728 24 26018 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/df5543efb00b350b028cb8f85031a7ed.mp4 8ef631c264794ebcfc4be8840a3a57df https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f81a4c0326b48df32f52ab069d857108.pdf b985674a533d093d2bdc46da89646ecc PDF Text Text ORAL HISTORY INTERVIEW ED CARPENTER Born: Rockford, Michigan Resides: Jenison, Michigan Interviewed by: James Smither PhD, GVSU Veterans History Project, Transcribed by: Joan Raymer, November 29, 2011 Interviewer: We’re talking today with Ed Carpenter of Jenison, Michigan. Mr. Carpenter, can you start out by telling us where and when you were born? I was born in Rockford, Michigan in 1921. Interviewer: What did your family do? Pardon? Interviewer: What did your father do for a living? He was a plumber. Interviewer: Did you live in Rockford and grow up there? No, I grew up around Grand Rapids. Interviewer: Did your father have regular work during the thirties, during the depression era? He was on the WPA for a while like everybody else, you know after the depression. Interviewer: Right—did you finish high school? Did I finish high school? Interviewer: Yes No Interviewer: How long did you stay in school? The eighth grade, actually. 1 �Interviewer: What did you do after the eighth grade? I was in the plumbing business with my father for quite a few years. !:00 Interviewer: How did you wind up in the military? Well, I was in a CC [Civilian Conservation Corps] Camp for two years, and right after that my friends all went into the service. Interviewer: Why were they going into the service? I suppose they went in there just to give them something to do. Interviewer: So, this was all before the war and started, or at least before the American war had started? Pardon? Interviewer: This was before Pearl Harbor then? This is before Pearl Harbor, right? Yeah, that was all before Pearl Harbor. Interviewer: At the time you signed up, did you think that we might get into a war, or that you might get into one? No, no, at that time we were allowed to pick where we wanted to serve, so I picked Hawaii, and that‟s how that started. 1:56 Interviewer: Where did they send you for basic training? Hawaii Interviewer: You went straight to Hawaii? Yeah, I left the United States and went to California. First I went to Fort Sheridan, Illinois and then I want to Angel Island, California, and I was quarantined there for two 2 �weeks, and got my shots, and all that stuff, and then we went on to Hawaii. I had my basic training in Hawaii. Interviewer: Where did they station you in Hawaii? Where? Interviewer: Yeah, where in Hawaii? Schofield Barracks Interviewer: On Oahu? That‟s right Interviewer: Can you describe the basic training process? What did you do? We went through everything there was to go through in the service. You had all the components they had to go through, you know, and it was quite a list. I‟ve got a list of them in my stuff in my room there. 2:57 You went through all your basic stuff, you know, your military maneuvers, your marching, and your gas stuff, you know, and all that stuff. Everything they did in the service, hand to hand combat, all of that. I took seventeen weeks of it, and then when we got to the manual of arms to graduate, I graduated and got we got our certificates, and was assigned to a company. Interviewer: Did you have any problems adjusting to army life? Was it easy to make the switch? None whatsoever, and being in the CC Camps helped a lot though. Interviewer: So, you learned to follow orders and take care of yourself? It was not a problem Interviewer: What kind of weapons did they train you on? 3:59 3 �Well, I was qualified with the 0-3 rifles, and 0-6, Grand 45 automatic, Thompson Sub Machine Gun, 37mm, 45mm, I mean 75mm. Interviewer: Now, were the 37mm and the 75mm, where those anti-tank guns or all-purpose guns? The 37mm was your anti-tank weapon. The 75mm was mounted on a tank, and that was with the Sherman tanks. I was a Platoon Sergeant in a Sherman Tank outfit. Interviewer: What Company did they assign you to, or what unit did they assign you to? We were with—I was with the 767th Tank Battalion, 19th Infantry Regiment, 24th Division, and we were assigned unattached to any outfit that needed us. 5:02 When we went to Leyte, I was with the 32nd, the 7th and a whole slew of them. Interviewer: All right, so basically your division served as sort of a reserve force in the Pacific Theater, and they would send parts of it where it needed to go, or was that mostly your tank battalion that was that kind of thing? We were with the 19th and wherever the 19th went, we went. Interviewer: When did you finish basic training? Pardon? Interviewer: Do you remember when you finished basic training? What time of year? Let‟s see—I got over there in July, and I think it was October. Interviewer: OK October, about three months, seventeen weeks 4 �Interviewer: What was it like living in Hawaii then, before the war started? Did you like it out there? Oh, it—I loved it out there. Yeah, that was a good place. It was native, a lot of it, you know. 6:00 Now it‟s all commercial. Interviewer: Right I was there when you couldn‟t drive all over the mountains, you had to walk, and we got to see a lot of stuff there. Interviewer: You saw that when you were out on marches? Yeah, training and stuff like that. Interviewer: What could you do for fun out there? Well, the only fun we had was—we had our own gym, you know, and a bowling alley, and a theater, and stuff like that, on the base, and the army PX‟s, you know, but after that it was Hawaii, going to Honolulu, and you were pretty well restricted on a lot of stuff too, you know. There were places in Honolulu that you could go to. I use to go to just outside Schofield Barracks a lot, and they use to have a drive-in up there that was real nice for GI‟s, for everybody really, but you could get a steak there for a dollar, and you couldn‟t eat the whole thing. 7:13 I‟ll tell you, it was nice though, and I don‟t have no complaints about Hawaii. Interviewer: All right, now, can you describe what happened, or what you experienced on December 7th, 1941? I was on KP for one thing, and I want outside to smoke a cigarette, so I went outside, and I heard this noise, banging, you know, bombs, and it was in Pearl Harbor, but we were thirty-six miles north of Pearl Harbor. Anyway, the planes started coming through and 5 �they started coming through over our outfit, and I was outside there, and this one Jap plane came in and he strafed me, but he missed me. 8:03 They strafed all the barracks and all the hospital was right behind us and they strafed that too. They dropped a bomb through our barracks, and it went right through my footlocker, and it never went off, it was a dud. I lost everything I owned, civilian stuff, everything. I had gabardine suits I had made, you know, tailor-made, I had all that stuff, and I didn‟t have anything left. Interviewer: If the bomb didn’t blow-up? It was a dud Interviewer: Did it still damage your stuff? Oh yeah Interviewer: Because A big bomb lands right on your footlocker. It went through the roof and right on down through. Interviewer: So, there was not much left anyway. Did you find a place to take cover when the—or did you just kind of watch them go through or--when the planes were coming over did you take cover somewhere? Well, I was looking up to see what the hell was going on first and I said, “they aren‟t our planes”, and I saw the yellow rising sun on them, you know, so I just hollered that they were not our planes, and by that time they got the word and the sirens went off, and everybody got ready to get together, you know. 9:19 We had to get our rifles and stuff, and everything was locked up, the ammunition was locked up, and we were going around like a bunch of chickens with our heads cut off. We got all organized and we got orders to go up in the mountains, and they said we were going to defend the island to the last man, so we went up in the mountains and dug in. I was up on a ridge, it‟s the highest 6 �point in Hawaii, and you could see the whole island, and our job was to notify whatever went on, but the Japs never landed. Interviewer: Nope It was a good thing too, because they would have wiped us out. Interviewer: We were not really ready for a war yet; so, how long did the attack itself last? How long were there planes over your base do you think? I would say it probably lasted over our area, maybe five or ten minutes. I don‟t know how long it lasted at Pearl Harbor, but it was quite a while because they—we had a few planes get up there though. 10:24 They had a couple of bases or airstrips here and there that they didn‟t know about, and we had a few of the guys get up and take out a few of the Jap planes, but they got taken out too. Interviewer: How long did you stay up in the hills after the attack? You said you were up there on lookout, how long did you stay up there? There you got me, I don‟t really know, I don‟t remember. Interviewer: Once things quieted down a little bit, did you get down to Pearl Harbor, so you could take a look at it? Oh yeah, we were on special assignments all the time and we had to go down and keep— we went down into Honolulu to get rid of the Japanese that were on the island, and we stopped everybody that was Japanese descent, and if they had any GI clothes on we stripped them right then and there. 11:31 Then they got picked up and sent to California or wherever. Interviewer: Actually a lot of the Japanese stayed in Hawaii, they didn’t intern the Japanese there. They probably interned some of them. 7 �You see the Japanese--the United States was so damn mad they picked up everybody they could get a hold of, and I guess that‟s why they paid them twenty thousand dollars apiece afterward. Interviewer: What was it like then just being based on Hawaii during 1942? What were you thinking was going to happen? We didn‟t know, we just couldn‟t really write home, and we didn‟t get any mail, and all we were doing was training all the time. 12:24 Organizing, and organizing, they would jump from— like I just got trained in 37mms, anti tank weapons, and then we got transferred into a tanks outfit. We had three different tanks we were training with them and we ended up with the Sherman‟s. That tank [the first one, the Stuart] was a real light tank, the old fashioned tanks, and then we went to a Grant, which had two guns on it, a 37mm and a 75mm, and then we went to the Sherman and that‟s the one we ended up with. Interviewer: Now do you remember when you got the Shermans? Was it still in 1942, or was it later than that? I remember alright, our company commander called us in, us sergeants in, and handed us a box full of pamphlets, you know, books, and it was on the Sherman Tank, and it had everything in it, all it‟s components and everything else. 13:30 We never had seen a Sherman Tank, we didn‟t even know what one looked like. Well we got them all in and everything was in Cosmoline, so we had to clean them all up, you know. Then we had to instruct our troops on the dumb things, so we had to pick out the men we wanted for drivers and so on and so forth, you know. We had a gunner, and a driver, and an assistant driver, and a loader, and two tank commanders. 8 �Interviewer: So you had a five-man crew? Yeah, so we got that all straightened out, we started training and we said we had three months to get ready, so in three months we were just like experts on it. We went together on it, and if you were a sergeant it didn‟t mean a damn thing, what it meant was, you were in charge, but the other guys there, they knew as much as you did, so we got together, we got our heads together and that‟s the way we operated. 14:31 We only pulled rank when we had to, but everybody did what they were supposed to do. Interviewer: How many tanks do you think you had in your battalion? How many tanks did your unit have? How many did we have? By company? Interviewer: No, how many tanks in your unit? There were five tanks in a platoon. Interviewer: And you had a full battalion? Yeah, we got three platoons in a company. Interviewer: Was there just one company or were there three companies? Three companies, A, B, and C Interviewer: So, in principle, forty-five tanks to start with? Right Interviewer: What did you think of the tanks, just as a machine to drive in, was it better or worse than a Grant or a Stuart, or anything like that? Just to be driving and trying to use. Did you like the Sherman better? Oh, I loved the Sherman Tank, yeah, but see, we didn‟t have any of those other ones that came out later like the Patton and all of them. 15:33 They were all in Europe. The 9 �tanks were limited in the South Pacific in what they could do, and it was the terrain. We had some rough terrain, man, I‟ll tell you; I don‟t know how we made it, and those mountains, I‟ll tell you—that was something else. Interviewer: In this period while you were training, were you following the news of the war? Were you paying attention to what was happening on in the Solomons, or New Guinea, or things like that? Were you keeping track of the war and wondering when you were going to go in? While I was in the service? Interviewer: You’re spending 1942 mostly in Hawaii, and you’re training in the tanks, and that kind of thing. In 1942 [1943?] we went to Kwajalein. 16:20 Interviewer: Tell us about that, how did they get you over to Kwajalein? By ship Interviewer: What kind of a ship were you on? LSD, landing ship dock Interviewer: So, how was that ship set-up? Loaded on a LCM, they loaded our tanks on an LCM, and they floated the LCM‟s out to the LSD, the LSD dropped her tailgate and they loaded it with five foot of water. We drove the LCM‟s in there. Interviewer: So, you’re actually taking the small landing craft, which holds one tank and a few men, and just sailing it into the stern of the ship? We got all these into the ship, they got them in there and pumped the water out and chained the LCM‟s down. Then we shut the gate up, the water was gone and away we 10 �went. We could go wherever we were going to go. 17:18 We got over to Kwajalein they dropped the tailgate, put the five foot of water in there and we floated out, rendezvoused, and got ready to hit the beach. When the shelling stopped we hit the beach. W e lost one tank in a shell hole, and it went in nose first, just like this, but we got the crew out. As far as I know it‟s still setting there. Anyway, it was an easy operation as far as we were concerned, because we wiped them out in nothing flat. It was just a small island, a couple miles long, and I forget how big it was. Interviewer: It didn’t have the kind of defenses on it that Tarawa did or some of these other places? No, it‟s a flatter island, it doesn‟t have mountains in it at all, and it‟s just a flat island. Interviewer: So is Tarawa, but they were better dug in there, but this was smaller still. 18:20 Tarawa was--the trouble was, the people don‟t know all of this either that, half of these islands that the Marines were supposed to have taken, they didn‟t actually take them, the army took them, but they never got the credit for anything because we didn‟t have the news media. Everything that went on was the marines, marines, and marines all the time. I don‟t have anything against them, they‟re nice guys and I had three buddies in the marines, in fact I went to Pendleton and I saw my buddy over there. It‟s just that—we had a guy that, on one of the island, a marine General, “Howlin Mad Smith”, they called him, and the marines and the army was over on Saipan, and the army took the center, the hills, so the marines took the flanks. 19:21 Well, the marines got around, and we got up there and we wiped them out. Here they are up there and they weren‟t even supposed to be there. We wiped them out damn near, you know. Well, “Howlin Mad Smith” 11 �complained about the army not doing their job, so Roosevelt fired “Howlin Mad Smith” from the Marine Corps, and replaced him, and that was never publicized. Interviewer: Let’s go back to the Kwajalein operation. The Kwajalein, was that just an army operation? Marines in the Marshall islands, there was Kwajalein, Eniwetok was one, was one and Majuro was one. Interviewer: But when you went into Kwajalein was that just the army or were there Marine? All army, another island had marines, but we had Eniwetok the next island over and that‟s where they tested all of their atomic stuff. 20:33 Interviewer: later on, and I think they tested some of that on Kwajalein too. Now ere you guys in the first wave at Kwajalein? Did they land the tanks first or did you come in after the infantry? No, I think we were in about the second wave. Interviewer: Did the Japanese on Kwajalein have anti tank guns or anything they could shoot at you? They had some small tanks, real light tanks. In fact, I never encountered any of them. The only ones I saw were when they were trying to repair them. Interviewer: Did you have targets to fire on there? Did your tanks do anything or did they just kind of drive up onto the beach? When you were on Kwajalein did you get in any actual fighting, or did the foot soldiers do that? Oh yeah, we had to knock out pillboxes and machine gun nests and snipers, and stuff like that, you know. 21:31 12 �Interviewer: How did you—were you able to communicate with the foot soldiers? How did you know what to shoot at? Did you just look around? In the back of the tank you have a telephone. We had this colonel come on our tank, my tank, and he wanted me to knock out this big cement abutment, and they had three hundred and fifty people in it, and they wouldn‟t come out. He wanted me to poke a hole in it, so they could put some satchel charges in there, and I thought to myself, “what the hell do you want to murder three hundred and fifty people for when all you have to do is sit here. They will have to come out or die right there”, so I poked a hole in it all right, but I don‟t know if they ever blew it up or not. 22:25 Interviewer: Did you have ordinary foot soldiers call you up on your phone on the back of your tank? Most of them were officers, or sergeants, somebody that was in command of an operation, you know. Interviewer: Once you guys took the island, how long did you stay there? Did they move you out again right away? We didn‟t stay there very long, just a few days. Interviewer: Did you go back to Hawaii from there? Back to Hawaii to retrain and regroup and get ready for Leyte Island. We were supposed to hit Truk Island, but they changed it. Interviewer: We only bombed that, but it didn’t get hit. Now, lets see Kwajalein— did you go anywhere in 1943? 43, 43, let me see 23:23 Interviewer: Well, Kwajalein might have been 1943, and not 42. 13 �Kwajalein was right after Guadalcanal Interviewer: Guadalcanal finished up pretty much in February of 1943, and Kwajalein was after that. We were in there before that because we went to Leyte in 1944. Interviewer: That’s in the fall of 1944 October 20th 1944 is when we landed. We landed in the first wave there, in fact the tanks landed before the infantry. I have a picture of my tanks lined up on the beach. Interviewer: All right, now when you landed there at Leyte, were you under fire at that point, or were the Japanese somewhere else? The Japanese had pulled back. Interviewer: Were they shooting artillery at you or just letting you come on? They didn‟t hit us until we got clear up past a little town around Leyte, and on the way to Tacloban, and we were on our way to Tacloban, when we started getting heavy fire. 24:29 Well then we moved to a Ormoc Bay, which was on the other side of the island, and we pushed the Japs off of there and we got there and we got word that the Japanese had fifty thousand troops coming in to reinforce them. Well, the air force went out, the Army Air Force, the Army Air Corps then, went in and knocked them out in the water, so that‟s what they told us. Interviewer: Well, there were still quite a few Japanese on that island. Now, when you were landing there did you have to take the tanks through jungle or was it more open country that you were in? I was in the jungles quite a bit. Interviewer: How do you take a tank through the jungle? 14 �We had a hell of a time there, because we were supposed to have infantry troops with us, you know, and we didn‟t have any. Here we were going through there by ourselves. I thought it was kind of stupid, you know. Interviewer: Dangerous 25:22 I don‟t know how anybody could stick up on the top, well one guy did get up on my tank, and my guy behind me, we were supposed to work in pairs to protect each other. So, a guy got on my tank, an officer, and he started chopping at my tank with a saber, you know a Samurai, so a guy on the radio tells me not to open my hatch because I got company. He said, “we‟ll take care of him”, and I heard bullets hitting my tank, and they got him with a machine gun. He fell in my air intake on my turret intake, so I had to get out of there and knock him off of there, so some of the stuff like that, they could have-Interviewer: Do you know how far away the infantry was? Do you know how far away the foot soldiers were at that point? Their soldiers? Interviewer: No, your soldiers, the infantry you were supposed have with you. They were behind us, but I don‟t know how far. Interviewer: Was there a trail in the jungle you were following, so you went single file or what? No we just followed by compass. 26:21 We had to pick our way because of the terrain. We weren‟t like a foot soldier, they go out through the swamps, but we couldn‟t do that. Interviewer: Now, did you get tanks stuck in the jungle? We got one, and it was mine. I came up on this flat plateau, and we couldn‟t see where we were going because it was all covered with brush. We started to torch it and all of a 15 �sudden the damn tracks started to spin. Well, I opened up the hatch and got out and I looked down and there I was, stuck. Well, then the damn mortars started coming in, and a mortar shell hit behind me, back of the tank and it blew me off the tank, and I got shrapnel in the back of my head and stuff, you know, but that didn‟t stop me. It wasn‟t that bad, so somebody came out of this area on this plateau and I shot this guy, and I asked the gunner for my Thompson sub-machine gun, and he gave me that. 27:38 I had fifty rounds in there and I got seven more, and then I had my man on the other tank come up and help me get out. So, I could pull myself out, you know, and we got out of there. then a Jap tank came up the side of the ridge, just beyond it, and my gunner said, “enemy tank ahead”, and I said, “Are you sure it‟s the enemy?” I give the orders what to shoot, and he shot and hit it the first thing and blew it all to smithereens, because they were light tanks. 28:21 Interviewer: Yeah, the Japanese didn’t have very good tanks at all. They didn‟t have very good equipment, tanks, they just had manpower. We would kill ten of them to our one every damn time. I don‟t know how they kept getting all these men. Interviewer: Eventually they ran out I‟ll tell you, there was another bad one too because of the terrain, and we got the unit citation over there too while I was there from President Marcos, and we got one from our country. Interviewer: Marcus was the president during the 60’s and 70’s, so Quezon was president then. Marcos was a guerilla, that‟s when I met him he was a guerilla. 16 �Interviewer: What Island was he on? Was he on Leyte? He was on Leyte, and his wife was from Leyte. I met a platoon of Philippine Guerillas, and I was around Leyte, it was a Sunday, we had things pretty well under control, so we were just out walking around, monkeying around, and we see this platoon come in this town. Well, they give their order, halt the platoon, left face, she gave another order, and they had bags on their shoulders, burlap bags, so they picked the bags up and threw them like that, well, I thought they were bowling balls or coconuts, but they were Japanese heads. They had gone out and beheaded the Japanese, and this platoon leader was a girl. 30:22 I was told that the government paid the guerilla, or they paid the guerillas, twenty dollars a head for the Japanese, and whether that‟s true or not, I don‟t know. Interviewer: But it’s still kind of a striking sight, and not something you would have expected. I don‟t know if the government would do that, but you know-Interviewer: It’s hard to tell. Now, did you see much of the native population there on Leyte? Oh yeah Interviewer: How did they get along with the Americans? Good, and we were well treated there. Interviewer: Aside from these guerillas, were there other Filipino soldiers? Were there other units that served with you? No, just the guerillas Interviewer: Just the guerillas at that point. We just ran into the guerillas, we didn‟t run into any troops. 17 �Interviewer: Now, did you—after that first action you had at Ormoc Bay, did your unit go further into the jungle and continue fighting, or did you move out? 31:26 When we got to Ormoc Bay we stopped right there, that was the end of the island, and we had the island taken then. Then we went on over to Mindanao, the next island. Interviewer: What happened there? Well, that‟s where we ran into a lot of trouble, over there. Interviewer: That was the Villa Verde Trail and that kind of thing? There were more troops on there and stuff. Interviewer: Do you know about when that was? Was it in early 1945 at that point? Let‟s see, October Interviewer: October is Leyte November, December—see, I left there in January and went to New Guinea in January, to I Corps, and then I went to the United States and I was assigned to Fort Ord, California as a drill sergeant. 32:27 I was there for about two or three months, and I got orders to go back to the South Pacific. I had an appendicitis attack, and they operated on me, and while I was in the hospital I got my orders rescinded and they set me up for a reenlist. I was up for a commission in the field, you know, in the South Pacific, but I wouldn‟t take it because they wouldn‟t let me come back to my outfit. They wouldn‟t reassign me to my outfit, and I told them that if I couldn‟t come back there as a Lieutenant, I don‟t want to come back. I said, “I‟m here as a Platoon Sergeant, why not a Lieutenant?” He said, “there‟s a difference”, and I could see there was too. 33:25 Once you get those bars on you, their attitude toward you changes. 18 �Interviewer: You had mentioned earlier that you were once on Peleliu? You were also on Peleliu, right? Well yeah, on the island, yeah, and the 38th was over there too. Interviewer: That’s another regiment from your division? Yeah Interviewer: Can you tell us about that? What sis you do there? What did you see there? I didn‟t do anything there myself. I went over there to visit, see I hitch hiked from Leyte to Peleliu. I went to the airstrip and saw his plane, and I asked this captain if anybody was going to Peleliu, and he said, “yes, but I can‟t take anybody, it‟s against regulations”. I knew that, I was AWOL, see, so I got—he said, “that‟s my plane over there”, so I got on the plane, and we went over to Peleliu. 34:34 I went over there and I asked some guys about the 1st Marine division, and this guy I knew, and they showed. Me where it was, and I went over there and saw him. He started crying and said, “I wondered when the hell you guys were going to get here”, and raw, raw, raw, you know, and I said, “Well, we‟re just over here to visit, we got Leyte taken care of so”. Interviewer: Was the fighting still going on then? Were they still fighting on Peleliu at that point? Sporadically, you know, mop up stuff, there‟s always that. Hell, they had a guy on the Admiralty Islands; the Japanese were there twenty-seven years after the war. They didn‟t even know the war was over yet, and they finally got him. 35:27 Interviewer: Did you also go to the Admiralties? 19 �I went there as, not as a fighting unit, we went there as a staging, getting ready to hit Leyte. We were supposed to go to the Truk Islands, see, but they stopped that. Truk Island was the highest fortified island in the Pacific, and it was a big naval base, but they bypassed it and hit Leyte instead, which is a good thing. Interviewer: A lot of those Japanese bases, once we knocked out the airstrips and got air superiority, it didn’t do them any good. They couldn’t do anything with Truk at that point. You know, just like Okinawa that was one son of a gun over there that was something else. Interviewer: You didn’t go to Okinawa? You didn’t have to go to Okinawa yourself though? No, I didn‟t fight there, but my outfit did. The report I got back—when they were taking that island the suicide rate over there for natives alone was astronomical. 36:34 They had suicide cliff there, you know. Interviewer: They had one of those at Saipan too. Oh man Interviewer: Now, when you took that trip over to Peleliu, what happened to you when you got back? Not a thing, they never even knew I was gone. Interviewer: They never knew you were gone, ok. I cheated, the idea was he had to go over there and come right back, so I probably didn‟t visit over an hour, and I was right back on the plane. That wasn‟t the first time. I went out on a damn sub patrol with him on B-24‟s. Went to the airstrip, asked the captain if I 20 �could take a ride, and he said, “Yeah, we‟re going on a patrol”, so he let me in there, an that was the most monotonous ride I ever had. Three feet above the water and here you are going just so many degrees this way and so many degrees that way, and back, and that was it. 37:29 Interviewer: How long were you out? I don‟t remember, a couple of hours, maybe three hours. They never knew I was gone there either. Interviewer: Did you have any other adventures like that? Did you sneak out anywhere else? No, there was only one other thing that happened that I could never figure out, and I haven‟t done it to this day. I was out there training my men on tank tactics, and this captain came up to me, and he wanted to talk to me, so he took me aside and he said, “How would you like to do something for your country?” I said, „Well, I‟m doing about all I can do, as far as I know”, and he said, “well, I got something I want you to do”. 38:21 “What‟s that?” Well, there‟s talk about this Lieutenant Nakamura, a Japanese officer, and he was in the United States and went through college, and went back to Japan to visit his folks. He got back to Japan; they grabbed his ass, and put him in the Japanese Army. He had two sisters on Hilo, on the big island., so they wanted me to go over there, get acquainted with those two sisters, and find out where he was, because they lost track of him. So here I am—and these women were barbers, and they only had women barbers over there, so I went to the barbershop, got a haircut, shave, shampoo, all this crap, and I got acquainted with them, you know. I got a picture of her here someplace. 39:22 I said, “Do you mind if I walk you home/” “me like, me like”, and I said, “alright‟, so we 21 �went down by the park, you know, and they had bomb shelters in the park, and we went around them, and we walked around. You see all the ships going by, so she was asking me about these ship, which ones was—I said, “I don‟t know anything about ships, I‟m not in the navy, and I don‟t know about ships”. I knew what some of them were, because some of them were heavy leaded and sunk in the water, and about ready to sink. Anyway, I got acquainted with her, and one night I took her home. She lived above a store, and the store was not operating anymore, and everything was blackout, you couldn‟t have any lights at night, you know, and to get upstairs we had to go to the back, the back of the store. 40:22 There was an outside stairway, and we get up there and she takes my shoes of, because that‟s there custom, and I bend down, I was going to do something with my shoes, and they had a window in the back door and I could see straight through the house. The moonshine was shining through the front window, and I see a shadow go by, so I asked her if she had anybody living there with her, “no”, and if she was all alone? “Yeah”, well, I had my 45 stuck in my shirt, and I wasn‟t supposed to have my 45 with me, I was supposed to go unarmed, see. Well, I pulled it out and I loaded it, and I let go right through the front of the house, and all of a sudden all the damn area lit up like a Christmas tree. These damn big spotlights, and the MP‟s came in there and surrounded the house, dragged my ass, took me back down to the airstrip, they had my bags already on the airplane, and they threw my ass on the airplane and back to Honolulu I went. 41:41 Back to my base, so I get back there, and I get into my bunk, I had my bunk and my own private room, and there‟s a letter on my bunk, so I opened it up and there‟s a picture of this Lieutenant Nakamura and three other guys, but it was from California at the concentration camp they had there. They had done something to them 22 �for inciting a riot or something. So, to this day I don‟t know what in the hell I was doing over there when they had him in California. Here I am looking for him in Hawaii, and what in the hell am I doing over there in the first place? They had me doing something that I didn‟t know anything about, and I didn‟t have nobody to contact, but this captain. Later on I go and check and there‟s not even a captain by that name in our damn outfit. 42.44 Interviewer: Did anything else happen to you? So, I get a hold of my company commander, he‟s still alive down in South Carolina, I get a hold of him and I said, “Captain, do you remember me, when was gone for ten days playing around in Hawaii, to Hilo?” “No”, and I said, “You‟re the company commander and you didn‟t know I was gone for ten days?” “No”, well, somebody‟s full of bull, you know, and to this day I don‟t know. It drives me nuts trying to figure out why they sent me over there to start with. It had to be something I was doing that I didn‟t know about, but I didn‟t have a contact and that‟s what got me too. If I‟d of got caught, I would have been—shit. Interviewer: As it was, they caught you after you fired the gun, right? Didn’t they just pack you back off to— What? Interviewer: Didn’t they catch you after you fired the gun? No, they didn‟t do anything Interviewer: The lights came on, but nobody came into the building or anything like that? 43:47 No 23 �Interviewer: Ok I didn‟t hear a damn thing about it afterwards, nothing, and I don‟t even know what the hell went on. It happened so damn fast that it—he told me—I had to destroy that letter right away, that picture and everything. I had to destroy it right away, after I read it, and I wish that I‟d kept it, but I didn‟t. I was following orders, you know. Interviewer: Right, but the fact is, they didn’t notice you were gone, they didn’t punish you, they decided they didn’t notice you were gone so— Right, I had a nephew that was in the navy, a jet pilot, and I had this nephew, my nieces husband, he‟s in the marines, and these other two buddies of mine are marines, and a couple other buddies in the army, one got killed, accidental, put a damn machine gun up on the back of a truck while it was loaded yet, and it went off. 44:49 Somebody got his ass in a sling over that I‟ll bet ya. They had no clearing blocks in there, you know. I had another thing happen too that I got away with, in a way. We were loading on Hawaii there to go to Leyte, the Philippines, and a marine came up with a Jeep, he came up to the supply house, he got out of the Jeep, left it running, and he went inside. So, I told a couple of my men, I said, “grab that damn Jeep and bring it over here”, so they drove the Jeep over by the dock, and I had the crane operator load it on our ship. 45:40 They loaded it on our ship, and I told my buddy, he was in the maintenance department there, ordinance, I said, “put our colors on that and put our insignias on that”, and he said, “Where did you get that?” I said, “never mind, get that thing painted up”. We did see the major come out of the building, and mad, he was so damn mad, he was looking all over that place—he didn‟t know what the hell happened. I seen guys pointing here and there 24 �and he was looking here and there, and we got that damn thing clear over to the Philippines. I got a hold of another—a 1939 Cadillac. Interviewer: Where was that? A black one, and this was on Leyte, right near Tacloban, and it was full of bullet holes, so we yanked it out of there with a tank, took it back and had them fix it all up, and we were going to use that as our car to go play around in. 46:42 Well shit, the MP‟s come along and they confiscated that too. Every vehicle we could find—we‟d pull it out of a ditch or take it out of a swamp, pull it out and take it back to our outfit, get it all cleaned up, fixed up, and we were going to use them, and they would take them away from us every time. Interviewer: Did you have the same crew with you the whole time? The guys in your tank, did they stay the same people? Yeah, and one thing about the war, I never lost a man in the war. One guy got his leg cut off, and that was due to an accident. We fell off a cliff, and I got the guys out, and his leg was cut off by the gun. It came down and it was in a traveling lock position, well the rod broke and it came down and hit his knee and cut it off. We got him out of there, but we had to send a rope basket down to get him up because it was a hundred feet down. 47:43 Interviewer: Now, did the tank go off the cliff? Yeah, it fell right off. Interviewer: It fell a hundred feet down? Yeah, it lit right side up too. Smashed all the bogie wheels on it too, the tracks and all that stuff—it‟s a wonder it didn‟t kill us all. That‟s where I was supposed to have got the Bronze Star, for getting them guys out. I don‟t give a shit about no Bronze Star, I got them out, that‟s necessary. 25 �Interviewer: Did you keep in touch with any of those guys from your crew after the war? I had one guy, two guys, but they weren‟t in my outfit. They were to start with, but I got rid of them because they both were a bunch of duds, you know. One of them ended up as a Master Sergeant in the air force in computers, and here he couldn‟t make PFC in our outfit, and in the air force he made Master Sergeant, and he did a good job. 48:42 The other guy, he‟s over in Annapolis, and I don‟t know about him. Everything was about him, him, him, you know. He had 8x10 pictures made of everything he did, and he was patting himself on the back all the time. He called himself “Sergeant”, and hell, he wasn‟t a sergeant, you know. I had a whole damn bunch of pictures I sent to him, and he wanted copies of them, so I sent him the pictures, and I told him to send them back. He sent them back, but he didn‟t put my name on them. He put the address, but he didn‟t put my name, and the damn post office wouldn‟t deliver them, so I called Washington, where he mailed them from, and they wouldn‟t do a damn thing about it. I never did get them pictures. I never got them, and they were in a box about like a check box. 49:50 They had pictures of it with the address, but they didn‟t have the name. Why in the hell couldn‟t they deliver them? Interviewer: I don’t know, they send things to occupant all the time. Shit, all they had to do was mail them to the damn address. I called everybody I could call. I called the postmaster over there, I got a hold of him too, and I told him I wanted them pictures. I lost enough shit during the war like that. Coming back home I got to San Francisco, I had my Samurai sword, I had my 45, a bunch of pictures, which were not supposed to have been taken, I took them through the turret of the tank, hand to hand 26 �combat stuff, and this major sat there, he had a 45 setting on the table right beside him. When we got off the ship we had to unload our duffle bags, so he could see what was in them. 50:53 He said, “ok, we‟ll tag this one and ship it to you, we‟ll tag that and ship it to you”. They wanted to check for cigarettes because you could get cigarettes for five cents a carton, I guess it was five cents a carton or something like that. Anyway, you were only allowed one carton, and it went on like that and I never got that stuff, none of it. I got a book in there that Colliers magazine put out years ago and my pictures are in there, but how in the hell could I prove that they‟re mine, I can‟t. I know they‟re mine, and I didn‟t have them developed, see, I had the picture, but I didn‟t have them developed yet. Well, they must have developed them. Interviewer: You had people in some of these supply services and things like that, that were pretty good at making things disappear. 51:50 The major, he was the one that made money off of that stuff. Interviewer: Entirely possible, either that or he handed it off to somebody else and somebody else sells it off. I didn‟t have a damn leg to stand on because he‟s a major and I‟m a sergeant. How the hell am I going to tell him what to do? Interviewer: Yup, and even if you did there wouldn’t be any way to show that it was he that did it rather than somebody else. That’s too bad. That sword was worth a lot of money because it belonged to a general too. Interviewer: How did you get it? How did I get it? From a general after he was killed. Interviewer: How did that come about? 27 �Well, we went—we were on this island and I don‟t remember if it was Leyte or where it was now, but anyway, there was a battle and all the Japs were dead. We got outside and made sure they were all dead, checked them out, you know. Well, I saw the sword there and I took the sword and put it in the tank and stuff. 52:57 I had a Hari-Kari [hara kiri] knife too that they used to commit suicide with. Interviewer: How could you tell he was a general? Well, he had—the generals had—all the big shots had the samurai swords with all jeweled handles, and this was jewel handled. They had a certain handle they used for each general. The higher the rank, the bigger the jewels, or the good ones, or whatever you want to call them. Then he had his uniform, and of course I didn‟t know what the hell his rank was at first because I didn‟t know their ranks, but somebody else told me that was a general, so I assumed it was a general. 53:47 The sword, the samurai, coincided with everything else. Interviewer: Now, when it’s all over, you get out, come back to Michigan, was that—did you come back to Michigan after you were out of the service, or did you go somewhere else? When I got out of the service I came back to Grand Rapids. I went from San Francisco to Fort Sheridan, Illinois. I was sent home for a delay in route for R&R in Florida, and I came home first, I stayed home for twenty days, that‟s all I got, and I got married while I was home, on March 31st, and my wife, I was going with her when I went in the service. I was sent on R&R to Florida, and I didn‟t know I could take my wife with me, so didn‟t. 55:06 I get over there, and I could have taken her for a dollar a day. Well, they didn‟t tell me until it was time for me to go back home. Then I got orders to go to Fort Ord in 28 �California, so what did I do? I got a hold of this officer in charge, and asked for a delay in route, and he asked my why, and I said, “I want to buy a farm when I get—on the way home, so he said, “Ok”, and they gave me a ten day delay in route. I got the orders to go out to California, you know—well, I had the orders already, and my wife wanted to go with me out there, and I said, “no, I‟m not going to take you down there, because I don‟t know what the hell‟s going on when I get there”. 55:52 “Where are you going to live? I don‟t have a place for you to live or anything else”, so I didn‟t. Well, if I would have told them about it ahead of time they could have had that set up, but they don‟t tell you anything, you know, so anyway, I got back down there, and my wife had been in California, and she worked as a telephone operator in California near Fort Ord. Her cousin was stationed at Fort Ord, and she went down there to see her husband and my wife went with her and she got a job. I could have gone down there, and she knew more about Fort Ord than I did really, so she never got to go there either, but it worked out alright I guess. 56:45 Interviewer: Did you buy your farm? No, I didn‟t intend to buy a farm. Interviewer: That was just a good story? I just told them that. Interviewer: Did you go back into the plumbing business, or did you do something else? No, I got home and started in the plumbing business, but you couldn‟t by soil pipe, you couldn‟t buy anything hardly at all, so I went to work for, I think it was General Motors Plant 1 for a while, and then from there I went to Kelvinator, Blackmere Pump, 29 �Production Die Cast, and I couldn‟t handle there jackass foremen and stuff in these plants. I had it out with every one of them except General Motors. 57:43 In 1952 I started back in plumbing with my dad and my brother, and that thing fizzled out, so I went back to General Motors, and I spent thirty and a half years there, and I stayed in the plumbing business too. I did a lot of plumbing on my own then, and I did a lot of houses in Grand Rapids, and all over really. Interviewer: I believe it, and when you look back on the whole thing now, how do you think your time in the service affected you? Do you think your time in the army made you different from what you were before, made you grow up at all? Oh yeah, I went from a snot nosed eighteen year old to a seventy-five year old man in five years. 58:40 Here I am trying to lead a bunch of kids and I‟m only a kid myself. We were all about the same age, a couple were a little older, but we were all about the same age. Interviewer: In the South Pacific it was kind of hard to be much older. They didn’t want a lot of older guys out in the jungle and that kind of thing. They didn’t think they could take it. The younger guys were fodder. Interviewer: It was that too They were the only ones that could take it, and when you go through that damn basic training—I‟ll tell you that aint nothing fun, and I don‟t know if you ever did it or not. Interviewer: Certainly not 30 �Man, that‟s something else, and they really pour it on too. You don‟t have one sergeant on your ass at a time, you got two or three of them, and you have them all hollering at you at once. 59:51 Interviewer: Now when you were a drill sergeant, did you do that too? Yeah, I had to do the same thing, just about. I had one sergeant that I chased across the drill field with a bayonet. We were doing a manual of arms, getting ready for graduation, I missed on a count and he said, “you ---eating son of a bitch”, that‟s just what he said, and I said, “nobody calls me a son of a bitch and gets away with it”, and I pulled down on him with my bayonet, and that‟s when we had all chrome plated bayonet‟s yet. I was chasing his ass across the 800 yard drill field, and I damn near caught up with him when this lieutenant came up, Lieutenant Yearman was his name, he came up in his Jeep and the driver pulled in between me and the sergeant, and the sergeant jumped in the Jeep and they took off. Here I am standing out in the middle of the field by myself. The next thing I knew, here came some damn MP‟s, and they grab my hind end and take me back to the regiment. So, I get back to the regiment and I had to go up to the colonel, Colonel Sullivan. 1:10 Interviewer: So, you were on the drill field here in Hawaii, chasing after the sergeant, the Lieutenant saved him, the MP’s came and took you, and then what happened? I went before the colonel, Colonel Sullivan was his name, and he asked me what happened, and I told him. I stood at attention for an hour from him and he was chewing me up one side and down the other, you know. He asked me what happened and I told him, and he called the sergeant and he busted him down to a private. He got his rank 31 �back in thirty days, but anyway, Sergeant White was his name, and I‟ll never forget it, but I never got anything out of it, and I graduated and everything else. Interviewer: Are there other things that stick in your mind or that you remember, whether it was in Hawaii or the islands? 2:10 A couple other things, when I was on guard duty one night, we got in this here, it was like a mine in the side of a mountain. It was all built out of concrete, and it was all lighted up and everything else. I couldn‟t tell you where the hell it was at, it was on Oahu, but I don‟t know where, up in the hill, in the mountains. I was on guard duty there, and it was where the Hawaiian headquarter was going to be moved in case the Japanese landed, and it was a top-secret place. I was always wondering if that was still there or not, if they let people know if it‟s still there or not. Interviewer: Do you think it was pretty close to Honolulu, was it pretty far away? It was up near Schofield Barracks, near there. 3:10 See you take—from one side of the island to the other, you go to Kaneohe Naval Base and you‟re 2000 and some odd feet above, up on the palley there looking down on Kaneohe naval Base, so from one side of the island to the other there‟s a difference and a lot mileage, you know, and they could have been building that stuff anywhere. It was a beautiful island until the damn white man got over there and screwed it all up. Kaiser, Kaiser Aluminum, he‟s the one that started it on Waikiki beach, them high-rises—I use to go to Hawaii and stay there on Waikiki beach. 4:09 I met a girl there and her dad owned, I don‟t know what it was, it was a big mansion or something, but he opened it up for the GI‟s, and I met her, and I don‟t even know what her name was. When they built that high-rise at Waikiki it blocked him off from even seeing the beach, and they fought about it, but it didn‟t do any 32 �good. Now look at it, and there was only one hotel on that island and that was the Royal Hawaiian, an all pink one, and it was the only one that was there, and now look at the damn thing. 4:56 Interviewer: People can’t afford to live there. There seems to be somebody is living there. 33 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carpenter, Edson (Interview transcript and video), 2008 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Carpenter, Edson Description An account of the resource Edson Carpenter is a World War II veteran who served in the U.S. Army with the 767th Tank Battalion 19th Inf. Division from 1941 to 1945. In this account, Carpenter discusses his pre-enlistment, enlistment and training in the U.S and the Pacific, and his combat experiences across the Pacific. Carpenter also mentions aspects of the war not generally talked about such as the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, the fighting on Leyte, and other island assaults he took part in. Carpenter concludes by discussing his life after the war and what he learned from his military experiences. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans United States. Army World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2008-05-13 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CarpenterE Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/07b5c8c3738ca17090e756a6b8ab87c8.mp4 8ea0714ddde12983c0aea5761a37c5ea https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/54e82e234b9012b96a716d1f6e589e60.pdf 5561f4085ae625bb997c6dd6b63fc778 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans’ History Project John Carlson Parts 1, 3 and 4 Cold War, Vietnam War PART 1 1 hour 10 minutes 19 seconds (00:00:09) Early Life -Parents came from St. Paul, Wisconsin and moved to Holland, Michigan in 1936 -He was born in 1943 -Dad worked at the Friedland Company -Made field jackets and coats during WWII -Spent a lot of time in St. Paul on a family farm growing up -Attended Holland High School -Graduated in 1961 -Wrestled and played the tuba -Interested in history -Wanted to study electronics after high school -Knew that the Navy would be the best bet to get that kind of education -Wanted to join the Navy for the sake of an education and adventurism (00:05:39) Naval Training – Basic Training -Reported for boot camp in September, 1961 -Finished basic training and electronics school in late October, 1962 -Trained at Great Lakes Naval Academy -Stayed on the compound the majority of the time -Not a lot of marching due to the base’s relatively small size -Mostly classroom work and not a lot of physical training -Trainers were more subdued than the stereotypical Army or Marine drill instructors -Got to go on Christmas leave -Transition into military living was not a difficult one -Used to marching from being in marching band -Expected the trainers to be tough on them (00:08:58) Naval Training-Electronics Training -Had to take test to qualify for electronics school -Electronics education gave him professional expertise -Guaranteed him a job in the field -Spent a week assembling a radio -Built circuits and transistors -Trained with analog computers from WWII that did calculations for the guns (00:12:55) Cuban Missile Crisis -Last duty watch he heard Kennedy’s address to the Union concerning Cuba -Went on leave and returned to find that his ship had been deployed to the blockade -Reported to the USS Everglades -Was supposed to be on the USS MacDonough -Frigate �-Went to Charleston and stayed there for two weeks -Eventually boarded the USS MacDonough (00:15:32) USS MacDonough-General Overview -Spent three years all told on the USS MacDonough -Did a few Mediterranean tours -Worked with the Marines in Puerto Rico for training exercises in Puerto Rico -Trained on designation and displacement equipment -Fire control for guns and missiles -Used the BW1 missiles-first missiles of their kind, extremely basic defensive capability -Trained to be a range finder operator -Outdated, but still essential piece of equipment -Usually last station to be involved in a training exercise -Did a lot of mess cooking for the first nine months -Would make thirty five gallons of coffee for every meal -Day started at 5 A.M. (00:23:25) USS MacDonough-Making 3rd Class -Eventually made 3rd Class -First night as 3rd Class got to pull shore patrol at St. Croix Island, US Virgin Islands -Station was where Alexander Hamilton learned accounting -Put on “special weapons watch” -Ordered not to let anyone behind locked doors: shoot on sight -Guarded tactical nuclear weapons -Had to go to the range for pistol training whenever they were in port -Ordered to go through 1000 rounds of ammunition -Not given any ear protection, still suffers hearing problems because of it (00:28:10) Seasickness Story -Never bothered by seasickness -Got ordered to clean a bathroom while still on mess duty first time going to sea -Superior officer kept showing up and berating him for not doing a good enough job -Officer told him that he wanted to keep his mind off being sick -Concerned about him getting violently ill (00:30:16) First Mediterranean Deployment -Heavy weather never really happened -Mediterranean Sea was always considered safe, North Atlantic was considered dangerous -They were not authorized to stop in North Africa or Israel -Visited Italy numerous times -Specifically the cities of Rome and Naples -Locals understood that Americans had money, so they were welcomed in for the commerce -First stop was in Izmir, Turkey -After that went to Naples, Italy -Cannes in July -They stopped in Valencia -Got to see the bullfights there -By November 1963 they had returned to the United States �(00:34:49) JFK Assassination -Remembers JFK being assassinated while he was pulling mess duty -Within five minutes the entire ship knew -Everyone that could gather around the TV did -News was received at 10 AM -Given “holiday routine” for reflection and to pay attention to the news -Kennedy was somewhat revered in the Navy for having been in the Navy himself -The assassination felt like it had been an attack on the entire Navy (00:37:17) Commodore Inspection and Other Duties -Was on board during an ORI (operational readiness inspection) -Made sure that the ship looked good and was up to code -Crew was interviewed by the commodore to see if they knew their jobs well enough -Commodore interviewed him and found out he knew how to work the range finder -This impressed the commodore and “made his day” -Conducted missile testing on the missile range -Conducted Marine landing exercises in April (or May) in Puerto Rico (00:40:47) 1964 World’s Fair -In 1964 they were deployed to New York City to be tied up at Pier 90 for the World’s Fair -Extremely close to 45th Street -There presence was meant to be a form of exhibition -Saw primitive IBM and GE computers -Cultural experience -Stayed there for a few days -Got to see downtown New York -Stayed out of trouble while ashore -Usually got a few drinks in the afternoon then got dinner with shipmates -Had to get up and do ship duties in the morning until noon or later anyway (00:45:46) “Jumping Ship” Story -In 1963 they were in Istanbul, Turkey and he got in an argument with the supply officer -Technically was under the authority of the weapons officer and not the supply officer -Weapons officer would habitually put in for Carlson’s Liberty Card -Supply officer revoked his liberty pass -Used liberty card from weapons officer to go ashore -Practice of leaving the ship illegally was called “jumping ship” -Returned to the ship successfully and no one ever knew (00:48:24) Second Mediterranean Deployment -In Summer, 1964 they did another tour in the Mediterranean Sea (00:48:33) Visiting Rome on the First Deployment -Got to go to Rome -Saw the Villa Borghese -Went to the Vatican -Got blessed by the Pope -Saw the Roman forum (00:49:29) Back to the Second Mediterranean Deployment -Went to Naples, Italy �-Had a layover in Taranto, Italy and had a party on the beach there -Went to Trieste, Italy in early October, 1964 -Docked with the USS Boston there (00:50:45) Ship Fire -While in Trieste he went ashore and visited the Alpine area -Came back and saw that there had been a boiler fire -Navy used Bunker 6 (recycled fuel) that was highly volatile and made of heavy metals -Firefighter was burned to death -Had to flood the compartments to put out the fire -Ammunition compartment had been flooded -Had to use carbon tetrachloride (highly toxic solvent) to clean the missile electronics -Reloaded and went to Cannes, France (00:55:16) Visiting Paris, France -Five day, all expenses paid trip to Paris was offered for $73 -Took a train from Cannes to Marseilles -From Marseilles took another train to Paris -At the time the train he rode from Marseilles was the fastest in the world -Stayed in a hotel -Had a tour bus with a tour guide every day -Got stuck across town one night because the subways stopped at 10:30 PM -Got to see Napoleon’s Tomb -Got to visit Versailles (00:57:35) Fleet Landing Watch in Cannes -Did fleet landing watch for one night after Paris -Had to report in every hour -Had a hand-crank powered generator that powered the short range radio -Served the watch with a chief that had served in WWII -Spent the night talking, drinking coffee, and smoking (00:59:40) More on the Second Mediterranean Deployment -Never ran into any major trouble at sea or ashore -Stayed out of the bad neighborhoods -In Naples and Palermo, Italy they were told to stay downtown and not go into neighborhoods -Got home by Christmas, 1964 TAPE ENDS AT 1 hour 0 minutes 45 seconds Note: Part 2 did not record properly--will try to reshoot. Story resumes with first Vietnam deployment in Part 3. PART 3 & 4 1 hour 25 minutes PART 3 (00:00:10) First Vietnam Deployment-Tonkin Gulf �-Aboard the USS Wainwright in the Tonkin Gulf -Went to Subic Bay, Philippines in May 1967 for refuel and supply check -Got fresh groceries and their mail -Went up to the Tonkin Gulf after leaving the USS Long Beach -Got order to go “online” on June 3, 1967 -After that they were planned to go around the world and return to Charleston -Three days later those plans were voided because of the Six Day War -Station period (time spent in a part of the Gulf) was thirty to fifty days -Always at least six ships in the Tonkin Gulf -Soviet trawlers occasionally came into the Gulf -Soviets were gathering intelligence to give to the NVA -Could not engage the Soviet trawlers -Their station job was to use long range radar to keep track of friendly and hostile aircraft -Search and rescue if necessary -Keep the aircraft carriers safe from air raids -Also had 250,000 gallons of helicopter fuel for refueling -Their station was thirty miles south of the city of Haiphong -Moved in closer when bombardments part of Operation Rolling Thunder were being conducted -Worked with aircraft carriers during bombardments -Protect aircraft and protect aircraft carriers -They gathered radar information and fed it back to radar operators on board the carriers -They stayed in the Tonkin Gulf Theatre for about three hundred days (all toll) -Went stateside between cruises -1967 cruise was seven and a half months -1968 cruise was eight and a half months (00:11:33) First Vietnam Deployment-Staying in Contact -Got their news from Newsweek and Time -Knew that the papers were heavily biased -Far removed from the details of the war -Didn’t know how it was going -Any objective information about the war came from Navy newspapers -There wasn’t much news about the war though -Radar killed off long range radio contact with the outside world -Very isolated in the Gulf -Stayed entertained with movies and music (00:17:17) First Vietnam Deployment-Incidents and Daily Life -Had a helicopter crash into their superstructure -Rotor fractured and exploded and wounded a number of sailors -Came to rest on their flight deck -They stripped it of essential equipment then pushed it overboard -Other than the helicopter crash the 1967 cruise was pretty uneventful -Kept themselves busy by reading a lot (00:21:00) First Vietnam Deployment-Repairs and Leave -Went to Subic Bay for repairs -Stayed there for three weeks �-Toured around the base, but stayed out of the town -Went to Hong Kong -Locals welcomed the American money -Chinese scavenged food as their payment for painting ships -Went to Sydney, Australia as part of leave -Liked the people, didn’t like the warm beer -Stayed there for four days -Went to Wellington, New Zealand -Went to Stokes Valley and visited a friend that lived there -Stayed there for four days -Went to Tahiti -Far superior to Hawaii (00:28:02) First Vietnam Deployment-Return Voyage and Coming Home -After leave boarded the USS Wainwright and traveled across the South Pacific towards Canal Zone -Cut through the Caribbean Sea and headed up to Charleston -Arrived in Charleston on November 13, 1967 -Most sailors saved their leave for the holidays -Commanding officer left the sailors alone, didn’t expect much work out of them -Went home on Christmas leave -Got married to a girl he had been talking to prior to and during service -Brought her to Charleston and made her an official Navy wife (00:31:30) Second Vietnam Deployment-1968 Cruise -After being back for four months they had to leave for an eight and a half month deployment -Went to Pearl Harbor, then Guam for fuel -Went to Subic Bay for fuel and orders -Arrived in Vietnam in July 1968 -Went up to Da Nang Harbor for information exchange with the Marines -Returned to former operating area in the Tonkin Gulf -CBS showed up to do an interview with commanding officer (00:36:24) Second Vietnam Deployment-First Part of Being on Station -From August to September they were on station -Went to Subic Bay in mid-September -Went back to Hong Kong -Tropical storm rolled in -Had to leave twenty sailors on shore to escape the harbor -British Navy brought them up to Subic Bay -After Hong Kong went back to Subic Bay -Saw the battleship USS New Jersey in the harbor -Returned to their station in the Gulf (Yankee Station) and relieved the USS Sterett -By the end of October they were back on station -Operation Rolling Thunder ended soon thereafter -Sent to Sasebo, Japan in November (00:40:04) Second Vietnam Deployment-Second Part of Being on Station -Went back to area of operations for forty five days -Ending Operation Rolling Thunder lifted the stress on the sailors �-Went back to Subic Bay in early January 1969 -Went back across the South Pacific after that -Made the Mess Deck Master at Arms -Checked the new sailors’ hands to check for hygiene -Gave them a pep talk and a rundown of how things worked on the ship PART 3 ENDS AT 45 minutes and 12 seconds PART 4 (00:45:28) Second Vietnam Deployment-Incident at Okinawa -In October 1968 they were bound for Sasebo, Japan -Got an emergency call to go to Okinawa -Rescued civilians that were stranded onboard the SS Lindenwood Victory without a propeller -Towed them back to port at Sasebo (00:48:00) Second Vietnam Deployment-Return Cruise in Pacific -Went back to Subic Bay and then down through the Tori Straits -Waterway between Papua New Guinea and Australia -Thick fog -Took an hour to pass through -Passed behind the Great Barrier Reef -Went back to Sydney, Australia -Went to Auckland, New Zealand -Went back to Tahiti for refueling (00:50:33) Second Vietnam Deployment-Return Cruise in Caribbean -Went to the Canal Zone -Stopped at Rodman Naval Station in Panama for fuel and supplies -Allowed leave for three hours to visit the clubs -Got into the Caribbean Sea the next day -Stopped at St. Thomas -Captain’s order was to buy stuff for loved ones -Also told to buy a crate of liquor from a store called Sparky’s -Got a gallon of duty free liquor from Sparky’s (00:53:35) Return to Charleston -Got to Charleston in the late morning -Had leave orders -Wife met him in Charleston for several weeks of leave -Won the Anchor Pool -Lottery based on time of arrival in Charleston -Spent that money and leave for honeymooning -Visited wife’s family in Hamilton, Michigan -Returned to Charleston (00:56:47) Norfolk, Virginia and Operation Springboard -After a few months in Charleston the USS Wainwright was invited to Norfolk for a demonstration -May 1969 �-Went ashore and no one from shore patrol came to pick them up -Went to shore patrol headquarters and got things sorted out -Stayed in the shore patrol headquarters building -Went to Operation Springboard later in May -Marine training exercise in Puerto Rico (01:00:14) Warehouse Job in Charleston -Got attached to a supply warehouse detail -Never had to go to the ship -Inventoried everything -Putting new stuff on the shelves -Pulling old stuff off of the shelves -Put in a normal forty hour week -Job lasted for five months -Lived at home with his wife -Spent Friday nights together -Socialized with shipmates (01:04:40) End of Enlistment and Return to Michigan -Heard rumor that there would be a manpower reduction -Became official shortly thereafter -Wound up getting cut six weeks later -Some sailors had to go through refresher training -Others had to back to Vietnam including one sailor he knew -January 5 1970 was his final day of duty -Left Charleston an hour after cleaning out their apartment -Spent a night in Gatlinburg, Tennessee -Second day of travel they got caught in a snow storm north of South Bend, Indiana -Followed a truck right up to Hamilton, Michigan (01:08:25) Working after the War -Planned to take some time off -Wound up applying for job with the Heinz Company in Holland on January 11 -Went to work on the 14th as an electrician -Only got nine days of break time -Worked with the Heinz Company for seven years -Lots of veterans from WWII and Korea worked there; he was the first Vietnam vet -Worked at the Holland power plant after Heinz -Worked there until his 55th birthday -Retired after that -Got a contractor’s license after the power plant to keep him busy (01:10:52) Reunion Involvement-Pre Reunion Group -Didn’t talk about wartime experience or meet with other shipmates for a long time -Went to a picnic sponsored by the Vietnam Veterans of America -Started getting involved after that -Went to welcome home parade in Chicago for Vietnam veterans -June 1986 -200,000 Vietnam veterans showed up -Saw war buddies reunite in a hotel lounge and wanted to experience that �(01:12:34) Reunion Involvement-Formation of the USS Wainwright Reunion Group -Stopped at VFW Hall for a few beers one day after work -Talked with another veteran and decided to start his own reunion group -Started communicating with old shipmates -Planned Washington DC reunion in July 1987 -Six of them went to DC -Saw the Bicentennial Celebration of the Constitution -Largest fireworks display in history -Within two months they had eighty names -Had first reunion in Charleston in 1989 -By that time there were three hundred names on the list -Assembled roster of 3600 names spanning twenty six years of service -Reunion list now has seven hundred names on it -Went to Cincinnati in 1991 -Built an association over time -Was able to step back and compile history -Payoff was being able to see friends reunite -Wanted to be able to create a lasting legacy for the sailors (01:19:45) Reflections on Service -Navy provided him with technical training -Shaped him into the person that he is today -Fulfilled his drive to go to sea -Did an unpopular thing at an unpopular time -Camaraderie was formed because of that -Proud to be part of an honorable group of soldiers -Comfortable with being a veteran -Owns the situation, isn’t scarred by PTSD or guilt -Wants to know the stories of other Vietnam veterans -Wants to be in touch with what the ground troops endured -Attends other reunions besides the USS Wainwright reunion to stay in touch with other Vietnam vets � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carlson, John (Interview outline and video, 1 of 4), 2011 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Carlson, John Description An account of the resource John Carlson is a U.S. Navy veteran that served before and during the Vietnam War first aboard the USS MacDonough (before Vietnam) and aboard the USS Wainwright during the Vietnam War and saw action in the Gulf of Tonkin during Operation Rolling Thunder. He was born in Holland, Michigan in 1943 and enlisted in the Navy in 1961. He trained at Great Lakes Naval Academy and specialized in electronics. He traveled throughout the Mediterranean Sea aboard the USS Macdonough and the Tonkin Gulf and South Pacific aboard the USS Wainwright. He then had shore duty in Charleston, South Carolina, and left the Navy in January 1970. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American United States. Navy Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-10-17 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CarlsonJ1325V1 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/affb9f8ba9c85f5f9aae3b6fc26e0020.mp4 02bf944d8bf5a40dc37d63b5d3aa61d2 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/77fa2baea5202c5bd03610834bc6241d.pdf 5561f4085ae625bb997c6dd6b63fc778 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans’ History Project John Carlson Parts 1, 3 and 4 Cold War, Vietnam War PART 1 1 hour 10 minutes 19 seconds (00:00:09) Early Life -Parents came from St. Paul, Wisconsin and moved to Holland, Michigan in 1936 -He was born in 1943 -Dad worked at the Friedland Company -Made field jackets and coats during WWII -Spent a lot of time in St. Paul on a family farm growing up -Attended Holland High School -Graduated in 1961 -Wrestled and played the tuba -Interested in history -Wanted to study electronics after high school -Knew that the Navy would be the best bet to get that kind of education -Wanted to join the Navy for the sake of an education and adventurism (00:05:39) Naval Training – Basic Training -Reported for boot camp in September, 1961 -Finished basic training and electronics school in late October, 1962 -Trained at Great Lakes Naval Academy -Stayed on the compound the majority of the time -Not a lot of marching due to the base’s relatively small size -Mostly classroom work and not a lot of physical training -Trainers were more subdued than the stereotypical Army or Marine drill instructors -Got to go on Christmas leave -Transition into military living was not a difficult one -Used to marching from being in marching band -Expected the trainers to be tough on them (00:08:58) Naval Training-Electronics Training -Had to take test to qualify for electronics school -Electronics education gave him professional expertise -Guaranteed him a job in the field -Spent a week assembling a radio -Built circuits and transistors -Trained with analog computers from WWII that did calculations for the guns (00:12:55) Cuban Missile Crisis -Last duty watch he heard Kennedy’s address to the Union concerning Cuba -Went on leave and returned to find that his ship had been deployed to the blockade -Reported to the USS Everglades -Was supposed to be on the USS MacDonough -Frigate �-Went to Charleston and stayed there for two weeks -Eventually boarded the USS MacDonough (00:15:32) USS MacDonough-General Overview -Spent three years all told on the USS MacDonough -Did a few Mediterranean tours -Worked with the Marines in Puerto Rico for training exercises in Puerto Rico -Trained on designation and displacement equipment -Fire control for guns and missiles -Used the BW1 missiles-first missiles of their kind, extremely basic defensive capability -Trained to be a range finder operator -Outdated, but still essential piece of equipment -Usually last station to be involved in a training exercise -Did a lot of mess cooking for the first nine months -Would make thirty five gallons of coffee for every meal -Day started at 5 A.M. (00:23:25) USS MacDonough-Making 3rd Class -Eventually made 3rd Class -First night as 3rd Class got to pull shore patrol at St. Croix Island, US Virgin Islands -Station was where Alexander Hamilton learned accounting -Put on “special weapons watch” -Ordered not to let anyone behind locked doors: shoot on sight -Guarded tactical nuclear weapons -Had to go to the range for pistol training whenever they were in port -Ordered to go through 1000 rounds of ammunition -Not given any ear protection, still suffers hearing problems because of it (00:28:10) Seasickness Story -Never bothered by seasickness -Got ordered to clean a bathroom while still on mess duty first time going to sea -Superior officer kept showing up and berating him for not doing a good enough job -Officer told him that he wanted to keep his mind off being sick -Concerned about him getting violently ill (00:30:16) First Mediterranean Deployment -Heavy weather never really happened -Mediterranean Sea was always considered safe, North Atlantic was considered dangerous -They were not authorized to stop in North Africa or Israel -Visited Italy numerous times -Specifically the cities of Rome and Naples -Locals understood that Americans had money, so they were welcomed in for the commerce -First stop was in Izmir, Turkey -After that went to Naples, Italy -Cannes in July -They stopped in Valencia -Got to see the bullfights there -By November 1963 they had returned to the United States �(00:34:49) JFK Assassination -Remembers JFK being assassinated while he was pulling mess duty -Within five minutes the entire ship knew -Everyone that could gather around the TV did -News was received at 10 AM -Given “holiday routine” for reflection and to pay attention to the news -Kennedy was somewhat revered in the Navy for having been in the Navy himself -The assassination felt like it had been an attack on the entire Navy (00:37:17) Commodore Inspection and Other Duties -Was on board during an ORI (operational readiness inspection) -Made sure that the ship looked good and was up to code -Crew was interviewed by the commodore to see if they knew their jobs well enough -Commodore interviewed him and found out he knew how to work the range finder -This impressed the commodore and “made his day” -Conducted missile testing on the missile range -Conducted Marine landing exercises in April (or May) in Puerto Rico (00:40:47) 1964 World’s Fair -In 1964 they were deployed to New York City to be tied up at Pier 90 for the World’s Fair -Extremely close to 45th Street -There presence was meant to be a form of exhibition -Saw primitive IBM and GE computers -Cultural experience -Stayed there for a few days -Got to see downtown New York -Stayed out of trouble while ashore -Usually got a few drinks in the afternoon then got dinner with shipmates -Had to get up and do ship duties in the morning until noon or later anyway (00:45:46) “Jumping Ship” Story -In 1963 they were in Istanbul, Turkey and he got in an argument with the supply officer -Technically was under the authority of the weapons officer and not the supply officer -Weapons officer would habitually put in for Carlson’s Liberty Card -Supply officer revoked his liberty pass -Used liberty card from weapons officer to go ashore -Practice of leaving the ship illegally was called “jumping ship” -Returned to the ship successfully and no one ever knew (00:48:24) Second Mediterranean Deployment -In Summer, 1964 they did another tour in the Mediterranean Sea (00:48:33) Visiting Rome on the First Deployment -Got to go to Rome -Saw the Villa Borghese -Went to the Vatican -Got blessed by the Pope -Saw the Roman forum (00:49:29) Back to the Second Mediterranean Deployment -Went to Naples, Italy �-Had a layover in Taranto, Italy and had a party on the beach there -Went to Trieste, Italy in early October, 1964 -Docked with the USS Boston there (00:50:45) Ship Fire -While in Trieste he went ashore and visited the Alpine area -Came back and saw that there had been a boiler fire -Navy used Bunker 6 (recycled fuel) that was highly volatile and made of heavy metals -Firefighter was burned to death -Had to flood the compartments to put out the fire -Ammunition compartment had been flooded -Had to use carbon tetrachloride (highly toxic solvent) to clean the missile electronics -Reloaded and went to Cannes, France (00:55:16) Visiting Paris, France -Five day, all expenses paid trip to Paris was offered for $73 -Took a train from Cannes to Marseilles -From Marseilles took another train to Paris -At the time the train he rode from Marseilles was the fastest in the world -Stayed in a hotel -Had a tour bus with a tour guide every day -Got stuck across town one night because the subways stopped at 10:30 PM -Got to see Napoleon’s Tomb -Got to visit Versailles (00:57:35) Fleet Landing Watch in Cannes -Did fleet landing watch for one night after Paris -Had to report in every hour -Had a hand-crank powered generator that powered the short range radio -Served the watch with a chief that had served in WWII -Spent the night talking, drinking coffee, and smoking (00:59:40) More on the Second Mediterranean Deployment -Never ran into any major trouble at sea or ashore -Stayed out of the bad neighborhoods -In Naples and Palermo, Italy they were told to stay downtown and not go into neighborhoods -Got home by Christmas, 1964 TAPE ENDS AT 1 hour 0 minutes 45 seconds Note: Part 2 did not record properly--will try to reshoot. Story resumes with first Vietnam deployment in Part 3. PART 3 & 4 1 hour 25 minutes PART 3 (00:00:10) First Vietnam Deployment-Tonkin Gulf �-Aboard the USS Wainwright in the Tonkin Gulf -Went to Subic Bay, Philippines in May 1967 for refuel and supply check -Got fresh groceries and their mail -Went up to the Tonkin Gulf after leaving the USS Long Beach -Got order to go “online” on June 3, 1967 -After that they were planned to go around the world and return to Charleston -Three days later those plans were voided because of the Six Day War -Station period (time spent in a part of the Gulf) was thirty to fifty days -Always at least six ships in the Tonkin Gulf -Soviet trawlers occasionally came into the Gulf -Soviets were gathering intelligence to give to the NVA -Could not engage the Soviet trawlers -Their station job was to use long range radar to keep track of friendly and hostile aircraft -Search and rescue if necessary -Keep the aircraft carriers safe from air raids -Also had 250,000 gallons of helicopter fuel for refueling -Their station was thirty miles south of the city of Haiphong -Moved in closer when bombardments part of Operation Rolling Thunder were being conducted -Worked with aircraft carriers during bombardments -Protect aircraft and protect aircraft carriers -They gathered radar information and fed it back to radar operators on board the carriers -They stayed in the Tonkin Gulf Theatre for about three hundred days (all toll) -Went stateside between cruises -1967 cruise was seven and a half months -1968 cruise was eight and a half months (00:11:33) First Vietnam Deployment-Staying in Contact -Got their news from Newsweek and Time -Knew that the papers were heavily biased -Far removed from the details of the war -Didn’t know how it was going -Any objective information about the war came from Navy newspapers -There wasn’t much news about the war though -Radar killed off long range radio contact with the outside world -Very isolated in the Gulf -Stayed entertained with movies and music (00:17:17) First Vietnam Deployment-Incidents and Daily Life -Had a helicopter crash into their superstructure -Rotor fractured and exploded and wounded a number of sailors -Came to rest on their flight deck -They stripped it of essential equipment then pushed it overboard -Other than the helicopter crash the 1967 cruise was pretty uneventful -Kept themselves busy by reading a lot (00:21:00) First Vietnam Deployment-Repairs and Leave -Went to Subic Bay for repairs -Stayed there for three weeks �-Toured around the base, but stayed out of the town -Went to Hong Kong -Locals welcomed the American money -Chinese scavenged food as their payment for painting ships -Went to Sydney, Australia as part of leave -Liked the people, didn’t like the warm beer -Stayed there for four days -Went to Wellington, New Zealand -Went to Stokes Valley and visited a friend that lived there -Stayed there for four days -Went to Tahiti -Far superior to Hawaii (00:28:02) First Vietnam Deployment-Return Voyage and Coming Home -After leave boarded the USS Wainwright and traveled across the South Pacific towards Canal Zone -Cut through the Caribbean Sea and headed up to Charleston -Arrived in Charleston on November 13, 1967 -Most sailors saved their leave for the holidays -Commanding officer left the sailors alone, didn’t expect much work out of them -Went home on Christmas leave -Got married to a girl he had been talking to prior to and during service -Brought her to Charleston and made her an official Navy wife (00:31:30) Second Vietnam Deployment-1968 Cruise -After being back for four months they had to leave for an eight and a half month deployment -Went to Pearl Harbor, then Guam for fuel -Went to Subic Bay for fuel and orders -Arrived in Vietnam in July 1968 -Went up to Da Nang Harbor for information exchange with the Marines -Returned to former operating area in the Tonkin Gulf -CBS showed up to do an interview with commanding officer (00:36:24) Second Vietnam Deployment-First Part of Being on Station -From August to September they were on station -Went to Subic Bay in mid-September -Went back to Hong Kong -Tropical storm rolled in -Had to leave twenty sailors on shore to escape the harbor -British Navy brought them up to Subic Bay -After Hong Kong went back to Subic Bay -Saw the battleship USS New Jersey in the harbor -Returned to their station in the Gulf (Yankee Station) and relieved the USS Sterett -By the end of October they were back on station -Operation Rolling Thunder ended soon thereafter -Sent to Sasebo, Japan in November (00:40:04) Second Vietnam Deployment-Second Part of Being on Station -Went back to area of operations for forty five days -Ending Operation Rolling Thunder lifted the stress on the sailors �-Went back to Subic Bay in early January 1969 -Went back across the South Pacific after that -Made the Mess Deck Master at Arms -Checked the new sailors’ hands to check for hygiene -Gave them a pep talk and a rundown of how things worked on the ship PART 3 ENDS AT 45 minutes and 12 seconds PART 4 (00:45:28) Second Vietnam Deployment-Incident at Okinawa -In October 1968 they were bound for Sasebo, Japan -Got an emergency call to go to Okinawa -Rescued civilians that were stranded onboard the SS Lindenwood Victory without a propeller -Towed them back to port at Sasebo (00:48:00) Second Vietnam Deployment-Return Cruise in Pacific -Went back to Subic Bay and then down through the Tori Straits -Waterway between Papua New Guinea and Australia -Thick fog -Took an hour to pass through -Passed behind the Great Barrier Reef -Went back to Sydney, Australia -Went to Auckland, New Zealand -Went back to Tahiti for refueling (00:50:33) Second Vietnam Deployment-Return Cruise in Caribbean -Went to the Canal Zone -Stopped at Rodman Naval Station in Panama for fuel and supplies -Allowed leave for three hours to visit the clubs -Got into the Caribbean Sea the next day -Stopped at St. Thomas -Captain’s order was to buy stuff for loved ones -Also told to buy a crate of liquor from a store called Sparky’s -Got a gallon of duty free liquor from Sparky’s (00:53:35) Return to Charleston -Got to Charleston in the late morning -Had leave orders -Wife met him in Charleston for several weeks of leave -Won the Anchor Pool -Lottery based on time of arrival in Charleston -Spent that money and leave for honeymooning -Visited wife’s family in Hamilton, Michigan -Returned to Charleston (00:56:47) Norfolk, Virginia and Operation Springboard -After a few months in Charleston the USS Wainwright was invited to Norfolk for a demonstration -May 1969 �-Went ashore and no one from shore patrol came to pick them up -Went to shore patrol headquarters and got things sorted out -Stayed in the shore patrol headquarters building -Went to Operation Springboard later in May -Marine training exercise in Puerto Rico (01:00:14) Warehouse Job in Charleston -Got attached to a supply warehouse detail -Never had to go to the ship -Inventoried everything -Putting new stuff on the shelves -Pulling old stuff off of the shelves -Put in a normal forty hour week -Job lasted for five months -Lived at home with his wife -Spent Friday nights together -Socialized with shipmates (01:04:40) End of Enlistment and Return to Michigan -Heard rumor that there would be a manpower reduction -Became official shortly thereafter -Wound up getting cut six weeks later -Some sailors had to go through refresher training -Others had to back to Vietnam including one sailor he knew -January 5 1970 was his final day of duty -Left Charleston an hour after cleaning out their apartment -Spent a night in Gatlinburg, Tennessee -Second day of travel they got caught in a snow storm north of South Bend, Indiana -Followed a truck right up to Hamilton, Michigan (01:08:25) Working after the War -Planned to take some time off -Wound up applying for job with the Heinz Company in Holland on January 11 -Went to work on the 14th as an electrician -Only got nine days of break time -Worked with the Heinz Company for seven years -Lots of veterans from WWII and Korea worked there; he was the first Vietnam vet -Worked at the Holland power plant after Heinz -Worked there until his 55th birthday -Retired after that -Got a contractor’s license after the power plant to keep him busy (01:10:52) Reunion Involvement-Pre Reunion Group -Didn’t talk about wartime experience or meet with other shipmates for a long time -Went to a picnic sponsored by the Vietnam Veterans of America -Started getting involved after that -Went to welcome home parade in Chicago for Vietnam veterans -June 1986 -200,000 Vietnam veterans showed up -Saw war buddies reunite in a hotel lounge and wanted to experience that �(01:12:34) Reunion Involvement-Formation of the USS Wainwright Reunion Group -Stopped at VFW Hall for a few beers one day after work -Talked with another veteran and decided to start his own reunion group -Started communicating with old shipmates -Planned Washington DC reunion in July 1987 -Six of them went to DC -Saw the Bicentennial Celebration of the Constitution -Largest fireworks display in history -Within two months they had eighty names -Had first reunion in Charleston in 1989 -By that time there were three hundred names on the list -Assembled roster of 3600 names spanning twenty six years of service -Reunion list now has seven hundred names on it -Went to Cincinnati in 1991 -Built an association over time -Was able to step back and compile history -Payoff was being able to see friends reunite -Wanted to be able to create a lasting legacy for the sailors (01:19:45) Reflections on Service -Navy provided him with technical training -Shaped him into the person that he is today -Fulfilled his drive to go to sea -Did an unpopular thing at an unpopular time -Camaraderie was formed because of that -Proud to be part of an honorable group of soldiers -Comfortable with being a veteran -Owns the situation, isn’t scarred by PTSD or guilt -Wants to know the stories of other Vietnam veterans -Wants to be in touch with what the ground troops endured -Attends other reunions besides the USS Wainwright reunion to stay in touch with other Vietnam vets � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carlson, John (Interview outline and video, 3 and 4 of 4), 2011 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Carlson, John Description An account of the resource John Carlson is a U.S. Navy veteran that served before and during the Vietnam War first aboard the USS MacDonough (before Vietnam) and aboard the USS Wainwright during the Vietnam War and saw action in the Gulf of Tonkin during Operation Rolling Thunder. He was born in Holland, Michigan in 1943 and enlisted in the Navy in 1961. He trained at Great Lakes Naval Academy and specialized in electronics. He traveled throughout the Mediterranean Sea aboard the USS MacDonough and the Tonkin Gulf and South Pacific aboard the USS Wainwright. He then had shore duty in Charleston, South Carolina, and left the Navy in January 1970. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American United States. Navy Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-10-17 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CarlsonJ1325V3 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/be62bc16d6bb4409aa185b2f51c60e34.pdf e183bd8f0008d409ce34c33a518c7109 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Program Carl Carlson (00:44:03) (00:08) Introduction • Born in Bailey, Michigan in 1922. • Attended a one-room schoolhouse through eighth grade. • Carl worked at Continental Motors during school. (04:48) Pearl Harbor • He remembers being in the barn and milking cattle when hearing over the radio of the attack. • He enlisted in the air force [Army Air Corps] in 1942. (05:55) Enlistment • Enlisted with his best friend in Muskegon, Michigan. • They were able to choose what branch of military service they wanted to join. • They were then sent to Texas for basic training. (06:54) Basic Training • Attended basic training around Dallas and San Antonio, Texas. • They received their basic training on air bases. • Attended gunnery training in Colorado Springs, Colorado. • Achieved the rank of a marksman while in gunnery training. • The men had to be able to take a .45 caliber shotgun apart and put it back together blindfolded. (09:10) Europe • 12th air force, 321st bomb group, 447th bomb squadron, while overseas. • Flew in a B-26 bomber to Europe. • He worked as a radio operator while flying. • They flew from Louisiana to Puerto Rico, and then from Brazil to Ascension Island, landed on the west shores of Africa, to Casablanca, and then to Italy. • Once they reached Italy, the men lived in tents. • The men were supposed to have served 25 missions and then they could go home, but they were taking such heavy losses to the air force that men had to serve around 70 missions. • He remembers being happy to serve his country. • The men described missions with no opposition as “milk runs.” • Remembers having a blonde lady painted on the front of one his airplanes. He describes these as serving a lighthearted function. (16:41) Tough Raids • He bombed a suspected German ammunition storage facility, which had very heavy anti aircraft fire. While it only lasted about five minutes, it seemed to last an hour. �He also bombed a Romanian oil field [Ploesti]. During this mission, many planes were lost. The enemy fire never seemed to end. They were bombing airports and ammunition dumps. • After one mission they found over 500 bullet holes in their plane. (18:50) Different planes • His first plane took a bullet that disabled the engine. • Another plane’s hydraulic system was shot out, disabling the landing gear. The crew was asked whether they were going to jump or fly the plane in, they flew it in. • Another plane lost radio contact and had a disabled fuel line. (20:38) Style of missions • the men did not know where they were going until they were on the plane about to leave on the mission. • They also flew about every other day on bombing raids. • After fifty missions, the men were allowed a break from bombing raids. (21:50) Dealing with the cold • The men were outfitted in fur lined coats and pants. • The only thing that was ever frostbitten was his ears. • It would reach 60 degrees below zero in the plane. • The cold never affected the gunnery in the plane. (23:54) Dangerous missions • The men had opposition on almost every mission. • A piece of shrapnel just missed his head, and was lodged into the side of the plane. • He believes his faith helped him carry on through the war. (25:00) Letters - His sister kept him very informed with letters during the war. (25:45) • Believes that war is hell. • He doesn’t think that any one aspect of the service is better than another. • He was very informed of the efforts on the home front while in Europe. • Carl was able to see Bob Hope perform while in Europe. He remembers him traveling very close to the front lines in order to help the soldiers. (28:14) - Salerno, Italy was a very hard bombing mission. The enemy was very persistent. (28:40) Length of Raids • Most raids were 4 to 8 hours. • This depended on fuel consumption. • They would have to bomb the target, circle it back over to see if they hit it, and if not bomb the area again. (30:00) Feelings towards Italians and Germans • Remembers the Italians being overjoyed to see the American military within their boarders and has fond memories of them. • Has no bitterness towards the German people, because it was not their fault, but the Nazi military. (32:18) Returning Home • �Came on the USS Mariposa. They landed in Boston Harbor. The first things he did when he reached home, was kiss the ground and bought some milk. (33:21) Pilot School • War was still going on in the Pacific when he reached home. • He was told that he might have to go on a Pacific tour. • If he would go to the pilot school, he would not have to go the Pacific theatre. • He attended the pilot school, and was a third of the way through when the war ended. • He took advantage of the points system and asked to be relieved of his duty after the war had ended. (35:30) Other memories • Was in at a carnival in Mississippi preparing to go to Europe. • A young group of women met up with his group. • He determined after a few dates that they were meant to be together. • They’ve been married for over 63 years. • Remembers while still in Europe that, after every flight the men would be greeted with a glass of whisky to calm your nerves. • Became a supervisor at Continental Motors after returning home. • He also began work in radio and television because of his radio experience during the war. • Continental Motors allowed him to have a leave of absence so he could take classes at radio television school. • He began working for Montgomery Ward in the service department. • He then opened his own business and became successful. • • • ��World War II Honoree Page 1 of 1 Carl M. Carlson BRANCH OF SERVICE u.s. Army Air Forces HOMETOWN Bailey, MI ACnVlTY DURING wwn RADIO OPERA TOR, WAIST GUNNER, B-25'S 12TH AIR FORCE. NORTH AFRICA, EUROPEAN THEATER, 70 MISSIONS, 3 YEARS SERVICE, 1 YEAR OVERSEAS. 1942-1945. http://www.wwiimemoriaLcom/registry1search/plaq.asp ?HonoreeID= 156357&print=y 5/31/2004 ��;.: ;{).'~7t!fi:ijifji2':'::"'::~?'~!i\:·:~j?{',':';> ":BaileY' Boj' In 'lJnl~ '. .. .Cited By freSldent, -~ d"S\i\11at.~ neWly l Y. w~.~·rlng. 1I.11'('.l).d • . 0 serVIC.e So'I'lpe ' T'lcnn .. ­ ed gold forel~n Carlson sen of' ,vs, cal Sgt. carl ~'E' carls~n of BIl.I\ey. and 1\·1rs, OUS o t':e' dls\.lngulsI1ed. unIt - noV' pin .. may '. \form, \ badge on hIs un, It the veteran T . Sgt, carlson 5 un r;up lias just \ :6-2'5 Mitchell bO:"~re~ident for "out­ been cited by :11 nee of d'Jty in ac- \ . 1 pcrt0 1D1 a stn,numg enemy," non against :he \.s serving r.s rad~o s<1t, Oall:;on . flown mOle T groUP has \ . l' t"le Mediterr a n -, o.unner. HIs. I:;SlOn5 11 jar " _ Ulan 4.DO rn now playing a rna ca n area and Is n m U11 ' CO tions behind ~ tt' g COl .. ~ role in cu' 111 'n Italy, .. the ,0,enna,n . lines 1 • 0 , �HEADQUARTERS ·­ AIR TWELFTH FORCE Carl M. r,arJson, Technical-Sergeant, Air Corps 321 t . st Bomba rdmen~, Group (M) by direction of the President, under the provisions of Army Regulation 600-45 as amended, and pursuant to authority vested in me by the Commanding General, Mediterranean Theater of Operations. <.titation For meritorious achievement while participating in aerial flight as radio gunner' of a B-25 type air­ craft during an attack upon a highvmy at Va1lecorsa, Italy, on 13 May 1944. Tecp~ical Sergeant Carlson's . proficiency in combat reflects great credit upon him­ self and the Military ~ervice of the United States. G.' O. No. 107, 26 .Ill]Y 19[14' JOHN K. CANNON Major' General, USA Commanding �ttbe lOol\1 Sepulcbre cernncare of " ~ilgrhnage. 'ttbe unoecetaueo, tbe IDer\? lRe"erenb arcblmanertte 'lltl]riaftos, $uar1;)ian anb Superior of tbe (Iburcb of tbe '!bolll s~re, bereb~ .~er~t~at -tf~ -------------~---4_~-.--.~----.-.------:-------------------------- ...--------------.-----------­ bas bul\? "isiteb tbe <tburcb of tbe bol\? Sepulcbre of our 10rb anI) Sa"iour leaus (!brist anb tbe other bol\? Sbrines witbin tbe :l3asilica of tbe bOI\? Sepulcbre ano as a lPilgrim bas maoe tberein bis pious oeeotlons on tbIs tbe / ~ bap of J une in tbe \?ear of @ur 10rb 1')!J!J; lIlIlbereOf tbis certirtcate signeb anc eeateo in tbe boll] (Iit\? of Jerusalem is a 'UUlitness. lIlIle pra\? ano beseech tbe Blmigbtp ano Eternal G~ tbat be will b ano salle tbis lPilgrim, anb \"'ill preserve bim trom "{}~f.,!~: ger. ... r . ~ , / g,f#;;.. . <, '.f" . t.".-..,,~.) Guarbian of tee "'aburcb of ree 1>0111 Sepulcbre �" Bailey.,.-Award of a bronze ba~ne star for his units parttctpattcnTn the French camapign has been made to T/Sgt. Carl M. Cartsorr, son of Grant E. 'Carison.'Ue is II I ,with the 12th'.air force headquar­ tersJn Italy. .. . ''"!. 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 I � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carlson, Carl (Interview outline and papers), 2008 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Carlson, Carl Description An account of the resource Carl Carlson is a veteran of the United States Army Air Corps. He served in the European theatre during World War II. He worked as a radio operator during flight missions, particularly over Italy. He served around 70 missions, the military had to increase the number of missions each man made due to the increasing numbers of casualties. While in Europe, he was able to see Bob Hope perform. After the service, he worked in electronics sales and repairs until he retired. Newpaper clippings and award certificates appended to interview outline. [Image not available]. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Troyer, Phillip S. (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans United States. Army. Air Corps World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2008-03-22 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CarlsonC Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4175bb268547604f5b343d9ef159c8c4.mp4 2bf2d5fd345fb20719f61902c6528fd1 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/fb52ee95549874ae6660a850767e551c.pdf 46a749b08b70f06689f84b96ca03c62f PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Cliff Carlon (01:02:34) (00:50) Background Information • • • • • Cliff was born in Grand Rapids, Michigan on March 14, 1921 There were six children in his family and his father had to trade their house in Grand Rapids for a farm in Wayland during the depression Cliff went to high school through fifth grade and then began working on the farm and carpentry work He later worked for the National Dairy Company in Grand Rapids Cliff was drafted into the military 6 months after Pearl Harbor was attacked; he was married and his wife was pregnant (4:05) Training • Cliff was sent to Fort Sheridan in Chicago for aptitude testing and they decided that he should be a mechanic • He then went to Augusta, Georgia for mechanic classes and was promoted twice before taking more advanced classes • He was also going through basic training but did not have to do as much work as others because they wanted him to focus on his classes • Cliff was working with Company B of the 692nd Tank Destroyer Battalion in Georgia for 3 months • He was then sent to Fort Hood in Texas for more training (9:30) Texas • They were working with WWI tanks that towed 37 mm guns that were impractical • He was later sent to Tennessee and worked with M-10 tanks that weighed about 32 tons with 50 caliber machine guns • Cliff was working with a cadre of 2 battalions and one of them was sent to North Africa while the other went to Europe • While in Texas Cliff had the rank of sergeant (13:30) Overseas • Cliff was sent to Philadelphia on a three day pass while waiting for the ship to be ready to leave from New York • The ship took longer than expected and he was able to spend 15 days in Philadelphia • They left right after D-Day on a British luxury liner and were on board with a company of nurses �They anchored in at Weymouth Bay in Southern England and left that night for Cherbourg, France (22:10) France • Their battalion was sent to a staging area near Paris around the occurrence of the Battle of the Dykes • Cliff later helped to clear the Germans out of the Netherlands so they could ship supplies North • They did not get heavy opposition in the Netherlands; the Germans knew they were losing and were dissolutioned • The people in the Netherlands were very appreciative of the US soldiers • Most of the towns were demolished in the Netherlands, France, Belgium, and Germany • There were still civilians in the Netherlands, but barely any in Germany until the actually crossed the Ruhr River • (25:45) Germany • The first town they took in Germany was Aachen • Earlier they had been in Belgium holding 3 cities during the Battle of the Bulge supporting the 104th Division • Cliff’s duties consisted of repairing tank engines and replacing old parts • They only had small damage from shrapnel and some wrecked tires, but nothing major from battle • Most of the Germans had run out of fuel and ammunition and stopped attacking • There was very little resistance once after the Battle of the Bulge and they were advancing towards the Rhine very quickly • They were not working as an attached unit and moved all over to where ever they were needed (32:10) Reconnaissance Transfer • Cliff volunteered to transfer to a reconnaissance company • He later decided that the volunteer was the worst decision he had ever made • He volunteered because he was young and foolish and did not get along well with the men in Company B • He worked ahead of the unit, always under cover and usually went out by himself, but sometimes with one other man • He used walkie-talkies to communicate and could get up to 20 miles ahead of the rest of the unit • Cliff would sometimes get pinned down in a town and would either have to take out the enemy or wait till night time to sneak out (37:15) Rhine Crossing �• • • • • Cliff actually crossed the river before the pontoon bridges were built and once he was There were many German planes scattered throughout the woods that they had abandoned once they ran out of fuel Cliff later crossed the Danube and arrived in Munich, but had gotten metal in his eye and had to be sent to a field hospital in France for 2 weeks While in Munich they cleared out the Dachau concentration camp There were about 50 car loads of bodies along the road outside of the camp and a few “walking skeletons” (41:35)Austria • Cliff was staying in a small mountainous town in the Alps working with the Army of Occupation for 90 days • They actually got to live in houses with civilians and they helped the men with their cooking and cleaning; they had time to go trout fishing • They were treated well by the civilians and they all got along well • The Austrians did not have much food and they really appreciated the men’s K and C rations (46:25) Post War • The men eventually took on so many prisoners, there were thousands and thousands of them and they did not know where to send them • The German soldiers were not in too bad of shape; they were old and young, with a couple of very old men • The SS troops were very cocky and thought that they were the epitome of a soldier • Cliff’s division only lost about 300 from about 15,00 men and they were very fortunate • Cliff did not have many points and thought that he was going to be sent to the Pacific • Just after leaving from La Havre, France he got news that Japan had been bombed (52:40) Discharged • Cliff was discharged at Camp Kilmer and began working at the dairy company again • He took some tests for the Grand Rapids Police Department and ranked in the top 10% • The GI Bill allowed him to start out at a higher position and higher pay and he eventually became captain • Cliff worked for the police for 35 years � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carlon, Cliff (Interview outline and video), 2008 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Carlon, Cliff Description An account of the resource Cliff Carlon was born in 1921 in Grand Rapids, Michigan. He was drafted into the Army in 1942 and trained as a mechanic. He served with Company B of the 692nd Tank Destroyer Battalion in Europe, and later transferred to a reconnaissance unit. After the Germans surrendered, Cliff was part of the Army of Occupation in Austria for 90 days before he was sent back to the US. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Byron Area Historic Museum (Byron Center, Mich.) BCTV Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans United States. Army World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2008-09-02 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CarlonC Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/a995c9a69305a51a5d08de8e08737cac.mp4 89c2b7fa4086f0d2f41a04c65cb244a7 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/95a726224d91fc7db4b82451d470fb20.pdf 51ae4f6bb8bc979d36be3a5f07179ff5 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Hayes Cargill World War II Total Time: 0:30:45 Childhood, Pre-Enlistment, and Post-War (00:18)        Born September 12, 1926 Attended South High and Davis Tech High School in Grand Rapids. Worked in some factories after graduation, and then went to umpire school in Cocoa, FL and then umpired minor league baseball throughout the Midwest and the south. Quit umpiring and umpired around the Grand Rapids area, and worked as an umpire for the Grand Rapids Chicks. Was drafted into the service at age 18. (23:32) Applied for and attended Junior College after the War. Is a member of the Veterans of Foreign Wars. Training (08:40)  Attended basic training and then attended airborne school at Fort Benning, GA and this lasted six months. Was then shipped to CA and then overseas in midAugust 1945. Active Duty (11:40)              Was in the Navy part of the Army Went to the Pacific as a Parachute Replacement Was in the Philippines for six months, and then docked in Yokohama, Japan. He worked on an LCM, which ferried seamen from their ships that were in a harbor to the shore. He worked in this capacity while he was in Tokyo. On weekend leave, he would play golf in Tokyo. Then went for a time into the Philippines and remembers all of the jungle around Manila. Never saw combat. Was awarded a medal for good behavior (15:30) Worked guard duty at times. For entertainment, the men would play softball and football during the day and watch movies at night. Would sometimes play pranks on the other men as well. Went from Georgia to California and then across the ocean to the Philippines. Was home in October 1945 on leave and was discharged officially in November of 1945. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cargill, Hayes (Interview outline and video), 2004 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cargill, Hayes Description An account of the resource Hayes Cargill was born in Grand Rapids, Michigan in 1926, and served in the Navy during World War II. He worked primarily on craft that took men from their ships to the mainland when they were at port. He worked in both the Philippines and Japan, but he never saw combat, as they were in theses areas after the war had for the most part wound down. After the War, he worked as an umpire for minor league and women's baseball. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Stephaie Horner (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American United States. Navy Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2004-12-17 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CargillH Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e44c6978405063b4feef61d89b27547e.mp4 d8935429d3ea62c311ef4200898c5601 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/17a2eaffb517520ffe5052a09d7c218d.pdf e7bd9bad0d83b9452c0654585a39a2bf PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veteran’s History Project War in Iraq Ben Cardenas Interview Length: (01:27:59:00) Early Life/ Early Military Experience (00:00:07:04)  Born in 1981 in Saginaw, Michigan, where he spent his childhood (00:00:07:00)  Both parents worked in the automotive industry (00:21:00)  Grew up in a family of 4 children (00:00:34:00)  Following his graduation from Bridgeport High School in 2000, attended Grand Rapids Community College for one semester (00:00:42:00)  Joined the Marines in 2001 (00:01:05:00) o Was drawn to the idea of enlisting to follow the generational family tradition (00:01:26:22) o Significant military history within his family including Spanish- American and Mexican- American wars (00:00:40:00)  Did not expect to become heavily involved in U.S. military duties (00:02:30:26) o Wanted to keep his lifestyle by maintaining a reserve membership, not active duty (00:02:30:00)  After the terrorist attacks of September 11th, 2001, began active training at the Marince Corps Recruitment Depot San Diego on November 13th, 2001 (00:03:11:00)  At the boot camp, they “strip you of your identity” (00:03:40:00) o Here, recruits are taught to be purely obedient (00:04:09:12) o Found it very difficult to adjust to the lifestyle (00:04:46:25) o Punishment was a collective burden to all recruits (00:05:18:00) o Camp used “incentive training” on recruits, which is similar to what is known as “hazing” (00:05:35:27)  Those in charge at the boot camp were “machines” (00:07:23:06) o Very demanding of the recruits, installing both respect and fear in new soldiers (00:07:35:00) o Appreciated his authority’s’ demeanor because at boot camp, he felt he had “something to prove” (00:07:43:00)  Certain pattern of diversity at the boot camp (00:08:00:23) o Boot camp population split largely between Michigan and Texas (00:08:01:12) o Most between ages 18 and 20. Anyone older than 20 was uncommon. (00:08:37:21)  Marine Corps boot camp lasted 13 weeks (00:08:59:19) o First week is an “administrative” week, where recruits are disciplined as a group (00:09:05:00) o Then comes “black Friday” where recruits are introduced to who and what the camp will actually involve (00:09:17:15)  By human nature, recruits would try to find “loopholes” (00:09:51:00) o Intensity must always be high, so new soldiers would “act” in a way that pleases the authorities (00:10:00:00) o Camp activities are “from sunup to sundown” (00:10:33:12) �o Camp activities are purposefully made more difficult and uncomfortable for recruits (00:10:43:00)  The goal of boot camp is to graduate as soon as possible (00:11:41:00) o Marine Corps is built on tradition and graduation ceremonies are highly respected events (00:13:10:00)  After boot camp, had 10 days of vacation and then went to the School of Infantry in Camp Pendleton for 8 weeks o More relaxed than boot camp, although it took time to detach from the boot camp mentality (00:13:58:00)  Infantry School included a significant amount of classroom time, contrary to popular belief (00:14:23:10) o Required pupils to learn things in mathematics, geometry, physics, and other fields (00:14:35:00)  Infantry school had fewer guidelines than the highly disciplined boot camp (00:15:16:00) o Authorities still managed to find ways to instill fear/respect in pupils (00:15:22:00)  There are 3 main weapon systems the platoon used: M-240G, M-2, & Bart 19 (00:15:41:24)  At the school, they were taught to handle the guns in groups(00:16:10:00) o The teams consisted of 3 members: a “Team Leader”, a “Gunner”, and the “Ammo Man”. All positions are held, respectively, according to level of experience (00:16:13:00) o The team leader, being the most experienced, deals with the most technical aspects of the weapon’s use (00:13:58:00)  The training terrain was mostly mountains and beaches, making the simulations much more treacherous (00:13:58:00)  Difficult to keep up with current events/location of deployed marines while in Infantry School (00:18:25:00) o Limited free time (00:18:27:00)  After Infantry School, you are assigned to a unit (00:21:06:04)  Went back home in May 2002 (00:21:58:00) Active Duty (00:22:30:00)  On December 26th, 2002, was alerted of mobilization (00:22:40:00) o Was only given 3 days’ notice, unlike today’s deployments, which are more scheduled (00:22:43:00)  Unit, (Alpha Company, !st Battalion, 24th Marine Regiment), reported to Grand Rapids for 3 days, then was transported to Germany for a few weeks (00:23:02:00) o In Germany, the unit was simply waiting to be transported again (00:23:25:06) o Was activated quickly because of outstanding health records (00:23:31:16)  Was then sent to Djibouti (00:24:20:00) o Throughout the transportation from place to place, the unit was confused as to why they were going there (00:24:22:00) o Stayed there for 9 months doing force protection, which is simply guard duty, during which time the invasion of Iraq was already under way (00:24:44:00)  Used chartered, commercial flights to travel (00:24:52:26)  In Djibouti, everything had a menacing quality (00:25:16:09) �o The wildlife was exotic and potentially dangerous (00:25:27:00) o Very hot climate (00:25:56:00)  Used tents for most of the time, as there were no established facilities when they arrived (00:26:24:00) o Things were being built around them, but they still had to live with minimal standards (00:27:15:00) o Despite unpleasant living standards, they were the only ones doing any real work on duty and thus were able to get some “perks” (00:27:41:00)  Did many humanitarian projects while in Djibouti (00:28:03:00)  Civilians also worked on the base (00:28:12:00) o Both men and women worked, as their culture was not very strict on gender roles (00:28:23:00)  There were some places to go for leisure in the town in Djibouti (00:28:50:00) o Had supervised trips into the city to the markets/etc. (00:29:01:13)  Took 6-7 months to establish effective means of contacting people back home in the United States (00:29:20:15) o Before other ways to communicate were found, “3 phones, 3 computers for…4 thousand people” (00:29:37:00)  After 9 months in Djibouti, got to come back home in September (00:29:52:04) o Everyone in the unit wanted to be stationed in Iraq very badly because the rest of their battalion was already there (00:30:08:19)  Stayed home for about 3 years (00:30:35:26) o During this time, there were several incidents where the men were told they would be deployed to the Middle East, but this never actually happened (00:30:40:00)  At home, continued to prep for what could await them in Iraq (00:31:35:00) o Tried to educate himself by attending military courses including advanced infantry, squad leader classes and went to the Defensive Language Institute for Iraqi dialect (00:31:38:20)  In May of 2006, was sent to Camp Pendleton for 4 months before going to Iraq (00:34:05:00) o Had to fill a training requirement before able to go to Iraq (00:33:22:00) o Also had to learn about how to handle civilians (00:35:50:00) Deployment to Iraq (00:36:49:00)  In September of 2006, was sent to Fallujah (00:36:51:00) o Was flown into Kuwait first, where the unit was then put onto military planes (00:36:50:00) o Then traveled to a desert region west of Fallujah (00:37:07:00)  First thing noticed when off the military plane was the very distinct smell (00:37:18:00)  Was then loaded onto a military utility truck and drove to Fallujah, which was a very frightening experience due to the regional fighting that they had to travel through (00:37:51:15)  Upon arrival in Fallujah, was surrounded by a “parade” of security forces (00:38:37:20)  Fallujah is similar to what happens when you have a “nice middle eastern city and step on it” (00:39:10:21) o The Battle of Fallujah left “almost nothing” (00:39:15:00) �           o The population was about 300,000, were trying to repopulate the area after the battle of Fallujah (00:39:33:00) First job in Fallujah was called SASO (Security And Stability Operations) (00:39:58:00) o Job was basically “whatever they needed us to do” (00:40:05:02) o Collected a census, where they walked door- to- door and kept track of who was in each home (00:40:13:00) Because had language skills, was a military advisor as well (00:40:22:00) o Was part of a “MIT” team (Military transition team) (00:41:25:00) o Did this for two months before becoming involved in SASO (00:41:35:20) o This job involved doing “whatever the Iraqi captain wanted to do”, and operated separately from other forces (00:41:40:00) o Difficult to communicate because of the language barrier between Americans and native Iraqis (00:42:01:00) The environment was more dangerous because the equipment was not the best and they were often in the city, which was the least safe in the area (00:42:33:24) o Was called the “Iraqi Death Box” (00:42:30:00) o Area was laden with Sheiks and Sunni hostility (00:43:08:21) o Police were very corrupt (00:43:26:00) Every day at noon, their living quarters were mortared (00:44:06:27) Was happy to be attached to an Iraqi force because they were able to help make improvements (00:44:49:04) o Being in Iraqi company allowed a “loophole” for Americans that could not perform certain necessary duties (00:45:23:08) o Shared American technology with the less privileged Iraqis (00:45:40:00) The Iraqi company was then moved, so the Americans were not needed after that and he was moved back to join the rest of the American company (00:46:11:29) o Began to do the same duties as the rest of the company such as the census, patrolling, raids, and arrests (00:46:29:00) o Instead of just trying to find something to do, was now a part of the company mission (00:46:47:00) On Christmas day, had a raid mission in Alpha company (00:47:07:00) Was never able to get heavily involved in the missions of Alpha company (00:47:17:00) o Mostly assumed an advisory position, and was “never really on the offensive, I was always on the defensive” (00:47:19:09) Was with Alpha company from Christmas until late April of the following year (00:47:48:20) The company was divided into different tasks by platoon (00:48:03:09) o One task was the “long ops”, where men would “live off the land” for roughly 2 weeks and gather intelligence (00:48:08:00) o Another task was the “short ops”, where men were stationed at the FOB, [Forward Operations Base] or “base”, on Euphrates River where they would also gather intel on short missions (00:48:22:00) o Another task was FOB security (00:49:10:00) o Another task was entry control, where men were in charge of who was entering the region (00:49:19:22) Company was frequently subject to open fire (00:49:56:24) �         o According to procedure, FOB security was the first to react when under attack. This was generally the point when the opposing forces would cease fire (00:50:17:02) Difficult to get permission to use alternate sources of weaponry (00:50:41:24) o All the men stationed knew how to use firing support, but were unable to use them. Much potential for the community was lost because of this (00:50:43:10) o In time, were able to use equipment more freely (00:50:05:00) A village called Hasa was particularly hostile towards those directly involved in the fighting each time American troops went there (00:51:46:00) o Did not follow typical Iraqi fighting styles, and actually wanted to put up a fight (00:52:11:00) o In this situation, were able to call upon heavier weapons company (00:52:50:00) o Regardless of Hasa’s bold demeanor, the company was always able to maintain control in action (00:54:01:26) Company lost a total of 5 killed with another 25 wounded out of approximately 160 men (00:54:41:17) With all the basic equipment, any given man had to carry about 60 pounds of gear (00:56:20:13) o With other things such as the “daypack”, or backpack, a man’s gear weighed around 80 pounds (00:50:40:00) o All of the gear was evenly distributed on the soldier’s body, although the weight still made it difficult to move about (00:56:54:00) Large temperature fluctuations made it difficult to adapt to the environment (00:57:20:00) Uniform material was “old fashioned” and didn’t take well to moisture or provide much heat (00:57:51:10) Men were “everyday sick” (00:59:05:00) o Being “sick” did not excuse you from duty. You had to be in critical physical condition, such as loss of a limb (00:59:17:00) Dust, a geographical characteristic of Iraq, was an issue for both weaponry and the men’s’ health (01:00:01:00) o Soiled instruments and weapons were not replaced when got extremely dirty. Marines were expected to do what was necessary to keep them functional (01:00:30:00) American troops began to make “friends with the enemy” after responding to trouble in a tribal city West of Fallujah (01:01:20:00) o In one region of the city, there was an especial amount of open fire due to a lack of peace between the local leaders and the Al Qaida leaders, who were mostly foreigners, when the latter party began to try to force their beliefs on the community (01:02:07:00) o At first, did not know who the two fighting parties were because there was “no friendly party” (01:03:07:00) o Americans began to seek intel from the local Iraqis, who were technically an enemy, but not in this situation (01:03:47:00) o Was difficult to accept the same people who had tried to kill them as a source of valid information (01:05:45:00) �o This alliance quickly mended the situation and helped things get on track towards peace (01:06:32:00) o In this situation, Americans “weren’t even the targets”, as a truck full of chlorine gas drove right past some marines and detonated it in the village (01:07:50:00) o Started to trust the Iraqis at this point, and began to use language skills to form a stronger alliance with them (01:08:43:00) o Wouldn’t have done anything to gain the support of the village population or perform regular procedures because then, the Marines would have become targets and casualties would have increased (01:09:14:15) o Building an alliance with other coalitions made intel easier to gain (01:09:53:00)  Americans and Iraqi alliances would coordinate things together (01:10:27:00) o The “good bad guys” had a leader who had sit-downs with Marine leaders (01:10:30:00) o Marines would show the Iraqis the “hot spots” (01:11:00:00)  The alliance really worked (01:11:34:00) o Didn’t know if the Marines did something technically wrong, but the system worked (01:11:36:00) o “We won our war” by empowering the local government and restoring authority (01:11:40:00) Post-Deployment (01:12:30:00)  Was overseas until April 2007 (01:12:30:10)  After that, went back to California (01:12:34:00) o Did some brief training there, and then “I was done” and went back home (01:12:40:00)  After leaving Iraq, was always following current events (01:13:20:00) o Especially interested in where had been stationed (01:13:25:00)  5 months after leaving, the city of Fallujah had become peaceful (01:13:35:10) o A general was able to walk down the street without any armor (01:13:36:00) o A Kentucky Fried Chicken was built (01:13:41:00)  Had news reporters tag along while on missions (01:14:16:00) o Would “make them miserable” just for the fun of it (01:14:17:00) o Reporters were always professional and stayed out of the way of the soldiers (01:15:02:00) o Was only able to see the documentary of the Christmas Day raid (01:15:13:00) o Seemed like Baghdad always got the attention in the media, and it wasn’t really a hot spot at the time (01:15:43:00)  “I left a good example” during the time overseas (01:16:40:00) o Got to solve many problems (01:16:46:00)  Becomes a part of the VFW, or Veterans of Foreign Wars (01:017:45:00) o Works there full time after returning home (01:17:53:00) o Involved in all sorts of operations including non- profit and financing maintenance (01:18:00:00)  Would like to become educated in journalism or economics (01:18:22:00) o Before enlisting, was going for chemistry, but is not interested in that anymore (01:18:27:00) �     One hard thing about adjusting as a war veteran is losing all the authority you had overseas now that you have returned to society (01:18:56:00) o Become something of a “kid” compared to where you stood in the foreign lands (01:19:17:00) o Economically difficult too because few skills transfer over into an American trade (01:19:47:00) War is highly glamorized by popular media, especially movies (01:20:37:04) o It’s not a captain who is calling all the shots, it truly is a “corporal’s war” (01:20:45:00) Marine Corps is “forever” (01:21:37:20) o Coming out of Iraq, everything has “slowed down” compared to how life used to be (01:22:00:00) o Tough to come back and feel that you may not ever be as important as you were overseas ever again (01:22:13:10) o Veterans are now the easiest to get along with (01:22:21:00) o Feels like “I can accomplish so much that nobody really knows about." (01:23:10:00) “Older” than the people who were not Marines (01:23:48:00) o Marines do not look like they are portrayed by stereotypes. They look young (01:24:11:00) o “The world looks at us differently” (01:24:58:00) “I’m proud of what I did” (01:26:10:00) � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cardenas, Benjamin (Interview outline and video), 2011 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cardenas, Benjamin Description An account of the resource Ben Cardenas was born and raised in Saginaw, Michigan. , he joined the Marines in 2001 after one semester at Grand Rapids Community College. Following the terrorist attacks on September 11th, he was sent to Djibouti in 2001. He remained there for 9 months where he was primarily involved in force protection. He returned home for a brief time and was deployed to Fallujah, Iraq in September of 2006. While in the Middle East, Cardenas was involved greatly in military advisory because of his advanced communication skills. He and his comrades were able to gain a level of trust within the community, which became a catalyst for the city's advancement and unification. 5 months following Cardenas' retreat to the United States, Fallujah became a completely peaceful and functional city. Cardenas stayed in Fallujah until April 2007 when he returned home. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) WKTV (Wyoming, Mich.) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings United States. Marine Corps Iraq War, 2003-2011--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-09-08 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CardenasB1248V Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7392f975f9ce1f738eb52c68dd2d2c60.mp4 898dd4fba5f738e8024dd620417afe2a https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/c12cfa2a4272cd3908f647a2afcfe5b0.pdf 28ae55d345b19ad69e74d07095ad6c5c PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veteran’s History Project World War II Richard Cannon Interview Total Time: 34:45 Background  (00:11) Born in Gary, Indiana, in 1925 o Went to high school here also, graduated in 1943  (00:24) Dad was a custodian, mom worked in hotels  (00:42) Grew up in a ghetto-like neighborhood o Mostly Hispanic people and blacks; just a few whites  (1:10) Mentions that most people had jobs here, some people migrated from the south  (1:23) His parents came to Gary in 1922  (1:36) Remembers hearing about Pearl Harbor o In 1941, they were in an auditorium and heard the president speak about it o At that age, Mr. Cannon says he was eager to go into the war, only 17 at the time o Didn’t say anything to his parents about it Drafted/Training  (2:28) Was drafted after high school  (3:00) Worked in steel mills on weekends in high school  (3:16) Got drafted and went in sometime in July of 1943 o Reported to the Gary Armory o It was a processing station here, then he was sent to Indianapolis and inducted  (3:53) The group he was drafted with from Gary were all black men from his neighborhood, and In Indianapolis they were segregated from the white recruits  (4:28) Assigned to the Navy at Indianapolis to Company 1082, 14th regiment, 16th battalion � (4:56) Went from Indianapolis to Great Lakes, Illinois, for training  (5:30) Got a good reception at Great Lakes, it was an all black unit with a white commander o Black drill instructors  (6:16) Mr. Cannon didn’t have a problem obeying orders  (6:28) There were a lot of physical training o Calisthenics o Basic training included a lot of climbing up barriers, ropes, etc.  (7:00) Taught how to leave the ship when it was on fire  (7:16) They were taught how to firefight  (7:30) Exposed to poison gas o They were taken to a little house and had gas masks on  (7:54) Didn’t go out on the lake during basic training  (8:10) Boot camp was 6-8 weeks  (8:23) They were sent to a receiving station at Burlington, Washington o Left on a train o Remembers stopping in Butte, Montana o Missed the train after they left the stop, but a sheriff helped him catch the train o It was scary because Mr. Cannon didn’t want to be AWOL o Here, they were also segregated o Mr. Cannon mentions that he saw signs that said “No blacks allowed” o Was here a week and a half o A lot of black seamen came through First Assignment  (10:38) Then went to Whidbey Island, stationed here for quite awhile o It was mostly for PBY’s; planes that landed in water o These planes were used a lot during this era �o Taught how to signal, recognize certain planes, how to navigate small and medium sized boats  (12:44) He had a crew of 4 men, talks about a seaplane that crashed  (14:00) At this point, black men had regular Navy jobs  (14:25) During a torpedo retrieving mission o They used 30-40 ft YP boats o Torpedoes were dropped o They picked them up with ropes and brought them back to the base o One time the torpedo surfaced and hit a YP boat o They got the 4 guys off the boat before it sank o YP’s were wooden boats  (16:25) He was the only one from Gary that was assigned to the boathouse, not sure where the others came from o Mixture of whites and blacks o Wasn’t a problem here  (17:25) On Whidbey Island, nobody cared about race, but Mr. Cannon said it was bad at Burlington  (17:50) Mentions that his last 6 months of service were in Pearl Harbor  (18:00) Probably on Whidbey Island for a year  (18:18) He mostly stayed on the base o Sent money home to his wife  (18:48) Mentions that guys went into town when they weren’t supposed to; got in trouble for drinking, etc.  (19:10) Wrote letters back and forth with his wife  (19:48) They got newspapers which allowed them to keep track of the war  (20:02) They showed movies on base, including newsreels  (20:22) Learned how to splice cable ropes o Went aboard ships, scraped the deck, etc.  (20:44) Said there was a swimming test they passed at Great Lakes �o Most of the guys passed it Next Assignment  (21: 45) Went to Schumacher, California and then to Pearl Harbor  (22:07) Went on a troop transport ship to Pearl Harbor  (22:33) Ethnic mix  (22:53) Went here for maintenance, saw the USS Arizona o The oil was still coming up  (23:15) Got to go along the beaches of Hawaii o Hawaiians were very friendly  (23:31) Stayed here for a few weeks Third Assignment  (23:34) Mr. Cannon was stationed in the Marshall Islands; Eniwetok  (23:54) Mentions that going to Pearl Harbor, they went through a very rough storm o He was on the bottom bunk, the guy above him was heavier and Mr. Cannon got seasick  (25:27) Eniwetok was a big rock; lots of white sand o 120 degrees o A lot of rain o They had to desalinate the water  (26:19) Mr. Cannon was on standby here; they trained on certain boats  (26:57) He was on Eniwetok when Japan surrendered  (27:22) Life on Eniwetok was laid back; they went to church, movies, regular work, etc  (28:07) They unloaded ships here also  (28:36) After the Japanese surrendered, Mr. Cannon got to go home earlier because he was married, had more “points” �Home  (28:54) Landed in California  (29:54) He says the most challenging part of being in the Navy was being away from home, he was still very young at the time  (30:17) Wife lived with her family while he was gone  (30:39) Mr. Cannon didn’t really experience negativity because of race o This was when they started having more black officers o Mentions that there were more on Eniwetok  (32:05) Got a job with auto parts after being discharged o Worked at a Ford dealership in the parts department o A couple years later he was the manager o This has been his job for the last 50 years  (32:40) Didn’t feel any different by the time he was done in the Navy o He did feel more mature, though  (33:18) Says that while he was stationed on the boat, he was his own boss  (33:55) At the time he wasn’t encouraged to stay in the Navy, possibly because they wanted to make the armed forces smaller � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cannon, Richard (Interview outline and video), 2011 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cannon, Richard Description An account of the resource Richard Cannon was born in Gary, Indiana in 1925. He was drafted after high school in July of 1943 as part of a group of black draftees from his neighborhood. Mr. Cannon was assigned to the Navy. After training at Great Lakes Naval Station, he was sent to Whidbey Island, Washington, where he commanded a small boat used to retrieve torpedoes from training missions. Later on, he was stationed at Pearl Harbor, and then at Eniwetok in the Marshall Islands. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings United States. Navy World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-11-11 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CannonR1323V Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d3b922b4e7c2fafd9089c35573954818.mp4 d8680cec09a83d2feb51ae6fb0bd6108 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/6d0b4462b7556b5d0259f9a2a79cf90a.pdf 8a20d40af7db324671d7afad98ebe2a6 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans Histroy Project John Canepa (49:02) (00:01) Background Information • John was born in a small town in Massachusetts in 1930 • He went to Catholic elementary and high school for two years and then went to a secondary school at a private military academy • At the time he had been concerned with preparing for college and not the military • His father had been in the Navy during World War I • John was attending college at Harvard and near graduation when the draft went into effect • He decided to join the Navy based on his father’s experience; he would rather enlist in the Navy then be drafted into the Army (2:45) Navy Enlistment • John went through some physical testing in Boston and was accepted into the Navy one week later • He was not able to attend his graduation ceremony at Harvard and received his degree in the mail • He took a train to Rhode Island and arrived at an officer school base • The Navy Waves barracks were right across the street (5:25) Training • Training was a very big change for John; they had to get up every day at 6 am for attendance and march for one hour • They had classes all day long and then did more drilling afterwards • John went through technological training, navigation, and gunnery training • He received a demerit for not sitting up straight in class • John spent 90 days in officer school from May till September • His parents and girlfriend attended his graduation ceremony and he got married two days later (8:15) Selection of Assignment • After graduating, future assignments would be given based on specialties • John chose to join the Amphibious Force because he though it would be exciting working with the Navy, Marine Corps, and the underwater demolition teams • John then traveled to the Naval Amphibious base in San Diego for amphibious training • First he had training for survival at sea, where he trained in a swimming pool all day long, in a full uniform, for three weeks • John was then assigned to a ship in Long Beach • He had amphibious training on a landing ship, working with Marines • John was also working in an underwater demolition area �(13:40) USS Comstock • John was issued a room mate in the living quarters and began bunking with the ship’s physician • He was in charge of the Combat Information Center, or CIC • They were working on sea trials for four weeks and making necessary changes to the ship • John was in the lower part of the ship working with radar equipment • He traveled to Japan, when the Korean war had just ended • They spent two weeks in Japan and then visited Korea (20:05) French Indo-China • The French had just lost the battle at Dien Bien Phu and the Americans were helping to evacuate the French army, which took a very long time • They were also evacuating civilians that did not want to live under communist rule • Many of the French were covered with ringworm and many of them had scurvy • The Vietnamese refugees had been very oppressed and most of them were women and children • John returned to Japan again for six weeks and then traveled to Alaska to pick up some men from the Army (27:30) Transferred • John was transferred to work on a landing ship of Division 2 in the San Diego Station • He was second in command and in charge of eight ships for about six months • The Navy had been in the process of decommissioning many ships • He was transferred again to Virginia where he had a landing ship staff job • John worked with 2 divisions and 8 landing ships • He worked with the commanders of the division and traveled to Cuba (33:30) Discharged • John was discharged six weeks early and continued to work in the reserve for three years • He was promoted to the position of full lieutenant • John continued to grow in his banking position and no longer had time for the reserve • He had become a much more responsible and accountable person while in the service • John learned leadership skills and how to get along with a very diverse group of people � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Canepa, John (Interview outline and video), 2004 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Canepa, John Description An account of the resource John Canepa was born in Massachusetts in 1930. He attended Harvard University and enlisted in the Navy near graduation and just barely missed the Korean War. He attended officer school in Rhode Island and was later assigned to work in the Naval Amphibious Force. John traveled to Japan, Korea, and Cuba while in the Navy. After he was discharged he remained in the reserve for three years. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Boring, Frank (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans United States. Navy Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2004-10-14 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CanepaJ Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/ab51bbbba24af2c248d96915b2bdbdf9.mp4 4ca9a52c0c6d7985b9d476d6f75a68eb https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/8fb0131c04d5d07ae1b9b0be2912ac66.pdf e900abf0a5f88a9e55c86cba5b31e17e PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Vietnam War Tex Campbell Length of Interview: 52:23 min (00:17) Background Information Born February 20, 1949 in Grand Prairie, Texas (00:20) Father in oil drilling business, moved around frequently (00:44) Father was in World War II, North African campaign (01:45) After high school worked in the oil drilling rigs (00:50) Was working in the drilling rigs when drafted by Army (00:56) (01:20) Draft/ Training Sworn into Army April 10, 1968 (02:25) Drafted at age 20, most drafted straight out of high school (01:25) Sent to Fort Bliss, El Paso, Texas for basic training 8-9 weeks (02:00) Training was easy, in good physical shape from rigging and had hunted all life (03:25) Sent to Fort Ord, California for advanced individual training (05:30) Learned how to use M-16, bazooka, mortars, and fire hand guns (07:00) Training didn’t prepare him for Vietnam (09:10) (10:00) Active Duty Flew from Travis Air Force Base, California via Anchorage, Alaska, and Tokyo, Japan, to Bien Hoa, Vietnam (10:35) First impression was that is stunk; had an unforgettable smell (10:55) When the plane landed the base was under rocket attack (11:13) Issued fatigues and jungle boots put in 101st Airborne Division Delta Company (12:00) Received 5 days of preparatory training to get in Vietnam mindset (13:05) Flew to Phouc Vinh where delta company base was located (14:30) When arrived at company referred to as “fresh meat” (15:00) Put as ammo bearer and made friends with a machine gunner (16:00) During night patrol, put on listening post, and claymore went off, thought fired upon (17:10) Patrolled the Cu Chi area everyday rain or shine and sent ambushes every night (19:15) First combat assault, dropped off by helicopter, everybody fired weapons, except him because he couldn’t find the enemy (19:45) (20:00) Transfer to Camp Evans Left Phouc Vinh and transferred to Camp Evans late 1968 (21:20) Booby traps were grenades in a can with trip wires (22:27) While patrolling rice paddies encountered booby traps (23:00) In the A Shau Valley everything was uphill and covered in thick jungle (24:40) Encountered minimal opposition from enemy, sporadic fire-fights (25:45) While in the mountains carried the M-60 machine gun (26:25) Enemy would usually ambush them and then quickly retreat (27:00) �Discovered abandoned enemy training facility with wooden RPGs (28:05) When encountered enemy complexes/ bunkers destroyed them (28:50) When flying into a hot landing zone, had to get off helicopter as fast as possible (29:15) Never had any idea of their location or where to call in medical evacuation if needed (30:25) Usually in field for 90 days at a time and went to base for a 2 day break to resupply (31:41) Fire bases under attack from mortar fire and enemy would reposition target each time (33:45) Received C-rations and sundry pack (cigs, pen and paper, soap, sewing kit) on fire base (34:30) Many soldiers were infected with jungle rot infection, treated with fungicide (35:45) Got fresh water from mountain streams and bomb craters (36:30) (45:00) Post Service Vietnam tour ended in late August 1969 (40:40) Attended Combat Leadership School in Australia while on leave (41:48) Never forget first guy see killed or when best friend dies (44:00) Flew out from Bien Hoa to Okinawa, Honolulu, and Travis Air Force Base, California (45:54) Encountered protestors that spit at them when got off plane (47:05) Sent to Fort Carson, Colorado, and assigned to 50th Ordnance Company (48:02) Assigned to project transition being a carpenter’s assistant (48:45) Went to work in oil rigging after leaving service (50:00) Became emotionally closed off (51:00) � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Campbell, William (Interview outline and video), 2012 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Campbell, William Description An account of the resource Tex Campbell was born in Grand Prairie, Texas, in 1949, and was drafted into the Army in 1968. After training in Fort Bliss, Texas, he was sent to Vietnam and assigned to an infantry company in the 101st Airborne Division. His unit patrolled around Phuoc Vinh and Cu Chi for several months, and then moved north and operated out of Camp Evans. His unit spent most of its time in the field, and was involved in actions in the A Shau Valley in 1969. Upon his return from Vietnam, he spent the last part of his enlistment at Fort Carson, Colorado. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings United States. Army Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-10-04 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CampbellT1454V Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e9020e0be762834d7d10926988bf15bc.mp4 f3c91846aa4cd47b0a7ba9a93ab1f76b https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/56670fb4c6d22c04fa6d8d9cc266a971.pdf 65bedc2bcbe96a9f939a06546a8eba27 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans’ History Project Jim Campbell Vietnam War 1 hour 27 minutes 54 seconds (00:00:15) Early Life -Born on August 26, 1946 in Santa Barbara, California -Family moved to Shreveport, Louisiana shortly after he was born -Grew up there -Father was a doctor -Mother was a housewife -Graduated from high school in Shreveport in June 1964 (00:01:20) College -Went to Louisiana State University in Baton Rouge -Thoroughly enjoyed it -Graduated from there in June 1968 -Majored in political science -Intended to go to law school at the University of Texas -Had been in Army ROTC (reserve officers’ training corps) at LSU -Planned on joining Navy ROTC at University of Texas (00:02:35) Enlisting in the Army -Returned to Shreveport in the summer of 1968 -Found out that a friend had been drafted -Friend wanted him to join the Army so they could be a part of the “buddy system” -They’d be able to train together and possibly be deployed together -Eventually joined the Army -Friend failed the Army physical -He passed the Army physical (00:03:56) Basic Training -Attended basic training and AIT (advanced infantry training) at Fort Dix, New Jersey -Trained with typical recruits -Men from all over the country -Most were in their late teens -Appointed squad leader because of age and ROTC experience -Had some disciplinary problems with draftees -Basic training lasted eight weeks (00:05:54) Advanced Infantry Training -AIT also took place at Fort Dix -Training was more focused on infantry training and weaponry as opposed to discipline -Because of Army ROTC at LSU he was slightly accustomed to military life -Drill sergeants had been to Vietnam -Higher ranking officers had not been to Vietnam -AIT lasted eight weeks �(00:07:57) Officer Candidate School -Took OCS at Fort Benning, Georgia -Course lasted six months -Consisted of daily harassment to break down officers and prepare them for stress -Went out on field maneuvers -Felt that he didn’t learn much -Felt that the OCS program was essentially worthless for the Vietnam War -Didn’t teach officers how to lead soldiers in fighting an insurgency -Training was more focused on how to fight a conventional war against Russia -Graduated from OCS on April 24, 1969 (00:11:15) Fort Lewis, Washington -Assigned to Fort Lewis, Washington as a rifle instructor -Assignment lasted about half a year -Taught AIT companies how to use the M-16 assault rifle -Mostly worked on the shooting range -Worked with sergeants that had been to Vietnam -Got to know them, but they didn’t really open up about Vietnam (00:13:45) Training for Vietnam -Knew nothing about Vietnam or the war prior to going over -Received orders for Vietnam and to be sent to “jungle school” in Panama -Given thirty days of leave before flying out of Charleston, South Carolina for Panama -Felt that “jungle school” was far more practical and useful for fighting in Vietnam -Taught how to read maps and how to set up ambushes in the jungle -Received training from combat experienced, Vietnam veterans (00:15:00) Deployment to Vietnam -Flew out of Travis Air Force Base, California -Landed at Bien Hoa Air Base in Vietnam -Stayed at Bien Hoa for a couple days to go through the 90th Replacement Battalion -Got assigned to the 101st Airborne Division and did orientation training at Bien Hoa -Received training with how to be deployed and extracted by helicopters -He was taken by C-130 to Phu Bai and from Phu Bai by truck to Camp Evans -Assigned to C Company,2nd of the 506th of the 101st Airborne Division -Appointed as a platoon leader -By now it was November 1969 (00:18:11) In the Field Pt. 1 -Assigned to Charlie Company and joined them at Firebase Bastogne -From there moved to Firebase O’Reilly -Troops under his command initially had anxiety due to being led by an inexperienced officer -He was cycled through the company leading each platoon -Had a black sergeant who was tremendously helpful introducing him to leading in Vietnam -Charlie Company stayed at Firebase O’Reilly until the end of December 1969 -Moved out of the foothills so that helicopters could extract them -Returned to Camp Evans for a stand down on January 1, 1970 (00:23:28) In the Field Pt. 2 -At this point Captain Vazquez takes command -No nonsense kind of man and a magnificent leader �-Shaped the company into an efficient and effective fighting force -Under his command they worked in small, tight knit groups in the field -Seldom worked as a full platoon, or as a company -Learned a lot about leadership from Captain Vazquez -Patrolled the Lowlands during the monsoon season -During this time he led the first platoon to enter the mountains -Got stranded for a couple weeks due to bad weather -Had no significant enemy contact during their time in the mountains (00:28:32) Establishing Firebase Ripcord -He was in Charlie Company when Firebase Ripcord was established -Third company to be sent in to establish a firebase there -On April 1, 1970 they established Firebase Gladiator -Supposed to support the assault to create Firebase Ripcord -Strategy didn’t work -Dropped into a landing zone east of Firebase Ripcord -Attacked Ripcord two days after that -His company was finally able to secure the hilltop and begin building Ripcord -Under Vazquez’s leadership Ripcord was designed to be nearly impenetrable -Created modified wire fences that surrounded the entire perimeter -Impossible to get over or go under due to design -Took one month of all day work to build Firebase Ripcord (00:35:46) In the Field Pt. 3 -Went back into the field in May 1970 after completing building Firebase Ripcord -Spent a few weeks in the field -Patrolled the area surrounding Ripcord -Operated as full platoons at this time -Comprised of roughly twenty five to thirty soldiers -During May there was no significant enemy contact -Started finding evidence of North Vietnamese/Viet Cong presence though -Field hospital and bunker complexes -Went to Firebase Ripcord mid-June for a stand down -Returned to the field shortly after that -Noticed a massive spike in enemy activity -Left the field after only ten days due to orders to take an R&R (00:40:43) R&R and Returning to the Field -Took his R&R in Sydney, Australia -Stayed there a week -Thought that after R&R he’d be able to go back to Vietnam and get a rear position -Returned from R&R to Camp Evans on July 6, 1970 and was sent back to the field -Greeted by a jeep that immediately took him back to his unit -His unit had been overrun and sustained heavy losses while he was gone (00:42:40) Working with Jeff Wilcox -Met Jeff Wilcox [new company commander, who replaced Capt. Hewitt, killed on 902] in the field and began working with him -Learned that his unit had taken severe losses at Hill 902 -Soldiers under his command welcomed him back due to this �-The next day they started carrying out maneuvers in the field -Had to move to where Bravo Company had established a mechanical ambush (landmines) -Bravo had returned to Ripcord without retrieving the landmines -Three soldiers from Bravo were sent out to extract the landmines -Got ambushed by the North Vietnamese, wounded, and stranded in the process -His company was responsible for extracting the wounded soldiers from Bravo Company -Worked with Jeff Wilcox during that operation on July 6, 1970 -Remembers that the Vietnamese were taking shots at the medevac helicopters coming in -By the end of all of this his company was down to thirty combat ready men (00:47:52) The Battle of Hill 1000-Insertion and Assault -On July 8, 1970 his unit was dropped into a landing zone near Hill 1000 near Firebase Ripcord -Worked with Jeff Wilcox and Delta Company to assault the hill -He questioned Colonel Lucas’s order to assault the hill -Told that it was to retrieve dead U.S. soldiers -Moved towards the hill under the cover of U.S. air strikes and artillery bombardment -By the time they reached the hill it had been turned into a wasteland -Received cover from gunships as they moved up the hill -Upon approaching the hill and moving up it they began to receive heavy enemy fire -Once he and his company reached the top of the hill he was able to create a battle plan (00:54:16) The Battle of Hill 1000-Retrieval of the Dead -After reaching the top of the hill they received orders from Colonel Lucas to move down the hill [across saddle between the 2 peaks of the hill--D Company was supposed to be coming up the other side] -Ordered to a low position that left them vulnerable was strategically insane -Met with Jeff Wilcox and tried to create a strategy that would allow Delta Company to aid them -Wilcox took charge of his company and led them down the hill -Campbell and his company provided covering fire -Had only thirty men to work with -Started taking rapid losses immediately -His medic was killed almost instantly -Able to retrieve the dead and wounded at the bottom of the hill and pull back to the top (00:59:59) The Battle of Hill 1000-Extraction -A recon helicopter flew over and alerted them of large enemy movement towards their position -Received orders from Colonel Lucas to move to an extraction point -Able to move off of Hill 1000 towards the extraction zone under covering fire -They were late getting back to the extraction point -Most of the troops were wounded, exhausted, and/or dehydrated -Colonel Lucas arrived at the extraction zone and gave orders to assault the hill again -Campbell argued that it would make no sense -Operating with only twenty soldiers and no medic -All the soldiers needed time to rest and regroup -Knew that given twenty four hours of rest they could take the hill -Wilcox exploded at Colonel Lucas for the order -The second assault was called off -Led to Wilcox being relieved of command of his company though (01:08:01) In the Field Pt. 4 �-The survivors were taken back to Firebase Ripcord to rest and provide security -He and his unit were at Firebase O’Reilly when they heard that Wilcox had been relieved -Despite the losses incurred at Hill 1000, company was sent along with D Company to rescue D Company, 1st of the 506th on July 21 -By the end of the Ripcord Campaign the battalion structure had been wiped out -Needed to be rebuilt over the course of a long stand down (01:11:46) Camp Evans -After the Ripcord Campaign he was given a rear position job at Camp Evans -Worked in the Tactical Operations Center there -Stayed there until the end of his tour -Worked as a rear liaison officer -Felt that it was a pretty useless position -Just spent his time waiting to be sent home -Enjoyed being able to eat better at Camp Evans and being allowed to drink beer -Noticed severe morale/race issues while at Camp Evans -He never had any issues with any of the black soldiers in his unit -Only one, but it was under extenuating circumstances (01:16:11) Coming Home -Boarded a plane at Camp Evans and flew down to Cam Ranh Bay -Drank with old friends from OCS at the officers’ club -Had to stay an extra day in Vietnam due to a mix up with the passenger manifest -Flew into McChord Air Force Base, Washington -Was able to go on leave without going to Fort Lewis due to officer status (01:17:47) Fort Polk and End of Service -After leave he was sent to Fort Polk to be a training officer for advanced infantry training -Tried to prepare soldiers for the reality of fighting in Vietnam -Got reprimanded by superiors for not following program guidelines -Demoralizing experience -Got offered to reenlist by a 3 star general from the Pentagon -Given option to be deployed to anywhere he wanted to be -Ultimately declined the offer (01:20:03) Life after the Army -Got discharged from the Army in March 1971 -Went to Europe for the summer of 1971 and relaxed -Went to law school in September 1971 -Didn’t pay much attention to the anti-war movement when he was home -Attended law school for three years -Graduated from law school and started practicing law in Shreveport, Louisiana in 1975 -Had no problem readjusting to civilian life -Credits that to friends back home that provided a support network for readjusting (01:21:45) Involvement with Ripcord Association and Reflections on Service -Didn’t talk about his experiences in Vietnam until later in life -In 1981 he went to the VA (Veterans’ Administration) to deal with issues from Vietnam -Friend from Delta Company gave him an old commander’s number -Got in touch with him and attended the Ripcord Reunion at Fredericksburg -Now an active member in the Ripcord Association �-Credits his success as an officer to the soldiers that served under him -Did their job and followed orders well even in terrible conditions � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Campbell, James (Interview outline and video), 2013 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Campbell, James Description An account of the resource Jim Campbell was born in 1946 in Santa Barbara, California, and grew up in Shreveport, Louisiana. He attended Louisiana State University and graduated in 1968, and then enlisted in the Army. He did his basic training and advanced infantry training at Fort Dix, New Jersey, and then went on to Officer Candidate School at Fort Benning, Georgia and graduated from the program on April 24, 1969. He served as an instructor at Fort Lewis, Washington until he was deployed to Vietnam in November 1969. He was assigned to the 2nd of the 506th of 101st Airborne Division as a platoon leader in C Company. He and his unit would go on to establish Firebase Ripcord and later participate in the infamous battle in the summer of 1970. After Vietnam he was stationed at Fort Polk until his service ended in March 1971. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American United States. Army Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2013-10-12 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CampbellJ1540V Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/b9440b17d053dae479fb45b800245856.mp4 12a1299fa95a3e27f9080e02fe75fc08 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/9c0b2654b3af899fe83afa88d6966316.pdf 93c5bc9d8a1f27ba8b14813a5f1f2f25 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Eleanor Cameron (00:30:40) Introduction: (:30) Born in Shaker Heights, Ohio. (1:00) She went to school in Miami University school of fin arts. (1:15) Met her husband her freshman year in Miami (1:20)She got a job as a fashion illustrator in a Cleveland department store (1:35) 1941 her husband joined the national guard to do his year of service (2:10) After Pearl Harbor she decided to become a WAVE (2:44) Her husband was in Chicago (3:39) Her husband was on a train to go to California to go the Philippines there was a snow storm that held up the train so he did not go to the Philippines. (4:34) He went to Fort Benning so he went to officer candidate school (5:25) She decided to have a baby instead of being a wave he went over seas and she went home to have the baby. She did not see her husband again for two years. (7:01) She reads a story written by her husband. Her husband was in a firefight in Italy near the Rapido River crossing when he was hit by a artillery shell. The Americans who could move retreated, and he and the other badly wounded men were found in a ditch by a German patrol. The leader of the patrol spoke English, treated the wounded courteously and then moved his men on, only to return later badly wounded himself. The Germans withdrew and Americans eventually found them, so the German became a prisoner. After the war, the Mr. Cameron saw a new story about a German prisoner who had escaped from prison camp and had been living under an assumed name in Chicago, where he ran a bookstore and was raising a family. Mr. Cameron testified on his behalf at his deportation hearing, and the families stayed in touch thereafter. The German, Reinhold Pabel, eventually became a published author, and lived in the US for some time before finally retiring to Germany. �(15:43) She is discussing how they started to correspond with the German solider. Her husband was in the hospital for nine months. (17:07) After healing up he went to the Riviera where he was in charge of the rest and rehabilitation of officers. This was a good job to have. Lived in the Carlton Hotel. (17:55) He came home after this. (19:01) After the War he became a successful businessman. (20:24) She talks about following her husband around before going over seas She says that the war was an adventure traveling all over. (22:48) After going to Fort Benning she lived with all the men’s wives. She did not like living in the south. 25:00) She went back and forth between their two parents’ houses. (25:42) she talks about seeing her husband again two years later. She talks about seeing her husband at the train station. (27:28) Pearl Harbor: She did not even know where Pearl Harbor was in 1941. She was an isolationist, and did not like Roosevelt at the time. (30:40) She thought it was necessary to drop the bomb. She thinks Truman had no other choice. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cameron, Eleanor (Interview outline and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cameron, Eleanor Description An account of the resource Eleanor Cameron is the widow of Malcolm Cameron, 3rd Infantry Div. who served during WW II. In this interview she discusses her life as a military wife, her husband's experience and injury while serving in Europe, and their life together after the war. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) Video recordings United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Army spouses Military spouses Other veterans & civilians--Personal narratives, American Women Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-06-03 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CameronE Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/81bf210b02c2ea1177aca9d44852785f.mp4 af2acea543852f468e205aabe1297a0d https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4ab40b382017539d2b65379a4461fb57.pdf 3b0b9eb4f6e82b1c12b5b54fb9000b6a PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Notes Length: 1:03:57 Glendle Gene Callahan Korean War veteran United States Army; February 1951 to November 1952 Field Artillery (0:00) Before grade school • Born in Draper, North Carolina in 1930 o Town is not there anymore; now called Eden • When 6 years old, moved near Mars Hill, NC; out in the country • Started school here • Callahan and his family met up with another family and farmed together o About ready to harvest the wheat crop when a big storm came and destroyed the crop o Callahan’s dad never farmed again (3:48) Grade school • Went to school in Mars Hill • One day, rocks fell on school and the school fell apart • Had to hold school in a different building until it was fixed • Before building was fixed, Callahan moved to Flatcreek, NC where he lived until high school • Throughout grade school, played marbles o One day Callahan played against and older boy who ended up winning all of his marbles. Callahan didn’t have his marbles with him so the boy said he would stop by Callahan’s house later to pick them up. Because Callahan didn’t want to give up his marbles, he begged his mom to ask the guy to let him keep his marbles. Callahan’s mom did ask the guy and the guy let Callahan keep his marbles. o During the winter time, Callahan would practice marbles on the bed, on the floor o He was one of the best marble shooters at school (7:35) How to play marbles • Either play ring or bull’s eye; would try to knock the other guys marbles out of the ring (9:44) High school • Played some baseball o Best “sport” was marbles, though • Very involved with theater o Got the lead role both his junior and senior year ƒ Each play was 3 hours long • Didn’t go to prom • Used to have cake walks • Used to love to watch the basketball team; went to many of the games �(17:25) Graduation • Graduated in 1948 • Got sick right before graduation • Rushed to the hospital (20 miles away) the day before graduation • Had appendicitis • The day of graduation, he was operated on • Did not attend the graduation ceremony although he was the Valedictorian; somebody else read his speech for him (19:14) Pearl Harbor • Didn’t have a TV or radio; heard about Pearl Harbor at school • Was sitting by the windows and someone said that Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor (20:21) WWII • Remembers rationing and food stamps • Didn’t have a car so the rationing of gasoline was a non-issue for his family (21:28) First job • After graduating in 1948, got a job at a department store in NC and made $18.75/week o Lived at home and paid parents $5/week for room and board (22:58) The draft for Korea • Went to Nashville, TN for a weekend with his friends • When got home, his dad handed him an envelope with a draft letter inside • Inducted into the Army February 5, 1951 (24:10) Induction • Went to Charlotte, NC and took an exam, then sent to Baltimore by train o Saw lots of guys in uniform there o Stayed there 5 or 6 days and got clothes, etc. • Sent by train to Fort Rooker, Alabama for training (26:15) Boot camp • Did a lot of marching o One day, a large group was told to march across the street double time. Some soldiers did and some soldiers didn’t; Callahan was one of the guys picked out of the group who supposedly weren’t marching double time. As punishment, Callahan and a few other men had to go to bed immediately after dinner and clean their rifles in the bed. (27:31) After boot camp • Volunteered to go to Korea o Didn’t like Alabama because too hot and the other men in his outfit were rough guys from the Dakotas (28:47) Korea • Sent to Washington (state) and marched onto the boat, which was shipped to Korea • Some people got really seasick but Callahan never got seasick • Landed in Japan and Callahan was sent to school to learn to operate a bulldozer o Didn’t want to drive bulldozer because heard too many stories of drivers getting shot at in the bulldozer �o Talked to the guy who was head of the school and said didn’t want to drive bulldozers because he had never owned a car and never driven machinery in his life and was way behind the others school (all of which was entirely true) o The head of the school conceded and sent Callahan to supply school for 4 weeks of training; then Callahan was sent to Korea • Part of Field Artillery o No. 223?, 5th army ƒ Ordered all the stuff needed by the soldiers like alcohol, cigarettes, and other supplies (34:10) Combat • Never saw combat because worked behind the lines • Spent lots of time playing horse shoes • some friends were on the front lines o Callahan met one of his school mates, who was on his way out having been wounded • Callahan got depression when over in Korea • Some days, could hardly do work • Fought depression ever since (37:10) Home • Discharged November 6, 1952, the same day Eisenhower was elected as president • Come to South Carolina by train • Stayed in SC on guard duty for 2 or 3 months (at this time, Callahan was a Sergeant First Class) (39:29) Guard duty • Most people didn’t like guard duty or felt it was necessary to participate • Callahan shares an incident that occurred during guard duty (42:00) After the service • Got a job at Cadillac Motors o day after Christmas Callahan was down at the pool hall when he ran into a guy from school o guy from school heard that there were a lot of jobs in Michigan o so Callahan and his friend drove up to Michigan o got hired by Cadillac Motors • worked there for 36 years o started as a laborer, then apprenticeship, then the die room o he worked in the plastic department as their only die maker (46:54) Marriage • Met wife at church in Michigan • Starting dating at which point he bought a car • Often they went up to Canada together • Dated a little over a year • Got married at her house in Detroit on Alexandrian Street o Her dad was retired from mining (51:26) First years of marriage �• Rented an apartment in Detroit • then moved to various places around MI • had 2 kids – a girl and a boy • he and his wife have been married almost 50 years (55:56) Masonry • Joined the Masons in January 1970 at the Temple Lodge in Detroit • Transferred to a lodge just outside of Detroit because an easier commute • Became master in 1982 (1:02:02) How the military and Masonry affected his life • In the Army, learned people skills • Masonry also helped in this area � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Callahan, Glendle Gene (Interview outline and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Callahan, Glendle Gene Description An account of the resource Glendle Callahan served in the Korean War in the United States Army from February 1951 to November 1952 in Alabama and Korea. In this interview, Callahan tells of the day he received his draft letter and why he volunteered to go to Korea after being at Camp Rooker, Alabama. Once overseas he attended supply school and became involved in the Field Artillery. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Collins Sr., Charles E. (Interviewer) Collins, Carol (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American United States. Army Freemasons Veterans Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-05-15 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CallahanG Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/5362f3df21b05f7d53403f09c5aa84fb.mp4 995e68668a21ff729e5fc15375325269 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/88da67e21346c0a589e2d0e787a07382.pdf 3dfcd81395126ccd983fec0fce723a40 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Keath Cady (00:43:24) Introduction • Lived in Illinois prior to war. Worked at Kroger’s grocery store. Entry into Service (1:56) • First days in service were horrible. Went to a train station in Chicago, and was put in charge of getting group of people to Fort Sheridan for testing. After testing he was sent to Texas for basic training. (2:39) • Had 13 weeks of medical training in South Carolina as was certified to work in surgery and with the ill. (3:54) South Pacific (4:49) • Left San Francisco on a ship that had been dry docked for 25 years and traveled to a French island in the South Pacific where a lot of people had malaria and stayed 3 days. • When Cady arrived at Guadalcanal, malaria patients were left out in the rain. Seabees set up a large tent to house patients. Cady talks about the treatment of malaria. (5:48) • Cady talks about the back-and-forth nature of the fighting on Guadalcanal and attributes the Japanese numerical superiority there to the attack on Pearl Harbor. Briefly talks about treating wounded soldiers (6:46) • Japanese were left to starve, due to U.S. bombing of Japanese supply ships. Japanese on the island would eat bananas, hunt for wild pigs, and fish. When Japanese soldiers were very hungry, they would try to get in the mess line where they would be wrestled down by other soldiers, and sent to the stockade. (7:50) • Japanese would often yell at soldiers that they were going to cut their throats, and would sneak in at night and do so. (9:10) • Cady recalls the food being horrible except at Thanksgiving and Christmas. Cady states that there was no milk for months until some could be brought from New Zealand. The soldiers ate lots of raw coconuts, chocolate bars, and hardtack. (9:46) �• Cady talks about the Potsdam conference (11:23) • For fun the men played softball and ping-pong. Every weekend they could send V-mail. (12:22) • On Christmas, Thanksgiving, and December 7th, turkeys were brought in from New Zealand. (13:02) • Cady talks about pre-war American attitudes about themselves and the Japanese as well as God looking out for America (13:49) • Cady mentions having had 30-day furloughs if had been in the army for a while. (15:07) • Cady talks about the Philippines, General MacArthur, and the Bataan Death March (15:29) • Cady made close friends during the war that he kept in contact with, but doesn’t attend reunions because they mainly drink. (16:43) • Talks about soldiers dying from drinking a beer made from coconuts, (17:56) • Cady discusses being aboard ship and describes an opposed landing. (18:35) • Mentions that during basic training they were made to sleep with their guns if the guns weren’t clean. (19:40) • Served with 1st Division medical corps. Participated in 11 invasions. Would disembark from LST’s in waist-deep water, and pick up wounded for transportation back to ships. (20:28) • Cady says that when U.S. forces build installations on British and French Islands in the South Pacific, they had to pay a fee of $50 per tree. (21:45) • Cady describes setting up medical stations and equipment, and the duties of the Seabees. (22:37) • Describes living conditions on Guadalcanal with four men living in a tent adorned with Japanese skulls. As well as a visit from Eleanor Roosevelt who demanded that the skulls be removed and the bathrooms covered. (24:28) • Men would back water from Manila in helmets which could hold a gallon of water. Once a week on Mondays a van would come so that the men could take showers. (25:35) �• Cady tells about delivering a baby, right after which an air raid occurred. (27:02) Germany (29:15) • Cady contracted malaria in the Philippines and was sent home. After he recovered he was sent to Germany as part of the occupation force where he met his wife. • Army had taken over school and turned it into hospital. In the morning they treated soldiers, and in the afternoon civilians. When civilians wanted to work with the American government, they had to have shots and tests. At the time, if a person didn’t work, that person didn’t eat. (30:10) After Military Service (32:48) • Most memorable moment was wafting to be discharged. Cady was discharged at Fort Hamilton in New York, and was given 10 cents a mile to get home. • Cady recalls that there wasn’t any work when he got back. He worked at a Kroger grocery store, and then went to work at a drug store for $35 a week. Military Anecdotes (34:36) • Cady tells about having a pair of shoes stolen, but he couldn’t get replacements unless he had the old ones to turn in, and was told to steal some to turn in. • In the Philippines, Cady was a Staff Sergeant, and had a pass to travel 50 miles in any direction from where he was stationed. (35:50) • Describes a day in Army life (36:36) • Cady tells a story about having unexploded Japanese ordinance turned into an ashtray (37:53) • Cady gives his thoughts on U.S. foreknowledge of Pearl Harbor and the Japanese ability to conquer the island. Cady also talks about Japanese spies, the USS Arizona, and the Bataan Death March. (39:00) � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cady, Keath (Interview outline and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cady, Keath Description An account of the resource Keath Cady served in the medical corps during WW II. Cady was on Guadalcanal and the Philippines and describes conditions there. After the war, he served in the army of occupation in Germany. In this interview Cady talks about treating malaria patients and setting up medical facilities during amphibious invasions. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ruiz, Olivia Mercedes (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American United States. Army. Medical Corps Philippines Guadalcanal, Battle of, Solomon Islands, 1942-1943 Veterans Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-05-29 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CadyK Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/c78104f2e74b83d091cbddb45b3cffc0.mp4 78fb2d47b22c16f45ecacb2a3012286a https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/175d619efd1f64d4421e3cc1b2c80e10.pdf 6da96e1dfb7ddfdb8285dba0cf7c85dd PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veteran’s History Project Air Force, Korean War Darwin Cutler Length of Interview (00:10:30) Background Born in St. Louis, Missouri Father was a CPA and a farmer; mother was a school teacher His older brother was also a school teacher and farmer Had family that served in different branches of military Enlisted into the Air Force  Everyone was either being drafted or enlisting Training (00:01:27) In September 12, 1950, sent for training  Had to get evaluated and medically examined  Training involved running obstacle courses, gun training, etc.  It rained often where he was training  Didn’t have any specialized training at this time Adapted pretty well to the military lifestyle  Learned a lot about mechanics and honed his problem-solving skills Served in numerous bases: Lackland AFB for basic, Mather Field in California  Mather Field: operated a library  Went to Texas, Sheppard AFB, for mechanical training  Then sent to a Duty Station near Washington to work on four-engine military air transports � Sent to the field in West Palm Beach, Florida o Would walk on the beach often Did transports to Europe; were often in the air for long periods of time  Would sit behind the Co-pilot as Flight Engineer Primarily worked as a Specialized Mechanic and would do inspections and repairs for airplanes Sometime would operate as a Flight Engineer  Always flew with different people  Operations would inform them who they were flying with Met quite a few people in the service, didn’t stay in touch with most of them afterwards After Service After the military, was glad to be home Didn’t have much to readjust to, job in the service was much like a civilian job Had to go through a lot of training after basic (00:07:00)  Learned aircraft mechanics, basic mechanical work  At his duty station, always attending school to advance his grade After the Air Force, took a four-year course in being a machinist for railroads His time in the military gave him the ability to solve problems and handle stressful situations Uses a lot of the things he learned in the service in everyday life Kept in touch with his family through letters Took trips to Alaska, delivered troops (to Korea) and merchandise � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cutler, Darwin (Interview outline and video), 2010 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cutler, Darwin Description An account of the resource Darwin Cutler enlisted into the Air Force in September 1950 and trained as a Specialized Mechanic and sometimes operated as a Flight Engineer. His job was to work on aircraft engines and transportation during the Korean War. He was based in the United States. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Clark, Mackenzie (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American United States. Air Force Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2010-06-06 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CutlerD Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0d60b9f6d41c5ee70575eee781a345fd.mp4 3a7dc7b4d18e50321e9edacce735b77c https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/187c5e15a432523b38f7abe76172e3bc.pdf ee54d0699a1a874edb4586aa10b96cb6 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Norman Curtis Vietnam War Total Time: 33:25 Pre-War (00:10) • • • Born in Albion, MI in 1946. Joined the Air Force in March 1966. Joined the Air Force because his older brothers were in the Air Force and he wanted to get away from school. Training (02:22) • Remembers basic training as being rough, but the instructors were fair. Active Duty (03:25) • • • • • • • • • • Served at Tan Son Nhut Air Force Base in Saigon. (3:45) Also worked as an instructor for a survival school at Eglin Air Force Base in Fort Walton Beach, FL. Remembers how hot Vietnam was when he got off the plane. He worked in Vehicle Maintenance for all of the branches of the Army. He had to check the vehicles before he performed maintenance on for booby traps that the Vietcong would place. Stayed in touch with his family through recorded tapes and letters. Most of the time, he ate off base because the two times he did eat on base he got food poisoning. He, for the most part, liked his officers. He had one friend that was injured and lived, but he never saw him again. He was given the option to re-enlist, finish his service (he had 23 days left), or leave then. He chose to leave. Post-Service (19:30) • • • • He was in San Francisco when he got discharged. He went to school on the GI bill when he got back, and worked part time. He didn’t stay in contact with many of the men whom he served with. Joined the American Legion when he returned. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Curtis, Norman (Interview outline and video), 2004 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Curtis, Norman Description An account of the resource Norman Curtis served in the Air Force during the Vietnam War. During his time in Vietnam, he worked at Tan Son Nhut Air Force Base in Saigon. His job was vehicle maintenance and recovery, which kept him for the most part on base but he did spend some time retrieving disabled vehicles. He also worked for a time at a survival training school at Eglin Air Force Base in Florida as an instructor. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Brenner, Allison (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings United States. Air Force Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2004-12-15 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CurtisN Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/b37c20fbdfda8aca71b95a3df2c4d259.mp4 fa0023d3419a92df5502f0c412992bb5 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/916466f5ea298ced70fe5ed99e5f7371.pdf 288884a0c92b00bffefe333aa8986074 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Randy Curry (02:38:00) (43:00)Washington D.C. • Born November 19, 1944 • Father was in the military for 23 years. He was the head dietician at Walter Reed Hospital • When he was two he spent 3 years in Bettelheim Germany where his father was stationed • (2:50) He began school in Germany. He took the bus to school. • He had a maid in Germany named Elsa • His parents took him for a walk and his dog was ran over by a truck • Came back on a ship to the states • (4:36) Remembers the ship was big and he was seasick • Went to Sandia Base in New Mexico • They lived in Albuquerque where he took his first communion • He started first grade here and remembers it was really hot (6:40) Fort Riley, Kansas • They lived in Junction City for 6 months before being given base housing • His father was an officer here so they lived in the officer quarters • Randy remembers that he had to eat salt tablets daily • (8:25) Remembers going to Manhattan, Kansas, close to Fort Riley • Stayed here for about 2 years (9:23) Raymond, Washington • Father was sent to Korea. They stayed with the Nevitts in Washington who had two daughters and a son • Lived here for 6 months • The school was at the end of the block. He remembers being a crossing guard for the school. (12:30) Milwaukee, Wisconsin • Randy’s dad decided to retire while in Korea, so when he came home they moved to Wisconsin • St. Peter and Paul Elementary School 1955-58 �• • • • • • Randy went to the seminary his freshman and sophomore year. His parents moved to Lacrosse, Wisconsin, during the same time. He decided that being a priest wasn’t right for him so he went back home and his dad was transferred back to Milwaukee. Started school at Pius High School and graduated in 1962. He wrote a few articles that were published in the school newspapers (17:50) Remembers at graduation having a picnic and it was hot His father retired from the Army as a Major Randy was anxious to leave home and join the service (19:00) Randy joins the Navy--Milwaukee, Wisconsin • Randy’s father signed for him to join the Navy at 17 years old even though he had apprehensions. Because he was in the military, his father was able to swear him into the Navy. His father also swore 2 of Randy’s friends in since they went in under the buddy program (20:37) San Diego California-Boot Camp • Randy and 11 other guys went first class on an airplane to California • Chief Petty Officer Pierson was his Commanding Officer • Randy became a squad leader right off the bat because of his history with the military • Remembers boot camp was vigorous: fire safety drills, procedure to wash and dry your clothes aboard a ship, drills on the blacktop, rifle training, • (23:40) After 5 weeks they go over to a camp called Camp Nimitz where they live out of cement buildings and hand wash and dry there own clothes and basically rough it • After 4 weeks they go back to main base and are allowed freedoms • At graduation they did the manual at arms and all the divisions and companies came together in a great stage • Randy put in to be in A school- torpedo man • Went home for two weeks on leave. He took a train home • (27:58)The Zephyr train had a car that you could climb upstairs in and look out at the sky through a glass dome • Randy took a plane back to San Diego (28:50) Torpedo Maintenance School • Randy attended classes teaching you the basics of electronics and electricity • Was allowed to look at the insides of dummy torpedoes but wasn’t much training on them �• • Randy passed school with an A after twelve weeks and put in for submarine school Went home again for a two week leave (29:39) New London, Connecticut--Submarine School • They had a nuclear submarine called the Nautilus • Went on board conventional submarines and learned what tight quarters are • Randy decided that he did not want to be on a submarine and that he wanted to see daylight a little more often. • He said you slept in the torpedo room and the mess hall consisted of two tables with a few chairs; you couldn’t eat with anyone since they took turns rotating • (32:00) Their training consisted of swim training, depth training from 50 to 100ft depths • Randy dropped out after 2 months (33:20) Port Mayfield, Florida • Randy was assigned to a destroyer • Randy had to request permission before boarding the ship and then he was shown his quarters in the ASW [anti-submarine warfare] compartment • His division consisted of Torpedo men and Sonar men • There was 25 men in his compartment with a 3 tier rack of beds • The beds were tubular frames with a canvas stretched over them with a 2 inch mattress that you slept on. Once on the bed there was a 6 to 7 inch space between you and the bunk above you • In the morning the guys would always say the same thing. “Heave out, Heave out…” (35:20)Aboard Ship • Each rack would turn their bed at a forty five degree angle so they could get underneath to get into their locker. • Randy was a Seaman Apprentice at this point • Up the ladder was the ‘head’-toilets, sinks, and two showers • When they woke up they had to shower, shave and clean the area for an hour before breakfast which was at 7:00a.m. • (38:00) Chow line went passed the kitchen where you ordered your eggs how you liked them, then you went to the mess hall where you were given grits or chipped beef on bread �• • • • • • • • • • Usually the new guy got mess duty where you would have to clean up the tables after people ate. You were given this duty for two weeks to a month before a rotation was done If not on mess duty you would do chores for eight hours with lunch in the middle (41:30)They had a Mark 15 and a Tripod on board and his job as a torpedo man was to maintain the 4 torpedoes inside the tripod on each side of the ship They had to undo the hatches three times a day and record the temperature, check the straps on the torpedoes so they didn’t come loose, maintain the decks by painting and repainting the boards Navy gray. They painted once every 6-7 months. They corroded quickly There was a helicopter hangar that they also had to maintain. It had mesh netting that was over the hangar, which they would have to scrape and paint black. It was a continuous process. (44:55)The sonar men had a better job and were up in the sonar room which was air conditioned. They traced sonar that reverberated off of anything in the area. There was a rubberized area that would receive those receptions. They could plot what it was, where it was going, and how close to them it was. The guys in the torpedo room would man the torpedoes and let the sonar men know that the torpedoes were ready so they sonar men could fire at targets in the area that they were in fear of either hitting or were a threat to the ship They had tests they would perform with the torpedoes where they had a submarine in the area and they would fire a torpedo at the ship, track its movements and at the point of impact it would shut down and rise to the surface for a tracking team to locate and recover with a motor whale boat. Once recovered they would have a recording ship check the torpedo to see where it went and how close it came to impact. Randy said they lost more than they recovered because of treacherous waves. (48:05) Once found they were refurbished and ready to go back out to the ships. Not necessarily the ones you sent out. They would dock at ‘GitMo” (Guantanamo Bay) for leave and go to gentlemen’s clubs and drink a lot and came back on cars called camel bars. Many times there were fights on the cars. The beaches were nice there and Randy said you could feed the iguanas popcorn and they were friendly. There were areas you couldn’t go beyond because it was under Cuban government and was hostile with Fidel Castro in power. (51:30) Port-Mayfield Florida • Randy was on the ship for approximately three years. �• • • • • • His home port was Mayfield, Florida. They got liberties here at night but had to be back by midnight. Weekends had 48-72hour leave unless holiday where you could get 96 hour leave. They hung out at the beaches in Florida on leave. They wore civilian clothes while they were off the ship and kept them in lockers in Florida. Sometimes they bought their civilian clothes on credit. (53:45) Randy and two other guys had an apartment in Jacksonville Beach for them to sleep at on their liberties. Only a mile to the center of town where the bars and restaurants were. Randy remembers while on leave a house behind his was on fire and it woke him up. He went to help with a garden hose and climbed up on a shed to reach the roof of the house adjacent to the house to keep it from burning down. Randy was seen by an officer in the military who wrote a letter to his superiors who gave him a commendation for doing what he did with the fire. (56:55) Randy’s compartment was just above the frozen food compartment. People were unloading turkeys for Thanksgiving dinner. Randy was going on liberty and took a frozen turkey to his apartment and had a Thanksgiving party complete with Bloody Marys to serve. Randy said the day he got out of the military he went around to the officers aboard ship and the chief cook told him he knew where that missing turkey went to. Randy finished his duty on this ship. (1:00:00) Stops out at sea • He made a cruise to the Mediterranean which took 37 days to get there. He was in the 5th Fleet and went to Sicily, the island of Malta, and Naples. He was a driver for officers who went into town for shopping or work. In France he took his captain to Normandy where they saw the landing sites. • (01:02:45)There were a lot of plaques at Normandy but not remnants. Overwhelming feeling of pride with Randy as he walked on the shores. • Randy said 10 guys who originally jumped off a plane in 1944 on Normandy shores re-qualified in 1998 for a 50th anniversary of Normandy where they jumped again and landing on the shores. One of the guys was Roger Williams. • Went to Nassau, St. Thomas, Guantanamo Bay, Key West (1:04:35) Midshipman Cruise • They went across the east coast picking up guys who were going to become officers in the Navy. They were treated very well, did work aboard ship, but were a class above enlisted crewmen. Went to Oslo, Norway, on the cruise. Randy said it was beautiful. Had to be on the ship by 11:00p.m. There were no real bars in Oslo. �• • • • (01:06:45) From there they went to Le Havre, France. Then off to Antwerp, Belgium, where the tides were 12-17 ft every day. Portsmouth, England, was the next stop. They got an overnight liberty here. The locals did not often see men off ship here. Randy went to a restaurant called Wimpy’s while they were there. (01:09:00) Florida Due to get out on November 18 1965, the day before his 21st birthday. Unfortunately, he was involuntarily extended for 4 months because of Vietnam. He received a notice telling him. Randy got out on March 16 1966 and signed out with the officers. The captain told him that if ever in a war he wanted him by his side but he wasn’t much of a peace time sailor. (1:10:45) Released from the Navy • Randy headed back to Halo Michigan where he had met a friend’s younger sister and had corresponded with her while he was aboard ship and asked her to marry him. • On April 2 he married Connie Stoll. He then phoned his parents and told them that he was home and had got married. (1:12:04) Ionia, Michigan • Lived here for a year and worked for his father at Gibson’s in Greenville, Michigan • He took parts off a line and painted them • His brother worked for Pesky Packaging Company so he left to here for better money. He put up orders for Petal Trucks to head to stores around Michigan • Worked here for about a year • Put in to go to school in Wisconsin (1:13:30) Milwaukee Wisconsin June 1967 • Lived in an apartment working for Dictaphone phone company repairing instruments making $50 dollars a week • Went to night school with the GI Bill to become an architect • Starts working for Western States Envelope Company as an engineer making envelopes in Sept 1967 making $80 dollars a week • (01:15:36) They had their first son in January 1969 • Lived on 76th and Morgan • Randy was offered a job as a salesperson in Inside Sales in the office • Promoted to Outside Sales in Michigan-January 1970 �• • (01:18:30) Randy increased sales 40% but was on the road 90% subsequently was separated from his wife Randy resigned from his job to try to patch things up with his wife (1:19:50) Enterprise Envelope, Grand Rapids Michigan • Randy returned to sales after 1 ½ years • Randy did end up getting a divorce (1:20:25) Western States Envelope Company Milwaukee, Wisconsin • Returned to Inside Sales with the company • Randy could not get an Outside Sales job with the company so he quit (1:20:45) Continental Envelope Minnesota • Salesman here • Met Nancy Goldwasser and married after a year in May 1978 • Randy seen an ad for sales manager in Idaho and applied (1:22:20) Porter Printing Company, Rexburg, Idaho • Department manager for the company • Lived for 2 years here in a Mormon community (1:23:45) William House Incorporated, Denver, Colorado • Randy took a job here as plant manager • Moved here in February 1981 • Worked her for 3 years • Lived in Aurora • Worked here till 1986 till company closed down (1:25:38) American Fiber Envelope Company, Gurnee, Illinois • Randy took a job as a 3rd shift plant manager • Worked here for a year before being offered a job in Milwaukee (1:26:38) Milwaukee, Wisconsin • Took over a plant in Toledo, Ohio, and one in Kentucky • Randy turned over the company in a year before it started making money • Moved his wife and him down to Kentucky and bought a 30 acre farm (01:28:30) Union, Kentucky • Randy took over plant here and was supervisor over it �• • • His job was to make sure the plant made money Lived here for 8 years Moved to St. Louis to take care of his mother-in-law (01:30:20) St. Louis Missouri • Randy started his own distribution company here printing and packaging supplies • His mother-in-law passed away 2 years later and ultimately divorced his wife in 2001 • Stayed here till 2003 (01:31:45) Grand Rapids Michigan • Randy had three of his children living in Lake Odessa • He got a job as a telemarketer in Grand Rapids for two years before moving (01:32:10) Lake Odessa Michigan • Randy moved here to be near his kids • Worked for a liquidation company and a bean and vegetable processor • He ran out of money and moved in with son for 6 months • (01:36:00) Randy checked himself into the Veterans facility in Battle Creek because of severe depression in Ward 39 • Randy learned here that he could go to the Veterans Home in Grand Rapids • July 24th he moved to the Veterans Home in Grand Rapids • (01:38:30) Randy is very happy that he found a home here where people understand his situation and care about what happens to him • (01:41:15) Randy said he is determined to recover by taking part in all the activities at the home • Randy is 62 years old now and is planning on moving on out of the facility • Randy wants to move down to San Jose Costa Rica in July of 2007 and has the encouragement of his children (01:46:30) Randy’s children • Son Sean (39) has Megan who has two children, Lindsey, Tyler, in Schuyler, Michigan • Daughter Shannon (34) Colleen lives in Woodland, Michigan with daughter Macy • Son Kevin (32) lives in Michigan with wife Marcy and son Caleb and daughter Anna • His son Kevin owns K&M Concrete in Lake Odessa • Shannon and his ex wife own a restaurant in Lake Odessa called C&R and she waitresses here �• • • Kevin lives in St. Louis, Missouri sells cell phones and is divorced from wife (01:51:00) Randy had no children from his second wife (01:54:45) Randy has a sister named Sandy married to Mike Dolak, sister Karen was killed in a auto accident, brother Doug married Ann live in Florida, brother Mark married to Lori in Wisconsin � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Curry, Randall Lee (Interview outline and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Curry, Randall Lee Description An account of the resource Randy Curry enlisted in the U.S. Navy in 1962 when he was 17 years old. He served on a destroyer as a torpedo man. His ship sailed to the Caribbean, Mediterranean and Norway. He spent an extra 4 months in the service due to Vietnam and signed out after that. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Collins Sr., Charles E. (Interviewer) Collins, Carol (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans United States. Navy Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-01-22 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CurryR Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/2cb965488f7741c1f00cad3a5ab80f88.mp4 b7a9a7a318d408d3002e27c954042e58 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/79489fd425c69301c1b56dd954703356.pdf c30c9b743abbe1654e87c23e38cd8770 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Name of War: Vietnam, Cold War Interviewee: Linda Crumback Length of Interview: 01:06:54 Background                    She was born September 27, 1947 in East Grand Rapids. She grew up in Caledonia and her family has lived there since 1865. She still lives in the house her grandfather built, but the farmland has since been sold off. She went to high school in Caledonia and graduated in 1965. When she graduated, she went immediately to Grand Valley State College for the summer. She would get a job there as a lab technician in the biology department. At the time, they did have the lake complex, but the bridge wasn’t built. They did however have Loutit Hall, where she spent most of her time, for physics, biology and chemistry. While she was going to school she lived at home and drove 40 miles every day to school and was glad when she was done, because she had had 3 close calls driving over there. But she didn’t mind driving. She attended GVSC from the summer of 1965 and graduated August of 1968. There wasn’t much going on at GVSC as far as war protests. Most of the conflict she had was with siblings. The closest one was 9 years difference from her. She focused on her studies and didn’t really get involved in politics, though she had her opinions on some things. Once she graduated, she went into pre-med and was going to medical school. She discovered that it was hard to get loans, so she tried getting jobs at different labs with no success. Soon she discovered that the military would help you go to medical school, so she decided that was the route she was going to take. So she took the different tests for the different branches and was finally accepted by the Air Force. She enlisted in the Air Force in 1970. The family was proud and thought it was a good thing to do. Her brothers who had all been in the Army had said to her “Don’t volunteer” and her friends didn’t say much. They thought it was an interesting thing to do. When she signed up for it, she thought that she was going to see the world and get some training. Things were not what they appeared to be, but more than anything she just wanted to get in and get into medical school. When she signed up for it she did not think of it in any connection to the War in Vietnam. (6:55) �     She did go in and had the 10 week wonders, officer candidate school in 10 weeks instead of the usual 12. While she was there, one of the people in charge had asked who was there because they got their papers and about half raised their hand. It was not the easiest thing to get into and she was actually rejected for it twice before. But she finally got a call from her recruiting officer letting her know that she had got in. She was surprised. She just assumed that she wasn’t going. That had taken pictures of the women, but not of the men. Training (9:05)             They had sent her to Lackland Air Force Base, in San Antonio, for Officer’s training School. At that time, the women were a separate squadron. There were about 60 women. When they had classroom studies, they would have it with the men, but any physical training they did, they did separately. The exercises they did were different as well. They had to do 5 BX, which were jumping jacks, sit-ups and things like that. Classroom work consisted of military history, training and speaking. They also emphasized discipline. When you first got there you had chicken stripes, which meant that you had to salute everything with stripes. Adjusting to military life was not difficult for her. Being away from home was the hardest part. It was fun being with the gals. There were no problems with the male cadets. The men and women would eat together as well. They all had 15 minutes to eat. This first stage of training would last 12 weeks. After that she went home. Her family came down for the graduation ceremony and she drove back home with them while she was on leave. After that she would get her first assignment, in Florida Active Duty (12:30) Florida        She would be placed at the McDill Air Force Base in Tampa, FL. She got on the job training at the time. She did not get the course she should have had; she would get it later, after she knew what she was doing. She was in a little Aero Space Defense Command and worked on a 2 person crew and basically they watched for sea launched ballistic missiles. She lived off base and worked shift work, 8 hour shifts 5 days a week. Given her solitary job, she did not have much interaction with other people on the base. She was the only woman in that detachment. The maintenance crew was all men. �         The computers were new to her. So when they came in and said they had to replace a card in the computer. Of course the only card she knew of was made of paper, but when they opened it up and showed her she got the idea. She doesn’t remember a lot of false alarms. But she does remember times when there would be alarms caused when the people near New Orleans burned their sugar fields. For some reason that would set off alarms for them. It was an interesting time, with a 2 person crew, waiting for nothing to happen. She did have a couple people tell her that they thought women shouldn’t be in the Air Force. She thinks she convinced them otherwise. She would converse with the enlisted men that she worked with to help pass the time. The enlisted men would have to do the watching, while the officer was there mostly to make decisions. She had that job for about a year and a half. During that time, while off duty there would be get togethers with other members of the attachment and she went to see the sights of Florida. After that year and a half she went to Denver, Colorado, to the 2nd Communications Squadron. Colorado (17:30)             At the time, she couldn’t have said much about it, but now she can tell us that it is the defense support program. They use the satellites that were in geo-synchronous orbit to watch the world for missile launches. This was quite a bit bigger than what she had experienced in Florida. There were about 500 people there. There were other women there and one of them she went through OTS was there as well. She got there just before she had, and there were a few others but not many. While she was there she was the Deputy Director on D crew. There were 12 people in D crew, sitting there receiving the data from the satellites and sending out all the necessary data to where it needed to go. There was much more to know working there than her old job. You had to know how everything worked and operated, not just how to operated it. When she first got there, there was only one satellite in orbit, so they would only get data every couple of hours. During that time, a civilian would train the crew. She would have training before that to help her, a four week course. She ended up living in off base housing again, because the officer’s quarters were full. Not one time in 22 years did she have to live on base. She did not run into any friction of her being a female in the armed forces. The crew was all about the same age, except for the enlisted, they might have been a little older. She and her friend ended up being the Senior Directors of two of the worst units. It was difficult working in them, but she made it through. She was told by her previous Senior Director that she was given the job because they believed that she could do the job and keep it going. �     It was interesting, as far as the operations, they were all standard and nothing really exciting happened during that time. The morale level at the bases she worked at was good. The officers were qualified and there was a new system and it was fun to explore. She was doing an operation and everything was supposed to go ok and suddenly there were arrows up everywhere. Her director was there for the whole thing and SAC was called, and they tried to decide if they wanted to bring in bombers, but nothing came of it. When she left Colorado, she was three years into the four. After that she was sent to Shemya Air Force Base, which is on one of the islands in the Aleutians. She and another woman were the first women ever assigned there. Alaska (26:15)                    The island was two by four miles. It was all men except for the general electric girls there, who welcomed them and told them what to expect. There were about 2,000 people there when she first arrived. The majority of the people there were taking care of the rest who actually had the operations there, and a lot of the operations at the time were monitoring Russia. She was also space tracking. She was flown out there on Reeves Aleutians Airlines. It was quite an experience as it is foggy most of the time and very cold. The pilots were really good at their job. When you wanted to go on leave, you would leave on military transports, which would be the only way they got fresh food and things that they needed. They would bring in barges during the summer months to bring in other things, like trucks. A semi came off the barge, it was strange. Collecting bottles off the shore would be one of their pastimes. They would collect 1950’s Coke bottles and they would find sake bottles along the shore. There was nothing to do there, so that entertained them. Almost everything was in a single building, from administration, to sleeping quarters, to the mess hall, everything. They did have an NCO club that was relatively new and it was nice. All the organizations on the base had their own little building. One of them was built with two little huts put together and a fireplace was put in it. It’s where the squadron got together. That’s where they spent their off time was in those places. She would be stationed there for a year. That ended right around the same time as her enlistment term. She didn’t think about getting out at all. She just got her next assignment, which brought her back to Denver. The range of the temperatures was 50-20 degrees. They were not allowed to go too far off base or you could fall and freeze out there. The flowers there were very beautiful. The wind made everything very cold. There was snow, in varying amounts. They would have tremors there too once in a while. �              The General Electric girls were there as maintenance. They came from a general contractor and worked 12 hours a day, 7 days a week. Their job was maintaining the antenna and the ladies came to work as secretaries. The job she had there was very interesting. The equipment there was older, which made the job more hands on. Later, when new equipment was brought in, it just wasn’t the same. It was also interesting to see the men when they were getting ready to go home, especially in the last two weeks. They probably did some things they wouldn’t normally have done. When they were going there, there was a sign that said “Welcome Linda and Terry”, well Alaska’s only congressman was on the plane, so their names came down and his went up. There was no trouble with her squadron about her being a woman in the Air Force, but there was one other woman who came up, who was assigned alone in the administration and she had some trouble. There was one individual who should not have been sent to the island. He had already been in some trouble on the mainland. He was an African American. He got upset with her and asked if he was different and there was tension that way, so instead of letting her handle it, one of the men told the individual that he owed her an apology. Well, this was the wrong thing to say, because this individual got really upset and that night he came into the room and tried to stab the man who had talked to him, and accidentally stabbed his roommate instead. She had planned on going to a movie the next day and was advised against it. But she felt it was necessary for people to know that she was not going to put up with that kind of stuff. There had also been rumors going around that they had all been flown out of there immediately, and she wanted to make sure those rumors were put to rest. (36:50) She ended up going to the movies with four men and there were not any African Americans in the movie that night. The individual who stabbed the man was eventually caught and put into custody. The man who was stabbed was taken to the mainland so he could recover. She believes that if they had just let her do her job, things would have been ok. That was the first time she saw that kind of racial tension and the only time she would deal with something to that magnitude. After Alaska she was sent back to Colorado, to 2nd Com, but this time she would work as a computer programmer. Colorado (40:00)    The job she had before was not to her liking. So she changed careers, which was not really available to women at the time, but they managed to get her switched. Her job would be to do the software and testing the software of the system. The biggest thing she can see is the difference in capacity, between now and then. She worked with a system that had 2 meg of high speed and 1 meg low speed. She had 64kb to herself. �                      Nowadays, in your telephone you probably have more memory to work with. The changes in hardware since then have simply been amazing. She had a training course for it right there and she was the only gal in it. She was never the kind of person to get up early to go to class, but the guys seemed to want it that way. So she would fall asleep at night, while writing her program. The operators would have this wild printer going and the paper would just shoot out. It would turn out to be one of the trainees not doing something right and they would quickly turn off the printer to avoid mass chaos. She was there for 5 years. During that time, she remained a captain, but rose from a computer software developer to chief of software development. They did one project, where they did the software instead of contracting it out. They got compliments on what a good job they did. By the end, she was in charge of 25 people. Most of them were officers. There were not too many enlisted that worked there. She made a lot of friends and had a lot of fun and she really loved Denver. She completed that in 1980. After the Soviet threat starts to diminish, the Air Force begins cutting down on people. But this would be after she got out and would not have to worry about those kinds of things. It was not a typical thing to work in one place for so long, but they wanted her to stay there because she was training others. She thinks it didn’t hurt any either, because she was able to make the next rank. After she finished that, they selected her to get a Master’s degree. So she was sent out Monterey, California to the Naval Post Graduate School. It was not a bad assignment by any means. They have their own campus after they acquired the Delmont Hotel and built a military base, with housing that she did not get, yet again. At that time, you went to the college as a civilian and there were a lot of foreigners there. The degree she was getting was sponsored by the Joint Command Control Communication. She was a little more senior than most of the others at the college. She took a few classes in each of the required topics, but they were not experts in any one thing. The program lasted 18 months. Since most of them had been out of college for a while, they gave them classes to get them back into the swing of things. Once she had her degree, she was really involved in looking at the National Command Control and how to improve it. She would return to a staffing job. Her system was taken over by the SAC, Strategic Air Command, so she was sent to SAC headquarters at Offutt Air Force Base, in Omaha, Nebraska. Nebraska (48:00) �                   When she got there and there were some of the people she had worked with were there. They informed her that they were creating airspace and many of them would be transferred soon. She would work there for a year and then be transferred to Space Command. She would do planning for new software while she was there. Her area was warning and tracking systems. She was there from 1983-1986. Things were discussed about the Soviets, but there was no real concern about going to war and most things kind of stayed on the same level. By that time, things had really changed for women and the military service. When she went in, you couldn’t have children. Now you can. There are also more fields opening for women at the time as well. There was nothing during that time that really stood out. From there, she went to the Naval Post Graduate School again, as a curriculum officer for the classes she had taken. It was an interesting job as she would work for the Navy and not the Air Force. She would work there for three years. While she was there she had a bomb threat to the school. There wasn’t much difference in what she saw in the Navy, but the attitudes for the importance of rank were very different than the Air Force. She could sense a difference, but can’t really put it into words. She worked just as an administrator and spent her time writing reports on finances and the curriculum and keeping the programs up to date. The relations between the military and civilians were always good, no matter where she was. Of the different places that she lived, she really liked Colorado. After Monterey, she was sent to Sacramento, where she worked at a joint job, working with the different military branches. She had to train and keep the software going for the system there. It was not the most exciting job, but it was an important job. There wasn’t a lot to do, except preparing for exercises. After this, she would decide to leave the Air Force. She had her mother living with her and she decided that it was time to get out, so they moved back to MI. Post Duty (1:00:15)     Since she left the Air Force, she’s retired with a pension, so she didn’t need a job. So she volunteers her time for different things. When people found out she was in the Air Force, people were surprised and she never had any negative reactions. Most people are interested and excited to learn about it. She notices a constant recognition and admiration for the military nowadays. They didn’t have that back then. She worked with a lot of veterans who worked in wars and it was interesting to see and hear their reactions to military life. �  She didn’t have a plan to make it a career, but since she didn’t have to reenlist, so all she had to do was take the next assignment. She would not be in the Air Force today, as they do not offer her job anymore. They contracted it out. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Crumback, Linda (Interview outline and video), 2011 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Crumback, Linda Description An account of the resource Linda Crumback was one of the first women to go through the Air Force ROTC School. She would serve her country for 22 years, initially monitoring missile launches, and later working with computers and computer software. She served on bases in Florida, Colorado, Alaska and California, and worked with officers from other branches, especially while serving as an instructor at the Naval Post Graduate School. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Other veterans & civilians--Personal narratives, American United States. Air Force Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-01-11 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CrumbackL Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/b280f848497c9430a60931d1c0e1c7df.mp4 a54f5554793e55357bddb0c6a68dc710 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/269d47184b3b6aa1f94e7203eec658e0.pdf 4fa9ed81737b1f70dc3fa0b902b467ac PDF Text Text Mary Crowell Interview Transcript Interviewer: Charles Collins Transcribed by Emilee Johnson Length: 1:16:41 Charles Collins: Well, Mary, I’m Charles Collins and today we’re going to do your oral history, actually your whole lifetime. So Mary, let us start out by me asking you your full name, your maiden name as well as your married name, where, and when you were born. Mary: My name is Mary Louise Mitchell Crowell. Mitchell is my maiden name. And I was born near East LeRoy, well, between East LeRoy and Pine Creek, those were two little villages, so I was actually born in the country in August of 1926, the last day of August. Charles Collins: Nineteen twenty—? Mary: Six. Charles Collins: Six? Mary: Mmhmm. That dates me. [laughs] Charles Collins: Yes it does, doesn’t you? It makes you be a nice young lady. Mary: A little. [laughs] Charles Collins: Mary, tell me what you remember about before you went to school. Mary: 1:00 Well, I was raised on a farm, the fourth of…well, I had two brothers and a sister older than myself, and then there was a sister and two brothers younger. There’s four years difference between my older sister and myself. My mother thought that, one time we were at home talking about children and at that time abortions, and my mother made the remark, “Well, I thought I had my family until you came along.” And I acted a little shocked at that remark and I said, “Well, Mom, I’m terribly sorry that I upset your plans.” Which, I said, “I’m a little confused, I’m not sure if I was a very good baby or if I was a bad baby that you had to have two more boys 2:00 and a girl to corral me!” But she said, “No, I’m glad I had you.” So from that point on, I would always get a dozen gladiolas and give to her on my birthday. Charles Collins: Aw, good! Mary: And tell her, I’m thankful that you had me. [laughs] And I think she said she was too. �Charles Collins: So tell me the names of your siblings. Mary: My oldest brother was Eldon Mitchell. Eldon…well, let’s see…gosh, he’s been gone a few years and I’ve forgotten his middle name! [laughs] Eldon …well, let’s say Eldon Mitchell. Charles Collins: Ok Mary: And Leon Mitchell, and Marcille Mitchell Wayne, that was her married name, and then my younger sister was Fern Mitchell Bishop, and my next brother was Gordon Mitchell, and then Franklin Mitchell was our youngest. Charles Collins: So your mother had 3:00 seven children. Mary: That’s correct, and they were all born at home, delivered by the same doctor which was Dr. Funk. I was born on the last day of August and they were harvesting oats at my father’s farm. And, of course, there were many men gathered for the process of, thrashing oats, and my mother had two sister-in-laws there, helping her with the dinner that day, and they had dinner for the men. And, she said that she got washed up, and got freshened up a little bit, went to bed and then they called Dr. Funk because I was on the way! [laughs] So I was born right after they harvested and were thrashing oats. Charles Collins: Well, now, tell me, did she get up do dishes afterwards too? [laughs] Mary: [laughs] No, I think she took the excuse to stay in bed a few days! [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Oh my! Mary: 4:00 So that’s how women…we were all born at home. Charles Collins: That’s very interesting, I’m sure your grandchildren will be very interested to hear that. Mary: They’ll be quite surprised. Charles Collins: Yes. Mary, tell us a little bit about the things you did before you went to grade school. Mary: Well, my younger sister and I had a play house in the grape arbor. It wasn’t built, you know, with wood and ladders and things like kids have today, but it was just how the grapes grew over the framework of wire, and we would fix our little playhouse in that grape arbor. Well, we had seen our mother as she baked cakes and so forth, and crack eggs and stir them into the batter, and for some reason or other one day, my sister and I decided we would go out to the henhouse 5:00 and get a few eggs and put them in with our mud pies. We thought that was great fun. But when it came the end of the week, when my mother usually took the eggs and the �cream into Athens and sell them, and that money went towards buying flour and sugar and things like that that we needed, she discovered that her eggs were short that week. [laughs] So as she looks around, and then she went to the grape arbor, she found shucks. So, I think that answered where the eggs went that week. [laughs] Charles Collins: And what did she say about that? Mary: Well, she was a very mild-mannered woman, and I think she knew that we probably saw the repercussions from what happened and so, we didn’t get a spanking for it but we knew that we weren’t to do that again. [laughs] Probably some of the 6:00 games we used to play? Charles Collins: Yes! Mary: We had a two-story house, farmhouse, and we would play Andy-I-over. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: And that’s where we took a ball and threw it over the roof, and you tried to catch the people on the other side before they caught the ball. So that was a game— Charles Collins: That was a fun game. Mary: Yes, it was, and not only that but we were getting our aerobics and our exercise at the same time. [laughs] And we had hopscotch and I can remember as a child, my dad thrashed wheat and corn…or, wheat and rye, and oats, and then he had a corn husker that he used for doing custom corn husking for the farmers, and as the thrashing machine was parked in our yard, we kids used to climb up on that and jump off. Well, that was really, five feet, 7:00 I would say, that we kids used to jump off of there. And we just thought that was great fun, running and jumping up on that machinery and jumping off. Until our legs got to aching and then we decided it was time to quit. [laughs] And another thing that we used to do was walk on stilts. We had, you probably know what those are like, a couple of sticks with a little wedge nailed to it, and we would get on those stilts and see who could walk the furthest. Charles Collins: Without falling off. Mary: Without falling off. And one time when our grandchildren were home, and Jim had built some stilts for them, why they were having difficulty trying to even stand up on those. So I said, “Oh, I think Grandma’d better show you how to do that.” Well, they looked at me in disbelief, that Grandma could get on 8:00 two things like that and walk around. But I showed them Grandma could still do it. [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Well, that’s rather interesting isn’t it? Mary: [laughs] That’s jumping ahead a few years. �Charles Collins: Couple days anyway? Mary: Yes. So another thing that we used to do in play, we would take an old tire with a stick. And we would see how long we could keep that tire rotating as we would keep pushing it along with a stick. Now, I don’t know if anyone else ever had a game like that or not, but we had a lot of fun doing it. And we also had a horse that we would ride. Charles Collins: That was fun, wasn’t it? Mary: Bareback. Charles Collins: Oh, you rode bareback? Aha! Mary: Yes. One time when I was riding bareback, the horse leaned over to eat, and of course, I slid over the neck of the horse, and my foot caught in the bridle, and I hung head-down. 9:00 And I just hung there for a while because I didn’t know how to get myself back out of that situation. But I had an older brother that came and rescued me. So some of that play could be a little— Charles Collins: Could be a little bit dangerous, couldn’t it? Mary: Yes. And we always would hop out of the hay mow too. Jump in and out of the hay mow, so that fun. Charles Collins: And that was in a fairly good-sized barn at that time. Mary: Yes it was. Charles Collins: How large a farm did your family have? Mary: Well, my dad was farming about 10 to 40 acres, cause he would do some custom farming too. Charles Collins: Was that his full-time job, farming? Mary: Well he did farming and then he did the custom harvesting for some farmers, and then he also had a saw mill. And he sawed ties for the New York Central Railroad. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: And one time when they were just finishing, a order for the New York Central Railroad, 10:00 the truck was loaded with the ties, and he was just using…he was left-handed, so he was using a little stick-like or board to kind of move some of the saw dust away from the saw, so it could be carried off to the pile where they carried it away. Charles Collins: Sure. �Mary: And he bumped his elbow and it threw his arm against the idling saw and cut it almost off completely. Charles Collins: Oh my! Mary: Mmhmm, so they rushed him with that load of ties and the truck, to the nearest farmhouse and they got in…they happened to catch the man at home, and he transported him to the hospital in Battle Creek, and the man that had just drove into the yard happened to be the man…he wanted to go with them, he was the man that donated the blood to my 11:00 father. Charles Collins: Wow! Mary: But Dad did lose his arm. Charles Collins: Did lose his arm? Mary: Yes, just about six inches below the left elbow. Charles Collins: And, how old was he at that time? Mary: Oh, he was probably in his late fifties. Charles Collins: Ok. Well, that was kind of a traumatic thing for you to see and to understand wasn’t it? Mary: Yes, but he was a determined gentleman. And, when he came home from the hospital, the first thing he did was get on the tractor and drive to East LeRoy to just show himself that he could operate the tractor. Charles Collins: Still could do that. [laughs] Mary: Could still operate the tractor! Charles Collins: Well, now, Mary, as…as life went along, and you started school, where did you start school at? Mary: I started school, it was just about a mile from where we lived, and it was a one-room school, 12:00 we went through the 8th grade there. , I had a teacher that was a cousin, at one time, and my older, next to my oldest brother, attended, my sister was there, and myself. And I can remember a picture that we had taken of that school, and I was sitting on the front row. And I had, it must’ve been early spring, because I had a ridge around my ankles, and I realize that I must’ve had my over…my winter underwear still on. Cause Mom wouldn’t let us leave the house until it got warm enough to take that underwear off. [laughs] So, that’s what we wore for warm clothing was some underwear. �Charles Collins: What were the winters like there, at your area? Mary: Some were very cold, we may have snow up to the fence rows, 13:00 and I can remember that my…our mothers sent warm meals to school with us. And that meant that my mother one day, fixed some vegetable beef stew and took it off the wood-burning stove that we had, that’s what she cooked with, a wood-burning stove, and we carried that to, about a mile, to our one-room school. By the time we got to the school it had begun to ice around the edge. [laughs] And so, that was a cold winter. Charles Collins: Yes it was! Did the school have a stove you could put it on then and keep it warm? Mary: Yes, we had a stove. It was a large, wood-burning…I think it was wood-burning completely, stove, and the teacher would put that pot of stew on there. And that’s what we had for lunch. Another thing that our teacher would do, they had a willow stick, 14:00 wooden stick that would lean…well, I’d say it was probably about five feet tall. And they had it leaning back in the corner, back of the wood-burning stove. And every kid knew, if they misbehaved, they would get that willow stick, probably, on their behind. But I never once saw it used. Charles Collins: Oh, wow! Mary: Never once. Charles Collins: It was just there for— Mary: It was there and people knew what it could be used for. Charles Collins: For information, they knew what it did! [laughs] Mary: Yes, yes. [laughs] And we, of course, being a one-room school, we, when we got our work done, we could listen to the class ahead of us, at what they were studying. And spelling was always a subject that interested me. And we had what was called spelling bees. Charles Collins: Yes. Mary: And we would go around to the different schools and have our spelling bees. 15:00 Well, I had to be in the 4th grade before they would let me go to any of the spelling bees. And one spelling bee was held at a school which was called The Little Red Schoolhouse. And the last two people still standing at the end of that spelling bee was my older sister and myself. And I thought, “Oh gosh, I got to be against Marcille!” And of course, I was challenged to speak the word…or to spell the word, acquaintance. And I was just so sure of myself, I just said “H-u-q-ui-n-t-i-n-c-e.” And my sister said, “She forgot the c.” So my sister won! [laughs] So that’s the way it was spelled then, anyway. �Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: But, it was interesting. And 16:00 as I look back on history, I feel fortunate that I went to a one-room school because it was fun. Charles Collins: And you learned so much in advance that the next grade was a little bit easier for you wasn’t it? Mary: Yes, yes. And we could play ball and different things at school. And to show you what the economic times were like, at that time, I recall one child coming to school and they must’ve had two penny suckers. Now, a penny sucker would be pretty good size, probably a little smaller than a golf ball. But it was good size for a penny. Charles Collins: Pretty close. Mary: Yes. So, we didn’t have candy at disposal like kids have candy today. But I sucked on that candy bar…or, that candy sucker for a while, 17:00 and then I saw my sister around, and I gave it to my younger sister to finish…finish the sucker. [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Ok! Mary: So, there was a feeling that you shared. Charles Collins: What kind of games did you play while you was at school? Mary: Well, we played ball. And some, we did have a friend…a couple of girls that had bicycles. Charles Collins: Ok, that was fun. Mary: Now that was really, they had to be rich to have a bicycle. Charles Collins: Yes they did. Mary: At least in my eyes. And I learned to ride on one of their bicycles. So we had bikes that we could share and kids would learn to ride on. Then as winter came, we could slide downhill. So there were…we made our own fun. Charles Collins: That’s true and …it was fun. And as you went on through 18:00 your schooling, did you have a 8th grade graduation ceremony? Mary: Yes, we did. But there’s one thing I’d like to say about the one-room school. We didn’t have flush toilets or anything like that that you have in schools today. We had to go outside. Charles Collins: To an outhouse. �Mary: To an outhouse. Winter and summer. Yes. But , yes, we had graduation from the 8th grade. That was recognized. And we used to have programs, especially at Christmas time, so that we gained some experience in performing. Charles Collins: Could you recall any of those special programs that you participated in? Mary: Well, I can recall the Christmas programs but I cannot recall what I did! [laughs] Charles Collins: Ok. Mary, as you went on through school, what year was it that you graduated from the 8th grade? Do you remember that? Mary: Let’s see. 19:00 Well, I graduated in 1944 from high school. So about 1940. Charles Collins: So it must’ve been 1940. Mary: Yes. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: And , then when we graduated we went into Athens, which was a larger village. And , my first day in Athens high school, I sat in the farthest corner because I was very shy, and I thought that looked like Grand Canyon to come into that building. And um, I just sat in the corner, and sort of looked out the window because I was afraid to look across that assembly hall. It looked so huge. And um, finally, I kind of turned around in my seat and looked off across the building at the [SKIPPED] looking over that freshman class. Well, I must confess that one of those boys 20:00 turned out to be my husband. Charles Collins: Oh! Is that right? Mary: There was him and his 3 friends. Charles Collins: And they were checking out the freshmen. Mary: And they were checking out the freshmen, so I don’t know whether he had his eye on me at that time or not. [laughs] Charles Collins: Well he must have for a little bit cause he was looking that way. Mary: Yeah. Yes he was. Charles Collins: Well now as you went to high school in 1940— Mary: Yes. Charles Collins: Tell me a little bit about what was happening in the world at that time, do you remember? �Mary: Well, I remember that we, some came to school by car, they would sort of carpool. In other words, my brothers had a car and they might have a few they would transport. Charles Collins: That would ride with them. Mary: Yes. But I came in town and stayed with a family. So then I walked from their home to school. 21:00 And um, we didn’t have but one major sport, either…in the fall it would be football, and in the winter, basketball, and in the spring it would be baseball. And I was not taking part in any of those sports because girls really were not involved in sports at that time. Charles Collins: They…did they have cheerleaders at that time? Mary: Yes they did. But I was too shy. Charles Collins: Sure. Mary: You know, I was so shy that…finally, it must’ve been sophomore or junior year… Because when the teacher would ask us to maybe read aloud in class, that frightened me terribly, I’d just think, well I can’t do that, you know, with all these kids. 22:00 But gradually I realized I didn’t want to be so shy. And um, so one time when they were trying out for cheerleaders, I thought, there’s one way to start getting myself out of this and that’s forcing myself. So I thought, I’m just going to try out for cheerleading. So I did, and I got chosen as a cheerleader. Charles Collins: Oh boy! Mary: So [laughs] that started me a little bit in getting over the shyness. Charles Collins: Yes, I bet it did. Mary: Then I’d take part in plays and so forth. Charles Collins: Do you remember any of the plays that you took part in? The names of them or what you did? Mary: Well, of course, I’d play some part. I don’t recall that I played a major part in any. But my goodness, I can’t remember any of those plays. Charles Collins: So tell us, did you get involved in any of the school dances? Mary: Oh, that was something I loved to do. I loved to dance. Because at one time, we lived just 23:00 a few doors, in Pine Creek, and we were about two doors from a dance hall. Charles Collins: Oh my! �Mary: Just around the corner. And my mother would let my younger sister and myself go to the dance hall because we had two brothers and a sister there that were older than we. And we danced every dance. That was our exercise. Charles Collins: Oh, that was fun, wasn’t it? Mary: It was wonderful fun. And I look at the kids today and I think, oh, I wish you could enjoy the fun I had dancing! [laughs] But yes, I did, I always took an opportunity to go to a dance that I could. Charles Collins: Mary, do you remember in 1941, where you were at when Pearl Harbor happened? Mary: Well, I was of course in school, at that time. Charles Collins: You’d be sophomore. Mary: And I remember of hearing that on the radio and realizing that we were at war. 24:00 Yes. Charles Collins: Probably as a young sophomore in high school, it didn’t really come home to affect you that much or did it? Mary: Well it didn’t until after I realized that…I had started dating Jim, and that he had enlisted, and was going off to the service. Charles Collins: Yes. Mary: So then I kept closer contact with the war. Charles Collins: Sure. What did you do as a high school teenager in those early years of the war, did you do anything special? Mary: Well, of course, many of the boys in my class, especially our graduating class, were already in service or enlisting, and so much of it was left to we girls to have our own fun. 25:00 I can recall a friend of mine, driving to our house, and this was just before the term, before the fall term started in school. And we decided we would drive from there into Athens and come back home, just for something to do. Well, on the way there, everything went fine, but on the way home, we had two flat tires. And course, we managed to get the tires changed, but it was quite a chore. [laughs] Charles Collins: I bet it was! Mary: Two girls! Inexperienced. But we managed to do that. But for our senior year, this same friend and I, Eleanor Hayward, was her name, and she and I had a room rented in Battle Creek �and we worked as waitresses 26:00 in a restaurant, that summer. And earned…this is back when you got a nickel tip. Charles Collins: Yes, it was a lot. Mary: Or a dime, if you were really making money. And we were paid $16 a week. And then our tips on that probably got us somewhere around $20-25 a week. Charles Collins: That was big money then. Mary: Oh, yes, that was… But we had earned enough money that summer that I was able to buy my class ring and my pictures, my senior pictures, paid for those. Charles Collins: Yourself. Mary: Myself. Yes. Charles Collins: That’s interesting. Mary: Yes, because we tried to be as independent as we could because we knew our folks didn’t have much money. Charles Collins: Well that’s what I was going to think, possibly had you not done that, you wouldn’t have had a class ring or senior pictures. Mary: That’s true, that’s true. Because when 27:00 I graduated from high school, I was offered a $300 scholarship and I was planning on going into the Nursing Cadet Corps. At that time, you know, during the war. Charles Collins: Yes. Mary: We had the Cadet Corps forming, and I thought, well, that’s a good way for me to get a nursing degree and , maybe I can do it that way. Because my folks didn’t have the means to send me on to school. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: So, I was 17 years old when I graduated. And of course they would not take you in the Nursing Cadet Corps until you were 18. Well, my birthday being the last of August, I had to wait a while. But I wasn’t one to sit around, so I went to work for Civil Service. And I worked at 28:00 Percy Jones General Hospital briefly, then I was working as a clerk typist out at Fort Custer. And this is where I got a vision of what it was like with these gentlemen coming back from way, some of them coming back oh, maybe 36 hours from the battlefield. And they came and then went to Percy Jones General Hospital. The critical ones went right there first, but there were some that needed psychiatric care, and they were still housed there at Fort Custer. And we �also had the prisoners of war, the German prisoners of war, housed at Fort Custer. So that was my experience through World War II working in the supply office. Charles Collins: Did you have much contact with the prisoners of war? Mary: No, I didn’t because I was in the office working as a clerk typist. 29:00 But I knew that they were there. Then shortly after the war was over, I was working for Equable Life Insurance Company and that was downtown Battle Creek. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary, do you remember VE Day? When it happened and where you were at? Mary: Well, I remember again, I remember hearing this on TV…not on TV, on the radio, and reading about it in the paper. But I can remember that it was a happy day because we knew that that was the end of World War II. Charles Collins: For Germany. And then VJ Day was the end of the war. Mary: Yes. Charles Collins: Do you recall hearing about and reading about us bombing the Japanese with the atom bombs? Mary: Yes, 30:00 I do. Charles Collins: And, what did you think about that? Mary: Well, I thought, when I saw some of the pictures that were printed out that was a horrible thing for civilians to be destroyed in that large a quantity. But then I also realized that we…the war would just continue because there didn’t seem to be much let up and that we had to do something drastic. But at the same time, we put faith in our leadership that our leaders knew best what needed to be done. So we trusted them that this is what had to be done. Charles Collins: And as VJ day happened, where were you? Mary: Oh, I was in Battle Creek. Charles Collins: And did you experience any of the revelry or…what happened that day? Mary: No, I guess I just came home and thought I’d stay where it was safe! [laughs] Charles Collins: 31:00 Probably was a wise idea! [laughs] During that wartime period, tell us what happened as far as rationing was concerned, and that type of thing. �Mary: Yes, we had books of course that rationed sugar and so forth, and gas, and so there was much, where we would share things together like transportation and so forth, it was shared to cut down on the consumption of gasoline. And I can remember silk hose—we couldn’t buy silk hose anymore during the war because the silk went into making parachutes and so forth. And we girls used to get a colored lotion and we’d put that on our legs, shave our legs and put this colored lotion on, and draw a black strip up you know, 32:00 with eyebrow liner, to make it look like we had a seam in the back! [laughs] And that would make it look like we had hose on. Charles Collins: To make it look like you had silk hose on. Mary: So those were some of the things and it was an all-out effort for the war. We did everything we could. Saved oil or saved lard, and tin cans, anything that we could do to help the war effort. Charles Collins: Being in Battle Creek, there obviously was some USO things happening and so on, did you go to any of those dances since you liked to dance? Mary: Yes, occasionally we would, and, when I was serving as a clerk typist at Fort Custer, at our place where we’d usually go to eat, there was a 33:00 gentleman there kind of tapping around and dancing like and we girls said, “Oh, he’s just trying to show off,” because there’s a group of us girls eating there. Well, later we found out that he was with the USO and he came to our table and he said, “Well, do any of you girls like to dance?” And course I spoke up and said, “Yes, I do.” And, a couple of the other girls did too. So he said, “Well, we’d like to use you in a routine that we’re doing. Would that be ok with you girls? We’re going to practice on such and such a night.” So we had gone and we’d practiced the steps and what the routine was going to be. And we thought, gosh we’re going to be able perform in one of the…one of these performances for the servicemen here. But they were shipped out before we could ever perform! [laughs] Charles Collins: Do you 34:00 know what the man’s name was? Mary: I don’t recall that. Husband: Colabrusco. Mary: Pardon? Husband: Colabrusco. Charles Collins: Colabrusco? See there? Mary: Colabrusco! Well, I had to get that from my husband! [laughs] He has a better memory than I do. �Charles Collins: Yeah, obviously. Did you happen to see any of the headliners at that time, at the USO performances and so on? Any of the big-name bands, or anything like that? Mary: Well, I’m sure I did. You see, I haven’t rehearsed this over the years like my husband with his, calls and reunions and so forth. Charles Collins: Well, that’s ok. Mary: But I’m sure many of the name bands were there. Charles Collins: So as you continued on with your life after the Second World War, what did you do? 35:00 Mary: Well, of course, Jim and I married— Charles Collins: Tell us about that, how you met him after the war, and dating and so on. Mary: Well, of course, as soon as he came home, he sought me out, and of course, he had proposed. He had sent me money for a cedar chest and the cedar chest was at my parents’ home. So, when I came to their home, why, he happened to be there to surprise me. And, so after talking a certain length of time, with the family and all, and I said, “Well, you’d probably like to see where some of your money went.” So I took him upstairs to my bedroom to show him the cedar chest. So while we were up there, he 36:00 pulls these…the ring out and said would I marry him. Charles Collins: And of course you said, “No!” [laughs] Mary: [laughs] Well, I said, that looked pretty sincere, so I said “yes!” [laughs] Charles Collins: And you still have those rings. Mary: And they were purchased in Pearl Harbor. Charles Collins: Isn’t that something? Mary: Yes. Charles Collins: Yeah. So tell us about your wedding. Mary: So our wedding was May the 18th, and this May the 18th it’ll be 61 years ago. Charles Collins: Wow. Mary: So that’s a long time. Charles Collins: Yep. �Mary: He was a slow learner—took me a long time to break him in! [laughs] Charles Collins: Did you ever get in a fight? Mary: Oh, any married couple, you get in squabbles! [laughs] But none sincere. Charles Collins: Obviously not too serious, right? [laughs] Mary: Right. But the day that we were married, I had made the wedding dresses and so forth, and my wedding dress, I could only find 37:00 enough satin, now this is in 1946, and I could only find enough satin to make the bodice part of the dress and the rest had to be made out of netting. And so, I did the best I could with the material I had. And then, the day of the wedding, we went to the woods, which is across the road from my folks’ property, and it had many dogwood in blossom. Charles Collins: Oh, yes! Mary: And I thought, those dogwood are so beautiful! And we gathered the dogwood and put them in baskets that we had got from the greenhouse and used those as our alter flowers. And they were beautiful. Charles Collins: And you made your own wedding dress. Mary: And I made my own wedding dress and veil and the flower girl and the ring bearer and the pillow. And the pillow that 38:00 I made, I have refurbished that and our granddaughter used that! Charles Collins: Oh, isn’t that neat? Mary: Yes. But so it was an evening wedding in the Congregational Church at Athens and Reverend Perrin performed the ceremony and his three brothers [nods toward husband] were in the service and my two brothers at that time, were in the wedding. And of course a nephew and a little niece and two of Jim’s nieces were in the wedding and my sister was the maid of honor and then I had 3 that were the bridesmaids. Charles Collins: So did you have a big crowd? Mary: Yes. I come from a large family! [laughs] But it was one of the first weddings held in a church 39:00 there in that community in a long, long time, that I remember. In fact, some of the people said, “Oh, you had a fancy wedding.” Well I didn’t think it was so fancy, I don’t think it cost much over $150! [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Nowadays it’s $10,000! Well, Mary, as you were married, where did you and your husband live? �Mary: We lived in a two-room apartment, upstairs apartment, in Battle Creek. And our transportation was a Model A Ford. My folks had never had a Model A Ford. [SKIP] Jim said he was going to buy a Model A Ford, I thought, my word, he’s taking me back to the horse and buggy days almost. 40:00 But in World War II you had to have your name, after World War II, you had to have your name on a list to even get a used car! Charles Collins: That’s right. Mary: So, this car, my brother knew someone who had a car they would be willing to sell and that was this Model A Ford. And it had leather bucket seats, and well I call them bucket seats, and yellow spoke wheels! [laughs] Charles Collins: Oh wow! Pretty neat, huh? Mary: So we wish we had it today! [laughs] So that was our first car and it served the purpose well. Charles Collins: And did you work then or—? Mary: Yes, I did. Charles Collins: Or did you become a homemaker? Mary: No, I worked at the Equable Life Insurance Company, and that was on the 11th floor of the Security National Bank Building, downtown Battle Creek. And Jim was going to [unintelligible] Business School at that time. I came 41:00 home from work one day, and here was Jim and the books were all over the living room floor and I thought, what happened? You know, that here the books are and he looks like he’s not going on to school, you know, what’s happening here? What have I married, you know? Somebody’s [unintelligible] in the middle of things? [laughs] But he found that he was feeling changes adjusting to civilian life, married life and now, whether he wanted to go on to school or not. And he didn’t want to see himself sitting inside the rest of his life doing nothing, well, doing something, rather, the rest of his life. He just didn’t know quite sure what. But anyway he went to work for Sinclair Oil Company in Battle Creek, so we worked there 42:00 until he and his brother decided to join in business in Athens. Charles Collins: And did you continue to work for the insurance company? Mary: I worked until I became about 3 or 4 months pregnant. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: And then I quit because back then you didn’t work till delivery time. Charles Collins: Right. �Mary: You just worked until you began to show, as they call it. And then you quit your work. So then I stayed home and became a mother and was a mother for 2 children: a daughter and a son. And we were living in Athens. And of course, I was an independent person at that period of time in my life, I liked to do everything myself, kind of like a 2-year-old kid. And I didn’t want everybody to know my business and I thought, if I go and live in Athens, I’m going to be 43:00 where everybody knows my business and I didn’t move to Athens very happy. You know, I really didn’t think I’d like it. But I thought, well, that’s where he seems to be destined to go. So I went. And spent our time there rearing the children and becoming involved in community. I was quite a volunteer or, they twisted your arm, as they say. And then as time moved on and the kids grew up through their stages of life, why, I saw that Athens was the best place to raise them. I thought he had chosen well. But in the meantime, our son was just starting school 44:00 and I was diagnosed with tuberculosis. Charles Collins: Ok. So you spent a little time recovering from that. Mary: Yes, back at that time, you had to be hospitalized. Charles Collins: Yes. Mary: It didn’t matter if your [prognosis] was negative or not, you had to be hospitalized. So, I had quite a rest period [laughs] for 11 months. Charles Collins: What hospital did you go to? Mary: Kimble Sanitarium. At that time, it was a sanitarium at Battle Creek. People came from Detroit, I had a roommate that was from Detroit when I first went in. And of course that was quite an experience, to think, oh my goodness, I’m leaving two young kids here at home! And have to worry about them. Charles Collins: So for a while, Jim was mother and father both! Mary: Yes, I think so! 45:00 [laughs] But a girl that we had that babysat for the children, which was infrequent, I didn’t leave them much, she came. In fact, her mother was working for us in the business. She was doing some office work. And one day when Jim went to the office, she said, “Well, why don’t you have Ruth Ellen just come and stay with the children and she can take them to school, and be there with them.” And it was the perfect set-up because then the children were able to be at home. Charles Collins: Sure. Mary: And we had a grandma in the area, which was the mother of friends of ours and she would take our son in the afternoon. Course, our son, at that time, he was reading, 46:00 and he �seemed to grasp words well. And he liked to read the Funnies. And so he would get the Funnies [laughs] as soon as they came, and read them, and then go back out and play. __________: Was this before kindergarten? Mary: This was before kindergarten. __________: Whoa! Mary: So the kids, where he stayed after school, you know, they thought it was fun to see him read the Funnies to them. So they let him read the Funnies [laughs]. But it was years later that I learned the teacher that he had in kindergarten, that one day she was reading a story to the children, and of course, Rod was standing at her elbow, reading along with her, that is, visually, and she was 47:00 embellishing the story to make it and he finally, after she read several pages, he stepped back and looked at her and said, “Mrs. [unintelligible], don’t you know how to read?” [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Cause she…there was words coming out that he didn’t see on the paper, right? Mary: Yes. [laughs] So I was happy for her to share that because I had missed out on his kindergarten completely, I wasn’t home. So I was glad to know that little incident that the teacher had to experience. Charles Collins: So, while you were at the sanatorium, there, did you form any friends? Mary: Yes, I did. And one of the girls came from Detroit, and she was with me several months. Because my involvement was in the lower right lobe, it wasn’t throughout the rest of the lung. 48:00 It was there. And they kept me in bed because it would be like swinging a broken arm, they couldn’t have the diaphragm hitting the lungs and have me walking around. So, bedtime 24 hours a day for 5 months. Charles Collins: 5 months. Mary: Well, really it was 6 months, because I’d gone to Ann Arbor for lung surgery and they excised that from my lung. Charles Collins: Ok. Yes. Mary: And so it was 6 months before they would let me out of bed once a day. _______: So you had to learn how to walk all over again. Mary: Well, this was an experience, for sure. But when I was in Ann Arbor, they said, “Well, you can call your husband, and let him know what time you’re going to have surgery 49:00 �tomorrow.” Well, the part that [laughs]…there wasn’t a telephone in the room, you know, and it was probably the distance of, oh, the front door here to probably the windows in the kitchen area here. I don’t know how many feet is that? Charles Collins: Oh, about 20. Mary: 20? Well, it was about 20 feet from my bed to down the hall where the phone was. And the nurses were busy because there were 4 of us in this room. And they couldn’t be in there, they knew we were all going to surgery sometime the following day. So I thought, well, Lord, I guess it’s you and me down that hall. I gotta make a call. So I got out of bed, stood up, course I’d been getting out of bed 50:00 to stand and move to a chair that had a bed pan on it and then back to my bed. That was my toilet facilities. So I thought, well here we go. Went down that hall, just fine, came back, didn’t tremble, didn’t get wobbly, or nothing. Charles Collins: Good. ________Female voice: Wow! After 5-6 months. Charles Collins: So now you’ve spent 5 months in bed, or 6 total. Mary: Six, well, another month when I got back cause I went to Ann Arbor, and another month back to the hospital. Charles Collins: And after that time, what did you do? Mary: Course when we were in the hospital, we did crafts, you know? Charles Collins: Sure. Mary: Occupational crafts. Ceramics, and needlework, and that type thing. But I’m an avid reader, 51:00 so I read a great deal. And of course you had a roommate. And the room was kind of U-shaped, so there would be really 5 girls that could kind of chat back and forth a little bit. Charles Collins: Sure. So, you were there 6 months and you had about 5 months more to go. Mary: Yes, well, that’s right. I went there 11 months. Because then you sort of came…your exercise [unintelligible] Charles Collins: So you went through a rehab period of time. Mary: Yes, so that was— Charles Collins: Then you had the opportunity to get done and go home. �Mary: Yes, but I think for…you see, when I went in, I would think, now, you know, I wanted to be a good mother, I want to stay home with my kids. And how come that lady, who was a neighbor, 52:00 she can go up to the tavern and leave her kids and everything else and Lord, you’re putting me in the hospital and here she is out there ramming around. I had that kind of little tension there, you know? But I thought, well, you don’t get well with a bad attitude. That was one of the first things they said to us. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: That your mental attitude has a lot to do with your recovery. Charles Collins: And it does. Mary: It does. Because, there was a lady that was around in the other section, and every day she cried. Because she couldn’t be home and spend her time with her family. But I felt that I had to trust that I would be taken care of. Charles Collins: And as you got well and left 53:00 for home, what did you do? Mary: Well first of all, I had to get used to hearing the refrigerator run! [laughs] I had to get used to someone sleeping with me! [laughs] Charles Collins: Sure! _________: Which is odd! Mary: Yes, it is, when you’re used to sleeping alone! [laughs] Charles Collins: Sure. Mary: And all the noises, you’d be surprised at the noises that are in a home that all of a sudden you have to get used to. _________: You take them for granted. Mary: And they’re taken for granted. And I realized how weak I was when I would get up and try to get breakfast. And then, I would get breakfast and the kids would get off to school, and I would sit down or lie down and rest a while. _______: Did you have anybody in to help you? Mary: I could have but I didn’t have because I knew that that was part 54:00 of my rehabilitation. That I needed to regain the strength. And it was the right thing to do that because I just gradually…at first I thought maybe I’ll never be strong again, but gradually I grew. �_____: How did the kids get along when you was gone? Mary: Well, I think they did fairly well because they had the same babysitter and they had the same home setting. It’s just that mom wasn’t there. ______: Did they have a problem getting reacquainted with you after 11 months? Mary: I don’t think so. I didn’t sense it. No, I didn’t sense it. And Jim’s shaking his head no. ________: I was going to say because they were quite young. Mary: Yes. Yes. Kindergarten and first grade. ______: That’s a long time for a child that age. To you know, not to see somebody. _____Mary Martha?: Had they been allowed to visit you? 55:00 Mary: Yes, well, they could come and visit outside. See, they weren’t allowed to come into the facility itself. Charles Collins: Right. Mary: But when it was summer weather, and I could go outside, then they came. _____: Oh, then they got to see you during that 11 months. Mary: Well first it was through the winter months, from August on through till the following spring and then they could come. But then, let’s see, at Thanksgiving time, I was allowed at 24 hour visit home. But now that 24 hours included going home and getting back. And institutionalization is an interesting thing because you become institutionalized when you spend that much time in a building and with a group of people. So I found that when I went home, 56:00 I didn’t sleep well because there were noises and so forth I wasn’t used to. I was glad to be home but at the same time I knew I had to get back to the institution to get well. To have them let me go home. Charles Collins: So after that 11 months and you got home, what went on? Mary: Well, of course it was the adjustment to getting back to home life and everything, and we had built a garage house, and I’ll put that into its perspective, but when our children were very, very small, we had built this garage house with the anticipation 57:00 of building a house there. And it was a new development in Athens. Charles Collins: OK. �Mary: But we needed a double-car garage and we thought, well, we can do that with the funds we have. And we borrowed $1,800 from a brother, and he graciously loaned us that, and we paid it back with a monthly pay. And then there was a lady who had lost her husband, and she called one day wondering if we would be willing to sell our garage house. Well, we had never thought about it, and so I said, “Well, let us think about it.” And then a little bit later, she called again. And I thought, well, she’s quite sincere about this. So we thought well, if we could 58:00 possibly get some land that we had looked at, but the man who owned the land had the name of Shingledecker [laughs]—that’s quite a name! Charles Collins: Yeah! Mary: He just didn’t want to sell any land because he might want to raise some potatoes at 90 years of age. Well, anyway, we finally decided we would sell the house and we rented a small house, out at the edge of town. And it was while we lived in that small house, that I was then admitted to the hospital and discovered that I had TB. And so you see how God seems to work things in sequences and so the fact that we moved to the larger place, it had 2 bedrooms, that gave 59:00 the girl staying with the children a bedroom, and she and our daughter had that bedroom and Jim and our son had the other bedroom. And Jim came in, I remember, one time he said, Rodney didn’t like to sleep on that one pillow because it had “Hers” on it! [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Ok. Mary: Oh, so much for his reading. So, kind of after this stint in the hospital, then we were in the process of thinking about building. And thought, well, we did have a chance to buy the property that we wanted out of town, so we thought that would be a good place to maybe build a house. And so it’s out in the country, we call it the suburbs of Athens. And we built our home, 1:00:00 but we couldn’t get all of the money for the mortgage because it didn’t have a fire hydrant next to it. But it had a river flowing through the backyard. [laughs] Charles Collins: [laughs] Ok! Mary: So as the home progressed, we did have some financing where we could get the shell of it up. Charles Collins: Ok. Mary: And we thought, well, we’ll let it set through the winter until the following spring and see if we can get it financed and finished. So, we did. And so we were able to build in a spot where we really thought we could enjoy living in. And we have, we’ve enjoyed it very much. Charles Collins: And you still live in that same home? Mary: We still live in that same 1:01:00 home. �Charles Collins: Wow! So you lived there, 40-some years. Mary: Close to 50, about 49 years. Yes. Charles Collins: I bet that’d be fun to move. Mary: Oh! I only plan to move feet first. [laughs] But in all the years of the kids growing up through school, we became involved in volunteer work, and after I got out of the san, I felt a strong urge to become more involved in the church. So we became church leaders or youth leaders, as it’s called. [laughs] And Mary Martha was one of our young people in the group. Charles Collins: All right! Mary: And we used to take retreats in the fall and go up to Pilgrim Haven or Silver…Lake 1:02:00 and spend a weekend there with the youth and that was really a very pleasant thing for us to do, but now, as you think about it, with the responsibilities with children and things happening and lawsuits, it would be a challenge to do. But they were a wonderful group to work with. And we did that about ten years, so we’ve been involved in church work a great deal. And I think the church work has permeated through our children because our daughter has become a major in music and both vocal and keyboard, she plays for churches and so forth. Charles Collins: Good! Mary: And our son is a pastor so I think that work probably influenced them and I think Mary Martha was a real influence on our son behaving in class. [laughs] I think she made him write 100 times or more that he would not be making…he would not be 1:03:00 talking so much in class? Was that it? [looks toward Mary Martha] Mary Martha: Something to that affect, yes. He was in my first teaching class when I graduated from college. Mary: And so that I have in his scrapbook. He kept that all the years and gave it back to us, it’s in his scrapbook. So with all of that and I became very active in the TB Association, became their Christmas Seal chairperson. Charles Collins: Oh right! Mary: And then their president. So, for the Calhoun Country Tuberculosis Association. So that gave me quite a bit of experience in… Because it was through their x-ray machine, that they used to do x-rays throughout the county that my TB was discovered. And the classmate that I used to run around with when I was admitted to Kimble Sanitarium, 1:04:00 she was one of the girls that worked there. Charles Collins: All right! �Mary: So that was a comfort too. But being involved in the TB Association and church and other organizations that seemed to come along, that was a way of expressing my gratitude for the people. That was something that sort of bothered me, I thought, well how do you repay so many people? Charles Collins: Yes! Mary: You know, just like a light bulb one day, it said, pass it on! Charles Collins: [laughs] Pass it on. Mary: Pass it on. Charles Collins: Help somebody else. Mary: That’s right. Charles Collins: That’s right. Mary: That’s right. Charles Collins: How do you repay it on? You help somebody else. Mary: That’s right, you pass it on. So then as our children were graduating from college, and our son was still in college, I thought, you know, I’ve done so much volunteer work, 1:05:00 I guess I’ll do something a little different, I’ll take a class over at K…Kellogg Community College was giving adult classes over at Union City. So I thought, well, I guess I’ll go over there just for fun and take a class at night. So I signed up for English 101, that’s usually what everybody takes when they start college. So I took a class in English and I kept taking another class and another class and finally the prof said, well, you folks need to go visit Kellogg Community College and see what you think of it, and you should continue on with your courses, because there were some kids, most of them, 1:06:00 were college-age kids and there was just one other gentleman and myself that were adults in this class. In fact, the very first class session we had, it was Chuck Spore who ran the John Deere Implement business in Athens and his daughter was in the class, and she said, “Well, Mrs. Crowell,” she said, “my dad would like to come to this class, but he didn’t want to come and be the only adult.” So, she says, “I’m gonna go home and tell him you’re here!” So she did, so he came! Charles Collins: All right! Mary: So we had, at one point in our English, we had to write some poetry. And we had gone into Battle Creek to visit KCC at that time, but I had left our car at the filling station to be serviced, so 1:07:00 we all rode in his car to Battle Creek. And when we came back, I said, “Well, if you’d just let me off at the filling station, I’ll pick up our car.” And he said, “Ok.” So �we pulled into the filling station which is after hours, you know, it was dark outside and using the car lights and so forth, and he said, “Well, just a minute, I’d like to read you all the poem I wrote.” So we said, “Ok.” So as we sat there with the dome light on in the car, and he was starting to read his poetry, a police car drives up! [laughs] And the police says, “Oh, I was wondering what was going on here.” [laughs] Well, of course we told him, the gentleman is letting me off to pick up my car, because what policeman would believe 1:08:00 that you were reading poetry? [laughs] Well anyway, it was a lot of fun! ____: If he’d believed it, you really want him to be a policeman! [laughs] Mary: [laughs] So anyway, as I was progressing on through these one-course stints, you know, through college material, I was talking with our daughter one weekend, and she said, “Well, Mom,” she said, “You’re getting enough credits, you ought to do something with it.” Well, of course the instructor had told me the same thing. And I thought, well, I was doing this just for fun. But she said, “Well, you thought about being a nurse at one time. Why don’t you look into that?” So I thought, well, I guess I will. So I looked 1:09:00 into nursing and I started taking nursing courses. ________: Now how old was you then? Mary: In my mid-40s, about 47-8. So I thought, well, you know. So I was taking all the courses, prerequisites and so forth. But I transferred because my daughter was getting married and my schedule was pretty heavy because we also had a paper route, that we had for our son to have in the summer or weekend so he could have a job to help…Because we didn’t believe in just handing everything to our children. We believed in kind of having them have a part in it. So you see, when I would go to KCC for a particular class, I’d always schedule that in the morning. 1:10:00 Then I’d go the Inquire and pick up the bundles that needed to be dropped off for the people out through our area, so I became a bundle… _______: A bundle lady! [laughs] Mary: [laughs] I guess, they called me bundle lady ever since, I guess. Anyway, so that kind of worked just fine, to do that for a while. But again, I took time off when our daughter got married, she got married in December. Then when I got ready to go back to KCC, they said, “Well we don’t have any openings.” And they had assured me there’d be an opening. And I thought, well, now what do I do. Well I was kind of devastated to think, you know I could do that, but again, you know, the Lord has a hand in it. So I thought, well, I’m going over to 1:11:00 KVCC in Kalamazoo, that means a longer drive, but just see what things are. So I went over to KVCC and continued my courses. And you know, how happy I was, because I got clinical experience at Borgess and Bronson and saw open heart surgery, all those things I wouldn’t have seen in Battle �Creek. Now, I don’t mean to put Battle Creek down, it’s just that they were different types of hospitals at that time. ___: Yes. Mary: So I got my nursing, I finished an LPN degree, wrote state boards to see if I could do it, you know, in a certain length of time, I passed it OK, went on a year more for my RN and passed that. ____: Oh my goodness. Mary: First time. So then I thought, well, now I can start work. Well I did and how 1:12:00 great it seemed to get a paycheck for what I was paying to learn! [laughs] Well, I worked about 6 years in the hospital and then I wanted to go into home nursing, visiting nurse, and that I thoroughly enjoyed because that fit me very well. ___: You just worked when you wanted to then, didn’t you? Mary: Well, I worked steady. So I was on the road, driving, in all kinds of weather to see patients. And now my hospitalization fit in. You know, my experience in the hospital, I knew exactly what a patient was going through. But I never talked about my stint, you know, I never let that on to any patient, because we didn’t talk about ourselves, or we didn’t talk about politics. But you know, 1:13:00 there would just seem to be a ???? that a patient and I had. _____: Well, you know or you’d been through just about whatever they had. You can relate to it. Mary: Yes. So I could see that my time was valuable. Charles Collins: So how long did you spend as a home nurse? Mary: Oh, it was about 18 years. Charles Collins: Really? ____: Wow. Charles Collins: So are you still doing that? Mary: Well, I keep my licenses current. I keep writing my exams to stay current. I still keep getting calls to come work. I even got one from Alaska! Charles Collins: Really? So that’s too bad you didn’t take that! [laughs] �Mary: It wasn’t a call, you know, it was not an audible call but it was an appeal, Alaska needed nurses. And if I were younger, yes, I’d do that, but I could 1:14:00 still do part time nursing if I wanted to but I feel we still need to have our time together. Charles Collins: Sure you do. Mary: So that’s kind of where we’re at right now. And of course our children are in Texas and Kansas and that lends itself to travel. Charles Collins: Well now, it’s been a pleasure doing your interview! And you know, for a lady that said she didn’t have much to say, an hour and a half is pretty good isn’t it? Mary: Well I’d like to say I still, I’m still doing community work. Charles Collins: Good! Mary: I’m a board member for Calhoun County Senior Allocation Committee. This is a millage that’s been voted in for service to seniors. And there a board that’s been formed by commissioners, we have commissioners representing each facet of the county. So 1:15:00 I am privileged to serve on that board as we allocate funds for other people serving the public. So I’m still— Charles Collins: That’s great. Mary: Filling a need. Charles Collins: And you still teach Sunday School, yes? Mary: Oh, yes, I’ve been trying to get out of that job! [laughs] Charles Collins: That’s a fun job! ___: Now you haven’t covered other talents you have. I hear you’re pretty good in art. Mary: Well, I guess, when Jim does his sawing, I do my work on the other end of the ping pong table and I do weaving of rugs, which I an inter-braiding, so that I find a good winter-time hobby. ___: And you sew. Mary: And I sew. Yes. Charles Collins: Well you learned to sew rather early in life, being that you made your wedding dress. �Mary: Yes, in fact, my sister and I would always buy material 1:16:00 just alike and we dressed alike every day of school and people thought we were twins. Because we dressed alike. But we did it merely because we could cut to an advantage, having one bolt or 2 or 3 yards of material making our dresses and skirts and so forth. ___: Now what do you do with the rugs and stuff that you make? Mary: Those, I usually have given those away. And I don’t think Mary Martha has one yet. [laughs] Mary Martha: Not yet! Charles Collins: Well it’s time. Mary: Well I guess she’s got her bid in. [laughs] 1:16:41 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Crowell, Mary Louise Mitchell (Interview transcript and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Crowell, Mary Louise Mitchell Description An account of the resource Mary Louise Crowell shares what life was like at home prior to, during, and after WW II. With the US involvement in WW II, Mary explains what it meant to take an active role in the war at home like saving lard, oil, tin cans, and using ration books. During the war, Mary worked for the Civil Service at Fort Custer as a clerk typist and attended many of the USO events. When WW II ended, Mary married her soldier, Jim Crowell, and together they raised two children. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Collins Sr., Charles E. (Interviewer) Collins, Carol (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) Video recordings United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Navy spouses Military spouses Civil service Veterans United Service Organizations (U.S.) Other veterans & civilians--Personal narratives, American Women Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-05-15 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CrowellM Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f8788da4d778c78be375ac3cb9dbf71b.mp4 ee1c9c981f864bcf693829f4c4b42137 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f0265b605310ab6ae9b95734c72293de.pdf d5e365c00d61544ab4e6de6c457cbc24 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project James Hugh Crowell (01:58:49) (0:00) Early years • Born in McArthur, Ohio 1924 (0:50) School • Rode a horse and buggy to school • 3-4 miles away from home o Horse stayed all day; boys had to bring food for the horse • 3 older brothers (went to school with 2 of them) • 1-room school house set back from a railroad stop • All 8 grades were in school • Had some female teachers and one male teacher • Remembers the male teacher using a willow whip on the boy next to him o A piece of the willow whip broke off and flew in between the barely open window; almost broke the window panes (3:01) Games • Tag • Little sponge ball • Had boots with jack knife o With the jack knife, used to play a game called “mumblely pig,” where you would take the knife and flip or throw it • Many kids had a pair of 4 Buckle Arnies (4:50) The Depression • Crowell’s father worked for the WPA o Father never told family what job was because he didn’t want his family to know that he went on welfare in order to provide for them o One comment (made by one of father’s work friends) Crowell will never forget: “When it came time to work, he would pick up the shovel and not put it down until it was time to quit.” • WPA o Projects run by the government like art work, forestry, etc. • Crowell’s mom stayed at home • Later, father worked for Ohio gas company (7:03) Meals prepared by mom • Baked bread once a week • Whenever would bake bread, would make bean soup o One time Crowell was carrying the bowl of bean soup to the table but dropped it because it was too hot so there was no bean soup for supper! (8:04) High school • Played baseball, basketball, and football �o o o o Liked baseball the best Played everything but catcher Lost championship game 2 – 0 Mother came and watched some games; father died of a heart attack when Crowell was 12 (9:52) Dances • Where met his wife (Mary Crowell) • Played three numbers, two slow songs and one fast one o Mary got him to dance all three numbers! (10:42) The death of his father • His mom, brothers, and himself lived with a doctor and his family o Mom kept house for them • Mom then went into practical nursing o When boys were in high school, would be gone for 2 weeks at a time • 4 boys o Elmer (oldest), Acen(?), Phil, and Jim (11:36) Current events during high school years • Crowell paid attention to the political arena • Used to get a current events magazine o Knew that the Japanese was secretly building up their navy; o Battleships had 18 inch rifles, which was against the League of Nations (which only allowed 16 inch rifles) • League of Nations o Useless because makes laws but cannot enforce them • Germany o Obvious that building up for war • Many US lawmakers were isolationists o FDR – Crowell had no love for him but respects what he did ƒ Started Lend Lease program • At the start of the WWII draft, many soldiers practiced with broomsticks because all the rifles from WWI and other ammunitions had been sent overseas to England • Press was often misleading • Other current events o Amelia Earhart o Lindenburgh’s kidnapped baby • In the 1930s, remembers that Hitler took over Poland and the smaller countries and Mussolini took over Ethiopia and Albania (16:56) Pearl Harbor • Sunday night o Crowell was staying with his brother in Kalamazoo and he would hitchhike back and forth from Athens [Michigan] o Stood at corner of where M-78 runs through Athens o A sailor came and ended up hitchhiking with him o The sailor had just arrived home on leave but got a telegram saying to report back immediately for duty. �o A salesman in a Ford Coupe picked them up and dropped Crowell off in Kalamazoo o Sailor was going to continue to Great Lakes, IL o News came on the radio saying that Pearl Harbor had been hit o Soldier said, “I know where I’m going now.” • The next day Crowell heard all the speeches, including FDR’s “a day that will live in infamy” (18:42) After Pearl Harbor • Graduated in June of 1942 • Enlisted in the Navy in September 1942 • Prior to enlisting, worked in Kalamazoo at NYA, which was training for shop work • Started working in Kalamazoo then went to Battle Creek • Had trouble enlisting because of a bad hand (20:16) Enlistment • Went to Detroit for a physical o Had to sign a waiver and wait a few weeks • Was sworn into the Navy • First Navy meal was beans! • Boarded train in Grand Rapids and traveled to Great Lakes, IL o Traveled on an old coach with a steam engine (21:49) After boot camp • Went to Jacksonville, FL radio school • Seattle, WA for gunnery school o On way to Seattle, train stopped in Chicago where Crowell got to see his mom, brothers, and girlfriend (Mary) for the last time before the end of the war • Went from Seattle to San Francisco on a train called a “40 and 8,” meaning that the car could carry 40 men or 8 mules. o Kerosene lights that would swing back and forth o Hot so would open the sliding wooden doors but then the dust would be incredible o One time, a little boy who was selling peaches jumped aboard their car; he sold the soldiers peaches and then had the soldiers hold him by the hands over the ground so that he could “run off” the train instead of jumping off. (24:12) First day at Great Lakes • Fastest haircut in life • When entered, each soldier was given $5, which ended up all being spent on the haircut, razor, toothbrush, and other required Navy items • Received a huge uniform (size 38 when he was a size 34 or smaller) (28:28) Boot camp • Barracks o Slept in hammocks o Tables were always in the middle �o Barracks were built in the shape of an ‘H’ where the center would be the laundry room and the toilets o One time, Crowell was assigned to introduce his barracks for inspection, making sure to salute the officers; the first officer through the door was Mickey Cochrane! • Testing o Took various test to see which school you were best suited for o Crowell loved flying but he couldn’t make it into flight school so decided to do aviation radio o Went to Jacksonville, FL for training (28:35) Jacksonville, FL • At the Naval Air Station, learned radio theory, worked with tube radios, learned Morse Code, and radar (which was brand new) o Wrote a letter home to parents talking about working with “radar” but his parents thought he kept misspelling “radio” • Explains the workings of radar o The machine pulsed 600 times a second (33:20) Friends • Cosby, a tall, thin boy from West Virginia (34:28) After gunnery school • Went to Seattle where trained with 12 inch shotguns • Crowell was 4th out of 100 in shooting skills • Learned how to fire machine guns, both .30 and .50 caliber (37:26) Alameda, CA • Became a part of CASU - 6 o Carrier Aircraft Service Unit • When VB-18 was formed, he was assigned to that unit in August 1943 o dive bombing squadron • trained until November then went to Watsonville, CA for more training • Flew with pilot steady named Art Chevelle o Randomly assigned to go on a practice flight with Chevelle during training o every so often, Crowell would be assigned another training flight with Chevelle o one night, Crowell couldn’t sleep and got this feeling that Chevelle was the pilot he needed to fly with o went down to the hanger and Chevelle if he could fly with him o Chevelle and Crowell made 266 flights together; the last 22 flights were made in combat • Talks about a softball game between officers and other Navy men • E-5 plane had controls in the backseat so if the pilot became injured, the gunner could fly the plane • After Thanksgiving, went to Crow’s Nest, CA for more training o Crowell turned down offer for NAP because liked what he was doing and who he was flying with (48:52) Hawaii �• Went on Lexington Carrier to Pearl Harbor where transferred using Jacob’s Ladders to the Ann Sheridan troop ship • Trained to navigate by radar • Night flight with Chevelle o Training flight operation was cancelled that day because of the weather o Chevelle and Crowell went out to practice o A few months later, Chevelle and Crowell needed to make a landing on carrier in a bad storm, which because of training, they successfully did (54:14) More about training • Crowell and Chevelle were making a navigation hop with Watkins and Fussell o Crowell and Chevelle were the tracking plane where the followed and checked the other plane for navigation • There was a really bad rain storm and Chevelle and Crowell began to think the other plane was lost • Crowell called radio, etc.; he did everything to try and get through to the gunner but the gunner couldn’t read code • Crowell wrote on a piece of paper “ARE YOU LOST?” and put it up against the window • The other plane motioned yes • Crowell used EB Adapter to get back on track o Used radio beacon and found signal o 2 days earlier, walked into an operations building and on the chalkboard was: “new EB frequency…55 kilos” o Crowell had written that down on a piece of paper and put it in his pocket o The day of the storm, that was the frequency Crowell needed to use to find the signal o Corrected plane direction by 10 degrees and they made if safely back • How the radio beacon works o If fly out of beacon, the radio signal will die o If fly into the beacon, the radio signal gets stronger TAPE 2 (0:00) Carrier operations • Lost 3 men in 4 months due to crashes • When joined VB-18 squadron, first thing you did was make a will (2:15) Combat • Started over Palau Islands, east of the Philippines • Above Babelthaup saw first burst of anti-aircraft fire • Watched a bomb hit a hill then slide down the hill into a forest where it blew up • In the southern Philippines (Mindanao), got into some real anti-aircraft fire • Burned the city of Lalle? the second day o The day before, threw out literature telling the people to clear out • Chevelle started in on dive but the smoke was so intense that he pulled out at 4,000 or 5,000 feet • Came in on a big cement wharf �• So close to the water, Crowell thought that the ripples were created by their plane however they were actually created by enemy machine gun fire (5:28) Landing accident • Crowell and Chevelle torn plane to pieces landing one time • When landed, plane bounced over 3 cables and hit the turrets, which snapped the plane in two • Crowell was thrown 100 -150 feet forward; bit through lip, had a hole in his elbow and knee and dislocated arm • Chevelle had a huge bump on his head • A motion picture has been made about this accident (8:27) More about combat • Heavy fire at a distance • Flying over Formosa to Okinawa October 1944 • Crowell, like always, rode backwards and saw the enemy crossfire o Looked like red straws of a broom (10:16) Battle of Leyte Gulf • Ship anti-aircraft is different from land anti-aircraft fire • Flying back to the Philippines when found Japanese fleet • Crowell’s ship was the only mainland carrier in striking distance of fleet until late afternoon • 28 planes versus the 29 Japanese ships o 1 ship has the anti-aircraft capacity to hold off 12 planes • At 18,000 feet, anti-aircraft fire was everywhere o Each ship had its own color of anti-aircraft fire so would know where bursts were going; looked like fireworks • An out of body experience o At one point, Crowell remembers seeing himself struggling against the gunner shoulder straps as if a strait jacket but he could do anything about it; couldn’t stop self o Then heard music of a hymn “Be Still My Soul” and the most comfortable feeling imaginable fell over him o Crowell was put at ease in the midst of fire and noise o Was relaxed even though the rest of the flight was wild • During the flight, 40 mm were blowing by them so close, it was as if you could catch them • Chevelle hit a Japanese battleship dead center and it exploded • In total, lost 2 planes • Squadron leader did a rendezvous to round up the planes that were left • Heard and saw huge splashes below • The Japanese were still firing but using their big guns; they had figured out the range but not the correct elevation • When Crowell got back, looked up hymn in hymnal and sure enough, “Be Still My Soul” was there (17:25) October 25, 1944 �• Decoy task force of carriers drew their plane feet while the real Japanese ships snuck through and shelled troops on • October 26, Panay, Palawan (west Philippines) • Ben Preston led the flight and found fleet of Japanese • Chevelle and Crowell asked for permission to pullout because couldn’t see target through the cloud cover • Permission granted so found another target and went back down • Crowell decided to look through the front window and found self looking down 2 gun turrets shooting at them • All 4 bursts hit behind Crowell and Chevelle, so close that their plane shook • Chevelle and Crowell dove again and just nearly missed hitting the ship with their fire o But hit close enough to ship where still caused some damage • When Chevelle and Crowell came back up, found themselves lost because in flying into the operation, their plane was a “wingman,” meaning that the pilot was focusing on flying the plane wing to wing as opposed to navigation • Worked their way to the Eastern Philippines • Met up with 3 other planes (WASPs) headed north • Strangely, could not communicate with them at all • Tried to pick up radio beacon from ship and failed • Crowell just leaned his head over and prayed • When opened his eyes, full blown signal on EB Adapter o It was a full blown signal right away, an answer to a prayer • Called pilot and peeled off, left the three planes alone • Found carrier and landed • When landed, plane died; there was NO fuel left • Crowell and Chevelle surprisingly beat the other planes from the squadron back to the carrier • Many planes went into the water because out of fuel; all pilots were rescued (31:23) Dogfights over Manila (37:47) Massive air attack • November 25, 1944 • 2 suicide planes hit the carrier as well as a 1000 pound bomb • Ship and task group was firing o Took off during the attack o One fighter pilot took off from the elevator just seconds before the bomb landed on that spot o When that pilot took off, the deck was swinging about • Group landed at Leyte because the carrier was hit badly and couldn’t be used in operation (39:22) Back to the United States • Lost 15% training and lost another 40% to combat • Traveled back on the carrier Intrepid • Chevelle went to fly fighter planes – “Bearcats” which were the fastest propeller driven aircraft �• Crowell went to Jacksonville, FL and then down by Key West until February 1946 • Chevelle nominated Crowell for the Yorktown’s Combat Air Crewman’s Roll of Honor and Crowell was sworn in (43:42) More information on rescuing pilots • Destroyers would go out and pick up pilots whose planes lost fuel before landing • Pilots would ride in life rafts which were in the plane; they also wore Mae Wests • Rescued soldiers would get to carrier by Jacobs Ladder seat (46:18) Suicide Planes • Crowell was in the Torpedo Defense room, located below the hanger deck at the aft of the ship • Sounded general quarters, which meant under attack • Scrambled to deck and saw a Japanese torpedo plane right in his face • Ran like crazy • Torpedo did not hit or was a dud because there was no explosion (48:46) Navy discharge • Discharged at Jacksonville, FL • Went to Ohio to visit relatives • Then lived with his girlfriend’s brother and wife • Started business school on the GI Bill • Got married • During the war, he and Mary wrote letters back and forth many times (53:25) Marriage • Church wedding • Proposed to Mary in her bedroom, when she had brought him there to show him the cedar chest she had purchased with the money he had been sending her • Inside the pocket of his uniform, he had rings he had bought in Pearl Harbor on his way back to the states • Worked as a clerk for Sinclair Refining Co. • Later, he and his brother started own business • In 1967 switched to selling wholesale hardware (59:26) Kids • Had 2 children of his own • Has many grandchildren and a few great-grand children • He and Mary have been married for over 60 years � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Crowell, James Hugh (Interview outline and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Crowell, James Hugh Description An account of the resource James Crowell is a WW II veteran who served in the United States Navy from November 1942 to February 1946 in the South Pacific. In this interview, Crowell shares with great detail his time in combat, including the Battle of Leyte Gulf, dogfights over Manila, suicide attacks, a massive air attack on November 25, 1944, and a landing accident that threw Crowell 150 feet from his plane. This accident, which both Crowell and his pilot survived, was made part of a motion picture. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Collins Sr., Charles E. (Interviewer) Collins, Carol (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American United States. Navy Naval gunners Veterans Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-05-15 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CrowellJ Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/998dd80c9c7787de011b8b2ef3270207.mp4 c9bac4dc9c8348e4187e48eeea95fbc5 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0454662fdcf15d6aee597880ab741372.pdf 2d3eba0957bf3e5b80242109a23b7d40 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview War on Terror--USS Cole James Croft Length of interview (26:46) (0:25) Background Born in Gainesville, Florida on November 29, 1977 (0:27) Graduated from high school in 1996 played sports and was in band (0:35) Decided he wanted to join the military during his senior year of high school (1:02) First looked at Air Force; didn’t have the job he wanted so joined the Navy (1:22) (1:29) Training Went to basic training in Great Lakes, Illinois (1:45) Did a lot of physical and mental training and learned about history of Navy (1:50) The training course lasted for about eight weeks (2:01) Stayed in Great Lakes and received additional training in electronics (2:15) Lived on base until able to bring family then lived off base (2:41) Orders were chosen based on grades and class rank (3:00) Chose orders to go to Norfolk Naval Base in Virginia (3:33) (3:45) Active Duty Assigned to work on the USS Cole (DDG-67) (3:51) First impression of the ship was amazement at the size and complexity (4:21) Duties included ship maintenance cleaning of the ship (4:30) Once he finished his tasks he was pretty much done for the day (4:45) Guided Missile Destroyer; carried lots of firepower and had many guns (5:30) Ship was able to carry 90 missiles, not including torpedoes (6:00) Never had to fire missiles on enemy, but did missile training (6:47) Ship went to Caribbean, Europe, and Middle East; Spain was his favorite (7:04) Sometimes allowed to leave the ship and visit locations (7:30) Did not interact with locals very much; mostly restaurant employees (7:50) (8:00) Attack Ship went to Yemen for refueling to boost their economy (8:06) While in port the ship was torpedoed by an Al-Qaeda ship [attacked by bombers in a small boat] (8:40) Sailors beneath the deck thought that there was a fueling explosion (8:53) Smaller boats around ship were collecting trash and were all authorized (9:25) He was sleeping during the attack and immediately knew something was up (9:45) Ship was hit near the galley and officer quarters; those areas became flooded (10:28) Attack took out major communications lines and caused significant damage (10:45) All the training paid off; everybody knew what to do immediately (11:15) Repairs were made; sailors had to stand watch to make sure repair stayed (11:56) Once the repair shafts broke the ship was in danger of sinking (12:12) �Felt that all the training had prepared crew adequately for the situation (13:03) Ship’s commander was the fall guy; didn’t think that this was fair (13:15) Crew stayed on the ship for about 3 weeks after bombing (13:30) Ship stayed in the harbor until Navy decided how to transport it back home (14:06) Used a semi-submersible ship to go under wrecked battleship (14:27) Crew moved to another ship to get hot showers and food (15:36) Sent to army base in desert before flying to Germany then back home (15:37) While ship was being repaired; in charge of monitoring contractors (16:25) It took about 14 months for the ship to be repaired (17:16) (17:20) Next Assignment Got temporary assignment in Norfolk, Virginia transporting prisoners (17:25) Next worked security for a company that overlooked ship repairs (17:49) Main duty was night security and transporting prisoners from brig (18:34) Worked with this job until he got out of the Navy (18:45) Thought about making the Navy a career but his wife was against it (19:00) 5 million dollar reward offered for capturing the ship’s attackers (19:12) (19:15) Post Service 10th anniversary of USS Cole’s bombing in coming up (19:20) Receives email every time the USS Cole is mentioned in the news (19:48) He is going to try to make it to the 10 year reunion in Norfolk, Virginia (19:50) Thinks the navy definitely was positive influence on his life (20:05) Military and electronic knowledge helped him get his current job (20:07) Completed a six year tour learning interior electronics (20:35) Moved back home to Gainesville, Florida after being discharged (22:10) Works in a manufacturing company testing MRI machine parts (24:32) While repairing an MRI machine discovered he had brain tumor (25:40) Had tumor removed and went back to work (25:45) Currently going to school for a business degree; plans on getting masters (25:50) Encourages all young men to join the service (26:20) � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Croft, James (Interview outline and video), 2012 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Croft, James Description An account of the resource James Croft was born in Gainesville, Florida, in 1977 and enlisted in the Navy after high school in 1996. He was assigned to the guided missile destroyer USS Cole and sailed with her to the Mediterranean. The ship then went on to Yemen, and was attacked by Al Qaeda bombers there. He remained assigned to the ship while it was under repair, and completed his enlistment at Norfolk, Virginia. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Snyder, Elaine (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Other veterans & civilians--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-04-11 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CroftJ1559V Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/8448ba0d2e22b211c5cfb49c46b211df.mp4 4c93aeece1a99fac420db8222c6e4947 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/be45ef49fe08d2f0ae64ef9b1753efeb.pdf 6c75353c5a97dfa347021eceaa57a3d5 PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Vietnam Anthony Critchlow Total Time – (01:44:30) Background · · · · He was born in Boise, Idaho on November 9, 1948 (00:26) He did not leave Boise until he joined the military He graduated from Borah High School in Boise, Idaho in 1967 (00:38) His dad passed away when he was ten years old o He was an auto body mechanic o His mom worked odd jobs after his father passed away · When he was in high school he was aware of Vietnam but did not pay much attention to it (01:37) · After high school he went to work as a dishwasher at the restaurant his mother worked at o He was nineteen and knew the draft was going to call on him so he went and enlisted (01:54) Enlistment/Training – (02:02) · When he went to enlist, he took a test and received a high score o They told him he could pick what job he wanted to have (02:21) § He chose to be a cook § The recruiter was slightly dumbfounded because of the high score on the ASVAB test (02:44) · He signed up around the beginning of November of 1967 (03:14) · He went to basic training at Fort Lewis, Washington (03:20) · The facility at Fort Lewis was essentially World War II barracks · The soldiers were “only one step above pond scum” (03:38) · When soldiers first go in, they get more shots, take more tests, given a speedreading on Morse Code, and taught all of the basic skills o They were also taught how to dress properly · If soldiers did anything wrong, it was automatically 20-25 push-ups (04:23) o There was never a level of punishment beyond push-ups · It was not very difficult to adapt to military life · He was always the slowest person because of his weight (05:12) �· Many of the men that had problems were men that were drafted (05:47) o They would always bicker and not do what they were supposed to · Within his training unit, they would sometimes have “blanket parties” for people who caused problems for the unit o They would roll someone up and “beat the crap out of you” (06:26) · He was in basic training for eight weeks (07:09) o He was sent home for Christmas · He was told that everyone was supposed to be infantry (07:49) · He then received his orders to go to Fort Lee, Virginia, for Advanced Individual Training (07:55) · It was culture shock when he first got there o He worked with a lot of black men · He was trained by blacks and whites (08:31) · Cook training consisted of how to read a recipe, how to read the worksheets, how to make the food, etc. (08:43) · He was at the Advanced Individual Training for eight weeks · Soldiers were allowed to leave the base on some weekends (09:46) o He made three or four trips to Washington D.C. · When on tours through Washington D.C., soldiers wore their Class A uniforms (10:35) · He never had any problems in Washington D.C. for being a soldier Active Duty – Part I – (12:10) · He was assigned to Frankfurt, Germany o He went home for a wedding and then flew to Germany (12:15) § He flew out of Fort Dix, New Jersey · When he got to Germany the soldier he was replacing had re-enlisted so they sent him to Vicenza, Italy (12:43) · When he landed in Vicenza, the cook had re-enlisted there as well (13:02) · They then sent him to Verona, Italy where he stayed for one year (13:11) · In Verona, it was 24 hours on, 24 hours off with every other weekend free (13:28) · He was able to take his time and travel through Europe o He wore civilian clothes when traveling · The Italians liked the soldiers as people, but they hated them as Americans (14:09) · When he would cook for the Army, he was told how to and what to prepare · He volunteered to go to Vietnam (15:11) · He thought that Italy was boring and that there were better choices in life than to be in Italy for three years and get out of the service · During this time he was paying attention to the Vietnam war and knew that it was where the action was (15:41) · He was in Italy for almost exactly one year �· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · o He was sent home for 30 days before leaving for Vietnam (16:03) He then went to Fort Lewis and went through preparatory training They then flew out of Fort McCord, Washington (16:31) He flew on a charter civilian craft They flew in to Alaska where they refueled the plane before flying to Japan and then on to Vietnam (16:58) He landed in Cam Ranh Bay, Vietnam (17:05) The mood on the plane was relatively calm o Men were reading, smoking, chatting, etc. o When they got off the plane, the stewardesses were crying (17:30) His first impression was that sand was everywhere o It was extremely hot and muggy (18:01) Once the soldiers were off the plane, they went to a reception center until they were told where to go (18:34) o He was there for nearly three days He was assigned to the 101st Airborne Division and his in-country training was in Bien Hoa, Vietnam (19:32) o He was there for nearly one week § They did a lot of guard duty, fake jungle patrols, fake Vietnamese attacks with blanks, and how to load people onto helicopters o Everyone received the training (20:39) He then boarded a C-130 and went to Camp Evans (20:52) At Camp Evans it was extremely bright and extremely hot (22:15) The soldiers got their orders and shifts that they would be working The food in Vietnam was primarily roast beef, chicken, or some turkey on holidays (23:40) o There were also canned vegetables and potatoes The cooks would get up extremely early every day He noticed that the African American men hated the white men and tension existed (25:46) o They would never hang out together no matter how much they tried The racial split was predominantly in the lower ranked servicemen Most of the cooks were on their first tour (26:44) o Many of them were going to retire immediately after Vietnam o Some of them were fairly old There was a lot of drug abuse on the military base (27:23) Some of the men smoked OJ’s – an opium and marijuana laced cigarette (28:21) o The drugs would sometimes affect job performance but all the jobs would get done If soldiers took one step off of the road they were immediately court-martialed They were not allowed to go to any bars or visit any ladies (30:07) When at Camp Evans, there were rockets that landed within the camp but they never made any contact with buildings on the base He began volunteering to join units that would relieve another company or unit in �· · · · · · · · · · · · the field because he did not want to stay at base the whole time (31:26) o He wanted to see more action The cooks were called “RIMF’s” (Retarded Ignorant Mother Fucker) (32:09) The first firebase that he went to was Firebase Blaze (32:24) o This was still in 1969 o He stayed at Firebase Blaze for nearly a month His unit put all of its supplies on a military mule [basically a platform on tracks used for moving supplies on a base] and loaded it onto the helicopter The firebase was very dusty and dirty (34:24) The soldiers lived in a hole in the ground that was big enough for a cot (34:36) The base never saw any attack when he was there He experienced his first “mad minute” where soldiers were ordered to just fire any ammunition that they had (35:55) o They would just shoot anywhere o They did this in case the enemy was sneaking in – it served as a deterrent (36:28) The weather was extremely hot and muggy – it would get cooler in the evenings because it was in the mountains C-rations were only used for lunch and there was always a hot breakfast and dinner (38:38) He would follow a similar routine at every firebase – he went to Firebase Bastogne, Firebase Birmingham, and some others (39:25) He remembers the monsoon weather at some of the firebases o He saw a typhoon around January o The military hooches stayed fairly dry during this weather (40:22) He remained with the same group for the majority of the time – they were the ones that always wanted to volunteer (40:51) Active Duty – Part I – Ripcord – (41:13) · He went to Firebase Ripcord on May 13, 1970 (41:59) o The Vietnamese artillery were on the lower side and the Americans were on top · The field kitchen was originally in a trench that was next to the helicopter pad (43:02) o They then decided to make a hole in the ground that was 10x12 ft. o They put sand bags on top to make sure it was waterproof (43:51) o It was only big enough for soldiers to come through and get their food but not to sit and eat · During his time there he was told that the enemy was around them (44:59) · There were times when there was so much fog that they believed an attack would happen · When he returned from R&R, Ripcord was getting hit with one mortar in the �· · · · · · · · · · · · · · morning and one at night (45:45) o The following day it was two in the morning and two at night – the day after that was three in the morning and three at night o There was much more activity as he was about to leave All of the cooks were replaced with new cooks (46:46) o There were two cooks on the firebase that were injured He remembers seeing one of the fellow cooks walking with shrapnel in his face and another cook's brains all over him (49:14) He went to Sydney, Australia for his R&R because it was the furthest location from Vietnam that he could go The Australians would try to convince the Americans to not go back (50:05) He feels that R&R was a chance to see something that he would never be able to see otherwise (50:50) When he was at Ripcord he could walk around and do what he wanted There was a cave on a mountain below Ripcord from where a Vietnamese soldier shot down an American helicopter (52:45) When he left Ripcord he was ready to leave (54:52) He went to the kitchen that had been blown up to get his stuff before leaving – this is when he saw his friend covered in another soldiers brains He then traveled back to Camp Evans (56:25) He stayed at Camp Evans until he left for Cam Ranh Bay where he stayed until he left for Fort Lewis (56:35) The trip back to Fort Lewis was extremely cheerful (56:58) On the trip back, they landed in Japan where they were told not to buy anything because they might cause the plane to weigh too much for takeoff o He bought a camera lens in Japan (57:29) He then landed in Fort Lewis where he received all of his tests and medical exams Discharge/After the Service – (57:55) · He was discharged at Fort Lewis (58:13) · When he landed at the airport they were told not to look at anyone in the eye, not to talk to anyone, and not to say hi because they would get spit on by protestors · The soldiers were still in uniform at this time (58:47) · When he landed, his mother met him, he found civilian clothes and flew home · When he got home he got a job as a delivery car driver for eyeglasses (59:36) o He stayed at this job for nearly three years Reenlistment – Active Duty – Part II – (59:51) · He then reenlisted into the Army because the Boise economy was bad (59:59) · He talked to a recruiter at the state fair where he was told how much money he could make �· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · o He realized he would double his current pay When he reenlisted, he remained a cook (01:00:41) o He had to remain a cook to keep his rank He got married and then talked to his wife about his reenlistment (01:02:02) He remained in the United States when he reenlisted and was stationed at Fort Eustis, Virginia (01:03:13) o He fed all of the MP’s and instructors for the school at Fort Eustis The food was much better than in Vietnam (01:03:38) o There were fresh vegetables His wife was able to go along with him during this assignment where they lived off the military base (01:04:03) o She got a job at Dunkin Donuts They remained at Fort Eustis for nearly a year until he received his orders to go to Europe (01:04:38) In Germany the soldiers took a lot of race-relations courses He received more orders for Germany (01:06:31) He was assigned to Stuttgart, Germany (01:07:12) o He showed up with his wife so they had to be put up in a hotel because the military housing was full § This lasted for 39 days (01:07:43) During this time they had to find a car, find a house, and get their drivers licenses o At this point he was an E-5 (sergeant) When he initially returned to the service, he felt like all of the fellow servicemen were terrible (01:09:52) o No one wanted to do their work There was a different attitude between the volunteers and those that were drafted (01:10:19) When he was in his assignment in Germany, he was moved from Stuttgart to Nellingen, Germany (01:11:15) o It was a joint Army and Air Force base He and his wife were able to stay in the same apartment – they simply had an extra twenty minutes of driving time to work They bought an American car and were able to travel around Europe (01:12:43) After Germany, he received orders for Fort Hood, Texas (01:13:15) o Between Germany and Texas, he was sent for advanced training to be a cook § He learned supervising skills, how to take care of soldiers, how to read a map, etc. (01:13:41) In Texas he was in the 2nd Armored Division (01:14:02) He was in a Deuce and a Half truck and would drive all over with standard field kitchen equipment (01:14:34) He became an E-6 rank and was in charge of a mess team He spent one year at Fort Hood (01:16:11) His battalion was chosen to go back to Germany for another three years in �· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · Karlstedt (01:16:30) o He lived in a town off of the base He was extremely disappointed to live back in Germany (01:17:32) Karlstedt was a depressing time because they did not want to be there After Karlstedt, he was given the option of Fort Hood or Fort Polk (01:19:52) o He had heard a lot of bad things at Fort Polk so he went to Fort Hood (01:20:23) At Fort Hood he became a part of the 110th Aviation (01:20:34) o He worked with helicopters in this unit When he would have to set up a field site, he would be flown to the site instead of driving He remained at Fort Hood for three years (01:21:10) He then received orders to go to Korea for a one year tour (01:21:21) o His wife stayed at Fort Hood In Korea he was stationed in Yongju-gol, Korea (01:21:35) He was an E-7 so he ran the mess hall and never had to cook He felt that Korea was beautiful and cold He was able to have a lot of contact with Koreans (01:22:36) o Nearly all of the Koreans spoke English Sunday was his one day off every week He went to Seoul, Korea for a couple of times (01:23:19) After Yongju-gol, Korea, he was moved to a base at Uijeongbu, Korea (01:23:39) o Every Sunday off he would go to Seoul to eat at McDonalds, KFC, or Dunkin Donuts (01:23:58) His time in Uijeongbu was much safer than at Yongju-gol The Koreans loved the Americans as long as they were spending money (01:25:10) He was able to call home once a week He was in Korea from 1985-1986 In Germany there were ammo bunkers in Denmark that they worked to protect from the Russians (01:27:48) There was a sense that there were still dangers and security was very important Some of the American tanks were shot at by the East Germans (01:28:34) After his overseas tours, he returned to Fort Hood (01:29:16) o He was placed into the 3rd Signal Brigade (01:29:18) He worked with nearly eighty cooks in the mess hall (01:29:37) He ran shifts and towards the end he was the training NCO and maintenance NCO (01:29:52) He finished out his Army career in this position Retirement – (01:30:36) · He retired from the military in 1990 (01:30:37) �· He went on convalescent leave in the summer of 1990 because he tore his meniscus · He took this time to look for jobs, find a home, etc. · During this time a start-up company named Micron were hiring so he took in an application (01:31:16) o He found a house during this time · Micron offered him a job (01:32:29) o He worked as a machine operator making computer memory chips o He stayed with the company for nearly seventeen years (01:32:58) o He was laid off from Micron in 2008 (01:33:44) · He then received an interview EDS (Electronic Data System) and was offered the job o He worked for them for two and a half years until it was bought out by Hewlett-Packard (HP) (01:34:52) o When HP took over his scores dropped with their system § He was then fired from the company (01:35:50) · He then applied for unemployment and received it · He got a job with the U.S. Census (01:37:10) · He still collects his military pension · The military food remained primarily the same during his twenty-three years of service (01:37:43) · His sole goal was to receive his retirement (01:40:11) · He found a way to work with all kinds of people · When the war in Iraq started, he was told that he was going to go to Iraq, but he said no o He did not place an extension for his service · He never received his medal for retiring (01:43:02) o They refused to give him his medal because he refused to go to Iraq · His highest medal is the Bronze Star (01:43:44) � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Critchlow, Anthony (Interview outline and video), 2012 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Critchlow, Anthony Description An account of the resource Anthony Critchlow was born in Boise, Idaho in 1948. When he was nineteen years old he decided to enlist in November of 1967 as a cook in the military. He went to basic training at Fort Lewis, Washington for eight weeks before going to Fort Lee, Virginia for another eight weeks of Advanced Individual Training. Anthony was then assigned to Frankfurt, Germany but was eventually sent to Verona, Italy where he remained for one year. He volunteered to serve in Vietnam and, after addition training at Fort Lewis, he was sent to Cam Ranh Bay, Vietnam. Anthony was sent to Fort Evans until he volunteered to serve as a replacement for Firebases. He initially served at Firebase Blaze until he was sent through Firebase Bastogne and Firebase Birmingham. His final Firebase came in May of 1970 when he was sent to Firebase Ripcord. He worked in a small field Kitchen at Firebase Ripcord until he was sent home. He re-enlisted three years later and stayed in the Army until 1990, serving in Germany, Denmark and Korea, as well as at Fort Hood, Texas. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American United States. Army Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-10-03 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CritchlowA1458V Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/eaca64acb08a5474f767577e5505e26c.mp4 366be8a7c84afbd1033693f19300dc36 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f336ddfa0fb39eb68bd4b9ff1bd4db86.pdf 79cc3954ad2066ee96fc10da1499ab7a PDF Text Text Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Arch Crist (00:17:34) (00:44) Pre-enlistment: • Graduated high school in 1945 • Lived in River Falls, WI • When to River Falls State Teachers College; which is now part of Wisconsin University • After a year of school he decided to enlist instead of being drafted • If he was drafted he would have lost some of his college credits • He had little money to pay for school so the GI Bill was another reason for joining (2:40) Enlistment: • He chose the Army when he enlisted • Was inducted at Fort Snelling near Minneapolis, MN • Went to Fort Sheridan, IL for deployment to basic training • Basic training took place at Fort Lewis, WA in 1946 • After basic he was allowed leave to go back home • Was sent to San Francisco to get on a troop ship to Japan • Stopped in Guam before going into a harbor in Yokohama • Took a train into Tokyo, were he stayed at a replacement depot (temporary Army camp) (4:30) Troop ship/Trip: • After going under the Golden Gate Bridge the swell of the ocean affected many soldiers, and caused a lot of them to become sea sick • Had bolted down standup tables were you would eat your food • Spent time in Guam at a Navy recreational center on the beach, had some cold beer (6:16) Military Occupational Service (MOS): • He was in the 1st Cavalry Division, 8th Regiment • 8th Regiment was the sister regiment to General Custer’s 7th regiment • The 1st Cavalry Division was an armored infantry division • Basic training was in Tokyo and then moved to Omiya; which was about 30 minutes away • Started a camp newspaper and a drum and bugle corp. in Omiya • Marched in a parade in downtown Tokyo on the Imperial Palace grounds in front of General MacArthur �• • • • Woke up early for daily calisthenics, and emergency drills They had to practice at the firing range with multiple firearms He was the best marksman with the Browning Automatic Rifle in the 1st Cavalry Division He had to attend instructional classes and forced marches (9:02) Friends: • Meet one of his best friends in Omiya, and eventually Arch went on to be his best man in his wedding • Arch also decided to follow his friend by joining his fraternity at University of Illinois (10:01) War Crimes Trials: • When he was on pass he went down to the courts to watch the war crimes trials of Tojo and Suzuki (10:40) Free Time: • He would do a lot of reading, tennis, and swimming • They would go into Tokyo on the weekends • Generally they were usually so busy they only had the weekends to enjoy some free time (11:01) Holidays: • Spent this first Christmas on the troop ship off of Guam • The only thing done to celebrate was to put a small Christmas tree on top of the Ship • Celebrated another Christmas in Japan (11:46) Fear: • When he landed at Yokosuka, an old Japanese naval station, in Yokohama they had to get on trains that were run by Japanese ex-military personal. • The replacement depot near Tokyo was surrounded by barbered wire and so when they went out at night on the town they thought they should carry 45 caliber hand gun for protection • After a few months they stopped carrying their firearms because the US did not prosecute the Japanese Emperor Hirohito (13:48) Lessons learned/Opportunities • Got his college paid for with the GI Bill • Experiences while being in the Army in Japan gave him a perspective on life that he might not have otherwise had • His military experience was a very positive one, but of course that had a lot to do the fact that the war was over �• • Ended military experience at a Private 1st class, and did not go on to further military service He felt lucky that he did not reenlist because he would have been sent onto Korea, and the 1st Cavalry Division played a major role in halting the Chinese/North Korean counter attack (15:49) After the Military: • Went to University of Illinois and joined Beta Theta Pi, and graduated with a bachelors in Journalism • He then went to Minneapolis and was hired by their local paper the Star & Tribune • He then went into advertising in the Twin Cities � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Crist, Arch (Interview outline and video), 2007 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Crist, Arch Description An account of the resource Arch Crist joined the US Army in 1946 and left after a year and a half. He spent his training time in the U.S. at Fort Snelling, Fort Sheridan, and in Fort Lewis. He was shipped out from San Francisco to Japan where he was part of the occupational force. Before getting to Japan he stopped in Guam where he celebrated Christmas. He tells of his experiences in Japan while in Yokohama harbor, and while at the base in Omiya. He attended the War Crimes Trials in Tokyo, and took part in a parade on the Imperial Palace grounds. General MacArthur was watching the processions at the Imperial Palace that day. He talks about the close friendships he made while in Omiya. He also mentions how his experience in Japan was shaped by the US government's decision to let Hirohito escape trial. He went on to be a journalist and then an advertising executive in Minneapolis. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Crist, Karl (Interviewer) Forest Hills Eastern High School (Ada, Mich.) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American United States. Army Veterans Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2007-05-20 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CristA Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/028a52801362e0b2657db835e0160a74.mp4 2224af2cf554c623380d5b26e1caa198 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d086f2594e65749e6afa3fcee87263cb.pdf d5a3fdfcad1a9e9706baa49fa6a3debc PDF Text Text ORAL HISTORY INTERVIEW DON CRIPPS 126th Infantry Regiment, Red Arrow Division WWII Born: Battle Creek, Michigan Resides: Battle Creek Interviewed by: James Smither PhD, GVSU Veterans History Project, Transcribed by: Joan Raymer, August 5, 2011 Interviewer: Mr. Cripps, can you start by telling us a little bit about yourself. For instance, where were you born? I was born in Battle Creek, Michigan and when I was nine years old we moved to the little town of Athens. That was during the depression and it was a little cheaper to live. My father worked at what they call the Federal Center now, it was the Battle Creek Sanitarium and my whole family worked at the Battle Creek Sanitarium and I worked different jobs throughout my lifetime too. I met a lot of famous people, Mrs. Roosevelt and lots of people. I had good contacts and when I—I always wanted to be a doctor, but there was no money to be had and I didn’t know what I was going to do, so—I was an athlete in school, football, I got letters in football, basketball and track. 1:05 Interviewer: When did you graduate from high school? 1939, in Athens, Michigan and then I want back to Battle Creek and I worked in the sanitarium there. For jobs, I worked at the main desk, I bell hopped and I worked on the sanitarium farm. I was in charge of the orchard one year and I had a number of different jobs. I knew that wasn’t what I wanted to do, but I stayed even though they were going into bankruptcy. The sanitarium was going broke and I lived at 1102, the tallest building there, for one year. I had my friend that I went to school with in Athens, we were always good friends, but I’ll be darned if he didn’t have a job at the sanitarium also. 1:58 The 1 �historian wants to interview me now because I can tell them things about the sanitarium that they don’t even have a record of. I’ve been to places they don’t even know were there. He is going to do it soon, but I can’t think of his name anyway. My friend said, “were going to be drafted”, and I couldn’t go on to college, so my dad knew a retired professor at the University of Michigan, but he also stayed at the sanitarium. He said, “if you like, I’ll start him on his career now until he gets the money or whatever he’s going to do”, so I started there and for that whole year I studied at the University of Michigan. 2:44 I took two subjects and still worked. When my friend said, “we might as well join the National Guard or we’ll be drafted”, so we—I joined with him knowing that I was going to be drafted. I was only in the guard for about a month and a half. We trained in Kalamazoo on the streets. Interviewer: When you were training in Kalamazoo, did you have weapons or anything like that? We went right back to WWI, I had the leggings that you—the windup leggings you know. Interviewer: The WWI uniforms? WWI, .03 rifles, which I had never seen an 03 rifle until we got down in Louisiana and we had campaign hats, the old WWI helmets, everything was WWI equipment.3:38 We marched up and down the streets and things like that and the fellow that was in there at that time , Captain Walker, I guess he was a WWI veteran and we had a 1st. Lieutenant, Fitzgerald, he was a WWI veteran, and then we had a 2nd Lieutenant and that was the only officers we had, and the 2nd Lieutenant’s name was Bush. He was a First Sergeant and he went up through the ranks and to the officer’s school with the guards. 4:16 Most 2 �of these young guys that came in were around twenty years old and in that area because there was no work anyway. They trained in [Camp] McCoy, Wisconsin and the next year it would be at [Camp] Grayling, Michigan, and to them it was like a big vacation anyway. We got twenty-one dollars per month at that time and then they federalized us, and we got on a train to Camp Beauregard, Louisiana. 4:56 Interviewer: So, you were federalized on October 15th 1940? Yes, 1940 Interviewer: They load you on a train to Camp Beauregard. The whole group is the history of the men-- the dentist is taking care of was the whole group that was on that train. [this sentence is probably garbled, so check it against the original] There were no draftees yet. Interviewer: About how many men were in your company initially? There were supposed to be two hundred, but there were seventy or something like that. There wasn’t a full train. 5:22 We went to Camp Beauregard, which was used in WWI as a training camp and there is nothing, it is just a monument, we had no place to go. We were going to go there and they were going to build us a camp, Camp Livingston, was going to be built and it had already been started. We trained in a tent there and had a real rugged time, even the cook had a homemade stove he had to use and we marched out each day with a band and trained. That was like our boot camp. 6:04 That’s how I can describe it. We were there about six months I think, I don’t know for sure the exact time. Camp Livingston, which is near Alexandria, Louisiana, that’s the nearest town. We moved in and that was a luxury compared to what we were used to being in. Interviewer: What did the training itself consist of? What were you doing? 3 �Because they had the, well they didn’t know about the Japanese at first. 6:45 I was on leave on Pearl Harbor day in New Orleans and the loud speaker came on and said for all the soldiers to get back to camp right now. That was Pearl Harbor and then they decided they were going to train us for general warfare and the never had anyone train for general warfare. 7:08 Interviewer: Were they giving you any jungle training in Louisiana or did that wait until Australia? No, actually we had very little jungle training anyplace. We went into action before we should have gone. Anyway, we had no equipment, no machine guns everything was simulated. In fact, one time we marched all over the Louisiana swamp and that was like where we were going to fight. We just had the old 03 rifles and gradually they gave us the equipment they had now and while we were down there we finally got the Garand rifle, and we used that going right into the war zone. 8:00 Then I—the conditions around there were still pretty much—the blacks were still--they had drinking fountains for blacks and they rode in the back of the buses and it was a new world opened up. That was more or less the training there. Interviewer: Tell me just a little bit more about the jobs there; what physically did you have to do? Were you marching? Were you shooting? We had some target practice, but not very much. Each day we marched out behind a band out to about three or four miles out in the country, at Camp Livingston and Camp Beauregard both, we did the same thing, marched behind the band. We had our flag with our unit on it and in fact, we still got that flag, it’s in the museum in Kalamazoo now. 9:02 They probably told you about that. General Harding was our general at that time 4 �and then all of a sudden they decided we were going to go to Europe. It was pretty rough training if you’re not used to anything like that, so we went to Camp Devens, in Massachusetts and we trained there for a while. Of course, there we had barracks and we weren’t used to that sort of thing. I guess MacArthur wanted Harding’s division, so they shipped us clear across the United States and we didn’t know we were going to Australia. We went to San Francisco. Interviewer: What was that train ride like? 9:58 It was—in fact, it was kind of fun and most of us have never done anything like that. We went on the train and we got to San Francisco and they put us in the Cow Palace. I don’t know if you—that’s where they held animal shows and stuff like that. It was rather new at that time and we all stayed in the stalls of the animals. I happened to have one particular assignment and I was a corporal by that time and a corporal was in charge of a squad at that time. A buck sergeant, he was the platoon sergeant. Those ranks went up over the years from staff sergeant to tech sergeant. A lot of them went AWOL and I was on assignment to look at all the guys around and see if I could find our soldiers and actually, we didn’t care if we found them or not, it was that much fun. 11:03 We were there about a week or so, I think about a week, and then we got on the Lurline. The Lurline was a passenger boat between the Hawaiian Islands, a luxury passenger boat, between the Hawaiian Islands and the United States. They had filled in the decks with bunks four high and there were about five thousand troops going on that boat and they still had the civilian crew on the boat. 11:41 Interviewer: How many bunks were piled on top of each other? 5 �I think it was about—it was either three or four and at the end of the thing they made temporary toilets and they were putrid anyway. I was sick, it took three weeks to get to Australia and I was sick the whole time and you had to line up so many people around that boat that you had to line up two hours before you would eat in order to get your hand on your food. I was too sick to eat, so I just took some fruit and went back to my bunk again. That was quite and experience for us. We arrived in Port Adelaide in south Australia and the reason we went to Port Adelaide—we didn’t know at that time that we were headed for New Guinea eventually. 12:44 We were going to train for jungle warfare and actually what we were going to do was train to protect the Australians. They figured the Japanese were going to come in and take Australia because all the Australian troops were over in the Middle East. We went to the Port Adelaide and they parked us right near a winery, that was a bad place to put a bunch of soldiers, and I think it was about October at that time. It’s semi-tropical and the have orange trees and tropical trees. I can remember the pails we had and we had regular tents and fold up cots that you put up yourself. The Australians, being that they were a big sheep country, there number one meat was mutton and they thought, we’ll give the American the mutton and we’ll have the beef. 13:51 We could smell that mutton ten miles away and we couldn’t eat it, so got to sneaking out and going to the farms and bringing food home and cooking it ourselves. Eventually they let us have beef. We trained there for a few weeks while they were building a camp in Brisbane, Australia to continue our training. We had to go crosscountry by train because the Japanese submarines were all around. Most of our equipment was going by boat around—if you’re familiar with Australia and the shape of it, around Port Moresby [Melbourne] and Sydney to Brisbane. 14:46 On that trip, the 6 �first man in our division was killed. I just had his name and I’ll tell ya—he was from Battle Creek, Michigan. I had the name and I thought I could tell ya, but maybe I’ll think of it. Interviewer: Was he killed in an accident or how? He was shot at from the subs, so they named that training place—it was an unusual trip to take because each train in Australia has a different railroad gauge and you have to get out at the end of each station and go onto another train. It was an experience there alone, and then we got up to Brisbane. 15:44 We trained there for a short—it wasn’t going to be too long a time and then they decided they were going to ship us—while I was in Adelaide I happened to go to a school down there and I made friends that we have kept in touch with for sixty years. We’ve kept in contact constantly all the time. What I went to school for was, we thought we were going to have to live on the land and we had to go out in the center of Australia, which is a desert, and from the Aborigines we learned we could eat the grubs and stuff like that and where the water was in certain plants. We thought we were going to have to fend off the land. That’s a bit of background and when we were ready to go they put us on Liberty ships and they were new, not the old Liberty ships 16:51. We got on the Liberty ships-Interviewer: Now, before they sent you over to New Guinea, did you get any kind of jungle training or what they called jungle training? We had some, but it was nothing like what we actually did. We never had the proper equipment in the first place and what they had to do for camouflage, they didn’t have camouflage, so they took our uniforms and sprayed them green and by spraying them you couldn’t get any air through them. When we were actually in jungle warfare every time 7 �we would get to a stream we would take them off and try to scrub the paint off of them. When we landed, under very dangerous times at Port Moresby, we stayed there for, I don’t know, several weeks or not that long. 17:52 Interviewer: What sort of place was Port Moresby at that time? Port Moresby is the only place in New Guinea that looked just like an Australian town. Australians, of course, it’s one of their possessions, and it would be like any little Australian town, but we were outside of the town and we never got into the town much. At our camp we got diarrhea terrible and we couldn’t eat and our cooks, no way could you eat the food. In Port Moresby, we were at the foot of the Owen Stanley Mountains, which are twelve to thirteen thousand feet high and they figured, the Australian figured, that the Japanese could never get over that mountain, but they were starting to trickle over and those that got over weren’t worth much anyway. 19:01 We were bombed by Japanese planes. They had air superiority most of the time, so every night they tried to show us, from our foxhole, a big movie. They would show it to us, but that’s as far as we could go anyway with the diarrhea. They would turn the lights out and show it and then you would dive back in your hole. They got ready and they decided that part of them were going to go over the mountain and before I forget it, at first our Colonel of the 126th Infantry, a full Colonel, I did know his name, but I can’t think of it. He was making a survey over New Guinea before we actually went into action and he was shot down and got killed. 20:04 Part of us, our particular company, we got separated from most of the fighting in New Guinea, I probably told you that. We were on a different side than the rest of them were. Then they decided—the whole thing was getting Buna and the airstrip. MacArthur said to take Buna no matter who was killed or what and he never set 8 �foot in New Guinea at that time. He just said, “you take them”, and most of the men in that division, the 32nd Division, from Wisconsin and Michigan were killed, wounded or got diseases. 21:00 There was a lot of disease. I had malaria six times and most of the men that you interviewed all had malaria too. Interviewer: What sort of effects does malaria have on you? It’s a high, high fever and you just can’t move. A lot of men died over there because there was no one to take you out. Eventually--we didn’t have any medicine and all we had was quinine, in fact, at that time. There was an Atabrine; the Germans had it, which would have helped us a lot. We didn’t have it and the Germans being our enemy, we didn’t have Atabrine at that time. You just more or less laid down and stayed there until you could move again because there was no way of getting you out. After a while your fever keeps going down. 21:58 Eventually, while I was there, we got the Atabrine somehow. Whether they made there own formula or what, I don’t know. It helped, but it wasn’t any cure. I use to have to stand my men up and make sure they put the pill in their mouth because they wanted to go home. Everybody was yellow looking and all that. That’s how it affects your body. Interviewer: The Atabrine would also make that. Yes Interviewer: Back up a little bit now. Originally the division is basically mostly in place at Port Moresby and part of your regiment is assigned to walk over the mountains. Now, the part that you were with, how did you get over? 22:50 They decided—there was a little strip on the northern shore there, I think it was near Pongani, there was a strip they thought they could get an airplane into, but it wasn’t a 9 �strip at all, it was just an open field. I think one of the planes crash-landed there. Part of us got in that plane and I was one of them. From then on it was jungle walking and we hadn’t met any enemy yet. It was along the coast with all the coconut palms and all that. It was along that coast. The only food we got was by airplane and, of course, the Japanese had air superiority and we might get the food and we might not. Most of it was C rations and sometimes we got the Australian corned beef and hard tack. 23:56 Sometimes we got their food and sometimes we would go as high as three days and never get any food. You couldn’t build a fire or anything because the Japanese would be after you. The only equipment you had—you had a shelter half. It rained every night almost, terrible temperature, mosquitoes, we had to wear a net over there. The Garand rifle we had—in each squad there would be a Browning automatic and they finally got—one in each squad got the little hand machine gun with a drum of either fifty or twenty and we wouldn’t use the fifties because they rattle. 24:50 We hadn’t seen any enemy yet. Interviewer: Were you seeing any natives in that area? Well, there were some natives, yes. A lot of natives took some of our equipment and you couldn’t trust them. They were apt to take you right into the woods and dump you and the only pay they got was some of our c rations and that’s how we paid them. We were told not to go into any of the villages because those people would starve to death because they don’t know enough to keep food. They had little gardens and stuff and they didn’t want you near their women, which nobody would want to be anyway. 25:50 The animals—the only animals you got—you got the alligators and a lot of poison snakes, but we didn’t—with all the troops there I didn’t hardly see a snake, but some of them did and some didn’t. We also had that problem on our Louisiana maneuvers with the Coral 10 �snake. We lost several people down there. We were going along the coast towards where we were going to make contact with them and the first think--you still didn’t think you were in a war and all of a sudden—along that coast there was a sort of a backwater and river and the Australians had a little boat trying to get closer to the front and all of sudden we saw hundreds of bloated bodies of Australians. That was the first realization that we were in a war and, of course, that shook us all. 26:47 Interviewer: What happened after you came on that scene? Then we kept right on going and we couldn’t get boats in there either, so we couldn’t do anything about it. All we could do was continue and along with that there were some Australians too. We kept on going on up the coast and you couldn’t dig holes because six inches down there was water. The only water you had to drink was brackish water. We put a pill in it to purify it, but you couldn’t quench your thirst any of the time. Sometimes you quenched your thirst with the coconut palms. You could open up the coconuts and drink it and if you did you got diarrhea. 27:41 Interviewer: Could you do anything to catch the rainwater? We weren’t in one place long enough to catch any rainwater, no. There were little streams you could go into and we tore our clothes all off and scrubbed them in the sand because that’s the only way you could keep them clean. We didn’t have any heavy equipment outside of 60mm mortars and the machine guns. Interviewer: You basically had what you could carry. What you could carry and they said later they had tanks, but we had no, not any, big guns. Mostly mortars and machine guns. Then we got up there where they figured the enemy was and that we were going to have contact with the enemy the next day. They 11 �said for me to take the men a hundred yards up the road and assemble up there and I got up there and I didn’t have any men there. They all went back the other way, so we went back and reorganized and jabbed them a bit and started over again. 28:56 The team, before we went up there, the supply sergeant, he went berserk and he got into a hole and was shooting at everybody. He finally got killed and that was in the beginning of the action.. From then on we had a jungle path—there’s no communications, only a runner and no radios or nothing like that in there. We had different incidents and it’s kind of boring in a way, yet you didn’t see the soldiers and in the night two guys would sleep together so one stayed awake while the other slept. You could hear the Japanese make noise at night and say English things to get us out. 29:58 We didn’t take any—the Australians wouldn’t take any prisoners, but we took a few prisoners. We didn’t want— if we did the Australians would kill them before they got back to be questioned. We found some of our men that were taken prisoners and they bayoneted them against a tree. I’m trying to think—there was all this long grass and every time an airplane came over they didn’t know where we were either and it was a scary thought. 30:40 Interviewer: Do you remember the first time you actually encountered the Japanese or were fired on by them? When we got off the line we were constantly being fired at with mortars. The jungle’s hard to see people and the Japanese had been there enough time ahead of us, they were in pillboxes and with the equipment we had it was almost impossible against the pillbox. I’d been on a lot of patrols and sent my men on patrols and around the pillboxes there would be wire fence with cans on it so they could hear you coming. It was impossible to do anything against the pillboxes with the equipment we had. The Australians, they 12 �would tell them they had to take that pillbox and they would try to take the pillboxes and the guys would get killed. 31:48 Interviewer: Now, did you have Australian soldiers serving right along side of you? No, they were just close by and we were not side-by-side. They were just a few feet from us. Interviewer: They were sort of the next section of the line? Yes, and that’s the way we fought to clear up the place until we got near Buna. Actually I was on the outskirts of Buna and when I took cigarettes to my men a sniper got me with a 25-caliber bullet, that’s what they had, and they were exploding bullets, which were supposed to be outlawed by the Geneva Convention, but the Japanese don’t go by anything like that. 32:48 It exploded in me, in my heart and my lungs, but I never was out. They had to get natives; there were no Americans, no Americans there to haul you out, so they had natives. They couldn’t use any equipment we had, so they had to make something on poles. Interviewer: Did your own men get you back off the front line first? There was no front line really, that’s another thing, there’s no front line. They could be behind you, beside you, you would never know where they were. I got cigarettes to my men and at that time I didn’t care if I got wounded or not. It’s not like Vietnam, you know you got to be there for a year, and here you didn’t know if you were going to be there was ten years or not. You never knew the end of it. 33:49 When I was up there, right on the coast of Buna, all the big generals, General Eichelberger, they came up there and two or three other generals. Their bright Chino clothes stood out like a thumb you know, and as soon as they got back we really got peppered. They were supposed to have 13 �brought us a Christmas dinner and if they did I never got it, but I have my doubts that they did. Interviewer: You got hit on December 22nd didn’t you? December 26 and that’s one date I did not forget, 1942. Interviewer: So, they got the natives to take you back, and did you got to an aid station at that point? Yeah, they had to take me back—there was a little strip on the coast down there. They had an aid station and they got some little planes in there and all they do is give you first aid stuff. 34:55 They got little planes in there and they took you out one at a time and flew you to Port Moresby. I went to Port Moresby and they had a big tent hospital there. That’s where you went until they could get you back to Australia. I was shot up so bad that my folks got the telegram that I was seriously wounded in action. They didn’t know if I would make it and they had to operate on me and take these pieces of shrapnel out of my heart and without any pain killer. Then I was too sick to fly back, some of them could fly back, but I was too sick to fly. They had a hospital ship called Wannanilla and mostly it was meant for Australia to take them back to New Guinea. 36.04 They had room for a couple Americans I guess, so we got on that boat and went back to Cairns and the hospital was full, so we went back to Townsville and the hospitals were full. We went right down the coast and in Brisbane the hospitals were full and we got to Sydney and they let a couple guys off there and I was one of them and then they were going to Melbourne and they got you out there weren’t any hospitals built either, so they sent us clear up in the mountains in a resort that was like a little hotel with rooms separate. 14 �36:50 I was in one of those rooms and I was there for quite some time and would see the doctor and nurses and Red Cross. I didn’t see anybody else up there. Interviewer: How well did they take care of you there? I was taken care of well, but you never see anybody and there’s nothing to do. I couldn’t move around and I was going to be there until—they were building a new hospital in Australia, in Sydney. After the Americans started using their hospitals they looked alike. They finally got that built and I was sent down there and finally I went to—I don’t know how many months I was there and then I went to Prince Alfred Hospital and was one of the main hospitals in Sydney and it was right downtown. 37:47 I would keep getting malaria and it takes about six weeks to treat you each time you get malaria. Downtown I thought I was going to go back home and they said—they needed help over there and if you want to go back, and actually I did, if I didn’t have to go back and fight again I’d just as soon stay there, so they sent me out to—they decided they were going to—that same hospital is where my son was born—they were going to send me out to a place where you recover and it was called Warwick Farm out in the outskirts of Sydney and actually it was a horse track, a horserace track. They had a tent city there, so we went back there to be treated. 38:39 Interviewer: Now, at this point could you walk and get around at all? I could walk around then, but I was limited and couldn’t do too much. I didn’t know what they were going to do with me and then they finally interviewed and they got me a job in Sydney in MacArthur’s headquarters. The Grace Building was the tallest building in Sydney and that’s only eleven floors high. They believed tall buildings in the earthquake zone were dangerous. I was put in charge, because I had some experience 15 �like that working at the sanitarium, they put me in charge as the chief clerk they called it, the chief clerk, and I had about thirty people working for me, some civilian and some army. 39:35 Interviewer: What rank were you at that point? I was a Staff Sergeant and they made me a Tech Sergeant, but if you look at the records, I was a platoon sergeant because all the officers were killed and the platoon sergeant was killed and several officers killed, and they were going to give me a battlefield commission, but I got shot up. Our Captain, and they probably never say much about it, his name was Captain Fryerson, he took over from the push, the push fight, and he stayed over there and became a Major, but Fryerson was a coward and he had to go back and be tried and all they did to him was make him a First Lieutenant and kept him in Hawaii, so I don’t know if he did better or worse. 40:34 Interviewer: Now, you’ve been assigned to MacArthur’s headquarters. When was that? I can’t tell you the exact date because a lot of that stuff has slipped out of me. Interviewer: Was it still in 1943? It must have been in 1943. I was in the hospital for quite some time. Of course the people that worked there, none of them liked MacArthur. His little kid would be in the hotel across the road and you would see him playing out there with a Philippine woman looking after him. All the people in my office were all people that had been wounded and the Captain was too. Then they decided to move back to Brisbane, so we went back to Brisbane. 41: 38 Before I went there I had a leave, a week off, and I went to the middle of the city to a hotel there and they had what they called a Trocadero, it was a 16 �dance hall and it had two orchestras, American soldiers, and a revolving stage. The Australian girls were to meet us there and dance with us to get acquainted. On the very first night I met my wife and they weren’t supposed to have anything to do with you on the outside, they leave you at the door. I went every night that week and I continued to go and visit her at her house while I stayed at this Warwick Farm, and then we decided to get married. No one had gotten married in those days; they didn’t allow the American to get married. 42:35 Interviewer: How did you manage it? I had to go see the commanding general of Sydney, I remember General Raleigh, a Brigadier General. My money had never caught up with me since I’d been wounded. He interviewed us and said he would have the Red Cross interview us. He said, “Have you got any money?” I said, “I’ve got a three pound note that I kept throughout the war, but I still haven’t been paid”, and he took money out of his pocket and gave it to me. That was one of the first ones and I had to go through a lot of red tape. Eventually there was thirty thousand Americans marrying Australians. I went back to Brisbane again and my wife came up to Brisbane too and we stayed there for about six months. 43:36 I went back to Sydney again to MacArthur’s headquarters and stayed there for a while and my wife had a baby, my son was born there. Then I went back to Brisbane again, and she couldn’t go up there this time and I was only there a short time. MacArthur’s headquarters was moving to Hollandia, Dutch New Guinea, so we went up there. It’s a different situation when you’re in MacArthur’s headquarters you live like a king. That was all right up there and the point systems came out and I had points in that whole area. I’d been over there long enough in all the conditions and they said I could go home if I wanted to. 17 �They offered me a warrant officer’s job again, but I said I wanted to go home. 44:39 They said, being in MacArthur’s headquarters, I could either fly home or go on the boat. I said I didn’t want to go on the boat because I was sick for three weeks. I had to island hop and sty for two or three days until I could get a plane, and I finally got back to the United States, back to Chicago to be discharged. I went in there to be discharged and they said for me to go home on a month leave and come back and they would discharge me. Interviewer: At that point was your wife able to come with you? My wife wasn’t able—the war wasn’t over yet in Japan and she had to wait a year. She came back on the Lurline, the same beat that we took over. There were about five hundred wives and three hundred babies and the called it the “brides ship”. 45:42 They had an experience when they had that big storm on the ocean and in Hawaii the towns were flattened. Interviewer: While you were stationed at MacArthur’s headquarters, what kind of work were you doing there? It was in the Adjutant General’s Publication Division and we were the ones that printed all of your army regulations books and manuals and assembled them and shipped them out to the different units, to each one of them, to their headquarters. It was an interesting job and I was a supervisor and I was the top non-commissioned officer. 46:45 That particular place was right in Brisbane, the last place I was at before we went to Hollandia. You’ve never been to Australia, but there’s a big town hall there and it’s still there, the town hall, and we had a little separate building right beside it where the Adjutant General’s Publication Division was. It was an interesting job and we had to make all the 18 �corrections in all the army manuals and everything else and make sure that all these units got them throughout all the SW Pacific. We were going to go— MacArthur, while we were up there in Hollandia, had a cabin or a house built up there just for his wife and we were all ready to go to Manila when I had this chance to get out. 47:51 Interviewer: Did you get to see much of MacArthur himself or were you far enough away? He was just in and out. I’d see him in and out all the time and I’d see his little kid playing at the hotel across there, but he wasn’t too popular among the men that worked there and even the other generals. Interviewer: As far as you could tell, why was that? He was a show off kind of a man. Like when he went to New Guinea and he said he didn’t care if every man gets killed, you stay there until you take Buna. He never went up there once. He went to a lot of the places, but he never went there. Then he relieved Harding because they weren’t getting things done fast enough and they put in Eichelberger after that. 48:57 A lot of these famous people--a lot of incidents on the road going up there. One time, all the food was dropped by air and sometimes you go two or three days with no food because you got to keep on going to the next stop and one time everybody had moved out, but part of our company, they dropped a battalion's worth of food on us. All we did was stuff ourselves and they had chocolate bars and they had never perfected chocolate then that wouldn’t melt, so we stuffed our pockets full of it and it melted and got insects and weird incidents like that. We ate grass, but you couldn’t cook anything because you have mortars right on top of you. 49:48 We saw soldiers, 19 �Japanese, they wouldn’t be taken prisoners and they would run out into the ocean and kill themselves with bayonets or grenades so they wouldn’t be taken. . Interviewer: In that period when you were in that Buna sector where the Japanese were, was your unit ever able to move forward at all or make what you would call progress? They made progress, but very slow, you might make a hundred yards and things like that. The main thing was the mortar. I sent one patrol out from my platoon and I’ll never forget that. It was the nighttime and they came back, what few of them did come back and I went on a few of those myself because you can’t make men go if you can’t do it yourself. 50:50 One of the guys in the patrol came back and had no face at all; all he had was holes in his face. Back on Port Moresby I happened to meet him again, but he died. We had a lot—not just malaria, but the dengue fever, the black water fever, and all those, jungle rot and all that and most of the division was killed or wounded. Interviewer: They weren’t all killed, but ninety percent of them were either dead or unfit for duty. That’s right, they weren’t all killed. Interviewer: For a lot of them, Buna was the war even if they survived. 51:46 It doesn’t seem like it was worth it for what—every little step that you had going toward Japan, because they were island hopping from then on and a lot of this—it was all along the coast, but you’re in your own little shelter and you only had half a company and our Captain, he’s be right in the middle with his men all around him because there was no front line. No food, no conditions and it was horrible thoughts when you start seeing your men get killed one after another, 20 �Interviewer: In the longer run they did learn some things from it. MacArthur didn’t do quite that same kind of thing again; they had better equipment and better supplies and medicine. You guys were the guinea pigs. 52:44 We were there before we should have been there and the equipment we had—the BAR’s would rust and it was hard to keep your equipment. In every squad you had one 03 rifle from WWI because we could launch grenades with it, so we had one in every squad. Whoever had that machine gun, sub machine gun; he would get killed right off the bat because they hated him. In fact, finally I got one too and I took it from my men because nobody wanted to carry it. 53:31 Interviewer: Was that a Thompson sub-machine gun? Yes, with a 20 drum. We had fifty drums, fifty shells, but they rattled. Interviewer: Those were the gangster movie ones right? Yeah, but they were troublesome too, they wouldn’t always work. You got equipment— you didn’t have any equipment to take care of stuff like that. No supplies except what was carried up by natives and no contact because there were no radios and stuff. Eventually they had a few tanks in there, but we never saw any tanks. It probably shows you in the records that there were, but I never saw a tank there at all. 54:15 Interviewer: Most of that stuff comes in later. The Japanese had those 37 mm’s and we didn’t get them until later. We didn’t have anything big and we couldn’t fight against those pillboxes. The mortars wouldn’t touch them and machine guns wouldn’t touch them. Interviewer: You would have to get up very close with grenades and get lucky. 21 �I didn’t want to have to—you slept at night with your buddy and we were awake all night. You had several men who were killed. They killed each other because they thought it was a Jap. You would wake up and it was too late. Interviewer: Did you manage to catch any Japanese trying to sneak into your position? There were dead ones all around, rotten and smelly. 55:09 They were all around us because we couldn’t get up. You couldn’t dig down to make a slick trench because there was water. Those kinds of conditions were just horrible. I saw a lot of our men get killed. Interviewer: Now, to kind of move here back out at the other end. You finally get back to the states and have been discharged etc. What did you do at that point? Then I—because I didn’t know what I was going to do, and of course I had a son and a wife, and the year that I had training in college wasn’t enough and I had to get a job fast. So, at that time, I had to go around and check out different places and in fact I wanted to—I had enough cash to buy a new car, but they wouldn’t sell you a new car if you didn’t have an old one to turn in. 56:18 I was going to get a Ford, but at they time it was only $700.00 for a new Ford, but they wouldn’t sell it to you. I had to borrow my dad’s car until later on I got another car, but being interviewed I got to the Sinclair Refining company and I got a job there. It was a dress-up job in the office and the man that had the job before hadn’t gotten out of the army yet and he let it be known that he didn’t want to come back there again, so I got that job. 57:09 The boss was a real eager beaver guy and he had me belong to every organization and things like that. Then I’ll be darned if the guy didn’t come back and he said he wanted his job back and according to 22 �the government I had to give it up. Then I went to work for the Kellogg Company. They wanted me to be in the office, but there weren’t any vacancies yet, so I worked six months in the plant. I got in the office and I ended up in the research at Kellogg’s, which was interesting and from then on I worked there for thirty-four years in different capacities, but mostly in the engineering offices and planning section because of the experience I had in MacArthur’s headquarters. 58:09 A lot of that helped me. I just stayed there and I had four children and I belong to a lot of different organization and active in the church and active—I’ve been a DAV, American Legion, I belong to them all. Now, all of my children are grown up and my son was a full Colonel and my son in law was a full Colonel, they were in Vietnam. I had one grand kid go to West Point and she had to go to Iraq twice as a Captain where she met her husband to be who was a Major and two weeks ago, on the holiday, they had a big wedding in Pennsylvania at the was college. It was a big outfit with three hundred people there. They had the crossed swords you know how they do? 59:13 My son keeps up—he probably knows as much about the 32nd Division as I do. He’s an ardent reader of history and he was a deputy commander at Fort Carson, the last job he had. He’s still dealing with the army. They sent him overseas and they send him to Washington every now and then. They want his opinion because he was on airplanes and disposing of equipment and because of the technical knowledge that he has. He’s well known all around and he knows all the generals. He should have been a general—he had a brigade command for one term, but because the army got cut back, the Colonel’s, had to do a brigadier’s job. :11 That’s how close he got to it. 23 �Interviewer: To look back on the whole thing now, how do you think your time in the service had an effect on you? You talked about the experience you got in Macarthur’s headquarters. What else do you think you carried with you out of all that? Well there was one thing—our original group is back to seven men now and I think we had about a hundred and seventy men and their all gone now and there was better comradeship What I find is people have their college friends, high school friends, and people you work with, but I think people that you fight with and protect each other is a different feeling. You have a different comradeship. These people are life long friends and not like the rest of them. I can’t compare them with the high school people or people you worked with or church people or whoever else, so in general, as I look back on it now, it was a good experience. 1:28 Interviewer: Thank you very much for talking to me today and that finishes the tape. 24 �25 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Cripps, Donald (Interview transcript and video), 2008 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Cripps, Donald Description An account of the resource Donald Cripps joined the Michigan National Guard in 1940 and served in Company C of the 126th Infantry Regiment, 32nd (Red Arrow) Division during World War II. He describes training in Louisiana, service in Australia and New Guinea. He was wounded at Buna in New Guinea and then was stationed in Australia after he recovered. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans United States--National Guard World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Video recordings Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2008-06-05 Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context CrippsD Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project Collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives