd have to flip a coin to see who 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department could buy it or try to outbid each other. It was a relationship that was OK, but I'm sure there were times when it wasn't the best. But Vernon was able to hire us, along with a number of other young men in Oceana County for both horticulture purposes and for cherry processing. He had one of the first cherry processing plants along the lakeshore. And I remember asking Vernon why he wanted to get into the food processing business when just raising crops was a full-time job. Vernon explained to me in his particular case, he was largely along Lake Michigan, which meant that he was about a week later than the cherry crops closer to Hart and Shelby. Typically, along the lake, it's a little bit cooler and that holds back the fruit in the springtime and then the summer. It might be eighty degrees in town, but it'll be seventy degrees close to Lake Michigan. What Vernon had a problem with since he was on the tail-end of the production, if he brought his cherries in at that time to either Hart or Shelby, but if the processing plant had fulfilled their contract, they were no longer interested in processing more fruit. So, by Vernon having his own food processing/ cherry processing plant, he felt he could then market the processed fruit. He ended up building freezer plants to go along with the food processing plant so that he could store it. So, my dad was able to take advantage of that from time to time, as well, because that's the one thing we found out. You really want to have multiple food processors as opposed to being so reliant on only a single food processor. And basically, you're at their mercy. WU: Well, I'm going to want to talk to you more in detail about your youth and working for Vernon Bull. But before we get there, I want you to describe as best you can your father and maybe your brother’s farming operation at its peak. What are you producing or growing? And approximately how many acres, if you know. LB: Yeah, my father, when he first started in Oceana County, he had to learn everything. I mean, everything from the standpoint of what we call stone fruit here, peaches and cherries. He was used to corn and hay and cattle. There's a difference, but it's not all that great. And, you know, we had a wonderful neighbor with Vernon Ball. One of his employees helped us if my dad had questions. And of course, the chemical dealers were always happy to help you and sell product. My dad's main crops the first few years, when we bought the farm, there were probably twenty acres of apple trees with probably twenty-five different varieties. You had varieties called “Snows.” You had “Kings,” you had apples that we would call them today, vintage varieties. And like the snow apple, for instance, would be a lot like a Macintosh. But when you bite into it, it's really white on the inside. And that apple’s specialty was as a caramel apple because once you had caramel and you bite into it, it was really wonderful to see that white. Now, Pete Burmeister, when he had all of these trees planted, had his own little packing plant and would bring apples to various vendors. Well, my dad didn't have the patience to learn about all of the varieties. And at that time, cherries were becoming a bigger and bigger thing because cherries in about 1966, when we moved here to Oceana County, you really started seeing more Shaker's. Now, what the shaker did was it took away your need to have hundreds of pickers to harvest the cherries. So, my dad planted a lot of cherries. We had probably fifteen acres of peaches, largely Clingstone. A Freestone peach would be the type of peach that you would sell in the store. A Kingstone peach, we used to sell to Gerber's and that was used for food processing. My dad also, on the whole, Leo Desoer farm, the one hundred acres, he ended up planting asparagus when he bought that, it was open and old cherries. Over the course of about six or seven years, he removed the old cherries and we planted all of that into asparagus. My dad was probably one of the larger asparagus growers in the early ‘70s. 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: So, cherries... peaches, and asparagus… LB: …peaches and asparagus. And really moved away from apples completely until maybe ten years ago. WU: Well, now I want to take you back to your boyhood days and give an idea, first, what it was like growing up and what kind of farm chores, if any, you had to participate in. First, maybe at home and then maybe Bull Orchard? LB: At home, when we moved to Oceana County, the biggest job was, of course, harvesting of the fruit. And we were not large enough to own a cherry shaker. So, all of our cherries were harvested by hand, starting with about three to four acres of sweet cherries, which doesn't sound like very much today. But that job kept us busy for probably two weeks and then we moved to the sour cherries. Then, of course, just before that was thinning the peaches and then the harvesting of the peaches. And by that time, we were just so happy to have school started. We were... most of us were happy to get off the farm and back to the school. WU: So, basically what you're saying is you're one of the harvesters. LB: Yeah. WU: And this is at an age of ten or eight? LB: Yep. WU: As you get into your early teens, did your father have to hire harvesters outside of family and neighbors and so forth? LB: Because my mother's family, she has four siblings and they all moved to the Grand Rapids area. And I have probably twenty-five cousins, about the same age as our family, little younger. And most of those cousins in the summertime spent two or three weeks helping harvest. WU: So, this was a family - extended family - effort. LB: It was very much an extended family effort. We, at that time, we saw quite a few migrants, including some blacks that maybe came up from Chicago, but our farm did not employ it. It's not that we wouldn't have, but we had enough family members where we were able to harvest with our family. WU: Do you have any vivid memories, good or bad, of when you were a kid working on the farm, that you would care to make part of our interview here? LB: Sure. One of our cousins would not like me sharing this, but I had a cousin by the name of Peter Westers and he was one of the youngest cousins. He was two. Now, these were the days when you had the whole family out in the orchard. My aunt, typically my aunt and all of the kids, several aunts. And Peter was two and he was very fond of eating cherries. The problem was he would eat cherries, pits and all and he was still in a diaper. And about ten or eleven o'clock in the day, he would start crying because as he was sitting, those cherry pits would become very uncomfortable. So, we always used to tease Peter about that. Another memory that I have was our first year here in 1966, Vernon Ball had purchased some existing orchards in close proximity and those orchards were being transitioned - this was a cherry orchard - to 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department mechanically harvesting. So, what you had was, we call it a double incline shaker, with a little limb shaker - didn't shake the whole tree, just the little limb. But in order to get the tarps underneath the trees, you had to cut the lower branches. Well, before they cut the lower branches, they asked all of the neighbors if we would go and, for fifty cents a bucket, pick the lowest limbs. Well at fifty cents a bucket, I remember one day as a ten-year-old picking like twenty-five buckets and earning an ungodly amount of money, at least from my perspective, and my mom keeping all of us in toll and which was a whole lot nicer than picking my dad's orchards, which required a ladder and to reach all the way to the top. WU: Well, I'm going to switch subjects and go on to your educational background. Starting in elementary, I’m not sure if you ended up in the village of Shelby or if you were out in the Benona schools. I assume it was the latter, but… LB: Yep, I am fortunate. I say fortunate in that for my first three years of school, I actually went to a tiny one room schoolhouse. This was back near Lowell... Talbot. And we had around eighteen students and four of those eighteen were Byl kids. And I tell my children and now grandchildren that I can still name all of my classmates in first, second and third grade, both of them. So, when we moved in 1966, we went to Benona school, which had around twenty kids per class and some classes had two grades, most had one grade, and that went through eighth grade. And some of my fondest memories there were you didn't have to try out for the basketball team, you automatically made it. And we had the most fun on Wednesday nights playing against New Era, New Era Christian, Weare, Golden. We didn't play against the big schools of Shelby and Hart, but we played at the State Street gym here in Hart and gosh, I was just very... those are fond memories for me. WU: Any teachers in your elementary years that stand out in your mind that maybe helped mold you or mentor you in any way? LB: I had very decent teachers in Benona. Probably the best English teacher I had was a lady who... Mrs. Hammond. And she was one of those individuals who was very frank with you. And this is in seventh and eighth grade. She taught English and spelling and some of the others, but she hated math. So, she and Dennis Tucker traded places for those classes. And I remember her giving me a dictionary, which I still have. And she said, “Larry, you're smart, but you can't spell worth a damn. I want you to look up your words whenever you have a question so that you don't get it wrong.” And that was probably a very good thing in the seventh or eighth grader to have a teacher be that honest. And I still have that little dictionary. WU: So Benona schools took you through the eighth grade. Is that what you're telling me? LB: Yes. WU: Okay, so you finished the eighth grade and where did you go from there for high school? LB: From there I went to Shelby High School with a class of about one hundred and ten kids and I took your normal classes, except I did take various what I call FFA - Future Farmers of America - classes. Shelby had... Hart had a very good auto mechanic class where some of my friends went to Hart for two hours a day for that with Larry Wagner. Shelby had a very good Ag. program and a shop program with Tom Carey, a woodshop and a metal shop. So, they really had some very good vocational training back then between the two schools. WU: Between the two schools… 8 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LB: Yeah, between the two schools. So, I took agriculture classes my last three years and FFA became a bigger part of my life along with my brother. And I learned parliamentary procedure and I took a forestry class which I didn't do real well in. But, in general, it was... I enjoyed it immensely and it served me well. WU: In terms of your high school experience, again, is there a high school teacher that stands out in your memory or is special? LB: In high school, I would say I had a… it's amazing how you connect with people that are close to your age. And we did have a single female teacher who by the name of Becky Gill, and she taught English and it seemed like most of us really could relate to her. And then also another English teacher by the name of Shirley Haeg. And one reason why I could connect with Shirley, her maiden name when she was first at Shelby High School was Bylsma. So, there was a little bit of kindred spirit there and she taught drama. And so, for plays, I had her and again, just a very good teacher. And she ended up becoming a minister. She was a minister at the church here in Hart Congregational for several years. WU: Her last name is… LB: Haeg, Shirley Haeg. WU: Yes, that’s interesting. Before I get you into college, I want to go back and visit the Bull situation and your work experience there. Just briefly, what you and your brothers were doing for... LB: Sure. The first time we worked for the Bulls was, of course, when Vernon Bull purchased this orchard close to our farm. And we got it as ten, eleven, twelve-year-old kids picking all the low branches. So, we thought Vernon was the best because we always didn't get paid when we worked for our parents. So, we really wanted to work for Vernon. Vernon, in 1971, there was a pretty big cherry crop and he needed more people to work in the cherry processing plant. And that was about three weeks, three and a half weeks, worth of work. And at age fourteen, he first of all, grabbed my brother Paul, who was sixteen. I was fourteen. So, I went there the next day asking him if I could work. And then he ended up hiring my brother John, who was thirteen at the time. I was... the only criteria, Vernon said, was if anyone asks, tell them you're 16. So, I got to work, what they called an IQF, which is an individual quick freeze. And what that would do was take the sour cherries after they're pitted and a certain amount of those cherries went through the IQF machine and I was to box them up and to keep it running. And so, I filled boxes and stacked it for about three and a half weeks. And then my brother, John, was able to run the cooling pad with the forklift outside and Paul was running one of the three shakers. WU: So, the Byl boys were running this plant that... teenage years, basically, with some adult supervision. LB: Some adult supervision. And of course, we felt very special because I was working with folks like Kim Griffin from Shelby and another fellow who I think is an attorney or a judge in Kalamazoo, Doug Burmeister. And so, they were all older than us, but they treated us... as long as we did our job, they treated us as an equal. WU: Well, briefly, describe your years, your educational years after Shelby High. From there you went where? LB: OK. From Shelby High School, I went to Hope College. And, actually, by the time I was sixteen, I worked on Dad's Farm and Vernon Bull and I have a little bit of my mom's blood; I wanted to do some 9 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department exploring. So, I asked my parents if I could go out west and work for an uncle who was the head gardener for Henry Kaiser from Kaiser Steel and Aluminum, who had a summer estate in the Puget Sound off Seattle. And it was probably a three-hundred-acre estate with seven homes and greenhouse. And I was one of seven gardeners. And I got to use my farming skills, which was spraying, weeding, mowing, and I really enjoyed that. WU: This was the summer of your junior year or going into your senior year? LB: I actually worked out there for three different summers. WU: OK. LB: So that gave me just a little different perspective because like a lot of kids, when you’re sixteen, seventeen, eighteen, you know, mom and dad isn't the brightest. At least they didn't seem that way at the time. And you want to spread your own wings. And I just really credit my parents for saying, OK, as long as Paul stays because he's the most gifted in terms of driving a tractor and helping out with the farm. But I know my interest was not going to be the farm. At least I thought that was the case. And so, then I went to Hope College for four years and got into real estate my sophomore year of Hope College. WU: What type of program were you on at Hope from an educational standpoint. LB: Econ and Poli Sci. WU: Okay, and then you started to tell me about getting interested in real estate. So, let's pick it up from there. LB: Sure. My sophomore year at Hope College, I talked to Pete Wickstra, who I knew from church, and he had a son a few years older than me who had dropped out of law school and had gone back into their family real estate business and was obviously doing very well financially. And that looked like something of some interest to me. And Pete Wickstra was interested in mentoring someone who could work with Jim Wickstra and so that was the start of what would eventually become a partnership. And then eventually I bought out Jim Wickstra as he retired early. WU: So that's what you ended up as your life's work, basically? LB: My life's work was real estate. But an interesting aspect if we get back to the agriculture... WU: Yes, that's where I was hoping... LB: In ‘91, ‘92, I was involved in my largest development project. I, and two other partners, purchased a Girl Scout camp at School Section Lake, and we subdivided that into forty waterfront lots and cleaned that up and sold that. And I did very, very well in that project. Now, what I did with the profits from that project, I turned around and purchased a one hundred sixty-acre asparagus farm in Walkerville. So here I went from couldn't wait to get away from the farm to wanting to purchase a farm and recognizing how capital intensive a farm is because in addition to the land, you either have to have trees or in my case, asparagus roots, which is going to cost you another ton of money and then the equipment and then making sure you have labor to harvest, which might mean housing. So, I got into a pretty good-sized asparagus operation and one of the reasons was I had three young children and I realized my children did not have to work. I had to work growing up. There was no... never any question. If we wanted to eat, if we wanted a bicycle, if we wanted anything, we had to work for it. My children did not have that 10 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department luxury. I mean, they were… I'm not going to say they were born with a silver spoon, but how could I say we can't afford to buy you a new bike? So, by purchasing this asparagus farm and intentionally I stuck with asparagus because pretty much by the Fourth of July, you're done with the crop. You're done harvesting. You've closed it and there's still some minimal upkeep, but it's not like cherries and peaches where you're slaving and working hard all summer. This still gave... I expected my kids to work hard and I paid them well. And being the Dutchmen that I am, by paying them well, they could then pay for part of their college. I could deduct the amount that I paid them and write it off as an expense. WU: And they reported income at a lower bracket. LB: ...at a lower bracket. So, it worked out well. Plus, if I would have simply paid for their education, which I could have done, it… I don't think they would have appreciated it as much. Now, they had their own money to decide, “Hey, do I really want Hope College.” And my three kids went to Hope college, and one went to Northwestern in Chicago, and my daughter went to Syracuse. Now the one that went to Northwestern was about double what Hope College was and Hope College was fifty percent more than U of M, where he had been accepted. But Northwestern just had the feel for him and for him that was the right choice. But he knew he would never have a car while at college like my son, oldest son, did at Hope. You make sacrifices and that's okay. WU: Probably to fill out your family tree, so to speak, you were married when? LB: I graduated from Hope College and got married in 1979. WU: And your wife's full name? LB: My wife's full name is Ann Chase Davenport. And now, of course, Ann Chase Byl. WU: Right. LB: And she is from New Jersey. Her father... she's the youngest of four children and her father was a CPA at Rutgers University. And Mom was a stay at home mom who ended up doing some tax work later in life. WU: And you met Ann where? LB: At Hope College. WU: And was she in your class or? LB: She was in my class. WU: So, both of you graduated about the same time from Hope. LB: Yes. WU: And right from college, did you come back to Oceana immediately or was there an interlude there? LB: No, because I was working in the real estate business in the summers. By the time I was a senior at Hope College, I had a Monday night class, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday; Thursday night I was back here in Shelby working real estate Friday, Saturday... WU: With Wickstra? 11 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department LB: With Wickstra. WU: Okay. LB: So, I was working three days a week at Wickstra and my wife was a business major and right out of college she got a job at Silver Mills Food Processing in Accounts Payable. WU: Henry Perlowitz [?] and his gang came to town. LB: Yes. WU: Gosh, Dan Bernson [?] was a great friend of mine and I really miss Stan. [?] He's still alive, but I just don't get a chance to socialize with him like I did once upon a time in my life, but that's an aside. Why don't you name your children and best you can, at least, the years they were born. LB: Sure. I have three children. My oldest is Ben. He was born in or around 1981. Then I have Jacob. Jacob was born around 1983. And then I have Christa, who was born around 1986. WU: And all these children, I'm sure, are out of the nest now. LB: They are all out of the nest. They are all married. My oldest, Ben, went to Hope College and this is going to tie in with the farming. WU: Okay. LB: Ben graduated with a history degree. Now, why my kids were liberal arts instead of having something practical, I don't know. But he was a history major and out of college, he really didn't know what to do. So, he actually went into the Peace Corps and was in Madagascar for two and a half years where he worked in ecology, they called it, and in agriculture. And that really stirred his interest in that area. So, when he got back, he asked me to continue with the farming operation. In fact, we bought another 40 or 80 acres in just east of Shelby for fruit production and Ben then went and enrolled in a two-year master's program at Michigan State in Ag. Research, Fruit Tree Research, and started farming full- time and met an absolutely wonderful gal from Kent City, Amber [?], whose parents are big apple growers and neighbors of Vernon Bull. And so, Ben, today... she, Amber, was also in the Peace Corps and they had met at a Peace Corps event. And so, Ben is farming with his father-in-law, which allowed me to, as I semi-retire, I ended up selling my asparagus farm two years ago to Ryan and Chris Mahlberg. [?] I was holding the farm back in case Ben wanted to farm full-time, recognizing it’s so capital intensive. If there isn't some help from the parents, it's never going to happen right away. WU: Right. But at this point, it's more or less working. Did he marry this gal? LB: Yes, he married this gal; that is his wife. WU: And so, he's working with his in-laws? LB: And he's working with his in-laws. He puts on a lot of miles with his little S-10 pickup. He still has the eighty-acre farm here in Shelby, and that's largely cherries and apples, some cherries. And so, he and his wife, she works for Gordon Food Services buying products, especially fruits and vegetables for them because of her background. And they do a Farmer's Market on Fulton Street and in Rockford on Fridays and Saturdays. And they help run the family farm at Kent City, as well as the Shelby farm, 12 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department WU: Well, I'm going to lead you into community activity because I know you're very much involved in that. And then we'll see if there's anything special you want to say and items that I haven't touched, at least for the purpose of today. Just briefly, you're involved in your County Commissioner to begin with, correct? LB: Yes. WU: And you've been there for how long? LB: I have been a County Commissioner for around thirteen years. Before that, I was on the Shelby Village Council for about twelve years, including Village President. WU: And are you from a church or a service club situation? Why don’t you describe that? LB: Within the church family, I'm a member and the chairman of the Deacons of New Era Reformed Church. And for organizations, I am a member and have been for over thirty years to Shelby Rotary Club. And I'm a member of, of course, Farm Bureau, member of MSU Extension Advisory Committee. And that would be a four-county committee. And part of being a County Commissioner also puts you in with other activities. One is I'm a member of the Michigan Works and that would be the West Central and that would be a total of six counties. I'm one of three members representing Oceana County. So, we look and we have an office here in Oceana County and Shelby and we work hard to get enough employees with the farmers, which is becoming a bigger problem. WU: Just to get the help needed. LB: Just to get the help needed. And part of it is, when I was in high school, all high school kids worked. Today, that isn't the case. I'm not saying they're lazy, but they've got band camp, they've got football camp, they've got cross country camp, they've got basketball camp. They've got all kinds of things going on. WU: And in what ways have you seen our area change since your boyhood days? LB: Since my boyhood days, I would say when I was in school, I'm happy to say we've always had pretty good race relations. And that, what I mean by that, is the Hispanics that were in my high school class were friends and they still are friends. But that probably represented five to ten percent of the class. Today, I think both Hart and Shelby, probably forty to forty-five percent of the student population would be Hispanic. I'm not saying that's bad or good, but, you know, that's probably the biggest change. And what I have found, Hispanics - in general, and I'm generalizing - but they really value hard work. They don't value education. You're going to see a lot of the parents will encourage the boys at sixteen or seventeen: Why continue with school if you're going to... if you can work elsewhere. WU: And make some money right now. LB: Right. WU: Well, if someone listens to this interview or reads the transcript that eventually will be made, say, thirty or forty years from now. What would you most like them to know about your life and the community? LB: Well, one of the things... I'm going to borrow a phrase from my old or former Shelby High School or Shelby School Superintendent, John [?]. John said he couldn't wait - as he was growing up on a farm - he 13 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department couldn't wait to get away from burning wood. He said it seemed like every Saturday we had to go out, chop down trees, cut wood. And he said, you know what happened? Of course, he started building homes in the summer. And he said, as I got older, I went back to burning wood because I needed the exercise and I enjoyed it. And I think back probably my least favorite thing to do in the wintertime was cutting wood on Saturday, using a two-wheel drive pickup, getting stuck, and having to cut wood with my dad and brothers and not liking that at all. Hey, the last two or three years, I’ve really enjoyed cutting wood and stacking it and burning a little wood along with my gas. WU: Well, is there anything that you would like to share that I may not have asked you about? Sort of an open-ended question... LB: Sure. WU: ...to give you a chance to say something that you think is important to, as part of this interview. LB: And again, this interview primarily ties in with agriculture. I am hopeful that we will continue to remain to have a strong, viable agriculture community. Obviously, we have the food processing plants, Gerber is very important, Peterson is important. But when I first moved here, in fact, when I graduated from college in ‘79, there was no such firm as Peterson’s Food Processing. Things are always changing and embrace that change. And hopefully you will get some dynamic people like an Earl Peterson who will continue to invest in the area and that we have smart enough government officials that basically stay out of the way when you have a responsible person like Earl who's willing to invest. And you can go through history over the last one hundred and twenty years, those individuals have stepped up. And it just seems to me like government is doing what it can to put a harness and hold back some of those folks. And I'm hopeful that in this area will continue to see people - again, I use the word “responsible” people - who won't leave a legacy of pollution like they did in the White Lake area. But that will continue to employ people, buy products here, and do what we call value-added services to our agriculture. WU: Well, I see the time that we had allotted is about to expire here. Larry, I just want to thank you for your time and for sharing your memories with me. And this formally concludes our interview. Thank you very much. 14 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/c816ace3fec8a9d7c1ec5c3235a0d7d9.mp3 25f7e47e9ff6887f4a4bcd689b9622db Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Byl_Larry Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Byl, Larry Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Byl, Larry (audio interview and transcript) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Lawrence (Larry) Byl. Interviewed by Walter Urick on June 18, 2016 in Hart, Michigan. English language. Larry Byl was born in Grand Rapids, Michigan in 1957 as the son of two Dutch immigrants. Larry and his family moved to western Oceana County in 1966 and created a life for their family on their eighty-acre fruit farm, which over the years grew to become a three-hundred-acre farm. He attended Shelby High School where he took Future Farmers of America classes, and later graduated from Hope College in Holland, Michigan before finding his life’s work in real estate. Larry also served many years as County Commissioner and Village President for his community of Shelby, Michigan. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Urick, Walter (interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Fruit growers Future Farmers of America Hope College Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/317fc84919c703fcad00e13092c2e044.pdf 7fbb40c0eecbbc98af7a6bb55a3d31ee PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project Walter Urick Interview, May 26, 2016. Total Time – (59:39) Beginning • Walter is the president of the Oceana Historical and Genealogical Society • His family history goes back to Europe because he is a first generation American o His father grew up in Belarus o His mother grew up in Poland Background on Walter’s Father – (1:08) • His father migrated to America when he was 16 years old, following his cousin who had migrated to Chicago o His dad got a job in Chicago and went to school to learn English o He then went through training to become a barber • During the time of World War I, Walter’s father began migrating westward o His father went to Spokane and ended up working at a valet shop in a hotel there and then in Seattle o President Franklin D. Roosevelt visited Seattle once, and his father was the person who did President Roosevelt’s bowtie one day there His Father and Mother’s Relationship – (4:56) • Walter’s father went back to visit his parents in Europe for the first time in 1930 • On his second visit back in 1934, his father met his mother there o On February 24, 1935 Walter’s parents got married o After six weeks, Walter’s father returned to the U.S. but had difficulty getting his wife there too because he wasn’t a citizen yet o In 1938 Walter’s mother was able to come to the United States • Walter’s father had moved back to Chicago and the immigrant community there • His sister, Mary, was born in December of 1935 • Walter was born on June 3, 1939 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Moving to Hart – (7:54) • Walter’s father was in the dry cleaning business now • His mother wanted to have a dairy farm and make a living that way instead of staying in Chicago • So his father took the bus to Wisconsin in 1939 and found a farm there • His dad took a boat over to Ludington and got on a bus to return to Chicago o The bus broke down in Hart and his dad started walking around there while waiting o He met a realtor who said that Hart needed a dry cleaning business • Walter’s family moved to Hart in April of 1940 • His father started the cleaning business there in 1941, but had to shut it down with World War II o After the war, his father started Urick Dry Cleaners Walter’s Siblings – (13:32) • His sister, Mary, was born in 1935 • His sister, Lola, was born on December 16, 1940 • His brother, John, was born on March 7, 1944 • They all attended Hart Public Schools • As a boy, Walter had some difficulty with languages and learning to read because his mother spoke multiple languages Working in Agriculture – (17:09) • Walter’s family lived on a 27.5 acre farm, and they had about a half dozen dairy cows • He had to do farm chores • For a number of years, Walter, his sister Mary, and his mother would pick cherries by hand at Marshall Spencer’s and the Jacobs’ cherry farms • They started with strawberries in June, sweet cherries in late June, and then tart cherries in the middle of July • They also picked pickles during August at Norm Jensen’s farm • Walter picked all of these until he was 16 years old, when he got his first formal job working for Hart Cherry Packers and worked there for another 7 summers o He made $1 an hour 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • o There were weeks when he worked 101 hours He remembers how the cherries were processed at Hart Cherry Packers Harold Morgan’s cherries were extremely large, and they got processed separately and were sold for a higher price Growing up in Hart – (24:39) • Hart was a close-knit community while Walter grew up • People did their shopping right in Hart at family-run businesses • They were a faith-based community at that time • Walter’s father was from a Russian Orthodox background in Belarus, who had many fights with the Catholics there • The English family in Hart invited Walter’s family to the Wesleyan church there o He got involved in the church choir • In high school, Walter was part of sports, drama, and the debate program College – (32:06) • Walter was offered scholarships for universities’ pre-law programs because of his performance in the debate program • After graduating high school in 1957, he went to Albion College • He received the Sloan Scholarship for his last three years and graduated in 1961 o He had saved enough money to pay for law school at the University of Michigan o He graduated from U of M in 1964 Beginning of Law Career – (34:18) • In his last year of law school, Oceana County’s local circuit judge wanted to talk to Walter before he accepted a position after graduation • He had been offered a position at the largest law firm in Toledo and a few positions in Grand Rapids • Oceana’s judge warned him about possibly getting drafted into the army because of the war in Vietnam o If Walter took the job as the prosecutor for Oceana County, he could be exempt from the draft o So he accepted the job, but didn’t take the Bar Exam until September of 1964 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Oceana County Judicial Setup – (39:10) • On January 1, 1965 Walter became the Oceana County Prosecuting Attorney • He did this for six years • They had a justice of the peace system at that time • The township board of supervisors ran the county financially • Walter and the judge were the only two with college and professional training at the time Walter’s Wife – (43:18) • Karen, who would become Walter’s wife, came to Hart in 1966 with a friend • Karen became a junior high teacher there • She joined the church choir that Walter was a part of • They began dating and then were married August 26, 1967 o They had three children o Now they have grandchildren as well Legal Career Overview – (47:26) • The first 6 years, Walter was the part-time prosecutor, and he started his law practice • In 1976, he recruited young lawyers o Walter hired Tony Monton and they eventually became partners • In 1988, judgeship positions opened up • Walter was elected and had an 18 year career as the family court judge for Oceana County • Overall, he had a 42-year career in law The Brandel Case – (50:44) • One of the big issues that Walter handled that had to do with farming and migrants was the Brandel case o Jerry Brandel had migrants working on his pickle farm o Walter and Jerry succeeded in the case 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Retirement – (53:20) • Now that he is retired, Walter is active in his tennis club, his rotary club, his church, Oceana Singers, and the Oceana Historical Society Final Comments – (53:45) • Karen and Walter built their home on Hart Lake in 1975 • Walter had formed a real estate company with a couple other men o They had bought land to build apartments on, but then decided they wanted to build their own homes there instead • His sister, Mary, became a teacher and married Bruce Krueger • His sister, Lola, also was a teacher, and she married Richard Bierschbach, who worked for Steelcase • His brother, John, is a veteran of the Vietnam War and now has a sawmill business, and his wife is also a teacher • Walter’s father died in 1985, and his mother died in 2006 5 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0dde03689a0a68639360655de18fa0c1.pdf 335029e42ff8c07b350b75ec1e955769 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Una comunidad que cultiva: El proyecto de la historia agrícola de Oceana Entrevista de Walter Urick, May 26, 2016. Tiempo total – (59:39) (Traducido al espaňol por Kassie O’Brien, Juno 2016) El comienzo • Walter es presidente del Oceana Historical and Genealogical Society • Su historia familiar tiene raíces en Europa porque Walter es estadounidense de primera generación o Su padre creció en Bielorrusia o Su madre creció en Polonia Los antecedentes del padre de Walter – (1:08) • Su padre emigró a los Estados Unidos cuando tenía 16 años, siguiendo a su primo que emigró a Chicago o Su papá encontró trabajo en Chicago y asistió a la escuela para aprender inglés o Después recibió entrenamiento para ser barbero • Durante los años de la Primera Guerra Mundial, el padre de Walter empezó a emigrar hacia el oeste o Su papá fue a Spokane y encontró trabajo allí en el departamento de valet de un hotel, y después trabajó en Seattle o El presidente Franklin D. Roosevelt visitó Seattle, y un día el padre de Walter le ayudó al presidente con su corbatín La relación de su padre y madre – (4:56) • Su padre regresó a Europa para visitar a sus padres por primera vez en 1930 • El padre de Walter conoció a la madre de Walter en 1934 durante su segunda visita allá o Los padres de Walter se casaron el 24 de febrero de 1935 o Después de seis semanas, su padre regresó a los Estados Unidos pero tuvo dificultades de traer a su esposa también porque él no era ciudadano estadounidense o En 1938 la madre de Walter llegó a los Estados Unidos �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • El papá de Walter había regresado a Chicago y a la comunidad de inmigrantes allá • Su hermana, Mary, nació en diciembre de 1935 • Walter nació el 3 de junio de 1939 Mudarse a Hart – (7:54) • El padre de Walter estaba trabajando con la limpieza en seco • Su mamá quería ganarse la vida por medio de una granja de productos lácteos • Así que su padre viajó en autobús a Wisconsin en 1939 y encontró una granja allí • Su papá fue en barco a Ludington para regresar a Chicago por bus o El bus se estropeó en Hart y su papá deambuló por allí mientras esperaba o Conoció a un agente inmobiliario que le dijo que se necesitaba un servicio de limpieza en seco en Hart • La familia de Walter se mudó a Hart en 1940 • En 1941 su padre inició su empresa de limpieza en seco en Hart, pero la cerró durante los años de la Segunda Guerra Mundial o Después de la guerra, su papá fundó Urick Dry Cleaners Los hermanos de Walter – (13:32) • Su hermana, Mary, nació en 1935 • Su hermana, Lola, nació el 16 de diciembre de 1940 • Su hermano, John, nació el 7 de marzo de 1944 • Todos asistieron a Hart Public Schools • Como niño, Walter tuvo problemas con idiomas y el aprendizaje de la lectura porque su mamá hablaba varias lenguas Trabajar con la agricultura – (17:09) • La familia de Walter vivía en una granja de 27,5 acres y poseyó media docena de vacas lecheras • Walter tenía que hacer tareas de la granja • Por unos años, Walter, su hermana Mary, y su mamá recogían a mano las cerezas de los cerezales de Marshall Spencer y el señor Jacobs • Empezaban con las fresas en junio, las cerezas a finales de junio, y luego las cerezas amargas a mediados de julio • También recogían pepinillos de la granja de Norm Jensen en agosto �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • Walter recogía estos cultivos hasta los 16 años de edad cuando encontró su primer empleo formal con Hart Cherry Packers, y trabajó allí durante 7 veranos o Ganaba $1 por hora o A veces trabajó por 101 horas en una semana Recuerda el procesamiento de las cerezas en Hart Cherry Packers Las cerezas de Harold Morgan eran muy grandes, y se las procesaba por separado y se las vendían por precios más altos Crecer en Hart – (24:39) • Hart era una comunidad unida mientras crecía • Se iba de compras en el centro de Hart en las pequeñas empresas familiares • Entonces era una comunidad religiosa • El padre de Walter era de la iglesia ortodoxa rusa en Bielorrusia, la cual luchó mucho contra la iglesia católica allí • La familia English de Hart invitó a la familia de Walter a visitar la iglesia wesleyana o Walter participó en el coro de la iglesia • Walter participó en los deportes, el drama, y el club de debate durante los años en la secundaria La Universidad – (32:06) • Se le ofrecieron unas becas para programas de estudios previos de abogacía debido a su desempeño en el club de debate • Después de graduarse de la secundaria en 1957, asistió a Albion College • Recibió la beca Sloan durante los últimos tres años y se graduó en 1961 o Tenía suficiente dinero para pagar sus estudios de derecho en la Universidad de Michigan o Se graduó de la Universidad de Michigan en 1964 El comienzo de su carrera de derecho – (34:18) • Durante el último año de sus estudios de derecho, el juez de circuito del condado de Oceana quería hablar con Walter antes de que aceptara empleo después de la graduación �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • El bufete de abogados más grande de Toledo le ofreció un puesto y Walter también recibió ofertas de empleo en Grand Rapids • El juez de Oceana le avisó sobre la posibilidad de ser reclutado por el ejército debido a la guerra en Vietnam o Era posible evitar el reclutamiento si Walter aceptó el puesto de ser el fiscal del condado de Oceana o Así que aceptó el puesto pero realizó el examen de acceso a la abogacía en septiembre de 1964 El sistema legal del condado de Oceana – (39:10) • Walter llegó a ser el fiscal del condado de Oceana el primer día de enero de 1965 • Trabajó como fiscal por seis años • Por entonces había jueces de paz • La junta de supervisores del municipio se encargó de las finanzas del condado • Las únicas personas con educación universitaria y formación profesional en el pueblo eran Walter y el juez La esposa de Walter – (43:18) • Karen, quien luego se convertiría en la esposa de Walter, vino a Hart con una amiga en 1966 • Karen llegó a ser maestra de la secundaria allí • Se unió al coro de la iglesia en que participó Walter • Empezó a salir con Walter y luego se casaron el 26 de agosto de 1967 o Tuvieron tres hijos o Ahora tienen nietos también Resumen de la carrera judicial – (47:26) • Durante los primeros 6 años, Walter era el fiscal y abrió su propio bufete de abogados • En 1976, contrató abogados jóvenes o Walter contrató Tony Monton y con el tiempo se convirtieron en socios • En 1988, estuvieron disponibles unos puestos de magistratura • Walter fue elegido y pasó 18 años trabajando como el juez de la Corte de Familia en el condado de Oceana • En resumen, trabajó en el campo de derecho por 42 años �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department El caso Brandel – (50:44) • Uno de los temas importantes de que Walter se encargó fue el caso Brandel que tenía que ver con la agricultura y los trabajadores migrantes o Jerry Brandel empleaban a migrantes para que trabajaran en su cultivo de pepinillos o Walter y Jerry ganaron el caso La jubilación – (53:20) • Ya que se jubiló, Walter participa en su club de tenis, su club rotario, su iglesia, Oceana Singers, y el Oceana Historical Society Comentarios finales – (53:45) • Karen y Walter construyeron su casa al lado de Hart Lake en 1975 • Walter había establecido una compañía inmobiliaria con dos otros hombres o Compraron tierras para construir apartamentos, pero después decidieron que querían construir sus propias casas allí • Su hermana, Mary, llegó a ser maestra y se casó con Bruce Kruege • Su hermana, Lola, también llegó a ser maestra y se casó con Richard Bierschbach, quien trabaja para Steelcase • Su hermano, John, es veterano de la Guerra de Vietnam y ahora tiene un negocio de aserraderos, y su esposa también es maestra • El padre de Walter se murió en 1985, y la madre de Walter se murió en 2006 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e9ac742fa723a7601a1264bc155af79a.mp3 731deba272484b80401a6c7bec4f0215 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Urick, Walter (entrevista de audio y resumen) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista autograbada por Walter Urick, Mayo 26, 2016. Idioma en Inglés. Walter nació el 3 de junio de 1939. Es estadounidense de primera generación, porque su padre creció en Bielorrusia y su madre creció en Polonia. Walter tiene dos hermanas, Mary y Lola, y un hermano, John. Su familia se mudó a Hart en 1940, y después de la Segunda Guerra Mundial, su papá fundó Urick Dry Cleaners en Hart. Por unos años, Walter recogía fresas, cerezas, y pepinillos en granjas del área. Cuando tenía 16 años, encontró su primer empleo formal con Hart Cherry Packers. Durante los años en la secundaria, Walter participó en los deportes, el drama, y el club de debate, y se graduó en 1957. Después asistió a Albion College y luego estudió derecho en la Universidad de Michigan, y se graduó en 1964. Walter llegó a ser el fiscal del condado de Oceana el 1 de enero de 1965, y lo hizo por seis años. Conoció a su esposa, Karen, y se casaron el 26 de agosto de 1967. Tienen tres hijos. Durante ese tiempo, él estaba contratando abogados jóvenes, y con el tiempo Walter y Tony Monton se convirtieron en socios. Después Walter pasó 18 años trabajando como el juez de la Corte de Familia en el condado de Oceana. En resumen, trabajó en el campo de derecho por 42 años. Ya que se jubiló, Walter participa en su club de tenis, su club rotario, su iglesia, el Oceana Singers, y es presidente del Oceana Historical Society. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Oceana Historical Society Primera generación Bielorrusia Chicago Presidente Roosevelt Guerra Mundial Hart Granja de productos lácteos Limpieza en seco Cerezas Pepinillos Hart Cherry Packers Iglesia Debate Estudios de derecho Vietnam Fiscal Juez de la corte de familia Derecho Compañía inmobiliaria Maestra Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Urick_Walter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Urick, Walter Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-05-26 Title A name given to the resource Urick, Walter (audio interview and summary) Description An account of the resource Self-recorded interview by Walter Urick, May 26, 2016. English language recording. Summary in English and Spanish. Walter was born on June 3, 1939. He is a first generation American, as his father grew up in Belarus and his mother in Poland. Walter has two sisters, Mary and Lola, and one brother, John. His family moved to Hart in 1940, and after World War II his father started Urick Dry Cleaners in Hart. For a number of years, Walter picked strawberries, cherries, and pickles at farms in the area. When he was 16 years old, he got his first formal job working for Hart Cherry Packers. In high school, Walter was involved in sports, drama, and the debate program, and he graduated in 1957. He went on to Albion College and then to law school at the University of Michigan, graduating in 1964. On January 1, 1965 Walter became the Oceana County Prosecuting Attorney and held that role for six years. He met his wife, Karen, and they were married on August 26, 1967. They have had three children together. During that time, Walter was recruiting young lawyers and eventually became partners with Tony Monton. He then was the family court judge for Oceana County for 18 years. Overall, Walter had a 42-year career practicing law. Now that he is retired, he is active in his tennis club, rotary club, church, the Oceana Singers, and is president of the Oceana Historical Society. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource Oceana Historical Society First generation Belarus Chicago President Roosevelt World War Hart Dairy farm Dry cleaning Cherries Pickles Hart Cherry Packers Church Debate Law school Vietnam Prosecutor Family court judge Law Real estate Teacher Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/ec68a062eadd4c5c05f0fe9158460fb7.pdf c6a64eaa4e223e4bfaee2340dd35dd6c PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Russell Robbins Interview Total Time – (41:17) Interviewed by Walter Urick, February 19, 2016. Background • He is the son of Mason and Dorothy Robbins o His father worked for Doctor Munger from 1946 until 1959 • He was born in September of 1941 in Hart, Michigan o From a family of 9 girls and 2 boys • He graduated from Hart High School in 1960 Work History Overview – (1:27) • From 1950 to 1960 he worked with his dad at Doctor Munger’s farm in the summer • He bought and took over a gas station in 1960 • From 1965 to 1972 he ran a Dodge car dealership • In 1971 he started teaching part-time at West Shore Community College in Scottville as an automotive instructor • He worked up to be a self-educated technical person o He took a correspondence course in 1961 with the National Automotive Service Excellency Group o He helped to organize the state of Michigan’s mechanic certification test and mechanic certification procedures • In 1991 he went back into business because the college eliminated the automotive program, and so he had an independent shop until 2003 • He then got involved in the Hart Historic District as a volunteer Doctor Munger’s Farming Operations – (5:40) • Doctor Munger owned 500 acres of cherries by 1950, as one of the largest tart cherry growers in the world • Russell was involved in the operation by trimming trees, handling fertilizer…but he didn’t pick the cherries • It would take 400-600 people six weeks to pick all the cherries • Doctor Munger’s orchard locations 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department o o o o o o o 12 acres on West Main Street in Hart, which is now Plum Street 30 acres west on 64th called the Bray Farm 80 and 12 acres on the Clark Farm 27 acres on Tyler Road 144 acres on Poke Road at 116th, called the McDonald Farm 80 acres called the England Farm where Russell helped plant the cherries 400 acres on Juniper Beach ▪ Doctor Munger would sell lots there and people would build cottages ▪ 164 acres of cherries at Juniper Beach How the Cherries Were Harvested – (10:29) • They had two crews from 250 to 350 people • They would pick by trees instead of by rows • They put the cherries into lugs when picking • At the checkout station, the cherries would be weighed and people got punches in their tickets for all their cherries picked • Doctor Munger and his wife came in the payroll car every day to pay the workers o Because they paid in cash and therefore had $6,000-12,000 in their car, they had an armed guard with them • If a worker had 200 pounds and it was 2 cents a pound, they got $4 • It took about six weeks to pick the cherries • On an average day, 500 people would pick 70,000-80,000 pounds of cherries • The cherries had to be picked, hauled, taken to the canning factory, loaded and unloaded, etc • In 1954 Floyd Cargill changed to hauling cherries in water tanks in trucks The Cherry Pickers – (16:28) • There was discrimination so all of the workers were Caucasian • Doctor Munger would go to Florida every year to visit the people and recruit them • None were Hispanic in the 1950s • The workers came from Florida, Georgia, Arkansas, Missouri, Tennessee • They were housed in little cabins at a number of the farming locations • Russell worked there from when he was 10-19 years old 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department A Typical Work Day – (19:25) • They could work from 6:00am until 5:00pm • Around 300 people that came to work every year • The average male could pick 1,000 pounds of cherries a day o When paying him and his family, they could make $75-100 a day maybe • The camps had a central water location, but people showered in Lake Michigan • They always had to haul around 500 people and 200 ladders • Supervisors were school teachers or full-time employees • Some people would only pick the bottoms of the trees if they were leaving town, so some workers followed behind to clean up the tops • They had to haul the cherries to Oceana Canning Company in Shelby • Russell and his father started the cherry shaker program in 1957 after Doctor Munger’s son had taken over • Farming has gotten much more advanced today than those days Outstanding Memories – (27:30) • Russell and others would have fun on the sand dunes with their tractors • He contracted work from Pearl Anderson’s lunch stand, and he would sell candy bars and pop to the workers in the fields o He remembers a day when kids were fooling around with his pop selling business The Migrants and Doctor Munger’s Son – (31:37) • Russell’s first girlfriend, Shirley, was from Georgia o Her family came up to pick cherries, and they were a well-off family • He can remember other people that he worked with in the farms • Doctor Munger’s son wasn’t as much of a business man as his father, and the operations defaulted quickly • The Gebheart family bought it, and then Ronny Longcore bought it after that • The orchards got old and were taken out, and the area was developed into cottages Oceana County – (34:33) 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • Russell believes the number one factor to the area’s economy is the tourist business, such as Silver Lake and Pentwater o Double JJ Ranch is a boom to the economy too Second in the county is farming o Years ago they did farming manually, but today it is an agribusiness o Farming depends on the weather and the prices o Farmers are more educated today and processing plants help them out too Russell was offered the chance to move and teach in Flint, but he turned it down He was brought up at Knox’s Swamp Doctor Munger and His Wife – (38:08) • His wife, Edith, was involved in the farming operations by keeping the books and being in the payroll car every night • Doctor Munger had a free gas pump for all of his full-time employees • Their old house is now the Oceana Genealogical and Historical Society • Russell remembers a story of his father taking him to visit Doctor Munger’s house when he was young • Russell doesn’t regret being brought up on a farm o He feels sorry for the younger generation today that has so much mental stress as opposed to the physical stress that his generation went through 4 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/bede772e9a327c36fb2f7c7ddd0ad9f3.pdf e185f0342ef269127b736af32da15ae9 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Entrevista de Russell Robbins Tiempo total – (41:17) Entrevistado por Walter Urick, 19 Febrero 2016 (Traducido al espaňol por Kassie O’Brien, May 2016) Antecedentes • Él es hijo de Mason y Dorothy Robbins o Su padre trabajó para el Dr. Munger desde 1946 hasta 1959 • Nació en septiembre de 1941 en Hart, Michigan o De una familia de 9 mujeres y 2 varones • Se graduó de Hart High School en 1960 Historial de trabajo – (1:27) • Desde 1950 hasta 1960 Russell trabajó con su padre durante los veranos en las granjas del Dr. Munger • Compró y asumió una gasolinera en 1960 • Desde 1965 hasta 1972 poseyó un concesionario de Dodge • En 1971 empezó a enseñar a tiempo parcial como maestro de automoción en West Shore Community College en Scottville • Se enseñó a ser una persona técnica o Tomó un curso por correspondencia en 1961 con el National Automotive Service Excellency Group o Ayudó a organizar el examen de la certificación de mecánicos para el estado de Michigan y los procedimientos de la certificación • En 1991 volvió a su negocio porque la universidad eliminó el programa de automoción, y así tuvo un taller independiente hasta 2003 • Después se involucró con Hart Historic District (el distrito histórico de Hart) como voluntario Las operaciones agrícolas del Dr. Munger – (5:40) • En 1950, Dr. Munger poseía 500 acres de cerezas, como uno de los cultivadores de cerezas más grandes del mundo �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • Russell participó en las operaciones con la poda de los cerezos, la manipulación del abono… pero no recogió las cerezas Se requirió entre 400 y 600 personas trabajando por seis semanas para lograr recoger todas las cerezas La ubicación de los cerezales de Dr. Munger o 12 acres en la calle West Main en Hart, la cual ahora es la calle Plum o 30 acres al oeste en la calle 64, llamada Bray Farm o 80 y 12 acres llamada Clark Farm o 27 acres en la calle Tyler o 144 acres en las calles Poke y 116, llamada McDonald Farm o 80 acres llamada England Farm, donde Russell ayudó a plantar los cerezos o 400 acres en Juniper Beach ▪ Dr. Munger vendía lotes y había personas que construyeron cabañas allí ▪ 164 acres de cerezas en Juniper Beach Como se cosechaban las cerezas – (10:29) • Había dos equipos que tenían entre 250 y 350 personas • Se dividía el trabajo por cerezos en vez de por filas de cerezos • Se ponían las cerezas en cestas • Se pesaban las cerezas y los trabajadores recibieron marcas en sus recibos para denotar la cantidad de cerezas que recogieron • Dr. Munger y su esposa venían en el auto cada día para pagar a los trabajadores o Había un guardia armado con ellos porque pagaron en efectivo y tuvieron entre 6.000 y 12.000 dólares en el auto • Un trabajador recibió $4 si recogió 200 libras con una tasa de 2 centavos por libra • Duró más o menos seis semanas para recoger las cerezas • En un día promedio, 500 personas recogían 70.000-80.000 libras de cerezas • Se recogían y se acarreaban las cerezas, se transportaban las cerezas a la fábrica de conservas, se realizaba la carga y la descarga de las cerezas, y más • En 1954, Floyd Cargill empezó a acarrear las cerezas en tanques de agua en camiones Las personas que recogieron las cerezas – (16:28) • Existía discriminación, así todos los trabajadores eran caucásicos • Dr. Munger iba a la Florida cada año para visitar a la gente y contratarla �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • Ningún trabajador era hispano en los años cincuenta Los trabajadores vinieron desde Florida, Georgia, Arkansas, Missouri, y Tennessee Vivían en cabañas pequeñas en varios lugares Russell trabajó allí desde tenía 10 años hasta que tuviera 19 años Un día típico de trabajo – (19:25) • Se podía trabajar desde las seis de la mañana hasta las cinco de la tarde • Había cerca de 300 personas que regresaban a trabajar cada año • El hombre promedio podía recoger 1.000 libras de cerezas por día o Si se le pagó a él y a su familia, ellos podían ganar quizás $75-100 por día • Los campamentos tuvieron un lugar central de agua, pero la gente se bañaba en el Lago Michigan • Siempre tenían que transportar cerca de 500 personas y 200 escaleras • Los supervisores eran maestros o empleados de tiempo completo • Algunas personas solamente recogieron la parte más baja de los cerezos si iban a irse del pueblo, así otros trabajadores venían detrás para recoger las cerezas en la parte más arriba • Tenían que transportar las cerezas a Oceana Canning Company en el pueblo de Shelby • Russell y su padre iniciaron el programa de los agitadores de cerezos en 1957 después de que el hijo de Dr. Munger asumiera las operaciones • La agricultura es más avanzada hoy en día Memorias espectaculares – (27:30) • Russell y otros trabajadores se divirtieron con sus tractores en las dunas de arena • Russell trabajó para el puesto de almuerzo de Pearl Anderson, y vendió barras de chocolate y refrescos a los trabajadores de campo o Recuerda un día en que los niños estaban haciendo el tonto con sus negocios Los migrantes y el hijo de Dr. Munger – (31:37) • Shirley, la primera novia de Russell, era de Georgia o Su familia vino a recoger las cerezas y tenía bastante dinero • Russell puede recordar a otras personas con quien trabajó en los campos �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • El hijo de Dr. Munger no era hombre de negocios como su padre, y rápidamente las operaciones empezaron a fracasar La familia Gebheart compró las operaciones, y luego Ronny Longcore las compró Se envejecieron y se sacaron los cerezales, y se desarrolló el área para construir cabañas El condado de Oceana – (34:33) • Russell cree que el factor más importante a la economía del área es el turismo, como en Silver Lake y Pentwater o Double JJ Ranch ayuda la economía también • El segundo factor importante en el condado es la agricultura o En el pasado se hizo la agricultura de forma manual, pero hoy en día es agroindustria o La agricultura depende del tiempo y de los precios o Hoy en día los agricultores tienen más educación y tienen la ayuda de las plantas de procesamiento • Se le ofreció la oportunidad de mudarse a Flint para enseñar, pero Russell la rechazó • Él creció cerca de Knox’s Swamp Dr. Munger y su esposa – (38:08) • Su esposa, Edith, fue parte de las operaciones agrícolas porque mantuvo los registros y vino en el auto cada noche para pagar a los empleados • Había una bomba de gasolina al lado de la casa de Dr. Munger, y él permitió que sus empleados de tiempo completo la usaran • Su casa ahora es el Oceana Genealogical and Historical Society • Russell recuerda una historia cuando su padre le llevó a visitar la casa de Dr. Munger cuando era muy joven • Russell no lamenta que creció en una granja o Le inspira lástima la generación joven hoy en día que tiene muchísimo estrés mental a diferencia del estrés físico que enfrentó la generación de Russell � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/43b2e91d58a2b2a44c01efe0c72120ea.mp3 5c6c53bc001b904550cb60e53f600486 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Robbins, Russell (entrevista de audio y resumen) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista de historia oral con Russell Robbins. Entrevistado por Walter Urick. Febrero 19, 2016. Russell Robbins nació en septiembre de 1941 en Hart, Michigan. Es hijo de Mason y Dorothy Robbins. Durante los veranos desde 1950 hasta 1960, trabajó con su padre en el cultivo de cerezas del Dr. Munger. Russell participó altamente de varias maneras en las operaciones agrícolas de cerezas, tales como la poda de los cerezos, la venta de refrigerios a los trabajadores de campo, el comienzo del programa de los agitadores de cerezos, y más. Asumió una gasolinera en 1960, y desde 1965 hasta 1972 poseyó un concesionario de Dodge. En 1971 empezó a enseñar a tiempo parcial como maestro de automoción en West Shore Community College. Luego, tuvo un taller independiente hasta 2003. Después se involucró con Hart Historic District (el distrito histórico de Hart) como voluntario, disfrutando de la experiencia gratificante allí. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Dr. Munger Las operaciones agrícolas de cerezas Automoción Juniper Beach Discriminación El programa de los agitadores de cerezos El turismo Agroindustria Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Robbins_Russell Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Robbins, Russell Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-02-19 Title A name given to the resource Robbins, Russell (audio interview and summary) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Russell Robbins. Interviewed by Walter Urick. February 19, 2016. English language recording. Summary in English and Spanish. Russell Robbins was born in September of 1941 in Hart, Michigan. He is the son of Mason and Dorothy Robbins. During the summers from 1950 to 1960, he worked with his dad in Doctor Munger’s cherry farming. Russell was highly involved in the cherry operations in various capacities, such as trimming trees, selling snacks to field workers, beginning the cherry shaker program, and more. He took over a gas station in 1960, and then from 1965 to 1972 he ran a Dodge car dealership. In 1971 he started teaching part-time at West Shore Community College as an automotive instructor. Later, he had an independent shop until 2003. He then got involved in the Hart Historic District as a volunteer, enjoying a very rewarding experience there. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Urick, Walter (interviewer) Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource Dr. Munger Cherry farming operations Automotive Juniper Beach Discrimination Cherry shaker program Tourist business Agribusiness Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/2a6945f8e6c85ed00d72e0915834eedf.pdf 796870ca4007d30fda52530c8c1835f9 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project América Reyes Interview Total Time – (36:58) Interview by Penny Burillo, February 11, 2016 Translated into English by Kassie O’Brien, June 2016 Family Background – (recording 1) • Her maiden name was Trigo • América was born in El Realito, Tamaulipas • Her parents were repatriated American citizens o They were given land in Mexico o América’s parents were born in the U.S. but returned to Mexico • She lived in Mexico for all of her childhood • Her father was born in Lockhart, Texas, and her mom was born in Texas as well • Her mother lived in El Realito, Tamaulipas, in the municipality called Valle Hermoso o Her father lived in the same municipality • Her mother had a daughter from her first marriage o Her mom had three sons and three daughters with América’s father, who were all born in El Realito • América went to school there through sixth grade Coming to the United States – (4:27, recording 1) • Her father was the first to come to the U.S. to work, and her mother stayed in Mexico with all the kids • América came to the U.S. when she was 22 years old o She came with her brother o They lived in Dallas • She worked in a framing factory in Dallas for about two years Her marriage – (5:45, recording 1) • She got married in Dallas o Her husband’s name was Arturo Reyes and was from San Antonio, Texas • América was 23 years old when she got married �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • They first had a civil marriage, and then two years later they got married by a church in San Antonio • América has three children with Arturo, one girl and two boys Working as a migrant – (6:55, recording 1) • She started working as a migrant in 1997 when she separated from her husband • She came to Walkerville with her mother and brothers • She started by taking care of her brothers’ children, and later she started picking asparagus • She had never worked in farming before • Picking asparagus isn’t hard; the weather is what really is hard • They would start very early, like around 4:00am o They would end late sometimes too, like at 9:00pm or 10:00pm (Recording 2) • She worked with Carlos Moreno • They lived in some sort of small house The Beginning of Her Time in Oceana – (1:04, recording 2) • She felt very alone and really far from stores and everything else • It was hard not knowing her way around • América’s kids stayed in San Antonio during this time • América and her family would come in April or May and leave in November • They also worked with apples and zucchini • At the beginning, she arrived eager to work o But as time went on she missed her children Farming Work – (3:52, recording 2) • At first they were paid all in one check, but later on they got paid individually • They would pick vegetables in pairs, and América was paired up with her brother • They would return to San Antonio or sometimes to San Juan, Texas, in November o Her mother lived in San Juan • América has come from Texas with her family to work here every year since 1997 o Sometimes they went to different places, and she would work in a cherry factory or would pick grapes • She has worked indoors and also outdoors on tractors �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Her Daughter – (recording 3) • América has a 15-year-old daughter named Xochitl who was born in Texas o She was born in April of 2000, when they were going to come up to work • They put her daughter in a migrants’ daycare in Walkerville • At two months old, they detected that her daughter had a heart problem o When she was nine months old, she had a heart operation in Grand Rapids o Everything turned out well, and she doesn’t even take medications anymore • América stayed in Hart for the first time in winter in 2000 o It snowed a lot o She didn’t know anyone o The only person that helped her was a woman named Randa, who especially helped during the daughter’s medical operations Current Work and Life – (4:11, recording 3) • América now works at Michigan Freeze Pack • She has worked there varying years, and when they don’t have enough work she goes to other places like Indian Summer • It depends on where there is work available • She is now 57 years old • She does not have a pension plan because the places where migrants work do not offer insurances or similar things o When her family gets Medicaid, they use that o Her daughter always has Medicaid • América has more friendships here in Michigan than she does in Texas • She has some friends from work and some friends who have been social workers Future Thoughts – (8:45, recording 3) • She likes the air here as well as the peacefulness of the town • She doesn’t want her daughter to ever work in the fields o Her daughter is in ninth grade right now • América wants a stable job, because the work in the fields is seasonal �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • o Her daughter needs more medical insurance because América can’t pay for all the things needed to be done, like dental work She wants to stay in Michigan It is hard for her to pay for car insurance Advice for Young People – (12:20, recording 3) • She would say that it is okay to work part-time in the fields, but it is better if they study because working in the fields will not provide them with enough to live on • There are many things that a single women in this line of work cannot do o For example, a single woman can’t buy a house or a car because the expense is just too high o She would have to buy something second-hand, but this can be dangerous Final Thoughts – (15:06, recording 3) • Her older children came one season but they didn’t like it • She has gotten tired of always coming and going every year o She wants to stay in one place o It has been a big struggle in the schools in Texas; they aren’t very easily accepting o América has decided to stay in Oceana due to all of this • Life is easier now, but at the beginning they still fought to find a place to stay • Everything has been improving now o People are living in better housing than they used to � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/dde99b22bf71da324cd902192c2bf912.pdf 1fbf7696121ae5d4914a6e952f0ebcc4 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Una comunidad que cultiva: El proyecto de la historia agrícola de Oceana Entrevista de América Reyes Tiempo total – (36:58) Entrevistado por Penny Burillo, 11 Febrero 2016 Antecedentes familiares – (grabación 1) • Trigo es su apellido de soltera • Nació en El Realito, Tamaulipas • Sus padres eran ciudadanos americanos repatriados o Les dieron tierras en México a sus padres o Los padres de América nacieron en los Estados Unidos, pero regresaron a México • Pasó toda su niñez en México • Su papá nació en Lockhart, Texas, y su mamá en Texas también • Su mamá vivía en El Realito, Tamaulipas, en el municipio de Valle Hermoso o Su papá vivía en este municipio también • Su mamá tenía una niña de su primer matrimonio o Con el papá de América, tenían tres niños y tres niñas, y todos nacieron en El Realito • América fue a la escuela allí hasta el sexto grado Venir a los Estados Unidos – (4:27, grabación 1) • Su papá se venía primero a los Estados Unidos para trabajar, y su mamá se quedó en México con los niños • América vino a los EEUU cuando tenía 22 años o Se vinieron ella y su hermano o Vivieron en Dallas • Trabajó en una fábrica de cuadros en Dallas y duró allí unos dos años El matrimonio – (5:45, grabación 1) • Se casó en Dallas o Su esposo se llama Arturo Reyes y era de San Antonio, Texas • América tenía 23 años cuando se casó �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • Se casaron para el civil primero, y después de dos años se casaron por la iglesia en San Antonio • América tiene tres hijos con Arturo, una mujer y dos hombres Trabajar como migrante – (6:55, grabación 1) • Ella empezó a trabajar como migrante en 1997 cuando se separó de su esposo • Vino con su mamá y sus hermanos, y llegaron a Walkerville • Empezó a cuidar a los niños de sus hermanos y luego piscó espárragos • Nunca había trabajado antes en la agricultura • Piscar espárragos no es duro; lo que es duro es el clima • Empezaba muy temprano, como a las 4 de la mañana o A veces terminaba muy tarde, como a las 9 o 10 de la noche (Grabación 2) • Trabajó con Carlos Moreno • Vivían en un tipo de casa pequeña Al principio de su tiempo en Oceana – (1:04, grabación 2) • Se sentía muy solo y muy lejos de las tiendas y todo • No saber los caminos era difícil • Los hijos de América se quedaron en San Antonio durante este tiempo • La familia y América llegaban en abril o mayo y se iban en noviembre • También hicieron manzanas y calabacín • Al principio llegaba con ganas de trabajar o Pero con el tiempo les echaba de menos a sus niños El trabajo en la agricultura – (3:52, grabación 2) • Se pagaba en un solo cheque, y luego se pagaba individualmente • Piscaban por parejas, así América estaba con un hermano • Regresaban a San Antonio o a veces a San Juan, Texas, en noviembre o Su mamá vivía en San Juan • América ha venido de Texas con su familia para trabajar todos los años desde 1997 o A veces iba a lugares diferentes y trabajaba en una fábrica con cerezas o piscaba las uvas • Ha trabajado adentro y también afuera en un tractor �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Su hija – (grabación 3) • América tiene una niña de 15 años que se llama Xochitl, y nació en Texas o Nació en abril de 2000, cuando iban a venir a trabajar • La pusieron en la guardería de los migrantes en Walkerville • A los dos meses, detectaron que su hija tenía un problema de corazón o A los nueve meses, la hija tenía una operación de corazón en Grand Rapids o Todo salió bien y ya no toma medicinas • América se quedó en Hart durante el invierno por primera vez en 2000 o Se cayó mucha nieve o No conocía a nadie o La única persona que le ayudó a América fue la señora Randa, y especialmente ayudó durante las operaciones de la niña Trabajo y vida actual – (4:11, grabación 3) • Ahora América trabaja en Michigan Freeze Pack • Ha trabajado allí años variados, y cuando no hay trabajo allí ella va a otro lugar como Indian Summer • Depende donde hay trabajo • Ahora tiene 57 años • No tiene ningún plan de pensión porque los lugares en que trabajan los migrantes no tienen seguros o cosas así o Cuando su familia recibe Medicaid, usa esto o La niña siempre tiene Medicaid • América tiene más amistades aquí en Michigan que en Texas • Tiene amigas de trabajo y también amigas que son trabajadores sociales Pensamientos futuros – (8:45, grabación 3) • Le gusta el aire que hay aquí y le encanta que hay mucha paz en el pueblo • No le gustaría que su hija trabajara en el campo o Ella está en el grado nueve • América quiere un trabajo seguro, porque el trabajo con vegetales es por temporada o La niña necesita más seguro médico porque América no puede pagar por las necesidades de los dientes y otras cosas �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • Desea quedarse en Michigan Pagar las seguranzas de carro es difícil para ella Consejos para jóvenes – (12:20, grabación 3) • Diría que está bien trabajar en los campos a tiempo medio, pero mejor que se estudie porque trabajar en el campo no da suficiente para vivir • La diferencia de una mujer sola trabajar en este tipo de trabajo es que hay muchas cosas que no se puede hacer o Por ejemplo, no puede comprar casa o carro porque el gasto sería demasiado o Tendría que comprar algo de segundo mano pero eso puede ser peligroso Reflexiones finales – (15:06, grabación 3) • Sus hijos mayores vinieron por una temporada pero no les gustó • América ya se cansó de ir y venir cada año o Quisiera quedarse en un lugar o Se batalla mucho en la escuela en Texas; no les aceptan muy fácil o América decide quedarse en Oceana a causa de todo eso • Ahora la vida es más fácil, pero a los principios allí todavía se batallaba mucho para encontrar un lugar para quedarse • Todo ahora ha ido mejorando o La gente se queda en mejores viviendas que antes � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/9c3223006514704c414d8ec72b5303ba.mp3 42a97d81e236a90143d4caeb496a5717 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/6f6de35113d8f4e8c512a30906246429.mp3 95c18849fbef2170606ae9fd3e59a7ba https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e41f7ac3031eccb25cd7c9b35ff3e78b.mp3 ad1fe4bfcb0bacec5e3a8da0c93f91b2 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Reyes, America (entrevista de audio y resumen) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista de historia oral con America Reyes. Entrevistada por Penny Burillo. Idioma en Español. Febrero 11, 2016. América Reyes nació en El Realito, Tamaulipas, en México. Pasó toda su niñez en México. Vino a los Estados Unidos cuando tenía 22 años y vivía en Dallas, Texas. Se casó allí y tuvo dos niños y una niña. En 1997, América y su mamá y sus hermanos vinieron a Walkerville, Michigan. Empezaron a trabajar como migrantes, recogiendo vegetales en los campos. Ahora América trabaja en Michigan Freeze Pack. Desea quedarse en Michigan en el futuro. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms El Realito Tamaulipas México San Antonio Texas Fábrica Espárragos Matrimonio Agricultura Invierno Michigan Freeze Pack Seguro Temporada Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Reyes_America Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Reyes, America Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-02-11 Title A name given to the resource Reyes, America (audio interview and summary) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with America Reyes. Interviewed by Penny Burillo. Spanish language recording. Summary in English and Spanish. February 11, 2016. América Reyes was born in El Realito, Tamaulipas, Mexico. She lived in Mexico for all of her childhood. She came to the United States when she was 22 years old and lived in Dallas, Texas. She married there and had two sons and one daughter. In 1997, América and her mother and brothers came to Walkerville, Michigan. They began working as migrants, picking vegetables in the fields. América now works at Michigan Freeze Pack. She wants to stay in Michigan in the future. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Burillo, Penny (interviewer) Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource El Realito Tamaulipas Mexico San Antonio Texas Factory Asparagus Marriage Farming Winter Michigan Freeze Pack Insurance Season Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/3a453659d44fc2672a5ae26a5c88c85f.pdf 65fe89684562417053cb92899bdcafcb PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department German Ortega interview Interviewer: Penny Bruyu Interviewee: German Ortega Penny Bruyu: Testing 1,2,3. Testing 1,2,3. [people speaking in the background] This is Saturday the 18th of June. We’re in Hart, Michigan at the Hart Library. This is Penny Bruyu (?) and I’m speaking with… German: -German Ortega. Penny: German agreed to be interviewed today, um, [switches to Spanish] German, would you like to speak in English or Spanish? German: No, Spanish. Penny: Okay. Good, tell us something about yourself. German: Like...what? For example, what about [me would you like to hear]? Penny: When you were born, where, uh... German: Well, I...my name is German Ortega, em...I was born in a village inside the state of Nayarit, Puerta de mangos on the fourteenth of May in 1971. Eh, [it’s] ‘bout twenty-eight kilometers from the, from, from the edge of the sea, the Pacific. It’s...really beautiful. And, I came here in ‘82. To... Penny: To Michigan, or? German: To, no, well, I came to California, Idaho in ‘78. That’s where I was. In ‘79 I returned, I had [previously] worked six months, and I [had] returned to my village another time. The following year, in ‘79 I only came to Idaho. There I picked apples, onions, corn, and I returned to Mexico the ninth of October. From there I didn’t return for three years and then I came to Michigan in ‘82. [Walter speaking in the background] I came [to Mexico] for six months to study, but I’m still here after thirty years and counting that I don’t… [people speaking in the background] Penny: What were you going to study? German: I wanted to study ___ engineering. (1:50) I studied an hour and a half. Penny: Where? German: In a village named Rosamorada in Nayarit. Back then it was a z. Z number seventy-two. Now it’s called, I believe it’s called Zebeiti. I think it’s Zebeiti...but I came for six months and here I am still, I don’t know how [German laughs] [people speaking in the background] But yeah, I studied a year and a half, three semesters. 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Penny: And…when you uh, arrived here...how did you enter, where [did you] live, with who did [you] work, what... German: Well, I was in Idaho. Um... Penny: - Where in Idaho? German: Um...it’s called... [knocks on the table] Marsing. Marsing, Idaho. And I had an uncle here, an uncle of ours. His name is Nicolás [pause] Carrillo Duran. [He lived] here in Grand Rapids. He was working in Kalamazoo. So we spoke, and when we were talking he told us that there was work here. So we came to Grand Rapids for four months. [People speaking in the background] [German laughs] I worked getting rid of earthworms [begins laughing] for this golf course. Penny: Oh. German: I only worked at night. Yes, it was around three, four months, something like that. Then, one of my uncles who was here worked as a [inaudible, 3:13] and he told us to come because there was work picking peaches, so we came. They gave us a place to stay, they gave us everything, and...they treated us well. We liked the work here, we liked the way the people in charge treated us, and… Penny: Who were those in charge at Benona Hill Farms? German: The boss was Bill Burmeister and the la...I don’t remember what his wife’s name was. [long pause] [people speaking in the background] Penny: Vi Burmeister. (¿? No estoy segura de lo que dijo) German: Uh huh, y the one in charge was just Gerry. Gerry Burmeister. Gerry was the one who was in charge of everything. And it finished, the apple season, we picked...I started picking peaches my first year. Afterwards [we picked] apples, the following year asparagus. Cherry. We picked cherries by hand before. [inaudible, 4:06] And uh... Penny: What year was this? German: In ’82. From 1982 onwards [hits the table for emphasis] until I was working with Gerry in ‘95. I was only working in the field, and afterwards I entered into a company. Ah, Whitehall Leather, and I left the work in the fields. [people speaking in the background] Penny: And, what else uh, in your life [noise picks up as people in the background begin speaking] What occurred in your life during these years? German: Well, sad things! Because in, i think it was in eighty...no wait, I don’t remember the year. It was in ‘86, no, ‘84 or ‘85. Um, I got sick, from appendicitis. My appendix burst and I spent...many 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department weeks without work. Like six...six weeks. And, and those who where there [hits desk] well, they fed me, they gave me ten dollars eachPenny: - But, where were you? German: Here, in the camps! I worked there, I was there in the camps working. I, I, I got sick and I don’t know...they performed emergency surgery and I was without work for six weeks. It was little by little that I recuperated. See…[Walter speaking in the background] and, right in the middle of, for example, when the cherry harvest ends, peaches, no with the asparagus we could sometimes take three weeks, or occasionally a month. Afterwards we would go to Ohio, [we’d go] there, or we would go to Traverse City to pick strawberries. Uh, or to Ohio to pick tomatoes. That’s what we did. [Speaking in the background] HowPenny: -You say that’s what we did, who were you with? German: We were, there was Mario [inaudible] a young man named [inaudible] ¿Caliento nonato? Nicolás Carillo, Víctor Cordero, and I. That’s all, it’s just that we were always together ever sincePenny: [noisy] - Were they all from your village? German: We all were from the same village, yes. Penny: From, from Puerta de Mangos? German: From Puerto de Mangos. [inaudible] We followed him because he spoke English, well, he spoke the most English. Um, and he had a car, therefore he would give us rides. We looked for jobs and everything, but, we were always together, all of us. Penny: And when you finished with the jobs available [to you] in Michigan, what did you do? German: When worked finished up, we would wait to work in tinos? Right there with the boss, but he gave us a [plazo] to leave the camp. For example, the tenth of November, we would sometimes work [inaudible] and we would go to Florida to work in the strawberry [harvest]. We had somewhere to stay there too. Penny: What part of Florida? German: Glen City, Florida. There, if an uncle of mine got there first he would arrange for us to stay in a house and everything. It all finished out well here, and we’d go down there to work. We barely ever struggled with the work because one of us always went ahead. Eh, because of the cold or what have you. But someone went ahead, and so, the job would finish there, we’d work picking strawberries, oranges we would also harvest. The oranges we didn’t have a boss for because [people speaking in the background] we only had to look and find where there were people harvesting 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department oranges and ask for work. And so, the strawberries would finish in March, March or April, and we’d call our boss and ask if everything was ready. If the camp was open. To, to prepare. Penny: The same boss, Burmeister? German: Yes, the same one. Uh huh. He’d call us and let us know that we could come whatever day, the camp was already open and we could enter. Everything was ready for the asparagus, and like that we’d return. Apple season would end and then [we’d stay] for strawberry [season] and we’d return to here [Michigan]. Yes, it was for, like ten years that we went going back and forth and then after I stopped for a year. It was for two, butPenny: And you, um, you got married right? [people speaking loudly in the background] German: I got married in...oh God. [pauses] Eighty... Penny: How many kids do you have? German: I have five kidsPenny: And when was your first child born? German: [stutters] twenty...ninth of May. The May 29th 1985. Benny, Benny Brian Ortega. Penny: And so, when did you get married? [pause] Or when did you get together with-? German: I got together, I got together with the mom of my children. Penny: What’s the name of your children’s mother? German: Her name is Mariza Lozano. Um...I had five children with her and…[Walter keeps speaking in the background] at the time I got married, I don’t remember how many years afterwards, two, three, I don’t know. But we had...after Benny followed Cristina. She was born the third of...March 6th of 1987. After Cristina, Herman was born [on] the 14th of November, November 14th of ‘91. Laura was born next, August 17th of ‘94, and Luis [was born] July 8th of ‘99. We had five kids and, and we lived comfortably but...things happen. But we did continue, we both worked in the camp. Um, we would arrive to pick peaches, apples or asparagus, everything. I’d help her with the kids, to-or make food, with the food. She’d do something else, but um...we lasted a while working in the camp. [Conversation continues in the background] For some seasons we worked for Peterson. No, only when another harvest would begin, be it the peaches or apples. Penny: And when you say Peterson, um [conversation continues in the background] [do you mean] Peterson Farms? German: Peterson Farms in, in the grocery store. Penny: O-okay. What did they produce [she uses the wrong form of the word in Spanish, the intent was to say produce in past tense]? 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department German: There we worked [picking] cherries [he uses the English word for cherry as opposed to the Spanish]. Until today they still pick cherries. In a group we would collect only-well, I worked outside cleaning the tanks, taking out the trash with a, with a strainer, taking care of the leaves, all of that. Marisa worked in the line taking out the pits, rocks, getting rid of all that. And...finally when work began here, they’d call us to tell us that it was beginning and we’d leave the grocery store here, even though there was work. And, uh, when we stayed here, when I got married, we started to stay. After ten, twelve years. I finally decided to work the winter with Peterson in the grocery store, sometimes working with peaches, sometimes apples. [Conversation continues in the background] And the work in the camps would begin, and again I’d go. With the time, I, I got accustomed to a company and uh, and finally the year was very round (?) I left the camps, we left the camp um, she looked for work in a (??) and I in another and um, and we left the camps. We didn’t, we didn’t work. Even now I don’t work in the camps. Penny: When you left Peterson’s camps, where did you start working? German: When I left, I, it was a [inaudible] I worked there for five years. Penny: And what did you do there? German: There in [company is inaudible]we would ___ cowhide, for shoes. Apparently [there were] many government contracts, for the army [army was said in English] it was the most, the most, almost everything was for the army. And I worked there for five years. I would beat the cowhide so that they could go into the oven and be tanned. [Alongside me] there was Mario, Mario Engurre, Victor Cordero, we were, we were the ones who always would get together and almost always were together working in different areas. And...after five years the company shut down, [conversation in the background becomes more loud] and-everyone went their own way. So, now no, we don’t get together anymore. Um, we had to work with the hide, the same as [company name is inaudible] we worked there with the hide of pigs, also for the same type of shoes. Penny: Where, what Wolverine? German: Ah, I can’t pronounce Rockford, um, in the state of Michigan. Rok-Rockford. Penny: Oh, Rockford, Michigan? German: Uh huh, Rockford, Michigan. There we worked uh, for four years. But during these four years I had a car accident. And...then I left for that reason too. Also because I could no longer work in this place, because, well, I couldn’t. The doctor told me that I could no longer do so, I couldn’t work there anymore, I wasn’t able to and so I left. And…[conversation continues in the background for a few seconds] 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Penny: What happened after the accident? German: After the accidentPenny: -When was the accident? German: [both begin to speak] the accident was...September 28th of ‘94-of 2004. Penny: 2004? German: 2004, um, after that, the accident, I didn’t work for four years. I left for Mexico, I didn’t come here. I didn’t work. Penny: What, what injuries did you have, what, what happened to you during the accident? German: We flipped and uh, I, well they say that it was pretty ugly. I was dead, lost and a part of me, um, well I don’t-I don’t remember what happened at all. Nothing of the accident, I don’t know. Um, the only thing that I know is that I woke up in the hospital and I stayed there, I stayed there a while. [Someone begins laughing in the background as part of the other conversation] It took some time for me to recuperate. With the, um, with the time I, the accident broke my knee. I broke part of my collar- the [both say collarbone in English] Umm. Penny: Oh, okay, collarbone. German: Collarbone, the ribs, eh, I had many operations on my stomach which was turned inside out. The operated on me [conversation in the background grows loader] and thanks to God that all turned out well. Well, it resulted well physically but not, not well with everything in order to...and uh, I was like that for four years without working at least, going to doctor appointments, overall. Afterwards I applied to a company that...it’s called Oceana Food. There um...there we worked in [picking] cherries, blueberries, granada, cranberries…[all fruits said in English] Penny: And what happened with those? German: There [both attempt to speak] they process them, hydrate them. There they hydrate them, through ovens. Everyone works with the ovens and it turns out in a style whichPenny: Dry, dry [second dry is said in English], like? German: Yes, dry. Penny: Like raisinsGerman: Yes, like raisinsPenny: Like raisins (said in English). German: Uh huh, and this is what I do. I work relieving because, I can’t, I can’t do anything requiring force. But this [cell phone begins ringing] In, in um [conversation in the background continues alongside a phone vibrating] 2008 [phone vibrates]. During the year 2008, in July of 2008 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department [conversation and vibrating continues] and until now we are- [vibration interrupts him] we are working there thanks to God. We are well [vibrations continue rapidly] I like the job, I like[vibrations continue in rapid sequence]. Penny: -Um, [vibrations stop]. Did you enter as a migrant [recording is full of static] with papers or without? German: When I first entered the United States it was without papers. I entered through the city of Tijuana with [inaudible] San Diego. And, and in that time it was easy to enter. They’d say “wait for me for two hours in such and such place” and I would arrive in Tijuana through the other side. And each year that I came I entered without papers. Here in the United States, and [conversation can be heard loudly in the background] over time [German coughs] over time it became harder too and thanks to [God] we were able to fix everything. Penny: And how was that, the process ofGerman: The process of fixing [our study] was through amnesty. In ‘85, in ‘86 something like that, and uh, thanks to God we qualified for, for this program and we fixed our status. Penny: And you’re still a permanent resident? German: No, thanks to God and a woman named Penny Bruyu? Who helped me a lot in the process of becoming a citizen. Penny: And when did you become a citizen? [bang on table] German: In ’96. In...yeah in ’96 I became a citizen after nearly twenty years [conversation continues in the background]. Penny: And have you studied English or gone to a university (she uses the term for high school here but means higher education), the dreams you had how-? German: I let go of my dreams. I never, I couldn’t study anymore, not even here. I only went to school one day here and couldn’t continue [inaudible] [conversation in the background is louder than German]. I went one day, only one day and-it’s just that I don’t have time with my job and family. Or, it’s more that I don’t want one [university education] because if I wanted one I’d be able to. All those who really want it can, and maybe I didn’t [want it enough]. Penny: And...what is your impression of Oceana county? What-what... German: Well, for me Oceana County is my life, my village, it’s my-my city is here. Everything [is here]. It’s my México over there, because here...I grew up here um, here I-I made-uh I had everything unfold well. Uh, my job, family, my people, everything is better than over there. Much better than over there, here it is as calm as it gets. 7 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Penny: Do you have family here apart from your kids? German: I have brothers, I have two more brothers. I have [murmurs] four cousins on my dad’s side and from my mom’s side too- [conversation in the background continues loudly]. Penny: And when you became a citizen were you able to help your family? German: Yes, thanks to God we were able to help. I helped my parents legalize their status and thanks to God they became citizens thanks to the help of the woman I mentioned earlier. Penny: And what are the names of your parents? German: My dad’s name is Pablo Ortega Manzo and my mom’s name is Felina de Chiga Herrero. Penny: And they, um, are citizens or residents or how-? German: They are citizens, thanks to God. They’re, they’re now Americans. Penny: So, so by...by coming here illegally and fixing your migrant status you made [yourself a] resident permanent, American naturalized citizen. You fixed and naturalized yourGerman: My parents. Penny: Your parents, like permanent residents and now they became American citizens. German: Yes, uh huh. Thanks to God, they could and they did. Penny: Uh huh, yeah. Is there something of your personal history that you would like to share? German: [long pause, conversation continues in the background] Well only...to give thanks to the county. The county have-has treated me well, I haven’t gotten into any problems and I’ve remained tranquil with everything. Penny: Your-your life has beenGerman: -As calm as it is possible to be here. I-much better than Mexico. I don’t discriminate [against] Mexico but, it’s as, it’s pretty. Penny: Thank you very much, we are going to end the interview. This is the end of the interview with German Ortega, uh, the 18th of June 2016 in Hart, Michigan. 8 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/ff9c7bc5d8c99bdadce342ce0e2aa48e.pdf 7f4623ea624b836850c0c3e2c646dd0d PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Entrevistador: ¿Penny Bruyu? Entrevistado: German Ortega Penny Bruyu: Testing 1,2,3. Testing 1,2,3. [personas hablando en el fondo] This is Saturday the 18th of June. We’re in Hart, Michigan at the Hart Library. This is Penny Bruyu (?) and I’m speaking with… German: -German Ortega. Penny: German agreed to be interviewed today, um, ¿German puedes hablar en inglés o español? German: No, español. Penny: Okey. Bueno, dinos algo de usted. German: Como… ¿de qué? Por ejemplo, de, ¿de qué? Penny: Cuando naciste, donde nacisteis, uh… German: Bueno, yo…me llamo German Ortega, este…nací el catorce de mayo del ’71 en un pueblo del estado de Nayarit. Puerta de mangos. Eh, ‘ta veinte y ocho kilómetros de la, del, del orilla del mar, del pacífico. Este…muy bonito. Y, me vine en el ’82 para acá. Para… Penny: ¿Para Michigan o? German: Para, no, bueno en el ’78 me vine a, a…para la California para Idaho. Allí tuve. En el ’79 me, me regre-trabajé seis meses, me regrese a, a mi pueblo otra vez. El siguiente año en el ’79 vine para Idaho, nada más. Pisque manzana, cebolla, elote, y me regrese de nuevo en octubre para, para México. De ya no vine por tres años, y me vine en el ’82 ya para Michigan. [Walter hablando en el fondo] Vine por seis meses para estudiar, pero aquí estoy todavía, treinta y tal años que no… [personas hablando en el fondo] Penny: ¿Qué ibas estudiar? German: Quería estudiar para ingeniar orónimo (¿? 1:50) Estudie año y medio. Penny: ¿En dónde? German: En un pueblo que se llama Rosamorada en Nayarit. En ese tiempo era zeta. Zeta número setenta y dos. Y ahora se llama, creo que Zebeiti (¿?) Pienso que Zebeiti...pero vine por seis meses y aquí estoy todavía no sé cómo. [German se ríe] [personas hablando en el fondo] Pero si estudie año y medio. Tres semestres. Penny: Y…cuando llegasteis aquí ah…como enterasteis, donde viví, como con quien trabajar, que… German: Bueno, yo estaba en Idaho. Este… Penny: - ¿qué parte de Idaho? German: En…se llama… [toca la mesa] Marsing. Marsing, Idaho. Y aquí estaba un tío, de nosotros, un tío. Que se llama Nicolás [pausa] Carrillo Durán. Aquí en Grand Rapids. Trabajaba en un compañía en Kalamazoo él. Y…hablamos, hablamos y nos dijo que aquí, aquí había trabajo. Y nos venimos a Grand Rapids, duramos como cuatro meses en Grand Rapids. [personas hablando en el fondo] [German se ríe] Trabajaba sacando lombrices. [está riéndose] para el campo de golf para la pesca. 1 �Penny: O. German: Puro de noche no más. Si, como tres, cuatro meses algo así. Y ya, un tío mío aquí trabajaba como un [inaudible, 3:13] Y nos dijo que nos vinieramos que ya había pizca durazno que nos vinieramos. Y…nos vinimos y allí nos dieron casa, nos dieron todo y…y nos trataron bien. Allí, nos gustó el trabajo, nos gustó el trato de los, de los patrones. Y… Penny: ¿Quién eran los patrones de Benona Hill Farms? German: El patrón era Bill Burmeister y la seño…no me recordó cómo se llama la esposa. [pausa larga] [personas hablando en el fondo] Penny: Vi Burmeister. (¿? No estoy segura de lo que dijo) German: Aja, y el encargado nada más fue Gerry. Gerry Burmeister. Gerry era el que se encargaba de todo. Y ya se terminaba la, la pizca de manzana, pizcábamos…empecé pizcando durazno mi primer año. Después, manzana, siguiente año espárrago. Cherry [cereza], se picaba a mano la cherry [cereza] antes. [inaudible, 4:06] Y este… Penny: ¿En qué año fue eso? German: En el ’82. Ya de la ’82 para acá [pega la mesa con su mano para énfasis] ya hasta el ’95 cuando estuve allí con Gerry. Trabajando en el campo, nada más. Y ya después me mete en una compañía. Ah, Whitehall Leather, y ya me salí del campo. [personas hablando en el fondo] Penny: Y, que más uh, en su vida [hablando en el fondo se hace más ruidoso] ¿qué pasó en su vida entre estéis años? German: ¡Pos, cosas tristes! Porque en él, como en el ochien…no me recuerdo que año, fue en el ‘86 no, ’84, ’85. Este, me enferme. Del apéndice. Me a reventó el apéndice, dure…muchas semanas sin trabajar. Como seis, seis semanas. Y, y los que estábamos allí [pega la mesa] pos allí me daban de comer, me daban diez dólares por semana cada quienPenny: - pero ¿dónde estabas? German: Allí en el campo. Allí trabajaba, allí en el campo trabajando. Me, me, me enferme y no este…me operaron de emergencia y seis semanas dure sin trabajar. Y ya poco a poco me recuperaron. Este… [Walter hablando en el fondo] y, ya en miedo del, por ejemplo, cuando se acababa la cherry el durazno que, no el espárrago que durábamos dos, tres semanas o un mes a veces, nos íbamos para Ohio. A la, o a Traverse City para pizca de la fresa. Uh, o a Ohio al tomate. Así andamos. [Hablando en el fondo] ComoPenny: -Y dice así andamos, ¿con quién andabas? German: Andábamos, era Mario [inaudible] un muchacho que se llama [inaudible] ¿Caliento nonato? Nicolás Carrillo, Víctor Cordero, y yo. Nada más, es que andábamos siempre juntos desdePenny: [ruidosa] - ¿y todos eran de tu pueblo? German: Todos éramos del mismo pueblo, todos éramos. Penny: ¿De, de Puerta de Mangos? 2 �German: De Puerto de Mangos. [inaudible] Lo seguíamos a él porque él hablaba inglés, pues más, más inglés. Este…y tenía carro, entonces él nos traílla y nos llevaba. Buscaba trabajo y todo eso, pero, siempre anduvimos juntos, todos allí. Penny: ¿Y cuando terminaba el trabajo aquí en Michigan, que hacían? German: Cuando se terminaba el trabajo, este, ¿nos iba-nos esperábamos a trabajar en los tinos? Allí mismo con el patrón, pero nos daba un plazo para salir del campo. Por ejemplo, el diez de noviembre, entonces a veces trabajábamos [inaudible] y nos íbamos pa’ la Florida a trabajar en la fresa. Ya teníamos a donde llegar allí también. Penny: ¿Que parte de Florida? German: Glen City, Florida. Allí hasta, se iba primero un tío mío, y nos conseguí la casa y todo. Y ya se terminaba aquí todo bien. Y nos íbamos para halla, y ya llegábamos para trabajar. Nosotros casi no batallábamos nada para el trabajo porque siempre iba alguien pa’ delante. Eh, por el frío, o por lo que sea. Pero se iba adelante, entonces este, se acaba el trabajo allá, pizcábamos fresa, naranja también pizcábamos. La naranja no teníamos patrón porque [personas hablando en el fondo, muy ruidoso] nada más a ver adonde pizcar naranja y pedíamos trabajo. Y este, y ya se acababa la fresa en marzo, marzo/abril, nos hablaba el patrón que ya estaba listo. El campo abierto. Para, pa’ preparar. Penny: ¿El mismo patrón Burmeister? German: Si, el mismo. Aja. Nos hablaba que ya nos podíamos ir cualquier día. Ya estaba el campo abierto, ya podíamos entrar. Y estar listo para el espárrago. Y así volvíamos, se acababa la temporada de la manzana la fresa, y de la fresa acababa y nos venimos aquí. Si, por, yo como diez años dure yendo y viniendo y ya después pare un año. Pare dos, peroPenny: Y este, eh, ¿te casaste no? [personas hablando en el fondo, ruidoso] German: Me case en el…hay dios. [pausa] ochenta… Penny: ¿Cuántos hijos tienes? German: Tengo cinco hijosPenny: ¿Y cuando nació tu primer hijo? German: [tartamudo] veinte y…nueve de mayo, veinte y nueve de mayo del ’85. Benny. Benny Brian Ortega. Penny: ¿Y cuándo te casaste entonces? [pausa] ¿O juntaste con-? German: Me junte, me junte con la mamá de mis hijos. Penny: ¿Cómo se llama la mamá de sus hijos? German: Se llama, se llama Marisa Lozano. Este…con ella tuve cinco hijos y este… [Walter sigue hablando en el fondo] al tiempo me case no me recuerdo cuantos años después, dos, tres. No sé. Pero tuvimos después de Benny siguió Cristina, nació el tres de…marzo seis ’87. En seguida nació Herman, noviembre catorce, noviembre catorce del ’91. Después sigue Laura, agosto diecisiete ’94. Y Luis, julio ocho del ’99. Tuvimos cinco hijos y este, y vivimos ajustó, pero…las cosas pasan. Pero si seguimos, trabajamos los dos en el campo. 3 �Este, llegamos de pizcar durazno lo que pueda manzana o esparrago, de todo. Yo le ayudaba a los niños a-o hacer la comida, con la comida. Hacia otra cosa, pero, este…duramos un rato en el campo, trabajando. [conversación en el fondo continúe] Por temporadas trabajamos con-con Peterson. No, nada más mientras empezaba otra cosecha, ya se el durazno o la manzana. Penny: Y cuando dice Peterson, eh, [conversación sigue en el fondo] ¿Peterson Farms? German: Peterson Farms en, en la bodega Penny: O-okey, ¿que producaban [quiere decir producían]? German: Allí se trabaja la cherry [cereza]. Se trabaja la cherry [cereza], hasta ahorita todavía. En una banda sacábamos nada más-pues yo trabajaba afuera limpiando los tanques sacando la basura con una, con un colador, sacando las hojas, todo eso. Marisa trabajaba en la línea sacando los huevos, sacando las piedras, sacando todo eso. Y…ya cuando empezaba acá el trabajo, nos llamaba que ya empezaba y nos dejábamos de la bodega acá, aunque hubiera trabajo. Y, este, cuando nos quedábamos aquí, cuando me case, nos empezamos a quedar. Después de diez, doce años. Ya me mete a trabajar el invierno con Peterson en la bodega igual a, a veces durazno, a veces manzana [conservación en el fondo]. Y ya empezaba el campo [y] empezaba otra vez y me salí. Ya con el tiempo, me, me acomode una compañía y este…y ya el año fue muy redondo (¿?) me salí del campo, nos salimos del campo eh, ella busco un trabajo en un (¿?) yo en otro y eh, y nos salimos del campo ya no, ya no trabajamos. Hasta ahorita ya no trabaja en el campo. Penny: ¿Cuándo saliste del campo de Peterson, donde empezaste a trabajar? German: Cuando salí, me, fue a [inaudible] allí trabajé por cinco años. Penny: ¿Y qué hacéis allí? German: Allí en [compañía inaudible] nosotros acabamos el cuero de vaca, para el zapato. Según muchos contrates para el gobierno, para el army era lo mas, lo mas, casi todo era para el army. Y trabajé por cinco años allí. Yo pegaba los cueros, para entrarán el horno para se curtieron. Y era Mario, Mario Aguirre, Víctor Cordero, éramos los, los que siempre nos juntábamos y casi siempre estábamos juntos trabajando en lugares. Y…Después de cinco años cero la compañía, [conversación del fondo se hace más ruidoso] y-cada quien se fue por su lado. Entonces, ya no, ya no nos juntábamos para nada. Eh, tuvimos que trabajar en los cueros, lo igual a [nombre de compañía es inaudible] allí trabajamos el cuero del puerco. Para el zapato igual. Penny: ¿en donde, que Wolverine? German: No puedo decir Rockford, eh, en el estado de Michigan, Rok-Rockford. Penny: Oh. ¿Rockford, Michigan? German: Aja, Rockford, Michigan. Allí trabajé este, por cuatro años. Pero en ese tiempo de los cuatro años tuve un accidente de carro. Y…y ya me salí por ese motivo también. También, porque ya no podía trabajar en ese lugar porque pues, no podía. El doctor me dijo que ya no pude, que ya no trabajaré allí, no podía y me salí. Y… [conversación sigue en el fondo por un par de segundos] Penny: ¿Qué pasó después del accidente…? 4 �German: Después del accidentePenny: ¿Cuándo fue el accidente? German: [los dos tratando de hablar] el accidente fue…septiembre 28 del ’94-del 2004. Penny: ¿2004? German: Del 2004, este después de allí, del accidente, dure cuatro años sin trabajar. Me fui para México, no fui aquí, no fui a trabajar. Penny: Que, que ardidas tenias, que, ¿que te paso en el accidente? German: Nos volteamos, y este, me-pues dicen que estuvo muy feo. Estuvo muerto, perdido y a parte de mi, y este, pues yo no ¿?? No recuerdo lo que paso, nada. Nada del accidente, nada no se. Este, lo único que se es que ya desperté en el hospital y allí dure, dure tiempo. [Alguien se ríe en el fondo como parte de otra conversación] Dure tiempo en recuperarme. Con el, eh, con el tiempo me, el accidente m-me quebró la rodilla. Me quebré parte de mi espoleta del collar- el [los dos dicen collarbone] [la clavícula] ehh. Penny: Oh, okey, collarbone. German: Collarbone, las costillas eh, tuve muchas operaciones en el estómago me reventó por dentro. Me operaron [conversación en el fondo es ruidoso] y gracias a dios que quede bien, bueno, quede bien físicamente pero no, no bien de todo para poder. Y este y así duré cuatro años sin trabajar por lo menos, por yendo a citas del doctor, por todo. Después aplique en una compañía de…se llama Oceana Food allí este…allí trabaja en la pura cherry, blueberry, granada, cranberry… Penny: ¿Y qué pasa con esos? German: Allí [los dos tratando de hablar] de la procesan, la hidratan. Allí le hidratan. Puro horno. Todo trabaja entre fresca el horno y ya sale el estiloPenny: ¿Seco, dry, como-? German: Si, dry. Penny: Como pasasGerman: Si, como pasasPenny: -Como raisinsGerman: Uh huh. Y este es lo que hago, trabajo aliviando porque no, no hago nada de fuerza, pero este [celular empieza a soñar] En el-en el [conversación sigue en el fondo, el celular para de soñar] 2008 [celular vibra]. Entre en el año del 2008, en el julio del 2008 [conversación y vibraciones continúan] y hasta ahorita estamos- [vibración del celular lo interrumpe] estamos trabajando allí gracias a dios. Estamos bien [vibraciones siguen rápidamente] me gusta el trabajo. Me gusta y- [vibraciones siguen en secuencia rápida]. Penny: -Um, [vibraciones para] ¿Usted entró como un migrante [grabación tiene estatutico] con papeles o sin papeles? German: Cuando entre yo aquí en los Estados Unidos yo entre sin papeles. Entre por la ciudad Tijuana con [inaudible] San Diego. Y, y en ese tiempo las pasadas eran fáciles. Eran desde, ‘esperame por dos horas en tal 5 �parte’ y ya allí llegó en Tijuana por el otro lado. Y cada año que yo venía entraba sin papeles. Aquí a los Estados Unidos, y [conversación se puede oír claramente en el fondo] con el tiempo [German tose] con el tiempo se puso a ser más duro también y gracias a [dios] ya arreglamos todo. Penny: Y cómo fue eso, el proceso deGerman: El proceso de la reglada fue por un amnistía. En el ’85, el ’86 algo así. Y eh, gracias a dios nos cualificamos por, por ese programa y arreglamos. Penny: ¿Y todavía eres residente permanente? German: No, gracias a dios a una señora que se llama Penny Burillo (¿?) ella me ayudó mucho a hacerme ciudadano. Penny: ¿Y cuando te hiciste ciudadano? [ruido en la mesa] German: En el ’96. En el…si en el ’96 me hice ciudadano después de casi veinte años [conversación en el fondo]. Penny: ¿Y has estudiado inglés or fuiste a colegio, los sueños que tenias como-? German: De mis sueños se me cayeron. Ya no nunca, ya no pude estudiar, ni aquí. Aquí nada más fui al escuela un día no más y no podía seguir [inaudible] [conversación sigue] Un día fui, fui nada más y-es que no se no caso el tiempo y el trabajo y la familia. No quiero uno mas bien, porque si quisiera uno si pudiera uno, todo los que quieren pueden. Yo a lo mejor no quiso. Penny: Y… ¿que es su impresión de el condado de Oceana? Que-que… German: Pues para mi el condado de Oceana es mi vida, es mi pueblo es mi-aquí es, es mi ciudad. Todo. Es mi México allá. Porque aquí…crecí aquí este, aquí me, me hice-uh me desarrollo bien de todo. Este, trabajo, familia, mi gente, todo ya esta mejor que allá. Mucho más mejor que allá, más, aquí es lo más tranquilo que hay. Penny: ¿Tienes familia aquí aparte de sus hijos? German: Tengo hermanos, tengo dos hermanos más. Tengo [murmullo] cuatro primos por parte de mi papá y de mi mamá también- [conversación en el fondo sigue con mucho ruido] Penny: ¿Y cuando usted se hizo ciudadano pudo ayudar a su familia? German: Si, gracias a Dios si pudimos ayudar. Les arregle a mis papas. Y…gracias a dios también se hicieron ciudadanos y gracias a la señora que le mencione al rato. Penny: ¿y como se llama sus papás? German: Se llama Pablo Ortega Manzo y mi mamá se llama Felina de Chiga Herrero. Penny: Y ellos, eh… ¿son ciudadanos o son residentes o como...? German: Ellos son-ya son ciudadanos gracias a Dios. Ya, ya son americanos. Penny: Entonces, entonces por…por venir aquí ilegal y arreglar su estatus migratorio hiciste residente permanente, ciudadano americano naturalizado. Arreglaste y naturalizaste susGerman: Mis papás. 6 �Penny: Sus papás, como residentes permanentes y ahora se hicieron ciudadanos americanos. German: Si, ajá. Gracias a Dios, pudieron y quisieron. Penny: Ajá, si. ¿Hay algo más de su historia que quisiera compartir que…recuerden? German: [pausa larga, conversación sigue en el fondo] Pues nada más este…darle gracias a aquí a el condado más bien. Al condado porque me han dad-me han tratado bien, no me mete en problemas no he estado tranquilo, con todo. Penny: Su-su vida ha sidoGerman: -Tranquila de lo más posible que hay aquí. Me-mucho mejor que allá, México. Yo no discrimino México, pero, es una, es bonito. Penny: Muchas gracias, vamos a cerrar. This is the end of the interview with German Ortega, uh, the 18th of June 2016 in Hart, Michigan. [Este es el fin de la entrevista con German Ortega, la, la fecha es el 18 de junio del 2016 en Hart, Michigan.] 7 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/51fd3083e454959ff4813440e1c26560.mp3 e20b3e5a0cbb91ca601c5112173d37f7 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Ortega, German (entrevista de audio, transcripción en Español y Traducción en Inglés) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista de historia oral con German Ortega. Entrevistado por Penny Burillo. Hart, Michigan. Idioma en Español. Junio 18, 2016. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Migrante Agricultura Puerta de Mangos Grand Rapids (Mich.) Cerezas Espárragos Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Ortega_German Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Ortega, German Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Ortega, German (audio interview, Spanish transcript, and English translation) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with German Ortega. Interviewed by Penny Burillo. Hart, Michigan. Spanish language. June 18, 2016. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Burillo, Penny (interviewer) Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource Migrant Agriculture Hispanic Puerta de Mangos Grand Rapids (Mich.) Peaches Cherries Asparagus Naturalization Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/08dbe21fb02677d03ca275a18af4552e.pdf 077c0e2c72e9c98c1556be93f6affd6a PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro Interview Total Time – (8:25) Self interview, May 18, 2016. Background • Norma grew up in Holland, Michigan • She lived there for fifteen years until her father was deported o Some family in Oceana County took her and her older sister in o Her family is Maria and Ramon Rosas, who own La Probadita, a Mexican store in downtown Hart o The Mexican store plays a big part in her life Vivid Childhood Memory – (1:24) • Going to school and coming home with her report cards was one of the biggest things her parents instilled in her Parents and Family – (1:45) • Norma’s parents are originally from Michoacán • They came to the United States in 1999 with Norma and her brother and sister • Her mother had two more children once in Holland • The family never worked as migrants or pickers o Her dad found a job as a factory worker o But Norma was not sheltered about the blueberry picking process in Holland Agriculture in Oceana – (2:23) • When she moved to Hart, it was an eye-opener of how big the agriculture business was there o It’s really common for any Hispanic-looking person to be asked if they were going to stay year-round because most of them come and go 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department o When she went to Hart High School, she was asked if she was going to go there all year, and Norma was shocked o She was not exposed to the fact that most Hispanic students leave before the winter and come back sometime in the spring Reflections on Oceana County – (3:39) • When Norma first came to Oceana County, she thought it was a small and very boring place with nothing to do • She started to find things to do and realized how vast the community really is and how many people there are to meet • Norma volunteered a lot with the Hart Main Street Program, with the Oceana Hispanic Center, and with her church • Hart has been a good place for Norma’s growth, and she has been very successful there o She has grown financially through working for her aunt and uncle at the Mexican store o The store is impacted by the influx of migrants during the summers and the lack of migrants during the winters Migrants – (5:08) • Norma has never picked herself, but has heard that it is a very tiresome and humbling experience • She is not a migrant worker but is a Mexican immigrant o She feels somewhat like she doesn’t belong because the other Hispanics all seem to have experience with picking when she doesn’t • Her father used to tell them that he didn’t want his children to have to do that kind of work and that he wanted better for them • Norma has some family who work in the fields and in the factories with the crops o The weather and seasons play an important role in people’s jobs Future Thoughts – (7:27) • Norma hopes that more relationships are built between farmers and workers in the community • Many workers share stories at the Mexican store, and the stories are both good and bad o Norma hopes that community members will get along in the future, no matter if they are farmers or workers or residents 2 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/9a8a5777f5ea89efd3271d86ca37c6b2.pdf 2aa83c89ebd2d1ab3b3d3501dda7c119 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Una comunidad que cultiva: El proyecto de la historia agrícola de Oceana Entrevista de Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro Tiempo total – (8:25) Antecedentes • Norma creció en Holland, Michigan • Vivió allí durante quince años, hasta que su padre fue deportado o Unos familiares vivían en el condado de Oceana, y Norma y su hermana mayor fueron a vivir con ellos o Se llaman Maria y Ramon Rosas, quienes poseen La Probadita, una tienda mexicana en el centro de Hart o La tienda mexicana tiene gran importancia en la vida de Norma Recuerdo vívido de su niñez – (1:24) • Sus padres le inculcaron el valor de la educación y de recibir buenas notas Padres y familia – (1:45) • Originalmente los padres de Norma son de Michoacán • Vinieron a los Estados Unidos en 1999 con Norma y su hermano y hermana • Su madre tuvo dos niños más en Holland • La familia nunca trabajó como trabajadores migrantes o Su padre encontró trabajo como trabajador de fábrica o Sin embargo, Norma sabía del proceso de recoger arándanos en Holland La agricultura en Oceana – (2:23) • Cuando Norma se mudó a Hart, se dio cuenta de la magnitud de la agricultura allí o Es muy común que se le pregunta a cualquier persona que parece ser hispana si va a quedarse allí todo el año, porque la mayoría de los hispanos va y viene o Cuando asistió a Hart High School, se le preguntaba a Norma si iba a quedarse allí todo el año, y eso le sorprendió 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department o Norma no sabía que la mayoría de los estudiantes hispanos se va antes del invierno y regresa durante la primavera Reflexiones del condado de Oceana – (3:39) • Cuando Norma llegó por primera vez al condado de Oceana, pensaba que era un lugar pequeño y muy aburrido sin nada que hacer • Empezó a encontrar cosas que hacer y se dio cuenta de que la comunidad es muy grande y que hay mucha gente que se puede conocer • Norma ha sido voluntaria para Hart Main Street Program, el Centro Hispano de Oceana, y su iglesia • Hart ha sido un buen lugar en cuanto al desarrollo de Norma, y ella ha tenido mucho éxito allá o Ella ha crecido financieramente por medio de trabajar para su tía y tío en la tienda mexicana o La llegada de los trabajadores migrantes durante el verano y su salida durante el invierno afecta a la tienda Los migrantes – (5:08) • Norma nunca ha sido trabajadora migrante pero se ha enterado de que es una experiencia fatigante y de humildad • Ella no es trabajadora migrante pero es inmigrante mexicana o Siente de alguna manera que no encaja con los otros hispanos porque todos parecen tener experiencia con la cosecha y Norma no tiene esa experiencia • Su padre solía decirles que no quería que sus hijos tuvieran que hacer este tipo de trabajo porque deseaba un futuro mejor para ellos • Norma tiene algunos familiares que trabajan con los cultivos en los campos y en las fábricas o El clima y las estaciones tienen un papel importante en los trabajos de la gente Pensamientos futuros – (7:27) • Norma espera que se desarrollen más relaciones entre los agricultores y los trabajadores en la comunidad • Muchos trabajadores comparten historias en la tienda mexicana, y hay historias buenas y malas 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department o Norma desea que los miembros de la comunidad se lleven bien en el futuro, sin importar si son agricultores o trabajadores o residentes 3 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/22765b8131f156026895b2242b72bf29.mp3 37fbb53ed931dc8bce5ab7ef2156d045 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Gonzalez, Norma Buenostro (entrevista de audio y resumen) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista autograbada por Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro, Mayo 18, 2016. Los padres de Norma son de Michoacán, México. Su familia vino a los Estados Unidos en 1999, y ella creció en Holland, Michigan. Luego, Norma y su hermana mayor se mudaron al condado de Oceana para vivir con su tía y tío, quienes tienen una tienda llamada La Probadita que está ubicada en el centro de Hart. Como la familia de Norma nunca trabajó como trabajadores migrantes mientras crecía, le asombró aprender de la enormidad de la agricultura en Hart. Norma ha sido voluntaria para Hart Main Street Program, el Centro Hispano de Oceana, y su iglesia. Espera que se desarrollen más relaciones positivas entre los agricultores y los trabajadores en el futuro. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Holland (Mich.) Deportado La Probadita Tienda mexicana Migrantes Fábrica Hart Main Street Program El Centro Hispano de Oceana Inmigrante Hispano Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Gonzalez_Buenrostro_Norma Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Gonzalez, Norma Buenostro Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-05-18 Title A name given to the resource Gonzalez, Norma Buenostro (audio interview and summary) Description An account of the resource Self-recorded interview by Norma Buenrostro Gonzalez, May 18, 2016. Norma’s parents are originally from Michoacán, Mexico. Her family came to the United States in 1999, and she grew up in Holland, Michigan. Later, Norma and her older sister moved to Oceana County to live with their aunt and uncle, who own a Mexican store named La Probadita in downtown Hart. As Norma’s family never worked as migrants or pickers while she grew up, she was astonished by how big the agricultural business was in Hart. Norma has spent time volunteering with the Hart Main Street Program, the Oceana Hispanic Center, and her church. She hopes to see more positive relationships built between farmers and workers in the future. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource Holland (Mich.) Deported La Probadita Mexican store Migrants Factory Hart Main Street Program Oceana Hispanic Center Immigrant Hispanic Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/cd241cc2e8e666ecd1ccaa623faee72a.pdf c3fe36efef60d225247425742b09ca23 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project Diana Azereth Giles Mendez Interview Total Time – (17:35) Interviewed by Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro, May 17, 2016, in English. Background • Diana grew up in Hart, Michigan o She grew up where all the stores were, next to the police department • She is not really used to life in the country • In a small farm town, community members get to know everyone else Vivid Childhood Memories – (1:50) • Diana got to know the neighbor kids pretty well o They would go over to each other’s houses and ask if they wanted to play Coming to Oceana County – (2:31) • Her family moved to Oceana County around 2002 when Diana was five years old • Diana’s parents were migrant workers, and someone recruited them to come to Oceana to work in agriculture • Diana and her family were the first Hispanics that settled in the area o Going to school was very difficult o Diana and her parents did not know English Diana’s Parents – (3:55) • Her parents had agricultural jobs o They started by picking asparagus and peaches o Years later, they went into factory work and worked on assembly lines o Later, her mom was a lab technician in the factory and her dad got a better factory job too • When Diana was growing up, she would go to work with her parents because they didn’t have a babysitter 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • o She would take the bus to school and then come back after school and wait until her parents were done o Her mother would tell her that she didn’t want Diana doing work like that Work ethic was very important to Diana’s parents o Diana would ask her mom how to do things to help, and she would teach her Back then, her family was not wealthy, and her parents didn’t make enough money between the two of them o When Diana was 9 years old, she began working alongside her parents o Diana and her siblings experienced what it’s like to do labor work o Going through this gave her the motivation to go to college and get higher education Diana appreciates what her parents did and has learned to work harder towards what she wants Current Job – (9:34) • Diana is currently a community health worker at a migrant clinic • She is studying to be a nurse and a respiratory care therapist • What she does now gives her experience and better medical understanding Agriculture in Oceana – (10:30) • Agriculture is the biggest business in Oceana and what brings many people to the area • Sometimes this is the only type of job that some people can get, so they come there • There is also some tourism • Some migrants come there together, and they always help each other out • Some farmers are close with their employees and are more understanding towards them • There are always new workers too because they’ve heard there are jobs in Oceana Future Thoughts – (13:00) • Diana hopes that her mother doesn’t have to work in those kinds of jobs anymore because she doesn’t like doing it, and Diana wants to take care of her • Her father really likes the agriculture 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • Diana wishes that there were other opportunities in Oceana too Many people don’t know what it’s like to do such hard work when they’ve never done it themselves before Diana’s children will never understand the struggle that it is to be a first generation migrant like she did 3 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/71f1a7948b65cf2efb96d4a65ffa8bb9.pdf da988c263a9742dd4856833fc2ac139c PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Una comunidad que cultiva: El proyecto de la historia agrícola de Oceana Entrevista de Diana Azereth Giles Mendez Tiempo total – (17:35) Entrevistado por Norma Gonzales Buenrostro, 17 Mai 2016 (Traducido al espaňol por Kassie O’Brien, May 2016) Antecedentes • Diana creció en Hart, Michigan o Creció donde había las tiendas y el departamento de policía • No está acostumbrada a la vida rural • Los miembros de la comunidad conocen a los demás en un pequeño pueblo agrícola Recuerdos vívidos de la niñez – (1:50) • Diana conocía a los niños vecinos o Se iban a la casa del otro y se preguntaban si querían jugar Venir al condado de Oceana – (2:31) • Su familia se mudó al condado de Oceana cerca de 2002 cuando Diana tenía cinco años • Los padres de Diana eran trabajadores migrantes, y se les contrató para trabajar en la agricultura de Oceana • Su familia fue uno de los primeros hispanos que se estableció en el área o Fue difícil asistir a la escuela o Diana y sus padres no sabían inglés Los padres de Diana – (3:55) • Sus padres trabajaron en la agricultura o Empezaron a recoger espárragos y duraznos o Años después, trabajaron en las fábricas y en cadenas de montaje o Luego su mamá fue técnica del laboratorio de la fábrica, y su papá consiguió trabajo mejor en la fábrica también 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • Mientras Diana crecía, iba al trabajo de sus padres porque no tenían niñera o Iba a la escuela en autobús, y después regresaba y esperaba hasta que sus padres terminaran de trabajar o Su madre le decía que no quería que Diana hiciera ese tipo de trabajo La ética laboral era muy importante a los padres de Diana o Diana le preguntaba a su mamá cómo hacer las cosas para ayudarle, y su mamá le enseñaba Entonces, su familia no era rica y sus padres no ganaban suficiente dinero o Cuando Diana tenía 9 años, empezó a trabajar con sus padres o Diana y sus hermanos tuvieron la experiencia de trabajo laboral o Eso le dio la motivación para asistir a la universidad y obtener educación superior Diana aprecia lo que hicieron sus padres y ha aprendido a trabajar duro para alcanzar lo que quiere Su trabajo actual – (9:34) • Actualmente Diana trabaja como agente sanitaria de la comunidad en una clínica para trabajadores migrantes • Estudia para ser enfermera y terapeuta respiratoria • Lo que hace le da experiencia y mejor conocimiento médico La agricultura en Oceana – (10:30) • La agricultura es la industria más grande de Oceana y es lo que atrae a mucha gente al área • A veces es el único tipo de trabajo que algunas personas pueden encontrar, así vienen allí • También hay turismo • Algunos migrantes llegan juntos y siempre ayudan a los otros migrantes • Algunos agricultores y empleados tienen amistades íntimas • Siempre hay trabajadores nuevos porque han oído que hay trabajo en Oceana Pensamientos futuros – (13:00) • Diana espera que su madre ya no tenga que hacer este tipo de trabajo porque a ella no le gusta, y Diana quiere cuidarle 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • A su padre le gusta mucho la agricultura Diana desea que existan otras oportunidades en Oceana también Muchas personas no entienden este tipo de trabajo físico porque nunca lo han hecho Los hijos de Diana nunca entenderán la lucha que existe para los migrantes de primera generación como ella 3 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/aa3d5d1199a2b95ff854311193acdb80.mp3 418e553020836032b92c58bacb1c62d3 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Giles, Diana (entrevista de audio y resumen) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista de historia oral con Diana Giles. Entrevistada por Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro. Idioma en Inglés. Mayo 17, 2016. Diana creció en Hart, Michigan. Su familia se mudó al condado de Oceana en 2002 cuando Diana tenía cinco años. Sus padres eran trabajadores migrantes, y se les contrató para trabajar en la agricultura de Oceana. Su familia fue uno de los primeros hispanos que se estableció en el área. Sus padres tuvieron trabajos en los campos y en las fábricas allá. Cuando Diana tenía 9 años, empezó a trabajar con sus padres y tuvo la experiencia de trabajo laboral. Actualmente Diana trabaja como agente sanitaria en una clínica para trabajadores migrantes. Estudia para ser enfermera y terapeuta respiratoria. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Migrante Agricultura Hispano Inglés Fábrica Se estableció Primera generación Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Giles_Mendez_Diana Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Giles, Diana Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-05-17 Title A name given to the resource Giles, Diana (audio interview and summary) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Diana Giles. Interviewed by Norma Gonzalez Buenrostro. English language recording. Summary in English and Spanish. May 17, 2016. Diana grew up in Hart, Michigan. Her family moved to Oceana County in 2002 when she was five years old. Her parents were migrant workers who were recruited to work in Oceana’s agriculture business. Diana and her family were the first Hispanics that settled in the area. Her parents had agricultural and factory jobs there. When Diana was 9 years old, she began working along with her parents, experiencing what it was like to do labor work. Diana is currently a community health worker at a migrant clinic. She is studying to be a nurse and a respiratory care therapist. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Gonzalez Buenrostro, Norma (interviewer) Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource Migrant Agriculture Hispanic English Factory Settled First generation Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/446626cc94678a24d70c909525e421d1.pdf c85300098517d754a7e41d7ab6ca0250 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Jerry Brandel Interview Total Time – (1:09:11) Interviewed by Walter Urick, February 12, 2016 Family Background • He was born February 28, 1945 in Muskegon, Michigan • His grandparents lived on a 20 acre farm north of Hart, Michigan o They had 9 children, with Jerry’s father being one of them • Jerry’s father was Herbert Brandel o On their 20 acre fruit farm, they grew cherries, apples, and peaches • Jerry’s father came from Muskegon to Hart and bought a fruit farm in 1945 when Jerry was a baby o Farm was located on 84th Ave. and Fox • Jerry has been in the area for 70 years • Jerry’s mother was Ruth Samantha Jacobs o She was in the top 20 of her class in 1927 at Hart High School • Jerry had one brother, Richard, and also an adopted sister, Marilyn • Jerry bought the current property that he’s on when he was a senior in high school in 1962 o He paid $6,500 for 80 acres o He bought it with a land contract at 3% interest Childhood Memories – (4:20) • He grew up in Hart and has been there all of his life • He went to the one room school there called Danielson School o He had to walk half a mile there and back every day • When he was around 8 or 10 years old, he had to start doing chores o He had to feed and water the cattle at a barn and at home o Eventually he had to milk the cows too • When he was 16 his brother went into the army, and Jerry was the only one home with his dad then • He had to milk 24 cows by himself o He would get up at 6:00am and end up with 40 gallons of milk o He would separate the skim milk from the cream, and then would feed the skim milk to the pigs 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • • o It took about an hour to milk the two dozen cows By 9:00am he was at the cherry orchard o He’d drive to Hart or Shelby and unload all the lugs of cherries He’d get home about 10:00pm, eat supper, go to bed, and then do it all again the next morning for about 6-8 weeks Jerry’s father was the principal at Walkerville High School during the first year of his farm (1945) because the crops froze out o His father had the farm paid off by the second year though (1946) because of the big cherry crop o His father went back to teach at Walkerville for five more years when he was about 60 years old Jerry’s father was a schoolteacher for 20 years, and Jerry’s mother taught for 36 years o His mother taught at the middle school in Shelby o She would take Jerry to school every day when he was 4 years old o He was then a student there through 7th grade When Jerry was 7 years old, he’d pick two lugs of cherries in both the morning and night, and he got paid 50 cents a lug to pick them ($2 a day) o He bought his first bicycle for $42 in Hart when he was 7 years old Becoming Involved in Farming – (10:20) • When he was 13 years old, he bought 60 acres with his brother near Pentwater for $10 an acre o They planted 10,000 Christmas trees on it o Three years later he sold that farm and split the money with his brother, using his half to buy his current farm at 17 years old • He graduated from Hart High School in 1963 and went on to Michigan State University for a two-year agricultural course • After his schooling, he went into partnership for 10 years with his dad and brother o They farmed from when he was 20 to 30 years old, roughly from 1965-1975 o They had 2,500 acres all together, all in Oceana County o Their largest piece was a 500 acre section in Hart • Cherries were the biggest crop for their partnership o 150 acres of cherries o 40 acres of apples o 20 acres of peaches o At least 500 acres of Christmas trees 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • They tapped 3,600 taps to make maple syrup too, and Jerry was the head of this Farming on His Own – (15:06) • The partnership ended in 1975 when Jerry decided that he wanted to be on his own • He started growing 150-200 acres of pickles • He had bought other farms since the original 80 acres, adding up to about 800 acres • He also had cattle, hay, and pigs • He chose his cash crop to be pickles because he got along well with the migrant workers o He saw that when the cherry season ended around August 1, the migrant workers had nothing left to do o So he wanted to use the time that they had that last month before they went back to school to give them work with his pickle crop • The largest quantity of pickles he ever grew at one time was about 300 acres • All the pickles were harvested by hand The Migrant Workers – (18:00) • Oceana County had families coming from Tennessee and Arkansas who were white, non-Hispanics o They’d come to pick cherries for six weeks and then go back home • There would be African American families coming the 36 miles from Muskegon who wanted to pick cherries too • A woman named Ruth Coleman would come with 35 people with her in a bus, and they housed them in a labor camp o Jerry owned this camp then • When Jerry was about 15 years old, he would keep track of the amounts of cherries picked by people and would have to pay them every Saturday • The non-Hispanic work force was around 25-30 people o These people did not like the pickle harvesting work because it was too hard for them • The Hispanic migrant workers started coming to work in the late 50s and early 60s • They would come from Florida or Texas in big canvas-topped trucks o Crew leaders would bring 50-60 people in one truck • During the Mexican fiestas, the people would come out of those trucks in nice clothes and ready to dance o That was the migrant people’s culture • Jerry employed around 60-70 Hispanic people during his pickle operations 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Farming Challenges – (24:53) • There were problems with drought and hot temperatures • In 1980, there were 22% bank interest rates o Jerry had to borrow $100,000 because he had lost money on the pickle crop one year • In 1976, Jerry was investigated for child labor in the fields o He got sued, and it took six years to get to the federal court o After an appeal, Jerry was the only person who has ever won that o Walter Urick was Jerry’s attorney • Jerry stopped farming pickles because they were costly to grow and a profit couldn’t be made • He then started into the broker business of doing the pickle selling for other farms or sheds o He usually gets around $200-400 per load that he sells for others o He knows the business and coordinates it all Relationship to the Migrants – (30:42) • There was an abundance of Mexican migrant workers coming in the late 60s and early 70s • They would come out of desperation because school was out o They would just show up because they didn’t know who to go to • Migrant organizations would call around to see if anyone had work for these migrants who needed jobs and housing • Jerry housed migrants and had them work in his pickle fields • Jerry wanted to increase the pickle market, so he started buying other farmers’ pickles as well as having his contract with Heinz • Jerry used to have strawberry acreage, and 350 migrants would show up to pick strawberries o It would spread by word of mouth that there was work at Jerry Brandel’s strawberry farm, and they’d come • He got along well with the migrants, and if there was conflict, they would compromise well 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • Jerry knew that he needed to settle misunderstandings because he had their goodwill, and he and they were all there to make money Migrant Housing and Living – (34:20) • The housing had to be licensed by the state of Michigan and meet standards • The housing was free to the migrants, which attracted workers to come • Jerry’s people had to maintain the housing themselves • The people who had trouble with the migrants were those who tried to cheat them somehow, by shorting how much they worked or picked • The migrants would have to be trained on how to best pick the pickles and maintain their sections of the fields • At this time there was no food stamp program, and people were so poor that they’d do whatever they needed to survive Jerry’s Family – (39:58) • He has two boys and one girl o Art is 47, Alan is 40, and Kathy is 44 • Art farms at the family place part-time • Alan is in Alabama, working for a 3,000 acre farm in the pickle business • Kathy is a schoolteacher in Hart Oceana Community – (41:24) • Jerry would like to see the Historical Society and the records to continue on for years • He also wants the county fair to continue running o He served 22 years on the livestock committee, promoting the 4-H program • The cell phone business has transitioned in to life now • Jerry farmed pickles for 17 years in Mexico o He would be there for 2-3 weeks at a time o They quit that business 3 years ago because of too many dangers and cartels o They had rented land there to farm o The U.S. would sometimes cause issues when they’d stop trucks for health inspections, and the pickles would have gone bad by the end of it 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • Jerry is in the Farm Bureau, but it isn’t as strong of a voice as it could be to help farming Migrants aren’t coming to work as much anymore because of the U.S. immigration changes, and people getting arrested now for being illegal o The government doesn’t have a program to let these people work legally here o It does exist in Canada though, so Mexicans or Jamaicans drive through to Ontario to work People who pick asparagus or apples are well-paid today, making $25 an hour People can be shying away from labor-intensive crops because they aren’t sure if they’re going to have the workers they need at the specific times their crops will need it Listening to the Tape in 50 Years – (51:44) • The population is stable and doesn’t grow very much • The area has been a good place to raise families • The biggest threat is some drugs coming into town now • There is a lot of goodwill and peace between the people • Jerry encourages young people to plant crops that will make money, such as fruit or asparagus farming • Farming today is so complicated that you have to be careful what you plant because you may not get enough profits to survive o The cost of farming is very discouraging for young farmers • Now there are many people without skills or a college education but are making so much money an hour picking • Jerry and his sons had lost money on crops, so they sold off some land to pay back debts • Today farmers have to guarantee hours and pay to workers whether there’s work or not • Jerry mentions current farming challenges and laws that cause many problems for farmers Final Thoughts – (1:00:32) • The migrants workers have always been a very important part of Oceana County, and some have settled and become good citizens, stabilizing the economy there • Jerry is in the process of selling his labor camp now • Segregation has been a problem too when some locals don’t want the Hispanics around • There’ll never be enough locals available to keep up with the work; migrants are needed • At one time, Oceana County was the biggest pickle county in Michigan 6 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/9f4b1a96c894c610e0ee58c1ed002df9.pdf 6a907ab0e829fbf64df11eaa6192b1b1 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department Entrevista de Jerry Brandel Tiempo total – (1:09:11) Entrevistado por Walter Urick, 12 Febrero 2016 (Traducido al espaňol por Kassie O’Brien, May 2016) Antecedentes familiares • Jerry nació el 28 de febrero de 1945 en Muskegon, Michigan • Sus abuelos vivían en una granja de 20 acres al norte de Hart, Michigan o Tuvieron 9 niños, y uno fue el padre de Jerry • Su padre se llamaba Herbert Brandel o Cultivaban cerezas, manzanas, y duraznos en su granja de 20 acres • El padre de Jerry se mudó desde Muskegon a Hart y compró una granja de frutas en 1945 cuando Jerry era bebé o La granja estaba ubicado en las calles 84 y Fox • Jerry ha estado en el área por 70 años • La madre de Jerry se llamaba Ruth Samantha Jacobs o Ella estuvo entre los mejores de su clase en 1927 en Hart High School • Jerry tiene un hermano, Richard, y también una hermana adoptada, Marilyn • Jerry compró su propiedad actual cuando estaba en su último año de la secundaria en 1962 o Pagó $6.500 por 80 acres o La compró con un contrato de compraventa de terrenos con una tasa de interés del 3% Recuerdos de la niñez – (4:20) • Jerry creció en Hart y ha vivido allí por toda su vida • Asistió a la escuela llamada Danielson School que solamente tenía una aula o Cada día tenía que caminar por media milla de ida y vuelta • Cuando tenía más o menos 8 o 10 años, comenzó a hacer labores o Tenía que alimentar y dar de beber a los animales o Con el tiempo tenía que ordeñar las vacas también • Cuando tenía 16 años su hermano ingresó en el ejército, y Jerry fue el único que estaba en casa con su papá • Tenía que ordeñar 24 vacas por sí mismo 1 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • • o Se despertaba a las seis de la mañana y terminó con 40 galones de leche o Separaba la leche descremada de la nata, y daba de comer a los cerdos con la leche o Le tomaba una hora ordeñar dos docenas de vacas A las 9:00 de la mañana llegaba al cerezal o Conducía a Hart o Shelby y descargaba todas las cestas de cerezas Llegaba a la casa alrededor de las 10:00 de la noche, cenaba, se acostaba, y la mañana siguiente volvía a hacer todo de nuevo por 6-8 semanas El padre de Jerry fue el director de Walkerville High School durante el primer año que tuvo su granja (1945) porque los cultivos se congelaron o Durante el segundo año (1946) su padre terminó de pagar por la granja porque hubo una gran cosecha de cerezas o Su padre regresó a enseñar en Walkerville por cinco años más cuando tenía alrededor de 60 años El padre de Jerry fue maestro por 20 años, y la madre de Jerry fue maestra por 36 años o Su madre enseñó en la escuela intermedia en Shelby o Cuando Jerry tenía 4 años, su madre le llevaba a la escuela cada día o Jerry fue estudiante allí hasta el séptimo grado Cuando Jerry tenía 7 años, recogía dos cestas de cerezas por la mañana y por la noche, y ganaba 50 centavos por cesta ($2 por día) o Compró su primera bicicleta por $42 en Hart cuando tenía 7 años Participando en la agricultura – (10:20) • Cuando tenía 13 años, Jerry y su hermano compraron 60 acres cerca de Pentwater por $10 por acre o Plantaron 10.000 árboles de Navidad o Tres años después vendieron esa granja y se dividió el dinero entre Jerry y su hermano, y Jerry usó su mitad del dinero para comprar su granja actual cuando tenía 17 años • Se graduó de Hart High School en 1963, y asistió a Michigan State University por dos años para tomar un curso de agricultura • Después de su educación, se asoció con su padre y hermano por diez años o Mantuvieron las granjas desde cuando tenía 20 a 30 años, más o menos de 19651975 o Poseían 2.500 acres en conjunto en el condado de Oceana o La parte más grande fue una sección de 500 acres en Hart 2 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • Las cerezas fueron la mejor cosecha en su asociación o 150 acres de cerezas o 40 acres de manzanas o 20 acres de duraznos o Por lo menos 500 acres de árboles de Navidad También prepararon mucho jarabe de arce, y Jerry encabezaba este trabajo Su propia agricultura – (15:06) • La asociación terminó en 1975 cuando Jerry decidió trabajar por sí mismo • Empezó a cultivar 150-200 acres de pepinillos • Había comprado otras granjas además de los 80 acres originales, que sumó un total de 800 acres • También tuvo ganado, heno, y cerdos • Decidió cultivar los pepinillos como su cultivo comercial porque se llevaba bien con los trabajadores migrantes o Jerry notó que los trabajadores migrantes no tenían trabajo cuando terminó la temporada de cereza alrededor del primer día de agosto o Así Jerry quería usar el tiempo disponible durante el último mes antes de que regresaran a la escuela para darles trabajo con sus cultivos de pepinillos • Cerca de 300 acres fue la mayor cantidad de pepinillos que cultivó a la vez • Se cosechaban a mano todos los pepinillos Los trabajadores migrantes – (18:00) • Familias caucásicas no hispanas viajaron al condado de Oceana desde Tennessee y Arkansas o Venían para recoger cerezas por seis semanas y luego regresaban a casa • Familias afroamericanas que viajaron las 36 millas desde Muskegon querían recoger cerezas también • Una mujer que se llamaba Ruth Coleman venía en un autobús con 35 personas, y todos vivían en un campo de trabajo o Jerry poseía este campo de trabajo en aquella época • Cuando Jerry tenía más o menos 15 años, mantenía un registro de la cantidad de cerezas que recogió cada persona y les pagaba cada sábado • La fuerza laboral no hispana fue cerca de 25-30 personas 3 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • o A estas personas no les gustó cosechar los pepinillos porque el trabajo era muy duro Los trabajadores migrantes hispanos empezaron a trabajar a finales de los años cincuenta y al principio de los años sesenta Se iban de la Florida o de Texas en camiones grandes con lonas o Los supervisores traían 50-60 trabajadores en un camión Durante las fiestas mexicanas, la gente venía en estos camiones vestida en ropa elegante, preparada para bailar o Eso fue la cultura de los trabajadores migrantes Jerry empleó a 60-70 personas hispanas como parte de sus operaciones agrícolas con pepinillos Desafíos en cuanto a la agricultura – (24:53) • Había problemas de sequía y altas temperaturas • En 1980, hubo tasas de interés de los bancos de 22% o Jerry pidió un préstamo de $100.000 porque perdió dinero durante un año con su cultivo de pepinillos • En 1976, fue investigado por trabajo infantil en los campos o Fue demandado y después de seis años la investigación llegó al corte federal o Después de una apelación, Jerry fue la única persona que ganó o Walter Urick fue el abogado de Jerry • Jerry dejó de cultivar pepinillos porque costaron mucho y no pudo obtener beneficios • Luego empezó a trabajar en la venta de los cultivos de pepinillos de otros agricultores o Normalmente gana $200-400 por cargamento de pepinillos que vende o Entiende bien el negocio y coordina todo La relación con los migrantes – (30:42) • Había una abundancia de trabajadores migrantes mexicanos que llegaron a finales de los años sesenta y al principio de los años setenta • Llegaron empujados por la desesperación porque terminó el año escolar o Solamente aparecieron porque no sabían adónde ir • Las organizaciones migrantes hacían llamadas para buscar trabajo disponible para los migrantes que necesitaron empleos y vivienda • Jerry les dio vivienda a los migrantes y les dio trabajo en sus campos de pepinillos 4 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • Jerry quería engrandecer el mercado de pepinillos, así empezó a comprar los pepinillos de otros agricultores, además de su contrato con Heinz Jerry solía poseer acres del cultivo de fresas, y 350 trabajadores migrantes vinieron a recoger fresas o Se promocionaban las noticias de trabajo disponible por el boca a boca, y los trabajadores venían Se llevaba bien con los trabajadores migrantes, y si había conflictos, llegaron a un acuerdo Jerry sabía que era necesario resolver malentendidos porque tuvo su buena voluntad, y todos estaban allí para ganar dinero La vivienda de los trabajadores migrantes – (34:20) • Se necesitaba la autorización del estado de Michigan para cumplir las normas de la vivienda • La vivienda era gratuita para los trabajadores migrantes, y eso atrajo a los trabajadores • Algunos empleados de Jerry tenían que mantener la vivienda • Las personas que tuvieron problemas con los trabajadores migrantes fueron personas que trataron de engañarles por medio de decir que los trabajadores recogieron menos que la cantidad verdadera • Se necesitaba enseñarles la mejor manera de recoger los pepinillos y de mantener sus propias secciones de los campos • En ese momento no existía ningún programa de vales para alimentos, y la gente era tan pobre que hacía cualquier cosa para sobrevivir La familia de Jerry – (39:58) • Tiene dos hijos y una hija o Art tiene 47 años, Alan tiene 40 años, y Kathy tiene 44 años • Art trabaja en la granja de la familia a tiempo parcial • Alan está en Alabama y trabaja con pepinillos en una granja de 3.000 acres • Kathy es maestra en Hart La comunidad de Oceana – (41:24) • Jerry quiere que se preserven la Sociedad Histórica (Historical Society) y los documentos 5 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • • • • También quiere que la feria del condado continúe o Jerry participó en la comisión de ganadería por 22 años donde promovió el programa 4-H El negocio de la telefonía celular ha cambiado mucho en la vida hoy en día Jerry cultivó pepinillos en México por 17 años o Estaba allí por 2 a 3 semanas cada vez o Hace 3 años dejó este negocio porque había demasiado peligro y muchos carteles o Alquiló tierra allí para cultivar o A veces los Estados Unidos causaron problemas cuando detuvieron camiones para realizar inspecciones de salud, y la comida se puso fea Jerry es parte del Farm Bureau, pero cree que la organización no es bastante fuerte para ayudar a la agricultura Los trabajadores migrantes no vienen a trabajar tanto como antes a causa de los cambios en la inmigración de los EEUU, y hoy en día las personas ilegales son arrestadas o El gobierno no tiene programas en que estas personas pueden trabajar aquí legalmente o Sí existe en Canadá, así hay mexicanos o jamaicanos que viajan en auto para trabajar en Ontario Hoy en día se les paga bien a las personas que recogen los espárragos o las manzanas, y ganan $25 por hora La gente rehúye cultivos laboriosos porque no está segura si va a tener los trabajadores necesarios en los momentos específicos para estos cultivos Escuchar la grabación en 50 años – (51:44) • La población es estable y no crece mucho • El área ha sido buen lugar para formar una familia • Unas drogas que han entrado en la comunidad son la mayor amenaza • Hay mucha buena voluntad y paz en el pueblo • Jerry anima a los jóvenes que planten cultivos que ganarán dinero, como cultivos de fruta o espárragos • Hoy en día la agricultura es tan complicada que hay que tener cuidado en lo que se cultiva porque es posible que no se gane suficiente dinero para sobrevivir o El costo de la agricultura es muy desalentador para los jóvenes agricultores 6 �Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Department • • • • Actualmente hay muchas personas sin destrezas o sin educación universitaria que ganan muchísimo dinero por hora cuando recogen cultivos Jerry y sus hijos perdieron dinero en cultivos, así vendieron parte de sus tierras para pagar unas deudas Hoy en día los agricultores tienen que garantizar horas y pago específico para los trabajadores sin importar si hay trabajo o no Jerry menciona desafíos actuales para la agricultura y leyes que causan problemas para los agricultores Reflexiones finales – (1:00:32) • Los trabajadores migrantes siempre han sido una parte muy importante del condado de Oceana, y algunos se han establecido y han llegado a ser buenos ciudadanos, estabilizando la economía allí • Jerry está vendiendo su campo de trabajo • La segregación racial ha sido problemática también porque algunos nativos del pueblo no quieren que los hispanos estén allí • El pueblo nunca tendrá residentes suficientes para hacer todo el trabajo; se necesitan los trabajadores migrantes • En cierta época, el condado de Oceana fue el principal productor de pepinillos en Michigan 7 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4c60e07d6225f6d2e1fabfe09c8e41a3.mp3 c58867556bce55c83ee3fc0d6e40d650 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Brandel, Jerry (entrevista de audio y resumen) Descripción Spanish language Description entry Entrevista de historia oral con Jerry Brandel, Hart, Michigan. Entrevistado por Walter Urick. Idioma en Inglés. Febrero 12, 2016. Jerry Brandel nació el 28 de febrero de 1945 en Muskegon, Michigan. En ese año, su familia se mudó a Hart, Michigan, y compró una granja de frutas. Se graduó de Hart High School en 1963 y después asistió a Michigan State University por dos años para tomar un curso de agricultura. Después de su educación, se asoció con su padre y hermano por diez años para cultivar cerezas, manzanas, duraznos, y árboles de Navidad. En 1975, Jerry decidió cultivar solo y empezó a cultivar pepinillos en Oceana y en México. Luego, eligió trabajar en la venta de los cultivos de pepinillos de otros agricultores en todo el país. Jerry tiene dos hijos y una hija, y actualmente ha vivido en el área del condado de Oceana por 70 años. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms La agricultura Granja de frutas Cerezas Pepinillos Árboles de Navidad Ordeñar vacas El cerezal Tasa de interés Acres Trabajadores migrantes No hispano Hispano Afroamericano Desafíos en cuanto a la agricultura Vivienda México Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Brandel_Jerry Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Brandel, Jerry Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-02-12 Title A name given to the resource Brandel, Jerry (audio interview and summary) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Jerry Brandel, Hart, Michigan. Interviewed by Walter Urick. English language recording. Summary in English and Spanish. February 12, 2016. Jerry Brandel was born on February 28, 1945 in Muskegon, Michigan. That year, his family moved to Hart, Michigan, and bought a fruit farm. He graduated from Hart High School in 1963 and then went on to Michigan State University to take a two-year agricultural course. After his schooling, he went into partnership for ten years with his father and brother, where they farmed cherries, apples, peaches, and Christmas trees. In 1975, Jerry decided to begin farming on his own, and he started growing pickles in Oceana and Mexico. Years later, he entered into the broker business, selling pickle crops for other farmers across the country. Jerry has two sons and one daughter, and he has now lived in the Oceana County area for 70 years. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Urick, Walter (interviewer) Shell-Weiss, Melanie (director) Subject The topic of the resource Farming Fruit farm Cherries Pickles Christmas trees Milk cows Cherry orchard Interest rate Acres Migrants Non-Hispanic Hispanic African American Farming challenges Housing Mexico Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7e32db56bf389496456899e766ee92a7.pdf 64114003b24cd87610a5da16b10e6eb0 PDF Text Text Growing Community: Oceana’s Agricultural History Project A project supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant Project Director: Melanie Shell-Weiss, GVSU Liberal Studies Departement Interviewee: Richard Walsworth Interviewer: Phil Carter Location: Hart Library Date: 6/18/2016 English Audio Transcription Phil Carter: This is Phil Carter and I am here today with Dick Walsworth, at the Hart Library, in Heart Michigan on June 18th, 2016. This oral history has been collected as a part of the growing community project; which is supported, in part, by a grant from the National Endowment for the Humanities (NEH) Common Heritage Program. Thank-you Dick for taking time to talk with me today, I' am interested to learn more about your family history and your experiences in living and working in Oceana county. Can you please tell me your full name and spell it? Richard Walsworth: Richard Walsworth, R-I-C-H-A-R-D W-A-L-S-W-O-R-T-H. Phil Carter: And you do not use any accents when spelling your name? Richard Walsworth: No. Phil Carter: Tell me about where you grew up. Richard Walsworth: I grew up in Golden Township in Oceana County. I spent my entire life in that township, except for a short period when I went to college. Other than that, I spent my entire life in Golden Township. Phil Carter: Who are your family members and could you give me their names? Your immediate family. Richard Walsworth: My parents were Walter and Anna Walsworth, who are both deceased. I have a sister, Joyce Ensign, and two brothers who are living, Donald and Kenny Walsworth. And I have one brother, James Walsworth, who is deceased. Phil Carter: Thank-you. What are some of your most vivid memories from your childhood? Richard Walsworth: Well, we grew up on a farm. My parents had just gone through the depression. That certainly left a strong feeling in their hearts on how we kids grew up. We grew up as poor children, but we were no poorer than the next door neighbor. Not many people in our area had much in that era, the early 1940's. Farming was a way of life, it wasn’t about making a lot of money, but it was about food and fiber. We always had plenty to eat living on a farm. In that respect we lived very well, probably better than some of our city counterparts. We all worked on the farm. The family worked as a group, we usually had a family project. We had a pickle patch and that pickle patch was always designed to finance something for the farm. Like a new furnace for the house, or kitchen covers, or the one I remember the most is when we bought a television in 1953 for 550 bucks. And you could buy an automobile, a new automobile, for $1500 in that era. So when you think about it today, the relationship between the cost of a television and a car it’s remarkable. The television was of course black and white purchased from Brisinski Hardware here in Hart. It provided tremendous entertainment opportunity for the family. �Phil Carter: Your father was a farmer? Richard Walsworth: Yes. Phil Carter: What about your grandfather? Richard Walsworth: My grandfather was what I would call a tenant farmer. He lived his entire life in the old Shana County area, worked for Hire Man. His last year was with Hawley's Nursery, owned by Monroe Hawley here in town. My dad in his teenage years lived on the Hawley farm and the whole family worked for the Hawley area. My dad moved to Golden Township in 1926. Phil Carter: Was your great-grandfather also born in Oceana County or was he an immigrant? Richard Walsworth: ... [Sigh] you know I don’t know the answer to that. Phil Carter: That's fine, not a problem. When you first came to Oceana County… and as you said, you have lived here your entire life. And you've kind of given your fresh first impression of what it was like to live in Oceana County. As a youngster growing up, what was your first impression of the area? Was it a nice place to live? Did you hate it? Is it something you just put up with? Richard Walsworth: Well, Golden Township and this area has always been a good place to live in the early years. I didn't mind it as much as my folks did. I can remember back in the late ‘40s living in the rural area in the winter was tough. I mean it was tough. Lots of times we were without roads five or ten days. I can remember hauling milk out on a stone boat and the neighbors would get two or three tractors together and we'd try to get the milk out to Bob Williams’s corner where the milkman would come get the milk. My folks, my mom especially, really did not like living that far back of the main drag. You know as a kid we would see the milkman and the mailman. We had rural gravel roads. Those two people lots of times was the only traffic you would see for the entire day. This was in the ‘40s and early ‘50s. But as far as the area goes, it’s a great place to live. We had good opportunity. Like Swimming in Lake Michigan and local fishing lakes. And we kids lived at the (Marlbed) when we were young. My brother Don, he was a great fisherman. I always tagged along. I never really got the hang of it. Phil Carter: Don is older than you? Richard Walsworth: Don is four years older, yeah. He was a good mentor. Phil Carter: Are there any particular memories about living here, maybe additional memories; thoughts or moments that are special and memorable for you? Good or bad? You mentioned some of the good ones, any other good ones. Richard Walsworth: Well [thinking pause] probably the tough one was there was a period of years when polio was running rampant and we couldn’t go to the lake. I never learned to swim because my mom said I wasn’t going to the swimming hole because there was a risk. Now that seems restrictive, but back then we all knew somebody that had polio. Well, my father in law had polio. I never saw Bob walk. That went on for years. I was in high school, I think about freshmen, when the Salk vaccine came along. That was a series of shots that we took. I think they were shots? And then later a booster thing. But that really changed how the community interacted for a good number of years. I think it was like 10 or 12 years. Bob got polio in the early 40's and I didn’t get the vaccine until ‘55 or ‘56. Phil Carter: And again, Bob was your father in law? How would you describe Oceana County to someone who has never been here before? �Richard Walsworth: Boy... it’s got a lot of [change of thought] when you think about the fact that it's surrounded by the Great Lakes; you got the Great Lakes, you got the dunes, we got inland lakes. It’s a great place to live and raise a family. Now we are so close, with good highways which you can be to Ludington in 20 minutes or Muskegon in 35 minutes. You can live in the country, enjoy the rural life, and have access to everything. The only thing that were short on.... would be maybe the arts and performances. If you want to see a good performance you got to go to Grand Rapids or now you can go to Manistee, they have some talent there. That's probably the only short coming. You got to travel to find the arts. Phil Carter: You mentioned some of the ways that the area has changed over time. Are there any other things that are vivid of that change? Richard Walsworth: Well in the world of agriculture. You know, my dad started with horses. In about 1926 when he came here it was strictly all horses. He farmed all his life and he lived to be a hundred years and six months. He drove tractors for me; you know 120 horse power tractors and fit corn ground for me when he was in his eighties. When you think about what happened in his lifespan it’s almost incredible. And probably when I gain another 20 years, I will look back and say look what happened in my lifetime! When I was in high school, we bought our first new tractor in 1950s. We were on the waiting list for 3 years after the war to get an H-Farmall. And we bought that tractor and three or four pieces of equipment for $2600. My mom said, "We always had money until we finally got a tractor." After that she said, "We spent all our money on machinery." But the changes that have taken in agriculture... in the early years if you were not smart enough to do something else, you were a farmer. That was the image that farmers had. If you couldn't do something else you could be a farmer. Today that certainly isn’t the case. You have to be well educated and willing to accept technology. It just amazes me to see how technology has come in to agriculture since the year 2000s. I remember when they were talking about how everything was going to be run by computer software. I said, "Computers and dirt will never work." And I was really wrong, because now computers are so technical that I don't do any spraying anymore. If you can't run a computer easily and fool with it, then sprayer is all done, you can't do it. Everything is computerized. And it’s all good. I mean it increases production and the ability to produce tenfold, you know. Phil Carter: Can you please describe a little more about the type of farming you family does, you know, specific crops, acreage, and number of employees that type of thing? Richard Walsworth: Well, I grew up as the son of a dairy farmer. My dad milked cows up until about 1963 when Marsh and I got married. We bought a farm closer to Hart. Just out of Hart, 2 miles on 60th avenue. My mom wanted to get closer to town, so we made arrangements. They moved to the house on a new farm. Marsh and I stayed at the home farm and my dad sold the dairy cows and put all the money into the house in remodeling, which was a lot of money, a few thousand dollars, but you know we bought that farm and 80 acres with a decent house and a decent barn for $1200 in 1963. Phil Carter: [impressed with the price] UUUUU Richard Walsworth: Actually '62, Marsh and I bought that the year before we got married. And so dad retired in about '65 and I went to work for DuPont and I worked for DuPont form '64 to '72. And my dad retired we rented the farm out to Wilberdy Rider and Wayne Sapphire for 6 or 8 years. In '68 we planted our first asparagus, like a 3 acre patch. Asparagus was really gaining popularity and farming was really tough in that era, commodities, like milk and beef and all that stuff was really cheap. And it was very difficult to make a living on a farm. So we said, "Well, we'll try asparagus." And we planted asparagus �almost every year after '68. By the time we were in the mid '70s we were probably in the 80 acre range. And asparagus was 62cents and today its 76 cents. So if you convert the dollars, asparagus was really valuable back then. From about the mid-70s to the early 80's it was really easy to buy land and to pay for it, because you could buy land in that era for 300, 400, to 500 dollar per acre. And asparagus... the varieties we were using then we were picking about 2,000 pounds to the acre. At 60 cents that $1,200 bucks you could net a $1,000, it was an excellent business. And asparagus stayed good... stayed really well until the late '90s before the Peruvians became a factor. Well there were some free trade agreements, NAFTA and CAFTA and some of those that came along. Basically gave our markets to our foreign competitors, and it has really changed the asparagus world. At one time Washington had 32,000 acres, now they’re down to about 6,000 acres. California had over 40,000 acres, they’re down to 8,000 or 9,000; Michigan had 20,000 acres and we’re about half that today. And it has really changed the industry. Michigan industry was primarily all processed, about 85 % processed up until about 2005 or 2006. Then we began to develop an infrastructure, in state, for packing lines. We now have about 3 or 4 facilities in Oceana County that process fresh asparagus for the big chain stores. And so now the industry in Michigan is probably about half fresh and the other half processed. And fresh by far is the best. You know, fresh is roughly about a dollar a pound, what we call tail gate weight. Processed is about 75 cents for cuts and tips and a dime or so more for spears. The other component that really made it better is the new varieties that have come in since about the 2,000s that have more than doubled yield. It’s not uncommon now to have 5,000 pound breaker averages, where back in the day the goal was 2,000 pounds. That’s what kept us in business, the higher production per acre; otherwise we’d be in trouble. Phil Carter: At one time... [Change of thought] well your farm is called Golden Stock Farm. Tell me a little bit about your beef operation that you were in for a while. Richard Walsworth: Yeah, we had livestock on our farm, I think, from 1932 until about 2002, we never was without some livestock. My dad was livestock farmer all his life. We had both dairy cows and then raised beef and then hogs. And in 1979 I built a feed lot and a new silo. We fed beef from about1979 until early 2000s. Never really made any money, it was so competitive. First in the agriculture world, chickens went mass production. Then pork went mass production. And the cattle feed lots in the late 80s became big and prominent. Not necessarily in Michigan, there were some, but the western states once they became so commercial, your margin per head got so little that you just couldn’t make it. There’s hardly any… I don’t know of a commercial beef operation in our county, today. There are some people that have 5, 10, or 15 heads. We had a feedlot with a capacity of a 180 heads and we turned it about every 10 months. It worked. We paid the bills and made a little money, but relative to the work that we were putting into it, we discontinued it. Phil Carter: Were there any other crops that you grew other than asparagus? Like corn, beans, potatoes, or anything like that? Richard Walsworth: Our current cropping plan for the last few years have been primarily asparagus because that’s where the money is made. We currently have about 280 acres of asparagus. It grows generally 350 to 400 acres of corn, 80 acres of soy beans; and soy beans are relatively new to this area, and we’ve been growing them probably for the last 10 years. They’ve developed varieties that do better in the northern area and closer to the lake. You know, we don’t get the sunshine here, they get in the center state, but they’ve bread some varieties. We now can grow 50 bushels beans, and if they are �underwater closer to 60. So it makes a pretty good mix, but in the final cut asparagus is where we really make our money. Phil Carter: When you were talking about underwater, you are referring to irrigation? Richard Walsworth: Yes, center [could not make word out] Phil Carter: To cure or purify that? Richard Walsworth: Yeah Phil Carter: You’ve talked about a lot of what it’s been like when you first started; you’ve talked about how it’s been and how it’s changed have. And I think you’ve probably talked about some of the challenges that you have faced as a grower. Tell me a little bit about your employee situation on your farm. Richard Walsworth: In the early years we hired local women for asparagus harvest. My wife was a crew leader and that’s back when we had 80 acres. And we would have about 10 or 12 people, all local housewives. As times have changed most local housewives now are on the work force, there are not a lot of women that don’t have a job in this day and age. So we started in the early 90s switching to migrant labor and today we hire 35 migrants and provide housing. We’ve got 4 duplexes and we house most of them at the farm. Labor is one of our very serious challenges. The immigration or the lack of immigration policy at the federal level is really making it difficult. There’s a couple like the H2A program where you can use offshore labor. Some growers are being forced into doing that, it’s very cumbersome. It’s a little on the expensive side too. I think that maybe well clear up some of those issues. We’re going to have to do more of the offshore labor because there’s less and less migrants and they’re becoming more and more educated and are less likely to do field work. The generation that’s doing fieldwork is getting older. And as they purge out of the work system, the next generations have all got at least high school education and a lot of them education beyond that. They’re not going to do field work. Phil Carter: Dick, what are some of the best things in your mind about being a grower? Richard Walsworth: [sigh, followed by thinking pause] it’s been a good life. It’s challenging. But the economics have always been good enough that if you do a good job. And asparagus is one of those things that are not easy. If it was easy, everybody would do it. It’s not easy, believe me. There are some critical things, culturally, that you have to do right. First you have to do a good job of establishing your beds. Use good culturally practices to get peak production. The other component is can you manage help? And a lot of people can’t manage help. Because we are dealing with help that’s not what you’d call mainstream help. Even the migrants that have been here 10 or 15 years, if they got their docks lined up, they’re working for Earl Peterson, or Indian Summers or some place in a more controlled environment. So it’s a challenge to keep your help happy. And how do you get 35 people to work for 8 weeks of the year? You know. It’s difficult. Phil Carter: And just to clarify, Earl Peterson and Indian Summer are fruit and vegetable processor in the county? Richard Walsworth: Yeah. Phil Carter: What are some of the special responsibilities you have as a grower? Richard Walsworth: Regulatory issues are huge responsibility. Food safety… I never believed we’d see the level of regulatory things that you have to do to comply with food safety. Third party inspection, now, �before you deliver to certain processer require third party inspections. Which means farm visits and there’s a whole host of things you have to do right to pass inspection, or your buyer will not accept your product. Regulatory issues not only in the food safety world, but the chemicals that you use on your operation. Unlabeled chemicals are not acceptable, you have to make sure all your chemicals are labeled and properly used because everybody can check and cross check. And you have to supply all that data to your processors before they receive your product. Phil Carter: Has housing for your migrant help been an issue? Richard Walsworth: Yes it is. We’ve had housing since 1988. We’ve added another duplex last year. Hosing is a necessity. If you don’t have housing, you can’t control your workers. They’re not there when you need them. Good housing builds loyalty and you have to have good housing. The days of housing in substandard conditions are gone. You have to have good housing. Phil Carter: You’ve said you’ve been doing this our entire life, has this been 50 years plus, I assume? Richard Walsworth: Yes it has. This is our 48th year of asparagus. Phil Carter: Dick, what do you do to relax and to socialize? Richard Walsworth: Oh boy… [laughs] we just travel… we’ve have gone to Florida for the last 20 years for the month of February. I have a motorcycle. I ride my motorcycle some, but it’s not a high priority with me. I like to ride, but the risk of riding a motorcycle outweighs the enjoyment. Phil Carter: Are there any places or institutions beyond your farm that are important to you that are important to you in Oceana County? Richard Walsworth: Well, yes. I’ve been on the board of directors with Great Lakes Energy for about 30 years. I’m retiring in August of this year and that has been a wonderful experience for me. A learning experience and I think I made a difference in our co-op. We’ve merged four co-ops together and became Great Lakes Energy. During my 30 years at Great Lakes, I served 24 years on the board of directors of Wolverine Power Supply, which is the supplier of power to Great Lakes Energy, and Great Lakes Energy is the cooperative that supplies energy to all of Oceana County, with the exception of the cities, otherwise we supply all the rural areas. And I’ve been chairman of Great lakes for the last four years and chairman of Wolverine power for the last four years. Both of those will come to an end in August. Phil Carter: Are there any other organizations that you participate in? Do you speak with, work with, or represent any farmer’s organizations? Richard Walsworth: Well I’ve been a member of Farm Bureau since I was out of diapers [laughs]. It’s kind of expected if you’re a farmer you should be a member of Farm Bureau, there a very important spokesmen for the agricultural industry on a state wide and national basis. I’ve been a member for as long as I can remember. I was a member of MACAMA, which is the marketing program that Farm Bureau sponsored. They have under the 232 law privilege of negotiating grower prices and terms of delivery. Phil Carter: And that’s for processing asparagus? Richard Walsworth: Yes, for processing asparagus. I was a chairman of that marketing committee for at least 15 years, maybe 20. I retired from that a few years ago and sold the farm to my son in 2005. Now he’s on that marketing committee. �Phil Carter: Wasn’t he chairman of that? Richard Walsworth: I think yeah he’s been chairman of that… MACIMA and the ability to negotiate with processors is probably the main reason the asparagus industry has been successful. We’ve negotiated favorable prices for growers in Michigan and some years in tough conditions because of international competition, but still kept the industry viable. We had some tough years, but the industry today is really in pretty good shape. And here we are last weekend of the season and everybody is still buying asparagus and eating it…so were very fortunate. Phil Carter: Let’s look towards the future now; what are some of the hopes for the future for yourself and Marsha? Richard Walsworth: Well… [laughs hysterically] health would be the first one I guess. I’m officially retired; I still do a lot of work on the farm, not the manual work. Ryan really is good about assigning projects to me if we got to build a migrant house or put an irrigation system in, he’ll say, “you take care of that for me.” I keep him in the loop and say, “here’s how much money you’re going to have to write a check for.” That’s provided a nice safety valve for me. So it’s been good you know. Phil Carter: How about your family, your children, and family members? Richard Walsworth: Well I have one son, Ryan, who has bought the farm, him and his wife Janise. They have two girls. One just graduated from high school and the other has one year of college, they are both going to Cornerstone University. And Janise and Ryan’s son is about 27; he’s out of college and working as an engineer in Grand Rapids. And I have a daughter in New York, she has two children. Phil Carter: The last question says, “Would you want your children to go into this line of work”? Richard Walsworth: Ryan is third generation and maybe [pause to laugh] when his daughters get married, well get a fourth. But at this point neither one of them have much interest in farm, but you know when Ryan got out of college, I was at about in my late forties I guess it was. And you know I really didn’t have an operation big enough for two people. And I said “hey go to the real world and maybe you’ll find something you really like.” He went into the workforce for about 10 years and then he came back to farm in ’93. He started some projects planting some asparagus. He had the opportunity to lease some asparagus form Ed Johnson in Cadillac. He got a little start and started planting his own; he probably had 70 to 80 acres of asparagus of his own. Then we got a joint venture, rented 75 acres from Larry Snyder over by the Shell airport. When I retired that project floated into his basket. Now he’s planted heavily the last four to five years, actually ten years now, because he’s been to farm twenty years now. He’s been in ownership position for twelve years; he kind of gambled and planted a lot of the Canadian variety and millennium, it was an unknown. But it turned to be a winner. I mean it is yelling really well. And he’s got a lot of acres so he’s doing well, doing a lot better than I ever did. Phil Carter: What do you think are some of the greatest needs facing this community going forward? Richard Walsworth: Well infrastructure is one. Our road system in our county is in really tough shape. There just isn’t enough money to do all the things you need to do. Roads are basic to the wellbeing of your community. You have to have good roads to fuel your agricultural business to get your products to market. Labor is going to be an issue as we go forward. More and more crops that are mechanized will develop higher acreages. Weather we can keep the asparagus industry viable depends on the labor. It really does. If we can make this government H2A program work or if our government will have an �immigration program; the labor is there if they were able to flow back and forth. And they really don’t want to live here, they want to come here and earn a living. Imagine living in Mexico where you make eight dollars per day and our people here are averaging $20 or $25 an hour working up here. Yes, its hard work! But they are being well rewarded. If we could just get the legalization system so it was easy to work with, those people would come here and just be tickled to death and November 1 st come and they would spend six months south of the boarder. They would really enjoy doing that. Phil Carter: Remember that this interview will be saved for a long time. Someone will listen to this tape 50 plus years down the road, what would you most like them to know about your life and this community right now? Richard Walsworth: [laughs and takes time to think] How do you answer that? Well we’ve had a great life and agriculture has been good to us. When we started, Marsh and I started out with nothing [voice breaks] we didn’t own any land and we started with nothing! It took a long period of years. If you set a goal, an objective, and a strategy to get there, you control 80 percent of things. The other 20 percent are uncontrollable: weather, markets, and health those are some of the things you don’t control. But we set goals and objectives and we’ve obtained most of them, we’ve been fortunate to both be healthy and have worked within the parameters of the regulatory world. We’ve had a good life and I think we have a great future. It’s different. When I was a kid in West Golden you could go down there were fifteen farmers. Each one of them owned eighty or a hundred acre farm and supported their family. Now, probably have got seven or eight of those farms under our banner, and were not the only ones, everyone’s bought their neighbors out and now the scope is that you have to own a thousand acre farm in order to make a living. Back then you could support a family on eighty to a hundred acres, but you know as times move agriculture will become more concentrated. I think in Golden Township now there are only three or four farmers that farm and make a living out of it. But a lot of those farms like Riley farms support four or five families and the Furring farm two or there. It has grown to the point where you can’t do it alone you have to have outside, additional help as well as hired help. But we have a great future and it’s a good place, everybody is a family. Rural country, yet we got access to everything everybody else has got. Now we got wheels. It used to be back in the 20s [re-word] I can remember when we to high school and my brother Don wanted to play and my folks said “No way are we going to drive to Hart to get you after basketball, that’s five miles.” So you know, now my grandkids have never rode a school bus, mom and dad take them to school every day and that’s just the way it is. But we didn’t do that. Phil Carter: Any advice for a young person that might listen to this tape? Richard Walsworth: In what respect? Phil Carter: I’ll throw the ball back in your court? What advice would you give to your grandkids? Richard Walsworth: First thing you got to do is get an education. Education is the key. If you have an education then you can open the doors. Once you get the door open you set goals and objectives and build a long term plan and try to seek it. You have to focus on them and try to complete them. Success doesn’t happen overnight. It takes a series of events over life, some you earn and some are given to you. If you got your help then you have everything. There’s a future, but you have to plan for it. Good things don’t just happen to you. They happen because of your initiative. How your peers view you and community a lot of times is included whether you’re successful or not. There are people who can do things to help you if they want to; sometimes it’s not even monetary help. �Phil Carter: Would it be safe to say that your advice in general might be playing your work and work you’re playing? Richard Walsworth: There you go, that’s just about it. Phil Carter: Anything else you will like to share in closing up? Richard Walsworth: Well, life is a series of good things at different stages. First get started and have a family. The older generations leaves and now were the older generation, so it’s been a great life. I’ve had a good life [voice breaks] been a good one. Phil Carter: Okay, Dick Walsworth, thank you very much for your time and for sharing memories with us this concludes the interview. SPANISH TRANSLATION Phil Carter: Este es Phil Carter y estoy aquí, hoy, con Dick Walsworth, en la biblioteca de Hart en Hart Michigan el día es 18 de Junio de 2016. Esta historia oral ha sido recogida como parte del creciente proyecto comunitario. Cual es apoyado en parte por una donación del Programa de Patrimonio Común vía el Fondo Nacional para las Humanidades (FNH). Gracias Dick por tomarse el tiempo para hablar conmigo hoy, estoy interesado en aprender más sobre la historia de su familia y sus experiencias en vivir y trabajar en el condado de Oceanía. ¿Puede por favor decirme su nombre completo y deletrearlo? Richard Walsworth: Richard Walsworth, R-I-C-H-A-R-D W-A-L-S-W-O-R-T-H. Phil Carter: ¿Y no usas ningún acento cuando deletreas tu nombre? Richard Walsworth: No. Phil Carter: Háblame de dónde creciste. Richard Walsworth: Crecí en el Municipio de Oro en el condado de Oceanía. Pasé toda mi vida en ese municipio. Excepto un período corto cuando fui a la universidad. Aparte de eso, pasé toda mi vida en el Municipio de Oro. Phil Carter: ¿Quiénes son los miembros de su familia y podría darme sus nombres? Richard Walsworth: Mis padres fueron Walter y Anna Walsworth, ambos fallecidos. Tengo una hermana, Joyce Ensing, y dos hermanos que están viviendo, Donald y Kenny Walsworth. Y tengo un hermano, James Walsworth, que falleció también. Phil Carter: Gracias. ¿Cuáles son algunos de sus recuerdos más vividos de su vida de niño? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, crecimos en una granja. Mis padres acababan de pasar por la depresión. Eso sin duda dejó un fuerte sentimiento en sus corazones sobre cómo los niños crecieron. Crecimos como niños pobres, pero no fuimos más pobres que el vecino de al lado. No mucha gente en nuestra área tenía mucho en esa época, la década de los novecientos cuarentas. La agricultura era una forma de vida, no era para hacer dinero sino hacer comida y fibra. Siempre tuvimos mucho para comer viviendo en una granja. En ese sentido vivimos muy bien. Probablemente mejor que algunos de nuestros homólogos de la ciudad. Todos trabajamos en la granja. La familia trabajaba como un grupo, usualmente teníamos proyectos para toda la familia. Teníamos una parcela de encurtidos y esa parcela de encurtidos siempre fue diseñada para financiar algo para la granja. Como una nueva caldera para la casa, o armarios para la �cocina, o la que más recuerdo es cuando compramos una televisión por 550 dólares en mil novecientos cincuenta. Se podía comprar un automóvil, uno nuevo, por 1,500 dólares en esa época. Así que cuando se piensas de eso en el presente, la relación entre el costo de una televisión y un coche es notable. La televisión era por supuesto blanca y negro la compramos de la ferretería Brisinski aquí en Hart. Proporcionó una tremenda oportunidad de entretenimiento para la familia. Phil Carter: ¿Tu padre era granjero? Richard Walsworth: Sí. Phil Carter: ¿Y tu abuelo? Richard Walsworth: Mi abuelo era lo que yo llamaría un arrendatario. Vivió toda su vida en el área del antiguo condado de Shana, trabajó para Hombre Contractado, su último año fue con Hawley's Semillero, Monroe Hawley, aquí en la ciudad. Mi padre en su adolescencia vivió en la granja de Hawley y toda la familia trabajó para Hawley en la zona. Mi papá se trasladó al municipio de Oro en mil novecientos veinte y seis. Phil Carter: ¿Tu bisabuelo también nació en el condado de Oceanía o él era un inmigrante? Richard Walsworth: ... [pausa y suspiro] sabes que no sé la respuesta a eso. Phil Carter: Bien, eso no es un problema. Cuando viniste aquí al condado de Oceanía. Y como has dicho, has vivido aquí toda tu vida. Usted ha dado un poco de su impresión fresca de lo que era vivir en el condado de Oceanía. Como un niño creciendo, ¿cuál fue su primera impresión de la zona? ¿Era un lugar agradable para vivir? ¿Lo odias? ¿Es algo que acaba de soportar? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, el Municipio de Oro y esta área siempre ha sido un buen lugar para vivir en los primeros años. No me disgustaba tanto como mis padres. Recuerdo que en los últimos años de los mil novecientos cuarentas en una zona rural en el invierno fue difícil a vivir. Quiero decir que fue duro. Muchas veces estuvimos sin carreteras cinco o diez días. Puedo recordar transportar leche en un barco de piedra, los vecinos tendrían dos o tres tractores juntos e intentaríamos sacar la leche hasta la esquina de Bob Williams donde el lechero vendría a levantar la leche. A mis padres, mi mamá en especialmente, realmente no le gustaba vivir tan lejos de la calle principal. Sabes que cuando fuimos niños veríamos al lechero y al cartero solamente. Teníamos rutas de grava y esas dos personas muchas veces fueron el único tráfico que veríamos durante todo el día. Esto fue en los finando años de los mil novecientos cuarentas y los principios de mil novecientos cincuentas. Pero en cuanto la zona va es un gran lugar para vivir. Tuvimos una buena oportunidad. Nadamos en el lago de Michigan y pescamos los lagos locales. Y nosotros, los niños, vivimos en el (Marlbed) cuando éramos jóvenes. Mi hermano Don era un gran pescador. Siempre lo seguí de cerca, pero la pesca nunca la conseguí. Phil Carter: ¿Don es mayor que tú? Richard Walsworth: Don es cuatro años mayor. Sí. Era un buen mentor. Phil Carter: ¿Hay algún recuerdo particular sobre vivir aquí, tal vez recuerdos adicionales; Pensamientos o momentos que son especiales y memorable para usted? ¿Bueno o malo? Mencionaste algunos de los buenos, ¿hay otros? Richard Walsworth: Bueno [pausa para pensar] Probablemente el más difícil fue que hubo un período de unos años en que el polio estaba corriendo desenfrenadamente. Nunca aprendí a nadar porque mi mamá dijo que no iba a nadar porque había un riesgo de polio. Ahora eso parece restrictivo, pero en ese tiempo �todos conocíamos a alguien que tenía polio. Bueno, mi suegro tenía polio. Nunca vi a Bob caminar. Eso continuó durante muchos años. Yo estaba en la secundaria, pienso que fui estudiantes de primer año, cuando llegó la vacuna Salk. Esa fue una serie de vacunas que tomamos. [¿Creo que fueron tiros?] Y luego más tarde una cosa de refuerzo. Pero eso realmente cambió la forma en que la comunidad interactuó durante un buen número de años. Creo que fue como 10 o 12 años. Bob tuvo polio a principios de los mil novecientos cuarentas y no puedo conseguir la vacuna hasta los cincuenta y cincos o cincuenta y seis. Phil Carter: Gracias. Phil Carter: ¿Y otra vez, Bob era su suegro? ¿Cómo describiría el condado de Oceanía a alguien que nunca había estado aquí antes? Richard Walsworth: Chico... tiene un montón de… [cambio de pensamiento] cuando piensas en la realidad que está rodeado por los Grandes Lagos; usted tienes los Grandes Lagos, tienes las dunas, y tenemos muchos lagos interiores. Es un gran lugar para vivir y criar una familia. Ahora estamos tan cerca, con buenas carreteras, que puede estar en Ludington en 20 minutos o Muskegon en 35 minutos. Usted puede vivir en el país, disfrutar de la vida rural, y tener acceso a todo. Lo único que está a corto sería los artes y actuaciones. Si quieres ver un buen rendimiento tienes que ir a Grand Rapids o ahora puedes ir a Manistee, tienen talento allí. Esa es probablemente la única venida corta de la vida rural. Tienes que viajar para encontrar los artes. Phil Carter: Usted mencionó algunas de las maneras en que el área ha cambiado con el tiempo. ¿Hay otras cosas que sean vividas de ese cambio? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, en el mundo de la agricultura. Mi papá empezó con caballos. En mil novecientos veinte y seis, cuando vino aquí, era estrictamente caballos. Cultivó toda su vida y vivió cien años y seis meses. Dirigió tractores para mí, tractores de 120 caballos y terreno tierra para plantar maíz para mí cuando tenía unos ochenta años. Cuando piensas en lo que sucedió en su vida es casi increíble. Y probablemente cuando gane otros 20 años, miraré hacia atrás y diré “¡mira lo que ocurrió en mi vida!” Cuando estaba en la escuela secundaria, compramos nuestro primer tractor nuevo en los años mil novecientos cincuentas. Estábamos en la lista de espera por 3 años después de la segunda guerra mundial para conseguir un H-Farmall. Y compramos ese tractor y tres o cuatro piezas de equipo por 2,600 dólares. Mi mamá dijo: "Siempre tuvimos dinero hasta que finalmente conseguimos un tractor.” Después de eso dijo, "Gastamos todo nuestro dinero en maquinaria." Pero los cambios que han tenido en la agricultura... en los primeros años si no fueras suficientemente inteligente como para hacer otra cosa, eras un granjero. Esa era la imagen que tenían los agricultores. Eso, si no pudieras hacer otra cosa, podrías ser un granjero. Hoy en día, eso ciertamente no es el caso. Tienes que estar bien educado y dispuesto a aceptar la tecnología. Me sorprende ver cómo la tecnología ha llegado a la agricultura desde el año dos mil. Recuerdo cuando estaban hablando de cómo todo iba a ser dirigido por software de computadoras. Dije: "las computadoras y la tierra nunca van a funcionarán". Y yo no estaba más equivocado. Porque ahora las computadoras son tan techincal que no hago ninguna pulverización más. Si no puede ejecutar una computadora fácilmente y jugar con ella, a continuación, pulverizando está todo hecho computarizado, no se puede hacer otramente. Todo es computarizado. Pero es bueno. Quiero decir que las computadoras aumentan la producción y la capacidad de producir diez veces, ya sabes. Phil Carter: ¿Puede describir un poco más sobre el tipo de agricultura que su familia hace, usted sabe, cultivos específicos, hectáreas, y número de empleados, ese tipo de cosas? �Richard Walsworth: Bueno, yo crecí como el hijo de un lechero. Mi papá ordenó vacas hasta los sesenta y tres, cuando Marsh y yo nos casamos. Compramos una granja cerca de Hart. Justo fuera de Hart, 2 millas en la Avenida 60. Mi madre quería acercarse a la ciudad, así que hicimos arreglos. Se trasladaron a la casa de una nueva granja. Marsh y yo nos alojamos en la granja de casa y mi padre vendió las vacas lecheras y puso todo el dinero en la casa para remodelaciones, fue un montón de dinero, unos miles de dólares, pero sabes que compramos la granja y 80 hectáreas con una decente casa y un buen estable por 1,200 dólares en mil novecientos sesenta y seis. Phil Carter: [impresionado con el precio] UUUUU! Richard Walsworth: En realidad en sesenta y dos, Marsh y yo compramos la propiedad en el año antes de nuestro matrimonio. Y así se retiró papá en alrededor de mil novecientos sesenta y cinco y yo fui a trabajar para Dupont y trabajé para Dupont forma sesenta y cuatro hasta setenta y dos. Cuando mi papá se retiró alquilamos la granja a Wilberdy Rider y Wanye Sapphire por un tiempo de seis o ocho años. En sesenta y ocho plantamos nuestros primeros asperges. Como un parche de tres hectáreas. Las asperges estaban realmente ganando popularidad y la agricultura era muy dura en esa era, comodidades, como la leche y la carne y todo eso era estaban realmente barato. Entonces era muy difícil ganarse la vida en una granja. Así que le dijimos: "Bueno, probaremos las asperges.” Y plantamos asperges casi todos los años después del sesenta y ocho. En el momento en que estábamos en la mitad de los años setentas estábamos probablemente en la proximidad de 80 hectáreas. Y asperja era 62 centavos y hoy 76 centavos. Así que si conviertes los dólares, el asperge era realmente valioso. Desde mediados de los años setenta hasta principios de los ochenta era realmente fácil comprar tierra y pagarla. Porque usted podría comprar la tierra en ese tiempo por 300, 400, a 500 dólar por acre. Y asperges... las variedades que estábamos utilizando entonces estábamos recolectando alrededor de 2,000 libras por hectárea. A 60 centavos era 1,200 dólares que podrían capturar 1,000 dólares, fue un excelente negocio. Y asperges se quedó bien... se quedó muy bien hasta finales de los años mil novecientos noventas antes de que los Peruanos se convirtieran en un factor. Bueno, hubo algunos acuerdos de libre comercio, el TLCAN y el CAFTA y algunos de los que surgieron. Básicamente dio nuestros mercados a nuestros competidores extranjeros y realmente ha cambiado el mundo de asperges. En una época Washington tenía 32,000 hectáreas, ahora están abajo a cerca de 6,000 hectáreas. California tenía más de 40,000 hectáreas, ahora están a 8,000 o 9,000 y Michigan tenía 20,000 hectáreas y estamos cerca de la mitad hoy. Realmente ha cambiado la industria. La industria de Michigan fue procesada principalmente, aproximadamente el 85% procesó hasta aproximadamente 2005 o 2006. Entonces comenzamos a desarrollar una infraestructura, en el estado, para las líneas de embalaje. Ahora tenemos cerca de tres o cuatro instalaciones en el condado de Oceanía que procesan espárragos frescos para las grandes cadenas de tiendas. Y lo que ahora la industria en Michigan es probablemente la mitad fresca y la otra mitad procesada. Y fresca de lejos es la mejor. Sabes, fresca es aproximadamente un dólar por libra, lo otro es lo que llamamos peso de la puerta de cola. Procesado es de unos 75 centavos para cortes y propinas y un centavo o más para lanzas. El otro componente que realmente hizo que sea mejor es las nuevas variedades que han entrado desde alrededor de los años dos mil que han más que duplicado el rendimiento. No es raro ahora tener 5,000 promedios por libras, donde de vuelta en el día la meta fue de 2,000 libras. La mayor producción por hectárea, eso es lo que nos mantuvo en los negocios, sino a lo contrario estaríamos en problemas. �Phil Carter: En un momento... [Cambio de pensamiento] ¿Así que su granja se llama Granja de Oro? Cuéntame un poco sobre tu operación de carne de vacuno en la que estuviste por un tiempo. Richard Walsworth: Sí, teníamos ganado en nuestra granja, creo, desde mil novecientos treinta y dos hasta aproximadamente dos mil dos, nunca estuvimos sin ganado. Mi padre fue ganadero toda su vida. Teníamos muchas vacas lecheras y luego criamos ganado y después cerdos. Y en los mil setenta y nueve construí un corral para engordar y una nueva ensiladora. Alimentamos ganado desde mil setenta y nueve hasta los principios de dos mil. Nunca realmente hizo dinero, era tan competitivo. Primero en el mundo de la agricultura, los pollos fueron a la producción en masa. Entonces el cerdo fue la producción en masa. Y las grandes granjas de ganado a los finales de mil novecientos ochenta se hicieron prominentes en el Oeste. No necesariamente en Michigan, hubo algunos, pero los estados occidentales cuando que se convirtieron en tan grande centros comerciales, su margen por cabeza fue tan poco que usted simplemente no podía competir. Casi no hay... no conozco una operación de carne comercial en nuestro condado hoy. Hay algunas personas que tienen cinco, diez o quince cabezas. Y nosotros teníamos un corral con una capacidad de 180 cabezas y lo giramos cada diez meses. Funcionó. Pagamos las facturas e hicimos un poco de dinero, pero en relación, con el trabajo que estábamos poniendo en él lo discontinuamos. Phil Carter: ¿Hubo otros vegetales que cultivaste más que espárragos? ¿Cómo maíz, frijoles, patatas, o algo así? Richard Walsworth: Nuestro plan de cultivo actual para los últimos años ha sido principalmente espárragos porque ahí es donde se hace el dinero. Actualmente tenemos cerca de 280 hectáreas de espárragos. Crece generalmente como 350 a 400 hectáreas de maíz, 80 hectáreas de frijoles de soya. Y los frijoles de soya son relativamente nuevos en este lugar, y los hemos estado creciendo probablemente durante los últimos diez años. Han desarrollado variedades que hacen mejor en la zona del norte y más cerca del lago. No conseguimos el sol aquí en la parte central, pero ahora tienen algunas variedades que crecen aquí también. Ahora podemos cultivar 50 bultos de frijoles, y si están bajo el agua es más cerca de 60. Así que hace una buena mezcla, pero en el último corte el espárrago es donde realmente hacemos nuestro dinero. Phil Carter: Cuando hablabas de submarino, ¿te refieres al riego? Richard Walsworth: Sí, el centro [no podía entender] Phil Carter: ¿Para curar o purificar eso? Richard Walsworth: Sí Phil Carter: Has hablado mucho de lo que ha sido cuando empezaste; usted ha hablado de cómo ha sido y cómo ha cambiado. Y creo que usted probablemente haz hablado de algunos de los desafíos que se han enfrentado como un productor. Cuéntame un poco sobre tu situación de empleado en tu granja. �Richard Walsworth: En los primeros años contratamos a mujeres locales para la cosecha de espárragos. Mi esposa era un líder de equipo y eso está de vuelta cuando teníamos 80 hectáreas. Tendríamos alrededor de diez o doce personas, todas las amas fueron de casas locales. Como los tiempos han cambiado la mayoría de las amas locales ahora están en la fuerza de trabajo, no hay un montón de mujeres que no tienen un trabajo en este día y edad. Así que comenzamos a los principios de mil novecientos noventa cambiando la mano de obra para los migrantes y hoy contratamos a 35 migrantes y le proveemos vivienda. Tenemos cuatro casas donde la mayoría de ellos viven en la granja. El trabajo manual es uno de nuestros problemas muy serios. La inmigración o la falta de acción política de inmigración al nivel federal es realmente lo que es difícil. Hay unos programas como el H2A donde se puede utilizar mano de obra extranjera. Algunos productores se ven obligados a hacerlo, pero es muy engorroso. Es un poco caro también. Creo que tal vez aclare algunas de esas cuestiones. Vamos a tener que hacer más de la mano de obra en alta mar porque hay cada vez menos emigrantes y se están haciendo más y más educados y son menos propensos a hacer trabajo de campo. La generación que está haciendo trabajo de campo está envejeciendo. Y a medida que eliminan del sistema de trabajo, las próximas generaciones han obtenido por lo menos la educación secundaria y muchos de ellos educación más allá de eso. No van a hacer trabajo de campo. Phil Carter: Dick, ¿cuáles son algunas de las mejores cosas en su mente acerca de ser un cultivador? Richard Walsworth: [suspiro, seguido por pensar en pausa] ha sido una buena vida. Es un reto. Pero la economía siempre ha sido suficientemente buena como para hacer un buen trabajo. Y el espárrago es una de esas cosas que no es fácil. Si fuera fácil, todo el mundo lo haría. No es fácil, créeme. Hay algunas cosas críticas, culturalmente, que tienes que hacer bien. Primero usted tiene que hacer un buen trabajo de establecer sus camas. Utilizar buenas prácticas culturales para obtener la producción máxima. El otro componente es ¿puedes controlar la ayuda? Y mucha gente no puede manejar su ayuda. Debido a que estamos tratando con ayuda que no es lo que usted llamaría la ayuda mainstream (popular). Incluso los migrantes que han estado aquí diez o quince años, si tienen sus conexiones alineadas están trabajando para Eral Peterson, o Indian Summers o algún lugar en un ambiente más controlado. Por lo tanto, es un reto mantener su ayuda feliz. ¿Y cómo consigues que treintas personas trabajen durante ocho semanas del año? Ya sabes. Es difícil. Phil Carter: Y para aclarar, ¿Eral Peterson y Indian Summer son procesadores de frutas y hortalizas en el condado? Sí. Richard Walsworth: Sí ellos son. Phil Carter: ¿Cuáles son algunas de las responsabilidades especiales que tiene como agricultor? Richard Walsworth: Las cuestiones reglamentarias son una enorme responsabilidad. Seguridad alimentaria... Nunca creí que íbamos a ver el nivel de las cosas reglamentarias que usted tiene que hacer para cumplir con la seguridad alimentaria. Inspección por parte de los terceros, ahora, antes de entregar �al determinado procesador requieren inspecciones de terceros. Lo que significa es visitas a la granja y hay un montón de cosas que tienes que hacer bien para pasar la inspección, o su comprador no aceptará su producto. Problemas reglamentarios no sólo en el mundo de la inocuidad de los alimentos, sino también en los productos químicos que utiliza en su operación. Productos químicos sin etiqueta no son aceptables, usted tiene que asegurarse de que todos sus productos químicos están etiquetados y correctamente utilizados, porque todo el mundo puede comprobar con una mara de equis. Y usted tiene que suministrar todos esos datos a sus procesadores antes de que reciban su producto. Phil Carter: ¿La vivienda para su ayuda migratoria ha sido un problema? Richard Walsworth: Sí lo a sido. Hemos tenido vivienda desde mil novecientos ochenta y ocho. Hemos agregado otra casa el año pasado. Alojamiento es una necesidad. Si no tiene vivienda, no puede controlar a sus trabajadores. Porque no están allí cuando los necesitas. Buena vivienda construye la lealtad y usted tiene que tiene buena vivienda. Los días de la vivienda en condiciones deficientes se han ido. Usted necesita buena vivienda para mantener sus trabajadores felices. Phil Carter: Has dicho que has estado haciendo esto toda su vida, ¿esto ha sido 50 años más, supongo? Richard Walsworth: Sí, este es nuestro 48 año de plantar espárragos. Phil Carter: Dick, ¿qué haces para relajarte y socializar? Richard Walsworth: Oh chico... [se ríe] solo viajamos, hemos ido a Florida durante los últimos 20 años para el mes de Febrero. Tengo una motocicleta. Voy en mi moto algunos días, pero no es una alta prioridad conmigo. Me gusta montar, pero el riesgo de montar una motocicleta supera el disfruto. Phil Carter: ¿Hay lugares o instituciones más allá de su finca que son importantes para usted y que son importantes para usted en el Condado de Oceanía? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, sí. He estado en el consejo de directores con la empresa de Energía de los Grandes Lagos durante unos 30 años. Me estoy jubilando en Agosto de este año y que ha sido una experiencia maravillosa para mí. Una experiencia de aprendizaje y creo que hice una diferencia en nuestra cooperativa. Hemos combinado cuatro cooperativas juntas y se ha convertido a la Energía de los Grandes Lagos. Durante mis 30 años con la compañía, serví 24 años en el consejo de administración de Wolverine: Suministro de Energía, que es el proveedor de energía para los Grandes Lagos, y es la cooperativa que suministra energía a todo el Condado de Oceanía, con la excepción de las ciudades, de lo contrario abastecemos a todas las zonas rurales. Y he sido presidente de Energía de los Grandes Lagos durante los últimos cuatro años y presidente del Wolverine durante los últimos cuatro años. Ambos terminarán en Agosto. Phil Carter: ¿Hay alguna otra organización en la que participes? ¿Hablas con, trabajas con, o representas organizaciones de agricultores? �Richard Walsworth: Bueno, he sido miembro del Departamento de Granja desde que estaba sin pañales [ríe]. Es de esperar que si usted es un agricultor deba ser miembro del Departamento de la Granja, es una voz muy importante para la industria agrícola al nivel estatal y nacional. He sido miembro durante todo el tiempo que puedo recordar. Yo era miembro de MACAMA, que es el programa de marketing del departamento patrocinó. Tienen bajo el privilegio de la ley de negociar los precios de los cultivadores y las condiciones de entrega. Phil Carter: ¿Y eso es para procesar espárragos? Richard Walsworth: Sí, para procesar espárragos. Yo era presidente de ese comité de mercadeo por al menos 15 años, tal vez 20 años. Me retiré de eso hace unos años y vendí la granja a mi hijo en dos mil cinco. Ahora él está en ese comité de mercadotecnia. Phil Carter: ¿No era presidente de eso? Richard Walsworth: Creo que sí que ha sido presidente de eso... MACIMA y la capacidad de negociar con los procesadores es probablemente la razón principal de la industria de los espárragos ha tenido éxito. Hemos negociado precios favorables para los productores en Michigan y algunos años en condiciones difíciles debido a la competencia internacional, pero todavía mantuvo la industria viable. Tuvimos algunos años difíciles, pero la industria de hoy está realmente en muy buena forma. Y aquí estamos el pasado fin de semana al término de la temporada y todo el mundo sigue comprando espárragos y comiéndolo... así que fuimos muy afortunados. Phil Carter: Miremos hacia el futuro ahora; ¿cuáles son algunas de las esperanzas para el futuro para ti y Marsha? Richard Walsworth: Bueno... [se ríe histéricamente] la salud sería primera supongo. Estoy oficialmente jubilado. Todavía hago mucho trabajo en la granja, pero no trabajo manual. Ryan es realmente bueno en la asignación de proyectos para mí si tenemos que construir una casa de migrantes o poner un sistema de riego, él dirá, "usted se ocupa de eso para mí." Lo mantengo en el lazo y le digo, "aquí es cuánto dinero vas a tener que escribir un cheque para.” Eso es una buena válvula de seguridad para mí. Así que ha sido bueno. Phil Carter: ¿Háblame de su familia, sus hijos y miembros? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, tengo un hijo, Ryan, que ha comprado la granja, él y su esposa Janise. Tienen dos chicas. Uno acaba de graduarse de la escuela secundaria y la otra tiene un año de universidad, ambos van a la Universidad de Cornerstone. Y el hijo de Janise y Ryan tiene 27 años; Está fuera de la universidad y trabaja como ingeniero en Grand Rapids. Y tengo una hija en Nueva York, tiene dos hijos. Phil Carter: La última pregunta dice: "¿Quiere que sus hijos entraran en esta línea de trabajo"? �Richard Walsworth: Ryan es de la tercera generación y tal vez [pausa para reír] cuando sus hijas se casan, así vamos a obtener una cuarta. Pero en este punto ninguno de ellos tiene mucho interés en la granja, pero ya sabes cuándo Ryan salió de la universidad, yo estaba en alrededor de cuarenta años, supongo que era. Y sabes que realmente no tuve una operación suficientemente grande para dos personas. Y le dije: "va al mundo real y tal vez encuentras algo que realmente te gusta." Entró en la fuerza de trabajo durante unos diez años y luego regresó a la granja en mil novecientos noventa y tres. Comenzó algunos proyectos de plantación de algunos espárragos. Tuvo la oportunidad de alquilar algún tipo de espárragos de Ed Johnson en Cadillac. Comenzó un poco a poco a plantar los suyos. Probablemente tenía de 70 a 80 hectáreas de espárragos propios. Luego tuvimos una empresa conjunta, alquilamos 75 hectáreas de Larry Snyder por el aeropuerto de Shell. Cuando me retiré ese proyecto flotó en su canasta. Ahora él ha plantado pesadamente los últimos cuatro a cinco años, en realidad diez años ahora, porque él ha estado a la granja veinte años ahora. Ha estado en posesión durante doce años. Él se puso a jugar y tomo un riesgo cuando plantó una gran cantidad de la variedad Canadiense, y el milenio que era un desconocido. Pero se convirtió en un ganador. Quiero decir que está gritando muy bien. Y tiene muchas hectáreas, así que lo está haciendo bien, haciendo más mejor de lo que yo nunca hice. Phil Carter: ¿Cuáles cree que son algunas de las mayores necesidades que enfrenta esta comunidad en el futuro? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, la infraestructura es una. Nuestro sistema de carreteras en nuestro condado está en una forma muy dura. Simplemente no hay suficiente dinero para hacer todas las cosas que hay que hacer. Las carreteras son básicas para el bienestar de la comunidad. Usted tiene que tener buenos caminos para alimentar su negocio agrícola para obtener sus productos al mercado. La labor va a ser un problema a medida que avanzamos. Cada vez más cultivos que se mecanizan desarrollarán mayores hectáreas. El tiempo que podemos mantener la industria de los espárragos viable depende de la mano de obra. Realmente lo hace. Si podemos hacer que este programa H2A del gobierno funcione o si nuestro gobierno tendrá un programa de inmigración; El trabajo está allí sí pudrieran fluir de un lado al otro. Y realmente no quieren vivir aquí, quieren venir aquí y ganarse la vida. Imagine vivir en México donde gana $8 dólares al día y nuestra gente aquí tiene un promedio de $20 o $25 por hora trabajando aquí. Sí, el trabajo es duro! Pero están siendo bien recompensados. Si pudiéramos obtener el sistema de legalización de manera que fuera más fácil trabajar con ellos, esas personas vendrían aquí y sólo serían cosquillas hasta el primero de Noviembre y llegarían a pasar seis meses al sur de la frontera. Realmente disfrutarían haciendo eso. Phil Carter: Recuerda que esta entrevista se va guardar durante mucho tiempo. Alguien va a escuchar esta cinta 50 años más en el camino, ¿qué es lo que más les gustaría saber sobre su vida y esta comunidad en este momento? Richard Walsworth: [se ríe y toma tiempo para pensar] ¿Cómo respondes a eso? Bueno, hemos tenido una gran vida y la agricultura ha sido buena para nosotros. Cuando empezamos, Marsh y yo empezamos con nada [pausa de voz] ¡no teníamos tierra y empezamos con nada! Tomó un largo período de años. Si �establece una meta, un objetivo, y una estrategia para llegar allí, tú controlas 80 por ciento de las cosas. El otro 20 por ciento son incontrolables: el clima, los mercados, y la salud son algunas de las cosas que no controlas. Pero establecimos metas y objetivos, y hemos obtenido la mayoría de ellos; hemos tenido la suerte de estar sanos y de haber trabajado dentro de los parámetros del mundo regulador. Hemos tenido una buena vida y creo que tenemos un gran futuro. Es diferente. Cuando yo era un niño en Oeste de Oro podías bajar allí y había como quince agricultores. Cada uno de ellos poseía una granja de 80 o 100 hectáreas y apoyaba a su familia. Ahora, probablemente nosotros hemos conseguido siete u ocho de esas granjas debajo de nuestra bandera, y no eran las únicas, cada uno compró a sus vecinos hacia fuera y ahora el alcance es que usted tiene que poseer una granja de mil acres para ganarse la vida. En ese entonces usted podría apoyar a una familia en 80 a 100 hectáreas, pero cómo los tiempos se mueven la agricultura se concentrará más. Creo que en el Municipio de Oro ahora hay sólo tres o cuatro agricultores en la granja y ganan la vida fuera de ella. Pero muchas de esas granjas, como las granjas de Riley, apoyan a cuatro o cinco familias y la granja Furring dos o allí. Ha crecido hasta el punto en el que la agricultura no puede hacerlo solo tiene que tener ayuda adicional, como la ayuda contratada. Pero tenemos un gran futuro y es un buen lugar, todo el mundo es una familia. País rural, sin embargo, tenemos acceso a que todo lo que los demás tienen. Ahora tenemos ruedas. Solía estar de vuelta en la década de los mil novecientos veintes, yo puedo recordar cuando llegamos a la escuela secundaria. Mi hermano Don quería jugar al baloncesto y mis padres le dijeron "No hay manera que vamos a conducir a Hart para conseguir después del baloncesto, ¡que es cinco millas!” Así que ya sabes, ahora mis nietos nunca han montado en un autobús escolar, mamá y papá los llevan a la escuela todos los días y así es. Pero mi generación no hicimos eso. Phil Carter: ¿Tienes algún consejo para un joven que pueda escuchar esta cinta? Richard Walsworth: ¿En qué sentido? Phil Carter: Voy a tirar la pelota en tu cancha, ¿Qué consejo les daría a sus nietos? Richard Walsworth: Lo primero que tienes que hacer es obtener una educación. La educación es la clave. Si tienes una educación entonces puedes abrir las puertas. A vez que usted consigue la puerta abierta usted fija las metas, los objetivos, y construye un plan. A largo plazo y trata de buscarlo. Tienes que concentrarte en tus planes y tratar de completarlos. El éxito no sucede de la noche a la mañana. Toma una serie de acontecimientos sobre la vida algunos usted gana, y algunos se dan a usted. Si consiguió su ayuda entonces usted tiene todo. Hay un futuro, pero hay que planificarlo. Las cosas buenas no le pasan a usted, pero pasan cuando usted sucede por su iniciativa. La forma en que tus compañeros te ven y la comunidad, muchas veces, se incluye si eres exitoso o no. Hay personas que pueden hacer cosas para ayudarte si quieren—a veces ni siquiera es ayuda monetaria. Phil Carter: ¿Sería seguro decir que su consejo en general puede ser jugar su trabajo y trabaja lo que estás jugando? Richard Walsworth: Ahí tienes, eso es todo. �Phil Carter: ¿Algo más que le gustaría compartir al cerrar? Richard Walsworth: Bueno, la vida es una serie de cosas buenas en diferentes etapas. En primero empiezas una familia. Las generaciones mayores se van y ahora eran la generación más vieja, así que ha sido una gran vida. He tenido una buena vida (pausa de voz), ha sido buena. Phil Carter: Bien, Dick Walsworth, muchas gracias por su tiempo y por compartir con nosotros sus recuerdos, esto concluye la entrevista. � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/1a61606c89fd1714a03d0472cb668e8d.mp3 eaa9e119c89162e4a480988f837cfa20 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Descripción Spanish language Description entry Dick Walsworth es un granjero local del condado de Oceanía. La historia de su vida destaca los desafíos relacionados con mantener su negocio agrícola, en gran parte la industria de los espárragos, viable y competitiva con el reto de las fuerzas emergentes del mercado global. En esta entrevista, Walsworth comparte su testimonio de los cambios sociales, culturales, tecnológicos, e industriales que han ocurrido en el área de Oceanía desde su juventud. Este rico relato histórico, de la perspectiva de un agricultor local—con una vida de experiencia en el mundo agrícola, representa los retos que tenemos por delante en el futuro para mantener viva nuestra producción de granjas y hortalizas. Walsworth declara que el futuro depende de la mano de obra migrante, cada vez más escasa, ya que "las próximas generaciones están por lo menos recibiendo educación secundaria y no van a hacer trabajo de campo." La profunda preocupación por la política de inmigración, o la falta de políticas gubernamentales, lo hacen más difícil a las empresas locales para mantener su flujo de trabajo constante y consistente en comparación con las necesidades de la industria al nivel estatal y nacional. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Agrícola Espárragos Póliza de inmigración Industria Labor migrante TLCAN Condado de Oceanía Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Walsworth_Richard Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Walsworth, Richard Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016-06-18 Title A name given to the resource Walsworth, Richard (audio interview, English transcription and Spanish translation) Description An account of the resource Oral history interview with Richard Walsworth. Interviewed by Phil Carter. Hart, Michigan. English language. June 18, 2016. Dick Walsworth is a local farmer from Oceana County. His life story highlights the challenges of maintaining his agricultural business, largely the asparagus industry, viable and competitive with the challenge of emerging global market forces. In this interview, Walsworth shares his testimony of the social, cultural, technologic, and industrial changes that have occurred in the Oceana area since his youth. This rich historical account from the perspective of a local farmer with a lifetime of experience in the agricultural world depicts the challenges ahead in the future to keep our farms and vegetables production alive. To this Walsworth declares that the future depends on migrant labor which is becoming increasingly short on supply since "the next generations are at least getting a high school education [...] they're not going to do field work." Walsworth also shares his deep concern with immigration policy, or lack of governmental policy, that makes it harder on local businesses to keep their labor flow steady and consistent compared to the needs of the industry in a state and national level. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Carter, Phil (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Agriculture Asparagus Immigration Policy Industry Migrant agricultural laborers North American Free Trade Agreement (1992 December 17) Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Allendale, Michigan Relation A related resource "Growing Community" (NEH Common Heritage) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/023ede1f8980822ad0031807f749c20d.pdf 8b0e12c69c892f4766efdbfbd4ea60cf PDF Text Text more th an ninPteen yearsago. J'lle ~ popul'ation of Norway is about 2,2~0, 00, ) or a little over that. I visited many I will now attempt, to write about our farms in the country, <'Specially around I journey :n Norway last summer. We where I was born. I al.so visited my left our home 011 April 16, and visited birthplace, ·a log hu~ ,,nd barn on ~b_out • • . . . ten acres of land, m a bad cond1t10n . ~nends m Chicago _for two da,•s, leav- ,L It was sold last year, befQre I arrived, mg there on Apnl 1'.J for Portland, in order t~ p ay -the expenses of caring where we got the Allan line steamer for my old father, who died three y~ars Tunesian for Liverpool, England. We ago. My mother died when I was eight had a fine tim,e while crossing the years old. ocea·.1, although it was a little cold. ,.€ I cou ld not get in ,the hou ::;e throu_gh num· After leaving Liverpoo l, where we r the door, so I took out one of ~he wm£ The th t , ,vi about dows tjust the same did when o e s an, stayed. three days, a four ho u rs , ride en years old. as My I stepmother not been fu: by tr-a m took us to Hull, where ~e used to pu-t me and mw sister, now livA row tw got a steamer over the North sea,and !n Ing in this town, to work on a field seed of eacl about. a day and a half we were m ,f picking up stone and we never got Chns~iansand, the first port of_ Norway .•, enough to eat. One day, while our used were o Arrlvmg there Sund~y mornmg, . May · stepmother was gone to some n eighso as to mal 6, a crowd of relatives and fri ends bor's, we d ecided to take out one sash, were on the dock to greet us, and I as she always locked the door. Then each, and a: tell you it w as a joyfu l time to see so , we got In throug" the window, and The secti man~ dear ones whom we had not seen ,€ being very hungry at that time, we got being dropJ for nm_e teen years. Lots of snow _was something to eat, and got lic ked very still lymg on the g:round at that time, badly for the act. This la st time or about two i and in ;1-orth~rn parts of Norway they f-l course was done not to get any~hlng to 0£ Howe were still usmg sleighs. eat but to repeat the act I did forty , t t 1 ·well, the first fun we had, after visit- 1 1< yea'rs ago. Now it was not my sister in O we V~ ing all our relatives, was sailing and ~ but my wife whom I invited to come gether weig fishing, my greates t sport. In fact · 1n through the window. _ £our ounce.: we had the best time we ever had in 3' You can believe how sad I felt, when ~ our lives. My wife is very fond of fish, we got . in-s.Jde. . The only two , rooms of May. and she got all she wanted. Thouwere stored full · of hand-thrashed _rye Gardner'! sands of Englishmen and men from straw in bundles, and there was I £ ·t th other nations visit Norway every ! enough. r'oom for a person to wa our een sum:mer, mostly on account of the through from said window to the door planted. gireat sport in fishing, and the healthat the other end, which I opene~ _from Many of ful climate. There ,a re three things the inside . . I thought -I _had a kmd of bt • d£· which especially strike a person ·when~ right to - do this, • as '. I - was . born there O aine . I< landing in No rway. First, the rosy r and had so many dear , and sad m em0. W. Mine cheeks of the people; second, the won-" ories. . was sent fu derful li ght-breathing air that almost ·1 Well we visited some other farms, makes the lungs of a person swell, and r and fo~nd most ·oE them running alo,ng H G. D. OW• heart work easy; third, the birds are :T in the old -fashioned way. In the dairy Rawson & ' s9 plentiful and so wonderfully tame. r , lin e they cannot · , beat. All the stoc_k Gardner's yn the winter we find in Norway on wherever ,we: went .was co sleek ,that it , most every barn, one or two poles, with J was a delightful sight to see. F~rmers dale, Mich. one or two big bundles of grain tied to , have " become · more interested m the Mich. the upper end, for the birds to h e lp care for their stock in late years than 0£ the themselves when they can find nothing • some twenty years · a:·o. Farm -hands . else to eat. Some places they have · ' are getting scarcer every year, received fr a shelf outside the kitc h e n window - so conse quently they raise more stock, from J. 1\1 where th_e y throw out ~read crumbs· y as it ' brings in a good price, and the ,r 0 £ d £. and the llke, and many tim , • I sat by ai farmers get along with less h~lp. ?' 0 o X or IO tlle op e n ·window, and several of the many yo1.:ng people are em1gratmg, Keeper £r birds at a tim e, not over t,Yo feet away and in many places I found only old from J. T from where I sat,_ would come _and h e lp ;, peop le to care for the farm, and Jots of ·nT t N the;11selve s , chattmg-and seemmg to be £1 land lying idle. ' n es , or so Joyful and thankful. . . . Farmers in general had a fair crop Colorado " \Ve ~tayed five weeks 111 Christian- , ~ last year and realized a good pz:1ce, , H 11··ngto sand. This beautiful c ity was burned ,. as all ' kin'ds of eatables are very high. a!-' down a few years ago, and it is now There .are m,a·ny creamerie·s in N?rway 01110. built up anew. with modern b r ick riow and farmers se'IJ' their ·milk to The £o1J buildings. Leavi n g th is place we went U good advan.t : ge there. Cattle are alt .· t' to Christiania, the •capital of Norway, 1 ways kept in the barn in winter and en vane · arriving th ere on June 16, at two n ever allowed to run in the srww, f?r results ob o'clock in the morning. The steamer ,_, ' both old and young stoc_k do- be:ter m The las· was late and only two of my nJat1ves u this way. No corn is rrused there, but . were on -th e dock, prepared to take us ee other kinds of grain , such as wi:eat, 1ty was q1 to their home. It was so light that . a 11ts barle y rye and peas are plentiful. varieties you could see to read a newspaper in l't ~tov'er and timothy .are their main hay the covered carriage. . . ro . Sandvetch and oats together are coarsenes:- When we came t? our destm'lt1on ~Jsb cut :(or hay, and make a very exa crowd of my relatives was r:-athered cellent · feed, when . cut green and seato greet us there. Th ey, a lso, had been ed in ·the right time. , • on the doc k for several hours waiting s O; ta toes are still . raised in the oldfor us, but it was very co ld that night fas~ioned way, about . thirt? in:hes and some of them were old, so- they a art and twelve to fourteen m a r<;>w , had to go home. W ell, 1t wa~ a __hearty )n later :years fruit has been commg welc9me, never to be forg0tte~ t the front. I saw many young O Christian}a has improved'") d erfully h ds just planted, such as apples, in nineteen years, and ma ny places I or~;: ea.rs and cherries. No peaches could not recognize myself. It has now P. 'o'I!.vn there· as far as ,I learned. about 2!7,000 inhabitan~s. about 150,000 aNre gr _, is a gr~at· fishing and timber - -- - - - - - - -- - - ~ _ , orway th' wrong country but there is some mg somew'i{ere, as they import . neari:5 ·twi ce as much as they export.-[ S. . ' Fi elq_._ THE OLD NORWAY HOIYIE. JUf~ � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Oceana_Peterson_Marge-008 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Field, S. O. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1901 Title A name given to the resource "The Old Norway Home" Description An account of the resource Letter written by S. O. Field describing his visit to Norway, where he was born. Published in the local newspaper, Shelby, Michigan. Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Peterson, Marjorie (Field) Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage Project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/NoC-US/1.0/">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Subject The topic of the resource Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Correspondence Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f768286c72c302274080be6128cc3d5c.pdf 58ba4d7b2b9039bfa73f7b22c96ad938 PDF Text Text ,EJ :, ,v, .._:..Ull.L.t, moved the barn up to within eight rods of the house, put new sills under the stone foundations all around it. r1 THRIFTY NORWEGIAN'S WAY. Have a~so put up a first-class windmill v\ with water for house and barn. Built \ FIFTH PRIZE ESSAY. a wagon and carriag,e house on the In the spring of '93 I bought a 40 a end of barn. \ arm for $2000. I was then 43 yrs old I now have five head of cattle, tw·o /JI. ~ nd worth 1750; mY estate is now wor~h horse!;'. four hogs and a flocl{ of fine / \ . \ fully 6000. Paid 1200 cash and gave a - bran, chickens. feed cornmeal ground feed suchand as / mealI and mixed mortgage for 800. Paid the mortgage slightly moistened with swill. When in the fall of the same year a nd have , clover is green I get some of that and never had a mortgage on my .::i.rm · when I have sugar beens I chop them since. Wife and myself started t? work fine and feed them with the grass. Our with an old horse, a cow, one pig, one money crops are potatoes and fruit. I hen and a rooster. I · got a 3 mos old never sell straw or ·hay. Have sold calf from my sister as a birthday pres- some grain, but after this I shall feed ent and from that one we have raised it to enrich the soil. I am going to all 'our stock. We did not know much make my· land rich enough so the farm about farming, but we had made up will be w1orth $10,000 before long. I am our minds to go slow and take care of going to ha,ve good-si:i:ed straw stacks everything, whether big or little, and scattered all over mY barnyard and "·e should sell as much as we could stable my stock and let them have a without making the soil any poorer. run once in a while in the yard. Have bought all the manure we could Flave lost lots of money in clover get in the town. Found I could not get seed by seeding in between wheat and along without farm papers, and finally rye. Sometimes I had a good catch, Use and pcot hold of 'F & H and it has been a• but as soon as the grain was cut the I Value. Yery valuable aid. . weatber generally became dry and the \Scale 1 to 10. My farm is a light sandy soil, but by sun burned and killed the seed. I find it plowing under green clover we can pays better to seed down to clover In raise a good crop of any kind every wheat or rye stubble, running over with I year. The so\! never becomes to<;> wet, 1- · , . , I • . and if very dry we keep the cultivator I a straight tooth 'harrow after sowing. going to hold moisture. Plow In ma- Have pastured the hogs and other stock nure in fall and winter on level land; In the apple orchard, but shall not on hil!Y land I turn it under In the fall again, as I do not think it pays to take - - 2 -10- - 6 i;o the ground there will not freeze so anything from the orchard except much, or wash the manure down. I the fruit and trimmings. I can go anyII 5 then plow again in the spring. I drag where and get anything T want on mY · 7 7 it nearly every week when dry until name. I have often borrowed monEY planting time. It pays to be sure that but never do so unless I neeil it ba•Jly. 2 6 the soil is finely pulverized. Plant as I keep an accurate s'l!; of bo .)kS includsoon as danger of frosts is over and ing all expenditures, income and the 2 6 the soil is warm for corn and potatoes, profit. I believe it 1,ays w•~ll to expend 5 and as soon as the rows can be seen freely for books, papE: rs an;i reports 1 10 5 I go over with a spring tooth drag with so as to keep well posted. Cleared over 3 5 lcyer having the teeth to slant back to $1000 in '97 on that account. I hire a 6 a,·oid clinging. Weed~ are thus _kept boy by the year, and we put in about 6 6 down and moisture retamed. Cultivate 16 a of potatoes, 8 of corn, 3 of beans· 5 each week if the soil is dry. I find a and some carrots. Have cleared 400 i;pr\ng tooth cultivator is best by far from 4 a of peaches. Potatoes have 2 5 5 for this soil. Cultivate t;hallow and brought 600 in one sea.son. keep the ground as level as possible. One of my neighbors beca me dis2 51 5 1 Have made the most money from po- couraged and rented me his farm. 4 tatoes selling them in spring with I borrowed $75 of a neighbor, paid ., , 6 1 7 profit.' 40 on rent and gave a note for 35. This · 10 \'Vhen I bought the farm it was very was just after the two bad yea.rs of '95- , 6 1 6 much run down and the only house ,~as 6. This investment ,paid me well. To 71 an old Jog hut about 30 yrs old standmg be a successful farmer it takes study in a little apple orchard of. 2 a. There and planning, and considerable reading, 5 8 was an old barn, but the sills had rot- one that isn't afraid to work or get 6 8 2 te<l from under it, also a couple of up ea.rlY in the morning. This year I 7 sheds. We kept house in the log house have rented my farm to a nice farmer. I 5 for 2 yrs. I planted 200 peach trees the Wife and I are going to take a trip to u 9 5 3 tlrst spring. They brought us a good our old home in Norway, and at the crop of peaches last year. Have plant- same time take In the World's fair at 6 6 ed peach, plum, cherry, pear and apple paris.-[S. o. Field, Oceana Co, Mich. 3 6 4 trees every spring and have now a fine orchard. Have .removed, all old fe~ces "In the Hands of HI• Friend•,; · · " 4 2 4 nd along the road leading to tow~ a The farmer had just arrived in tow~ planted apple trees ·on th e fence lme. "What" he asked 0 f h. f · d s 5 9 In the winter o.f '94-5, bought the , . ,,'. is new oun 1 right to get logs for a new house at 75c [ fne nd ' is a bunko steerer anyway? I 51 ; I p M ft for hemlock and $2 for pine. have seen a great deal about them in the 6 8 oak and maple. Had it cut into lumber papers." that winter, prepared it and got it "Of course," replied his friend, "you 7 well seasoned for th•e fall when the know what a bunk is?" 7 6 house was built of which an illustra- "Certainly," replied the farmer. tion is shown herewith. It is the "Well. a hunko steerer is merely a man finest farmho~se in this neighborhood. who steers another man to his bunk wh~n Have also built a packing house for he is unable to find it himself H · fruit in connection with woodshed. 1 •d h.l · e is a Th'~ ,,. built so it can be used f01 gm e, a P I osopher and a friend. And i w,. 5 · now, that question being disposed of I would like to show you whE:re- yon ;re sure of getting not Jess than $50 for $1 if you follow my advice." - Washington bride on the cheek,- and he WI ed by all the others. When th had returned to his seat, the on his coat and said: "There, that's all right. and I courted for seven Jong married at last in a thunders· we haven't got but $50 for tour and to set up in housekei we propose to Jet folks know · earth just the same. Now. are going to squeeze hands and the more giggling I hear 1 shall like it!" l\' t{!t Q :I i Star. Expensive Econom.• "l\Iadge. we can't afford n this spring." "Well, then, Albert, we I don't mind wearing my ol new neighborhood, but I here and wear them."-1 .Journal. Rending Between the l\Iiss Bullion read my han ing. She's quite an adept said the Jines Indicated that about to propose to a girl wi "Yes. What did you do?" ' \ "I proposed to her."-Clev ~ 115 * 116 117 * * 118 * 119 120 * * 121 * 122 * * *" t * * 12-1 * * 125 • ** * 12 6 * * * * i* 130 I • 129 ·-;r~· * I I 131 132 * * I• • . 133 \ __ __ . . .. 13! - "Deah boy, we've got to d on the pwinee, don't you kno "How so, old chap pie?" "Why, he weally cawn't 'll"e'II carry our devotion so awound the country wit shooting at us, don't you kn "* J Marriage Licen Chas. H. Boody, Hart Mary Evalyn McR:.te, Ha Will C. C11nningli:1m, We, Dora Gri1ff. Hut Robert E'l'1min\!, Benona Orvilla R. I•'leming, 8helb Sbe Was -Dos 12 3 * * * 127 * 128 .• n ........ ,...... I • •. Tommy-Let's play gra Ethel-All right! I'll "No; it takes a man to ager." "Ohl you can be the want to be what they donna."-Catholic Stauda A Gnllty Conscl 'Rastus-·Whad yo' t'in wif me, doctah? Doctor-Oh, nothing pox, I guess. 'Rastus (getting nerv on mah honah, doctah, I whar I could ketch dat!Warned. "I may be a tramp," "but under my ragged c heart that beats." "Stranger," said the f the fence yonder is a do"' Philadelphia North Am~ � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Oceana_Peterson_Marge-005 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Field, S. O. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1900 Title A name given to the resource "Success Without a Mortgage: A Thrifty Norwegian's Way," circa 1900 Description An account of the resource Article published in the local Shelby newspaper discussing S. O. Field's (great grandfather of Marge Peterson) success at financing their farm. Article accompanies Peterson_Marge-006.jpg Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Peterson, Marjorie (Field) Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage Project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/NoC-US/1.0/">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Subject The topic of the resource Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/ad4cff54c84f320c55ada0930ba800ac.pdf 859208d01cc1d148e4259b739cafbf33 PDF Text Text ~s•- --.o,.-,-..,f..-.l;w,<1,-."""i.-,--:---.-~-----.,-..,.,rnc u~ - - ..,.,..,.,,c_,,,.,,__ .,~.,,...,..,,,.,.,_.,...,....,_ ...,.._ _~ ~ ~ ~ -- -- - - - - - - - - • : e r es Interestingly From on . ard going for Uhrlstmas visit"lJ ,r Norway. Editor Oce11na Heral<i • , f DEAtt Sm:-l believe there are some o your subrcribers, who are my friends who have been lookinl!' for a few lines from me agd the fa1· norlh t,hroµgh your paper. Joy and sorrow at the Rame time is now my share, joy b ecause I am so glad .I am here in m•, moth, r country to spend the rest ~f ·a nd of these were bounft for ~or· way and for every hundred coming l1ere, the1·e 1·s abl' ut one pe1·s<,n de· e,· west · · parting for America abuut this time. tanicnl 1 am gaining in health and am soon going to work, n<,L hard but e11.sy. I have bought about live acres of land. and am going to build a cor,y litt le ·den; a house to have it ready for Mrs. Fiel(t v. in th<:: spring. J intend to plant some small an d 1 lar!("e fruit and combine tl1is wi t ll fist;• · bb't · ing and hunting and rai s1ug r a I and cliickens. The location is a beauty, alJout seY· en miles 1'rom here and close to a nice h .) little town and about tiftee n minutes 1 t h of my• •lifo -.v11ere I can regain my healt,h, \ ·801 1 o v 1Jecause 1 cannot be with mv dearest 011 ea1·th, 1·11 tl1e borne, t'·';.. u, fruit of rn.v labors in America, but I feel that l have done w!Jata man like myself posit,ively should do and I am glad now to rn_y to you if I can haw-: bread and butter and a little meat e once a week I will be satistied. M v walk from the sea . S. O. F rnLD, bably wr·t a h d tl • •. ,.,, e I1 s a mo re mn 11 er s 1iarc o.: Solpryd , Storhaug, f:tavan g-er , .,_, or• the hard wort, and she will be glad t t. way. . join me here in U1e spring. We leav€. -~ ,'I (llll' monument behind us ·in Amerh;a r' " •, irsTAND.squarely upon my record," said may it e Yer be a bJessirw · the political candidate. "Well," yelled Norway is a freer "~rnntry th au the little man at the rear end of the hall, America. In Am eri ca a person is the "you can hardly be blamed fo r wantin' to slave to the almighty dollar. 'l'he re keep the blamed thing from bobbin' up." a person loses his s t rength a nd se nseF< - Chicago Rec;ord-Herald. nted in and knows no t a eno,ugh to qui t rli o"A·MER+cuR !" grandiloqu ently,sdreech• ~ ging when tifty or sixty years old bt~t ed the youthful graduate in the midst thinks be must hnve as many doll a r1of his oration on "Our Country and I ts as his neighbors and a few better. an c' Destinies,'' the wh ile his gestures were before he can realize lie has ennugll very like those of an inebriated windto Jea\·e off .h e lies with his nose in the mill. "A-mer-i-cur, fou nded on the so id air and a poor as a church rat,. rock of the Constitution, that mighty The air and climate here in Norway document of which shall never pass away makes a rerson, l.e1lthy, wealthy and . one tot or jittle-1 mean, one jit or tottle'Z wise. A person feels wealthy here er-h'm ! one tit or jottle-that is, as I was ~; when he is in good health and can Ji ve about to say, never shall pass one jol or day by day. Bence he is.wise. little--er-r-lol or jottle- h'm ! h'm !1 J, Norway is a freer country because j il or Jottle-ar-r-r-r !- till or jittle-lol, [e here are not so many devils, Lazaru::; , tol-lil, jil-tat, tot, t ut-Iii, !al, lo!, Jul. andrascalsto encounter. Mostpeople Oh, dear me! Water! water!" "Hodi are as sound in head and body as the µ: du rn !" chuckled conscienceless old Uncle .ii 'Ji ai1· is pure, no n:ilroad wrecks, no E Timrod Tarpy to himself. "T his is the h murders, no robberies, and hardly a n y Ill fi rst t ime in a good while that I have 11 windlers or drunks. To prove t,his i r really enjoyed one of these 'ere combave but to refer to this city- S t n va n - t mencements !"-Puck. er- which with 3ii,000 inhabitant," · ~ · ·· - .. ~ MH•h v I Rln P B eecl1 r. has been half a dozen policemen . ,, 1 l\IRs. I-loMER: "-Have you nottcect how weary and worried lUrs. Goodwin erns. ! Here are the largest hermatic ca r:• ninl,{factories in the world and t he looks of late?" :i\Irs. Neighbor : "Yes, i) A most factories ' of • i<inds in Norwa ,· poo r th ing; she has quit doing her own 1· mThe winter is mild along the coa~~ work a nd is trying to keep a hired girl."- dy soil here, and we ~1ardly need mittens. Chicago Dai ly News. The thermometer st:mds mostly abon t i 30 degrees an::t seldom colder than 20 degrees above zero. 1· all:e good 1nc1ne,v. B11t t ·' prioclpa.l streets fur men must ma.ke great fort t many hours on the •last night of the producer at, one enrJ and · th *Oas a nea old year and make the ears or tile peoth In t h e Pe J tingle with the hideous noises Cal'f at e other suffer and i; • "Catalpa I made l.Jy tish1horn<i, horse fiddles, cow , I ornra trnit growers ,vest bells and any other thing that will vi- same unen\'iable conditi dw~ brate harshly upon the Confet-ti Michigan potato growers "Catalpa '-j is thrown upou the heads and shonl- 'lari,rn protits in the 1J•.1sine Hard] de rs of tll'e promenade crowds . A t'ew ping- l'rnit to eastern mark unhappy grower doesn't ·=>catalpa wear mas ks and the whole thin g par- them nowadays. R. D. S Near tai<es of the spirit of a carnival. Fun ., kt•pt tab on 0 4 soil is let loose and hilarity reigns supreme coacramentu r t'rnit st.ii'pp"d 1.,.0 m tli C t l Ti · 1a · t ti I d · · ' ·>=· a a pa - ie mi Will er wea ier ie,re a mrts Past, in the summer· of 1<.J r th f h td 1 :Nor · 0 sue an ou oor ce e 0· - ation or th e found a net loss to the ''Catalpa ] birt,h of a new vear . .. < $ 1:l:i,O:i,i, at'ter the exprn-; 1 t N or b t a· R~t's\n ~~ d her r!a_,ti~h- turns were compared. 1s -x •cata 1pa ·e r " "' · .Y, F1 ie Y are dv,s1 mg Here is one item. in the ic ,vest relatives in San rancisco an e njoy - , which shows \1uw the fruit ·*Ceanothu iug tile P .tcitic breezes. They stroll made to pay all the t.rnt'lic In t h out to ,Jefferson Square, a pretty four 1Tlie Armour Refri!rn. l",'l<>i 1 G G , • «·ceanothu ,block park on olden ate .avenue I cl1arges $12-'i for puLLi11g ic A ba r that always looks. g-reen and inviting car at certain points on tl1 •·ced ar . e ven on aJ;!loomy day. To wall< on tile · journey. Ttle actual cos Celastrus ~-reen la.wn and sit in the warmtsun in this is only $JO :;o; t,l,e diffet On t h ( .la1'11irtry, witl1 dogs and babies playir,g t.o swell the already plPt hor «·Celastru s by tile d11zen around you, is a, privileg·e of tile car company: nnd th On th( they cli i;I nut 113\'c a cliance to enjoy in and commmer pay tile bills, *Celtis oc, Mi c liig-an. an uecasional grnmhle now North Jolrn Alex;inder Dowie, tlie heav.1· TI011T . K .Jo orcl »e t, !-\'"\11,\(' !l'.HIU WIW P''~(·~ ,P, ~l(j ,_1/1_vl1t San FranciRco, .Ian. 11. rnoi'i. -:+Celtis oc i'5 ecnnd on the sboi'b uf Lake )i1tJhiga,1\ 1-1-. -----t -th On t h is i n terestcrl in a law snit in the 1 "CHILDREN," said e aS onis th -::• cephala n courts or this city. Flu,ril Crnig, a I opeidmig}he door of e roo; 1s1 South ivealtiif insurance man here ll /lS 1~, wh_at ari yo?t'., wes bruu i:rht suit t o reco ve r ah•.,ut $17-'>0 1 ea rtiy n0tse a out. st Cercidip Llrnt he all eges !Je ac~vanccd to Do"·lt: rike," ~nswer;d th Tommy.,, st East / years ago wh (:: ll t ile · iatl.er :nade a l'unker, an Dicks e packer. nd <+ cercis ca tile attemp t to start a mi~sirm lw re. have you got Johnny bou nd \Vith Dowie does ii 't d.eny bon<,wi ng- lhe a tied to a chair ?" "Oh, ·=❖ cercis c I muney but Il e says i t wa,; a debt of he's th e consumer."-Chicago With love lhat Il e expect ed " Bruther" IT is told of an American Craig ne ver to collect on tl1i s sid e of who bought a castle on the the rirnr Stvx. 'l'h e ma tter liasn't one cold day his daughter bee n settled ye t . wa rmin g his hands at a fi re w Nortb. I want to say a fe w word ;; in com· kindled in suit of plate armor. Ch am::ed : 111endation or the C!1ri Rtma,; edition wha t have you been doing?" 1 or the t:ih elb,Y H e rald . l t was the that patented that stove/ repli In t h l peer of any sr1iall pape r th i,t I ha \"e of th e castle, "must have been · · cl t'o1· a lonu· tim e 'l'l1·'t Ii · t C h erry, examine " · " rs I've made th e old thing heat u Ch erry. oag-,i ot' greetings from t h e business T it-Bits. Chestnu ;nen or Shelb_y was inte restin g rea d- - - - - - - - -~ C in!leven for a st ran!("er. The potat,, l\lRs. R uRALLES: "Yourplac, t h eS n u article deserves spec ial mention a lso. I wonde r you don't keep fow Chinqu a :, It covered tile ground compleLely. nice to have fr esh eggs every If it wa'! nut for the· cos t of trans - Clyde: "But fowls are sucl poct.ation the potato growers ot' Oce- \ Vhy couldn't we keep an 11 ~ aoa cuuuty would never need t i? hunt stead ?"-Brooklyn Life. fOJt a, ,;i:b)rk t or lluld t,be i r cr 0 p fur ·=- 'Ol.,"tll]ml]l'lffl:ffl'lfli'P""'r.l'r.M Jil'imi;lJTtaTIU a.it·. :V[!t .?·: I I t I I j m~: � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Oceana_Peterson_Marge-004 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Field, S. O. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1905 Title A name given to the resource "Land of the Vikings" Description An account of the resource Letter from S.O. Field published in the local Shelby, Michigan paper describing why he decided to leave Michigan and move back to Norway, the country of his birth. Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Peterson, Marjorie (Field) Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage Project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/NoC-US/1.0/">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Subject The topic of the resource Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/43d11f5a53ce8d108bb146c4f29ef056.pdf ab608ed73304d85cdc55a75b3d2cf74b PDF Text Text ~KtPAKtU FUK INVASION BY ?J I PEST ENEMIES! -~~~ c. FIELD - AREA Asso. CIATES HAVE REAL DEFENSE AGAINST ENEMY HORDE l Defense against an enemy invasion mmbering billions is stocked in the . C. Field store at Shelby and in the listributing points of the concern, and o keep up the s upply these munitions ,f war are moving consta ntly from a nufacture rs to dealers in this area. 'l'hese munitions consist of insecti· ides and fungicides of various kinds nd uses and the central point of dis·ibution is the store once occupied by . G. Avery, later by Meyers & Philips and later by Meye rs & Son. It vas one of the most active of the a rly s tores of the town, being built y W. H. Churchill and W. A. Phelps. , pon its completion the adjoining ~ore to the north was occupied by .F. ' · Va nWickle as a drug store. In this ,or tion the fir st t elephone office was ocatPd. Over the nor th stor e Benona i,odge, No. 289, F. & A. l\L, \Vas loatecl for many years, while Shelby ,odge, No. 344, I. 0. 0. F ., was loated over the present Field store. The Field centra l store is represent- i r1 by around forty distributing stores. 11 ' bey include : ~ J; :::lhelby-CraeyS' f.fa rdware, Oceana \· fo-0p. Oil Co., A. J . Rankin, Hardin ~ear Co., Shelby Pha rm acy, C. E. ! echtel, E . P. J ohnson. Mears-Fra nk ,v. Downing. Rothbury-H~ F. Kewma n. Bruns wick- Ezra J. Monette. Ae tna-Delbert D eLong. H a rt-Bright's Dr ug Store, Farm lureau Supply Store. P entwater- J . L. Congdon, Pentate r Lumber Co. Ludingto n-Ludington Fruit Exb a nge, J . N. 'l'aggert, L. G. J ebavy. F erry-Forrest Bowers. H esperia-Husband & Anderson, [ esper ia Milling Co., H enry Senecal, I . K. Bush & Son. G. E. Knowles. Scottville-N. V. l\l cP her son, l\iason 'o. Co-Op. Marketing Ass'n., Readers mplement Stor e. Fremont- Fremont Co-Op. Produce 'o., J. L. Hillya rd. Produce Co., L . D. 'uff Hardware, P ioneer Dr ug Store, iaar's Drug Stor e. Sitka-J. L. W olbrink. W alkenille- R. E . Clemens. IIolton- S. S. Roger s. Kew Era-Post ema Bros., Ba rtell clema, W esting & Swanson . l\lontague-White Lake M a rket ss' n. "\lhi te ha ll-C. G. Pi tk in & Co. Custer-,v. E. R eader & Co., H. :med berg. Reema n-R cema n H a r dwa re Co. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Oceana_Peterson_Marge-003 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Unknown Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1931 Title A name given to the resource "Prepare for Invasion by Pest Enemies: M.C. Field and Area Associates have Real Defense Against Enemy Horde" Description An account of the resource Article published in local Shelby, Michigan newspaper highlighting where to purchase pesticides in the area, including M.C. Field Company. Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Peterson, Marjorie (Field) Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage Project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Subject The topic of the resource Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/6fc73378b7d98808220d7973d270935b.pdf 2df8db0a3f52ca3b0edfb427bb9318b1 PDF Text Text /•••••••• • • • 11 ••••••••••• 11 •• ·••••• -- •••• I I I I I I SAVE YOUR CROP • Wit:h Insecticides and Fungicides ! : • •• • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • • : ,~ I ._;..;) I I I I When it comes to Spray Lead . . . " Corona Dry" •I means effective application ancl poisoning. Electric Spray Wettable Sulp_b;ur~ - • 98½% Superfine Sulphur 1½% wetting agent I = I Owl Brand Wettable Sulphur I I I I I 95% Sulphur 5% wetting agent Proclucecl by STAUFFER CHEMICAL CO. of Texas, one of the worlll's largest refiners o·f sulphur. Michigan fruit growers have apparently gone wilcl about these ma.terials which have heen on the market for three years, officially tested at the Graham experiment station in 1935. Also usecl exclusively by the two largest orchards in the state. We are unloacling our fifth car as this ad. goes to press. SPREADERS AND ADHESIVES Grandpa's Wonder Pine Tar Spray 111 fl al, e and liquid form. POWDERE D CASIEN SPREAD ER Grandpa's Soap which your ancestors used may hel11 solve your Codling ~1oth problem, You ca n get by with less nicotine uhing this inate1-ial. Funginox and P. D. 7 For Seed Potatoes 11 • • • Instant clip, teste1l', proved very economical. Also COROl'iA COPP,E_ly I CARB fo r bunt and smut on seecl wheat. I • • • : (Improved Calcium Arsenate) for sprnying or dusting potat~ s. Cucm·, bits, sometimes userl fo1· late s1n·ays on a1)J1les to avoi£1 lead residue. • Packed in 1 and 4 lb. distinctive square cartons. 11 Always, an am11le stock of I • •• • in all sizes, and NICOTINE DUST. This is the worlcl's le-ailing TJX E INSECTI6luE. Don't accept stibstitutes. : : I CORONA CALSENATE : = "BLACK LEAF 40" NW&--:: FOR CUT WORMS-WHITE ARSENIC I : • • • • LAVANBURG'S STAR BRAND PARIS GREEN, Ai\IYL ACETATE I (Banana Oil) Stock Molasses. All 1mt u11 in convenient sized Ill containers, properly laba.Iecl. I • • • • • •• • • •• •• • • • • For S1JI'a,y i11g arid Dust ing. Corona P repar ed Bor rleaux- Superio1· Bran d CoP11ef Sulphate, powdere<l a nd c1·ystal. Manufactm·e1·s of various items ma intain research depa1·tments whose service is you rs for t he asking. Plenty of spray charts ancl inst rnctions available free. I ll I I I Full Line of p t F or the home gardener or florist who (lislikes to talrn home a paclrnge of poison, we offer NEW EVERGREEN aml JIM DA ND Y PLANT SPRAY. Also a full line of PYRETHRUM a ncl ROTENONE DUST. - --- •• • • • • : PITTSBURG PAINT PRODUCTS : : SPRAYERS and DUSTERS OF ALL KINDS STOCK and HOUSEHOLD FLY SPRAYS I : MISSISSIPPI SPECIAL HYDRATED LIME : : • • • : : • • • • - - - -- T ANGLEFOOT PRODUCTS Iinown the Worlcl Over fo1• 50 Year s We have a Special Dust for Cucumbers. ,ve have so me fi ne b,argains in Lawn Spr inklers. ---- M. C. FIELD I I I 1 = : • • • : WESTERN MICHIGAN'S LARGEST DISTRIBUTOR OF INSECTI- : CIDES AND SEED DISINFECTANTS • Meyers Building. Next to Bechtel's, Shelby Mich. Phones 48R2-3 aml231 • F ruit Paclrnges, Laclclers, Sun Proof Paints, Golcl Stdpe Brushes • • � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Oceana_Peterson_Marge-002 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Unknown Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1936 Title A name given to the resource "Save Your Crop With Insecticides and Fungicides!" Description An account of the resource Advertisement in Shelby, Michigan newspaper for insecticides sold by M.C. Field. S.O. Field, Marge's great grandfather owned a share of that company, as did her grandparents Anton and Abba Field. Company was located in downtown Shelby. Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Peterson, Marjorie (Field) Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage Project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Subject The topic of the resource Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/471f3bcb508df40ee94e518b57d700e4.pdf d2f886c1ccfb27d0dfd1f152a0d9e467 PDF Text Text ~ M. C. F I ELD ~- T. F I ELD WE CATER TO PARCELS POST , EXPRESS , AUTO. TRUCK AND CAR LOT TRADE Fruit Guara11teecl First Class Whe11 Shipped Terms: Cash With Order FANCY SHELBY, Mt LE NORTH-WEST OF SHELBY TELEPHONE 133 hEFEREN C E : CHURCHILL Be WEBBER , BANKER S. SHELBY � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Oceana County Migrant Labor History Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Shell-Weiss, Melanie Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Growing Community: A Century of Migration in Oceana County." This project was a collaboration between El Centro Hispano de Oceana, the Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society, and Grand Valley State University funded by a Common Heritage grant from the United States National Endowment for the Humanities. The materials in this collection document the history of communities in Hart, Shelby, and Walkerville and explore themes of migration, labor, religion, family, belonging, national and cultural identities, regional, national, and international connections, and citizenship. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant Oceana County (Mich.) Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource El Centro Hispano de Oceana; Oceana County Historical and Genealogical Society Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage project) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg audio/mp3 Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Image Sound recording Language A language of the resource eng spa Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2016 Subject The topic of the resource Oceana County (Mich.) Hart (Mich.) Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Hispanic Americans Account books Diaries Oral history Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-06_Oceana_Peterson_Marge-001 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Red Arrow Orchards Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Unknown Title A name given to the resource Red Arrow Orchards Business Card Description An account of the resource Business Card for Red Arrow Orchards, owned by Anton and Abba Field. "Growers and shippers of all kinds." Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Peterson, Marjorie (Field) Relation A related resource Growing Community (NEH Common Heritage Project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Subject The topic of the resource Shelby (Mich.) Farms Farmers Migrant agricultural laborers Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives