435 24 26018 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d6b449024744c7a8afa6046410f7e31f.pdf 0ca96ff01c2cbf9f72cd8abcda57f07d PDF Text Text ··· . Jewish Foundation for Ouistian Rescuers . 4000 Town Center, Suite 420 Southfield; Michigan 48075-1405 ~~~ -~ . •• Moral Courage During the Holocaust and in a Post Holocaust World. '1~ _ A · Hol<>aU$lM~oria.1 ~~ One Day Conference _ . . . .. , WEDNE.SPAY, .QCTQBER. 23;.1991 . . . . . �Mllri4 Dumul, heroine of Huguenot history, writing "RESIST" Tdlere site tDOS imc prisontll. Drtnoing by Slllfllld. Bastidi. · . . From gmeration to gmtnztion . , . Mme. Haitw (cmta bthind boy), 11 rescllel" · "Bllnality "[ /r/Jffl Le 01111nbcm, llppt!ll"8 here with four lldditional gmmltions of her family. (from "Wtapans of the Spirit"). Eflil" "'J flllly Otitllgo, 1989 . ·" The Jewish Fou~da~ion f_or Chri~tian·Rescuers ·. · · _ _. -·_ -~.-: . of.the . · . · . · ·: -··An.J i-Defamation League . . in cooperatio~ with • . . The HoJocaust Memorial Center . · presents Moral Courage During the Holocaust and in a Post Holocaust World . .. . .Wednesday, ·October 23,1991 _:· .on the ca~pus of . The_Jewish -~ o~munity Ce~ter . ·West Bloomfield, Michigan_. · "Moral Courage During .t he Hol~caus~ and i11: ·a Post Holocaust World" is a oneday co~ference .examining from .historical and psychological perspectives;.the questions: What .were the motivations of those righteous few during ·the Holo- · caust? Why were there so few people U?ho acted righteously? . Can the moral-under-. . · pinnings of th~ righteous be taught and practiced today? · of · _· Designed for:·att ethnically diver~e group edu~ator~, religious leaders_an·d : other interested parties, the conference will serve as a catalyst - for 'further .discussion and dissemination information and will promote· creative and · 'effective ways of teaching and helping to put into practice valu_es of righteous.ness and moral courage. . . . . . . . . of s •• ,· �:· MORAL COURAGE .. ... . . . . ' '·. . . ·Wednesday, c;>c!ob_er 23, 1991 _Program .· 8:30A.M. - . · ' ... _, REGISTRATION AND CONTINENTAL BREAKFAST ,1 MORNING SESSION - "Historical Perspectives" · _.... OPTION A .· . .._. - .. . -: ·. . . • . Dr. ·-oavid Wyman ·_ · ·. ·.. · • Response: . Dr. ·Melvin Small · · . Moderator: pr. .·Guy Stem ... : . . . . . 9:30 -A.M. , OPTION u· _· . ._ :.' .• · Audio Visual Presentation .. . . Viewing and discussion of a ·sampling 'o f films curr~ntly available .. on the subjects of the Holocaust, Hidden Children -and :i;no:ral courage. ·. . . . . . . ..· . · Moderator: Dr. Carol Rittner . NOON - l_:00 P.M: LUNCH . . Program to be announced . _ - · 1:lSP~~s P.M.__. -.-.. . . . u· AFTERNOON sESSION . "Psycholog~ Perspectives" . · ·· · · • · Dr. Yehudah Nir • · Response: Dr. Emanuel Tanay · . Moderator: _Dr. · Guy Stem . OPTION A · · · ··. · . · . or:rioNs · . . , .· - . . ·· • Audio Visual Presentation continued ·. : .Moderator: Dr. Carol Rittner ' i3REAK' · - ·. 3:15 P.M:-.3:30 P.M. ·. . ··. 3:30 P.M. - 5:00 P;M. : · ,· · . . OPTIONA ·. . Small group discussions to be facilitate4 by staff and other ,. guests . .· .· . . . . OPTION B ·, . . . . . ~ Independent viewing of the Holocaust Memorial Center; . ·. · ··. Docents available . ·. . · . · . . : · · ' .· . · · ~ 5:00 P.M. - 7:30 P.M. . . BREAK/INDEPENDENT DINNER · , . 7:30P.M. . ~ ··• ' : III EVENiNG SESSION::. PUBLIC-LECTURE : • Keynote Speaker: -Professor David Wyman . - .. · · _Summarizing the day's events ang. looking tQ the future . • : .DESSERT RECEPTION . . . . ·_: ' ' . . "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones." Wm. Shakespeare (Julius Caesar, Act 3) . · · :A~ti-Defamat_ion League of B'n~i B'i.ith -·. · · 4000.TownCenter ~ ·suite420 • .Southfield,Michfgan48075-1405 • ·_ ~313)355~3730 . PRINTED ON RECYCLED. PAPER . .. 1,,J · �The Jewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers The Jewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers is a program of th,e Anti~DefamationLeague. The Foundation provides recognition of and support to individuals who rescued Jews during the Nazi Holocaust. The Foundation: • sponsors conferences, publications and films on moral courage, altruism, and other ethical and educational implications of the rescuers' acts; · • provides modest grants to over 650 rescuers in 15 countries who are in finandal need; and • organizes, through its Reyim ("friends") project, regular volunteer visitation, phone contact, and other services to isolated rescuers; • The Foundation's program budget is raised entirely by public support. We thank you for your support! This conference has been made possible through a generous contribution from the Carol and Joel Dorfman Educational Foundation. TheJewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers gratefully appreciates their.support. · The .Participants · . · Yehudah Nir - Dr. Nir is an Associate Professor of Psychiatry at Cornell Medical College, Cornell University. A recognized authority on the psychological aspects of victimization, he is the author of The Lost Childhood. Sister Caro'I Rittner, R.S.M. - Dr. Rittneds the co-producer of the AcademyAward nominated documentary film, "The Courage to Care".· She is widely sought to speak on the subject of moral righteousness_. Melvin Small - Dr. Small, a Professor of History at Wayne State University has focused on the historical context of The Holocaust and will offer his insights during the morning session. Guy Stern - Dr. Stem is Distinguished Professorof German_and Comparative Literature at Wayne State University. The author of several books and pamphlets incl tiding "Nazi BookBurningand the American Response", he is expert in the literature of exiles. Dr. Stem will serve as Moderator of the Conference. Emanuel Tanay -Dr. TanayisProfessorof Psychiatry at Wayne State University. Himselfahiddenchild,hehas gained international recognition as a forensic psychiatrist. David Wyman - Dr. Wyman is Professor of History and Judaic Studies at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst. The authorof the Abandonment of the Jews, he will open the Conference's morning Session and be the Keynote Speaker during the Evening Program. ----------. -------. REGISTRATION - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - . - · -Moral Courage During the Holocaust and in a Post Holocaust World Program - Wednesday, October 23, 1991 · Jewish Community Center Campus, West Bloomfield, Michigan · Names of all participants are required; guests are welcome. If you h_ave any questions, please call the AOL office, (313) 355-3730 -----'-----------------•FEES: NAME ADDRESS _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ OCCUPATION/TITLE _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ $ 35.00perpe.rson, . No._ at$ 35.. 00 includes Options A or B, Conference materials, Continental Breakfast, Lunch . and Dessert Reception following the · Evening Program $ _ _ __ HOME PHONE _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ WORKPHONE GUEST _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ ADDRESS _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ OCCUPATION/TITLE _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ HOME PHONE - - - - ' - - - - - - ' - - W O R K PHONE______ Please provide additional guest information on a separate sheet $ 25.00 per person, includes Options A or B, Conference materials, Continental Breakfast, and Lunch. No._at$25.00 $ _ _ __ $18.00perperson, Evening Program only including Dessert Reception. . No._at$18.00 Student rates available on request, TOTAL ENCLOSED. $ _ _ __ $ _ _ _--' Make check payable to Jewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers/ AOL/MI · . Please return regiStration form and remittance to: Jewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers, c/o Anti-Defamation League • 4000 Town Center,Suite 420, Southfield, Michigan48075 �ANTI-DEFAMATION LEAGUE OF B'NAI B'RITH National Chairperson: Melvin Salberg NationalDirector: Abraham H. Foxman MIOilGAN COMMITI'EE JEWISH FOUNDATION FOR OIRISTIAN RESCUERS/AOL . Chairperson: Fran Gross Linden JEWISH FOUNDATION FOR CHRISTIAN RESCUERS/ ADL Founding Chairperson: Rabbi Harold M. Schulweis Chairperson: E. Robert Goodkind Director: Dennis B. Klein MI OUGAN REGIONAL OFFICE ANTI.:.DEFAMATION LEAGUE OF B'NAI B'RITH President: Norman H. Beitner Director: RichardLopenthal Committee Esther Applebaum Cheryl Bloom Rabbi Ernst Conrad Carol Fogel Jay Gerber Howard Goldberg Barry J. Goodman Tammy Gorosh Nancy Grand Greg Herman Jonathan Jaffa Nancy Kurland Simpson Rene Lieberman Lisa Mendelson Paula Milgrom Shelley Nadiv Judi Rosen Cheryl Scott Cherie Selis Michelle Sider Charles Soberman Leslie Taub Arlene Victor Harold Zucker Vice Presidents Gene A. Farber Barry J. Goodman Fran Gross Linden Ruth Lando Sheri T. Schiff HOLOCAUST MEMORIAL CENTER Rabbi Charles Rosenzveig Founder & Executive Vice President Founded by:.ShaarH Haplaytah For Information on the HMC, tours or membership applications, contact the Holocaust Memorial Center 6602 W . Maple Road, West Bloomfield, MI 48322 • (313) 661-0840 JEWISH FOUNDATION FOR CHRISTIAN RESCUERS • · 4000 Town Center, Suite 420, Southfield, MI 48075 • (313) 355"3730 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Adriana B. and Peter N. Termaat collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Termaat, Adriana B. (Schuurman) Termaat, Peter N. Description An account of the resource Collection contains genealogical, personal, and family papers and photographs documenting the lives and interests of Adriana and Peter Termaat. The bulk of the materials are related to family history and genealogical research carried out by the Termaats, including research notes and materials about places in the Netherlands that were significant to the Termaat and Schuurman families, such as the city of Alkmaar. Other materials in the collection are related to the Termaats' experiences on the eve of and during the Second World War, especially the German occupation of the Netherlands and the Termaats' participation in organized resistance to the Nazis. Also included are materials that document the family's post-war life in the United States, including their public efforts to recognize, commemorate, and honor people and events significant to World War II. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1869 - 2012 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/719">Adriana B. and Peter N. Termaat collection, RHC-144</a> Subject The topic of the resource Netherlands Netherlands--History--German occupation, 1940-1945 World War, 1939-1945 World War, 1939-1945 -- Underground movements -- Netherlands Dutch Dutch Americans Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-144 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Text Image Type The nature or genre of the resource application/pdf image/jpeg Language A language of the resource eng nl Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-144_Termaat_DOC_1991-10-23-ADL-Moral-Courage-Conference Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1991-10-23 Title A name given to the resource Moral Courage During the Holocaust and in a Post Holocaust World conference program Description An account of the resource Conference agenda for "Moral Courage During the Holocaust and in a Post Holocaust World," sponsored by the Jewish Foundation for Christian Rescuers and the Anti-Defamation League. Subject The topic of the resource World War, 1939-1945 Courage Heroes Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/719">Adriana B. and Peter N. Termaat collection (RHC-144)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d5ec16d755532bbef1ce6d09f1beb288.mp4 fd083317bfe7abdbed55b62b1d3d6d48 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4ea30830d7424f319c315b45a6d2e9e2.pdf 5f00b4661883bc3e49456009f2ca00f2 PDF Text Text ORAL HISTORY INTERVIEW Tom Jillson Interviewed by: James Smither PhD, GVSU Veterans History Project, Transcribed by: Joan Raymer, November 19, 2013 Interviewer: Mr. Jillson, can you begin by giving us a little bit of background on yourself, starting with where and when were you born? Sure, I was born in 1947 at Butterworth Hospital, right here in the Grand Rapids area. East Grand Rapids is where we lived, in the home of Gerald Ford, and my family did know and meet them. As a matter of fact, drove to Washington DC and met them and went through the oval office when he was down there, as a matter of fact. And I had conversations, through the mail, with Gerald Ford. It was kind of interesting growing up in East Grand Rapids, and it’s a little better to do area and surprisingly, most of the kids that graduated high school in East Grand Rapids went on to college, immediately, and I’m sure my parents had that plan for me as well. Interviewer: What did your father do for a living? My father was an insurance state agent, which meant he was a consultant, effectively, to the agents around the state of Michigan. 1:05 He traveled and he was home, probably, most every weekend, but the four days in the middle of the week, he was out visiting throughout the state. Halfway through my growing up he got transferred to Traverse City, Michigan and started a home office for the Home Insurance Company, in his home, and traveled from there, which was a lot less cumbersome for us, because we got to have him home a lot more, at that time. But, that was only three years and it was 7th, 8th, 9th and partway into the 10th grade and then we moved back down to East Grand Rapids and I took over my high school work at East Grand Rapids High School. About the time I 1 �was ready to graduate a buddy of mine decided that it was time to go and look at the military and see what the recruiters had to say, so I went along with him. 2:02 he didn’t join, but I did, that same day as a matter of fact. I joined the Air Force and got kind of excited about it. The reason I chose the Air Force is my brother Victor, who's a few years older than me, a twin to my brother David, joined the Air Force and was stationed in Biloxi, Mississippi, working in electronics and that was exciting to me. Electronics technology, and when he came home on leave he would build a radio, or something like that, and I got really excited that the Air Force could do that kind of thing for people. So, that was kind of what I had in mind, I wanted to join the air force, learn technology, and I did. As a matter of fact, in the first few months I got into technology. Halfway through my training, which I’ll get into in just a moment, but first of all I joined in June, graduated in June, joined in June, and was shipped out to Detroit to get mustered in and do all the paperwork. 3:05 It took about three or four days to get through all the mustering process because I had some hearing problems they said, so they put me through all sorts of tests and finally passed me through and sent me down to Lackland Air Force Base for basic training. This was right at the beginning of the real rush of kids joining the military, because of Vietnam in 1965. Interviewer: That rush to join the military, was that a rush to avoid being drafted or was it a call coming out to serve your country, because they needed people? I felt the patriotism the reason that I joined. I felt the draw, because I wanted to get in the military, I wanted to help stop the bad things that were going on. I don’t think it had anything to do with missing the draft, and again, I’d only been eighteen for a few weeks and it hadn’t even entered my mind that would happen. 4:00 It didn’t bother me, 2 �because I was ready for it and it was the right thing to do. College material, I could have gone to college and probably would have signed up for Grand Rapids Community College in the autumn, but I heard the nice recruiter talking about all the things I could get out of the military, education benefits, which I did use once I got out. When I joined the air force, got switched down to Texas, to get into Lackland Air Force Base, they had shortened the basic training from the normal thirteen weeks, or twelve weeks, to about a five to six week impacted training, and then they would send us out to whatever training we were going to go through for our career and finish it up at that point. Interviewer: Describe that first phase of training and what that experience was like. The Lackland Air Force Base and the basic training, I talked about it many times, and as a matter of fact, when my older brother, the twin of Victor, who had already been in and out of the air force, joined about a year and a half later and I’d visited him at Lackland Air Force Base when he was going through it. 5:08 The proof of what I’m going to say, I can describe as I watched him. Lackland Air force Base, or any basic training for any military purposes, and they can attest to this, I think their job is to break you down to a two year old and then build you back up into a man or woman, if it’s a woman joining the military. They did a very, very good job of making you feel totally inadequate, but then start building some belief in myself and to trust in the people that were directing me, the officers and NCO’s, etc., that were in control of whatever our lives were at that time. We learned how to dress, we learned how to shave, and we learned how to make sure our haircut looked good, polish our shoes. 6:00 To spend four hours polishing your shoes to the spit shine, shine seemed like a very inane thing to do, however it was important to the process, to make us feel proud of what we had. If there was a little dot of water on 3 �our shoe, we knew that it was a bad thing. Today I don’t care if I walk through the snow and ice, but back then it made a big difference. Interviewer: Did you have a sense that the people who were, the drill instructors and so forth, that there was sort of a logic to it and if you learn to do it their way you were fine, or did they play more games with your head than that? They played a lot of games with all of our heads and some of the people that were appointed as our student, or our squad leaders, or whatever, that weren’t any further along than we were, but were somehow recognized as being a leader, or having leadership talent, I don’t think that they had a clue of what the overall plan of what basic training was, but certainly there was a plan. 7:08 The intent had probably worked for two hundred years, to bring somebody in, getting them to trust the people that were going to tell them what to do when they got to the battlefield, or whatever else. To be able to respond quickly in the way they were told to and not just start thinking, “Maybe that’s not a good idea. Maybe I’ll just not do that”. Anyway, they got to that point with all of us. Sergeant Cahill, I remember him to this day getting right up to my nose and looking for the whiskers that—I hadn’t grown any beard up to that point, or anything else and that’s why I kind of have one now. I had to be clean shaven and they ran me through the whole role, noticed that I had a couple whiskers showing and I should have shaved better, or whatever. He was a nice guy, but you couldn’t see that during the day. 8:03 You could only see that during his down time, and whenever we got a chance to just sit down and you know, whatever. He would drink a beer and we would drink our milk until we turned twenty-one. Interviewer: Now, when you got through that phase, what did you do next? 4 �That phase went so quickly, it was unbelievable. I learned marching tactics and I learned all sorts of things. We did an awful lot of marching and an awful lot of calisthenics and an awful lot of that kind of stuff. It felt like a couple of weeks went by and all of a sudden the six weeks was over and I was shipped out to where--I didn’t know where I was going to, they didn’t tell me that I was going to go up to Chanute Air Force Base in Illinois and learn electronics. I said, “Fine, that sounds good”, and they wanted me to get into this electronics that was a fifty-four week training program. “Okay, that’s technology, that’s exciting, that’s building the radios that my brother did.” 9:03 The interesting thing is, that it was really geared toward the “Hound Dog Missile”, which was phased out before I got done with training, so they transferred me out of that. But, during that period of time, since I was in the long electronics course, there were some people that came in just to be an electrician. They might have been there for twelve weeks, or sixteen weeks and then they’re gone. I was in the fifty-four week program, so almost immediately, when I got to Chanute Air Force Base, I was appointed as a “Green Rope”, which was a squad leader and holding that green rope just meant that I had a little bit of authority over these six or seven guys that were in my barracks. After that first batch of kids had graduated and gone to being an electrician, or whatever else, I was appointed as a “Red Rope”. I’d moved up a stage, which meant I was in charge of a whole squadron—a whole; I think it was larger than a squadron. 10:00 I can’t remember what the group was, but that “Red Rope” meant that “Green Ropes” reported to me and we had discussions about what to do about specific infractions of the rules, you know, to make things nicer for the kids that were—I always called them kids once I got to that authority level and I was younger than most of them. Some of the fellas came in halfway through 5 �college or at twenty or twenty-one years old and here I am still eighteen or nineteen. But, that didn’t matter, nor did it matter even for the career folks. They always had young kids coming in as 2nd Lieutenants that were their boss, regardless if they’d been in the service for thirty years, but they only had seven stripes and reported to this little guy that came in new and had been in the military for two weeks, and the 2nd Lieutenant could tell him what to do. It was an interesting hierarchy and it didn’t take me long to realize that I was not going to be a career military. 11:03 I was in there for the short term, I was in there for my four years of duty and that was it. But, I also felt that I really wanted to do what I joined the military for, and thinking Vietnam at that I joined, I wanted to get to Vietnam. I didn’t think I was going to get there. After Chanute, after the training the decision halfway through that the Hound Dog Missile’s not going to go forward, that we’re not going to continue this program for these folks, you have a choice, you can either get into cryptology or you can get in accounting, and I didn’t think that cryptology was really career directed towards outside the military, and I knew I wasn’t going to be career military, so I chose accounting and that was probably a good move. They switched me down to Webb Air Force Base, which is a little base in Texas, in West Texas. 12:00 When I flew in the first time to that base, in the airplane I looked out the windows and there were lights forever. I thought it was the biggest city in world and, “How come I didn’t hear about this?” We got down there and found the town was probably about thirty-six hundred people, maybe four thousand people, and all these lights were the oil wells in West Texas. We flew into that and realized this was just the towers and the pumps out there in the wilderness. In Texas, West Texas, there’s nothing for fifty miles in every direction. The town was called Big Spring and the big spring was 6 �a little tiny trickle at the park in the middle of town, and that was about it. The closest actual water that you could swim in was seventeen miles out of town. It was a leveed up reservoir and it was kind of interesting and we drove out there quite a few times. I worked like a regular job for two and a half years while I was stationed in Texas and got to know a lot of the local folks and meet some of the families of some of the other people that lived in that area. 13:06 My roommate happened to be in charge of the civilian, or actually the kids of the military. I can’t remember what they actually called it, it was not a U.S.O., or something like that and we had those as well. They had a place where the kids of the officers could go to and kind of play and he was the director of that, so I got to go along with him on his job quite often and he got to meet quite a few of the folks. I suspect it was my relationship with one of the Colonel’s daughters that perked him up a bit and that’s probably why I ended up going to Vietnam. He said, “I don’t think so”, so he shipped me out. Interviewer: What did your duties actually consist of while you there on the base? I was in accounting and there I was a straight accounting clerk. I did payroll, runs, interestingly, computers, which is what I’m doing now; I work for a company called Trivalant, which is a network group now. 14:05 Back then I was a key punch operator. Even in the mid-sixties I was working in computers and technology, but the interesting thing then was, instead of doing paychecks we would do these keypunch cards and there was a keypunch card for every employee, every payroll run , and we’d have to take that box of cards for all these folks over to the computer, run them through to alphabetize them twenty-six times, one for every letter of the alphabet to get them all A through Z. then we would carry that back and we’d actually run those cards through a check printer 7 �that duplicate the information, basically, on the check and put the payroll together. I also did temporary duty. Probably the most important thing that happened during those two and a half years was I learned my first sales words from one of the clerks that worked alongside of me and his name was Bill Boyer. 15:03 I couldn’t figure out why all these officers and all these folks that came in to do their temporary paperwork would always gravitate towards Bill rather than me. At that particular time in my life I couldn’t understand why anybody would spend any moments of their life talking about sports, or talking about anything besides the business at hand. My job was my job and that was why I was there, but Bill always took the time to listen. He never shared one thing about him, he always listened and what he always said to people was, “Is that right? That’s really interesting, what else happened?” He asked questions and he showed interest and he showed me, really, how to sell. To listen and to care about people and it was not overt for him, he didn’t know he was this, but I was learning from him and I really appreciated that. 16:05 That memory has stuck with me all the way through. I didn’t become a sales person, I was an accountant at that time, remember, and I didn’t become a sales person until, probably, two years after I got out of the military and realized—put those two pieces together ad kind of went on in that direction. Interviewer: At that time, there was no particular profit to be generated by you coming to that realization? No commissions, or anything else, but it’s just that I felt, “Why do they like him and why do they not like me?” Well, it’s because he cared and he didn’t do anything different except listen, so I learned how to listen at that time. 8 �Interviewer: And you knew the Colonel’s daughter well enough to get sent somewhere else. Yeah Interviewer: How was that, did you just get a notice sent to you? Absolutely, and it wasn’t too long after a couple dates and she probably mentioned to her dad that she was seeing this enlisted guy and he probably shook his head and I think I even got sent to talk to the Chaplain for a moment to hear him say, “It’s probably not a good idea for you to go along with your buddy to the Spice anymore and see this particular girl”. 17:11 Whatever, she was good, I mean it was nice and I was a good straight up guy, but it still wasn’t something that he wanted to deal with. At least that’s my suspicion; I have no proof other than the Chaplain telling me that. But yes, I just did get a notice that within two weeks I would be shipped out and I had two weeks of vacation, or two weeks of leave that I could take beforehand. I went back home, got ready, got shipped out to—took an airplane, took a commercial plane over to California and waited for three days to get a transport plane. We were expecting to take a commercial plane over there and by the time three days had gone by and we’re sitting in this airport, we were ready to take anything. 18:04 We ended up going on a transport plane, a C-140, with a box, a cardboard box of sandwiches that was our lunch as we went over there. We stopped in Hawaii for about thirty-five minutes and I happened to know the senior master sergeant that was stationed with me back in Texas that was stationed there, so I called him and let him know that I was coming in. He hustled over and we got to talk to each other for about fifteen minutes and then I had to take off. We went over to Wake Island, which was a—you say Wake Island and you think that’s an actual place to 9 �go, but there were like about twelve people on the island wearing T-shirts and shorts and that was it. We got more gas, flew out and dropped off some boxes that we had taken to them and flew over to Da Nang. We landed in Da Nang on April 18th, I believe and it was 1968. 19:04 It was a good time, we came in during the day and it was a good time just to get adjusted for about three days. I didn’t know where I was going to be, or what I was—who I was going to work for, or whatever, but it was quickly assigned where I was going to be in the barracks with the other accounting folks. My only task for the first six months was to be a clerk at the airport, at where all the airplanes come in for all the military coming into the country, or the military going out of country and going back home, or even civilians. The first five or six months I had to meet every airplane and what that entailed was one airplane. Almost every day it was one airplane about eleven o’clock at night, so the good news about that was I didn’t have to work during the day, didn’t have to report to the office, didn’t have to do anything, I just waited until the airplane showed up. 20:00 It was about a forty-five to fifty minute task to make sure everybody went through and traded their money from green money they couldn’t use in country to the military pay certificates, which I traded for each one of the quarters, dines, nickel’s in dollars, ten dollars and twenty, I think we had the twenties at that time. Interviewer: So, why wouldn’t they just let people use American money or bring their money in with them? A couple of reasons, first of all, green money around the world is always on the black market, people wanting to get the green money just for whatever reason and there was a value to it, so you would actually pay more in whatever trade that they were giving, so we wanted to keep it out of the military hands. That was the intent of the military pay 10 �certificates and that had happened since WWII. Every conflict, every combat zone, folks were given this paper money. 21:00 Another couple of reasons why is because of the jingling change that the marines and the army didn’t want in their pockets, because it would be a giveaway that somebody was there if you’re trying to hide and that’s not a good thing, but a little piece of paper, which is worth five cents, doesn’t jingle. So, they wanted to get the change out of the hands of the military as well. So truly, every dine, every penny, not pennies, they could keep pennies for whatever reason, but there wasn’t that many of them, obviously, but every nickel up had to be switched for paper and that was my job. The first five months I did that and then I did get a couple tasks of taking cash out of the office in Da Nang and we had to take a helicopter, or a transport plane, or whatever down to a couple little cities, or towns around, to pay contractors, Australian contractors, Canadian contractors, and others. 22:03 Some of them didn’t want checks, some of them didn’t want MPC’s, so we had to actually take them green money. I had a Marine sergeant that went with me, he was my guard, and we never really got into too much trouble. I had the bracelet around my wrist taking this money down to them and the Marine sergeant was my body guard for that purpose. We went down to Pleiku, which is a little town, probably, forty miles or fifty miles south of Da Nang. Da Nang was right on the border right near the demilitarized zone. Da Nang was an interesting place too, the China Beach television show was taken on China Beach, which was about twelve or thirteen miles out of town and right on the ocean. An interesting thing I mentioned in the first five months, I didn’t work except at night, so I had to find things to do during the day and one of the interesting things I did was I found a camera. 23:03 I had television in my barracks, so everybody kind of gathered into my booth, my little 11 �cube that I lived in, to watch, I think we had Bonanza, and we even had Star Trek at that time and that was a fun time, we actually had good times. I had the benefit of getting to know some of the people that were in the barracks all day long, because I had nothing better to do, no work to do, no work assigned until the first sergeant found out that I was free and found things for me to do. We played cards, and I didn’t see, but I’m sure there was stuff going around. You always hear about Vietnam and drugs and all that kind of thing, but I did not see that. I guess the crowd that gathered around me, and the crowd that happened to be around me, was not that group. Interviewer: You were in a barracks with a bunch of accountants, right? 24:00 Well yeah, maybe that’s it, that’s the reason, but we did get into poker and we did get into roulette wheels and we did get into some of the gambling stuff, which was somewhat condoned. We did it openly, out in the middle of the barracks. Barracks, barracks and then the latrines were all up the middle of the area and the inside of those barracks was where the airplanes, fighter jets, and everything, were kind of stores, but it was interesting to me that around the perimeter of the base they put the personnel, knowing that the rickets and snipers and everything else were right on the outside edge. There were two fences right on the outside edge with barbed wire and control towers and everything else, two separated lines in the demilitarized zone we had around our base. It was probably about forty yards between those two fences. 25:00 The other interesting thing to me too was, along with the personnel and the barracks around the edge of the base, the hospital was set right on the corner, on the outside edge, where the helicopter came in to bring in the wounded and everything else, was right there on the edge and we’d always have snipers out there just taking pot shots at the helicopter pilots and it 12 �didn’t seem smart to me. But, that’s the way they built the base and intended it. I guess there’s no protection when you’re flying in anyway, whether you’re sixty yards further in, or whatever. Interviewer: In general, what was the country like was it hilly or really flat? The monsoon area, the area that I was in had a lot of vegetation. The interesting thing in the buildings that we worked and lived in, when we first got there we were interested to find that in the United States you see all the plugs in the walls close to the floor, just a foot and a half up from the floor. 26:04 All the power and everything else was five feet up, they were up in the middle of the wall and we could never figure it out until monsoon season came through and the water in our accounting offices, and everything else, everything was built to withstand about a foot and a half of water trenching through there for two, or three, or five day period of time when the monsoons would hit. But Vietnam, in that area, was very lush a lot trees, a lot of green, a lot of dirt roads, there was almost nothing paved, but between Da Nang and China Beach there was a good paved highway and every day there was probably six, or seven, buses that would take us from the base out to China Beach, so we could actually go to the beach, and the beach was fun. It was probably the most beautiful beach I’ve ever been on. 27:01 We had about seven, or eight military guys on blankets and there were no girls. There was a whole batch of Vietnamese kids that would hover on the edge of the beach, kind of down towards town. They weren’t really allowed on the beach, per se, but sometimes they got there and there wasn’t any way to keep them off. It was interesting that after I’d been there, probably, three, four, or five months and got to know some of the people around and even some of the kids and got to recognize them, and they got to recognize me, that sometimes they 13 �would steal things from blankets when military guys would go into the water, or whatever. You’ve got to watch out for the water in Vietnam too, the jellyfish, sharks, and all sorts of stuff. I learned that first hand on seeing those jellyfish, “Oh those are pretty”, and they’re kind of dangerous too, so don’t step on them. 28:00 But anyway, the beach is beautiful, they even had a PX, which was a store, and they had a restaurant where you could get a hamburger, you could get french fries, you could get a milk shake, of course I only made twenty-one hundred dollars the year I was in Vietnam, so I didn’t have a lot of cash to spend, but a hamburger only cost fifteen cents. You’ve got to realize that cigarettes only cost twenty-one cents, but we were rationed and I didn’t smoke, so I had a little more extra money than some of the folks. I could trade my rations to somebody else that smoked, twenty-one cents, or whatever, I didn’t care. Interviewer: Aside from going to the beach when you were going off base, was there anyplace else you could go? Well, there’s certainly places to go, there was an NCO club, which I went to all the time, and I would also go to the—not the NCO, just the enlisted club, but they had shows that would come in. 29:00 Monkey Mountain, if you’ve ever heard that term in Vietnam, was very close to us as well and that was where the marines were stationed. They garnered quite a few national, international, stars that would come over. Bob Hope got there, I think, one time during the year, but I couldn’t get out there, I was either working, probably meeting that airplane, or whatever when he was in town, but there were several important people that would come, and there were some singers and the ones that we really enjoyed the most were the Korean bands that would come in and imitate American singers. Those guys were fantastic, they couldn’t speak English, but they could sing 14 �those songs. I’m sure there was Chuck Berry in every single one of them and they did some good stuff. I actually had a pretty good time most of the time that I was in Vietnam. 30:01 There were good people and I made some good friendships. I actually worked part time for the Chase Manhattan Bank that also had an office. I was in accounting and they needed tellers and they hired a fella by the name of Rumbah, I can’t remember his first name that worked with me. They hired me just to be a clerk, probably for only four months, but I always tell people that in Vietnam I worked for Chase Manhattan Bank. I was just a teller for that, but it really was just a part time thing. I was really a teller for the government. The last six months, besides taking some cash, and that only happened three or four time, to some contractors I was assigned the negative side of trading those military facetive tickets, instead of meeting the airplanes for the guys coming in and going out, I had to go to the hospitals and go from bed to bed to bed for that were either wounded or getting shipped back because they were sick or whatever else. 31:05 if they were ill mentally, or whatever else, I had to go and take their cash and trade that for them as well and I guess I got good at it because that kept me in that job until I was ready to leave. I was looking forward to it every minute and sang the songs like everybody else did and it was getting short and getting ready to get out of the military. When I did I was right out of the military, but it was a couple of months before my four years was up, but it was time. It was a good four years, the second piece of the story happened to be mustering out and being told, “You shouldn’t wear your uniform outside the base, because people don’t like the military and they don’t like the Vietnam War”. I know I heard part of that, but I never really realized how negative the feeling was and how pervasive the feeling was about Vietnam. 32:06 I thought I was doing 15 �something good, I was very patriotic about it and I was getting paid, I don’t know, twenty-five extra dollars, because of being in a combat zone, and I finally fulfilled the reason I joined the military by getting to Vietnam and I thank that Colonel for that. I would have felt cheated spending four years in the military, during Vietnam, sitting in Texas, or sitting anyplace. I’m glad I went and I’m glad I was there. I grew up a lot , I was ready for college when I got out of the military and I wasn’t ready before I got into the military. But, the interesting story that has to be told about anybody that was in Vietnam, at that time, is the attitude for the next ten years after I got out of the military. Nobody wanted to hear the stories, nobody could drag out those intimate little things that happened during that particular day, or that particular time, nobody wanted to hear it. 33:01 My parents didn’t want to hear it. You know, I told them one or two stories and okay, that was enough. Now they know everything about what I did in the military. Go on to what’s going to happen in the future, none of my friends wanted to talk about it and it just didn’t come up in normal conversation. Probably seven or eight months after I got out of the air force, maybe it was even later than that, maybe it was like 1972, a couple of years later, that the state of Michigan sent us a check saying, “Thank you for your work in Vietnam”, and it was a check for fifty bucks, and it was almost like a slap in the face. Every single one of us that ever talked about it said, “I can buy dinner, and thank, oh boy”. It wasn’t a thank you , it was sweeping us under the carpet and saying that they did something for us. For fifty bucks, I didn’t do that for fifty bucks, I didn’t do that for anything but the freedoms of the United States and everything else. 34:03 maybe I was misguided, I don’t know, but I think I wasn’t, I think I did the right thing. It wasn’t until ten years, maybe twelve, fifteen years afterwards that I took a job, took an advisory 16 �position, at a company in Holland, Michigan called Can-Do, which is a help group that does interviewing and resume building and they do a lot of things for people that are looking for work. I think they do the unemployment activities in Ottawa County as well. Can-Do was a helping group that had an advisory group that was really what the advisors did was to refer volunteers, find placed that would give money and whatever else. We were just basically advisors of how to do the training and how to do some of this other stuff. 35:02 I was invited to be an advisor and it sounded like a great idea, so I did. The person that met me at the door and was going to drive me over to where this first meeting was, was a fellow my the name of Michael Vu and I’m sure his first name wasn’t really Michael, it was probably Wung Phau Vu, or something like that, but he changed it and Enlishized it when he got shopped over as a young kid, probably ten or twelve years old in 1972 when they escaped from Vietnam and come over to the United States and centered there. He was the one that happened to pick me up and I noticed that he was Vietnamese. You can tell the difference between a Vietnamese, a Korean and Chinese person once you’ve been there and know. There are major differences, and he was, obviously, a very nice young Vietnamese fella. I mentioned that I was in Vietnam and his eyes got wide. 36:01 He stopped the car, we were already driving, he stopped the car, I didn’t know what the heck was happening, he got out of the car, came around to the side where I was, made me get out of the car, held out his hand and shook my hand and said, “Thank you”. I’m going to do it again, I cried, I had ever been told “Thank you”, except for that stupid fifty dollars. Nobody had cared, but I got it from him and he had made it his mission and his issue to say “Thank you “ to everyone that he ever met that 17 �was in Vietnam and did that job. So, I made it my issue and my mission, to do the same thing, so I’m sorry to choke up like that. 37:01 Interviewer: The contrast to that response, coming home, is pretty traumatic and it’s a reminder here that we were in places like Korea and Vietnam. And we wonder if that will come out, in the end, for Iraq and Afghanistan as well. Many of the people who were there actually saw what the Americans were doing as something other than being a bunch of imperialists, or whatever, and that they really were people and they were trying to help. You have to remember that the story is that complicated and that’s part of it too. It wasn’t so much the time I spent in the military, because I knew what I was doing then, but it was the fifteen years between leaving and being told that the muster out saying, “You might not want to wear your uniform out there. As a matter of fact, if you don’t need them, throw them away”, and I did, which is kind of—I feel really bad about that because I could have used those fifteen o’fives in some of these military parades that they have on Veterans Day and the Fourth of July, and marched in and walked in as a veteran, but I didn’t have my uniforms and I would have liked to have kept that. 38:04 I think I kept the hat with the emblem on it, but that was it and I didn’t have the rest of the blues. But, it was that fifteen years of wanting to talk, I’m sure, wanting to just get it off and talk about all the good, bad, or indifferent things that happened, and things I saw, especially the bed to bed in the hospitals, but nobody wanted to hear it, but he wanted to say, “Thank you”. Interviewer: Now, I want to back up to a couple other dimensions of that period in Vietnam. You were talking about the layout of the base and driven away as a 18 �perimeter and talking about having rockets fired at you. To what extent were you aware, while you were there, that you were in a war zone? You had, in many ways, a civilian type job, but was there—did the base get fired upon and regularly and by what? 39:03 Probably once a month, or so, and maybe a couple times during the Tet period and whatever. Rockets were definitely sent at us and what was kind of interesting about that is we could hear those rockets coming from way away, and we could almost tell how far past, or whether they were coming close or whatever else. A lot of the fellas got kind of jaded, they thought they could tell that the rocket wasn’t going to touch the barracks, or whatever else, so they just stayed in their beds, or whatever. I was pretty conscientious about getting out and getting down to that bunker myself. But a couple times it was kind of interesting. After the rocket attack, it might have been ten o’clock in the morning or the middle of the day and you get these rockets coming over and it wasn’t always at two o’clock in the morning, in the middle of the night. These guys would sit out, probably half a mile from the base, and they’d just set up this little launching pad and they’d lob a couple of rockets in. 40:05 What they were trying to do was take out the airplanes and jets that were in the center, or maybe the Huey helicopters, or whatever. But, I saw the devastation that those rockets made even in the middle of the street, right in front of our barracks, where one hit. It blasted the concrete and the tar, or whatever was on there, probably six or seven inches, completely away. A seven or eight foot hole went down about eight feet, but the military was so good at repairing things that probably within forty-five minutes you couldn’t tell it was ever done. They filled up that hole, they put that stuff back on the—you could see that it wasn’t the way it was before, but it was solid 19 �and ready to drive over in forty-five minutes to an hour. I’ve got a lot of pictures of the things that—things like that, but I didn’t get really close. 41:02 The only times I was ever really given a gun, a rifle, I can’t call it a gun, it was a rifle, was a couple times when we had noticed that the insurgents, or the Vietcong, were close, because we were close to the demilitarized zone, we were close to the north. They were coming close and they were in the area, and they would issue us, if we were on call for protection of the perimeter, they would issue us a rifle and six bullets. I was always wondering what good were six bullets. I mean, and if I see somebody I would probably shoot all six and now what do I do, walk away or run, or whatever? Is seems like they should have given us enough to get us by for the whole evening, or whatever. This was a semi—M-16. Interviewer: So, it was pretty easy to squeeze off all six bullets. Yeah, bam and they’re all gone. 42:02 Interviewer: So, you had, sort of, regular Army and Marine guards, or things like that, around the base? Sure, we had the guys in the huts around the edge and we also had the MP’s that were always there. They were really in charge of the perimeter guard, but me as an accountant; I guess that I was on call a couple of times, because I remember getting that rifle and the issue of the six bullets. Interviewer: Once you had the rifle, what did you do? We were actually led out to one edge of the airport and we were stationed there and spread out with one or two people that were kind of in charge of the group, and they would just leave us there for forty-five minutes and never saw anything, maybe closer to 20 �two or three hours and never saw or heard anything, so then they got us up and walked us back and we turned in our rifle and turned in our bullets. Interviewer: Now, did it appear there were sniper attacks, did that go on? 43:02 I didn’t see any, or hear any, but I heard about several of them that were sniping at the helicopters that were coming off the helicopter pad by the hospital. I got told by the nurses, again I got to know the nurses and I got to know the folks over at the hospital when I was going through and stationed at that particular point in the accounting office. But, I got to know some of the Vietnamese mamasans that worked in the different barracks, to clean up. There was at least two assigned to every building. Interesting people and I even got invited to one of their homes for an evening meal, which was unheard of. I didn’t know of anybody else that got that kind of invitation, so I must have done something right, or whatever. She invited me to meet her parents and they lived in a little village kind of connected to the base, but not on the base. 44:01 We had to actually go through the exit gate, but their little hut was outside of that. I had a dinner that I could not describe and I had no idea what we were eating, but I did my best at tasting. Interviewer: Were there concerns, or security concerns, about any Vietnamese people working on the base? Of course, we always worried about what these—and I guess they had some kind of interview process and whatever else, but some of the mamasans were fifty years old and some of them could have been thirty years old and looked fifty as well, I don’t know, but some of them were twelve, thirteen and fourteen years old. The interesting thing is that they have different concepts of what’s right and what’s moral, or whatever. Nudity is not 21 �anything to them and they would go in these barracks and the mamasans would walk right down where all the guys were taking their showers and they’d be taking their own shower. 45:04 It didn’t matter to them. It’s just an interesting concept to adjust to. There was no sex involved, it was just weird. They just don’t have the same feelings about some of the things that we do, but they were there just as part of the family and their jobs, and, actually, one of the things I liked about it was, they would polish our shoes. They wouldn’t do the spit shine stuff, but they would polish our shoes, they would dust the room, make the beds, even, for those folks that weren’t there during the day and it was kind of like having a maid. Interviewer: Were there other Vietnamese working on the base other than military or civilians? A few, there were definitely some translators that we needed. We had some translators on the accounting office that we pulled in whenever one of the foreign nationals or one of the military of the Vietnam that were working with us would come in and they’d have money and we’d have to switch that over, or they’d have some other business to do with the accounting office and we’d have to talk to. 46:07 We had half a dozen of the secretaries who were Vietnamese girls that worked in our accounting office and, certainly, there were the waitresses in the different places. They weren’t all military employees that worked in the restaurants and the NCO and officers clubs. There were quite a few civilians that worked throughout the base. Interviewer: What were the dates that you were actually in Vietnam? April of 1968 through April of 1969. 22 �Interviewer: That’s a period when you had-- the Tet Offensive started early in the year and then you had the ramifications that played out after that. Yeah, we knew it was going on, but it didn’t feel any different on a day to day basis. Whether that was going on or it was just—we saw heightened activities going on, more trucks going in and out and marines coming through. 47:07 Air Force, Marines and Army have a great relationship, especially at the supply folks. Marines seem to get the better food for whatever reason. Interviewer: That’s not what the Marines will tell you. You know, except they traded most of that food to get other things that they wanted like boots and we—for whatever reason the Air Force got better boots, better fatigues, I don’t know, whatever, but they wanted to trade those things over. But, we had a lot of steak outings thanks to the Marines, but they also wanted their money taken care of too, so we kind of had something over them and we took care of the finances for a lot of the different military activities, it wasn’t just Air Force. Interviewer: Did you have any idea sense of how the war effort, itself, was going? We were pretty well kept in touch with it. 48:00 Whether it was reality or not, I don’t know. We had the—we definitely had the local radio stations, and because I had the only TV set in the area, I got to see some of the little Vietnam news stations and some of it was overlaid with American words and stuff and it was kind of fun to try to understand what was going on from their aspect as well. It was probably even less sophisticated than the community type TV station like this. I mean, they had TV stations, but they were probably put in the back room of a warehouse or something and they put a camera up and 23 �started shooting. They would do news articles and they would have some woman talk about the weather, or whatever and it was kind of fun to watch that. Interviewer: Did you have any sense of whether the war effort itself was going well or not? 49:00 I still don’t know how it was going. To this day I really don’t know if there was an up and down. We were there for a particular job, and I was there for a totally different job than fighting the war. I was just support. Accounting and finance and doing paperwork and making sure the cogs of the business actually went through. Interviewer: I guess the place where you would see a certain amount of it would be when you would go into the hospital and so forth, when you’re dealing with the wounded men and that kind of thing. Sure, and talking to the Marine guys that we got to know. Even out to China Beach when I was on my little daily R&R’s. I tell you, I went out there as often as I possibly could, so I took—the bus driver knew me by name, so I’d get on there and we’d have a nice ride. I would take pictures of some of the—he would actually drive a little bit different once in a while, so I could see and take pictures of some of the fancier homes. 50:00 There were fancy homes over there and there were gates communities over there. I’ve even gotten pictures of, what looked like to me, a mansion that had a nice cement wall built around it and nice foliage in there and a bunch of people hanging around in there. Very oriental looking, but it was, really, kind of cool. The driver would take me into the different areas. Now, downtown Da Nang and downtown Pleiku, it could not possibly be considered a downtown anyplace else, but in those areas. The dirt roads that were the side streets that were narrow enough to get, maybe, two motorcycles and maybe three 24 �bicycles, but not two cars at the same time going down those roads. The things I was looking for to take pictures of, totally different than East Grand Rapids, Michigan, or Hudsonville, where I live now, or anything else in the United States. 51:04 There are no places in the whole United States that I can even imagine that were anything close to this and I’ve been to the four corners, I’ve been out to Arizona and I’ve driven through the deserts out there. That is not what I mean, this is where people live that are so at the low end of the scales, in terms of homes and housing, and yearly and annual incomes, and all that kind of thing. I don’t think they had much, but there are also, the hierarchy, the people that ran the government, and I’m sure they had those nice homes. Somebody had money, someplace, but what they did and how they got through day to day, I don’t know and I don’t know what they were. Interviewer: It was part of a larger political issue. A sure thing when you have people living in that much poverty. That much money and that much poverty with nothing in between and there’s nothing in between. There’s no middle class and I never saw a middle class at all. Interviewer: You talked about going into, and seeing, downtown Da Nang or Pleiku, or so forth. What occasions did you have to go into those places? 52:04 The reason I went to Pleiku was to take money to contractors. Something, probably, in my Captain’s head decided that I would be a good person to send out there. It was not an overt progression; it was just that one day I got this assignment. Interviewer: That was a little further away, now did people go off the base and into DA Nang for any reason otherwise? 25 �No, you had to have a special pass; you had to have a special reason. You had to have escort. They were not able to just walk off the base and just wander around in Vietnam. You didn’t do that and they had to know where you were, you had to have a pass, you had to have papers, you had to have reasons. Even if you’re going close to the edge of the base, you had to be—you could be collared and questioned and try to figure out why you’re doing something that’s a little abnormal. 53:02 Interviewer: It makes for a kind of insular existence there with the base and with these people and you’re aware of certain parts of what’s going on around you, but not necessarily others and you focus pretty much on the task. You focus on the task and what was interesting is that most people worked, went to the NCO Club. They had slot machines and, you know, it was fun, it was—they had drinks and they were cheap. You could get almost anything you needed to for a nickel. I mean, it was just—the PX down the street, or the PX that you could get to the store. You could buy anything that you wanted at government discount rate or whatever. Money was not too much of an issue. Nobody had any, we only had probably seventy-five dollars every paycheck, or even that, I wouldn’t be surprised. We had everything taken care of, we had our clothes and we had our housing, and medical, everything was taken care of there. 54:04 If we had a toothache, or something, we could get that taken care of at no cost. I can’t imagine wanting for much, except, maybe, a picture frame or a radio. I did get a nice camera while I was over there. I got an Ishika. Hong Kong people would come over and they would build you a suit for seventeen dollars, or eighteen dollars. A complete suit, coat, vest, pants, and they fit it to you and everything else for eighteen bucks and that was it. I did take my R&R to Australia and I had a wonderful time in Australia. 26 �That could be another forty-five minutes of discussion just for the two weeks I was down there. I got conned by a guy in Australia that said he worked for the Australian Embassy. I found out much later that he didn’t, but we gave him money, but he usually spent it on us, buying us drinks and everything else. 55:04 The day we tripped up on it, I went down there on a Christmas week, or a couple of weeks and the day he got tripped up on, his—for whatever reason he promised he was going to take us out on the Embassy yacht and there wasn’t an Embassy yacht, but whatever, he was going to take us out. He must have known he was going away for a couple of weeks, or something, because he knew that we would find out that there wasn’t one, because we showed up trying to get on the Embassy yacht. We came up to the Embassy and knocked on the door and mentioned this guy’s name and they said, “We’ve been looking for him for quite a while. He doesn’t work for us, but by the way, we’re having our Christmas party and would you two guys like to come up and join?” We said, “Yeah, wonderful”, and we got invited to the Canadian Embassy Christmas party and got to meet some people there. I got to meet a family called the Stewarts. 56:00 Mr. Stewart and the lady that asked me to come was Christine Stewart and her father owned Stewart Wines, which was a very large winery in Australia. I got invited over to their home for a Christmas party and for Christmas Day and they treated me just like family. I felt like I was home for that period of time and these are Australian folks that didn’t know anything about me, but had invited me to this Christmas party at the Embassy and then she invited me to her home for Christmas parties. It was, actually, a neighborhood party that they got together with and the interesting thing that happened at this party was, they had just gotten, in that neighborhood, the police had just gotten a Breathalyzer that they were going to start 27 �testing, and they took it, brought it to this party to show off their Breathalyzer and this was 1968, so it was Christmas of 1968. 57:00 So, Christine and I got to know each other pretty well, and her older sister had married a navy guy. They had already moved back to the United States and he had gotten out of the service. But, she was pregnant at the time I was at this Christmas party, the sister was, and I wanted Christine to come and visit her in July of the next year. I would be out of the military at that time and I was going to be home in Michigan. Her parents, and Christine, asked me if I would meet Christine at the airport in New York and drive her up to Buffalo, which was not a short drive. She didn’t know anything about the United States, or what she could do, or how she was going to get to the next leg. I said, “Sure”, so in July, after I got out of the military, I drove to New York, saw an old girlfriend there for a while, but ended up marrying the old girlfriend. I met Christine at the airport and drove her up to her sister’s house and spent two, or three, nice days there as well. 58:02 The plan was that Christine would also come and visit me in Michigan afterwards, but Iended up getting engaged to this other girl. Interviewer: Alright, now once you did come back from Vietnam, then what did you do next? First of all, I went back to the job that I’d had before. I worked at Meijer's, Meijer's Markets at the Thrifty Acres No. 11 on 28th Street and Kalamazoo, their first one. I worked at Thrifty Acres there as a marking clerk, working in the marking room, putting little tags with prices on them. I went right back there and they gave me my job back even though they didn’t have to. I don’t think the rules were that they had to give me my job back after four years, but they did, and I started working and within two months from 28 �that job—I kept that job, but I also worked at Spartan Stores. 59:00 Now, competitive issues the way they are between Spartan Stores and Thrifty Acres, I was in an ideal position. I was in the marking room pricing at Thrifty Acres, and I was an inventory clerk dealing with pricing in inventory at Spartan Stores. The perfect place to have all the information and I was without a clue. They didn’t know that I worked at either place. Either place didn’t know that I was working the other, but I worked at Meijer's there another six months, or so, and worked at Spartan for another couple of years. But, that’s what I did immediately and then I took a job as a warehouse guy at—warehouse and accounting. I still thought I was going to be an accountant for a company called Celanese Corporation and DeVoe Paint and started working at a warehouse in Grand Rapids. For about six or seven months I worked in the office as the accountant and a sales job happened to pop up and I asked if I could have a couple accounts, just small accounts that we were doing business with, like Amway, would be a good account to take on. 00:09 I built that company revenue from DeVoe Paint from seventeen, or eighteen dollars a month, you know, they would just come in and buy a gallon of paint, or whatever, to about twenty to thirty thousand dollars’ worth of business and at that time it was a pretty good business. Then I started—they came up with a product, special to DeVoe Paint, which is a type of hypo- latex and it was an area where a lot of guys were getting out of the military, they were building a lot of apartments complexes and a lot of other kinds of things were happening that housing was becoming a very big thing and necessary for the military guys getting out. So, this hypo-latex was a onetime shot. It would build up to twenty-one, twenty-two mils on a wall without draping, so that was, again, kind of towards helping the military, but it was a product that we were doing. 1:08 The closest 29 �thing I got to working with the military again, after the military—the progression was getting out, warehouse accounting, thinking I was going into accounting, I took classes at community college nights, weekends, I worked three jobs and I worked even at Howard Johnson's at night to do studying. I was just newly married, coming up in August or September of that year. The year I got out—going to college, two jobs, at least, and sometimes three, just making ends meet and then soon after that having a family and going through that. But, in the middle of the seventies, which is about ten years later, or eight years later, an organization was in town called United Electronics Institute, which was a tech school. It has molded into, and I’ll tell you a little UEI to ITT Tech, which is still here in town. 2:07 I was a sales manager there, but at the beginning I was hired by group called George Shinn and Associates, which was a consulting firm to tech schools. What they did, they taught tech schools and trade schools and business schools how to recruit veterans. How to go to the Criss Cross directory, the Polk Directory and find the names as you go through there page by page and find that they were a veteran, or military. Education, paid by the military, we had the ability of using the Veterans Administration money and UEI was a hurting school. They had seventy students in the school, but these veterans coming back from the military and getting out of the service, finally started—instead of UEI going out to the high schools and trying to draw in graduating high school seniors, we started, and impacted my job, actually paid by George Shinn, not by UEI, paid by George Shinn and Associates consultants, to get the recruits from the military. 3:16 I built that school, just in the two years from 1977 through 1979, from seventy students in the school to over four hundred, with almost two hundred of that four hundred, primed and ready to start in July of 1969, when ITT Tech, ITT 30 �Educational Services, decided they wanted to buy UEI. There were ten schools across the country and only two of them were growing. Grand Rapids, where I was active, they made me the assistant manager of there as soon as I started getting some of these numbers and a fella by the name of Fred Weber was the director, the sales director, and he just kind of put him arm around me and let me work. 4:04 About halfway through 1969, when ITT started, George Shinn and Associates wanted to know why I was so successful and why these other ten, and they were consulting to all ten, why they weren’t. They called me down to North Carolina to a meeting to tell them all my secrets. I said, “Okay, I’ll tell you all my secrets. I work seven days a week, I work twelve hours a day, I set up ten to twelve interviews every single day, I call for four hours a day and I get all these people coming in and I play Ping Pong with them. We had three Ping Pong tables and all my sales guy were active playing Ping Pong with all these Vietnam veterans, and we recruited—I had, again, two hundred and fifty eight students primes for the July start in 1969. 5:02 The sale was culminated before those students actually showed up, because there was an encumbrance of those funds. ITT had to pay me as if those kids showed up, a month and a half before they actually showed up for school, so I got the largest commission check ever given by that company, for bringing those two hundred and fifty students in. Probably about a hundred and eighty of them showed up, but I got paid for all two hundred and fifty of them, as if they showed up, just to get rid of the encumbrance. But, that was veterans and we continued to bring veterans in with the plans that George Shinn had shown us how to do, but I was actually hired by ITT Tech when they came in. Straight commission with UEI, company car, expense account, and everything else, but it was all based on George Shinn’s plan of bringing in—George 31 �Shinn, by the way, won the Pulitzer Prize for writing a book, or something, it was a pretty important thing, and part of his talent was in recruiting. 6:03 That is what he promoted, that was his own company. Portland, Oregon and Grand Rapids, Michigan were the only schools that ITT bought, and now at ITT Tech, I’m still an advisor to them, still on their advisory board, and it’s still a good school and they’re teaching a lot of different things at this point. I worked for them about five more years after that and a lot of interesting things happened there. I was director of sales and we had some amazing years, but most of it was due to the veterans coming out of the Vietnam era, so if you ever went to ITT as a veteran it was probably because of somebody like me. I’ve always been kind of drawn to helping as many as I can. Interviewer: If you look back on the whole thing, how do you think your time in the military wound up affecting you overall? 7:01 I would have been a totally different person, probably wouldn’t have learned those sales words from Bill Boyer, and I would probably be a totally different type of person. If I had tried to go to college at that time I would have failed miserably. I would have stayed with my job at Meijer and I probably would still be working at Meijer as a clerk in the back room, or something, I don’t know, I really don’t know. I pat myself on the back all the time thinking I’m better than that, but I don’t know. The military definitely took me down to a two year old and grew me back up to being somebody self-sufficient. If you ask my wife about whether I can be self-sufficient, she would say no, but I know I can, if I want to, I’ve got those options. 32 �Interviewer: All right, are there any other kind of individual events that stick in your mind, or come back to you a lot from your time in the service that you haven’t mentioned yet? 8:01 The time I spent in Texas was probably an interesting time, basically, because it was do different from anything else I’ve ever done. For that tow and a half years I had no parents, I had no responsibilities, I had my job to go to, I had my own car, I had my own income, I had my own friends, and again, I didn’t have brothers around or anything else, I just was totally free. When I got out of the military and back home and lived at home for probably four months before I got my own apartment and I ended up getting married pretty quickly after that, marrying that girl from New York that I went and visited when I picked up Christine. That two and a half years was—West Texas is totally different than Michigan too. 9:00 I keep going back to those two and a half years, wondering if I got out of the military and gone back there—because I had friends there, I could have gone, and I was even asked to go and I’d be a Texan instead of somebody from Michigan. I don’t think too much about Chanute Air Force Base. I was there for that training and that seemed like one long day. I was there for, probably, four months, or so, and just don’t remember much of it except the Pizza that got delivered at night. Regularly the Pizza truck would come by and they had the most wonderful little Pizzas with sausage on. When I go out to Fricano’s, here locally, they got the sausage that tastes just like those little Pizzas they had down there delivered in those little trucks. I had a good time in the military, but I definitely would not have been a good career military person. Interviewer: Well, it makes for a good story and thanks for coming in and telling it to us. 10:02 33 � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context JillsonT Title A name given to the resource Jillson, Tom (Interview transcript and video), 2008 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jillson, Tom Description An account of the resource Tom Jillson was born in Grand Rapids, Michigan in 1947 and grew up in East Grand Rapids, Michigan. He joined the Air Force upon graduating high school and was initially trained as an electrical specialist, but was then transferred to accounting. He was stationed at Webb AFB in Texas for two years of his service and was then shipped to Vietnam for the remainder of his enlistment period. His job in Vietnam was a clerk, trading American money for Military bills. He remained in Da Nang for the greater part of his time in Vietnam. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James (Interviewer) Kentwood Historic Preservation Commission (Kentwood, Mich.) WKTV Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military Veterans Video recordings United States. Air Force World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2008-12-18 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project collection, (RHC-27)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf video/mp4 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e6413f0cb89de1407c181a8d7fe62a96.pdf dcd274a4db7981ab446239ab54c1a86c PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Amparo Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 6/22/2012 Biography and Description Amparo Jiménez lives in Aguas Buenas, Puerto Rico where she is very active within the Catholic Church. During her oral history, Ms. Jiménez had a statute of the Virgin Mary at her home with a lit candle next to it. A small group of people had brought the statue to her house and prayed the rosary with her. She would keep the statue and candle lit in her home for nine days, a novena. During that time, she would also pray to it. After that, the group would return and pray together once again. They would then keep the chain unbroken by processing together to another neighbor’s home, giving them the statue after praying the rosary. This is the charismatic way of keeping the Catholic Church alive through actions or events within the community. It is also what the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María did in Chicago to wake up and unite Puerto Ricans who were dispersed within Chicago, and as a result of their diasporic situation. Ms. Jiménez is daughter of “Tio Funfa Jiménez” whose children and their offspring left Puerto Rico and grew up primarily in Detroit and Pontiac, Michigan. She does not want to think of her cousins, the children of “Tio Gabriel Jiménez” as members of the Hacha Viejas and she states it because she grew up with them in this town of Aguas Buenas and that she knows them well. She stresses how her uncle Gabriel was a good, decent hardworking farmer and so were his children. � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7cd2894d5a446a28a133ca1f2d2a1876.mp4 3fadee4830da6ce3dae3c35f9c5efbb7 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Amparo Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Idioma español--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Puertorriqueños--Vida social y costumbres Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Amparo Title A name given to the resource Amparo Jiménez video interview and biography Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Amparo Description An account of the resource Amparo Jiménez lives in Aguas Buenas, Puerto Rico where she is very active within the Catholic Church. Ms. Jiménez is daughter of “Tio Funfa Jiménez” whose children and their offspring left Puerto Rico and grew up primarily in Detroit and Pontiac, Michigan. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José , 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puerto Ricans--Personal narratives Spanish language--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Puerto Ricans--Social life and customs Language A language of the resource spa Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-06-22 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e6838aa4d06c81277201caf813361160.pdf 862c934f3bbfe53dff77d15003c35dcd PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Benedicto Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 6/2/2012 Biography and Description Benedicto Jiménez is the son of Toribia Rodríguez and Miguel Jiménez. His father, Miguel, is the oldest of Gregorio Jiménez’s sons, but is the only son from Gregorio’s first wife. For Mr. Benedicto Jiménez, the importance of family and neighborhood ties became especially clear once he was in Chicago. There, Puerto Ricans faced the same hardships and so sought each other out and were glad to know that they were related in some way. Instead of asking what one thought about the weather, the conversation would be about, “what town in Puerto Rico are you from and what are all your last names.” They would research on and on until they could prove that they were related, or at the very least that they were close friends of close friends, or from a nearby town. Initially, Mr. Jiménez wanted to become a priest. Instead he became a different type of father and raised a wonderful, stable family in Aurora, Illinois. He also lived in Lincoln Park for a couple of years on Seminary Street near Armitage, close to Eugenia Rodríguez, who he would frequently visit, who lived at 2117 North Bissell Street. Rather than returning to Chicago, Mr. Jiménez moved closer to Aurora, Illinois because he was desperately looking for work and with the help of other relatives and friends worked at the honguera of West Chicago. The honguera produced mushrooms and other vegetables for the Campbell Soup Company. Mr. Jiménez worked there for many years and since he is well educated and fluent in English, he was asked to translate many times. For this help the company bosses would relate more to him but this never translated into more �pay or a better job. In those days of the 1960s and 1970s jobs were not given by skill but by national origin and by race. He says that the honguera was 50/50, about 200 Mejicanos and 200 Puerto Ricans, who lived in the dormitories of the migrant camp, by signed contract. The company would pay for their trip from Puerto Rico or Mexico and the employee would work to at least he made enough to reimburse the company. Mr. Jiménez describes long days and work weeks in an enclosed, unlit room because the mushrooms are grown in the dark. He could talk to them but could not see who he worked next to during that day. It was there that he was reintroduced to Don Teo Arroyo, whose wife Gina cooked at the camp for the men. They too were from Barrio San Salvador of Caguas and would help Latinos, later becoming the ones to begin organizing the community for Aurora’s first Puerto Rican Day parades. Since West Chicago was a small town, when the migrant workers decided to settle down with their families, they often would move to Chicago or settle in Aurora. Significant Mexican and Puerto Rican communities have grown in both places. � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/dc4c2aaf462d2e7bb2afa7c315b8f810.mp4 9f344c940d52ac570e5a9443b7bb1f40 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Benedicto Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Idioma español--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Puertorriqueños--Illinois--Chicago--Condiciones sociales Puertorriqueños--Illinois--Chicago--Vida social y costumbres Trabajadores migratorios agrícolas--Illinois--Chicago Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Benedicto Title A name given to the resource Benedicto Jiménez video interview and biography Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Benedicto Description An account of the resource Benedicto Jiménez is the son of Toribia Rodríguez and Miguel Jiménez. For Mr. Benedicto Jiménez, the importance of family and neighborhood ties became especially clear once he was in Chicago. There, Puerto Ricans faced the same hardships and so sought each other out and were glad to know that they were related in some way. Instead of asking what one thought about the weather, the conversation would be about, “what town in Puerto Rico are you from and what are all your last names.” Mr. Jiménez moved closer to Aurora, Illinois because he was desperately looking for work and with the help of other relatives and friends worked at the honguera of West Chicago. The honguera produced mushrooms and other vegetables for the Campbell Soup Company. Mr. Jiménez worked there for many years and since he is well educated and fluent in English, he was asked to translate. His help never translated into more pay or a better job. In those days of the 1960s and 1970s jobs were not given by skill but by national origin and by race. He says that the honguera was 50/50, about 200 Mejicanos and 200 Puerto Ricans, who lived in the dormitories of the migrant camp, by signed contract. Mr. Jiménez describes long days and work weeks in an enclosed, unlit room because the mushrooms are grown in the dark. He was reintroduced to Don Teo Arroyo, whose wife Gina cooked at the camp for the men. They began organizing the community for Aurora’s first Puerto Rican Day parades. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puerto Ricans--Personal narratives Spanish language--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Puerto Ricans--Illinois--Chicago--Social conditions Puerto Ricans--Illinois--Chicago--Social life and customs Migrant agricultural laborers--Illinois--Chicago Language A language of the resource spa Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-06-02 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e32790486f7770dad960ec68d122c299.pdf 930c9e18e8ffcbddfb9a938caa210791 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Daisy Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 5/16/2012 Biography and Description English Daisy Jiménez, or “La Prieta” as she was called by her father, is one of José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez’s sisters. She was born on the seventh floor of what was the Water Hotel at Superior and La Salle Streets in Chicago, where her family was then living. She grew up in La Clark between Ohio and North Ave., and then in the Lincoln Park area where she helped her mother Eugenia go door to door recruiting Hispanos for Spanish mass and praying rosaries for the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María. After living on Claremont and North Ave. for several years the family moved to Aurora, Illinois. There they joined up with grassroots leader Teo Arroyo, who was also from Barrio San Salvador of Caguas, Puerto Rico and was organizing the first Puerto Rican Parade for that city. Daisy entered the contest for Puerto Rican Parade Queen and won. She has raised four children and today lives in Camuy, Puerto Rico with her husband, Israel Rodríguez. Spanish Daisy Jiménez o como la llamaba su padre, “La Prieta”, es una hermana de José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Nació en el séptimo piso del Water Hotel en la calle Superior y La Salle Streets en Chicago, donde vivía su familia. Creció en La Clark medio Ohio y North Ave. , y luego en Lincoln Park donde ayudo a su mama �a reclutar gente para misa en Español y dando rosarios para los Caballeros de San Juan y Damas de María. Después de vivir en Claremont y North Ave. Por unos años, la familia se movió ah Aurora, Illinois. Aquí conocieron a Teo Arroyo quien estaba organizando el primer desfilo Puertorriqueño en Aurora, y también era de Barrio San Salvado de Caguas. Daisy entro la carrera para ser Reina del Desfilo Puertorriqueño y gano. Ahora vive en Camuy, Puerto Rico con su esposo Israel Rodríguez y cuatro hijos. �Transcript JOSE JIMENEZ: Give me your name, when you were born, your birthday. DAISY JIMENEZ: Daisy Jimenez. JJ: Okay. DJ: December 1st, 1954 in Chicago, Illinois. JJ: And what’s your relationship to the Young Lords? DJ: My brother was the president of the Young Lords. JJ: Okay. And your brother’s name is what? DJ: Jose “Cha-Cha” Jimenez. JJ: Okay. All right. All right. DJ: But I call him Joseph. JJ: Okay. Why do you call him Joseph? DJ: Because I always thought when I was growing up, that’s what his name was. They told me that his name was Joseph because in English, Jose is Joseph. And I grew up thinking that’s what his name, so I’ve always called him Joseph. JJ: But I mean, did his mother call him Joseph too, your mom? DJ: No, everybody else calls him Jose. I call him Joseph. JJ: Okay, because it’s in English? Is that why? DJ: Because it’s in English. JJ: Okay. Okay. And you were born where? Where were you born at? DJ: I was born in the Water [00:01:00] Hotel in Chicago on La Salle. I was born -- JJ: La Salle. Do you know where the street, or -- 1 �DJ: I’m not sure if it was Wells. I don’t know if it was in that area. JJ: Okay. Well -- DJ: Superior is what it’s -- it was Superior Street, exactly. That’s where it was at, located. JJ: And La Salle, Superior and La Salle. DJ: Mm-hmm. JJ: Okay. DJ: And I was born at the hotel because they had told my mother she could not have any more children. JJ: Who told her? DJ: The doctors, and she shouldn’t have any more children, so she still -- JJ: Why would he say that? DJ: Because she had already had -- with me, would’ve been probably eight pregnancies. She had lost a couple, had miscarriages, had one on a plane, had a son on a plane that died. JJ: Coming in from Puerto Rico? DJ: Coming from Puerto Rico. JJ: [00:02:00] Okay. DJ: Well, that’s what they told her at that time, that she shouldn’t be having any more kids, even though after me, she got pregnant another time, and that was the last time. It was for my younger sister. But she did have me. They didn’t want to take her in the hospital because she can sue the hospital if anything would happen, so they had all these issues about you couldn’t do this, you couldn’t do 2 �that. So when she was in labor, she had me. They called the hospital. A nurse came from the hospital and I was born at the hotel. JJ: Okay, so a nurse from the hospital took care of -- DJ: A midwife came to the -- JJ: Was that legal? DJ: Well, I think at that time, that’s what they used most of the time were midwives. [00:03:00] I’m not really sure, but I just know that they did use midwives at that time. JJ: I know they did that in Puerto Rico, but this was in Chicago. DJ: But I still think -- well, maybe a nurse, but I still think they used midwives. I really think they did. JJ: Okay. Well, they used them for you. DJ: Yeah, a nurse did me or a midwife or somebody because I was born at the hotel. JJ: You were born at the hotel in the bedroom. DJ: In the bedroom there, and my birth certificate is saying that my father’s name is Gregorio, which is -- my father’s name is Antonio, but I assume that’s because they probably asked, “What is the father’s name?” and they assumed they said “What is your father’s name?” because my father was not there at that moment. There was uncles and compadres that were there because they all lived at the hotel as well, but they all had their own little apartments. JJ: All your uncles [00:04:00] were -- DJ: Uncles. This was a hotel that when the people were living there, they actually were like little apartments. Like little studio apartments, I assume, is what it was. 3 �And all of our aunts and uncles and family members lived in this little hotel. And I guess when I was gonna be born, there was a lot of people there. My uncles or somebody was there. When they asked the name, they said Gregorio instead of Antonio. They used my mom’s maiden name instead of my dad’s last name, so my birth certificate is Daisy Rodriguez Jimenez instead of being Daisy Jimenez Rodriguez. JJ: Okay, so they got all the paperwork mixed up. DJ: All the paperwork mixed up. I have an affidavit that says I am the same person both ways with the same name. JJ: That’s probably ’cause most of the people, they didn’t speak English at that time, or? DJ: They didn’t speak English at that time, and at the same time is [00:05:00] I didn’t -- the first time I actually had a birth certificate, that I actually found my birth certificate, was when I was 16 years old. Before that, all I had was a little registration, [pink?] paper. Well, that’s when I eloped with my husband. JJ: At 15? DJ: At 15. And when I asked -- JJ: Who’s your husband? DJ: Israel Rodriguez. And when I asked my mom for my birth certificate ’cause I eloped and went to New Jersey, she sent me a little pink slip. Through that little pink slip, I had to find out the department where you get the birth certificates at. JJ: City Hall, you mean? 4 �DJ: No, there’s a name. Statistics. Vital Statistics, it’s called. [00:06:00] And I found out that I was born in Chicago. I put down on a letter that I was born in a hotel. I put all that information down and I put down my mother’s name and my father’s and they couldn’t find me. And then they sent me a statement with that number, with that little registry number. That’s the birth certificate I got, and when I looked at it, it had my grandfather’s name as being my father. JJ: So you were born in this hotel. Did you have other brothers and sisters there? DJ: I have two sisters and one brother. JJ: And they were living in the hotel also, in the same one? DJ: When we lived there, my brother lived there. My older sister lived there and I lived there. My younger sister was not born yet. JJ: Okay. And there were other family? DJ: And my uncles and other uncles. JJ: And their families were living there? DJ: And their families were there as well. JJ: And this was a hotel, not an apartment building? DJ: No, this was called the Water Hotel. JJ: And so they were like apartments that were kind of turned -- DJ: [00:07:00] I think it was -- JJ: -- turned into a -- DJ: I really think they -- JJ: -- studio apartments. 5 �DJ: Exactly, is what I’m thinking. I’m thinking that it had like a little kitchenette and actually it was probably a one-bedroom or something like that, a bathroom, and maybe a little area and a little kitchenette is what I’m thinking it would’ve been. JJ: Of course, you were young and -- DJ: No, I don’t know anything about -- this is all what my mother has told me. But I know that she did say we lived there. JJ: When do you start remembering Chicago? Was it when you -- how old were you when you start -- DJ: I remember when I did my first communion. I was four and a half. We were not allowed to do our first communion until you were five or six, but because my mother taught catechism -- JJ: Oh, okay, so your mother taught catechism where? In a school or -- DJ: No, at the house. JJ: What do you mean, at the house? DJ: Our apartment. We had an apartment, a first-floor apartment. JJ: On what street? DJ: I don’t know. That’s what I [00:08:00] don’t remember. I’m thinking of Fremont for some reason. If it was a one-bedroom, I’m thinking Fremont. JJ: Or Dayton? DJ: Or Dayton. It was Dayton or Fremont, one of those two. JJ: There were both. DJ: Mm-hmm. JJ: So she taught catechism? 6 �DJ: She taught catechism to a group of kids at the Catholic church, but I wasn’t allowed to be inside because I was too young. So they would have me outside and I was only able to stay outside playing while my mom would teach the catechism. But because I sat on the windowsill outside, I would hear everything that they were saying, so I memorized it all. JJ: So how many people were in the catechism? DJ: In the catechism, there could have been about 20 kids. JJ: About 20 kids. From the neighborhood? DJ: Mm-hmm, and we liked it because that was the day we all had cookies all the time. Every time the catechism kids came, Mom always had cookies, so we all had cookies all the time, and that’s what we did. And when the priest came, there was a day that the priest was supposed to come for a test and it was an oral test. You had to know everything, like the Our Father, the Hail Mary, the Apostle’s Creed. You had to know all that. The sign of the cross. You had to know all that by memory. And my mom, I told her I wanted to do my first communion. She said I couldn’t do it because I was too young. The priest said, “Well, let me see what she knows.” And I told them everything. So I was able to do my first communion at the age of four and a half years old. JJ: Because you were listening from the windows? DJ: Because I was listening to everything and I knew exactly. JJ: And so were these kids in public school or Catholic school? 7 �DJ: I think they were in public school because we went to Catholic school. When we started in school, we went to Catholic school and none of those kids were with us in school. JJ: Were they American kids? Black kids? DJ: They were all different nationalities. JJ: Different nationalities? DJ: They were Black. That was one thing that we grew up with, [00:10:00] Black, Hispanics, white, Mexican. We grew up with all of them, a mixture of all. JJ: Okay. But your mom, did she speak -- DJ: My mom spoke Spanish. JJ: So how did she teach the other kids that spoke English? DJ: She would teach them in Spanish. So I guess they would have all been Spanish, then. Yeah, because the catechism was in Spanish. JJ: It was in Spanish? Okay. Okay. But there were kids in the neighborhood -there was a mixed community? DJ: Exactly. JJ: That’s what I’m trying to say. DJ: Exactly. JJ: But the catechism was in Spanish because she didn’t speak English, then. DJ: No, she didn’t speak English very well, but then now that I’m thinking, all my prayers, I know them in English and not in Spanish. At my age that I am now, I know all them and more in English than I do Spanish. But that also could’ve been because I went to Catholic [00:11:00] school. 8 �JJ: What school did you go to? DJ: It’s either St. Joseph’s -- was it St. Joseph or St. Teresa's? JJ: Both, yeah. DJ: I only went to Catholic school till I was in fifth grade, from kindergarten till fifth grade because they couldn’t afford it and ’cause we were all in Catholic school and they couldn’t afford Catholic school anymore. So when I started sixth grade, sixth, seventh, and eighth, [phone dings] I went to Arnold. That’s my phone. I went to Arnold for sixth, seventh, and eighth grade, and that was -- JJ: Oh, you went to Arnold? DJ: Yeah, that was a public school. That’s when there was the riots with the Blacks and the whites. JJ: Yeah, what was that about? DJ: Oh, that was terrible. That was when my brother was in the Young Lords. That was the gang part. That was when a lot [00:12:00] was going on, and wherever you went, there was gangs here, there was Latin Kids here, there was Disciples here, Young Lords here, and you couldn’t walk down this block because that block didn’t belong to the Young Lords. And then my brother was the president, so it was like you either can say you were related or you couldn’t say you were related because you didn’t know. And he wasn’t in school with me, so he doesn’t know what I had to go through. You would go to school and people would look at you and say stuff like, “Oh, this is Cha-Cha’s sister,” something like that. And I remember there was a fight at one time, and my brother had a girlfriend. Her name was [LaVaughn?]. I’ll never forget. She was Black. Very pretty, very, very 9 �pretty. I remember him saying that was his girlfriend and then all of the sudden, [00:13:00] she was with some guy -- Black guy -- at a restaurant or some cafe or something. One of the other Young Lords told my brother that she was there with some guy. They went over there. They got into fights. Somebody ended up getting stabbed. The guy got stabbed. It was all over the news. It was all over all the newspapers and everything. When I went to school, “Oh, this is ChaCha’s sister.” I had denied. I quite denied it, and that hurt. Then I actually told somebody that he was my brother and it was only because I wanted to be protected ’cause I was afraid. And at the same time, [00:14:00] my mom went to court. The guy then -JJ: You said he was your brother or that he wasn’t your brother? DJ: I said that he wasn’t my brother, that I didn’t know who he was, and everybody kept saying, “Oh, yes.” There was one kid in school -- ’cause I never talked about my brother when I was there in school. And so there was one kid that knew, “Oh, this is --” And he was going all over the school and everybody was laughing and everybody was talking about it. I had to pretend I didn’t know anything. I left that day. I went home early. So that happened and my mom had to go to court. My mom went to court, and when they were in court, the guy that actually got stabbed looked at my brother and said, no, that my brother did not do that, that he did not stab him because he said that when he got stabbed, he felt where my brother [00:15:00] had punched him in the face. And at the same time, he felt the stab wound. That’s why they couldn’t accuse my brother of doing it. But then now, after so many years, I found out that, yeah, it was true. He did 10 �stab him. But I find this out when I’m in my forties. But all my life, I always felt that he had never done it, that he wasn’t involved with that. JJ: So there were, like, some kind of denial, not wanting to think that your brother would do something like that? DJ: That I couldn’t believe that my brother would actually do something like that. But because of how things were, though, you also would think, yeah, he would’ve done it. So is it true or is it not true? That’s how -- JJ: Why would you think that he would’ve done it? DJ: Because he was the president of the Young Lords. He had to show respect. I mean, [00:16:00] you have the Young Lords and if the president, that’s the one that’s making his gang strong, if he backs out of it, how does that make him look? He has to be the strong person in there so he can have his followers. Otherwise, they will take him out of being a president. So he had to always show that he was in charge and he did, and that’s how we grew up. But he was more or less to himself. He didn’t get us involved in his stuff with the Young Lords. We knew some of his friends, but we knew him as protection for us. That’s how it was. He would protect us. I remember there was a boyfriend I had. It was lunchtime. I was sitting in his car and I’m there and we’re having an argument right there, and here comes one of the Young Lords, this big [00:17:00] Black -- his name was [Lacy?] -- comes up and sees me. Now he knocks on the window. “What are you doing in that car?” I had to beg him so he wouldn’t tell my brother that I was in that car, or my brother would beat the shit out of my boyfriend. And mind you, I shouldn’t have even had a boyfriend. I was only 13, so I shouldn’t have even 11 �had one. But that's the respect that everybody had for my brother. They were protective. JJ: So you went out with Lacy? You used to go out with Lacy? DJ: No, Lacy saw me with my boyfriend. JJ: Oh, with your boyfriend. DJ: And I was afraid that Lacy was gonna tell you and then you would beat up my boyfriend, so I told -- JJ: (inaudible)? DJ: That’s probably [Melissa?]. I made Lacy promise that he wouldn’t tell you. I said, he goes, “I won’t tell him, but you’d better get out of that car right now and go back to school.” JJ: So there were other people watching you. DJ: Everybody was watching us. Everybody would watch us. Everybody. Even though we [00:18:00] weren’t walking down the street with the Young Lords or anything, but on every corner, there was one on your way to school because that was our area and that’s where they would hang out. So since they were hanging out, that’s how it was. JJ: And this was your area. Where was that? DJ: This was on Bissell Street, Fremont, and between Armitage, Sheffield, all that area. In all that area. JJ: And this was about what years? DJ: This had to have been, like, in ’66 ’cause I would’ve been, like, 11, 12 years old, 13 years old. Sixty-six, ’67. 12 �JJ: Okay. Going back to La Salle Street for a little bit, what do you remember about your father, Antonio? DJ: There, I don’t remember. I don’t remember hardly nothing ’cause that’s when I was born, so I was really -- JJ: When do you start remembering [00:19:00] things? DJ: I remember, like I said, when I was four and a half and I did my first communion. JJ: Okay, but I’m talking about Antonio specifically, Antonio Jimenez, your father. DJ: There are things that you remember and you don’t forget certain things in your house. I remember living in a basement and I don’t remember the street. JJ: That was La Salle. On La Salle Street? DJ: It was a basement that had a two-bedroom, a small living room, and a kitchen, and the bathroom was inside the kitchen, and we had ducks inside the tub. And there, I was, like, eight years old ’cause I remember I had gotten the mumps and it was very rare for kids to get it. Or I don’t know if it was rare, but I was the only one in my family to get the mumps and I remember that they didn’t know what was wrong with me. My face was all swollen up and I had all these hives. And my mom called the ambulance. [00:20:00] The ambulance picked me up and the people in the ambulance didn’t want me to even lie down on the bed because it was contagious. And they took me to the hospital and they sent me back home saying that I had the mumps and I specifically remember because in that apartment, some next-door neighbor across the street gave us all these ducks and we wanted them as pets. We all slept in the same room, my brother and all of us. We had two full-size beds and all of us slept in one room and my mom and 13 �dad in the other. And I remember specifically about one day that my mom, that day with the ducks, because my father -- how would I say this word in English? Machista? JJ: Machista? Macho. DJ: He was very macho, [00:21:00] and that’s what they said or whatever. JJ: What do you mean, he was macho? What do you mean? DJ: Because that’s what they said. JJ: Okay, that’s what they said, but what did you see? DJ: What did I see? Well, because my dad would take my mom’s check away. My mom would work. He would take her check. She didn’t own the check. She would have to work but she didn’t own the check. JJ: I mean, what do you mean, he would take -- DJ: He would take her check. Friday is payday. Friday, give me the check, and she would have to hand over her check to him. But there was always food in the house. That’s one thing I can always say, that he made sure that we had food, and bills and stuff like that were paid always. That, always, always. And I’m not talking about a cupboard with just a little bit of food here, a little bit of -- my father always believed in having a lot of food and a lot of meat inside that freezer, always. But I remember specifically that Friday, my mom went grocery shopping and they had these little vans that they would bring the people home with their groceries, and the guy slammed the door, and when he slammed the door, [00:22:00] he smashed my mother’s finger on the door. My mom came home crying with a swollen finger and it was killing her and killing her and she didn’t 14 �know what to do. My dad was out with his friends, which they would call -- it was like a little Spanish gang called the [Hacha Viejas?] and he was with them and he comes home, like, at 2:00 in the morning and my mom’s crying and he made her get up out of bed to cook for all these men because that’s what men did at that time. The husbands would go out with their friends, come home, and they’d expect the wives to get up out of bed and do all these things. That was at that time. JJ: These were Hacha Viejas? DJ: Yes. JJ: Old Hatchets. DJ: Yeah. JJ: That was a gang at that time. DJ: That was a gang at that time. JJ: That he belonged to. DJ: Mm-hmm, and this is what I remember of them. I won’t forget that incident ’cause I remember my mom holding up her finger and crying and frying pork chops at the same time. [00:23:00] And this and that, and crying, and over and over and over, and he wouldn’t -- “No, hurry up and cook this.” And I remember him going to the bathroom and the ducks were there. They were all quacking. And my mom says, “Your father’s gonna kill you,” and this and that. And then we had to get rid of the ducks the next day. Those are the things I remember of my dad, stuff like that. I remember going with my dad to the South Side. That was the best times of my life. That, I’ll never forget. 15 �JJ: So, what? DJ: We used to take two buses to go to the South Side because my dad would go buy [coats?]. He had three girls and he would buy coats. But let me go back. Let me go back before getting to that part because I’m gonna tell you an incident with my brother when he was still with the Young Lords as a gang. They were looking for him. The cops were looking for him. My brother showed up. He would take off for days and come show up. There was a time [00:24:00] when my brother got arrested, like, 20 times, one day after another, 20 times in a row because they kept telling him the curfew was to be at home at ten o’clock and he always had to be home at 10:15, 10 after, 10:30. On his way home? He would be on his way home. The cops would stop him. At that time, I would think, how stupid were the cops at that time? I really think they were stupid because they would come to my house. First, they would take my brother. They were not arresting him. They were picking him up because everybody was under a curfew. They would pick him up, take him to the police station, but then they’d have to drive all the way to my house, pick up my mother to go take her to the police station to pick up my brother and bring them both back. Now, wouldn’t it be easier just for the cop to go and take him home? [00:25:00] Instead of going through that whole ordeal? My mother did that, like, 20 days in a row, day after day after day after day. That stuff started to get old because my brother, it didn’t matter, he was still always walking home after ten o’clock. He was never home at ten o’clock. So I remember that and those instances at that time. I remember when I found my brother smoking for the first time. He was 16. He thought he 16 �was all cool with his Young Lords and his big old friends and everybody, and my mom saying -- that was one of the days that my mom was looking for him because he was supposed to be home before curfew. My mom says, “No, I’m gonna go get him. I’m gonna go get Jose.” So I was always volunteering to go with my mother everywhere. When she would take me, I would go. A lot of times, she didn’t want me to go. So I went and here we’re walking down the street and we’re going closer. We’re getting closer and I see my brother from far away. We’re walking. [00:26:00] He almost ate the cigarette. He took that cigarette. When he saw my mother, he about dropped dead. He dropped that cigarette so quick but I already knew he was smoking it because the smoke was coming out of his nose. But my mom totally ignored it, of course, because out of all of this, my brother is my mother’s favorite son. That’s the only son she has, so even though she had three daughters, my brother was always the baby of the family. She always overprotected him. JJ: So do you think that your brother, or, you know, that -- you could say me or whatever. It doesn’t matter. But do you think that he was afraid of your mom or was it more like feeling guilty? You know, because he tried to eat the cigarette at that time, right? DJ: I think he was just doing it out of respect. JJ: Okay. What do you mean by that? DJ: Out of respect because we knew he was too young to be smoking, but in my house, my mother and father [00:27:00] both smoked, and my mother would’ve forgiven him anyway. It didn’t matter what she caught him doing. She would’ve 17 �forgave him anyway because whatever he did, she always forgave him, always, always, always. JJ: So it was respect, something -- DJ: I think most of it is respect. JJ: Was that an important thing for your brother? DJ: Oh, that’s very important. At that time when we were growing up, you had to have respect. We have to have respect for our adults. When you go past in front of them, you say excuse me. It’s a big thing. You have to. You bow your head down when you’re walking between two people. That’s how we were raised. You need the TV off? Should I get up, stop it -- (break in audio) DJ: Oh, the respect, because when Puerto Ricans or Latinos -- I don’t know all Latinos, but Puerto Ricans -- when two people like us, that we’re sitting right now facing each other, if someone’s gonna walk in front of us, we have to bow our heads [00:28:00] down lower than their faces. That’s out of respect. We just don’t walk straight up with, you know, straight and just walk straight across them, not even say excuse me. No, we bow our heads down and we go underneath their heads. That’s respect. That’s how we were taught. JJ: Who taught you that? DJ: We were taught that by our parents. JJ: Right, who? DJ: By my mother and my father. JJ: Your father too? 18 �DJ: Mm-hmm. JJ: So he would say that too, that you’ve gotta -- DJ: We have to respect, yeah. JJ: You have to respect older people, stuff like that? DJ: Mm-hmm. JJ: So even though your brother, or I was in a gang, and I’m the leader of the gang at that time, and I have to fight and whatever, there was still the thing about respecting your parents? DJ: Oh yes. JJ: It wasn’t being afraid, it was just respect? DJ: Yeah, it’s not being afraid. JJ: ’Cause today, kids don’t respect their parents. DJ: No, and exactly, and that’s why now today now -- JJ: But you’re saying at that time, it was big. DJ: Oh, [00:29:00] you have kids. My children, they will walk underneath like that. My children will say excuse me. My children know better than to say something to an adult, somebody older than them. They know better. They know that that is not allowed. And they’ll even tell me, “Mom, I’m only doing this because out of respect.” Because they know that’s how I was taught and that’s how I taught them. You respect your elders. It doesn’t matter if you like the person, if you don’t like the person, if you don’t wanna talk to them. I don’t care. And just like education, you don’t have to have a college education to walk into a room and say good morning. You walk into the room, it’s your job to say good morning 19 �because you’re the one that walked into the room. The people that were there were already there. So that’s respect and that’s what they do. But yeah, that’s how it was, and that instance [00:30:00] was -- that part about the cigarette and the time that the police were looking for my brother. JJ: Okay, what was the (inaudible), the police? DJ: The police were looking for my brother. I don’t remember for what, but I know they had gone to our house and they were looking for him and they couldn’t find him or whatever. And then one day out of the blue, my brother comes in through the alley. He sees my sister talking to some guy and he thought that the guy was trying to get nasty with her or something like that, but they were just friends. It wasn’t nothing like boyfriend or girlfriend, nothing like that. And then they were gonna get into a fight. A big mess happened. The cops came. So they were looking for my brother anyway. They went and grabbed my brother. They handcuffed him. But then they started taking his head and banging it on the cement out in the street [00:31:00] on the sidewalk, just would lift his head and bang it down, lift it, and my older sister -- my mom went in there. She tried to get the cops away from him and they wouldn’t. They kept saying, you know, “Take him. If you’re gonna arrest him, just take him. Why are you doing this? Why are you hurting him like this? He’s in handcuffs. He can’t move.” And my older sister went and she put her hands underneath his head and his face so they wouldn’t keep smashing his face on the cement and one of the cops just took his hand out and backslapped her on the face and knocked her clear across. And at the end, they all got arrested, my mother, my brother, my sister. My father was 20 �working and my younger sister that was at that time 10, and I was 11, we were left by ourselves. And that was the cops. JJ: So your mom got arrested? DJ: My mom got arrested. My sister got arrested. We even had the priest from the church [00:32:00] go down to bail my mother out. We had everybody from the Catholic church bailing my mother and my sister out, and all this time my father was working. He didn’t even know what was going on. JJ: What do you mean, everybody -- DJ: Everybody in the community got together because everybody was there. They saw it. JJ: (inaudible) hearing? DJ: The whole community. The whole block came out. Everybody knew. My brother was already in handcuffs. There was no reason for them to be hitting him or punching him or slamming his face on the ground. There was no reason for that. JJ: So this was, like, a neighborhood incident where everybody came out and everybody took the side of -- DJ: Of my brother and my mother. JJ: Oh, your mother. DJ: My mother. JJ: Okay, there was a big -- DJ: Yeah, because they were still looking for my brother anyway, so that was fine, but they already had him. They didn’t have to do that. JJ: And what happened after that? 21 �DJ: No, then they went to court and my mom had to go to court. My sister had to go to court. They let my mom go after the priest [00:33:00] and my uncles went down there and got them out of jail. Then they went to court and they said that my mom knocked a tooth out of the cop during the incident or whatever. JJ: How did -- DJ: We don’t know. They said that she hit him in the face, and she was like, “How could I hit you in the face?” Not even the judge believed it, so they dropped everything. They dropped the charges or whatever. JJ: On your mother? DJ: Yeah, and my sister, ’cause they already knew they did more abuse on my brother by hitting him when he was handcuffed ’cause everybody was there ready to testify that my brother was handcuffed, and why were they beating him? Because he was the president of a gang? That’s not why they should’ve done that. JJ: So that’s when you felt that there was no reason they were beating him ’cause he was president? DJ: I think so. I think they were abusing more because he was the president of the Young Lords versus just somebody that they were looking for. They could’ve just stopped, grabbed him, [00:34:00] and handcuffed him and put him in the patrol car. JJ: Okay, now, this is when the Young Lords were a gang, but you knew some of these people. I mean, what did you think about some of these people? DJ: Nowadays? 22 �JJ: At that time, what did you think? DJ: Oh no, at that time, oh, I was all proud. I mean, we’re walking with the Young Lords. This is a gang. Everybody had to belong. So you belonged to something, even though we weren’t allowed. JJ: Even though a gang is a bad thing. DJ: Exactly. But there was gangs everywhere, so it didn’t matter. So they had the Young Lords. They had the Disciples. They had the Latin Kings. So somebody belonged to some gang on any block, so it didn’t matter. There was not one block where there wasn’t gang people. JJ: So you’re saying it was actually a good thing to be in a gang? DJ: No, I can’t say that. I can say it’s a good thing for protection, but not a good thing to think that you could hurt other people by being in a gang. But then also [00:35:00] I know that they -- JJ: But there was some benefit that your brother was in a gang? DJ: There was benefits because we were protected all the time. JJ: Protected from what? DJ: Protected from other gangs. You were not allowed to go to another block. If the next block -- or three blocks down, it was the area for the Young Lords. It was the area for the Latin Kings and you’re a Young Lord, you’re not allowed to walk down that street. They catch you, they will beat you up. That’s how it was. JJ: You mean that you weren’t in the gang? DJ: Exact-- well, no, no, if you weren’t in the gang, you could walk down there, but if you were in a gang -- I mean, they each had their colors. Everybody had their 23 �colors. You wore purple and black, those were Young Lords. Yellow and black, that was Latin Kings. Disciples, I believe they wore red and black. So it was like everybody had their colors and everybody had to respect their colors. I mean, that’s all it was. And not necessarily they would actually all beat each other up because there was people from Latin Kings [00:36:00] and the Disciples that knew some Young Lords and they didn’t have no conflict with each other. They respected each other. But when it came down to, okay, this one got beat up and we have to beat up, everybody got into it. The whole gang was into it. So that’s what it was. JJ: Even other people that weren’t in gangs that were around, they got into it too? DJ: Yeah. JJ: So it was like a neighborhood -- DJ: It was a lot of neighborhood. JJ: It was like a neighborhood thing and then the gang -- DJ: And then the gang was in there, so they had the gang, like, being their protectors. The gang was like the police station, let’s put it that way. The gang is the police station and everybody else is just the civilians. So these civilians would count on the gang for protection. That’s how I saw it. Everybody else probably didn’t see it that way, but that’s how I saw it. JJ: So these civilians are living in an area [00:37:00] where the gangs are the policemen? DJ: More or less. More or less, that’s how it was. JJ: And [they were?] soldiers, whatever. 24 �DJ: Whatever, exactly. JJ: And they’re in their community and they feel safe in their community. DJ: Exactly. JJ: I’m not putting words in your mouth, okay. DJ: No, that’s exactly how it is, or how it was at that time. And then it turned into an organization. JJ: Okay, before we get into the organization, what was it like growing up in the same -- Bissell Street? DJ: Oh, I loved Bissell Street, but that was just because I like boys, so I was -- JJ: Explain that, then. DJ: At the age of 12, I already liked boys, so at 12, 13 -- they could send me to the store 100 times -- JJ: What do you mean, you liked boys? DJ: I liked boys and I liked older boys. I didn’t like no 12-year-old. If I was 12, I liked a 14, 15-year-old, 16-year-old. [00:38:00] Actually that boyfriend that Lacy caught me with, talking in the car, he was actually 18 and I was 13. I never had a boyfriend in school. In school, I never had a boyfriend. I’ve had three boyfriends in my life. One is my husband. Two other boyfriends before that. And they were all between the ages of 13 and 14. One at 13, one at 14. And then my husband at 15. JJ: Why did you seek out other older -- DJ: Because I considered myself, that the kids that were in school were like little kids. My mind was always way up, higher up than my age. I was always thinking 25 �ahead. I was always stronger. And that’s how I still am and that’s how I’ve always been. I’ve always been stronger and you have a problem, [00:39:00] you deal with it. You can’t fall apart because if you fall apart, who’s gonna take care of the problem? So that’s how it was. I liked boys and it wasn’t that I had a lot of boyfriends ’cause I actually only had three, but they all were like a year. This boyfriend was my boyfriend for a whole year and then we moved somewhere else and then from there, then I had a boyfriend from there for another year until we moved to Aurora, and then that’s where I met my husband. But no, that’s how. I always wanted a boyfriend that had a car and that had a job. I was not into having no little boyfriend that cannot buy me a candy, that cannot buy me for Valentine’s Day some candy or flowers or whatever. No. I wasn’t into little kids. I wanted older guys that can work and pay for it. If I wanted a gift, I wanted to make sure I got a gift. [00:40:00] That’s how I always was. And I was always at the store. I mean, they would send me 20 times and 20 times I’d be volunteering to go to the store. JJ: Who would send you? DJ: Oh, my mom, my dad, or whatever. “Oh, go get this.” JJ: So you would run the errands? DJ: I was the one that ran all the errands all the time, all the time, all the time. JJ: And so you would go to the store and the boys would be there -- DJ: Oh, I’d go to the store 20 times just to -- I would break pencils -- JJ: Just to go to the store so you -- DJ: -- to buy another pencil. 26 �JJ: So you weren’t worried about them whistling. You were going there to get with somebody. DJ: Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. I always wore my little tight pants. I wore my little shirts. That’s how I was when I was growing up. But I was always respected. I never let anybody touch me, that part. I knew what was allowed and what wasn’t allowed, what was good, what was bad. I knew that. JJ: Now, how could you prevent -- there’s all these gang [00:41:00] members out there. How can you prevent them from touching you or -- DJ: All I had to do was say that I was Cha-Cha’s sister. That’s all I had to say. “Don’t look at her, that’s Cha-Cha’s sister.” None of the Young Lords were allowed to look at us other than being friends of my brother’s and we didn’t have a lot of them as friends of ours. The gang was a very big gang but they were only allowed, like, maybe four or five -- JJ: What do you mean, a very big gang? DJ: It was a big gang. It was a lot of people. It was a lot of guys in the gang and a lot of girls in the gang, but -- JJ: There were a lot of girls in the gang? DJ: There was girls in the gang as well. But we were only allowed to know a certain amount. JJ: So this gang, the Young Lords, were in several blocks or something like that? DJ: Mm-hmm. JJ: And so they were kind of all in the neighborhood? DJ: Mm-hmm, [00:42:00] they were. 27 �JJ: And they knew that you were related? DJ: Exactly. They knew who was whose sister, whose sister was whose, and everybody knew each other. JJ: So everybody knew each other. So other people’s sisters were respected too? DJ: Yeah, it wasn’t just us. It was other people’s as well. “Oh, this is so-and-so’s sister. This is so-and-so.” Yeah, that’s how it was. JJ: So it wasn’t just like a gang on one corner. These were people respecting each other’s family members at that time. DJ: At that time, they were. JJ: We’re not talking about the gangs today. Was there any difference? DJ: No. No, because the differences at that time, it was more that they were trying to help people. JJ: The gang? DJ: The gang was like -- I mean, there was certain gangs -- JJ: This is before they were -- the gang -- DJ: Even before they turned into an organization. It was like, no, they tried to help, you know. JJ: How would they help? DJ: I remember [00:43:00] something about a church. I remember there was a church. JJ: But that was when it was political. DJ: That it was political, uh-huh. JJ: But I’m saying before that. 28 �DJ: Before that, they would just hang out on corners and stuff like that, but they would just watch for each other. That’s all, what it was, and they wouldn’t actually go out and look for a problem. They would have problems because the other gangs would go into your territory when they knew they weren’t supposed to. And they would start looking for fights and stuff like that. But not because they would just go automatically out there. And when my brother got picked up those 20 every day, he wasn’t doing nothing bad. He was coming home. Just that, it was not because he didn’t listen to the policeman, told him, “You need to be home in the house at 10:00, not walking home at 10:00.” And that’s why he got picked up. They didn’t follow rules is what it was. JJ: So there was a big curfew at that time. DJ: There was a big curfew. It was a big riot as well when I was 12 years old with the Blacks against the whites, [00:44:00] humongous. My father had to go pick us up at school for a week because we were not allowed to leave the school. JJ: Because there were riots? DJ: There was a riot with the Blacks against the whites. Not with the Hispanics. Hispanics can go down the street with no problem and the Blacks were not touching them and the whites were not touching them, the Hispanics. But it was Blacks against the whites. And the school, it was on lockdown. You were not allowed to go out of the school until your parents came to pick you up after school. JJ: This was at Arnold? DJ: That was at Arnold. 29 �JJ: Okay. Did you ever go to Waller? DJ: My sister went to Waller. I never got to go to Waller. JJ: You just went to grammar school? DJ: No, we moved is what it was, so I didn’t go to that, to Waller. I graduated from eighth grade, from Pulaski School. JJ: From Pulaski School? Okay, so you were on the West Side, okay. DJ: At that [00:45:00] time. JJ: Pulaski was where, do you remember? DJ: No. JJ: Okay, you don’t remember what direction it was in? DJ: No. We walked like 10 blocks to get to the school because we had just moved there and we actually -- JJ: You walked on North Avenue or something like that? DJ: When we lived with -- Claremont -- JJ: Claremont, okay. DJ: -- we would walk down Claremont. We wouldn’t go towards North Avenue. We would go the other way. JJ: Oh, okay. DJ: We would go that way down. JJ: North, you went north. DJ: Yeah, like about four or five blocks down. JJ: (inaudible) around there. DJ: Exactly. 30 �JJ: Okay. Now, so you were living on Claremont. Okay, but before that, you lived on Bissell and Dickens? DJ: That was where the cops had arrested Mom and my sister, all that. That’s when you were -- JJ: That’s when we became political [later?]. DJ: Exactly. JJ: [00:46:00] Okay. Now, but before that, why did you move from there? You lived there for a while, right? DJ: On Bissell Street? JJ: Yeah. And what do you remember about Bissell Street besides that? DJ: Playing with our friends outside. We played a lot of Chinese jump rope, hopscotch. I did babysitting. I babysat two little girls. I did that as well. JJ: Wait a minute, it was 2117 Bissell? DJ: Twenty-one seventeen Bissell, North Bissell Street, and oh my God, [Johnny?]. Johnny, Johnny, Johnny. I was in love with that boy. He lived upstairs on the second floor. JJ: When we lived at 2117 -- DJ: He lived on the second floor. JJ: Johnny. Do you know his last name? DJ: No. He was white. He was a white guy. JJ: (inaudible) you was in love with Johnny? DJ: Oh, I was, and oh, he was so cute and he would drink Dr. Pepper and I would go to the store and buy him his Dr. Peppers and bring them to him and everything. 31 �He knew I liked him but he was too white. [00:47:00] He was too old. I was only 10 or 11 at that time, but oh, I thought I was in heaven every time I would see him. That, I remember of Johnny. JJ: So you played hopscotch. You had Johnny. DJ: Johnny. Chinese jump rope. JJ: Okay. Anything else that you remember? DJ: No. JJ: That’s when you were going to St. Teresa's, right? When you were in Catholic school, what school were you in then? DJ: I guess we had finished because then I went to sixth and seventh at Arnold. JJ: So what was Arnold like? That’s not Catholic. DJ: No, Arnold, that’s when I started the public school. That’s where the riots were. That’s where it got scary. I remember I would buy my dad -- JJ: So across the street from Waller High School? DJ: Yes. My dad would give us two dollars and fifty cents for lunch for the week. He would give it to us every Sunday, and of course, I wouldn’t eat because I liked music. JJ: What kind of music? DJ: [00:48:00] Everything. Spanish, English, Motown, anything. I would dance to everything. And what I would do is I would take all my money, all my lunch money, and I would buy records, the little 45 records. So that’s what I always used to do. And then the hot dog stand was there. One time, if I would get hungry, I would buy -- 32 �JJ: Where was that hot dog stand? DJ: On Halsted. JJ: And Dickens? DJ: Uh-huh, on Halsted and Dickens. JJ: So you were going there? DJ: I would go there and I would love their hot dogs with the French fries, greasy French fries all wrapped up and put them in a paper bag. You would get a bag of fries for a quarter and that was enough to fill you for lunch. For 50 cents, you would get the hot dog and fries, for 50 cents at that time. JJ: Did other people go there? I mean, other Hispanics? DJ: A lot of people. JJ: Okay, a lot of Spanish people went to that place? Okay, so you lived on 2117 Bissell. DJ: And then from there, we moved to (inaudible). JJ: You had a pretty good -- any other experiences that you [00:49:00] remember there? DJ: No. JJ: Okay. And then all of the sudden, you moved from there. Why? DJ: We moved because the owner on Claremont were a family or compadres of our father and mother and they had an empty apartment and we moved over there. JJ: But why would you leave a place that you liked, that was [well away?]? DJ: Because it’s all about what the dad says. We’re moving and we’re moving and that’s it. 33 �JJ: So Dad said we’re moving. DJ: We’re moving and we moved. They didn’t care how we were doing in school. They didn’t care. I would do my dad’s homework. JJ: Okay, you did your dad’s homework. DJ: When we lived on Bissell Street, my dad was going to school at night, learning how to speak English. I would do all his homework. He had all his homework done every day for him to take to school. JJ: So he wouldn’t learn any English, then. DJ: But he did. He did. He did learn. JJ: Why was he learning English? DJ: [00:50:00] I have no idea. I don’t even know why he was going to school. JJ: What did he do, your dad, Antonio? DJ: He worked. JJ: What did Dad do? DJ: My dad used to work nights. JJ: Where did he work? DJ: That, I don’t know. JJ: He used to work nights. DJ: I don’t remember. He worked nights and he would cook and we loved Fridays because Fridays was fried eggs and French fry day and Pepsi day. JJ: Fried eggs? DJ: Fried eggs with homemade French fries and a 16-ounce Pepsi because it was a day that he would do grocery shopping. He would go grocery shopping in the 34 �morning and he wouldn’t have time to come home and cook. My dad would cook every day, so my dad would work nights. Before he would go to work, he would have dinner ready. He would cook it at twelve o’clock so that when we got home from school, dinner was already done and ready. When my mom would come home from work, dinner was already cooked, and my dad would be at work [00:51:00] ’cause he would work second shift and get out. He would work 3:00 to 11:00. JJ: So he would (inaudible) and Mom worked during the day? DJ: During the day. So then he would go and -- JJ: Now, was that enough to pay the bills, or everybody lived good? DJ: They never gave us money. They had issues about that. But my father always had money in the house. If there was an emergency, he had money. At that time, people would always have 2, 300 dollars in a sports coat in a pocket. That was the bank. They would keep their money in a pocket. An emergency all of the sudden would happen, they had their money there. JJ: What kind of discipline did your dad use? DJ: For us? JJ: Did he yell? Did he make you feel (inaudible)? DJ: For us, not that much. He used to hit my brother. JJ: Okay. So he used to hit me, then. DJ: Yeah. JJ: So how would he do that? 35 �DJ: But he wouldn’t hit [00:52:00] you all the time, but when he would hit you, he would hit you hard. He would actually hit hard when he would hit you. JJ: Punch or? DJ: No, he would hit you with whatever. I remember him breaking a broomstick on you for stupidity because he told you to put the dishes inside the sink, but he used a different word and you didn’t know what he meant with the word he said in Spanish and you didn’t put it on, so he got mad and hit you. Then you had ice skates. You would hide them behind the refrigerator. He didn’t want you with that. He kept saying that Mom would baby you, which was true because Mom babied you. You know, that’s what the thing was. You were like Momma’s little boy and I guess he didn’t like that. Because now growing up, us, we sit down and I think of my mom and everything and we feel like she didn’t really want us. JJ: What do you mean? DJ: Us daughters. My mom did not like daughters. [00:53:00] She liked her son. My mom would leave us with our brother and my brother used to beat the shit out of us for no reason because he was born machista. So it was what he said. JJ: So your brother was a macho too? [That’s where he stands?]. DJ: And he thinks he still is, though, but I control him. (laughter) He still thinks, but I control him because I don’t take his crap ’cause I can hit back now. He would be, “I want that shirt washed, dried --” JJ: Now, you’re talking right to me right now. DJ: Exactly. “I want that shirt washed, dried, and ironed in five minutes.” And if we didn’t do that -- “I want it now.” “But we can’t do that.” “Give me the belt. Give 36 �me the belt. Give me that belt right now.” And he would get the belt and he would hit us. And my mom would think it was a joke. [00:54:00] She would be out in the street playing lotto numbers, selling illegal, because that is illegal. You play the numbers. JJ: Now, she’s a Christian woman, right? DJ: Yeah, but she played numbers. JJ: But she played the numbers and that was illegal. What would she say? DJ: I have no idea. She would go to people’s houses and collect money and play numbers for them, and that’s illegal. JJ: Oh, so she was collecting the numbers. DJ: The numbers. JJ: ’Cause I know your father did that too. DJ: No, she would do it too. JJ: She would do it too. DJ: When my dad was working at night, she would go out at night and she would collect numbers. JJ: She would collect the numbers. DJ: But then she didn’t know -- JJ: That was part of the syndicate. DJ: Exactly. But then the thing was that she kept leaving us with our brother. She didn’t understand and we kept telling her, “He keeps hitting us.” And she didn’t care. “Jose, I told you not to touch the girls.” And my brother would run around the table and my mom would run after him and they would start laughing at the 37 �end and nobody would get hit. [00:55:00] But we would get hit all the time. And I remember my brother. He used to say the mass. We used to prepare the altar. Those were our games. That’s why I don’t remember -- when my childhood, I never liked dolls. I never played with dolls. That’s probably why I liked boys because I never played with dolls. We didn’t do that. We played priest and nuns. We were in the Catholic church. We did a whole mass, I remember. I mean, when we would snap our finger, we would kneel down, snap the finger back up. My brother was the priest. He would put on a sheet over him. He would say the entire mass. We would take bread, smash them up, and that was our communion. JJ: So what do you think was going on with your brother at that time (inaudible) to make a priest? DJ: My brother wanted to become a priest. My brother was in Catholic school and he wanted to become a priest, but because there wasn’t money for certain [00:56:00] things -- mind you, we went to Catholic school, but for a certain age, then it gets more expensive and more expensive. So he was gonna go into high school and because he was gonna go to high school, the Catholic school was more expensive. And then he wanted to become a priest, and this is what my mom says. My mom says the priest said that my dad had to go to the school, and because my dad didn’t want to go to the school and he wouldn’t go and he wouldn’t go, then that’s why they took my brother out of the seminary that he was supposed to be. JJ: So your brother was suspended from school? 38 �DJ: Well, they just told him, yeah, that he couldn’t go to that. They couldn’t afford it so he couldn’t go to that Catholic high school. He would have to go to a public school, a public high school, and that was the wrong thing to have done because that’s when everything started. That’s when he stole the car. Of course, he said that he didn’t know [00:57:00] it was stolen, but I never believed that. He showed up in Indiana. My father had to get on a train and pick him up. That’s why I can’t say that my father didn’t like my brother because I think he loved him very much. But in his own way. Because if he really didn’t care, he would’ve let my brother rot it jail. He would’ve let him. And no, he always made it a point to find how to get him out of trouble because he always did. But the thing was that my mother was always smothering him. She always smothered you. JJ: So there was like a time where your brother ran away in a stolen car? DJ: Yes. JJ: And then got arrested? DJ: My father had to go all the way to Indiana and there was a snow blizzard. JJ: I think it was Missouri. DJ: Okay. JJ: It was Missouri, St. Louis, Missouri. DJ: Okay. And there was a blizzard and he had to go on the train. I remember that. And he had to go over there to go pick you up and bring [00:58:00] you back. That was a big ordeal. JJ: Okay. Now, your mother did catechism classes, right? Our mom did catechism classes. Okay. Wasn’t she involved with Damas de María? 39 �DJ: Damas de María, and we were Hijas de María. JJ: You were Hijas de María. DJ: Mm-hmm, those are the women that -- Hijas de María, the Damas are the [word?] ’cause they’re the women, the married women, which belong to the Virgin Mary, and then the Hijas were the daughters of the Virgin Mary. That’s what the groups were called. JJ: So you were like the daughters of Mary. DJ: So it’s daughters of Mary. So it’s mothers and daughters. And the group, like right now if you go to a Catholic church right now, they have groups for the young children. They have [00:59:00] groups that might be for just girls only. These were just for girls. They had the men that were Caballeros de San Juan. That’s where the men -- Damas of María were the mothers and Hijas de María were the younger girls. JJ: Okay. What did, for example, the Hijas de Marías do? What did you do? DJ: We would organize parties, do stuff like that, bake sales, raffles, stuff like that. The moms would help and all that stuff as well. I remember getting involved in doing actually parties, like trying to get a band, sell tickets, you know, doing all that stuff. JJ: Why did you do that? I mean, were you raising money? DJ: I was doing it to get out of the house, let’s put it that way. I did it to get out of the house. I tried to get involved in anything to get out of the house. JJ: Were other girls doing the same thing? DJ: Yeah. 40 �JJ: (inaudible) to get involved to get out of -- DJ: We wanted to go dancing. The only way we’re going to go -- you know, these men are machistas. They don’t take us anywhere. So if we want to go dancing, [01:00:00] you need to do that. You go, “Oh, I’ll volunteer. I’ll do this. I’ll do that.” I get to go out, I get to dance. That’s how it was. JJ: Okay. And what about the mothers? Why would they do it? DJ: They would do it to raise money for the church. That’s what they did mostly. It’s like they do nowadays. You have your organizations in the church and some of them teach catechism. Some of them do this. Some of them go -- JJ: So there were other mothers teaching catechism classes? DJ: Yeah, there was other people that did that. JJ: (inaudible) Lincoln Park? DJ: Well, Mother was one of them, the basic one that I remember when I was small. But then Mother didn’t do it later on. Mother did it when we were growing up. But once we were older, she was in the Damas de María, so she wasn’t really teaching catechism that much. JJ: But you heard of other women doing it later? DJ: I don’t really know. I think Mother was like the main one that I knew. JJ: Now, I remember they were trying to get like a Spanish mass [01:01:00] at St. Teresa's or something. DJ: To do Spanish mass? JJ: Or St. Michael’s. Do you remember St. Michael’s at all? DJ: Not too much St. Michael’s. 41 �JJ: You remember -- DJ: St. Teresa's, ’cause that was like in a corner. St. Michael’s was where I think I did my first communion. That was on La Salle down there, that way. JJ: Yeah, by Cleveland and -- DJ: No. No, no, no, it was St. Teresa's because -- JJ: No, you went to St. Joseph’s. I think you went to St. Joseph’s. That was more like La Salle. DJ: Uh-huh. Oh, St. Joseph’s, yes. JJ: Right. So they had some stuff. They were trying to get the Spanish mass there. DJ: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. JJ: Okay. Do you remember anything there? DJ: No. But I guess they must’ve had the Spanish mass, if they had the Caballeros of San Juan and they had Damas de María. They had to have had the Spanish mass. JJ: What about St. Teresa's? What do you remember about that? How did that mass come along? DJ: That, I don’t remember too much because at that time, we would go to church, but we wouldn’t go to church all the [01:02:00] time. We would go because we wanted to belong in the group to be able to do that and do the dances and stuff, and we would go to church at that -- but there was a lot of times Mom stopped going to church every Sunday. I know she wasn’t going there and we weren’t going either. JJ: Why did she stop going to church? Just tired? 42 �DJ: She was always doing promises for my brother. JJ: What do you mean, promises? DJ: That you have to wear an outfit, like if you were the Virgin Mary. You wore the whole robe thing and you tie it with these little balls that hang down. JJ: Like a Franciscan monk. DJ: Something like that. JJ: Not Virgin Mary. DJ: Exactly. JJ: Franciscan monk. DJ: And those were promises. That’s like a promise you make to God. “I will wear this for a year if you help my son get out of jail.” It was promises, or “Please protect my son and I will do this for another year.” I mean, she constantly had that for you. This was like a constant thing. JJ: So she would pray to God -- DJ: All the time. JJ: -- and make a promise. DJ: [01:03:00] And then a lot of times, she wouldn’t finish. JJ: That I wouldn’t go to jail or something. DJ: That you wouldn’t go to jail or that you wouldn’t get in trouble or if she couldn’t find you, then say that he can come home safe or whatever. JJ: Did she ever do that for your father? DJ: Hell no. She never did it for us either. JJ: I thought she had done it for -- 43 �DJ: I don’t ever remember her doing it for our father. JJ: On Dayton Street. DJ: But you were three years older, so you could -- JJ: I didn’t know that she did that for me. DJ: This was our entire life. JJ: Okay, she was doing that. DJ: I remember that. JJ: I remember she did it for my father. DJ: Well, she could’ve done it at one time, but I don’t remember. JJ: (overlapping dialogue; inaudible) for me too. DJ: She could’ve done it for you but she never finished. Like, it was for a year and she would stop, like, seven months later. So if you stopped seven months later and didn’t complete the year, then it doesn’t count. That’s why you kept getting into trouble. (laughter) If she would have done it the whole year, maybe you would’ve stayed out of trouble. JJ: Okay. Now, let’s look at [01:04:00] the Young Lords. They became political, right? Did you see any difference, like you were talking about the church? DJ: I don’t know much about it but I do remember the church. I remember a church. I remember going to that church. I remember a lot of Young Lords there, girls, women, and men, and they lived there or they stayed there or something. I remember my sister leaving home. She ran away with her boyfriend. Her boyfriend beat her up so bad that my sister left him and walked all the way down to that church. I remember my brother being there and my brother grabbed my 44 �sister. All the Young Lord women grabbed my sister, put her in this room. Then her boyfriend went in there to try -- he says, “Oh, I’m looking for my wife,” and you [01:05:00] said, “What do you mean, your wife? Are you talking about my sister? She’s not your wife. And who are you to beat up on my --” ’Cause he had beat up on my sister really bad. So I remember that my brother went, that you went and you beat him up so bad that you couldn’t even see his eyes. They were closed shut. I remember you beat him up and after you beat him up, you made him take my sister back home to our house. I remember that night because that was, like, I was so upset at everybody because I hadn’t seen my boyfriend that day because everything was going on and I kept saying, “You had to go run away with your boyfriend and Joseph had to go and beat up your boyfriend and now I can’t go see Johnny,” and all this and that. You know, it was like a constant, and I go, “Why do you keep doing stuff like that?” But it didn’t help ’cause she kept going back to him and he kept beating her [01:06:00] up. But she will tell you that part, if she wants to say it. I’m not gonna say that part ’cause I don’t know if she wants to talk about it. JJ: So there was another incident. DJ: That was a big incident. But after that, it wasn’t like a gang anymore. It was like community. It was doing breakfasts. I remember that. I remember a lot of stuff in the newspaper. I remember in the news -- JJ: Did you ever see the breakfasts? DJ: They would show it on the news. It would show people going up to get breakfast, to go in there. They would cook. They were helping the whole Spanish 45 �community. I remember that. But at that time, I remember at that time -- I left my house when I was 15, so after that, I wasn’t involved anymore. I wasn’t in Chicago anymore. We moved to Aurora because of my sister and that boyfriend that kept beating her up. We actually moved to Aurora, so I had to leave my boyfriend, break up with him, so that was -JJ: So at that time, you were living [01:07:00] in Claremont or -- DJ: We were living in Claremont. From Claremont, we moved -- JJ: Claremont and North Avenue. DJ: And that’s when we moved to Aurora because of my sister and her boyfriend. And then I had to break up with mine and that was like -- I thought I was gonna die. It was a huge ordeal, a huge, huge ordeal for me to have to get used to a small town when you were used to living in Chicago. JJ: Why did you pick Aurora? DJ: Our cousins lived there. We had cousins that lived there and they said it was okay for us to go there. So my dad stayed in Chicago for a couple months until we got a place to stay out in Aurora, whatever. We stayed at our cousins’ house until we got an apartment. JJ: Okay, so you didn’t hear anything about the Young Lords after that? DJ: After that, I would see my brother here and there. My brother went underground. JJ: Okay, what do you mean underground? DJ: Underground, that we didn’t know where he was at. JJ: For how long? DJ: For years. 46 �JJ: For years? DJ: For years. JJ: So for years, you didn’t [01:08:00] know where your brother was at? DJ: After, there was an incident at the church. There was an incident with some material. They had my brother arrested because they said he had stole some material that they were -- JJ: (inaudible). DJ: Exactly, and they arrested him and he had to serve time for a year. After my brother got out of there, after you got out of there after that year, we don’t remember where you were at for years and years and years. JJ: And so what were you guys thinking about at that time? DJ: Well, we thought you were with gangs and all that, and I know you had gone I think to California. You had gone to a lot of different places. You had gone -- that we would hear here and there and here and there that we were hearing all this stuff. JJ: From who would you hear it? DJ: Just from family members that were actually still living in Chicago, ’cause remember, we moved to Aurora, so we weren’t in contact with -- so we would just hear like from our aunts and uncles. “Well, no, I heard this [on the news?].” Or “So-and-so’s cousin [01:09:00] knew this.” ’Cause the gossip always goes here with the family, and if they’re still living in this neighborhood, oh no, we heard -- JJ: So this was uncles too and aunts saying they had heard something? DJ: They had heard stuff. “No, well, I thought he was --” “He had left here and --” 47 �JJ: So they knew what was going on with the Young Lords. DJ: It was always all over the news. It was in the newspapers and it was in the news. When it turned into an organization, that they had the church, and then when that preacher, that pastor died, or they shot him or something -- JJ: Reverend Bruce Johnson. DJ: The reverend. That was another big ordeal. JJ: How did people take that? DJ: Well, I don’t know because I didn’t live there anymore. I lived in Aurora. JJ: You say it was a big ordeal. DJ: Well, when I say a big ordeal, it’s because it’s came out all over the news, and they would come out on the news, they would always mention Jose “Cha-Cha” Jimenez. They would always mention the Young Lords. They would always mention -- I think they even tried to think that the Young Lords had had something to do with it. [01:10:00] So it was always they had stuff like that on. JJ: So when they thought that the Young Lords had something to do or they tried to make them think that way, what did people say? What did family members say? DJ: Well, people were not believing it because they already knew the Young Lords, what they were trying to do was help the community and help all the poor Spanish Hispanic people because they weren’t treated right. So that’s more or less how it was. But after that, like I said, after that, I was with my husband and I had my kids and that’s how it was. I didn’t go back to Chicago. Till then, I’ve never lived back in Chicago. JJ: Okay, but did you ever participate in any demonstrations? 48 �DJ: I went I think to two of them. I believe I went to two of them. There was a walk when one member got killed. JJ: Manuel Ramos. DJ: Manuel Ramos. I went for that. JJ: So you went to the funeral? DJ: I went to that. JJ: [01:11:00] To the wake -- DJ: To the wake. JJ: -- at St. Teresa's? How was that like? What can you remember about that? DJ: It was just a big walk with thousands and thousands and thousands of people walking in the street. I mean, it was like something I had never seen in my life. JJ: Gang members? DJ: Everybody. Gang members. Family. Just people. It was just thousands of people. JJ: So how did you feel then, seeing all those people? DJ: Then that’s when I actually realized this thing was huge, that the Young Lords were not something small, that the Young Lords changed, and I was glad and happy at the same time that it changed from being a gang to an organization to help people. And I actually at one time -- I don’t know where I was at -- I went into a library, something. I picked up a book or something and I don’t even know what it was and I was reading this book and there was something mentioned about my brother in that [01:12:00] book. I don’t even remember the book’s name now ’cause this was years ago. It mentioned my brother, mentioned the 49 �Young Lords. It mentioned walks, and this, from Manuel Ramos, that was all over -- there was clippings. There was a lot of stuff on that. JJ: So that was the only book that you had ever read about the Young Lords before? DJ: That I actually said, “Oh my God, my brother’s in a book.” JJ: There was no newspaper or anything? They always used some -- DJ: Yeah, there was always clippings and there was stuff all over of the Young Lords and stuff. JJ: What about when they took over the seminary? Did you hear anything about that? DJ: Mm-mm. JJ: Okay. Okay, so from Claremont, you moved to Aurora, and now you got married with Israel? DJ: Mm-hmm. JJ: Okay. But you had eloped. I mean, what was that about, (inaudible)? DJ: Eloped. JJ: Why did you elope? Couldn’t communicate with your mom or what? DJ: No, ’cause of communication. [01:13:00] My mother would -- remember, you were the favorite. She didn’t like us. We were slaves. We had to come home from school. We had to mop. We had to wax the floor on our hands and knees. We had to have dinner ready. We had to wash clothes by hand. We had to wring ’em out. We had to iron. I considered that slavery at that time. We had to do all that every day, every day, every day. And okay, she worked, yeah, but she 50 �would come home from work and just sit down. We did everything else. It was that. It was the fact that my -JJ: So you didn’t [like?] your brother because of that? DJ: I’ve always loved my brother. I have always. Didn’t matter what he did. Always, always. I didn’t like a lot -- JJ: Is this ’cause we’re here in front of each other or what? DJ: No, no, no, no, it’s always been like this. It’s just that my brother and I are two different people. My brother has certain [01:14:00] beliefs of independence and I don’t believe that. JJ: Tell me what you believe. DJ: I believe that men and women are equal. I don’t believe that a man is better than a woman. I don’t believe that a man has to say -- if you say, “Oh, well, you have to do this.” No, nobody’s gonna tell me what I have to do or what I don’t have to do. I do it because out of respect and because I wanna do it, but not because I have to do it. And that’s how I am in my family and that’s probably why I feel that I have to take on so many problems of my family, of my kids, of my brother, my sister. I worry about everybody. Everybody. Even my brother can say, “If anybody has a problem or whatever, call Daisy. Daisy knows what she has to do.” Because I take care of the problem. I do this. I do that. I make things happen. I don’t fall apart. I don’t have time to fall apart. And you learn that when you have kids [01:15:00] because when I was growing up, no way. I kept saying, “I don’t want to, and we’re not living in Chicago. I don’t want anything to do with gangs. I don’t want anything to do with drugs. I don’t want anything like that.” 51 �But that’s not how life is. That is not how life is, so you have to be realistic. So when you’re realistic -- I can say and I can swear on the Bible. I can say I’ve never used drugs in my life ever. Ever, ever, ever. I’ve always said I would never, never do that and I never have. I would protect my kids against that. But we live in a world where that’s all over the place. I can tell my kids, “Don’t smoke weed.” JJ: Did your brother use any drugs? DJ: My brother used to use drugs. JJ: And everybody knew that? DJ: Not everybody knew it. We knew it. I knew it. JJ: How did you know? DJ: I just knew. I just knew that being in a gang [01:16:00] had to do with drugs. I just knew it had to do with that. JJ: So it had to do with being in a gang. DJ: But my brother has changed so much from the person he used to be. I know you used to smoke weed. I know you used to shoot up. JJ: Shoot up heroin? DJ: Everything, I guess. I don’t know, like I said, a lot of the stuff because I don’t know. But I know you used to shoot up. He was an alcoholic. JJ: Alcoholic, okay. DJ: He was an alcoholic. He stopped and now I’m so proud and proud. He doesn’t drink. He doesn’t smoke. He doesn’t smoke weed. He doesn’t shoot up. He drinks coffee and that’s it. 52 �JJ: That’s not saying much. It’s caffeine. DJ: No. But it’s saying a lot to what you were years ago. But one thing that you can never change on my brother, and I will say this, you can never change him [01:17:00] speaking of the Young Lords. I mean, I’ve got tapes here. He sends me everything. I’ve got tapes here. I’ve got everything that he sends me. I read it and I will say sometimes -- you’ll say, “Daisy, I’m sending you so you can read it.” “Yeah, okay, okay, okay.” And I tell my husband, I go, “Oh, here comes Joseph sending me some stuff. It’s some stuff of the Young Lords.” I read it. He’s my brother. I’m gonna read everything or whatever. I have it and I keep it. I save it. JJ: Okay, now another thing that you disagreed with which are within your brother, about the question of Puerto Rico. How do you feel about that? DJ: What do you mean? JJ: Puerto Rican independence and all that. DJ: Oh. You don’t want to get me started. JJ: No, no, I want it. DJ: You wanna know independence? Because when the people that live in the United States in Chicago, in Illinois, they’re people that do not live in Puerto Rico. [01:18:00] They have some nerve to come and say, “I want Puerto Rico independent. I want Puerto Rico to stay the way it is.” Well, you know what? The people that are saying that don’t live here because if they would live here, they would want Puerto Rico to be a state because then we would be equal to everybody else. We are not equal to everybody else. We are a colonial. We’re 53 �part of the United States. We’re not complete. We’re part of it, okay? So for instance, you’re in my house right now. We’re in 2012. I built this house in 1992. This house was finished building. At that time, hardly had water. Our light would go on and off here and there. We’re in 2012. My brother just came today, showed up this morning for this interview, and I have no water. Now, why is that? And we are [01:19:00] in 2012. That’s ridiculous. But there’s cell phones. But they have internet. So why isn’t the system of the water and the light fixed? Why are we still struggling? Why do I have to go to an appointment at two o’clock in the morning? Go to an appointment at two o’clock in the morning, wait for the secretary to show up at 8:00 in the morning. The doctor shows up at 9:00 or 10:00. They see you. At two o’clock in the morning, and you might be number 15 at two o’clock in the morning because there’s people that slept there all night. Now, why do we have to struggle like that? Why do we have to? Why do old people have to go through all this? And then they don’t want to pay you but the minimum, and in certain stores, they pay you five dollars an hour. What is that? I don’t believe that. I don’t believe that. This should be a state because in a state, everybody’s gonna be equal. You will have to pay everybody equally. [01:20:00] But also the Puerto Ricans are lazy because they are. I worked all my life in the States. I came to Puerto Rico. I worked here. I couldn’t believe the way they worked. There’s a saying that they said -- when those buildings from 9/11 happened, something like that with all these deaths and people dying. None of that would ever happen here in Puerto Rico. Why? Because Puerto Ricans are never where they’re supposed to be at time we work. That happened to 54 �those people because they were doing their job. They were in their offices. They were at work. Puerto Ricans, they go into work at 7:00. This one has to kiss this one’s face. “Hi, how are you?” Hug this one, do this. “Let me go get a coffee here.” “Oh, how was last night?” “Oh, did you see the novella last night?” And this and that. By the time they get to [their area?], it’s around 10:30 in the morning. When you have patients -- [01:21:00] I’ve always worked in hospitals. When you’ve got patients standing in the line, do they care? Because it’s all about them and not about the patients and not about the other people. That is why I don’t like Puerto Rico and if it wasn’t because of my mother, that I have to take care of her, I wouldn’t be living here. I would have already sold my house and I would be living in Florida with my kids and my grandkids. JJ: So you want it to be a state but you don’t like it, Puerto Rico, or because if it’s a state, then it won’t be Puerto Rico? DJ: No, if it would be a state, I think things would be better. We wouldn’t have all these problems. I mean, why would I have to worry about water? I have my brother coming to visit me and I have no water. Now, what is this? For two days. We’re not talking about an hour. We’re talking about two days with no water. Does the government think that people don’t take baths? JJ: So you’re saying the Puerto Rican Commonwealth government -- DJ: Exactly. JJ: -- is not doing their job. 55 �DJ: [01:22:00] They don’t know what they’re doing and it doesn’t matter who’s there. It doesn’t even matter if it’s independent, if it’s Republican or Democrat. It’s all bullshit. It’s all the same. JJ: So [where does?] the state [of the party?]. Today, now that the government today, the state of the party, so how do you feel about that? DJ: Right now? To me? JJ: Yeah. DJ: I don’t trust any of them. I don’t like any of them, period. I’m tired of it. I came here to live with my family and we did and my kids are grown up. They’re married and none of them live with me. None of them live in Puerto Rico and they tell me right off the bat -- and they went to school here also. They go, “Oh no, Mom, I can never have my kids go to school in Puerto Rico. They don’t learn anything.” My daughter, how can you get an A in gym if the teacher never went to school the whole year? But in her report card, she got an A in gym. Now, how can they do [01:23:00] that? JJ: The teacher wasn’t there at all? DJ: Not the entire year. There was no gym. They have no gym classes here. JJ: But she had an A? DJ: She had an A and there’s no gym. JJ: So people are not doing their jobs, basically. DJ: Exactly. JJ: Okay. 56 �DJ: You’re gonna watch. They’re gonna fix the light or whatever and the water. There’ll be five people. One will be digging and the other three are watching, but they’re all getting paid. That is the problem that they have in Puerto Rico. JJ: Okay, yeah. I was just trying to get how you think. I’m not trying to take sides or anything like that, not for this thing. DJ: Oh, it doesn’t matter. I know you’re independent. I don’t agree with you. That’s okay. Now, the day that you live here, you’re going to be independent. Now, in the meantime, I’m not gonna believe anything you tell me. JJ: Okay. Okay. Well, that’s a point down. DJ: That is a point down. The day that you move to Puerto Rico and you go to a two o’clock in the morning appointment or you have no water or you don’t have light, when you have all that and you go through all that struggle [01:24:00] that I go through, then you can tell me you can be independent and I’ll let you be independent. JJ: In Aurora, you were the Puerto Rican Queen. We’re gonna go to that since you’re attacking me already. DJ: Okay, but we need to cut the interview. JJ: Right now? DJ: Yeah. JJ: Okay, let me stop it running. END OF VIDEO FILE 57 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/1840aa9d349dbe21ee0e59802d4aade2.mp4 cd29aa0e01d97f76b28aea2c5789c1be Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Daisy Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 1 Descripción Spanish language Description entry Daisy Jiménez o como la llamaba su padre, “La Prieta”, es una hermana de José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Nació en el séptimo piso del Water Hotel en la calle Superior y La Salle Streets en Chicago, donde vivía su familia. Creció en La Clark medio Ohio y North Ave. , y luego en Lincoln Park donde ayudo a su mama a reclutar gente para misa en Español y dando rosarios para los Caballeros de San Juan y Damas de María. Después de vivir en Claremont y North Ave. Por unos años, la familia se movió ah Aurora, Illinois. Aquí conocieron a Teo Arroyo quien estaba organizando el primer desfilo Puertorriqueño en Aurora, y también era de Barrio San Salvado de Caguas. Daisy entro la carrera para ser Reina del Desfilo Puertorriqueño y gano. Ahora vive en Camuy, Puerto Rico con su esposo Israel Rodríguez y cuatro hijos. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Puertorriqueños--Illinois--Chicago--Vida social y costumbres Religión Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Daisy_1 Title A name given to the resource Daisy Jiménez video interview and transcript, interview 1 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Daisy Description An account of the resource Daisy Jiménez, or “La Prieta” as she was called by her father, is one of José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez’s sisters. She was born on the seventh floor of what was the Water Hotel at Superior and La Salle Streets in Chicago, where her family was then living. She grew up in La Clark between Ohio and North Ave., and then in the Lincoln Park area where she helped her mother Eugenia go door to door recruiting Hispanos for Spanish mass and praying rosaries for the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María. After living on Claremont and North Ave. for several years the family moved to Aurora, Illinois. There they joined up with grassroots leader Teo Arroyo, who was also from Barrio San Salvador of Caguas, Puerto Rico and was organizing the first Puerto Rican Parade for that city. Daisy entered the contest for Puerto Rican Parade Queen and won. She has raised four children and today lives in Camuy, Puerto Rico with her husband, Israel Rodríguez. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puerto Ricans--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Puerto Ricans--Illinois--Chicago--Social life and customs Religion Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-05-16 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/3143b58bebcdf41996ddd2297dbdf157.pdf 372238cba2e8c0bd6849941f646ad9c1 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Daisy Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 5/10/2012 Biography and Description English Daisy Jiménez, or “La Prieta” as she was called by her father, is one of José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez’s sisters. She was born on the seventh floor of what was the Water Hotel at Superior and La Salle Streets in Chicago, where her family was then living. She grew up in La Clark between Ohio and North Ave., and then in the Lincoln Park area where she helped her mother Eugenia go door to door recruiting Hispanos for Spanish mass and praying rosaries for the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María. After living on Claremont and North Ave. for several years the family moved to Aurora, Illinois. There they joined up with grassroots leader Teo Arroyo, who was also from Barrio San Salvador of Caguas, Puerto Rico and was organizing the first Puerto Rican Parade for that city. Daisy entered the contest for Puerto Rican Parade Queen and won. She has raised four children and today lives in Camuy, Puerto Rico with her husband, Israel Rodríguez. Spanish Daisy Jiménez o como la llamaba su padre, “La Prieta”, es una hermana de José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Nació en el séptimo piso del Water Hotel en la calle Superior y La Salle Streets en Chicago, donde vivía su familia. Creció en La Clark medio Ohio y North Ave. , y luego en Lincoln Park donde ayudo a su mama �a reclutar gente para misa en Español y dando rosarios para los Caballeros de San Juan y Damas de María. Después de vivir en Claremont y North Ave. Por unos años, la familia se movió ah Aurora, Illinois. Aquí conocieron a Teo Arroyo quien estaba organizando el primer desfilo Puertorriqueño en Aurora, y también era de Barrio San Salvado de Caguas. Daisy entro la carrera para ser Reina del Desfilo Puertorriqueño y gano. Ahora vive en Camuy, Puerto Rico con su esposo Israel Rodríguez y cuatro hijos. �Transcript 2 JOSE JIMENEZ: -- about you ran for Puerto Rican Queen in Aurora. Tell me what was that all about? DAISY JIMENEZ: That was when we moved to Aurora. There was candidates. They had, like, three girls that were running for Puerto Rican Queen. JJ: What year did you move to Aurora? DJ: That was in 1969. JJ: Nineteen sixty-nine, you moved to Aurora. DJ: We moved to Aurora. JJ: So right after the Young Lords started, that’s when you moved there? DJ: Yes. JJ: Okay. And what was the reason for moving there? DJ: The reason we had to move was because my older sister eloped with her boyfriend and he beat up on my sister. She walked all the way to the Young Lords church where they were all located, where everybody lived out there. JJ: (inaudible). Then what happened? DJ: Then my brother -- then you beat up on him [00:01:00] and you took him back to our house with my sister and you made her stay there and he had to leave. JJ: How do you know he was beaten up? DJ: Because he couldn’t open his eyes. That’s how swollen his eyes were. And he had said that you had beat him up. And then you made him take my sister back 1 �home, so since you made him take my sister back home, after everybody left and everything, my dad came home from work. JJ: He was being treated with respect when he went to your house? DJ: Yes. JJ: And you (inaudible) maybe he was beat up. He was -- DJ: Oh no, he was treated -- no, he went into the house, took her back home, nobody said anything to him or whatever, and then he had to leave. So he left and after he left -- JJ: Was he beaten up because he eloped? DJ: He was beaten up because he beat my sister really bad. Really [00:02:00] bad. And he had no reason to do that to my sister. And then my sister told you that he would hit her every day for no reason at all. She had to walk -- he was very -- the word is machista. He was very machista, so when they would walk down the street, my sister had to walk looking at the ground. If she would raise her head up at all or look at a window at a store or anything like that, automatically when he got home, he would beat her up. JJ: So was he jealous of her? DJ: He was very insecure. Our sister actually threw herself out of the second floor window because he had her locked up in the house with the bolt and keys. She couldn’t get out of the house, so she tried to escape, so she jumped out of a window and he was waiting for her downstairs, brought her in the house, and beat her up again. And then that’s when he got up all of the sudden and he left. JJ: [00:03:00] Now wasn’t he also married or something like that? 2 �DJ: On top of all that, he brought his wife -- his ex-wife -- to their apartment and had her staying there overnight with their child while my sister was there. So there was a lot of issues there. There was a lot, a lot of issues there. So then because of that, my mom could not take -- JJ: That was on Claremont, right? Why did you move from Bissell to Claremont? DJ: We moved from Bissell to Claremont because the owner of the house on Claremont was a compadre of my mom and dad. So since they were compadres, he had an empty apartment at the time and they just decided they were moving from Bissell to Claremont, to that area. JJ: Why all of the sudden? Because you lived many years on Bissell Street. DJ: I don’t know. JJ: [They weren’t talking about him?]? Nothing happened? (inaudible) DJ: It could have been. [00:04:00] It could have been that they raised the rent. It could have been a lot of different -- JJ: It could have been, but you don’t know. DJ: I don’t remember. At that time, I don’t remember ’cause at that time, I actually was not paying attention to much. JJ: So you moved from Bissell Street and Dickens, Bissell and Dickens, 2117. DJ: Twenty-one seventeen North Bissell. JJ: Well, we lived several years there. DJ: We lived a lot of years there. 3 �JJ: A lot of years there. And so we knew everybody in the community. ’Cause when we moved from there to Claremont and North Avenue, there was a church -- I think the FML or something like that. DJ: The what? JJ: I think they’re called FLM or something, that group, the Puerto Rican group? DJ: I’m not sure. JJ: (inaudible) over there (inaudible) there in the corner or something? DJ: There was people there at the corner. But I don’t remember. Like, I wasn’t really into all that stuff. I know all about this. I know about my sister getting beat up because we lived it. I mean, we saw it. But at that time, [00:05:00] I hadn’t gone to the church where my brother was with his organization. At that time, we weren’t there, and then from there, because of all the problems that we were having at the house with my sister, my parents decided that we were moving. Out of the blue. It was like overnight. We had a cousin. We moved to Aurora. He let us stay with him for a couple of weeks until we got our own apartment. JJ: Who was that? DJ: [Benedicto?]. JJ: Benedicto Jimenez? DJ: Jimenez. JJ: So you stayed at his house for a couple weeks until you were able to find a -- DJ: Until we were able to find an apartment. JJ: Okay, and that was -- DJ: That was in 1969. 4 �JJ: Okay, so now you found an apartment where? What street? DJ: On Claim Street. On Claim Street. Claim and High. JJ: And was it a big apartment? DJ: It was a little house. It was a little house, a detached home, and we got the apartment. We got the house and we were living there. And that was fine then. JJ: You don’t have the [00:06:00] address on Claim? DJ: Six fifteen. JJ: Six fifteen? DJ: I think it’s 615 Claim Street. JJ: In Aurora? DJ: In Aurora. JJ: Okay. So now you’re at 615 Claim Street in Aurora and are you in school? DJ: I was going to school. I believe I was in ninth grade. I was in the ninth. I was in eighth grade. I remember eighth grade. I had just finished -- JJ: You don’t know what school? You don’t know what school, do you? What school? DJ: No, and it wasn’t eighth grade, it was ninth grade. It was Waldo High School. JJ: Waldo High School. DJ: Yes, because I did ninth, tenth, eleventh, and twelfth there. Or, no, I went ninth and tenth. JJ: Okay, so you didn’t finish high school, then? DJ: No. I finished ninth there and then we went to East High and I started tenth, but that’s when I really started cutting class. 5 �JJ: And why were you cutting class? DJ: It just didn’t faze me. School was not fazing me [00:07:00] anymore. I was upset because we had to move from Chicago. I didn’t want to move. I had a boyfriend in Chicago. I didn’t want to move to Aurora. I couldn’t see him. I couldn’t talk to him. So this went on and on, so all of the sudden, we went to school one day -and I’ll never forget this because it was the first time I ever cut school in my life -we go and we cut school and my sister’s decided they were gonna cut school as well. We were just at a girlfriend’s house down the street by the school. There was like a group of us cut class, and we all went there. Well, all of the sudden, my brother -- which is you -- had an auto accident. JJ: Jose, Joseph. DJ: Jose, Joseph Jimenez. JJ: Okay. DJ: ’Cause I’ve always called him Joseph. JJ: Why was that? Why did you call him? DJ: I thought his name was Joseph. All my life, I grew up, I thought it his name. I never thought he was Jose. Could be because I’ve always -- JJ: But Mom called [00:08:00] me Jose. DJ: But I always thought you were Joseph, and probably because I’ve always considered myself more American than Puerto Rican. For some reason, I’ve always thought myself as that. I always go with what the Americans do. Puerto Ricans like rice and beans and everything. I prefer mashed potatoes, green 6 �beans, a salad, stuff like that. I mean, I eat it. It’s not like I don’t eat the Spanish food. But I would prefer American food. JJ: ’Cause you were born there too. DJ: ’Cause I was born and raised in Chicago, and at school, I loved their hot lunches, so that’s what I liked. JJ: What they actually did in school, they kind of changed peoples’ names. Anyway, but Daisy, yeah, they kind of changed peoples’ names when you’d go to school too. DJ: Uh-huh, exactly. JJ: So instead of the Spanish name, they called me -- DJ: Well, they never called me Daisy Jimenez. My name was Daisy Jiminez. And they also spelled it J-I-M-E-N-E-Z and it’s J-I-M-É-N-E-Z. [00:09:00] They spelled it J-I-M-I-N-E-Z. So they never spelled it correctly either, so it was a big ordeal. So then I’ll never forget that day, my first time in my life cutting class. The first time I cut. And here goes -- my brother goes and has -- which is you -- but decides on having an auto accident clear across -- I don’t know where it was. It was far away. JJ: In Aurora? DJ: You had a car accident. So what happened? My mom was babysitting some little kids during the day, so my dad goes to the school to go pick us up so we can go to the house, take care of the little kids so they can go to the hospital and go see you to make sure you were okay. When my dad goes to the school to pick us up, we were not in school. So we started coming home and we get home 7 �from school. He asks us, “Where were you?” We said, “In school.” “You were not in school because your brother had a car accident. We’ve been looking for you all [00:10:00] day. Where were you? We will take care of this later,” whatever, whatever. And they took off and left us with the little kids and they took off to the hospital, go see you to make sure you were okay. And then also while we lived in Aurora, I decided I’m running for Puerto Rican Queen. There was three girls running. And running for Puerto Rican Queen, it was the person that sold the most tickets. There would be a big raffle but the person that sold the most tickets, that would be the person that would actually win, and by winning -JJ: What organization was sponsoring this? DJ: Oh God. JJ: (inaudible) DJ: [Doroteo Arroyo?]. And it was just the Puerto Rican Parade Committee. That’s what it was called. So he was the president of the committee and it was three of us that were running for Puerto Rican Queen. We had to sell tons of tickets, so we were selling. Mom was cooking all these pasteles and selling this and selling that, and [00:11:00] we actually got to 2,000 tickets sold, and I for a fact knew that one of the other girls, one of them had 1,300 and the other one only had 1,000, so I already knew I was gonna win because I had the most tickets. But because I got upset at my dad -- I already had my dress, my gown, and everything. I had it altered. Everything was fine, ready for -- the dance was supposed to be -- and the crowning and everything -- on a Saturday. Well, the Tuesday before that Saturday -- the Saturday before, there was a dance. We 8 �had to sell more tickets, more raffles, more stuff to make more money for this organization. They were gonna pay us a trip to Puerto Rico at that time. JJ: Do you remember the other girls’ names or no? Not that important. DJ: One of them is [Carmen?]. JJ: What’s her last name? DJ: [00:12:00] Carmen [Brasero?]. That was one of ’em. And the other one I don’t remember, and the other one was the one that got crowned because she had 1,300 tickets sold, because what happened was that we went to this dance the week before. Our father already knew I had a boyfriend, which is my husband now. And we were not allowed to go out of the house together. He can visit me at my house, but I couldn’t go in his car and go anywhere with him like on a date or nothing like that, okay? So every time he would come over, for some reason when my husband came to talk to my dad and say, “I wanna see your daughter, and this and that. I want her to be my girlfriend,” and out of respect. That’s how the Puerto Ricans do that. They have to ask permission to be able to visit the daughter at the house. So my husband did that. At that time, he was my boyfriend. He did that. Well, my father didn’t [00:13:00] want to talk to him, so my mother talked to him. My mother said, “Fine, no problem, he can come by.” I believe it was on a Tuesday. “And he can come on Saturday.” So what happens? No, on Sunday. So what happens? He started coming on Tuesdays and Sundays and every time he would come, every time he would leave, there would be an argument at my house with my father. “Why is he here? Why did he come here? Why this?” And this was, like, every time, every time, and all we 9 �would do is sit on the couch and hold hands. I mean, we couldn’t even touch each other, I mean, like clothes, my elbow, or anything. We couldn’t do none of that. And for me to give him a goodbye kiss, my sister would have to, like, stand and hold up the wall in front of us, like hiding so he can give me a kiss and he can go home. So it was like one fight after the other all the time, all the time, all the time. JJ: What was [00:14:00] your father’s concern? What was he worried about? DJ: Because he said my husband drank and he don’t want him as my boyfriend because he drank. But my father drank. So what was the big deal? But no, he didn’t want him to be my boyfriend because he drank. JJ: Was he drinking a lot at that time, your father? DJ: No, no. Well, no, not at that time because my father at time, he would drink once a week. He either would drink on a Friday or drink on a Saturday. If he wanted to get drunk, he would get drunk either on a Friday or a Saturday. He would never touch anything Sunday through Thursday. JJ: What did he drink? DJ: Beer. At that time, he was really having beer. He wasn’t into drinking a lot of -before that, he did drink more, but when we moved to Aurora, he was just really drinking beer. I don’t remember him actually just like pounding down drinks or something like that. [00:15:00] I saw him more drinking beer. JJ: Was he being abusive at all at that time? ’Cause I don’t know if maybe when he was younger, he was a little abusive. 10 �DJ: No, he didn’t actually get abusive. He wanted to hit Mom one day and [Jenny?] got into it, but it was really more like an argument or whatever, not actually hitting. That’s why when my mom says, “Oh, your father always hit me,” and this and that, I don’t remember none of that. I don’t remember my father putting a hand on my mother ever. Ever. So that’s why I would like to know where was this hitting, because I never saw it, and I lived in the same house. It’s not like he did it in the bedroom ’cause when he wanted to fight, we would fight -- I know abusive in the part that she could be sleeping and he would get home at 3:00 in the morning with some friends, with the Hacha Viejas, and he would come and say, “Get up out of that bed, and I want you to cook for us.” And that, I found abusive ’cause she would get up and cook, but he didn’t hit her. So if there was hitting, it had to be when we were babies. JJ: Yeah. There was hitting when we were babies. DJ: [00:16:00] Yeah, but then after that, I don’t remember. JJ: Once we grew up, he didn’t. DJ: Yeah, I don’t remember him even touching her. JJ: Right, no. DJ: They didn’t actually talk. I don’t remember all this talking. I don’t remember hugging. I don’t remember kissing. I don’t remember my mom ever hugging me and kissing me. Ever. JJ: She never hugged you or kissed you? DJ: She would hug and kiss you because you were her son. You were her favorite. She only liked you because you were the male of the house. She didn’t like none 11 �of us three. Our three sisters? We don’t remember that. I remember one birthday party all my life, all my life, and that’s when I was 15. JJ: So did you resent that then? DJ: Oh, I resent it now. I still resent it because where we? I mean, she would come home from work. I remember having to be on my hands and knees waxing the floor, on my hands and knees. [00:17:00] So it was like all of the sudden, we grew up. We were the age of 9, 10, 11, 12. I remember we had to do everything at the house. One of us had to mop. One of us had to sweep. I had to get on my hands and knees and wax the floor by hand. It was the whole house, not just one little living room. It was the entire house. And to wash clothes, we didn’t have a machine. She would get a pillow case full of clothes. She would take that entire pillow case full of clothes and she would throw all those clothes -- it was everybody’s clothes -- dirty clothes in that bag. She would take those dirty clothes and she would throw them in the bathtub and with one of those little wooden things with the metal on it, she would put the -- JJ: The scrub boards. DJ: And we had to do the scrubbing boards. We would have to do that by hand. JJ: Instead of going to the laundromat? DJ: Exactly, and the laundromat was across the street. JJ: So you could’ve just (inaudible). DJ: Yeah. So we had to do that. We [00:18:00] had to rinse it out. We had to hang it up. And that wasn’t all because once it was dry, that whole sack of clothes, we 12 �had to stand there and we had to iron it all. She would make us iron the underwear. JJ: Do you think, was she trying to save money or maybe she wasn’t used to the new technology or something like that? DJ: No. JJ: Because she used to wash, you know, like the old days where they used to wash clothes. DJ: But she also had a machine. JJ: On the rocks. DJ: That was in Puerto Rico. But then after that, we did have machines. It’s not like we didn’t have machines. But it broke down, and so we had -- JJ: So she didn’t know how to use the machines. DJ: No, because we had a laundromat right across the street. We could’ve put all the clothes at the same time and had them all done. JJ: Did she know how to use the laundromat? DJ: It didn’t matter. If she didn’t know, we knew how to use it. All she had to do was give us the money and we would go and do it at the laundromat. No, she would make us do that. She would make us be home from school at 3:15 on the dot. We had to [00:19:00] be home and we had to start dinner. One of us had to start dinner. The other one had to start sweeping. The other one had to start mopping. And this was every day, every day, every day. We hated Saturdays. Saturdays, she would get in our room. She would take everything out of the closet. One shoe could not be out of place. Everything had to be. And in the 13 �meantime, she’d come home and just lie on the sofa. “Give me my black coffee. Give me a cigarette.” See, those are the things that you don’t remember ’cause you weren’t there. We remember a lot. There was things that I don’t know if I should say, but there’s things that happened, that bad. There was fight -- I know that they were gonna split up at one time because my mom was with some man. JJ: Okay, so it was a man. DJ: And she thinks that we don’t know. That’s the whole thing. She tried to [00:20:00] make it look like that some guy went in the house and tried to get nasty with her. But that’s not how it happened. She was getting ready for work and she knew this guy and she let him in the house and she knew Daddy wasn’t home. She knew Daddy was working. Why did she let him in the house? And then on top of that, you know that Daddy would take and get her check out of her purse to pay for the groceries, to do groceries. JJ: Let’s (inaudible). So how long was this man in the house? DJ: No, that man didn’t live there. That man just came that day. JJ: Oh, he came that day. Were you there with them? DJ: No, we were not there. We were in school. JJ: Oh, okay, so you weren’t there. You were in school. DJ: And Daddy was working. So he was there at the house. JJ: So something happened. DJ: I obviously think that something happened, but of course what happened was that our cousin Benedicto that lived in Aurora happened to be in Chicago and knocked on the door -- 14 �JJ: At that time. DJ: -- at that moment and she was in a robe. And so when he knocked and he saw her in a robe and saw this man there, [00:21:00] her excuse was -- and she put it in his mind and put it through all minds -- that this man tried to force himself on her, is what she says. But Daddy found a letter in her purse, some type of love letter in her purse, and she didn’t get rid of the love letter, so he found it. I remember we stayed next door. She had us underground, all of us. We were hiding next door. We couldn’t leave the house ’cause Daddy wanted to kill her. But we didn’t know why he wanted to kill her. We did not know why and we didn’t know why, and why? And then all of the sudden, we heard them talking. We heard all this fighting and this and that. Daddy started arguing. He wanted to hit her, but she grabbed us and we left, and then all of the sudden we just came next door on the second floor. But we would see Daddy go in and out, in and out. Well, that happened all weekend, but by Monday -- see, that’s why Daddy always loved me [00:22:00] and I know he did -- by Monday, we were walking to school and he was under the train tracks waiting for us. “You’re gonna tell me where your mother is.” And my mom specifically told us, “Don’t you tell your father where we’re at.” So I told him, I said, “Oh, we’re right next door, Daddy. We’re there. Why are you guys fighting?” And he wouldn’t tell us and wouldn’t tell us, but then we heard him talking again and I knew it was because the letter that was in her purse. And then she tries to justify herself because that wasn’t the only time. JJ: How come? 15 �DJ: That I remember. JJ: With the same person? DJ: No, this is then somebody else. Then we know. We went to a carnival. Had the carnival. We were dying to go to the carnival. Well, she kept saying, “No, we have no money. I have no money.” Daddy was working nights. “We have no money.” But all of the sudden we had money to go to the carnival. We go to the carnival. We’re getting on all [00:23:00] these rides. All of the sudden, we’re up, we’re up on the Ferris wheel, we see our mother down there talking to some man. We’re on our rides. All of the sudden, the man kept paying us rides while they were by themselves talking. Of course, at that time you don’t think anything about it, but our sister was three years -- JJ: So she was flirting with the man at that time. DJ: Of course, but our sister was three years older, which was Jenny. JJ: So I mean, on that day, you didn’t see them doing anything sexual. DJ: Not sexual. She was with him and all this laughing and all this thing. JJ: Well, that’s flirting. DJ: Exactly. And then another time when we actually lived on Bissell Street, the landlord -- JJ: But the other time, they weren’t in the house. That’s what you were saying. DJ: One of them one time was in the house. JJ: That’s the only time you saw them? Where there was a man in the house? DJ: That they talked about, that he tried to get nasty with her in the house. That’s what she said. But the only reason she was saying that was because she got 16 �caught, because she got caught. If she wouldn’t have gotten caught, she wouldn’t have even said [00:24:00] anything. But because she got caught, she had to say that. And then it was a man at the carnival that I remember. Then when we lived at 2117 North Bissell, the owner of the house lived in the basement. We lived on the first floor. Well, the lady, the owner downstairs, she had a brother. See, I didn’t know this, but my sister Jenny told me this. She says, “Daisy, I’m three years older than you. There was things that happened that you don’t know.” And I go, “Well, what happened?” “Well, don’t you remember the lady downstairs had a brother?” I go, “Yeah.” I always would see Mom talking to them, to him. JJ: So who’s telling you this? DJ: My sister Jenny told me. JJ: Jenny, okay. DJ: I would always see them talking but I never said anything until one day, I was going down the stairs. Jenny’s the one that told me this, that she was going down the stairs and she heard Mom tell the lady -- the owner of the house -- say, “Listen, tell your brother [00:25:00] that I can’t meet him tonight because so-andso wasn’t working,” or something, which was our father, and she couldn’t go. “Just make sure you tell him that I can’t go tonight.” I didn’t know what it was. Jenny told me and she goes, “Yeah, she was seeing him.” So that justifies probably all the arguing and all the fighting that was happening in our house when we were growing up. That’s what I’m thinking. I don’t know. But anyway, 17 �that’s why there’s a lot of resentment there. There’s resentment and the fact that my father died. JJ: So you resented that she was doing that? DJ: Because she taught us that you don’t do stuff like that, and what makes her any better than us? That’s how I see it. She taught us -- we were Catholic. We respect our husband. We do this. We do that. Whatever. Threw the whole Book. You can’t do this. This is bad. [00:26:00] Don’t French kiss, ’cause we did that. Don’t go out with a guy that has tattoos. When you get married by the Catholic church, you can’t get a divorce. That’s a sin. Unless you’re a widow, you can’t remarry. You know, all this sin and all this thing and all this Catholic church and all this for what? My father died, and two months after my father was dead, she was sending me a letter stating that she had a boyfriend. Two months after my father died. And she remarried seven months after my father was dead. She didn’t even wait a year. And then she had this huge wedding. JJ: And it’s custom to wait a year? DJ: At least custom to wear black. At that time, a widow wore black for a year. JJ: Wore black for a year? DJ: Yeah. And then you can do whatever you wanted and people wouldn’t say nothing. Everybody talked. She didn’t care. JJ: What do you -- talk -- DJ: Everybody talked [00:27:00] about her. JJ: So everybody knew? DJ: Why was she seeing a man when her husband wasn’t even cold in the grave? 18 �JJ: Everybody in San Salvado? DJ: Everybody. Everybody in San Salvador, her brothers and sister. My uncles on my father’s side. Everybody talked about her. We were all upset. And then we weren’t even part of her wedding, not even my younger sister. She threw my younger sister out of the house. She’s ready to get married. She still has a 17year-old living with her, which is my younger sister, 17-year-old living with her, so what does she do? My sister cuts class, goes to the beach with her boyfriend, some friend of hers sees my sister. When she gets home -- mind you, our dad’s already dead. She’s already preparing to get married -- she puts her house up for rent, a new house, because she says that she needed to get married because -- the necessity. How was she gonna eat? There [00:28:00] was food stamps. What makes her better than anybody else to take food stamps? There was factories. She was only 40-something. She could’ve gone to work. She wasn’t disabled. She could’ve gone to work. I told her to come and live with me and she didn’t wanna go to New Jersey. You know, Jenny told her to go live with her in Aurora, go back to Chicago, and she didn’t want her. Her excuse was -- we knew she just wanted to go to bed. She wanted to have a boyfriend. She wanted to get married. She didn’t care. So she goes. My sister cuts class. My younger sister cuts school. She tells her brother because my mother couldn’t go. She was ready to get married and she couldn’t walk ’cause she had had a broken leg right before the wedding, so she didn’t walk very well. She tells her brother, “I want you to take my daughter to her boyfriend’s house because she’s moving out. She is moving in with her boyfriend because she cut class and I 19 �don’t know if she’s a virgin now.” Those were her exact words and she threw my sister out of the house. JJ: [00:29:00] Because she didn’t know if she was a virgin? DJ: But she didn’t take her to the doctor either to see if she was a virgin. She just wanted to get rid of her because she wanted to start a new life with her new husband and she didn’t care about her. That is what it was. JJ: Okay, this is after Antonio died. DJ: Yes, this was after our father died. This was seven months after our father died. JJ: Okay, so then she’s marrying this new guy and she wants [him around?]. DJ: She wants to be very soft with him. She doesn’t want a 17-year-old girl in her life. She didn’t even ask her to be in her wedding. This is her daughter that lived with her. She didn’t ask her anything. That is why we’re all resentful. Those are things that you don’t understand because you didn’t live with us. So that happened. Anyway, that happened, that part of the life. JJ: (inaudible) you’re real angry. DJ: I’m still mad at her. We all are. [00:30:00] Joseph, this doesn’t go away. And then now on top of all this -- JJ: But she’s been living with you for how many years now? DJ: Three years and I’m still mad. JJ: For the last three years. DJ: And I’m still mad. JJ: So if she’s been living with you for the last three years and you’re angry, why is she living with you? 20 �DJ: Because nobody else wants her. Because nobody else wants to keep her fulltime. They made me quit my job, leave my kids to come to Puerto Rico when I was living in Florida. JJ: Why doesn’t she go with Jenny or something? DJ: Because Jenny all of the sudden now has Paget’s disease. Not all of the sudden, because she does have Paget’s disease. But she says she can’t deal with that and can’t deal with her appointments and can’t deal with this. So then I come here to Puerto Rico with no job, no nothing. JJ: Does she want to (inaudible) or no? DJ: My mother? JJ: Right. DJ: I don’t know. She’ll want to be with you. I mean, if you noticed, [00:31:00] she got up this morning thinking that she was gonna go hang out with you. I told her, “Mom, you’re going to the nursing home.” “Oh, I thought I was going with Jose.” I go, “No, Joseph is doing interviews today.” You notice that ever since you’re here, she’s with you. She gets up in the mornings, sits with you. When you’re not here, she doesn’t come in this house. JJ: So you’ve gotten less angry since she’s been with you or more angry? DJ: I’m the same. JJ: The same? DJ: I’m about the same because she also told me -- I understand she’s starting Alzheimer’s, but she also told my daughter -- my daughter says to her -- my daughter comes on vacation from Florida, says, “Grandma, when are you going 21 �to Chicago?” “Oh, I don’t know.” And my daughter says to her, “Well, you know, Grandma, you do have a daughter and a son over there. Maybe you should go visit and you can stay a couple [00:32:00] months because they are your son and daughters as well.” “Oh no, I’m staying here in Puerto Rico. This is my house here and your mother has to take care of me because I had her in my stomach for nine months and it’s her job to take care of me.” JJ: She told this to who? DJ: To my daughter. She told me that I had to take care of her because that was my job and that pissed me off more. So then that’s when I got on her case and I told her, “I take care of you because I wanna take care of you, because I can easily put you in a nursing home. If nobody wants to deal with you, I can put you -- but because I wanna take care of you, that is why I’m taking care of you.” JJ: So is she kind of controlling? DJ: She tries, but she can’t pass me. She tries to control me but I won’t let her. JJ: But she is controlling? DJ: Oh, she’s very controlling. JJ: How does she control? What does she control? DJ: Oh, she’ll say something like -- I have to take out her clothes. I go, “Here, Mom, here’s your clothes.” “I’m not wearing that.” And I go, [00:33:00] “Mom, I just spent 30 dollars on this outfit for you. You said you liked the outfit. You need to put it on because I don’t have money to keep spending to be throwing clothes away.” JJ: So she confronts one way or another. 22 �DJ: She likes to confront. She comes up and she says, “I’m not wearing it.” And then I’ll tell her, “Well, you either wear it or you’re not going to the nursing home.” JJ: What other ways is she controlling? Does she use guilt at all? DJ: Does she what? JJ: Does she try to make you feel guilty? DJ: No, she just swears. All of the sudden -- she never used to swear. That’s how I know it’s part of the Alzheimer’s. JJ: She didn’t used to swear? DJ: No, she told me to go to hell not too long ago. She told me, “Why don’t you go to hell?” Because she had eaten lunch at around 2:30 and it was only, like, four o’clock, and mind you, she had a big, huge lunch, and she wanted to eat again, rice. So I said, “No, I can give you [00:34:00] a piece of cake and milk or something, but you’re not having rice again, not a big bowl.” “Oh, you never wanna --” And I go, “Mom, you just ate.” “Oh, I wanna eat again.” I go, “Mom, you can’t keep eating. Look how heavy you are. You cannot continue to eat. You keep gaining weight and gaining weight.” “Oh, why don’t you just go to hell?” And I opened this door and I said, “Who did you tell to go to hell?” I go, “Not in my house.” I go, “This is my house and you respect --” “Oh, I didn’t say go to hell.” I go, “Now you’re calling me a liar?” So she does try, but I know some of it is the Alzheimer’s, so I try to control myself. I do and I try to control myself. But I do need you to help from time to time. I need Jenny to help because otherwise, I get angrier and angrier and angrier, you know? I wanna be with my kids and I 23 �have to see my kids at least twice a year. [00:35:00] The entire last year, I only saw my kids for eight days and it’s hard. JJ: And then you’re going through something (inaudible) [yourself?]. DJ: Yeah. JJ: What kind of stuff? DJ: Well, now I have some white lesions inside my left cheek all the way on the inside, but it’s taken most of my cheek. It’s called pre-cancer. It has to be removed and then it has to be watched every month. Every month, I have to go to a specialist, have it watched because there’s like 85 percent it’s gonna return, and once it returns, it could be carcinoma. It could be cancer. And there’s, like, 65 percent of the women that have this have never smoked, so I guess I’m one of the 31 percent that does smoke. This is very rare. It’s not like everybody has this. Women get it more than men but I was reading [00:36:00] on it. It said something about African women, women that came from Spain, family heritage from Spain. It has different things. JJ: Nationalities have more? DJ: Yeah, more that get this. JJ: But is it African? Could be Latino? DJ: I believe it said African and I know it said Spaniards. I know it said that. JJ: It’s the Moors. Yeah, the Moors were African. DJ: And out of five people, four of them are women, so it’s very low for men to get this. The risk is higher for women. And like I said, 65 percent of the women, they 24 �have never smoked, and 85 percent of the people, it’ll return again. I will get it later on. JJ: When you say it could, not that I want to be in denial, but they did say that sometimes if it comes back, it might not be cancerous? DJ: No, most of it. Most of the time when it comes back, they’ll find a cell that’ll be cancer. It’ll be cancerous. JJ: [00:37:00] But it’s something very serious. DJ: Yeah, it is serious, so you have to keep watching it and watching it all the time. What they mean with watching is all of the sudden, they’ll remove it now. If all the sudden they see one, they’ll do a biopsy on that one, and if it’s cancerous, then right away they’ll remove it and do whatever they can do to it. But yeah. So anyway, going back to all of this ’cause we changed back to Mother and all that. JJ: Yeah. I just wanna ask one more thing about Mom. Okay, at different times in her life, she was very religious. DJ: Yes. JJ: You think she was lying then or was she religious then? DJ: Well, she was religious then. But then because now she married three times -she’s been widowed three times. She’s a widow three times. What happens is that she doesn’t want us to talk about our father. If we mention our father, right away she talks about how he used to hit her, but I don’t remember that. [00:38:00] So she’s always talking bad about our father, always, always, so we don’t even mention him. But then her second husband -- and also she never had to take care of our father. Our father had a stroke in July and he died in August 25 �and he was in the hospital the whole time, so she never had to do anything for him. JJ: But her second husband? DJ: But her second husband that she wanted so bad after only seven months, she marries him and he was already, like, a year later turning blind because he had diabetes real bad. It just got worse and worse and then he got bedridden and he was bedridden, like, for 5, 10 years, something like that, and she had to take care of him. JJ: For 10 years. DJ: Yeah, she had to take care of him for 10 years. JJ: So she had no life? DJ: Exactly. And then he died, but see, that’s what she wanted. And then he dies and we had to have her come move over here because she had nobody over there in Caguas. So we had to have her move over here. I found her [00:39:00] a little apartment for people 65 or older. JJ: Senior citizens only? DJ: Senior citizens only. I found her like a little studio apartment. We set it all up. She had everything. She was very modern. She had all her stuff, so she was doing okay and she was fine. All of the sudden, she goes to the nursing home, started visiting the nursing home. The bus would pick her up. She’d go down there, play dominoes. They would bring her back. All of the sudden I go to her house after about a year. About a year, year and a half after going to the nursing home, all of the sudden I see her. “Mom, who painted your nails?” ’Cause I 26 �always offered and she was like, “No, leave them like that.” She was already in her seventies. She was, like, 72, 74. All of the sudden, another day, I see her eyebrows plucked. Never in her life had she ever plucked her eyebrows. [00:40:00] I’m working one day. A lady at the nursing home calls me. The administrator from the nursing home calls me because I know her. She says, “Daisy, did you know your mom’s getting married?” And I go, “What?” “Yeah, your mom’s getting married with so-and-so,” and I go, “Since when?” “Oh, she asked us if she can get married here. His daughter makes cakes, so she’s gonna do the cake here. The ceremony’s gonna be here. She said that she had her dress already. I didn’t know if you knew. I just wanted to make sure you knew. But it looks like she’s the one planning the whole wedding. It doesn’t look like he’s the one that wants it. It looks like she’s the one that wants to get married,” is what she told me. So I confronted her and I says, “Mom --” Then Jenny found out and Jenny was crying and she was upset and I was upset too. I go, “Mom, what are you doing? How can you say you’re gonna marry somebody? You don’t even know this [00:41:00] person. We don’t even know him. What if he’s a killer? What’s if he’s a drunk? What if he beats you up? You don’t know. What if he has AIDS? You don’t know. We don’t even know him. You met him in the nursing --” “Oh no, he’s fine.” And I says, “How do you know if he’s divorced?” “No, no, he’s a widow.” And I says, “Oh yeah, he’s a widow?” “Yes, he’s a widow.” And I go, “You know Jenny is crying, Mom. Jenny is sick and she’s crying. She’s got her blood pressure going up.” “I don’t care if she’s got her high blood pressure going up. I don’t care if she cries. I don’t care if she 27 �dies. I don’t care of anything. I am getting married and that’s it, and I’m old enough to make my own decisions and nobody has to get into my life. I can do what I want.” Those were her exact words. JJ: Why was she angry in that moment? DJ: Because she’s didn’t want none of us to get involved. She was doing all this hiding. We would’ve found out when she was already married. She didn’t include us in anything. It’s [00:42:00] like we don’t exist. But here she turns 82 and we have to exist because we have to watch her. Those are the things that I say that she’s being selfish about because she likes to be with the old people, senior citizens. She likes to play dominoes all day. She comes here to my house and as soon as she gets here, all she does is go in her room, watch TV, and sleep, and lie in her bed, so why can’t she do that at the nursing home? Why can’t she continue being with the seniors, have a good time with them? ’Cause they take them on trips and everything. When she’s tired, she can go in her room in the nursing home, go to bed, get up in the morning and play dominoes all day ’cause that’s all she likes to do is play dominoes. Here she doesn’t play dominoes. She doesn’t do nothing. But no, and I told her one day, I go, “Mom, all you do is sleep here. Why don’t you just stay at the nursing home and sleep there?” “No, because I don’t want to. I’m staying here. You’re supposed to watch me.” That’s what makes me so mad is because she -- JJ: So she says you’re -- DJ: [00:43:00] I have to watch her. Nobody else. I have to watch her. JJ: And that’s because of her tradition, her beliefs, and all that? 28 �DJ: That children are supposed to watch their parents. JJ: So that is because of her beliefs. DJ: Exactly. JJ: So she’s just following her beliefs. DJ: But that’s okay. But see, my mother is not -- JJ: Right now, that’s not the way reality is. DJ: Exactly. First of all, my mother’s never taken care of my kids ever. She doesn’t know how to be a grandmother. My kids don’t even know. They’ll say, “Oh, hi Grandma,” and that’s it. But they don’t have that love connection between a grandmother and their -- no, not with my mother. My mother never took care of any of our kids, none of them. They’ve never spent the night by themselves like a grandmother would have them, to baby them and all that. Uh-uh. And we’ve lived like that all our lives. That is probably why I’m angrier more, that why do I have to do this, you know? Why? [00:44:00] ’Cause she didn’t care about us before. She didn’t care, and mind you, she didn’t care about us till the age of probably 76, so it’s not like -- she just started her Alzheimer’s, like, a year and a half ago, but way before that, her mind was fine, so why was she treating us like that, you know? But anyway, that’s in the past. And like I said, we lived in Aurora, going back to the Puerto Rican Queen thing. And because my father -he was abusive that day, that Saturday right before the coronation. That Saturday, my boyfriend -- which is my husband -- was at the dance. I was at the dance. My two sisters were at the dance. But he was already my boyfriend. He visited me. We were standing in a circle. Standing, not sitting or holding hands. 29 �[00:45:00] Nothing. Just standing. It was like six or seven of us just talking. My father comes and sees me next to him talking. We were all talking together. “What are you doing?” I go, “Nothing, Daddy, we’re just standing here talking.” “You’d better not be standing there talking. You’d better get away from him unless I want you to go home.” I go, “Dad, but I’m not doing nothing.” And he says, “I told you to stay away from him. I’m taking you home.” He took us out of the dance. We got home and then he went back. JJ: How could he take you to the dance? DJ: He got us in his car. He says, “We’re leaving. Get in the car.” This was the week before. JJ: You had you and your -- DJ: My two sisters. This was the week before of the coronation. JJ: What did you tell your boyfriend? DJ: That I had to leave and then he got upset. So when we got home, my father went back to the dance and my boyfriend showed up at the house and my mom says, “Oh, you’d better go before he comes because he’s gonna get upset.” Well, my father went and got drunk. He got drunk and then came home that night drunk, [00:46:00] like at midnight, and when he came, he started yelling and my sisters were saying, “Daddy, stop yelling,” or whatever. “You shut your mouth, you little tramp.” And this and that. And then we were lying in bed and I remember he grabbed me by my hair and threw me on the floor. I’ll never forget that. I hit myself with the metal on the side of the bed. That was the first time he had ever hit me ’cause my dad never hit me. First time he had ever hit me. Then 30 �he was fighting in my mom’s room, not hitting her but just fighting. “Oh, this and that. You’re a bunch of tramps,” and this and that and all this. He just went on and on. My sister got up, older sister. “You’d better shut up and you’d better not lay a hand on anybody or I will call the --” “You call the police, you little bitch,” and this and that. That’s exactly how he was talking to her, but he was drunk. He was mad. He was drunk. I was crying so bad that night ’cause I was so upset ’cause he had touched me. He had never hit me. [00:47:00] And I was so mad and so mad. The next day, I go, “You will never touch me again.” My boyfriend, which is my husband now, calls me. “How can your father do this and that? And we’re not doing nothing wrong. I want you to elope with me.” All he had to do was tell me once. I wanted to get out of there. He told me once. We were planning it for Monday, but because Monday was a holiday, we couldn’t go on Monday. So then Tuesday was Columbus’s birthday, October 13th, 1970, Columbus’s birthday. I left, I got on a plane and went to New Jersey, and they were looking for me for three weeks until I finally called somebody. JJ: Who did you call? DJ: I called my mother because -- JJ: What’d she say then? DJ: “Are you okay?” And this and that, whatever. “I hope you don’t come here pregnant.” I go, “Well --” [00:48:00] But that, she didn’t know. So then that happened in October and in January -- but going back, before I eloped, when I was eloping that Tuesday, since I was running for Queen, that Saturday was the coronation. I knew I had already won. I had my dress in my closet and I left four 31 �days before the coronation. That was the biggest embarrassment my mother could’ve had and my dad could’ve had. They were saying that I had left, that they had already crowned me because I wasn’t gonna be a virgin, and all this and that. Oh, they talked. The whole town talked. I didn’t care. I lived in New Jersey. I wasn’t there. But it was all over, all over, all over that I had left. So they had no choice. They only had two girls running and they picked the other one that had sold the 1,200 tickets. So they crowned her. And then [00:49:00] from there -JJ: Okay, I’m not clear how you lost (inaudible). DJ: How did I lose the coronation? JJ: Can you repeat that? I’m not clear. DJ: Okay, I lost the coronation ’cause I left. I eloped four days before the coronation. JJ: So they had messed up the -- DJ: That messed the entire thing up. JJ: Oh, you eloped. You didn’t win -- DJ: I eloped. I wasn’t there. JJ: You weren’t there. DJ: So they continued. They did the crowning and everything, but I wasn’t there. But everybody was upset because everybody knew that I had won. They had already counted the tickets so everybody knew I had won. So then that happened. We went to New Jersey. I was there till -- yeah. Yeah, I was [over there?] to New Jersey, and then I came back in January. When I came back in January, I was pregnant then. I was two months pregnant. 32 �JJ: So you were there a few months in New Jersey. DJ: And then I came back. JJ: Okay. And you went back then to live in New Jersey? DJ: I went in 1972. [00:50:00] I went back and lived two years -- I hated it. I hated it, hated it. JJ: Where did you live [in town?]? DJ: In Jersey City. JJ: Jersey City, okay. DJ: New Jersey, and I hated it. I didn’t like it at all. JJ: What part of Jersey City? Was it divided by north and south sides? DJ: I don’t know. All I know is Jersey City is, like, the town, and the state is New Jersey. That’s all. ’Cause they have North New Jersey, Elizabeth, New Jersey -- JJ: Were you working there? Were you working at all? DJ: I started working, like, in a factory where they sewed coats but I didn’t like doing none of that stuff, so I just stayed home. I worked, like, for two weeks ’cause we had to be real fast and I was only 15. JJ: What other places have you worked? DJ: Have I worked? Then I started getting into the medical field. Then we left from New Jersey and we went back to Aurora and then in 1970 -- I got married in 1976. JJ: [00:51:00] So you’ve been married for a while, right? DJ: I’ve been living with my husband for 42 years. In 1976, we actually got married after being together for five and a half years, and my son was in my wedding and 33 �I had two boys at that time. And then in 1979, I started working at Dreyer Medical Clinic as an interpreter. I was the interpreter there and then from there, we came here to Puerto Rico in ’86. In ’86, I came down. I started working in (inaudible) in Caguas and then -JJ: What were you doing there? DJ: I was a supervisor of the billing department in the emergency room, which they’re actually called secretaries. I had 13 secretaries. [00:52:00] I had to do their shifts, like 3:00 to 7:00, 3:00 to 11:00, 11:00 to 7:00. JJ: You had to schedule them? DJ: I had to schedule them. I had to do their timecards. I had to supervise them, make sure one covered the other. We had to do that. I did that for six years. JJ: In Caguas? DJ: In Caguas. Then we decided we were moving to Florida. We were in Florida, like, for about two months, three months. JJ: What part of Florida? DJ: In Orlando. JJ: Orlando. DJ: But we were there only four months because I kept getting asthma attacks and asthma attacks and then we figured out it was because I had the dog inside the house. And the air and the vent, I was getting sick every day, so we had to come back to Puerto Rico. So we came back to Puerto Rico. We came to Camuy, this part of town, because that’s where my husband’s from. And we started building this house. We stayed here for 15 years, and all of the sudden, my kids were 34 �gone. I have four [00:53:00] kids -- two daughters, two sons. They were all gone, married, and they all have moved to Florida. My husband, after working here in Camuy -JJ: Where do they live? DJ: They live in West Palm Beach, Florida. JJ: West Palm Beach, okay. DJ: I’ve got two daughters in West Palm Beach, Florida. I have a son in Kissimmee, Florida, and I have a son that lives in Chicago. I started working here. I worked for 10 years, and all of the sudden, my husband one day says to me, “Let’s move to Florida. Why are we here? We have no kids here, we have no grandkids, we don’t have nobody here. We need to move.” So we moved to Florida where my kids were. I was there for six and a half years until all of the sudden, my mom’s third husband dies because she did get married in the nursing home that none of us went, so she’s a widow again. JJ: What type of person was he? DJ: [00:54:00] Like I said, they got married in September -- JJ: Was he a religious man? DJ: No. Then on top of this, I found out that he was divorced. He was never widowed. On top of this, my mother got married through a pastor from some Pentecostal church when we has been Catholic all her life. So that’s why my whole religion thing was like -- JJ: So he kind of took over her life at that point. DJ: Yes. 35 �JJ: Okay. DJ: But not even take over. The point is that she knew that she was supposed to marry somebody Catholic. She knew that she had to be married by the Catholic church. She knew that she couldn’t marry this man because he was divorced and not widowed, so she was committing all the sins in the book. But then she’s trying to preach to me and tell me that this is how life is? She said that God forgave her because of her age. Now, what does that have to do with it? JJ: [00:55:00] The Catholic church forgives when you go to confession. DJ: Yeah, but she didn’t go to confession. She went and married through a pastor from a Pentecostal church and we’re Catholic. JJ: So she was changing her beliefs. DJ: She was just doing it because she wanted to get married, and then she lied to us through the whole thing. You know, she lied to us. She told us that he was a widow. She did all this on purpose. And then now we have to deal with that. That’s what it is. So like I said, we lived six and a half years in Florida. When I was in Florida, I worked for Dr. [Wilbert Pino?], an orthopedic surgeon, and I was the surgical coordinator. That was my last job until I had to come here to take care of my mother. So I quit my job after six and a half years and come here, and this is where I am with my husband, dying to get up and leave, again, to Florida because I wanna be with my kids. So next week, [00:56:00] I will be taking a vacation to be with them and eventually, probably, I will end up living over there, and if nobody can take care of my mom, I guess I’ll have to take her 36 �with me, you know, here and there because I definitely have to be with my grandkids and my kids. I have to. JJ: Mainly because of what’s going on now with your life? DJ: With my life, with my face, with my illness. You know, what if something happens and I don’t see them? It’s hard. But that’s okay. Take one day at a time. And now I live here with my husband and my mom, and this is my story. JJ: Okay. (inaudible). END OF VIDEO FILE 37 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/20212cfc54134870ddfc1ebca7a039e0.mp4 918d82d1a11e767b1094e5069a274946 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Daisy Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 2 Descripción Spanish language Description entry Daisy Jiménez o como la llamaba su padre, “La Prieta”, es una hermana de José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Nació en el séptimo piso del Water Hotel en la calle Superior y La Salle Streets en Chicago, donde vivía su familia. Creció en La Clark medio Ohio y North Ave. , y luego en Lincoln Park donde ayudo a su mama a reclutar gente para misa en Español y dando rosarios para los Caballeros de San Juan y Damas de María. Después de vivir en Claremont y North Ave. Por unos años, la familia se movió ah Aurora, Illinois. Aquí conocieron a Teo Arroyo quien estaba organizando el primer desfilo Puertorriqueño en Aurora, y también era de Barrio San Salvado de Caguas. Daisy entro la carrera para ser Reina del Desfilo Puertorriqueño y gano. Ahora vive en Camuy, Puerto Rico con su esposo Israel Rodríguez y cuatro hijos. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Narrativas personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Puertorriqueños--Illinois--Chicago--Vida social y costumbres Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Daisy_2 Title A name given to the resource Daisy Jiménez video interview and transcript, interview 2 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Daisy Description An account of the resource Daisy Jiménez, or “La Prieta” as she was called by her father, is one of José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez’s sisters. She was born on the seventh floor of what was the Water Hotel at Superior and La Salle Streets in Chicago, where her family was then living. She grew up in La Clark between Ohio and North Ave., and then in the Lincoln Park area where she helped her mother Eugenia go door to door recruiting Hispanos for Spanish mass and praying rosaries for the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María. After living on Claremont and North Ave. for several years the family moved to Aurora, Illinois. There they joined up with grassroots leader Teo Arroyo, who was also from Barrio San Salvador of Caguas, Puerto Rico and was organizing the first Puerto Rican Parade for that city. Daisy entered the contest for Puerto Rican Parade Queen and won. She has raised four children and today lives in Camuy, Puerto Rico with her husband, Israel Rodríguez. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puerto Ricans--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Puerto Ricans--Illinois--Chicago--Social life and customs Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-05-10 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/2e9a07b39a329f3df5b77542164950cd.pdf eef6390183fd8d95441cb33ba8580f0e PDF Text Text Speaking Out Western Michigan’s Civil Rights Histories Interviewee: Fabiola Jimenez Interviewers: Lucas Mosher, Kelsie Overhuel, Kyle Richard and Karly Stanislovaitis Supervising Faculty: Melanie Shell-Weiss Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 2/14/2012 Biography and Description Fabiola Jimenez, a Colombian woman who has been living in East Michigan since 1994. She discusses how she feels as though she was never discriminated against because of her race. Transcript MOSHER: This is Lucas Mosher, Kyle Richard, Kelsie Overhuel, and Karly Stanslovaitis. We are at Mackinac hall, on the grand valley state university Allendale campus, and it is February 24th at 4:30 pm. We are interviewing Fabiola Jimenez, a Colombian woman from East Michigan. So, Tell us your story. Let’s start from when you moved from Colombia to Texas. JIMENEZ: Yes, I came to the United States in 1971, and I was 12 years old. My parents sent me here to live with my uncle and aunt, they stayed back home. And I went to school, to middle school, I started the 7th grade. I did not go to the special school where there was bilingual education, I went to the regular school in a separate school district, where there were no Hispanic children there, but there were cousins, that live in that neighborhood. And so when I went to that school, they were pretty much the few people who spoke Spanish were my cousins, but they were all obviously in other classes. I took special classes, I guess, with the counselor, who taught me words in English from flash cards, but I also attended regular classes with the other children in science, and math. Math was taught in a progressive mode, where you worked on worksheets, and you advanced at your own pace, it wasn’t like a classroom lead math class, unless there happened to be a group of kids working on the same subject. Through that method, I was able to advance quickly through algebra, so I moved on to take algebra in the 8th grade. By the time I went to the 9th grade, I was ready for geometry, and that didn’t seem to be an obstacle that I didn’t speak English that well. I feel that having to be immersed along with the other English speaking children, and not having a bilingual education helped me learn English very fast. And so I didn’t need special bilingual education classes to be able to catch up, or move a long with the other 8th graders and high school. So that’s how I finished high school in Texas. I got married in ’81, and we moved to Michigan in ’94. Lucas was a year old. And at that time, I was already a nurse, I had gone back to school and taken a nursing degree, a bachelors in nursing, and I worked in nursing all my life. And I feel that it has never been an obstacle to have been Hispanic. I have never felt discriminated upon by my employer because of my background. I have always obtained a job with my nursing credentials. Page 1 �RICHARD: When you had first moved to Texas, did you find it difficult to learn English at first, or did you catch on quickly? JIMENEZ: I feel that I caught on rather quickly. I had help, I would bring my homework home, and of course my uncle and aunt would help me with understanding what they wanted me to learn. The Spanish teacher at school would translate the homework for me, and so I went home with some idea of what I needed to do. I in particular remember my English teacher giving me almost special attention with flash cards, and film strips, which I’m sure you don’t know what those are, but they were special films that I could progress at my own pace that would show me words and pronunciations, and would tell me little stories to help me read. I feel that it was maybe special to me, because I was one of the few kids that did not speak English along with the other people. But when my uncle chose which middle school to send me to, he didn’t send me to the neighborhood school where I went, which was predominantly Hispanic, he wanted me to learn English right away, and so he sent me to the school where there were fewer Spanish speaking kids, so I feel that I quickly made friends that spoke English, and who helped me along. In particular, a funny story that I think that sticks in my mind is at the cafeteria. You know the little milk cartons? They showed me how to open the milk carton; because of course I did not know what “push up” meant. The combination where you open it like this (gestures) and you push it up, so they showed me, that’s how you open a milk carton. Well it only took once for me to learn the milk carton, but after that I knew what “push up” was. And so I had very kind people everywhere I’ve been, in the states. With all the different communities and people I have found them to be generous towards me, and they have taught me lots of things. I’ve never felt that they would withhold knowledge or information or acceptance. So I have to say that I don’t feel that I have been discriminated upon during my time here. MOSHER: At what point in Columbia did your family decide to send you to Texas? JIMENEZ: When you’re growing up in a 3rd world country, you don’t have the opportunity to go to school, mostly for financial reasons, because school is not free. Especially your elementary school, and your high school, and college is very expensive. In the states you are guaranteed that you’ll go through high school, and your parents don’t have to pay for your school, they pay from taxes, and yet you’re guaranteed that you’re going to be provided the education that you need, and if you’re smart enough, and dedicated enough, you’ll be able to go to college if your parents have the money, they’ll be able to pay for college for you, or you can get school loans and help from the government for whatever circumstances. My parents felt that I would have better opportunities here, to go to school, and advance further. My uncle and aunt lived here, and they did not have any children, so they asked if they would be allowed to bring me with them, and so they were my guardians, my uncle and aunt, and they lived in Texas. So I feel sometimes that maybe my parents; I used to think that they didn’t love me, or they abandoned me, or whatever, but you pretty quickly grow up from those thoughts when you realize of all the riches and wealth, that we live here in the United States, You know what I mean? There’s no war, there’s jobs, there’s healthcare, there’s the opportunity to work, to go to school, and you can say what you want and go do it. While in a 3rd world country, a developing country, you don’t have those opportunities, you don’t. If your parents have money, and you are smart, and you work hard, you might be able to maintain that level, but it doesn’t come easily for you independently to do it. You sometimes Page 2 �have to know somebody, to give you the favor of having a job. You got the job because you know that person. Or they are your friends. There’s a lot of… It’s who you know that gives you the job. Not because you got it because you saw an offering in the newspaper, and you applied, and they go for the best candidate. It doesn’t happen that way. And to get into school, is tough competition, because there are limited resources. Here, if you didn’t get into a 4 year college, well you can go to a 2 year college, and maybe bring up your grades so that next year you can go to a 4 year college. And you can go to college all your life. Here I am, as old as I am, and I was able to go back to school, and right now I’m in school to get my masters. In south America, if you don’t go to school when you’re young, weather you had the skills, the knowledge, and the money, to pay for school, in your later years, you probably won’t have the opportunity to go back to school. If you don’t have that opportunity when you are young, and take advantage of it, it’s probably gone for you, the opportunity to go back to school. STANISLOVAITIS: You mentioned that you had to pay for school, unlike you do here, before you go to college, so are you aware of how much that was? Or how much it would have been? JIMENEZ: Well it depends, because there are private schools, like kids that go to private schools here in the states, and they are very expensive. And there are also other schools, like the Montessori schools have a different fee, and pretty much it’s what your parents are willing to pay. There are public schools, but there’s a lot of kids in those schools that they probably don’t have the best resources to provide the best education. So if you can go to a catholic school, where the nuns will teach you, you’re probably considered very well educated, by having been given the best opportunity to succeed. MOSHER: What point growing up did your opinion of your parents sending you to America change from resentment to sadness, to like, “oh, thanks for sending me.”? JIMENEZ: When I went back home after high school, I went for a couple of years, and I realized that what I had learned in the states was applicable in south America, but it wasn’t what I wanted, because for a woman in a 3rd world country, when she becomes of marriage age, it is expected of her to marry and have kids. And I didn’t think I was ready. To me, I still had school to go to. Because I wanted to go to college, and I probably couldn’t have gone to college down there. So at the time I realized what they really wanted for me was to have a better lifestyle, more opportunity that other people don’t have. STANISLOVAITIS: Did they ever talk to you about that, or was it just something that you came to realize on your own? JIMENEZ: A little bit of both. We talked about it, especially after you grow up and you realize that your sisters’ lives are not that much better, and that they probably would have been better, or different if they had had the opportunities that we as women have here. That other girls don’t have in a 3rd world country. We can make the decision not just of career, but weather we want to marry or not, weather we want to have children or not. In other countries, you are told what you’re going to be doing. (Laughs) Over here, we don’t, we can do many things, when we want. We can decide even who to marry, we don’t have to wait for our parents to make the match, or for a man to come asking, we go look for one. It is just different culturally, and expectations for women are different. STANISLOVAITIS: How many sisters do you have? Page 3 �JIMENEZ: I have lots of sisters, one of them had 3 kids, and another younger sister than me has 2 children. But they have also travelled abroad, for better opportunities. I have a sister that lives in London, and of course she left Colombia, because of jobs, the economic situation is better for jobs and financially. We don’t have that many resources that everybody can be guaranteed a job. RICHARD: So when you finally decided that you were going to move to Michigan, what played into your decision to move from Texas to a place like Michigan? JIMENEZ: That was marriage. School, for my husband, dictated that we would move to Michigan, for job reasons. At that time I already had my nursing degree, and it was very easy for me to get a job almost through Internet and the mail, through a travelling nurse agency. I came to William Beaumont Hospital in Royal Oak, as a travelling nurse, until we settled in Michigan, and figured out where we wanted to look for a house. When we settled in Milford, Michigan, then it was easier for me to see what hospitals were in the area, and I have worked in the area ever since we moved here. And it’s going to be 19 years, 18 years for sure. So it wasn’t like my decision, it was just like a family situational thing, that it was time to move for job reasons, and so we did. MOSHER: Would Michigan have been your first choice if you had just and option to go anywhere? JIMENEZ: Um, you know up to the time we moved to Michigan we had the luxury, I guess, to travel throughout the United States with being, you know, we’ve been in many states and every states has special situations that I don’t think I would have been unhappy practically anywhere. You know what I mean? I think that I would have found contentment, or satisfaction wherever I lived as long as it was in the United States. You know what I mean? It just doesn’t matter, I mean the highway system makes sense, we speak a common language, you know? We expect certain things so I don’t think I would have preferred living in California or Florida or move back to Texas. Now I do have to admit that it took me a while to accept living in Michigan. Right. Because you have a certain vision of things that you want your life to be and it didn’t seem that at the beginning that it was going the way I wanted, I expected it. Ok? Because we all have expectations. But after a while you realize it’s not bad at all. We have a job, we have a house, we’re healthy. Lucas is going to school. You know and that kind of thing. You kinda settle into the acceptance mode. That this is okay and now the weather doesn’t bother me. It was like yay snow! It was time to get some snow. So it will be gone here, it’s gone actually and the tulips are going to bloom soon so…I like it, I appreciate it now. I appreciate the fall and the summer, the apples and the cherries. All those things I appreciate them more now. But it takes time for me to I guess mature and settle down in the environment that you live. MOSHER: So I guess it’s safe to say that you wouldn’t choose to live in any area other than the United States? JIMENEZ: Oh absolutely, Yeah, cause we’ve lived, I have had the opportunity to live in a third world country and when we were younger we had the opportunity to travel to Europe and live in Europe for nine months and it was not a good experience. There I felt discriminated. MOSHER: Can you describe some of those instances of discrimination? Page 4 �JIMENEZ: Overseas? Yes. Um, we lived in Belgium and they are a French speaking country and we lived in the French speaking area of Belgium and we would go to the bakery and I would want a loaf of bread and of course my French is not very good and I couldn’t make myself understood so I would notice they would serve the customer who had walked in the door behind me first before they would attend to me. So I assumed it was loyalty to the customer, that’s a regular well we had just gotten there. But no it seemed to be a persistent pattern that I had to wait for the girl in the back to come and help me. Not necessarily in English either. While here I feel that, in America if you go to the Japanese store or the Korean store you can walk in and pick whatever you want. You got money and you are going to spend it in my store so yay come in. Exactly? No they are not going to discriminate against you; you’re coming to give the business so I felt somewhat discriminated. MOSHER: Do you feel that that was in part to your Columbian upbringing or your language barriers? JIMENEZ: I think it was in part language barrier and a little bit signaphobia. MOSHER: So they just didn’t like outsiders? JIMENEZ: They just didn’t like outsiders because I think they felt that there were quite an influx of foreign students into the community that we were living in. STANISLOVAITIS: Do you in general people there were maybe more hostile or maybe not as accepting as people in America? JIMENEZ: Yes, Yes I feel that they were not accepting and I feel that they were annoyed that we were butchering their French roots and not speaking properly. MOSHER: This is kinda funny because earlier in class we watched a video called “Black Boy” and it’s about Richard Wright, the author and in that video he was talking about how he moved to France and actually really liked it because he didn’t feel discriminated against there. So it was kinda funny hearing you saying that you felt discriminated there and he saying he actually enjoying it more. JIMENEZ: I don’t know people have different experiences and different perceptions. I know personally that I wouldn’t want to live in Europe. For sure, I don’t want to live in Europe. I like my car, I like my mobility, I’m comfortable anywhere but, so I don’t know. We all have different perceptions so I would not move overseas. I don’t even want to travel overseas. I’ve been there so I don’t want to go. I mean I don’t want to discourage you from going. I mean Paris is beautiful, London is beautiful and it’s definitely an experience to behold, to be involved in it but I wouldn’t want to go. Brush that old city in Belgium is beautiful and I appreciate their history but I don’t want to live there. STANISLOVAITIS: Did you say that you valued having the experience knowing that that wasn’t what you wanted and did it make you appreciate being an American even more? JIMENEZ: Absolutely, absolutely because I can see what influences have made America what it is now. So yes, I appreciate it very much. I like it here. I love it here. I don’t want to go anywhere. So but no you as young people I encourage you to travel and see the world and experience it and formulate your own Page 5 �opinion; don’t let anybody discourage you from going to Mexico. Mexico is beautiful. Columbia is beautiful. They have their things to offer, experiences to offer. STANISLOVAITIS: I feel like in America we are a little bit spoiled and we think that everyone has what we have, but they don’t. JIMENEZ: Yeah, they don’t have it and sometimes I feel that young people are like ingrates. They are not thankful for the things that they have and they don’t appreciate it. So yeah do go, go and see how the rest of the world lives and you’ll soon realize that you are very unique in your own self. Just because you are in America because it makes you who you are and you are very unique and they’re the ones that are “weird”. I didn’t say that. No but do travel if you get the opportunity to go on an exchange program or go for the summer somewhere. Do go, absolutely. Don’t be afraid of it. RICHARD: Earlier you had mentioned that you were a nurse; do you think you can tell us a little bit about your nursing career and how you got into nursing? JIMENEZ: Absolutely, it’s a great question. The thought of nursing was put into me by a teacher I met in High School. She taught a class called Health Education and because I was a foreign student, Health Occupations Education it was the class, and because I was a foreign student I was not able to work and have a job and get paid cause I did not have a Social Security number. A little card with social security number, I had a student visa. So my job was to be her assistant. She gave me the job to be her assistant and I could take both classes, the first period and the second period and for work I would be her assistant. Because the kids were able to work in doctors’ offices, dentals, at the hospital, clinic that kind of thing but I couldn’t cause I didn’t have the proper documentation I guess for work permit. So she guided me and told me that I should consider being a nurse and influenced me a lot in making that my career so I always knew that that’s what I wanted to do or that’s what I should do. And to tell you the truth I never imagined myself not being a nurse either, from her influences, and so that’s what I’m did. I was not able to go to school right away after finishing high school but once I was able to return to the United States I started taking classes at the community college, one class at a time, two classes at a time because I had to work and pay for school at the same time. My parents did not have the financial resources to say yeah go to Grand Valley, live in the dorm and we’ll pay your tuition. It wasn’t that way, I had to pay for myself. And so I could only work a little bit and take a class here and there. Once I got married it afforded me a little bit of financial freedom because of my husband’s job and income and I was able then to pay for school and go full time and so I got my bachelors in science and nursing and I worked as a critical care nurse for eighteen years. And I am now going back to school to get my masters and I hope to get my nurse practitioner’s degree with an education certificate by 2014, so I hope to be done soon. As in soon, in two years’ time goes by fast. So I hope that I’ll be able to accomplish that. But yeah, I was influenced by a lady that I call mother, I call her mother. Her name was Evelyn and she influenced me to go stay in a health career path. So I’ve been a nurse all this time. Never a day unemployed for sure. I always had a job. MOSHER: Before you met her what were your ideas of what to do in life? Page 6 �JIMENEZ: What to do? I probably didn’t have any ideas. Just winging it. Yeah, I was probably was just winging it. You go to school and you study and what not but I had taken a Child Development class and through that class we had to have practicum hours and I went to an elementary school, a kindergarten and pre-kinder and I was the teacher assistant with the kids and that seemed like fun so I thought maybe I want to be a teacher but because this health occupations Education was also an elective class that you could sign up for during High School. I did that and in that would discuss what a dentist does, what a doctor does, nurses, pathology, lab tech and all the different careers in the health care and so I knew that one of those would be fine for me. That I would like it, I enjoyed the Anatomy Physiology component of the class. Talking about diseases and stuff like that so I think I would’ve chosen something in medicine but nursing seemed acceptable. So that’s what I’ve done all this time. MOSHER: Earlier off the record we talked about some people not understanding your accent over the phone… JIMENEZ: Mhm, I have to do some phone interviews for the patients are coming for procedures and stuff and give them instructions prior to their procedures and at times I have to speak to people and it hasn’t been often and occasionally I’ll bump into someone who is less patient and maybe my accent comes a lot stronger or louder over the phone and they say I have a hard time understanding you. I think it’s your accent or something and I say well I’ll have someone else call you, no problem there. It’s kinda like did you not understand me or were you just not willing to talk to me? But what can you do? STANISLOVAITIS: I know if you would’ve you decided you still wanted to live in Columbia and still wanted to do in nursing do you feel that since you would’ve not really had that opportunity to get the education that the quality of care that you would’ve given would be lower? JIMENEZ: Since I was in South America when I was little I did not even consider even studying nursing. But I did do, I took a certificate as a bilingual secretary and I started working as a bilingual secretary because I had learned English in high school so that gave me a leg up instead into perhaps a business degree or a business career in secretarial at work or maybe a hotel, tourism or something I probably would’ve done that because of my bilingual ability. So I wouldn’t have considered nursing but if I had considered nursing the quality would be according to their resources. And I know that many people in South America they do have access to medication but they are not free. Is that like when you go to the public health department? Have you ever been to the public health department? In South America you have to pay for your…for everything, when you come to the hospital here women give you a bucket with tooth brush tooth paste soap a towel…right, a bucket to puck in if you need to…right. When you go to the hospital in South America you better bring those things with you or have someone bring them for you including the sheets. And if preferably bring someone to stay with you to help you with your stay in the hospital because there are few health care people who are skilled to take care of patents there’s fewer medications right. And there is fewer resources. So it’s not as available as it is here. So I don’t think that if I had stayed in South America in Columbia that I would be a nurse right now. More than likely not. And probably…I would have had more than one child. (Laughs) I would probably have twenty of them. (Laughs) I don’t know what the deal is but it would have been my choice definitely it be only Page 7 �what I wanted. You know what I mean? My life would have been a little bit different. In a more male dominated environment. STANISLOVAITIS: You mentioned that your sisters, they still live in Columbia so like do you feel like they because of all of the opportunities that you have gotten in America. Do you feel like they have any desire to have the same opportunities? JIMENEZ: Mhmm well yeah I am sure they have. I mean they’re not lacking. I mean they have a nice house, a nice home they have families and everything. But like what I was telling you we all settle in to what our fortune is and you accept it. You know what I mean? So I think they have been content, you know my oldest sister you know she has her husband, her kids, they’re in their thirties their grown. You know, she’s a grandma. You know I am sure she loves her grand children and stuff. You just kind of settle in to you lifestyle, and make the best of it. You know? And make the best opportunity that you have, she had a good job and her husband had a good job and it provided for their families. You know? They took advantage of the opportunity that was offered to them at the time, but I don’t think that they had the same choices I had. *Pause* JIMENEZ: So I encourage you to travel overseas or even in the United States. I encourage you to stay in school and if your parents are paying for it take all that you can. (Laughs) And take advantage of it because once you start paying for it yourself it is hard, it is hard to part with that money that you are paying for by yourself. And it is difficult to work and go to school at the same time, it’s hard I mean I am sure you have friends who work and go to school at the same time or who would like to be at Grand Valley but they have to go to the community college because they can’t afford it or didn’t get student loans. Or if they got the student loans [they are] already in debt to pay for the student loans. You know what I mean? If you have a scholarship definitely take advantage of it. Stay in School. You know prepare yourself because knowledge is something that nobody and take away from you. I mean that goes where you where ever you go, it will follow you. You know? And you never know when you are going to us it; you never know when it will become valuable for you. So…the opportunity presented itself for me to go back to school right now so I want to go I want to do it so I always wanted to get my masters. I am working on my masters right now. Very busy. The house isn’t clean, the kitchen isn’t washed the dishes aren’t washed, but Lucas is not home so it can stay that way. You know so I like it though I’m happy…I’m happy to be going to school now. It will be over April 15th so…just keep my calendar of how many more days. I know you do too right? (Laughs) You know, so stay in school and travel if you can now that your young, and you can see the world. RICHARD: Could you tell us a bit about because you said you graduated high school and you went back to Columbia JIMENEZ: I went back to Columbia for two…two years maybe RICHARD: Could you tell us what it was like when you finally came back to the United States? Page 8 �JIMENEZ: Oh, it was wonderful. When I came back to the United States I lived with my brother who was also living in Texas and after a couple of months I didn’t like living in his house because I needed to go to school and what not so I called the teacher I told you about and told her I needed a place to stay and she allowed me in her house. She was single, no children elderly obviously she was my high school teacher. And so I lived in the house with her. And so while I worked and continued to go to the community college I lived with her for a couple of years. And than shortly after that I got married. And I have been married ever since. And that changed you know my life quite differently it became a different dynamic. Where I still can go to school full time but I was able to go to school part time and work and start you know the next step. You get married have children except the child didn’t come until thirteen years later you know. (Laughs) It just happened that way but it was my choice it was a decision for me to make you know what I mean it wasn’t my parent’s decision to make. So… STANISLOVAITIS: I sound like you have always sort of valued being independent and to have. JIMENEZ: Ahh your very smart, you are so smart. Yes and that is something that this this is funny. You’re going to make me laugh because yes a thing a child would experience. I was raised. most Hispanics are catholic. And for my elementary school I did go to a Catholic school. I was raised by the Catholic Church in school. But when it came to Sundays my grandfather would take me to a Presbyterian church. Which is a protestant faith. So during the weekend…during the week I was catholic but on the weekend I was protestant. Right because I was going to the catholic school it came the time where the girls had to do their first communion. Who any kind of Catholics? Are you Catholic? No, Okay but you know what a first communion is they have the ceremony and it’s like an induction in to somewhat older girlhood or adulthood almost. So I did my first communion and I did that without my parents consent. Because as far as I was concerned they could go to hell but I not. So I did my first communion and how my parents found out I found me a dress, the Vail, the shoes and somebody to take me up there to do my first communion, because that is what we were learning in school. It is time to do your first communion and this is why it is important to do it and dedicate your life you know say that you know are catholic. Now profess your faith. Yeah I think I am I’m not going to hell. So I did my first communion and how my parents found out was because the photographer brought pictures to the house to see if they wanted to buy the pictures of the beautiful girl doing her first communion. So yes I have been very independent so that’s an example right there. The other example I can give you about independence I can give you about independence is my…piercing of your ears. You know some Hispanic countries they do believe for children to have their ears pierced if they are girls the day they are born. You know? Mom already has earrings in the girls ears, my mom didn’t do that to me she wanted me to wait until you know I was fourteen or fifteen to get my ears pierced. No I didn’t wait I was probably seven or so my friend was getting her ears pierced by her grandmother and I went and had my ears pierced without my mothers consent. So yes you are very…very observant. Very smart. But yes I have been very independent sometimes gets me in trouble too. So yes I have been very independent in doing my own thing and that’s something you don’t…a luxury almost that most girls don’t have in third world countries to choose you know, what classes they are going to take next semester. You know someone is always telling you what to do whether it is your parents or your husband or somebody else. Yeah Page 9 �MOSHER: What were your parent’s reactions to you going off and doing those things with out their consent? JIMENEZ: Well (Laughs) my mom bought the pictures so whatcha’ going to do you know. (Laughs) I have a couple of them. She could not afford all of them but she did buy a couple of pictures and the other pictures I remember the man being upset when my mom told him that she couldn’t buy all the pictures and he tossed them in the street. You know she only bought two of them you know what I mean. I have…I have…I have those pictures. And for my earrings I had to hear the lecture I told you so, I told you so, I told you so, because they got infected. And so I had to do that, washing with soup and water and put alcohol in that little thread in there so that … MOSHER: to floss the little thing JIMENEZ: Yeah yeah to keep the hole open. Yeah you know if I hadn’t done that it would have just sealed back up but of course it got infected because I am sure the old lady that poked my ear probably didn’t disinfect the needle. It’s probably old and dirty. You know she did my friends ears and than she did my ears. So it’s like oh my gosh. So totally not clean technique, she probably didn’t even wash her hands you know. But my mom was very prompt to remind me “I told you so”. But what not they healed I got earrings (Laughs) So but anyway besides being annoyed and upset I think that she was also supportive you know you can only control your children so much that’s the other thing as a parent I have learned now. I can only offer my children the opportunity and than they have to make their own decisions as to what they are going to do with their lives. So that’s it. MOSHER: On a different not I know you met your husband Mark in high school, how did you do the two years when you were in Columbia after high school? JIMENEZ: Oh very good question. …letters. Mark would send me letters. Well Mark didn’t right me…I don’t know maybe six months almost a year until he sent me the first letter in high school. And I think it was because he bumped in to my cousin or something so he …got my address from one of them or I don’t remember what happened but I started getting letters in the mail and because the mail was so slow many times I would get two, three letters at a time. And I would try to send him a letter back. And I have a stack of letters and so I started telling him to please number the letters that way I would know that there was another letter coming. Because sometimes I think he spent his time in class writing the letter to me rather than studying. Because many times it would be written in the notebook and on notebook paper and than I feel that he would just finish fold it up put in an envelope and put it in the mail. If he was not finished with the letter he would continue on another page, and so he would send that one the next day and the mail…one would not catch up with the other and they would arrive out of order. So he started numbering the letters. And you know I would try to keep them in order. So I have a little stack of letters that Mark sent from the states, cards and that kind of thing. And the calling of the phone was expensive. We didn’t have Skype there was no email no instant messaging. You know none of those things that we take for granted now. I mean right now I could get on the internet with Skype connection and call my sister you know and see her you know it’s kinda cool. We didn’t have that and you know the phone it was expensive. And he had to tell me in a letter “ I’m going to try to call you on this day at this time” and than I would have to wait and think, “Is he going to call is he not going to call” Page 10 �you know I can’t leave. You know what I mean it was just a lot of hassle a lot of difficulty but…but that’s how it was done. No instant messaging, no texting, no emails, no phone messages either. No answering machines, did we have answering machines? I don’t think so. None of the convince. STANISLOVAITIS: That must have been really hard. JIMENEZ: It’s really hard. I know it’s really hard. It’s even hard now when he says “oh I can’t talk to you I have phone fatigue”. It’s like really? Phone fatigue. But anyway yeah it’s it’s really hard. It was really hard, it’s almost like a joke you know “no text messaging” (Laughs) I still don’t have text messaging but I know it’s available. You know what I mean. I mean if I don’t have it it’s because I’m delayed in moving in to the 21st technological advances. 21st century technological advances but not because I don’t want them you know I haven’t found a need for it. But you know it’s there. STANISLOVAITIS: Can you blame anyone that doesn’t want to be connected to everything all of the time? JIMENEZ: I know exactly. I do panic if I can’t find my cell phone. So yes I am one of those that has developed I think they came out on the Internet with a new phobia of being separated from your computer or I don’t know what they call it…eh phobia. So yeah I don need my cell phone. JIMENEZ: I think they came out with a new phobia of being separated from your computer or your…I don’t know what they call it. So yeah, I do need my cell phone. I’m always in the wrong place of town. I’m always like, I’m lost look at the internet, how do I get outta here, you know, and I’m on my way home or had a flat tire {and} ran out of gas, whatever I’m gonna be late, so I do need a cell phone. MOSHER: Earlier you talked about how you think young people they’re ungrateful for what they have. Do you think that’s in part due to the satisfaction of things like text messaging and Skype? JIMENEZ: I just think that, and I think we all, have a little bit of {a} lack of gratitude at one time or another, because it wasn’t until much later that I understood, and felt very grateful, that my parents sent me here. As hard as it was to be away from my parents during my early adolescent years and early adulthood, you know when I wish to be maybe mothered more than what my aunt was willing to do for me- because she wasn’t my mother, she was my aunt, after all. So I felt a little bit ingrateful {sic} not grateful enough, I feel. But later on I understood it was because she really wanted me to have better opportunities, and so I appreciated that highly. And I think with kids now all they have to do is tell the Easter Bunny what they want to bring ‘em and they kinda get it, ya know what I mean? I want a new swimsuit I want a new car, ya know, some kids get it, they just get it. Their parents are there. And so they don’t see that even though their parents go to work everyday, have to punch a card everyday, make sure that they don’t go on vacations, that they follow their finances and expenditures and purchases and stuff like that it still affects them. I think if their parents had a choice they’d wanna stay home, they don’t wanna go to work, ya know, unless they really love their job so much ya know, but at one time or another everybody has had to make even the sacrifice of getting up early in the morning to get in the car to drive to work. You may not always feel…you may like your work, but you may not always feel like you’re ready to go. You wanna sleep late on Monday morning sometimes, ya know? Page 11 �So you take for granted that at one time or another your parents have had to make do to provide for their children. Even if it is a different extra expenditure of the cell phone, the instant messaging, ya know the calls, the extra hours of points so you don’t go over your minutes or whatnot, you know what I mean? New clothes. And you wanna give your kids, too, ya know? So I think that kids just have it easy now. I mean there’s no more child labor, ya know what I mean? And you’re not gonna go hungry, most parents would provide for their kids, unless there are other circumstances, ya know, I’m not saying that all parents have the ability to provide for their children, ya know there is other issues whether it is drug dependency, or mental illness or unemployment like what’s going on right now, but I think for the most part parents, at one time or another, have always made a little compromise for their children. Ya know, diapers are expensive, especially when you’re just starting out and you’re working for a little bit more than minimum wage and you have a baby. And all of a sudden it’s like, it’s not that you don’t want the baby, but another side of you that money’s gonna be not for your haircut or your nails, it’s gonna go for diapers or a bigger Onesie ‘cause he’s growing too fast, ya know, so…and I don’t know that kids understand that, but I think you all will. At one time or another you’ll be parents yourselves and you will understand that a little bit better. MOSHER: Earlier we were talking about how you hadn’t seen much discrimination in America; do you think that’s true for almost everyone or do you think America’s just a really friendly place? JIMENEZ: I don’t know, I don’t wanna say that there isn’t discrimination, I just, from my personal experience, I have to say I have not ever felt it being directed ya know? But I mean I know that, , some African American individuals feel that they have been discriminated. Ya know I have never felt that, ya know. Some of ‘em may say that they need to be ‘paid back’ for slavery after all this time, I never can say that I’ve been a slave so I don’t know their experiences so I don’t have a shared experience with that, but I was like you, learned in school. I don’t deny it- yes, there was slavery- ya know, but I don’t know how to put it. I’m sure there’s discrimination. I can’t say that I have experienced it. STANISLOVAITIS: Well it seems like there’s a really big perception among other countries that Americans are spoiled and entitled, and like you said earlier, kids especially are not grateful for what they have because we have so many opportunities. Since you have been back to Columbia a few times, were you old enough, did you feel that way when you came back to America, did it make you look at Americans differently? JIMENEZ: No, because it’s just the environment that we live in; you just don’t know any better, you just don’t know any different. Until you experience that yourself you’re not gonna realize that it’s any different, right? I think that’s how I see it. But yeah, I could say that most kids are spoiled, but that’s what we want, as parents, we want ‘em to have what we didn’t have, you know what I mean? Like, I never had a beautiful bicycle when I grew up; I learned to ride a bicycle when I was fifteen. So needless to say I’m not very agile in turning wheelies and all this stuff, right, but when Lucas became of age, five or six, to have a bicycle, I got him the most beautiful bicycle I could find, because it was the bicycle I would’ve loved to have had as a kid. And granted it wasn’t purple and it didn’t have little flutteries, but it was a very beautiful red bicycle, right, Lucas? Page 12 �And I think as parents you will learn that it doesn’t matter, you’re gonna try to give your kids the very best you can. So I think that’s just being a parents ‘flaw’ or fault; we wanna give the kids the best. We don’t want them to have an trouble like our parents had or like I had, even though I don’t feel like I’ve had any trouble. We always wanna make it best for them, which may not be the best parenting thing to have done. We still wanna teach them to work hard, to study hard, to achieve, to progress, to motivate. But we don’t accomplish that test by providing things for them. MOSHER: The distaste…from other countries about America, do you think that stems from jealousy, or do they have other motives for disliking us as a country? JIMENEZ: I feel in part it’s jealousy, but also in part it’s their cultural influences, their own cultural influences. Because many people have had a background of being raised in a socialist mentality, that your computer is my computer, too, right? While, in America, it’s like, no, I have my computer, you have your computer, and you have your computer. And you get the computer you can afford, I get the computer I can afford, and you get the computer you can afford, but we all have computers, right? Over there I feel like it comes from the mentality that we’re gonna have to share and I don’t care how much money you have, you’re gonna pay more taxes and that kinda stuff. So it’s partly their social upbringing, their political influences, and their cultural as well. While here in America I feel that if I get two jobs, I might be able to get an Apple {computer} like that. It may take me a little bit longer saving it, but nobody’s gonna tell me I can’t have it. If I want it you betcha I’m gonna work for it and I’m gonna get it, even it means I’m not gonna go to McDonald’s’ for the next two months. Nobody’s telling me I cannot have it; nobody’s regulating whether I can go to the Apple store, or Walmart or Kmart or Meijer’s to get it, ya know what I mean? While over there they may only have one computer for sale; they may not have computers for everybody anyway, whether you have the money or not. Does that make sense? Does that make sense or am I just rambling? MOSHER: Do you think there’s anywhere else in the world that functions on that same ‘if you want it you can have it’ kinda thing, or is America the only place to get that? JIMENEZ: I think, another place might be, I’m assuming, I don’t know for a fact, but I think maybe England might work under those premises. That if you have the money, and you want it, and you have a job, you can get it. While in Mexico, for example, they may not be able to find that second job to buy what they want because their first job isn’t providing for them. Even if they wanted to get a second job, there isn’t one. Even here, with the extent of unemployment, and I don’t know if your parents are employed or unemployed with the economical circumstances we have now, we can still go mow the yards, there are still signs that say ‘help wanted.’ OK, maybe not with the skills that you went to school for or whatever, but you can find a job. I don’t know, I don’t think there’s another place in the world like the United States, I don’t think so. STANISLOVAITIS: You mentioned that you have done a lot of traveling…do you feel like that has given you a bigger appreciation for not only for where you came from and where you are, but from a global view? Page 13 �JIMENEZ: Yeah, because I learned to appreciate other people’s cultures. For example, in my house I like to celebrate the Chinese New Year in January, so we have Chinese food. I love Chinese food, I wouldn’t wanna be without it. I wanna know that it’s available and I like it. I like to go to the Vietnamese kitchen; I like to go to the Italian restaurants, so defiantly I can appreciate the foods. My Pączki’s didn’t go unnoticed from the Polish community, I knew that they were available for when I wanted to get it, so I can appreciate that. I can appreciate the music, and I can appreciate the contributions that they have done not just to the United States, but culturally, and through literature and all that stuff. So yes, it broadens your prospective, and I appreciate that. But I don’t wanna live there; I’m happy right here. I wanna know that I can go just about any city in the United States and find a Chinese restaurant, an Italian restaurant, Greek, ya know. Whatever, I just want it here, I wanna go. STANISLOVAITIS: I think it’s kinda interested you mentioned restaurants and food and general things like that. When people think of things that they don’t have they don’t think of things like that. ‘Cause we’re always taught big things like education, and being independent and being able to provide for yourself. I feel like we don’t realize if we didn’t have those opportunities we wouldn’t have any of that. JIMENEZ: Absolutely. The little things do matter. And pretty soon you’ll realize it’s not the big picture, but it’s things that you do everyday that matter the most. MOSHER: So I guess to wrap things up here it’s safe to say that you think America’s a pretty diverse place? {Inaudible} JIMENEZ: Absolutely. I feel that it’s very diverse, and I feel that people are realizing that they need to fight for the opportunities and to keep it, for the opportunity to continue to be on their level. For the mentality that hard work would provide things for you, not wait for somebody to give them to you, OK. Don’t expect the government to provide for you health care, safety or security, or anything like that. You need to be able to provide those things for yourself, and in return provide it for your family, your community, and your. {Inaudible}. Whether it is the freedom of choice, the freedom of religion, the freedom to go to school and study whatever you want. And to shop for the things you want to shop for, and work as many jobs as you want to. MOSHER: Well, thank you for coming in Group: Thank you END OF INTERVIEW Page 14 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/a2588214a018331d7231e2e49e2ef579.mp3 a35c6475300f6ff561200cdd0bcca1a1 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral Histories Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Personal narratives Oral histories African Americans--Personal narratives Gays--Personal narratives Lesbians--Personal narratives Bisexual people--Personal narratives Transgender people--Personal narratives Veterans--Personal narratives Women--Personal narratives People with disabilities--Personal narratives Muslims--United States--Personal narratives Hispanic Americans--Personal narratives Homophobia Discrimination Islamophobia Stereotypes (Social psychology)--Upper Penninsula (Mich.) Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history recordings documenting the history of civil rights and social justice advocacy in Western Michigan. The collection was created by faculty and students as a project of the LIB 201 (formerly US 201): "Diversity in the U.S." course from 2011-2012. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. Brooks College of Interdisciplinary Studies Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project (GV248-01) Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-05-02 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1930-2011 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01_Jimenez_Fabiola Title A name given to the resource Fabiola Jimenez audio interview and transcript Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jimenez, Fabiola Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Mosher, Lucas Overhuel, Kelsie Richard, Kyle Karly Stanislovaitis Description An account of the resource Fabiola Jimenez, a Colombian woman who has been living in East Michigan since 1994. She discusses how she feels as though she was never discriminated against because of her race. Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Women--Personal narratives Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Relation A related resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-02-14 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/a439aced87ed7185d2660dff223507f2.pdf 9675f36ea32682280c9efbd63811f95e PDF Text Text Speaking Out Western Michigan’s Civil Rights Histories Interviewee: Jose Jimenez Interviewers: Timothy Robertson, Ashlie Hood and Angelica Perez Supervising Faculty: Melanie Shell-Weiss Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 2/24/2012 Biography and Description Jose Jimenez was born in Caguas, Puerto Rico and lived in Chicago. He discusses his experiences as the leader of the Young Lords and an activist for Latin Americans. Transcript JIMENEZ: So the name of the class is what? HOOD: US diversity, diversity in the US JIMENEZ: Oh diversity, ok ROBERTSON: So we will essentially be conducting an oral history which I’m sure you have way more with experience than we do JIMENEZ: No I don’t have any experience this is my first time that I’m doing the history, the oral history ROBERTSON: Oh nice, right on JIMENEZ: Yeah I don’t have any experience ROBERTSON: Then it will be a new experience for the both of us; essentially we will be running through basic history about you JIMENEZ: Ok ROBERTSON: Integrating a few points of what kind of built you personally and then like your opinion of home JIMENEZ: Ok where do you want to start, what’s your name again? HOOD: Ashlie JIMENEZ: Ashlie? Ok I’m José, ok ROBERTSON: To start actually if we can get some basic information about you Page 1 �JIMENEZ: You do have a lot of questions? Or is that ROBERTSON: Well these are… JIMENEZ: Background stuff ROBERTSON: Yeah, they JIMENEZ: Ok ROBERTSON: Just some basic questions JIMENEZ: (laughing) ROBERTSON: We kind of developed our own from this so JIMENEZ: Ok so you want some basic personal questions first or ROBERTSON: Yup. Yeah the first, if you could introduce yourself JIMENEZ: Ok, I’m José Jimenez, the nickname I’ve had for most of my life is cha cha, C-H-A C-H-A (spelling out cha cha) and I got that, it was more like a people in the neighborhoods usually get nicknames in a negative way so they were kind of little racial in nature because this guy used to call another black person sambo and he called me a cha cha cha, and so as more, I was just a little kid, but as more Latinos came into the neighborhood. I, I kind of liked the name cha cha so I just kept it, some people get called frog face or whatever, (Ha-ha) I just kind of liked the name cha cha ROBERTSON: If you could tell us date of birth and location JIMENEZ: Ok, I was born in Caguas, Puerto Rico. My family is from the country but of course I was born in the city, in the town because my older sister had died and my mother was worried because there was no medical treatment in the country so she moved to the town of Caguas but us when I went back to Puerto Rico when I was fifteen years old, all I knew was the country. I came straight from Chicago back to the country there. It was actually a good experience because I spent a lot of time with my grandfather, Egragrorio Jimenez, and I mean I had to use the two bulls to turn ground and… ROBERTSON: Oh wow JIMENEZ: And coming from Chicago there was real whole awakening for me. The whole country, the whole culture, the music of the people that they had there so I was able to catch a lot to really appreciate the country life of Puerto Rico there ROBERTSON: Kind of to bounce off that, what kind of ancestry did you have? JIMENEZ: I had, well my great grandfather and my great grandfather, they’re all Puerto Rican so. On my mother’s side there’s a lady that comes directly from Spain but basically we’ve been Puerto Ricans for generations. We came when I was two years old, my father did not own his own property, he did not own his own farm so he worked on other peoples farms. At the time they called them agregaros, so Page 2 �aggregated or connected because they were able to get some space for their house in somebody else’s land and that’s how you make a living, you work for the farmer and so there was a large farmer named Jimenez which is my last name and he worked for him, a lot of people worked for him at that time. Later on my grandfather was able to purchase a lot a large a lot where his sons and daughters were able to work because there were about 13 or 14 of them, brothers and sisters so siblings. So they were able each of them to have their own section, and so things improved later, after this large land owner Jimenez left the area. Ah, well that was just the way of life. People were not angry with him, it wasn’t like slavery or anything like that it’s just that he had money and he was able to provide for other people at that time, it was his business. from my father, because he worked at the farm it was easy for him to, when the united states was having trouble with Mexican workers because of their documentation and their papers and that Puerto Ricans were citizens of the united states so the united states, the US companies went to Puerto Rico to bring Puerto Ricans here to work in the fields, so my father came and he worked by concord Massachusetts when there was still farm land at that time and he did that since 1945-46 and then he moved up and they let him drive a tractor because he spoke a little English and so he went back and brought other people to, to near Boston to the Andy voy farms. Andy voy farms were connected, they were the farms providing vegetables to Campbell’s Soup Company because I tried to do some research on them and that’s what I found out. But so he was bringing in people so, but the conditions were not that well because they would come and they would have to work from early in the morning to late at night and they had nothing else to do to socialize, I mean a lot of them started drinking alcohol became their way to relax on the weekends because on the weekdays they had no time to relax and they and they didn’t know anybody. ROBERTSON: It certainly becomes a social conflict JIMENEZ: Yeah yeah, so he did that for a few years and then he brought my mother and myself to concord and then my sister Juana was born there and from me moved, after he brought us here. I guess even though we had our own little cottage life, I guess he didn’t like that environment for us, for the family environment. It was mostly just men working there. Although my mother, she started making money ironing clothes, and she was making more money that he was. Because she was ironing clothes for the men and the place ROBERTSON: Mmhmmmm JIMENEZ: But there were more family in Chicago so his sisters and brothers were I Chicago so he decided to move to Chicago in 1950 and that’s when we lived in a, what they called a new barrio, a neighborhood a new community because it was developing in Chicago at that time. So everybody kind of knew each other, I would say there was maybe ten thousand Puerto Ricans at that time in the city and they were kind of spread out like Clark, around Chicago avenue, Clark was a neighborhood developing, it was a Puerto Rican neighborhood, it actually was it actually was a skit row area because there was a lot of hotels that they were converting into apartments and rooms and stuff like that it was a little rent. They were ready to tear down the buildings and so there was low rent and that was where Puerto Ricans can go. I mean most of them were migrant workers anyways so they were just coming Page 3 �there to work for a few years and to go back, the same as my father was doing in concord Massachusetts ROBERTSON: Right JIMENEZ: But this time it was in a city and factories and they were trying to make enough money to go back but the plane fair was very expensive and then it wasn’t just the plane fair but when you went back to Puerto Rico, you had to put a fassad, like you had money. So you go there and everybody’s expecting you to buy drinks and everybody’s expecting you to wear the best clothing and everybody’s expecting you to act like your upper class because you have money and you’re an Americano, you’ve been to the united states and so those things were hampered with the travel back and forth because people had to put their fassad to pretend that they were something that they weren’t. ROBERTSON: That’s an interesting condition though, I mean to me essentially what you’re saying is that the condition I Puerto Rico was just a lack of employment and that’s what drove you to the states JINENEZ: Exactly that was very you k know when there is employment here at 90% you’re looking at even at right now 30% in Puerto Rico so it’s definitely by triple the amount that it is here so those were bad times there in the early 50’s, late 40’s and people were looking, there was a big migration at that time of Puerto Ricans coming not only to Chicago but to the Midwest and the steel mills and to the hotels they had a, my uncles had a favorite quote that they used to talk, if you asked them what kind of work they were in they would say that they were gravando discos making records. What they meant by that they were spinning records, what they meant by that they were washing dishes (Tim and Ashlie begin to laugh) because there were so many of them that were living in the well they were working in the hotels in Chicago we lived like six blocks away from the downtown so I mean that was and that kind of created a bad problem later because it was prime real estate so the few Puerto Ricans that were able to buy some houses cheap resold them cheap then there was a whole land grabbed in that area of downtown which is where we came in later, we were, cause we kept moving, we didn’t know, I mean we were not connected to the city at all, we were not connected to the politicians or anything like that or we didn’t pay attention, our parents didn’t pay attention to the news or anything like that because they didn’t speak English ROBERTSON: Right JIMENEZ: And we were young we didn’t care about it and we were like disconnected from the city. Like Mexicans are today, a lot of Mexican people immigrants, are today they are kind of in their own world they’re disconnected and that went like that for a while through generation until we started to go to school and making our own little connections and that but, so we kept moving from one place, we lived there for a few years then we got pushed out of there and moved to another place and so you read in some of the books today that Latinos or Puerto Ricans moved a lot but what they didn’t say was that it would be renewed and being pushed out from on, I mean because we didn’t know that they were trying to re develop the whole lake front ROBERTSON: Okay Page 4 �JIMENEZ: So we just kept moving north along the lake front and so we kept on being pushed out ROBERTSON: So that that berry field then pushed you farther away from downtown JIMENEZ: Right and then they were trying to develop the downtown and the lake front so we were always near downtown I mean because of our jobs because we were with the dishwashers, the women with the hotel, with the maids, with the rich people, they cleaned people’s houses and companies were recruiting women from Puerto Rico to do that and they I can’t think of the name right now of one of the companies but they actually they companies and it was cheap labor they were looking for that and you’re dealing with citizens, you’re not dealing with someone that is not a citizen. Puerto Ricans were born citizens. In 1966 we were getting were for our first world war, and so we were made citizens of the united states, there was no vote or anything like that, they just said you we’re giving you this right to be a citizen and the next day you got to go to war ROBERTSON: Of course JIMENEZ: But it’s true, why would you become a citizen in 1917, what was going on was the war you k now ROBERTSON: Right JIMENEZ: So anyway we were citizens and it gave us some benefits it’s not, so yeah there were some benefits that came with that those benefits made us more independent but you’re talking about food stamp benefits, that we didn’t have before so those benefits were good. We have a lot of companies in Puerto Rico but the owners are over here I mean if you own a business and you’re over here, you’re the one that’s making the main money I mean you’re giving jobs to some people, but you’re the one that’s making the profit so it was like that but, I’m saying that because the whole fight that happened with the young lords later was about self-determination of like Puerto Rico. We believed that Puerto Rico should determine their own destiny and it nothing against the United States believes the same thing I mean they fought their war against England so I mean we believed the same thing. We don’t disrespect the American flag we can’t because we want to respect our flag; we want to fly our own. Right now you have to fly both flags, there was a time in the 30’s when Puerto Ricans were made, they were forced to speak only English in school, that’s crazy. Somebody’s not going to go to Germany and tell everybody ok, you got to speak English now (laughing). ROBERTSON: Right JIMENEZ: What I am saying, no more German allowed that’s what they did to Puerto Rico not everybody but the people in charge. We definitely don’t blame the American people, just the people in charge and I grew up over here so but anyways I got off on in a tangent here ROBERTSON: It’s all right JIMENEZ: So we came to Puerto Rico to la Clark, was the neighborhood we called it and then there was another community called la Madison which was right around down town on the other side, on the western part of it but they actually were together except there was an express way that divides or the Page 5 �Kennedy, that divides up the two neighborhoods so basically we lived downtown and we lived near the lake front, basically we lived in that community. But there was two barrios, there was two neighborhoods that were being built at that time, one was la Clark and one was la Madison. Now people from both la Clark and la Madison moved into Lincoln Park or Wicker Park. And that is where my generation grew up, in either wicker park or Lincoln park and so that’s all knew of Puerto Rico again I can’t remember I was only two years old and most of us came when we were young so we didn’t know anything about Puerto Rico but in our neighborhood here in Chicago and so to us that was our Puerto Rico and all of sudden after were there for like 15, 20 years, here comes the bull dozers again and here comes the urban renewal program and they wanted to evict us again, except this time they’re not evicting our parents, they’re evicting us and we grew up here ROBERTSON: Right JIMENEZ: And so were saying we can’t go for this anymore, we have to do something and that’s kind of how the young lords started. We were just hanging out on the corner I mean we didn’t care about anything, we wanted to listen to music, smoke a little weed, drink a little wine, and have a good time and some of us were soldiers, we went to the service and once in a while we got a little mischief. We would cut the hippies hair (Tim and Ashlie laughing) or jump on the sailors. Some of us probably, I remember going to the dances and there was about eight of us with different stoning cars that we got to just go to the party, if wanted a new car, we couldn’t afford it so we just took it. So we weren’t even taken it to, some people would take it to get the hop cats and sell them or whatever. We would just take it to go to the parties. We weren’t the only ones getting into trouble. I mean we had our fights; we won some we lost some. So I mean that’s all we were about. We weren’t political, our parents were sure not political, they came from the farms from the field of Puerto Rico where there were farm workers. They didn’t have any education, we didn’t have any education, most of us dropped out at eighth grade or ninth grade of high school so we definitely didn’t have no education, our parents had no education. My father was on welfare and my mother worked in a transformer place where she got minimum wage almost and then my father had to say that he didn’t live with us so got welfare, first he got unemployment I guess then he got welfare but he did work for about 13 or 14 years for Oscar Meyer it was a meat factory, he worked in a meat packing factory but then they fired him, they moved the company and so he lost his job and he didn’t want to work again he started hanging out at the bar, became a pool shark and that’s how he made his money I guess but then he sold the numbers, that was another way of making money and the neighborhood was to, now its legal, the lottery is legal but at that time there was no lottery ROBERTSON: Okay JIMENEZ: But in Puerto Rico they did have a lottery that was legal and so they just thought it was okay to sell the numbers but it was not legal because there was no taxes being paid ROBERTSON: Right, right JIMENEZ: But today they didn’t distinguish it too much so I wouldn’t say that my father was a gangster, he did belong to a little club like the old hatchets, it was a name that they chose, but they would get into Page 6 �bar fights, bar brawls but it wasn’t really as gang if you compared to gang stuff its nothing like that. And I think he went to jail twice because I went with my mom to bond him out for fights and he was definitely afraid of jail, he didn’t want to go. Not like me I went a lot of times but he, so he was just more of a family person. In fact Jackie glease, the honeymooners was his favorite show ROBERTSON: Yeah, so you would say that one of the biggest draws for Chicago was your own people there JIMENEZ: The draw, you mean for myself? ROBERTSON: Right, well with you and your family even I mean you were saying that there were more job opportunities JIMENEZ: Right and our families were there we were closer to our family versus being in some farm, in a field farm in the fields and stuff like that but yeah so one of the draws with living in Lincoln park was that there was families growing up together and it became a tight knit neighborhood, just like any other neighborhood ROBERTSON: So would you say it helped maintain a sense of your culture? JIMENEZ: Right and maintain the culture, that’s what I’m saying because it maintained our culture and it made, that was my Puerto Rico, that’s what I knew of Puerto Rico. I loved Puerto Rico today but I never, I didn’t live in it that much what I’m saying. My sisters were all born here and they lived there for several years they loved it there. And I loved it there too but I can’t find any work but their husbands were raised there so they’re kind of used to their economy, their culture and I’m not. I was raised here so I’m used to here more. Even though I love Puerto Rico and defend it I had to me my Puerto Rico was Lincoln Park and that neighborhood and that community and then because we did the bad thing and we did the good things. Think of the new immigrants moving there, like pilgrims ROBERTSON: Mmhmmm JIMENEZ: Because they came in there and actually acted like pilgrims cause they came with a religious fervor from Puerto Rico and when they saw that a lot of the older people, the man would get into gangs and start selling drugs they used religion, they used Catholicism to preach when they saw that the youth could not afford to go a catholic school, my mother had her own catechism in her own house, she had an altar in the house but basically, she would have our living room was about 30 chairs, and the kids would come in there and she would, they would have to memorize the book because she wasn’t a good teacher, she never went to school and she only went to, I don’t think she even went to the 1st grade because she was raised in an orphanage but her mother got ill land so she was raised in an orphanage near san Juan until she was like 15 or 16 then she got connected with my father and they got married but she had catechism classes and they would graduate and she worked it out with the local priest and they would go and do it there. She would have catechism classed and they would have to recite word from word yes ma’am god raised on the third day no mam, yes mama. That’s the way they had to answer that was the way she trained them and she was excited when the priest would come and ask them questions because they would graduating at that time and the families were excited, they would Page 7 �go them like a little suit and fine dresses and that and they would go and receive their first communion and I saw that, I was going to catholic school at that time and it was like one of those where your mother is the minister and you don’t want to be connected to the class, you’re always on the sideline. But I appreciated what my mom was doing and I learned her organizing skills and how she had to talk to the parents and stuff like that. And she did that for, she had a few classes that graduated (Jose’s phone starts ringing) I should have turned this off, sorry ROBERTSON: It’s alright; do you need to take that? JIMENEZ: No, (Jose is trying to turn his phone off) and Tim is trying to help him JIMENEZ: Where were we? ROBERTSON: You were just describing your appreciation with what your mom was doing JIMENEZ: Well I need to also say, because I said we had a little altar, she my mother also, in Puerto Rico there is different customs, so even though 99% are catholic, there’s still old customs from the Indians and from the Africans, so you have their religions also a part of the thing. And my mother had, today she is what you call a charismatic Catholic so that means that they pray to the saints and she’s very into, well the Africans have the santaria, which is what we say is more like voodoo but it’s just a religion from Africa but it’s in the music you here songs like changu, and all that so my mother wasn’t into that, she was more into Indian, she said I’m an Indian. But even though she was catholic she doesn’t say it because she would get criticized even with the community. But I know that she believe, she says I believe in the tongues and the holy spirit, which is catholic but I know for her is was little bit more. But I don’t think she understand the whole religion part of it, she’s just like, you go to any Puerto Rican neighborhood and they have what they call botanicas, so you can go in there and buy candles and different things and that a regular store and they make good money because there’s a lot of people that buy that stuff. So m my mother was just kind of picking from that, she’s like one of those people that would pick a candle. Right, so she did believe and that so I wanted to say it, because it is part of our culture I mean it’s not just a religion, its apart of our culture, it’s a part of the fact that Puerto Ricans are Indian, African and European Spanish, so I have my light features because from the European Spanish. But even within our own family for 500 years we’re mix. So there’s also a saying in Puerto Rico that says y tu abuela donde esta? And your grandmother where is she? Meaning that all our grand mothers were from Africa. I mean that’s what they’re trying to day by this saying. Even though they weren’t all, what they mean is that we’re all mix; we cannot be prejudice against anybody, because we’re, we’re all, we’re all mixed people. So we’re mixed for 500 years, so talking about diversity… ROBERTSON: You were ahead of the game? JIMENEZ: We were ahead of the game a little bit, I think. But the problem also—it says that in the United States we don’t get our history. And, and so we’re, we’re not being taught that, although that’s common knowledge among Puerto Ricans that, that went to school in Puerto Rico. So, the Puerto Ricans that grew up here don’t [pause] don’t have that knowledge. We were, what the Young Lords were doing [pause] was to try to teach people about their history and, that’s one of the things that we, we promoted that we still promote. Page 8 �ROBERTSON: Say, I’m kind of curious moving onto that point… what was it like actually organizing and assembling the Young Lords? JIMENEZ: Well, that’s [pause] it wasn’t easy. I mean it’s still not easy today, I mean, ROBERTSON: Certainly. JIMENEZ: You kind of have to keep one step ahead of yourself, even today. [Pause] I mean, part of the reason I’m in Michigan has to, has to do with some of that, too. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: But [pause] I got in, in, I went to jail, I got from the gang we went, we, there were different stages in the gang. We were first starting out; we’re just kind of just drinking and having a good time… ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And then we started organizing ourselves and then we started trying to get a name for ourselves so we go to [pause] to other neighborhoods, to challenge them right in their own neighborhoods. to, to let ‘em know we can kick their butt in their own neighborhood. At that time it wasn’t like today where you just are shooting, but some of us had, some weapons, but just some of us. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: Well we were going to another neighborhood. I remember going with Orlando one day and, and we went, and we used to have to walk around this one neighborhood because The Corps used to hang around there and The Corps was a [pause] was a grouping of a lot of Italian, Irish, Polish gangs, and they all… ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: They used to be the Saint Michael’s Drum and Bugle Corps but they [pause] they changed into a gang. They, they, they started The Corps themselves became a gang. so we used to have to, to go to… we had a branch in Old Town it was like ten blocks away from our other branch, so me and Orlando, Orlando was the founder of the gang—Orlando Davila—was the founder of the street gang. I was the founder of I was one of the original founders with him. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: But I was the founder of the political group the Young Lords. So I transformed the gang into, into the Young Lords as a political movement. So anyway, we, we walk, one day we’re walking and we would always have to go around the churches. Orlando said, “what, I got my pistol from my father, we’re gonna walk—me and you are gonna walk right through there. And I’m going…[all laugh a bit] And I’m going to let you; you better protect me because I don’t have nothing. ROBERTSON: Right. Page 9 �JIMENEZ: I had like a little knife and that was it, but, we’re talking about like eighty people that we’re going right… ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: Going through eighty people on the playground, so we’re, we’re walking in there [pause] and, I mean, there was like a big pride in us because I knew he had that, that, that weapon. I knew that he had that, and, and at that time there weren’t that many people carrying guns like they do today. ROBERTSON: Yeah. JIMENEZ: And today that wouldn’t work. [Chuckles] ROBERTSON: Yeah, I bet. JIMENEZ: But so usually they would have bats and sticks and stuff like that; throw rocks, whatever—or, cut you up or something like that. So anyway, we’re walking through the middle and I can see these, these, these guys are, you can hear them. “Whoa, look at these Puerto Ricans here, they think they’re bad. Look, they’re walking through our neighborhood,” that kind of stuff; ROBERTSON: Yeah. JIMENEZ: And I’m just glowing, like I know they’re not gonna... No, but they’re kind of afraid; they don’t know what we got. They don’t know what we got, but finally they kind of surround us and that, and they go, “Whoa, you guys are bad,” and, I don’t know what Orlando told them. He just said something, but, all of a sudden, “We should kick your butt,” and that, something like that. Orlando said, “Well, come on!” and that… [Fumbling over words] when they took out the pistol he started shooting, like in the air, and it just emptied out—the whole playground emptied out. [Sounds of shock/amazement] JIMENEZ: But, I mean after that, [pause] after that we would walk through there; it was like, everything was okay. I mean, we, ‘cause we went to school with some of these people, so the next day I got to the school and then after that there was no more, like we couldn’t walk through there. Now, to, to some people they would say that that’s prejudice that we can’t walk through there, ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: But we were looking at it more like from a gang point, point of view; but you can, today you can kind of look at it and say—well, what Puerto Ricans… ‘Cause we had the same problem at the beach; we couldn’t, Puerto Ricans couldn’t go to the beach, so it wasn’t just the youth, it was the adults. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: We couldn’t go to North Avenue Beach in Chicago, and that was in our neighborhood, so we had to go to Fullerton Beach, and, so the beaches were segregated. Chicago was a, was a segregated town at that time. It’s still somewhat segregated—where you have different, Puerto Ricans in one area; Mexicans in another; Page 10 �ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: Italians in another; Irish in another;, Polish in, in another; so, so there in Lincoln Park it was like that, but, and, and blacks. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: So these three blocks would be Polish. These three blocks German; like that, and we couldn’t, like African Americans couldn’t move north of North Avenue. In Chicago, there’s a street called North Avenue; and you would hear that, I mean, I would hear that as a kid going to the barber shop I heard [pause] because I was light-skinned, they didn’t know I was Puerto Rican [laughs], ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: So I’m sitting there getting my hair cut, I’m just a little kid, and I’m hearing these adults talking about, “Mayor Daley, he’s not gonna let no blacks move past North Avenue. We don’t have to worry about that,” So, this was during the time of Urban Renewal, but I didn’t know that. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: So there, so, so Urban Renewal to us was it was like a master plan for that city for—a fifty year master plan to clean up the lakefront and the downtown area. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And we were just caught up in the middle of that—the Lincoln Park neighborhood and Wicker Park later. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: Because now Wicker Park no longer exists as we knew it then. That was also a Puerto Rican community, and it was wiped off the map. and I’m saying, you’re talking about thirty or forty thousand people to sixty thousand people in a neighborhood. ROBERTSON: They just had to up and relocate. JIMENEZ: Right, I mean they were like sixty thousand people, but let’s say a good thirty percent of that were, were Puerto Rican. That’s a good percentage, and we were all centered in the central part of the area. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: The rest were, were the lakefront that was always the same way. They called it the Gold Coast, so there was no urban renewal there. but in our neighborhood it was completely wiped out and just robbed; it was a land grab. I mean, they took they tra… they bought—they did it— legally, it was legal, a legal land grab. so, [fumbles over words] everything was done legally, if you, if you think that out of, out of a city council with fifty elder men and forty-nine of them are democrats, so if that’s legal to you [all laugh] Page 11 �JIMENEZ: Forty-nine out of fifty are voting one way, with Mayor Daley. So, if that’s le… if that’s called laws, making laws, I don’t know where to… [Laughing] I don’t know where it’s democracy; it’s definitely not the Americas. And they call themselves democrats; that’s the other thing, see. Here, it’s, it was strange for me to come to Michigan because everybody’s Republican, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And I’m going like, “I can’t tell the difference.” It’s, [all laugh], we’re still in the same boat. But, [pause] but anyway, I got off track again, I, I don’t know maybe we’ve got another question. ROBERTSON: Let’s see… yeah just I mean that process of organizing… JIMENEZ: Oh, organizing; okay, yeah. Okay, so we were in the gang—we’re gang banging, we’re doing all this stuff—I come out of jail, I’m in jail and I start reading, I got put in the hole, ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: And they said, we go to jail and, and all the Puerto Ricans hang out together, that’s just common. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And so there was some, some gangs there and they said “Those guys are a gang and they, and they want to attack us,” so they’re telling the guards; and then they’re talking about escaping because this one guy, we were joking and he’s, he’s putting his head through the window. So they say, “If you can put your head through the window, you’re gonna put your whole body,” So he’s, but he’s just joking; we’re not talking about escaping. He’s just, playing games. We’re just passing the time away; ROBERTSON: Yeah. JIMENEZ: And so anyway that night they, they took us all downstairs, strip-searched us, and, took us to the hole; and that was a, a, a city jail so, so it was a, the house of correction? ROBERTSON: Mmh. JIMENEZ: So the most you do there is a year, and but, and I was doing sixty days and everybody else was doing like ten days, or something like that. So I had the most time; I had just come in, and now I’m like, they’re saying that I’m trying to escape so they’re putting me in maximum security, which is the hole, which means I don’t get out of my cell but once a week for a shower, and that’s it, and that’s with a guard. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: So, you’ve got a lot of time to read; there’s not, no, nobody else there but you. I mean, it’s an old Civil War, Civil War cell house, so the catwalk, instead of being steel, it was wooden; and they had, they had big cats to get the rats, ‘cause there were rats, and there were roaches. ROBERTSON: Wow. Page 12 �JIMENEZ: I mean can you imagine going to jail [all laugh] and you gotta deal with roaches in jail. [Laughs] Oh, man; but, and then it was real cramped up cells and stuff like that. So I mean, you had nothing else, you’re spent most of the day in your underwear and, and, and you listen to the radio which is on a loud, those loud speakers like on M.A.S.H. that t.v. program. They had like loud speakers that you would hear the radio all day; and [pause] so you had a lot of time to, to, to, to think there. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And so, I’m coming with my family—my mother being religious and that, and, and she had tried to convince me to become a priest anyways, at one time, before I got into the gang thing. I started trying to reflect and, and I wanted to go to confession—, as a Catholic you want to go to confession— and confess my sins and, and then I was using. I went from the gang to the drugs. That’s what, what you lead to; it goes from the gang to the, to the hard drugs. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And so I said, “I don’t want,” “I don’t want the hard drugs,” I want to get away from that. a little beer and that, that’s fine. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: [Pause] But I don’t, I didn’t want to be involved with the, with the drugs, with the hard drugs. So, I went to confession and then they, I wanted to go to confession and the guard says, “Well, what you’re trying to do is just get out of your cell;” so, “we can’t let… you can’t go to confession.” I said, “What do you…” so I start trying to get legal on him, “You’re trying to,” you’re trying to well, I mean not legal, I just tried to tell him, “All I want to do is go to confession. Can I have the priest come here?” ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: He said, “I don’t know if we can do that.” So I said, “Well, I’m asking,” . So he told me, “Put a note, and we’ll do that;” so that’s what I did, and then all of a sudden the priest came and, —, I it took a little bit because I had, you’re in a p-prison-like environment, [pause] and, you’re gonna go to confession, that’s like drinking [laughing] cookies and milk, what I’m saying? ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: It’s like, “Are you trying to be a Cub Scout in here? You can’t be a Cub Scout. You gotta… you’re not going along with the program.” But anyway I didn’t care; what I’m saying? I was, I was, … it was… when I believe in something that’s the way I, I was ? I, I didn’t care. That’s what I learned from my, from my mother and from her religion and stuff like that and so I said, “I don’t care. We’ll go to confession right here,” and, you feel like an-anybody when they go to confession. You feel pretty good afterwards and, and so I start… so now I’m hearing all this stuff about the Black Panthers, and I’m going to confession and then I hear the Black Panthers are on the radio and they’re taking over a courthouse in Alameda, California and they’re going with guns and everything to take over, and I’m going like, “Wow,” “this is great! This is what we need to do.” [all laugh] So I’m gonna change my life. I’m gonna stop gang banging and I want to become a revolutionary; what I’m saying? I don’t want to, … so then, Page 13 �then at the same time they’re bringing Martin Luther King… is, is, is killed, and so they’re bringing in the people that are riding, they’re bringing them into our cell house. ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: So we’re looking at them from the top of, our cells. We’re looking down as they’re being [pause] shaken down, to see if they’ve got that… anything in there. Then they’re being asked questions diagnostic… questions, when they come in. So they’re bringing in riders and all of a sudden they’re also they’re doing raids on, on Mexican undocumented workers. So they’re bringing them in, and now there’s black guards--there’s not that many Spanish guards—but there’s black and white guards mainly. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: But I’m looking at the black guards and they’re pushing the, the Latinos, and even though they’re Mexican or Puerto Rican—but they’re still Latinos, just like me; and so I’m going like, “Why don’t you leave those people alone? You don’t, you don’t,” I’m yelling; we’re yelling—the few Latinos that are up in the jail. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: We’re yelling out, “Why don’t you leave them people alone? They’re not messing with you. They don’t understand what you’re talking about.” So, they would start asking a couple of qu- they would ask, the couple of black guys that were pretty good they would ask us a couple questions so we could help them translate. So then, I asked them, I said, “ what, I’ll translate,” “there’s not a problem. I’ll…” “Oh, you want to get out of your cell again.” I said, “No, no, no, no; I’ll do it from here.” [laughter] So I started yelling the questions and answers, back and forth and, that kind of helped me, also. I was like, I’m, I’m, I’m kind of serving my people or something like that, or in a way. so, so the riders and the Mexican, undocumented workers that were coming through there… and then I’m reading about Martin Luther King. The first book I read, though, was Thomas Merton, and I found out later he, he, he was a Trappist Monk, and I felt like a Trappist Monk [all laugh] in the cell, so he was, like, going through the same kind of stuff. So then, [pause] so I read that first, so that’s why I went to confession. I mean, that made me go to confession, the fact that he was religious and all that. But then I started reading Martin Luther King, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And then I read Malcom X also. so that was two different philosophies: one was for peace, and one was for by any means necessary. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: [interviewee coughs] Excuse me, and then I’m, I’m hearing about the, the Panthers on, on the radio at the same time, and then... Anyway, I get out, I said, “What I need to do, what we need to do is to, to do the same thing for Puerto Ricans, ; ‘Cause we don’t have nothing like the Panthers. This is what we need to do.” Page 14 �ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: So I came out with that idea, I’m gonna come out and I’m gonna try to ‘cause I was still the leader of the Young Lords at that time. So, I’m gonna try to do something with the Young Lords and do that, because I knew every time you go to jail they, the, the gang kind of breaks up a little bit and… ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: They don’t break up but they don’t, they don’t meet. There’s no meetings in there, … ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: That wasn’t to meet; and so, I came out but I had to deal with other stuff. I had to deal with— [laughing] I didn’t have a job, ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: What I’m saying, and so I, I got into this, program at the Argonne National Laboratory where half of the day I would be a janitor and the other half I would study for my GED. ROBERTSON: Nice. JIMENEZ: So, [pause] that was a riot, too. [laughing] But I mean, that, that, … we used to hide out and everything like that [all laughing] from our work, but we did, but we did… Anyway, they took us on a [pause] on a field trip to the Democratic convention and we saw the hippies getting beaten up; and before that, like I said, we used to cut the hippies’ hair. I mean, we just, just… they were there in Old Town, so they were there with us. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: It… Many of them were our friends, but we would do it just, just as, as a prank. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: And like I said, we fought with the sailors and that so it wasn’t no big thing, but [pause] but anyway, we went to the Democratic convention and now they’re… we’re all former gang members or, or, or we’re still gang member’s but we’re studying for GED. So in there we’re getting along, everybody gets along because we’re all for the same thing. We’re trying to, get our GED. So we go to the Democratic convention and the police are running to get the hippies and they’re beating them up, but they’re beating up reporters, and we’re saying to ourselves, “If they come to us,” everybody’s saying, “Is everybody going to stand for themselves?” and everybody said, “Yeah, we’re ready.” so I mean you could tell that we were, we, we were going to fight. Our thing was not peace. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: We were [laughing] we were gang bangers and we don’t know anything about what’s going on, we just came on, on a trip, a high school trip here. Page 15 �ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: They’re not going to beat us up, so… So anyway, when they came, we just kept walking straight. I remember about five or six of us, and the, and the professor—the teacher—and the police ran around us. They did… they, they could, I mean the way we were dressed, they could tell that we were not part of that, that crowd. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: So it wasn’t that we put fear in them, [laughter] it’s just that these guys are not any part of this. They kind of let us go, but that kind of stuck [pause] seeing people getting beat up, that kind of stuck in my, in my head ‘cause we would get beat up by the police, too. that kind of stuff, and all this kind of stuff that I was reading. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: So, anyway I had, I… On a different day, I met this lady, Pat Devine, and she was with some— two other people from the Concerned Citizens of Lincoln Park, and I’m talking to Benny, who was a Young Lord, and he was in his uniform and he’s proud that he just… he’s on leave from Vietnam, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And this lady comes in, and I’m looking at the neighborhood since I got out—I was only gone sixty days ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: And I could see the changes ROBERTSON: Wow. JIMENEZ: and this lady, I mean, they would… I mean, one-way streets, two-way streets, or one-way streets, you could see people getting thrown out by the sheriff and, and I’m talking to Benny, my friend, my best friend. He’s a Young Lord and he’s in a uniform and he’s proud. He’s a, a Vietnam veteran and all this stuff, —the Vietnam War because we were the ones who were put in the front lines. our, our people, … and this nice lady is telling him, “You’re killing the, the, the [pause] Vietnamese people,” and all this other stuff. I’m going like… so I go to his defense. To Benny’s defense and I used… I don’t mean any disrespect—I go, “Look, you [laughs] white bitch,” ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: “who the heck do you think you are? You’re kicking us out of our neighborhood, and this man is fighting for our, for our people; and you’re kicking us out of our neighborhood against…”, “You’re a Communist,” and she goes, “I’m proud to be a Communist.” I go, “Oh no! [laughter] This lady’s crazy. This lady’s way out there; this lady’s crazy.” So, … so, anyway she, she hit me hard; harder than another guy would hit me—I mean she knocked me down with the way she, the way she could express herself and stuff like that; Page 16 �ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: And, so it made me stop to think, and then, then I was a-already thinking about urban renewal and she says, “, we’re f… we’re… our organization is trying to fight to help people stay here,” . So, I mean, it started making sense to me. You get what I’m saying? So anyway, that night the, the other guys that were trying to rap to her and to her other friend and, and trying to, they were just trying to just rap to her but I was interested more in what she was saying; ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And, anyway, she invited me and Benny and, and everybody else to go to her house. just to relax and stuff like that—have a, have a few beers, stuff like that. So we did that, and we… I remember we were just talking all night, I mean we were sitting there talking and, and, and I’m asking her questions about it and stuff like that; and so she invited me and … me to, to, to come to a meeting. She said, “Well, can you bring any people to come to the urban renewal meeting,” ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And I’m going, “I can bring a thousand people. I’m the leader,” [laughter] that kind of stuff. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: So she said, “Well it’s going to be in about three weeks,” “just, whatever you can come… whatever, as many people as you can get just bring them,” ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: “Because it’s an important meeting about the neighborhood.” it was the Department of Urban Renewal was coming in. So that’s… this is a long story, but it’s… that’s when I started organizing and then I found out that, that to get people to come to a gang fight was a lot easier than to get ‘em to come to a meeting. [all laugh] what I’m saying? I mean, I, I went, I, I… people are supposed to organize like in the houses and stuff like that—well I didn’t know—I organized on street corners and in the bars. ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: That’s all I knew. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: The street corners and the bar. So I, I remember going to the bar of, of another gang ‘cause I’m trying to reach out to everybody, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: All the different gangs, and I remember going into the bar and they go, “Oh, here comes that nut again, Cha Cha,” [all laugh] and, and, and even the bartender didn’t want me in there. ROBERTSON: Wow. Page 17 �JIMENEZ: And I’m talking and I said, “man, they’re kicking us out of our neighborhood,” and, real basic stuff. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: I… “You see these one-way signs,” and all this, real basic stuff. “Oh, you’re a Communist,” and I go, “I’m a Communist? Come on out and tell me that.” [laughter] So I would go out and get beat up [laughs] and then they would buy me a drink and, it went like that. like I said, I got beat up a lot of times and put down and, and and, basically they didn’t want you there. The bartender didn’t want you there, you’re messing with his customers. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: The guys didn’t want to hear, they don’t want to talk about that. they… politics, they don’t want to… and they thought I was crazy and stuff like that. So it was like a, … but I learned that from my mom. I mean, I learned that you had to be, you had to be committed. You had to stay, stay with it; that it takes time to, to organize something. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: I mean, it wasn’t easy. Those kids come into the house, for catechism, wasn’t just they did a lot of stuff; they did the catechism, and then they did, rosaries like because what their goal was to get Spanish mass… ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: In the churches. There was no Spanish mass. ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: And, their goal was also to get them… they would have, they finally got some Spanish masses, but then they put—they did the mass in the hall instead of the regular church because it was offensive to the, to the regular parishioners; and there was, there was not enough Puerto Ricans to, to, to… They felt that there was not enough Puerto Ricans, but actually the hall was getting more filled up than the church. [laughing] what I’m saying? ROBERTSON: Right, right. JIMENEZ: but they did a lot of good stuff; and then they worked with the gangs. I mean, the, I mean they, the… It became a community, because when there was a big gang epidemic, when we started fighting and stuff like that, they started organizing dances—weekly, weekly dances. So they were smart; they made money [pause] and they work, they work with their kids. They were, they could see their kids, so I mean… and they could promote, proselytizing, that’s what you call it. they could promote their, their church, also. out of that community, Lincoln Park came the first Puerto Rican parade of Chicago; out of this, this group called, the Knights of St. John, which was equivalent to the Knights of Columbus; ROBERTSON: Okay. Page 18 �JIMENEZ: And the Damas de María, Hijas de María, “Daughters of Mary”, in Spanish… [pause] But out of that they’re organized; my parents became that, and then we did our own organizing as youths, the Young Lords; because we didn’t just… When we, when, when we started to grow as Young Lords we didn’t just organize the Young Lords, we organized all the other youth in the area, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: All the other youth groups and stuff like that. But yet, the, the organizing part was, … I took you on a whole trip [laughing] to tell you that I was getting beat up every day... [all laugh] that it wasn’t that easy, that, the organizing; and, and, and then we got beat up by the cops later, so that’s, so that’s a different story. I mean, after we get organized we’re thinking that we’re doing good, good things, right. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: ‘Cause we’re, we’re not fighting. We’re refusing to fight any, anybody. we’re not, we’re trying to stay away from drugs; we don’t, we don’t want… we’re opposed to drugs. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: We are for discipline; we want people to give more discipline. we want people to go to school; I mean, we thought we were doing everything the right way, but we begin to get attacked, by the police. for doing the… now they hate us more than when we were in, in a gang. They literally hate us more; I mean, they’re… anybody that’s wearing our button, they’re putting them against the wall and shaking them down, and these are community people who are wearing our buttons. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: They had a car parked twenty-four hours a day in front of our, our, our church; we did take over the church, but it became our headquarters and we had a daycare center there. We had a free breakfast for children program; we had a free health clinic; and we had cultural educational classes that were taught in the church. So, before it was empty. So we did take it over, and then, but right away the next day after we took it over… because the pastor had been working with us, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: It was the congregation that was opposed to us. We told them it’s not really a take-over, we just want to work together with, with the church for the community; and that pastor was later killed about six months later because it’s a cold case. It hasn’t been, [pause] proven who killed him or why. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: But we know that, during that time he was killed, another pastor was killed, and Fred Hampton from the Panthers were killed. So we knew that it was some kind of pattern going on there at the time but we, but we can’t prove it. I mean we, we know that; and, and out of respect for the family we, we didn’t promote it at that time. we didn’t talk about it that, that, that much. just out of respect for them, but by not talking about them people thought that we had something to do with it; because they used knives and all Puerto Ricans are supposed to carry knives. I mean they, but, it was a, … Page 19 �ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: People that, that, that read about it they could tell that it was something related to passion [fumbling over words] because of the way he was stabbed; he was stabbed seventeen times and his wife nine times. so it was, that was passion that tells you… it had to do with passion. ROBERTSON: Certainly. JIMENEZ: Now, when we took over the church we put Che Guevara as a mural; we put out Lisa Compos, which is another, Puerto Rican—nationalist from Puerto Rico; we put Lolita Lebrón, another Puerto Rican nationalist woman; we put Adelita, a woman from Mexico; and we put Emiliano Zapata on the wall. We put, like I said Che Guevara was on, was on the wall; so that could make somebody in the congregation… because the congregation was mostly Cuban exiles, so that could make Cuban exiles angry. We didn’t think about it because, we were thinking, “We’re Puerto Ricans,” and the community was mainly Puerto Rican; ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: But, I could see why that would make them very angry that they’re first to put a mural of Che Guevara on their church wall. I mean, today I wouldn’t do that, I mean, … ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: But we, we didn’t … We didn’t mean any harm by that, but I mean, … but I’m saying that could be one of the reasons. Now another, another thing was that we protested against the local mafia because he had put a sub-machine gun on a Puerto Rican business owner, because he, the business owner owned a restaurant and couldn’t afford the rent at that time. So the, the, the real estate office, who was, who was also the local mafia guy—and the reason I know he was the local mafia guy was my father. He used to sell the, bring the money for the numbers to him. So I knew, [laughing] so I knew that personally. Yeah, he was the local mafia; but any… but we still picketed in front of his place and, and I went with some, with some people that had a local tabloid newspaper, ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And, and they took pictures while this guy put his sub-machine gun on me. All I did was put my finger in my pocket, I didn’t [ROBERTSON: Wow.] have a weapon. So I put my finger in my pocket because I didn’t know what else to do when he put the sub-machine gun… and he ran into the back office that had a window and started calling the police. The police comes in, he comes out with his submachine gun and the police is there, and they’re frisking me [ROBERTSON: What?!] while this guy’s holding a sub-machine gun, but we’re taking pictures. So we took pictures and we, and we put those on the newspaper tabloid—about twenty pictures all around the front page; ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: And then we, we, we split about twenty thousand copies of them, we spread through the neighborhood; Page 20 �ROBERTSON: Yeah. JIMENEZ: And so, after that we didn’t, we didn’t break his windows, [laughs] but the adults were breaking them. Every Friday night they would break his window. He started with a big picture window and then… little, little, little blocks of windows; but, so it could have been, it could have been them too. I mean, it could have been the local mafia that we had to deal with, because the local mafia was the one pushing real estate with the city. It could have Lee Alderman, because Lee Alderman had an organization called United People to Inform Good-Doers and they were going through our garbage cans and stuff like that trying to find any information that they could to use against us. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: And that they could publicize to the… they thought we were getting funding from the Methodist churches in the suburbs, so they, they publicized a few things in the suburbs, Lee Alderman did. Now, we also broke into Lee Alderman’s press conference and, and exposed them because he had gotten caught with a prostitute in the neighborhood, so we exposed him right in front of the media. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: So he wasn’t too happy with that, either; [laughter] so we were making enemies, I mean is what I’m saying, and, and they, they were, our target was, was the pastor who was allowing us to… Oh, and they were also trying to, … there’s letters at DePaul University where they, they were sending letters to the bishop, trying to get the bishop to kick us out of the church; ROBERTSON: Okay. JIMENEZ: And he was saying no, that he was not, going to kick us out and the bishop was with us. he’s saying, “No, no,” “that’s his ministry and, and, and we’re gonna let him work with the youth. He’s working with the youth, so that’s his ministry.” So, so Lee Alderman and the committee, the uptight United People to Inform Good-Doers was definitely… had a campaign to try and get us out of there; and they were connected with the local mafia and the police and everybody else, so, so I don’t know… but then we also had the fact that we were part of a a rainbow coalition with the Black Panther Party and the Young Patriots, which was, an Appalachian white group that, that was, that we were working together with, and, so they… the Black Panther Party was being investigated by COINTELPRO, the Counter-Intelligence Program. ROBERTSON: Mmhm. JIMENEZ: So anybody that was connected to them—and we definitely were—I mean, I was going to speaking engagements with, Fred Hampton many, many times and many days. We spent a whole day with him because he was helping train, train us also. ROBERTSON: Right. JIMENEZ: We were learning from… so the- we had a lot of enemies at that time. We were in cir- what you call in circles, they were circling… we were the wagon and they were circling us. and we didn’t… and Page 21 �all we were trying to do was just, like to save our community; I mean, that’s all we were trying to do. We were probably saying too many things we didn’t need to say, but, other things, but I mean that was the main reason that, that we started was to save, to save the neighborhood;, save our ‘hood, save our neighborhood… but, [pause] but anyway, that’s how… That was a long one, right? [all laugh] JIMENEZ: I mean we did not understand how at that time I was well liked by a lot of people at that time and I know I should be liked more because I went through a program substance abuse programs and everything to change my negativity right. ROBERTSON: Mhmm JIMENEZ: I should be liked more, but I am hatted more ROBERTSON: Hmm? JIMENEZ: So that was we are saying was a concerted effort. To discredit me and what we were doing to people and that was one of the reasons that I ran for alderman and in nineteen seventy five it was more so that we could stay alive. As a movement and so that I ran in the neighborhood north of Lincoln Park which was lake view uptown because there were no more Puerto Ricans left in Lincoln park and in uptown they were starting to kick the Puerto Ricans out of there as well as like I said we kept moving north and west. So the aldermanic campaign I remember because we had to go underground and I went underground because I got arrested eighteen times in a six week period and for all felonies and so they were it was clear that they were trying to destroy the group in that way so I got a year and asked for a little time to straighten things out with my family and I took off and just went underground that meant that like today I could say that I am underground but because I am not in Chicago I am not in public or anything. But so we did that for like two and a half years which was I would have liked to looking back at it today I would have rather done two and a half years in jail then to be underground for two and a half years because at least in jail you have communication but I could not even communicate with my own family for two and a half years so that that’s why it was more difficult in that way but next time I would just take the jail time but anyway the while I was underground we organized a couple of movements a few more chapters of the young lords like in Los Angeles and San Diego and Hayward and Boston we worked with a group there so we were keeping a little busy while we were underground then what I decided was we needed like a training school for the leadership because I found out that Chicago was kinda falling apart a little bit m and they were starting to put drugs back in to the neighborhood so when I heard a lot of that stuff I said let’s get a group of people and we will rent a farm in Tomah Wisconsin I considered that because no one is there but we rented a farm in Tomah Wisconsin and about twenty three of use lived together like a commune but not really we had structure we would wake up in the morning and every one would have chores it was like a program and then people had to read. Like my mother I was not a teacher so I would tell them to read the book and discuss it I want I didn’t really have a plan you just have to read this book so we read it so read books like Frantz Fanon and books like that and some Lennon books but m we were mainly concerned with what they call the national question so that was the whole question of Puerto Rico, self-determination and how to organize that and in other words it was a two-step process because people were saying that we have to talk about the class struggle the poor vs. the rich and we were saying that we also have to talk about Puerto Rico we have a Page 22 �nation called Puerto Rico so it is ok to be a little nationalistic as long as you are also internationalist as long as it is not racist because we were against nationalism because that was racist but we said its ok to talk about that and be proud of that as long as you are still an internationalist and you respect everyone else and so that was to us the national question so said that before you can talk about class struggle m it is all collectivism or whatever but it’s all the same thing it’s all mixed up anyway but before we could even get to that point, but at that point everyone was talking about the class struggle or organize the workers and stuff like that and I’m going we can’t even get in to the job you want us to organize the job but we can’t even get in the plant so we are going to organize with in the community so that was what we decided that we needed not in the factory but in the community but I am not saying not to organize as an effect but our goal as an organization is to organize the values(27:55) to organize the communities and to look at it geographically to go door to door and that what we learned latter on with the aldermanice campaine and the mayoral campaine of mayor Washington was to go door to door that that was the best form of organizing we had programs but if you go door to door you don’t miss anybody and so our goal then became clear what our job had to be it was to go to each latino balto and try to organize door to door and stuff like that but we were never able to because of funding and other stuff we were never able to accomplish that goal completely, but it did spread and it did spread to other cities like that like creating base areas we called it but that was the kind of stuff that we started at the training school and that we did that for about two years and then from there we started doing target practice because we though that the revelution was going to be the next day and this guy blew his thumb off (Ha-ha) so we had to close down the place we had to get out of there because I was wanted by the law and so every one could have gone to jail but I had to so we moved from there to millwalky and we put out a newspaper and then whent back to Chicago and got appartments and people lived togeather and today when I am doing these interviews today there are still living togeather in the same apartment you go to one apartment house and everone in the building is an organizer that works togeather but they are not all young lords they are in different group but they learned from us because that is what we did so we went back to Chicago and we I actualy was livng a couple of blocks from the police station were I turned myself in laterbut we planed the turning of myself back in, turning my self in. but it is like they are not going to do this for us we have to do it aurselfs so passed out flyers all over the neighborhood and we sent them to peole in the media to make sure that they would be there and stuff like that and then we had about five hundered people when it was like four below zero(25:36) and there was like five hundered people marching when I turned myself in and basecly I wwnt downtown and took a cab and drove up to the police station and the marchers are on this side and I am paying the cab driver and I start to walk in to the crowd and I start shaking hands with every body and the loyers were there and the police grabed me right away but I was able to shack hands with a few people and then because of the layers they let me talk through a loud speaker to the crowed and stuff like that and so that was good I mean it was a good event but the fact that we had five hundered people show up at four below zero was pretty amazing that was pretty good and then right away they took me and I started my year in jail and wial I was doing the year in jail we were planning the alderman campaign and so when I can outit was easy because people know that I had just came out of jail and I am running for alderman(24:35) so I mean that brought news but we did a good campaine we had 39 percent of the vote for the first time and all you need is 51 percent to win and usualy the first time people get like one percent but I mean we did pretty good. And the second time it was not me running but the major and Page 23 �we helped him win the election so it was a different feeling from picket signes to, I think two hours are up, right (Ha-ha) from picket signes we went to a victory we won a majors we won a majors race and it was a different fealing because I could wallk in to city hall and see the major when I want just callhim up and say that I am on my way I did not have anything important to talk to him about it was just to say hello (Ha-ha) but it was a great fealing. I remember that night when we won because see our office was the fullerton office and it was mixed it was divers and latino were atomaticly going to go vote for herald not attomaticly I mean that we had to do our work but we were winning eighty to ninty present for herald Washington major the first African American major and in the purto rican area and in the anglo community in the white community they did not do that well but still with out them getting any vote we would have not have won and so I remember how hapy they were too I mean it was like hay we won like yea we did it. So it was a good fealing I am telling you I i remember my cousin I had submitted his name for the some liberary board and and I walk in to city hall and there was a couple of other people there with me and I see him and I great him an I go hay how are you doing Carmelo and he goes hay cha cha how are you and I says if you cant he says that if you came to see that major he is out of town you will not be able to see him and I’m going like I’m thinking that he is out of town I just talked to him but I did not tell him that so I said ok he said that I have been here a couple of hours and I am going to see the cheaf of staff because they are going to put me on the library board and I am going I know because I put your name (Ha-ha)ha but anyway so I’m going in there and this guy herald safical the security guard he is a cop major safle but he is a progressive cop he was with the he was for the panthers and things like that. And he goes hay cha cha so I say ok and I go in to the back and sure enough halrald Washington in in the back (Ha-ha)ha he was not out of town we was in the backbut I had gone to see him because I had went with some bills to his office and I sayed who is paying for this because I don’t have no money (Haha)so that was pretty pretty amazing times at that time and then he won again the second time but I did not work on that I was in Michigan during the second time but that was a victory for us because what happened is because we were the first group, latino group in the city to indorce him we did not ask for money you see our thing was more poklitical and we did not ask we were conserned about the community we were we vote we worked on his campaine because he rep… in fact it was called neighberhoods vs. downtown so that is why it fit in with what we were in to (20:37) so we were for his campaine and we know he had that he was very progressive person and we wanted anyone to defeat the daily machine so he was against that so so when he won he he organized he we did we and the office of special events for Chicago organized an event in the purto rican neighborhood of humble park and there were a hundered thousand Puerto Ricans in that park I mean wall to wall Puerto Ricans in that park and I was the only one on stage introducing the major at that time and he and he we were able to be able to choose that band that played it was willy colone and when he came to town people would pay like 40 50 dollars to see him and so they were seing him for free so that loded it up plus we did media on the radio and stuff like that that was payed from the budget of the office of special events so we were kind of directing it but they were kinds supling the money and the expertise to quordinate it because he had invited all of the community leaders to sit in a band shell or what ever but I was the only one on stagewith introducing the major but that is that whole speech in in the wikipidia article it’s a hole little two minite speech that I gave. Introducing him cus there that to use represented the victory we had went from a gang or what ever from an…to to becoming the young lords picketing protesting to taking over occupy they use the word occupy to day but we were calling it takeovers then and and our Page 24 �takovers we won we did not leave till our demands were met and and we were so unpredictabale that they wanted to give us the demands so what ever you want you can have (Ha-ha) because they did not know were we were going to come from so there was a few of us running around with guns (Ha-ha) and we are not leaving so I mean but and the families but we would have got killed but the families that were in side wial we took over micormic seminary for example we were there for a whole week the demands were $605,000 for them to invest in to low income housing, $25,000 for the health clinic for two health clinics so that was $50,000 and then another $25,000 to open up a peoples law center. (17:57) because the loyers were helping us negosheate we were there for a whole week we took it over the young lords and the next day and we did not even plan for food for provitions so today they would havewiped us out that is what they do today they some body took over some other place the other day in Chicago and they would not allow any food in. but you see what happened with us the community came and brought food the net day and then we let them come in so the next day we had three hundred and fifty people and and what happened is that when the police were wanting to attack us they decided to bring in the kids not us we did not want the kids to come in side but they said no no we are going to bring the kids so that that way they wont attack they wont come in and then the students were in the front of the building the students were our security in front so it was a seminary it was a complex like this it was a big complex we are talking about depaul university and it is today at that time it was called micormic theological seminary so it was a big complex like this and we took over the administration building a three level three story administration building and we were there we lived in there for a week in fact we won all of the demands and I told everybody that ok we can leave now and they went I am not leaving I have an office and no we got to leave (Ha-ha) we got to leave we did not leave but we had fun doing that they had music they had a lot of descution groups nothing but talk everyone was just talking all day and so every one came close by talking and became close and then we won all of the demands and we thretone to burn down the liberary because they were thretining to come in so we said we are going to go take over the liberary and then we are going to burn it down if we have to burn it down we don’t care that night is when they called us for the meeting “cough excuse me” that night is when they called us for the meeting but about two oclock in the morning and they said what what ever demands you wantwe will sign we will agree to your demands they had a little we had just read your demands and if thoughs are your demands then we will give you all of the demands you ask and I sayed ok so than the next day we were but I remember having press conferenses every day on top (Ha-ha) of the thing they had a little window sill that we would have press conferences out of there is a picture of that some were there is a picture but I have it some were but anyway so that is I don’t remember were we were at there a tangent I guess. ROBERTSON: (Ha-ha) Yea its like your saying coming from that level of street corner talk to political standing. JIMENEZ: How much time do we have left. ROBERTSON: Well we have as much time as we need. JIMENEZ: Ok Page 25 �ROBERTSON: As far as the questions. I was curious, I mean like you were saying, born in Puerto Rico, never really knowing it to much coming hear like you said when you were two years old and just moving around as much as you have like what are essential elements for you to consider some place home? JIMENEZ: Well my home is been Chicago that has been my home but my home is also but it does not exist any more I mean linken Park does not exist anymore I really don’t know when I was fifteen years old I went and stayed for about a year in Puerto Rico and and that was I was put on the plan in handcuffs and sent to Puerto Rico they were trying to deport me because I was the leader of the young lords and I had got some kind of case were we broke in to a house or something at the time and and I was not even good at that but that was something from the gang days and anyway I was still a juvenile and we will either put you hear and I was fourteen or something we will put you in a sharaten and shareten was a juvenile prison until your twenty one like juveniles htat have commited murders or something would go there or dangerous criminals they thought that I was a dangerous criminal or I don’t know I was never the fighter Orlando was the fighter in the group I was more always the organizer but Orlando never wanted to lead so I was the leader of the group. (12:48) but anyway so my mother said that I don’t want my son to go to jail till he was twenty one years old I will send him to Puerto Rico but I was balling I was crying I did not want to go but they took us in a pady wagon from the jail to the airport and at the airport they watched us from up above ant they let me talk to my parents and they walked me to the door and I I was that was when I started crying cuz I could not control myself cuz I did not know were I was going I’m like cheradin I knew were I was going and I will find friends who are there in jail I mean it is a life of jail so people but in Puerto Rico I didn’t know anybody or I thought I didn’t know anybody once I got there my uncle who met me he had come back and forth to Chicago several times so I did know him and other uncles and ants that had come back and fourth because we are like a shudle culture so we travel back and fourth all the time but I did not know that at first so but I went there at first and right away they said gangster from Chicago alcapone (Ha-ha) right away that was what everyone was thinking so but I remember hanging out with the priest because he was the only guy that I could talk to in English and I remember smiling because my grandmother would ask me stuff and I would just smile because I did not know the heck what she was saying and my grandfather woud get mad he would say he knows he knows he is just pretending that kind of thing but he was the backwards guy my father was bad he was wors but he was the one who tought me about the country and stuff like that I would hang out with him and go up to him on the mountain because the farm was a mountain the farm was not flat land it was on a mountain all of Puerto Rico is like that it is all hilly so the farms are all hlly and stuff like that so you have to climb and it is good because you climb to the top and there is fresh airy cool fresh air (10:37) when you go to the bottom it is all hot and but I got to know slowly I even went with one pare of shoes and had to save them for like Sunday so I walked around like what do you call it huckel berry fin is that with out shoes I mean I walked around that is what we did at that time we could not people could not afford shoes and that so they would save there shoes for like Sunday and that but I hung around witht the prist and I remembered I did not get in to any real big truble all though I did steal his hourse (Ha-ha) and his jeep one time because I fell in love with this girl in another bouyo another part of Puerto Rico and I was hanging out with and I was not trying to steel it I was just trying to barrow it (Ha-ha) butthat is what guys do when they are young and in love. So I I took his hourse one day and the jeep and then every one in the hole the thing is that every one goes to church on suday so if you do Page 26 �not go to church on Sunday you have to hide you don’t let anyone know that you are not at church cuz its like a country and its just one church and every body for miles away you can see form all the hils so we would go I remember cause he made me go to confection in front of everybody and that kind of stuff and that but he became like a friend of mine he got me a job in a in a hard wear store a ferreta they call it and I remember I met a guy from New York that was helping me because I would just sit there and stand in the front counter and people would come there and ask me something like a nail or something and I would not know but hten they ask me for something like a fouset and I right away I would have to go to my friend from new york whats this mean calesa what is he saying but I learned Spanish I had to learn Spanish that way and I even learned the song and stuff like that and in Christmas time that’s a big holiday in Puerto Rico the the three kings but it because of the American culture it starts like on crismas eve and then it last till January six which is the day of the three kings and everyone goes house to house and there like trubidors so they like sing and they improvise and so all my uncles and stuff like that they know how to improvise and before they had radio that was the way that they that was there music after they work in the fields all day they would come back and at night time and I learned it from my mom from researching her and at knighting like that my brothers and that we would just hang out on the purch and the vatey the yard ike hear like the yard hear they were not that big but they would there was a clearance because the rest was jungle you are talking about a tropical place so there was a little clearing in the front called the batay and they would sing there music there that was there radio that was how they relaxed at night and stuff like that but today it is only used mainly at Christmas time but before it was used for any holiday if you die you get a batranda they call it if you a birthday you get a bathranda wedding baptism whatever you get a bathranda but now it is just mainly done for Christmas for Christmas time and stuff like that but it is they are really celebrating the the three kings verses santa clouse and in fact they have an improvisation were one guy( 6:52) would say well I believe in Santa clause and the other would say no I am Puerto Rican I believe in the Three Kings but they are both Puerto Ricans but because we believe in both because of the influences but that type of music my uncles that I grew up with hear even though I did not grow up in Puerto Rico I grew up with that kind of music here for Christmas we would get together the family and we would sing thoughs songs and then and believe me I have some uncles that are pretty good at improvising and they would I remember one time we went to this house one of our ants house and they had just finished painting the house I mean you could smell the paint and so they come to the door and they start with whatever and they would start singing and they would say what a beautiful house it has such nice furniture and stuff like that and the walls must have been painted by the brush of pecaso (Ha-ha) so then it so then everyone had to rhyme with that at the end they would be they would sing a song and the last vers was it was done with the brush of Picasso so I mean they that was how it works that music that kind of music but it was great music I mean its also n the web there is a bunch of websites and stuff on there on the YouTube and stuff like that but yea we grew up with so I learned a little bit about the culture and I came back and I remember the young lords sweter cause I came back before around the year o yea I came back around the year that my father comes and the first thing he does is that the tetarus the tetarus are the riffraff’s of the neighborhood and I was one of them and he was one of them everyone from there in that section growing up became one of them so its like a gang but it’s a community gang so everyone knows them nobody worried about them (Ha-ha) but they are always stealing the eggs or something but no one pays attention to them they all talk and they all scape goat them like they scape goat gangs here but they Page 27 �scape goat them but they are all kids so they cant really hate them and every single one of them would snake out there so there really all really part all the men are apart of the thing (Ha-ha) ROBERTSON: (Ha-ha) JIMENEZ: And they would hang out in front of the store and look at the women and look at every one but anyway I remember but they would do serves to because my because the people that would come and visiting they would take there suit case and carry them to make them feel important for a tip and I remember my father he is over here coming to pick me up(3:57) and to visit and he hadn’t visited me all year but here he is coming to visit me but at least he’s I’m happy because he is going to take me back to Chicago so then I remember right away the titas they would carry his suit case and yea no problem and he is showing off and I am going I don’t know pops you got to slow down on the money because he starts buying everyone drinks and you got to slow down the money and I’m looking at his pants pocket like he is half way drunk he’s got his pants on and there is food stamps so the next day I tell him what are you doing showing off and you got food stamps (Ha-ha) so I said and he did not even have a job at that time my mother was the one that was working and he was getting well fair so that was the vasod that Puerto Ricans hear that was a contradiction that I was seeing how our people were acting and how it was not real how our people were playing the lottery but telling me that I cant do certain things that are not legal I said you’re not legal you are selling the numbers and what I am saying you’re your selling the numbers you’re playing the Spanish bingo which is not legal now I don’t know why that shouldn’t be legal but because they play it at the churches they play bingo at the churches so I mean that is another contradiction right but the Spanish bingo was illegal I don’t know why I mean they just they just did it for a quarter or a dime or whatever not a big thing but there were so many contradictions that you see and stuff like that then you go to school and then they are teaching you one thing and how even coming here to grand valley so and one class were they show us pictures and they say what does this person look like and everyone goes all right they had a picture of a hippy and they got a migrant worker and something like that and they go well he is a losser and this is in one of our classes and I’m going like I did not say nothing but I’m thinking to myself that guy looks like my dad how are you going to call my dad a losser he is not a loser I mean he did not have any money but he was a good parent I mean he what I am saying I mean ROBERTSON: Yea they were generalizing JIMENEZ: Yea he was a little macho and stuff like that but then(1:27) my mom had a little thing for the macho (Ha-ha) she says that a macho is a guy who can raise a family (Ha-ha) be a man he’s not he is not a macho he is not a man when he would get smart she would put him down ROBERTSON: (Ha-ha) JIMENEZ: I mean it was a part of the culture thing because they also labeled macho to to mean for Spanish people and it is in all cultures and stuff like that so he was a little macho by culture he thought he was the big shot but he did not works she would put him down like I am the bread winner you don’t work you are on well fair (Ha-ha) so I mean there were so many contradictions and and that came in to play when we got in to the young lords and stuff like that and but we got in to the young lords we like I Page 28 �said we were learning from the panthers and stuff like that and we needed the whole question of selfdetermination and the whole the whole the main reason that we started was the displacement of our community we were being kicked out but then we related that to is this thing going out are we recording? ROBERTSON: I am kind of queries yea JIMENEZ: Oh ok actually the other stuff you can probable get out of the Wikipedia thing (Ha-ha) I gave you stuff that is not on there END OF INTERVIEW Page 29 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/1a554612e6ea23035344655137db3604.mp3 fa9084f027e31f5aac64e45563d48a7f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral Histories Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Personal narratives Oral histories African Americans--Personal narratives Gays--Personal narratives Lesbians--Personal narratives Bisexual people--Personal narratives Transgender people--Personal narratives Veterans--Personal narratives Women--Personal narratives People with disabilities--Personal narratives Muslims--United States--Personal narratives Hispanic Americans--Personal narratives Homophobia Discrimination Islamophobia Stereotypes (Social psychology)--Upper Penninsula (Mich.) Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history recordings documenting the history of civil rights and social justice advocacy in Western Michigan. The collection was created by faculty and students as a project of the LIB 201 (formerly US 201): "Diversity in the U.S." course from 2011-2012. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. Brooks College of Interdisciplinary Studies Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project (GV248-01) Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-05-02 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1930-2011 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01_Jimenez_Jose Title A name given to the resource Jose Jimenez audio interview and transcript Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jimenez, Jose Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Robertson, Timothy Hood, Ashlie Perez, Angelica Description An account of the resource Jose Jimenez was born in Caguas, Puerto Rico and lived in Chicago. He discusses his experiences as the leader of the Young Lords and an activist for Latin Americans. Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Relation A related resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-02-24 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d2fafae31a1865622f9098c49424e475.pdf 0aa45ed4e8309475f3d307b104fd8a68 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Jose Jimenez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 3/15/2012 Runtime: 01:14:00 Biography and Description Oral history and interview of Jose “Cha-Cha” Jimenez on March 15, 2012 about the Young Lords in Lincoln Park. "The Young Lords in Lincoln Park" collection grows out of decades of work to more fully document the history of Chicago's Puerto Rican community which gave birth to the Young Lords Organization and later, the Young Lords Party. Founded by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, the Young Lords became one of the premier struggles for international human rights. Where thriving church congregations, social and political clubs, restaurants, groceries, and family residences once flourished, successive waves of urban �renewal and gentrification forcibly displaced most of those Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, working-class and impoverished families, and their children in the 1950s and 1960s. Today these same families and activists also risk losing their history. �Transcript Jimenez_Jose_1 Q1: All right. First off, if you wouldn’t mind just introducing yourself and telling us where you’re from. JOSE JIMENEZ: I’m José Jiménez, Cha-Cha Jiménez, from the Young Lords, founder of the Young Lords organization. Q1: Can you tell us a little bit about the Young Lords? JJ: Well, the Young Lords were a neighborhood youth group in Lincoln Park, Chicago back in the ’60s and ’70s, and then, late ’60s, 1968, we transformed ourselves into a human rights movement for self-determination for Puerto Rico and for neighborhood control. We were in the middle of -- the neighborhood was being displaced by the city that wanted to expand downtown and clean up the Lakefront area, which is where we were located at the [00:01:00] time. So, we were kinda caught in the middle by accident, and we were just trying to defend our hood. We looked at it like that. Although the majority of the people thought it was a good idea to rehab the housing, we just felt that they were taking away our community from us. So, those things, and the things that were going on in the country at that time -- the anti-war movement. There was, the late ’60s, the whole revolution movement, and it happened right there in Lincoln Park also with the Democratic Convention. And so, all those things together and what was going on in Puerto Rico, our people were trying to fight for self-determination 1 �there, all those things together contributed to our development into a human rights group. Q1: What was it originally that drew you to the Young Lords? JJ: [00:02:00] As the gang or as a political --? Q1: Well, initially. So, when it was still, first, a gang. JJ: Well, you know, when we first became a gang, there was several things that were going on. We had just got displaced from the neighborhood that Puerto Ricans called La Clark on Chicago Avenue and LaSalle -- Chicago Avenue and Clark. And so, we had just been displaced and pushed into the Lincoln Park neighborhood. The Lincoln Park neighborhood was an ethnic community. It was a very segregated community, but segregated by -- you know, Polish [were two or three blocks away?], we’d see Polish people, or Italian people, or German people, Gypsies, hillbillies, and Puerto Ricans that were coming in. And so, we were the new kids on the block at that [00:03:00] time, and we were being harassed by the other gangs that existed. At that time, the gangs were not like the gangs of today. Those were more territorial gangs, and based on culture and ethnicity. And so, we started getting robbed, you know, lunch money taken away from us. We started getting chased from school, and we started growing. There were more Puerto Ricans starting to move in. So, as we expanded, we started thinking about protection for ourselves. And so, the Young Lords, there were already some social clubs that were Puerto Rican that had been connected with the church, or individuals organized, like, sports leagues and that. They were older than we were. We were the younger [00:04:00] ones. And so, they were 2 �concerned more with playing softball and things like that, and then, later on, they turned into gangs, but we started -- from the very beginning, we wanted to look for territory. You know, we just wanted to have some kind of say-so in our area. So, we were going to other neighborhoods, and we would pick fights with people just to get a reputation. So, we’d go into an Italian neighborhood, hillbilly neighborhood, Irish neighborhood, and just taunt people until we were fighting with them. And then, if we won, then we could brag about that at the school that most of us were going to, Waller High School at the time, or [Arnold?] Elementary. So, [00:05:00] basically, that’s how we began. Again, we’re being harassed by other people that were more organized. They already had gangs. And so, we saw a need to begin our own gang for protection, and, you know, some of us even saw our parents beaten up, our uncles and fathers beaten up also, ’cause they were young too. I mean, they were in their twenties, early twenties, and that -- maybe up to thirties. It was just a young community at that time, and we were kinda breaking ground, and the kids saw a lot of things that were going on. Like I said, we were being chased around. And so, that’s how we originated as a gang, for protection and for recognition, and we went like that till the community became primarily Puerto Rican [00:06:00] at the time. People just kept move-- but that was a natural movement, I guess, that took place, where, later on, it was more done with the city and with the urban renewal programs, and, you know, was unnatural at that time. And, in fact, not only Puerto Ricans were evicted, but Italians, Irish, and Germans, all the people that 3 �we were going to school with at the time that we were fighting. We, later on, came together to try to defend the community from city hall. Q1: Do you want to move on or?(inaudible)? JJ: Probably going into the political stuff now. Q1: [00:07:00] ’Cause I wanted to touch on -- JJ: (overlapping dialogue; inaudible) -- Q1: -- a little more -- JJ: -- the gang. Q1: -- how -- just, I mean, kind of the idea that you felt you had to defend yourself to have just a better quality of life. Like -- JJ: Well, we -- Q1: -- ’cause I know, for you, you were saying that there was a changing point, where you realized that fighting wasn’t so much the answer, and you had to search something else out. I mean -- JJ: Well, you know, we were looking -- we originally began like that, like a gang, but, as time changed and the country was changing also, we began, also, to experience -- that was just simple prejudice, where we didn’t even look at it as prejudice. We looked at it more like one gang against another gang, but, in a way, it was subtle, you know. [00:08:00] But our parents were experiencing discrimination. I remember running home. My mother wanted to find an apartment, and I had talked to an Italian family, and they said, “We have an empty apartment,” and I ran home and told my mom, “Hey, there’s an apartment over here, not too far,” and she was all excited, and got dressed, and everything, 4 �and we went to see the Italian family, and, when they saw my mother, they said, “We don’t have any apartments.” To me, being light-skinned, that kind of opened up my eyes a little bit more, that I knew something was fishy, that something was funny there. It happened where our parents were like pilgrims, you know, moving into Chicago from Puerto Rico and being -- in Puerto Rico, like [00:09:00] 97 percent of the people were Catholic. And so, they’re coming into Chicago, and they see that some of the youth are going into gangs, and some of the parents also are having problems with alcohol or whatever. And so, they come together as a church, as a Catholic church, to try to change those things, to try to improve the community, to develop the community. And so, they come together, but then, they go into the Catholic church, and the Catholic church is saying, “We’ll give you space. We’ll give you --” All they wanted was Spanish Mass, Mass to be celebrated in Spanish. They said, “Well, we’ll give you Spanish Mass, but you have to do it in the hall. You can’t do it at the regular church because some of the people there don’t want you there.” But, you know, our parents didn’t -- they were not concerned with that. I mean, later on is when we found this out. [00:10:00] They were more concerned with Spanish Mass. So, they had to organize. They had to go door-to-door in Lincoln Park, and they would do Rosaries in different people’s homes. They organized themselves. They had retreats, church retreats. They formed the Caballeros de San Juan and the Damas de María, Daughters of Mary. So, it was like the Knights of Columbus, that type of organization, so they began to form organization. They form a credit union. They had an annual play of the Crucifixion of Jesus that they participated 5 �in. They had dances. You know, so, they involved the family. And very good dances, very well organized. Dinners, annual dinners that they had. They had picnics, where they would -- 10 to [00:11:00] 15 busloads would go to Oconomowoc, Wisconsin on picnics and that -- or to Libertyville, Illinois. So, our parents began to organize, and Lincoln Park became a barrio or a community, a Latino community. It was one of the first Puerto Rican communities in Chicago, well organized -- council number three, even though they were -- council number three ’cause there was -- council number one was on 63rd Street, and council number two was Holy Name Cathedral, where we had just been displaced from. So, they became well organized, a community. They cared for the youth. When the youth were getting in trouble, they started -- hey, you know, we can have dances, and make money, and still work with our children. So, they didn’t depend on the city. There was no political power [00:12:00] at the time. They created their own political power, their own base. In fact, the first Puerto Rican Parade Committee or first Puerto Rican Parade in Chicago came from Lincoln Park, from that community. There was a lot of bands at that time, youth bands, orchestras, that were organized in Lincoln Park -- bilingual. Some were primarily in Spanish, Spanish music, and some were the Motown type of music at that time, but that originated, again, in Lincoln Park and spread later. So, you know, we see this community. We grew up with that. We participated with our parents. You know, we went to their Rosaries, to the funerals, to the baptisms. Some of us were confirmed. Our parents had catechism classes. My mother had catechism classes [00:13:00] in our living room. That’s what I mean. We were 6 �like pilgrims at the time. And so, we see a community being organized, a community beginning to make a name for itself, a community that is becoming more stable, and, all of a sudden, the city of Chicago decides that they need that area. It’s prime real estate. It’s 15 minutes from the Loop downtown. It’s like five minutes from Lake Michigan, and lakefront property is prime real estate. Near downtown property is prime real estate, and that’s where we were at. We were located there because, when we first came to the city, many of our people were -- they used to joke around, called “grabando discos.” “Grabando discos” means making records. What they meant by that was that they were washing [00:14:00] dishes. So, that was their occupation. So, they were making records by washing dishes. So, meaning by that that many of the Puerto Ricans that came to Chicago at that time, in the ’50s and ’60s, were working downtown at the hotels, you know, some as maids for some of the rich people that lived near downtown, personal maids and that. But a community arose from that, and the city wanted that land, wanted to expand downtown, wanted these -- there was what they called at that time white flight to the suburbs. Many people were afraid of the Puerto Ricans ’cause they were new. They were odd to them and that. So, they wanted to flee to the suburbs to get away from Blacks and from Latinos at that time, and from poor whites, [00:15:00] you know, [or hillbillies running around there also?], and people didn’t want to be around poor people, basically. In fact, it was more income-oriented that was the problem, but, in a way, if you go today, what you see is it’s segregated. There is no integration. It’s primarily white, and I’m light-skinned myself, but it’s primarily white people with money that 7 �live in that community. And so, the poor have been wiped out. You can count them on the fingers of your hand, the poor that live in Lincoln Park. Of course, there’s some that work there, but they don’t live there. So, that was the answer to white flight, was an inner city suburb, which is what the city was calling Lincoln Park, [00:16:00] an inner city suburb, at that time. [Got a little racist in there?] (inaudible). Q1: It’s all right. I kind of feel like there’s almost a transition of anger a little bit here, between how -- just between the different races that were trying to live in Chicago, and then this movement towards kind of an anger towards the actual city. JJ: Yeah. Exactly. There was a little anger of people trying to get control. More of a -- trying to control their own lives, their own destiny at the time. The African American community was coming from the south at that time. They were moving from the south. The Appalachian white community, the hillbilly community, was moving from the mountain range in the East Coast. So, they were coming [00:17:00] into Chicago at that time, and Puerto Ricans and Mexicans were also moving into the city. So, you know, you have these new minorities coming there, and then you have the ethnic minorities that were there before. And so, there’s a big change going on, and change, you know, that destabilization, I think, is what created the gang problem there. I mean, gangs are always there, but it’s what created the problematic gangs, [to contributed to that?] and poverty, because we’re a lot of poor people living together in one area, which is what Lincoln Park was. But, you know, Lincoln Park was a very -- although it was segregated every 8 �three or four blocks, you can say it was diverse. You can say it was, in a way, integrated because, every three or four blocks, you would see a different [00:18:00] minority. But Chicago in the ’50s was a very segregated city, where African Americans were living on the West Side and South Side, and the white community was on the North Side, and Latinos were kind of in the middle, near downtown, at that time, so it was a very segregated city -- not to say that has changed much because, now, those minorities are on the outskirts, on the periphery of the city and in the suburbs. They’ve been pushed to the suburbs, and the Lakefront and downtown is primarily upper class white community that exists there today. But it wasn’t done for -- it was done racially. I mean, I’m not gonna say it wasn’t -- you know, I remember when I would get a haircut when I was younger in Lincoln Park, and people didn’t know that I was Spanish, and they would be talking about how Mayor [00:19:00] Daley was not gonna allow Blacks north of North Avenue. I mean, hearing things like that. So, it was done racially. I mean, that’s who was in power at that time, but it was also done economically. I mean, it was done for profit. It was done to advance the democratic machine, you know, to keep Mayor Daley in power. In Puerto Rico, every time there’s an election, they get machetes, and they cut the grass, you know, the little trails, the little [cow trails?], and they make them look like roads. I remember, when I was younger, they used to do that. It’s sort of what Mayor Daley did in Chicago, but he did it with housing. He did it, you know, fixing [each?] neighborhood and -- be he used that to keep himself elected. So, it’s a 9 �political thing that people do at that [00:20:00] time, and that’s what was done in Lincoln Park. (coughs) Excuse me. Q1: So, do you think some of the poverty was result of lack of opportunity, or just too many people within the area? JJ: Well, no. A lot of poor people that were coming in and no services for the -- no welcoming committee for the poor people. You have all these people moving in, and, instead of accepting them, you’re trying to push them out. You’re saying that there is the blighted area. We need to fix this area. And so, instead of providing for the youth, like an after school program so that they’re occupied, busy, supervised, because, you know, both of their parents had to work, so they couldn’t supervise them just to survive. So, instead of, for the city, welcoming people in, the new immigrants [00:21:00] in, what they were doing was to displace them, just push them to another neighborhood and just push them away to get rid of them. So, urban renewal became urban removal of poor people. They were just being kicked out. No attention was being given to these new immigrants, and these new immigrants, Puerto Ricans, are United States citizens. They fought in every war that the United States has fought in since they became connected to the United States, since they were invaded by the United States in 1898. They were made citizens 1917 for World War I, so they fought in World War I, World War II, in Korea, in Vietnam. They’re fighting today in the Middle East. So, you know, these are citizens of the United States, and they were being treated [00:22:00] like illegal aliens and like they treat undocumented workers at that time. I’m just saying that they were treated incorrectly, not as 10 �citizens and not welcomed to this country, and they were not the only ones. You know, African Americans were being treated, other ethnic minorities were also being treated the same way. The urban renewal program that was supposed to be geared to helping renovate poor areas and uplifting communities was basically a for-profit scheme that we know now today that the banks were involved, and the politicians want to blame the banks, and the banks want to blame the politicians, but they were both in cahoots with each other. It’s part of the [00:23:00] dynasty of Chicago. You know, so many people in Chicago that have been put in jail for corruption. If you look at it, most of them were -- it was connected to the housing situation in Chicago. But, today, we blame the youth for all these problems, and they need to take responsibility, but city hall did not do anything to help the youth or to help the new immigrants, which is where most gangs originated, from new immigrants that no one is paying attention to. So, in Lincoln Park, had we paid attention to them, there probably wouldn’t be the supergangs that we have today. They probably would have just been neighborhood little kids playing, doing some petty little crime here and there that could have been resolved, but, instead, now, what we have [00:24:00] are drug enterprises and supergangs because the city not only did not pay attention to the youth, but they displaced them. They discriminated against them. They scapegoated them. And so, the Young Lords were unique in the fact that not only individuals changed, but an entire gang changed and began to work -- we set up, you know, a daycare center so that the women of the group can participate in what we were doing. We modeled ourselves after some of the 11 �Panther programs. So, we had a free breakfast for children program. We had a free health clinic. We had a dental clinic. We had a Puerto Rican cultural center. We began a little militant because, again, we didn’t have any [00:25:00] role models. Our parents were involved in the church, and here we are, becoming more and more militant. So, we didn’t have any role models. We just had to fend for ourselves, but we didn’t want -- you know, our parents were being discriminated, but they were quiet and silent, and we had grown up here. And so, we knew we had rights, and we were trying to defend our rights, and that’s more or less how we began. So, we held the first large demonstrations in Chicago in terms of the Puerto Rican community, in terms of the Latino community, where we had 10,000 people, up to 100,000 people in 1983, when Harold Washington, the first African American mayor, was elected, and we played a major role in that election. There was 100,000 people in June of 1983 at Humboldt Park, and I was the only one on stage [00:26:00] representing the Young Lords and introducing the newly elected mayor. We gave out 30,000 buttons with “Tengo Puerto Rico En Mi Corazon, I have Puerto Rico in my heart,” because the Young Lords stood for self-determination for Puerto Rico, and also, you know, self-determination [for?] neighborhood empowerment. It was a simple philosophy that we had. We fought against police brutality. We marched against police brutality, but our main concern was more the community. We were not just thinking about ourselves. We knew that the police were -- there was a lot of repression on our group, but we were more concerned with trying to set up programs for the community, trying to save the community from being -- today, 12 �they call it gentrification or that. We call it more -- we needed to control [00:27:00] our own neighborhood, our own destiny at the time. Q1: So, could you actually describe the moment where you realized that the gang activity just wasn’t the right way to go and that this more political front could [better?] --? JJ: I mean, there were changes that were going on with a lot of people at that time, but, personally, I had become the leader of the gang in the mid-’60s, and then I [had gone?] into jail. You know, mostly, that’s why I was the leader. I was going in and out of jail and that, and I began to do organizing within the group and that and tried to keep the group together because, you know, groups have internal fights also. So, I was the one that would keep everyone together and thinking Young Lords first before [00:28:00] our little, petty differences. And so, I remember organizing a month of Soul Dances, where, every Saturday, every weekend, we met at St. Michael’s, and we -- was the first time that we were on the radio. You know, we bought a advertisement on the radio, and we filled up the gymnasium for four weeks straight. So, it was a month of soul. We got this other gang called the Blackstone Rangers. They had a dance group and African dancers. Remember bringing them and some Spanish bands to our dances. We had learned from our parents, the Knights of St. John and the Hijas de María, and how they organized their dances, so we did the same thing also. You know, my mother was pretty active in the church at that time. And I had -- myself, personally, was thinking even of going into the priesthood. She had taken me out of [00:29:00] Newberry School because I was getting into fights and, because 13 �she was involved in the church, they were able to put me at St. Teresa’s for sixth, seventh, and eighth grade. So, all that and my mother preaching to me every day made me want to think about going into the priesthood, but, you know, it was difficult with poverty. [I ended up?] throwing a snowball at a bus where the pastor was in, and so I got punished, and I couldn’t go that year, and, actually, it was a blessing, anyway, in disguise, but that year that I didn’t go was when I got deeper into the Young Lords gang, where I got deported to Puerto Rico because they were looking for gang leaders at that time. So, I was put in handcuffs on a plane and sent back to Puerto Rico versus going to jail till I was 21 years old, but I actually wanted to go to jail because I didn’t know Puerto Rico. I was crying when they put me on the [00:30:00] plane. I thought I was going to a foreign country. The only country I knew was Lincoln Park, Chicago. Anyway, I came back from Puerto Rico. I called myself El Cagüeño. I changed my name from Cha-Cha to El Cagüeño. Cagüeño is Caguas, the town in Puerto Rico where I was born ’cause I came when I was two years old. But, anyway, I came back after a year. I kinda snuck back in. My father came and picked me up, and, now, I have a little culture in me. I had learned even some jíbaro music in Puerto Rico that I really appreciated my culture. I didn’t appreciate it when I was there. When I was there, I actually wanted Puerto Rico to become a state because all I remember was the United States while I was there, but, when I came back here, it was the opposite thing. I only remembered -- was Puerto Rico, so, now, I wanted the Puerto Rican culture to be brought out and all that. So, you know, we had gang sweaters, and I put my name, El [00:31:00] Cagüeño, and I became -- I 14 �was still the president of the group. But, anyway, the gang was kind of going downhill, like most gangs go through phases. And so, the gang was getting into drugs, and crime, and all the other stuff that gangs do when they’re being destroyed, when they’re destroying themselves. It was the Vietnam War era also. And so, many of the Young Lords were going to Vietnam or coming out of Vietnam, getting married. The gang was falling apart, and I’m trying to keep the gang together, but I’m involved in drugs myself. So, I went to jail for possession of drugs, and I was given a 60-day sentence, but, because, right away, when you go to jail, you hang out with other Puerto Ricans, some -- a Black gang that was there thought that [00:32:00] we were a gang, and we were just Puerto Ricans hanging out. And so, they told the guards that we were trying to escape, and, anyway, they took all the Puerto Ricans. They strip-searched us and put us in maximum security, or the hole. I had just come in, so I had 60 days, so that was -- it was a city jail, the House of Correction, so the most you can do was a year, and I had 60 days, so I had the most of that group of nine people that got put into the hole. And, you know, I’m in the hole. I’m in a cell by myself. I’m on the third level. It’s an old Civil War cell. The catwalk is made out of wood. There’s rats running around, so they have large cats that they allow to live with us so they can get the rats. There’s roaches [hanging?] -- I mean, can you imagine going to jail and having to fight roaches? We had roaches in the jail, [00:33:00] where, basically, it’s summer. It’s hot. There’s no air conditioning, so we’re in our underwear and just hanging onto the bars. I mean, it’s a old Civil War jail cell. And so, I began to read. I hadn’t read since I had been in eighth grade and I 15 �read Seven Storey Mountain by Thomas Merton, which was about a Catholic hermit. Just, I read him only because the books were there. I mean, had it been another book, I probably would have read that one, but I read Thomas Merton. I didn’t really get too much out of it except that he was a hermit, and I’m in the hole, and I feel like a hermit myself. So, now, I want to go to confession. You know, I want to end drugs. I don’t want to be addicted to drugs. And so, I went to confession, and they said, “Well, you’re just trying to get out of your cell, so we’re not going to allow you to see a priest.” So, I talked to the -- I kept sending [00:34:00] messages to the priest, and he finally came to see me in my cell. And so, I went to confession there, and then I felt good, you know, like people, Catholics, feel when they go to confession. They feel real good. I had cleansed myself, my soul, and everything, and I joke about it now, but, I mean, I really took it serious because it was like standing up for your rights because other inmates are taunting you because, “Hey, this guy, Cha-Cha got a priest comin’ up here. He’s crazy.” But I was standing up for what I believed at that time. Again, we were Catholic. My mother had ingrained that in us. So, anyway, after that, I started reading Martin Luther King, and, you know, he’s a religious person. And then, I also read another religious person, Malcolm X. So, I kind of got both sides. I got the peace side, and I [00:35:00] got the Malcolm X talking about revolution, Black revolution, and, you know, there were no Latino books at that time, no Latino role models. And then, I started hearing on the news -- we had a loudspeaker with a radio on that would be blasting 24 hours a day with the old dusties. We didn’t call them oldies [but?] we called them dusties, but there would 16 �be, I mean, real old songs. And so, I would hear that, but, in between, there would be the news, and so I was hearing about the Black Panther Party in Oakland, taking over a courthouse with guns, and I’m going, “These people are crazy,” where, you know, they had different laws in the West Coast. From Chicago, you can’t be walking around in Chicago with guns, but -- not publicly. But, over there, you can walk with rifles, but that’s why they were protesting, because they were changing the laws and that at that [00:36:00] time. But, anyway, that kind of fascinated me a little bit, and I felt, you know, this is what we need to do in the Puerto Rican community. And so, I said, “When I get out of here, that’s what I want to do.” So, I got out, but we had to go through an exoffender program because I had to look for work. I needed employment. I didn’t want to get involved with any more drugs. So, I got -- half a day, we would go to get the GED, and the other -- you know, these were all ex-gang members, [exoffenders?], but we were still gang members, but they called us ex-gang members, but we were all together. We weren’t fighting. We were in school half a day. This was at the Argonne National Laboratory program there, and the other half a day -- so, half the day, we were janitors, and the other half a day, we were at school, getting our GED. So, we had a lot of fun there. [00:37:00] I remember opening up the maintenance room, and there’d be somebody asleep, and we would be stealing the golf carts and driving all over the place. I mean, we were little mischievous people, but we were studying and that. And, in fact, on one of the field trips, the teacher took us to the Democratic Convention so we can be exposed to the current events of the time. About 10 of us went to the 17 �Democratic Convention. We’re all gangbangers, and the hippies are getting beaten up and that, and that kind of affected us because we were used to getting beat up. That was a big thing, and then we’re reading about it in the newspaper. They’re calling it a police riot against the press ’cause the press was also getting beat up at that time. Mayor Daley was talking about -- I mean, later on, when the Black riots, when he was talking about shoot to kill. [00:38:00] You know, when Martin Luther King died, there were riots. So, anyway, even while I was there, I had seen people coming in from the Black riots, and also undocumented workers. Mexican people, which, to us, are our people, were being brought in, and the only crime they were committing was that they were working. So, we’re looking at it -- we’re inmates in jail. We’re criminals, and these people are coming in just because they’re working. They’re bringing them in, and pushing them around, and discriminating against them because they can’t speak any English. So, I mean, I offered to translate, and they said, again, “You just want to get out of your cell.” And I said, “Look. I’ll translate from up here.” So, they let me translate from my cell, and, you know, “Just don’t push them around. You just don’t understand. They don’t speak any English,” ’cause they were being pushed around and smiling. Ask ’em a question, they would smile ’cause they didn’t know what the officer [00:39:00] was asking them. But, anyway, all those things were kinda contributing to my enlightenment in terms of -- I don’t know if it’s enlightenment but in terms of seeing our people being discriminated and in terms of seeing a need to organizing something similar to the Black Panther Party but in the Puerto Rican community. I was fascinated with the Black 18 �Panther Party because, to me, they were like an army, and I felt that that’s what we needed at that time, was like an army and that. They started that way, but later on, they also were involved in primarily organizing, and I learned that later as I became more involved, that they were concerned with organizing the community for change. Not just the military aspect of it, but also the [mass line?] of organizing [00:40:00] the community with programs like the breakfast for children program, the health clinic, sickle cell anemia concerns, women’s rights. They stood for gay rights, gay liberation. Environmental movement, all those movements were right around that time that the Black Panther Party worked on. In Chicago, we made a coalition with Fred Hampton, and it was called the Rainbow Coalition. Later on, Jesse Jackson adopted that name, which is fine, but it originated from Fred Hampton, Chairman Fred Hampton of the Chicago Black Panther Party, and it was the originators that [were with?] the Young Lords, the young preachers, and the Black Panthers, and then it spread nationwide. So, all these things -- you know, a lot of movement going on in Chicago, a lot of stuff. [00:41:00] And then, we had no choice. Although the Black Panther Party’s main issue at that time was police abuse, police brutality, they did have a Ten-Point Program. Our main issue was not our choice. It was being displaced from our community, so our main issue was a housing issue, and it still is today. I mean, today, the Humboldt Park area in Chicago is still being displaced, and we’ve been displaced out of other cities, like in New York, and other areas, and in Puerto Rico. It’s a way to destabilize the community and to take control by the city of those areas. (inaudible). 19 �Q1: Well, what was one of the major acts that the new political group strived for in order to help with this whole displacement issue? JJ: Well, the first act that we did was -- [00:42:00] I was standing on the corner, and this lady named Pat Devine was from the Concerned Citizens of Lincoln Park. They had been organizing poor people to fight against urban renewal. They weren’t organizing Latinos. They were just organizing poor people. And so, remember, she was on the corner of Halsted and Dickens, which used to be our neighborhood, but it was displaced, but we still hung around there ’cause a new hot dog stand had moved to the other side of the street, and, in Chicago at that time, if you were a gang, you belonged to a hot dog stand. I mean, that was your neighborhood hangout. We even had credit and everything at our hot dog stand on Halsted and Dickens. But, anyway, she was there, and this guy, [Benny?], was in uniform. He was [00:43:00] on leave from Vietnam, and I was talking to him. He’s a Young Lord, and I’m talking to him, and I’m excited to see him. I hadn’t seen him in a while. I had just got out of jail. And Pat Devine just starts telling him, “You know, you kill all the Vietnamese people. What’s wrong with you? You should be ashamed of yourself.” I say, “What are you talking about, you white B?” You know what I’m saying? I was very annoyed by her. I said, “You’re trying to kick us out of our neighborhood.” And, anyway, she got into a fight, and then she says, you know, “You’re a communist.” I called her a communist. She says, “Oh, yeah? Well, I’m proud to be one, then.” And I’m going like, “This lady’s crazy.” You know what I’m saying? She’s a communist. We got into an argument, but the guys intervene and stop this arguing and that, 20 �[00:44:00] but I was convinced that she was one of the people that was kicking us out. I found out from her later, as we spent some time talking -- all of us went to her house and spent some time, and she explained how they were trying to stop urban renewal in that community, and she wanted us to get involved. Well, the other people were not that interested, but I got interested ’cause I had just come out of jail, and I had seen the changes in two months. I mean, you see people get their possessions thrown out on the street. The streets that were twoways became one-ways. The fire departments and police departments were all being renovated. All the hospitals and institutions were being renovated and expanded. And so, this all happened, like, in a two-month period, this was all going on. And so, I could see the difference. It was like a whole new area at the time. So, she asked me to bring people to a meeting, and I says, “Well, [00:45:00] you know, how many people can you bring to a meeting?” I said, “I can bring you thousands ’cause I’m the leader of the Young Lords street gang. I can bring you thousands.” Well, I began to ask people to come to the meeting, and I was getting involved in fights, physical fights, and they were calling me a communist, and I didn’t know anywhere else to organize. All I knew was to organize where we hung out at, in the street corners, and in the bars, and places like that, and parties and that, so I was going into -- when I couldn’t get enough Young Lords, I was going to the other groups, like the Black Eagles, and the Paragons, and the Flaming Arrows, and Imperial Aces [and Queens?], Trojans, Continentals, all these different groups that were in Lincoln Park at the time. I was going to their neighborhoods and getting into fistfights with them. When they 21 �saw me, they’d [00:46:00] go, “Oh, here he comes again. Here comes that crazy nut trying to talk to us, some crazy stuff.” I mean, I became obsessed with trying to fight against urban renewal, and I was trying to bring people to that meeting, but I wasn’t having a good -- I wasn’t making too much progress. In fact, half of the Young Lords quit. They didn’t want anything to do with me anymore because I was talking about political stuff and politics, you know. So, anyway, on the day of the meeting, I was able to get people from the various groups, just a few representatives from the various groups, and, remember, we met at Dayton and Armitage, which -- we were hanging out there, which, later, was where we took over the church there. But we met there, and we marched from there. We kinda walked from there. I wouldn’t say march. I mean, we kind of -- it looked like we were going to a gang [00:47:00] fight, like we usually did. About 60 of us walked to Larrabee Street, about four, five blocks away, and we entered the building, and there was a display there, and I told people -- I wasn’t educated about urban renewal. I tell them, “You see this display? Look at -- your houses are all empty. That means that they’re gonna destroy your houses. These people are meeting here to kick you out.” It was a meeting of the Community Conservation Council. It was the urban renewal headquarters at that time, and it was in Lincoln Park. And so, we didn’t know then, at that time. But, anyway, the people saw the display. Then, we walked into the meeting, and in the hall, on the stage, were about 10, 12 Americans. There were no Blacks, no Spanish people there, no poor people. In fact, most of them were, like, [00:48:00] developers. Some were members and the audience were members of the Lincoln Park Conservation 22 �Association, and a few people like Pat Devine was there, and some other people, but she hadn’t come with us. We came on our own. She was glad to see us, but, see, our people were not used to -- you know, we were gangs. We were representing different gangs, so our people were not used to -- first of all, we didn’t understand urban renewal, and we were not used to going to meetings. So, all I remember was saying something to the nature of, “This meeting is over. It’s dead. You’re not meeting here no more until you have Black, Latino, and poor white representation, and I remember them looking at me like I’m crazy. So, anyway, to make our point, some of the gang members start picking up chairs and didn’t throw it at the people ’cause we said, “We’re not here to jump on anybody,” [00:49:00] but started just throwing it at windows and stuff like that. Anyway, we ended up -- this guy told me later to use the word “trash.” We trashed the place, but, I mean, we would have probably used a different term then because that’s what we were trying to do. We were trying to tear it up, and then, we went to -- messed up the plumbing. The display was broken in 20 million pieces, and we all walked down and told everybody, “Go straight home. That way, we don’t get arrested.” So, you know, we had about 60 people, and everybody goes home. Nobody got arrested. The next day, we were giving each other five. It was like a victory and stuff like that that we did. So, that was the first action that we did, was -- some people would call it militant today. It was just a natural -- we didn’t know what we were doing, so that’s what we did. So, that was followed by what we call an organized riot because there had been so many -- a few riots [00:50:00] already, but we had people from Vietnam [in that 23 �school?]. We say, “We don’t want to destroy our community. We just want to get the stores that don’t belong here, that are not Puerto Rican -- we want them wiped out. So, we had an organized riot. Some of the Vietnam veterans synchronized their watches, and everybody took windows and bricks from all the way from Larrabee to Racine and Armitage, and we busted all the windows that were not Puerto Rican. And, the next day, they were all boarded up, and we’re giving each other five again. It’s another victory. We got one victory after the other. We went to the real estate office, and we picketed because it’s the local mafia -- we called him Fat Larry later -- had put a submachine gun on a Puerto Rican store owner that was renting [00:51:00] and didn’t have money for the rent. So, he didn’t want to go to the police because he knew the police were connected with the local mafia, and the reason we knew he was a local mafia was my father used to sell the numbers, Orlando’s father used to sell the numbers, and they used to turn the money in to the local mafia, so that’s what ran the numbers game in that neighborhood. So, everybody knew that they were Italian, they were the local mafia, whatever. Not that the mafia’s only Italian. (coughs) Excuse me. I messed it up. [I can stop?]. Q1: You’re fine. (inaudible) take a break. JJ: Okay. Yeah, I think I need (inaudible). Q1: Yeah. Yeah, you’re free to take a drink. Q2: (inaudible). JJ: But, anyway, I was -- let me finish. Q1: Okay. 24 �JJ: I don’t know if I can or not. No, let’s take a break. Q1: Okay. Yeah. JJ: Yeah. [00:52:00] It’s like dust. The dust gets in my -- Q1: Yeah. Q2: Yeah. JJ: (inaudible). How much time do you want to go with this? Q2: There is -- Q1: We’ve gone for almost -- it’s like 50 minutes right now. JJ: [Did you shut mine off?]? Q1: Fifty-three minutes. JJ: But do you want to go to 50 -- (break in recording) Q1: So, you’re rolling. JJ: So, you know, we knew who they were. They were the local mafia. At that time, they were organized, and they didn’t want to really create any disturbance because they were reaping profits from the real estate. They were involved in the real estate market. There were three offices, three real estate offices on one small block, so they were making a lot of money on the real estate. So, anyway, we picketed his office. [Yeah, he put a?] [00:53:00] submachine gun on us, and then I remember I didn’t know what to do at the time. I just put my hand in my pocket like I had something, but he went in the back office [with a window on?], and he called the police. The police came, and, instead of searching him, he was locked up in the office, although he left his partner on the front desk, scared, 25 �and we told his partner, “We’re not here to create any problems.” But we had some photographers with us, and they started taking photos. So, what we did was, the next week, we took all those photos and put them on the front page of a local newspaper that we produced, and we spread about 20,000 copies all through the neighborhood. So, now, the community is riled up. Our parents are upset. The Caguas Social Club, were [00:54:00] my father and other -- uncles and that, other people, would go, they started taking it on their own to break his windows. We were not breaking his windows. So, his windows went from big picture windows to little cube windows, basically, and that was the parents doing that, not us. So, you know, the community was getting there. We started uniting with other groups, like the North Side Cooperative Ministry, the Concerned Citizens of Lincoln Park, the SDS, Students for a Democratic Society, Rising Up Angry, different organizations. I mean, the churches were all involved with the Young Lords and that at that time. So, now, we’re broadening ourselves, and we’re forming the Lincoln Park Poor People’s Coalition, and I was elected president of that, [as being?] with the Young Lords. Also, we were connected with the Waller [00:55:00] High School Planning Committee, and I was elected vice president of that. You know, keep in mind, I didn’t go that far in school, but the Young Lords were gaining a reputation in the political field at that time and standing up for the community. So, anyway, that group, the Lincoln Park Poor People’s Coalition, and the Young Lords were meeting with the institutions, like the hospitals and McCormick Seminary, and asking them to -- we’re kinda demanding that they be involved in low-income housing. Somebody had to -- 26 �’cause they were the ones that were involved in trying to displace us. We were trying to put pressure on them to also invest in low-income housing. We were not against improving the community. We just wanted to make sure that there was neighborhood diversity, that everyone was included. Well, McCormick Theological Seminary, a religious institution, [00:56:00] clearly stated that they were not gonna be involved in low-income housing because it was not profitable. So, it was like our group was demoralized. The coalition was demoralized, so the Young Lords -- we took it upon ourselves. We walked out [in caucus?] at the meeting, and we took it upon ourselves. We were walking back, and we’re looking at McCormick Theological Seminary, and we said, “You know what? We can take this building over,” and we went in, and we had no cars at that time, no vehicles. Most of us had bicycles, so that’s what we used, was chains from the bicycle chains, and we chained the doors, and we -- you know, broke in, and chained the doors, and took it over. We used the offices and the phones. By the next morning, we had called the media. The media had broadcast it, and the place was filling up with our [00:57:00] people. And so, by the next morning, we had about 350 people inside that seminary with us, the administration building. Today, it’s DePaul University. We stayed there for about a week. During that process, there was a theater there, so we had singers. We had poetry readings. We had acting. We had all kind of stuff going on at that time. People started organizing. We hadn’t provided any provisions. We hadn’t really planned it, so, the next morning, restaurants and neighborhood people were coming with food for us, delivering food, and we set up a kitchen crew, and we started cooking 27 �inside the administration building and that, and started feeding the people. So, [instead of going?] to [00:58:00] students from the -- seminarians that were going to the school wanted -- we kinda didn’t trust them because they were connected with the school, but we did trust them a bit, so we told them that they could -- you know, they wanted to join with us, and we said, “Fine. If you want to be our security in the front so, when the police comes, you’re there, and you are students, so it’s gonna be more difficult for them to attack you first. But, if you’re willing to do that --” And they were definitely willing to do that. At one point, McKay, the administrator, wanted to send in the police, and the -- we didn’t want the women to do it, but they did. They started bringing in their children. We asked them not to do that, but they did it on their own. We threatened to burn down the library, and that was the final [00:59:00] thing that made McKay, the director, change his mind. We also had sent a representative to Texas, to their annual conference of the Presbyterian Church, who were the people that were running the seminary, so we had a representative go all the way to Texas, Obed López. And then, by Sunday, when we threatened to burn down the library, is when they negotiated with us, and we received all our demands. We won all our demands -- 601,000 dollars to be invested in low-income housing, to hire an architect so that we can come up with our own plans, 30,000 dollar -- no, 50,000 dollars for a health clinic for Lincoln Park, the Ramón Emeterio Betances Health Clinic, which we later put in at People’s Church on Dayton and [01:00:00] Armitage, another 50,000 dollars for a clinic in West Town, in the Wicker Park neighborhood, which -- today, Wicker Park has also been displaced. We had 28 �50,000 dollars for a cultural center. Fifty thousand dollars went for the People’s Law Office, which still exists today. In fact, that clinic existed to maybe 15 years ago, so, I mean, it was -- these became institutions in their own right. But, anyway, right after that, McCormick -- that victory -- where we hung out, it was Dayton and Armitage, and there was a vacant United Methodist Church there. And so, we had been negotiating with them to see if they would let us use their gymnasium so that the guys who were hanging out outside of their church would be able to go inside and play basketball instead of just hanging out and creating a ruckus outside, [01:01:00] but we can work with the youth, and they wouldn’t be involved in gangs. But the congregation was a Cuban congregation, and they did not like what the Young Lords were doing. At that time, we didn’t understand what we were doing wrong, but the community was primarily Puerto Rican anyway, but the congregation was Cuban at the time. But, anyway, we ended up -- Reverend Bruce Johnson, who was there, was also a member of the Northside Cooperative Ministry, so he was already working with us. So, when we took over that church, he basically went against his own congregation. His congregation called the police, and I was standing outside with him, and I said, “There’s gonna be a bloodbath.” You know, there was weapons there. “There’s gonna be a bloodbath.” And so, Reverend Bruce Johnson decided to [01:02:00] tell the police that he had given us permission to be there. So, because of that action, we in turn said, well, this is really not a takeover. So, the next day, we had opened up the day care center of the clinic and all that right away, and there was a press conference, and the press conference asked me, were we gonna permit 29 �the church to have Mass, and I told them, “This is not a takeover, and not only are they gonna have Mass, but I intend to be there myself.” And so, after that, they came up with a button that said, “People’s Church,” so they became part of the movement that we also were doing. In fact, that’s what was good about the Young Lords, was we were increasing in numbers. We got many people to be involved, so it became more than just a Puerto Rican movement, but it became more of a diverse movement. [01:03:00] So, after that, the police came down heavy with repression. There were building inspectors being brought to the church to try to close it down ’cause we were there. They had a police car that changed their shift right there, in front of the church, so it was there, parked, 24 hours a day. They were photographing everybody going in and out of the church. They were calling the radio and stop people like a block away, shake them down, you know, go through their possessions. Many times, I would be arrested, and they would take my phone book with out -- just, they knew they could do that, and they were getting people’s numbers, and addresses, and that from me, so I know they were doing that with a lot of other people. So, you know, they had put the Young Lords and the Black Panthers in the police training videos, so -- [01:04:00] we didn’t have cars, so, when we walked down the street, we were being stopped by new recruits, new police recruits, because, hey, this is Cha-Cha, or this is Fred Hampton, or these are Panthers. These are Young Lords. Anybody with our buttons, and there were a lot of people wearing our buttons, would be stopped and harassed, which is freedom of speech, wearing a button, but they would be stopped and harassed. But, anyway, when we saw 30 �that that was taking place, we were learning more from the Black Panther Party. Say, “That’s why we need these programs,” the breakfast for children program, the health clinic, and that, so not only are we showing people what type of society we want, a cooperative society that we want, you know, to work together, more collectivism, to work together, as we call it, but these are ways also to keep us alive, to survive, so [01:05:00] that the police cannot attack us and destroy our movement, which is what they wanted to do at that time. So, we said, instead of being so -- the Puerto Rican community had not gone, like the African American community, through a phase of -- at least the Puerto Rican community in Chicago -- through a phase of nonviolence, and demonstrations, (inaudible), so we needed to involve more of the people in the community. And so, we began to organize demonstrations, and one turning point was when Manuel Ramos was killed by an off-duty policeman, James Lamb, and people in the Young Lords wanted to get even, and we had discussions and said, “You know, the best way to get even is to organize the community.” [All the?] hotheads in the group wanted just to shoot people, to get even the old-fashioned way, [01:06:00] but we were able to organize, and we had a march of about 10,000 strong. At that time, we had other groups join in. I remember the Horsemen was a motorcycle group, and they came with their motorcycles in front, and they looked beautiful. And then, the Caballeros de San Juan and Hijas de María of council number nine, they were deeply involved with us at that time, so the church was involved. In fact, Antulio Parrilla, the bishop of Puerto Rico, came to celebrate -- specifically to Chicago -- to celebrate a Mass for the Young Lords, so we were very grateful 31 �for that. This is the bishop of Puerto Rico coming just to see us, and the Caballeros of San Juan were the ones that brought him in. Jesús Rodríguez was the leader at that time that brought him in. So, we were getting [01:07:00] not only the Protestants with the Northside Cooperative Ministry, but the Catholic Church was also, now, supporting us and that. Later on, of course, I was involved in the [aldermanic campaign?] where I ran for alderman also, and we got 39 percent of the vote. You know, all you need is 51 percent to win, so, for the first time ever -- usually you get maybe one or two percent. Here, we got 39 percent. The second time that we were involved in a campaign was the campaign for mayor Harold Washington in 1983, and he won, and it was a different feeling from picketing and protesting to being victors, to winning, and that’s when I introduced him in front of 100,000 Puerto Ricans in Humboldt Park with 30,000 people wearing our buttons. So, you know, we started kind of militant from the [01:08:00] gang, kinda evil and mischievous, and became citizens, honest citizens working for the community, and, now, many of our people know us. Our history’s being taught in many Latino studies departments in many universities across this country. Right now, as a student at Grand Valley State University, I’m in the process of documenting the community of Lincoln Park that was completely displaced with an oral history project. We have done some work with DePaul University, but this is -- I’m excited. This is a bigger project, and it’s the people themselves, telling their own history. And so, that’s what we’re doing. That’s what I’m doing today. That’s what we’re doing today as a group. 32 �Q1: [01:09:00] Now, with that, why is documenting the past so important to you, and what do you want to achieve with this project? JJ: Well, you know, it’s not just documenting the past, but this is a group of people that stood up for their rights, so it’s -- we’re telling the history of an immigrant group, the Puerto Rican community, that -- not many people know about the Puerto Rican community. The first Puerto Ricans to Chicago, their community that was displaced, and we’re saying that they stood up for their rights. So, it’s like a historical piece that we’re doing for the community. I mean, they stood up. They marched. They protested. They were militant. They were religious. They were pilgrims. [01:10:00] There’s many lessons to be learned. They worked with their own youth. The whole lessons of how they were a stable community, and then they were destabilized and destroyed, and supergangs came out of that. All those are lessons that not only the Puerto Rican community can learn but everyone can learn. And so, I think it’s an important element in terms of the history of the United States itself. I mean, this is the first gang that completely turned themselves around. I mean, you don’t have that. That’s history by itself. You don’t have that in the history of -- this is good for the sociologists and anybody that wants to study the gang problem that exists today to at least get some ideas how we can change that for future immigrants that will be coming -[01:11:00] you know, this is the land of immigrants. So, it’s important, I think, for America. It’s important for Puerto Ricans that we do this history. Q1: Well, thank you. JJ: Thank you. 33 �Q1: Awesome stuff. Q2: Very nice. Q1: Thank you. (break in recording) Q1: And recording. JJ: Well, I’m against the plebiscite mainly because it’s not Puerto Rican. It’s more of a master plan for Puerto Rico that was put in place since 1898. It’s a tool to try to complete the process of colonization for Puerto Rico. It’s not half of the population of Puerto Ricans that live in the United States, who live in what we call a shuttle culture because they move back and [01:12:00] forth to Puerto Rico. They travel back and forth to Puerto Rico. Their children were born here or born there. It’s a shuttle culture. Half of the Puerto Ricans will not be able to vote in this plebiscite, so it’s a rigged election from the beginning. It’s only there for the purposes of helping to elect the current governor that exists there. Puerto Rico is an occupied nation. There is no army, no military. They government of Puerto Rico is basically on the payroll so that, you know, you have more people in government than you really need, and they’re just basically there to maintain the island [colonized?]. One-third of Puerto Rico is a military base. Puerto Rico does not have its own currency. From the peso, they went to the American dollar. Puerto Ricans [01:13:00] are not against the Americans. We have fought for the American people, so we -- Puerto Ricans are American citizens. What we’re saying is that we have a right to determine our own destiny, the same thing that the United States was saying against England. We have been in existence 34 �300 years more than the United States. In fact, the first governor of Puerto Rico, Ponce de León, discovered the oldest city in the United States, St. Augustine, Florida. So, I mean, Puerto Rico is a nation with its own culture, with its own language, with its own history, a nation of 500 years and more, and we feel it’s an occupied nation, and it needs to remain free. Libre, as we call it. [Thanks?]. END OF VIDEO FILE 35 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/c5131908777cdf642451538df4f7adaf.mp4 9002636d2da7277abcfb9ae39d32c14d Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Jose Jimenez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 1 Descripción Spanish language Description entry La historia oral de Jose 'Cha-Cha' Jimenez, entrevistado en 3/15/2012 sobre los Young Lords en Lincoln Park. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Mexicano-Americanos--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Mexico-Americanos--Illinois--Chicago--Condiciones sociales Relaciones raciales Conflicto social Identitad cultural Partido Pantera Negra. Illinois Capí­tulo Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Jose_1 Title A name given to the resource Jose Jimenez video interview and transcript, interview 1 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jimenez, Jose Description An account of the resource Oral history of Jose 'Cha-Cha' Jimenez, interviewed on 3/15/2012 about the Young Lords in Lincoln Park. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jimenez, Jose, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Mexican Americans--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Mexican Americans--Illinois--Chicago--Social conditions Race relations Social conflict Cultural identity Black Panther Party. Illinois Chapter Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-03-15 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/4c3bf5e1e33c7819d42bcf28fa55154a.pdf 723307eca2555bbeff1f0f266f28c814 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Jose Jimenez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 7/14/2012 Runtime: 00:28:27 Biography and Description Oral history and interview of Jose “Cha-Cha” Jimenez on March 15, 2012 about the Young Lords in Lincoln Park. "The Young Lords in Lincoln Park" collection grows out of decades of work to more fully document the history of Chicago's Puerto Rican community which gave birth to the Young Lords Organization and later, the Young Lords Party. Founded by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, the Young Lords became one of the premier struggles for international human rights. Where thriving church congregations, social and political clubs, restaurants, groceries, and family residences once flourished, successive waves of urban �renewal and gentrification forcibly displaced most of those Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, working-class and impoverished families, and their children in the 1950s and 1960s. Today these same families and activists also risk losing their history. �Transcript yl_Jimenez_Jose_2 Q1: Yeah, it is kinda low. JOSE JIMENEZ: It is low. Q2: Okay. Could you state your name? JJ: Yeah. It’s José Jiménez, born 1948. Q2: Good. (inaudible). Q1: [And you were?] -- JJ: Is this one on? Is this one on? (inaudible) [press?] that button. Q1: Yes, it is on. JJ: Okay, the red button -- Q1: And the voice is going. I can see the audio. JJ: Okay. Q1: Okay. Q2: Okay. I’d heard a report from a former Young Lord about the killing of a pastor in the DePaul University area. [If you could?] tell me what you know about it. JJ: Yeah. Reverend Bruce Johnson and Eugenia Johnson, his wife, were -- he was found stabbed seventeen times, and his wife nine times. They tried to make it look like it was [00:01:00] a gang that did it because we had been in his church, at People’s Church. Reverend Bruce Johnson was a member of the Northside Cooperative Ministry, which was a coalition of ministers that were supporting the Young Lords. His congregation were Cuban exiles that were against us having murals on the wall, but, I mean -- and they were against us being in the church. 1 �We were also having problems with the local mafia at the time, and also -because we were picketing. They ran the real estate offices that were displacing the Puerto Rican community of Lincoln Park. Q2: What was the address of this church? JJ: It was 834 West Armitage. When we took over the church, he prevented the police from coming into the church, where the congregation was trying to get us arrested, [00:02:00] so we were able to work with him, and we started saying, “Well, this is not really a takeover. We’re gonna work together.” And, together, we renamed it People’s Church. We came up with buttons and everything to go along with that. We set up the first free community daycare center in Chicago. We set up the Ramón Emeterio Betances Health Clinic, and also a dental clinic in the basement. We also had a Puerto Rican Cultural Center in the church. So, we did a lot of work, and he supported us. He was under attack. They fined the church 200 dollars a day every time it remained open, so he was going under that attack, and the local alderman, Alderman Barr McCutcheon, had organized a group called -- something about [00:03:00] uniting the do-gooders, basically, it was called, but they were sending letters to the Methodist bishop to try to get him out of there. This is just prior to when he was killed. Of course, we had -- the police were parked, the [Red Squad?] was parked, like, 24 hours a day in front of the church. There were people being arrested for wearing the Young Lords buttons or arrested for disorderly conduct, harassed. They had the stop-and-frisk law, so they would stop and frisk them any time they wanted to. So, he was under attack, basically, before that happened. On the week that it happened, I 2 �had been in the county jail because of -- I had, like, 18 cases pending. And so, I would have to go to court, and, sometimes, [00:04:00] it was three courtrooms at the same time. And so, one judge would get angry and give me another charge for bond jumping because I wasn’t in his courtroom when I had to be in three at the same time. So, I mean, that was me. I was the head of the group, the Young Lords, but other members were also going through repression, similar repression, at the same time. So, all that was going on, and this was 30 days before Fred Hampton and Mark Clark were killed, so this was right around that time. They had announced one time that we had a cache of weapons inside the church. It was announced on ABC News, on the national news. Well, we didn’t have any weapons. I mean, we had to set up, like, a [vigil?] because we knew that a raid was coming to the church ’cause the Panthers had been raided three times. They had had three shootouts [00:05:00] with the police or -- you know, the police started shooting at them, basically. It’s not that they were having shootouts, but the police were shooting into their offices and that. So, that’s the kind of climate that existed at that time. Our main, primary concern at that time was that our neighborhood was being displaced, that they wanted to create an inner city suburb in Lincoln Park. And so, you know, like, some people use the term gentrification. To us, that’s like cookies and milk. It’s not really reflective of what was going on. What was going on was that these were -- was what they did to the indigenous people, where they took their land for [beads?], and that’s what really was going on. The Latino community was being ripped off of prime real estate because we were so close to downtown and so close [00:06:00] to the 3 �lakefront, so this was prime land, which -- we were not aware of it. We were new immigrants coming into Chicago since the ’50s, since the late ’40s and ’50s, so we were buying houses cheap, like 15,000, 24,000, that are, today, being sold for a million dollars. So, I mean, that’s why I’m saying gentrification is a sweet term to what they actually did there. It was a rip-off, basically. But Reverend Bruce Johnson and Eugenia Johnson were supporting us. Q2: Can you tell me anything about them? How old were they? JJ: Well, they were young. They were young ministers. I don’t really know them that well. They were young ministers. They were trying to work with the poor at that time. Maybe a little naive, a little idealistic, [00:07:00] naive, there, but we had respect for them. They did have our respect. He used to teach Puerto Rican history to some of the gang members that -- we would hang around in front of the church before we became political. Some of us hung around in front of the church, so some of us already knew him, so he would teach Puerto Rican history, which we didn’t get in any school. So, he was actually trying to awaken us to the conditions that were going on at that time. His church was also -- they were renting space to the welfare department (inaudible), so the people in the neighborhood would go there to pick up their food stamps, or their cheese, or whatever the welfare department was giving out. But, as soon as urban renewal came to Lincoln Park, that was the first place that was moved, so it became an empty church. It wasn’t being utilized, and that’s one of the reasons that [00:08:00] the Young Lords were meeting for about four or five months prior to the takeover. We were meeting, and we were being frustrated because the 4 �congregation didn’t want us in there, even though we offered to pay them money, to raise money, to pay to help pay the rent, just like the city had had the welfare department (inaudible). We offered to pay them some money, [some rental space?], but they said no, and especially when they heard that we were connected with the Black Panther Party, they didn’t want anything to do with us there. What happened [on the?] takeover was -- I remember standing outside after meeting with Reverend Bruce Johnson, and one of the members of the Young Lords signaled to me that, you know, we got the church. The church is taken over. I wasn’t even aware of it. This was something that was spontaneous, and they had decided to do it because we had just come from [00:09:00] the takeover of McCormick Theological Seminary, where we had stayed there for a week and won all of our demands, including 601,000 dollars to be invested in low-income housing. So, we even had our architect draw up plans, and we had a project. So, we had won a victory there, and, now, we were coming, and these people from the Young Lords, on their own, basically, took it over, and they’re signaling to me, “We have it. We have the church.” So, right after that, soon after that, the congregation called the police, and we’re trying to talk to each other, myself and Reverend Bruce Johnson, about -- this is gonna be a bloodshed here if the police try to enter the church. So, we were trying to calm things down, and that’s what he did. He basically told the police that he gave us permission to be in the church while the congregation is [00:10:00] saying, “No, they can’t be there. What are you doing?” So, you know, clearly, they were angry with their own pastor at the time. So, he was getting a lot of enemies 5 �because he was working with Puerto Ricans at that time. And so, I believe that’s why they -- you know, to us, he was our pastor. The reporters asked me, “Are you going to allow the church to have service?” The very next day after we had taken it over. And we said, “We’re not here to disrupt anything from the church, and, in fact, we’re gonna be at the service ourselves.” So, we had respect for them and the church. A lot of the Young Lords are -- a lot of Latinos are Catholic, and we kind of respect the church, even though they were -- he’s a United Methodist minister, but we respected any church at that time. And so, our concern for the takeover of the church was [00:11:00] more -- we’re trying to stop displacement of our people, and we’re trying to talk about community rights, you know, because all the decisions that were made in Lincoln Park were not done with us. In fact, that was really our primary concern. We’re not against improving the community, but we just wanted a voice in it. It was our neighborhood, and they just came in and took it over physically because a lot of - the people were evicted by sheriffs. They were evicted by the police. At that time in Lincoln Park, where you don’t see that today, I mean, you would walk around and see people’s furnitures on the sidewalk, where they were evicted because the rents went from -- I know, myself, personally, we paid 80 dollars a month rent one month, and the next month, it was 400. So, I mean, this is what was going on all over [00:12:00] Lincoln Park to a lot of families and that, but that was our main concern at that time. And then, we also learned -- because we joined with the Black Panther Party and the Rainbow Coalition, we began to learn about the programs, and we set up a free breakfast for children program, a clinic, 6 �some other programs in the church and that. And so, we had some other ideas from the Panthers, but our concern, instead of the police, was more housingrelated, and, today, it’s been brought up more like with the Occupy movement, the Wall Street movement. [At that time?], but it was more reflective in terms of the neighborhood at that time. Q2: What government agencies were involved in either keeping tabs on you or harassing or (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)? JJ: They were trying to encircle us to destroy us, I guess. You had this regular [00:13:00] Chicago police. They were against us, that were keeping tabs on us. You had the Alderman Barr McCutcheon, and the UPTIGD. That’s the name of the group. United People to Inform Good Doers. UPTIGD. So, they had an organization. They were keeping tabs on us. The local mafia, we had picketed several times, so they didn’t get along with us too well. You had the Red Squad. They had a car parked 24 hours a day in front of the church. They would literally change shifts there. You know, you would see them change the shift. That car was there 24 hours a day. And then, in the neighborhood, you had the Gang Intelligence Unit because we had been a former gang, so they had files on us, and they had people checking us out. We, later on, found out that the Panthers in Chicago were being investigated by [00:14:00] COINTELPRO, so that meant that anybody part of the Rainbow Coalition was also being investigated. I mean, they kept very good records. We had congressional committees that were set up to investigate the Black Panthers, and the Young Lords, and all that. We, later on, were reading some of their documents and that. So, you had quite a few 7 �people -- well, and then, Mayor Daley called the War on Gangs. And so, now, you have the regular precinct organization that were spreading rumor campaigns about the Young Lords to try to disrupt us, but on the other side of the coin is that, because we were former gang members of that neighborhood -- our parents grew up there in that neighborhood, we grew up there -- we had a very tight connection to the community, and that’s why it was difficult. That’s why they needed all these -- the precinct captains [00:15:00] and everybody else to try to discredit us. When we were growing up, I remember being in altar boy at St. Michael’s. Our parents were involved in the church there. They had an organization called the Caballeros de San Juan or Knights of St. John and the Damas de María, the Daughters of Mary. Their whole concern was just to get Spanish Mass, and yet, if you look at a lot of the churches where they got Spanish Mass, they got it, but it was usually kept in a hall. They didn’t have it in the regular chapel, so there was a prejudice where people -- the old-timers didn’t want these new Puerto Ricans coming in, so they said, “Okay, you can have Mass, but not in the regular chapel,” although they said later that they preferred that. In the oral histories that I’m doing, some clearly say that, no, they did not want us there [00:16:00] [in the thing?]. So, we had seen what our parents had done, but, to us, they were more [docile?]. They knew there was discrimination because, when they went to rent apartments, they would say, “No dogs allowed.” You know, they were telling them, “We don’t rent to Puerto Ricans,” or, “No dogs allowed,” or whatever. That kind of attitude. And some of our parents were beaten up by the white gangs at that time in that neighborhood, the Anglo gangs, 8 �the greaser gangs that we were talking about earlier, that we fought later. But, of course, we were all kicked out, so, you know, we later joined together. So, it was a community. It was basically a community. Our parents were very good organizers. They organized the softball teams. The first Puerto Rican Parade came out of the Lincoln Park neighborhood. [00:17:00] So, all the first Puerto Rican businesses in Chicago came out of there, out of the Lincoln Park neighborhood. So, this was a broad community that we became the representatives of and the leaders in fighting back Mayor Daley. I mean, we were fighting Mayor Daley directly, and even his own people don’t fight him. I mean, but we were fighting -- so, we got scapegoated. We took a lot of [hits?] for that. We eventually ended up in the underground. When I had to serve -- the first of my cases was a year. That was the maximum that they could give me for -- they said I took 23 dollars’ worth of lumber for the daycare center or whatever, but I actually pleaded guilty to that, but the other cases that I pleaded not guilty, we negotiated for them. They threw them out of court and that, but there [00:18:00] were a total of 18 felony counts on me at that time. But, anyway, I knew that they were trying to destroy the group, so I didn’t go to court. I did jump bail then, and I went underground for about two and a half years. We organized a underground training school for new leaders. And then, we came back, and I began [doing a year?] -- we came back on the exact date of the memorial to Fred Hampton and Mark Clark, on December 4, 1972. I turned myself in then because I felt that I needed to -- we wanted to organize. Some people saw me in 9 �Cuba, [they thought I was?] in Cuba, but I wanted to continue organizing. We wanted to keep the Young Lords alive at that time for our community. Q2: Well, the FBI has been very focused on Puerto Rican nationalism and people [00:19:00] who want the status of Puerto Rico changed to either a state or independent country. Was that tied to the Young Lords (overlapping dialogue; inaudible)? JJ: Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. We saw urban renewal -- we connected that to the issue of self-determination for Puerto Rico. So, we held the first demonstrations in Chicago. There had been demonstrations in New York, but, I mean, we held the biggest demonstrations and the first ones in the city of Chicago, supporting self-determination for Puerto Rico, and we connected that to this -- we would tell our people, “You see what they did here in Lincoln Park? That’s exactly what they’re gonna do in Puerto Rico. They’re gonna come in with businesses, and flowers, and everything else, and beautify the country with the only purpose of continuing their colonialism, continuing to take it over even more.” And today, [00:20:00] this year, they were talking about the plebiscite and trying to make it a state. Every time the republican governor goes there, that’s what happens. So, no, that was our major issue, was the self-determination for Puerto Rico, but we had -- we started because of the urban renewal. That’s what got us -- we could see that clearly because we were right there in Lincoln Park, and we saw what was going on. Q2: Do you have any idea who killed that pastor and his wife? 10 �JJ: Well, I mean, we don’t know who killed him. I mean, we think it’s the government, but, I mean, we don’t have any proof, but he had enemies, like I said, the alderman. At DePaul University, there are letters that were being sent to the bishop by the alderman and the UPTIGD organization, demanding that the United Methodist Church kick him out and the Young Lords from the church. [00:21:00] The local mafia that we were picketing in the neighborhood -- when I said local mafia, they ran the numbers, and I know they was a local mafia ’cause my father used to sell the numbers and turn in the receipts to them, so it’s not like we didn’t know. Everybody in the neighborhood knew they were involved with the numbers, and, now, they were also involved in real estate. They had three real estate offices on the same block, so we know that there was a local mafia. We didn’t bother them. We weren’t against them. It’s said that they had put a submachine gun on a Puerto Rican store owner, and we wanted that corrected. We didn’t want that Puerto Rican business owner disrespected like that, and that’s why we picketed them, but they looked at us -- since we were young, they probably blamed Reverend Bruce Johnson because he was the pastor at the church, and he allowed us to be at the church, and that’s why they were angry with him. [00:22:00] So, you had that, and then you had the police. I mean, the Red Squad, clearly. You had COINTELPRO that, 30 days later, killed Fred Hampton and Mark Clark. They were against us. By being against us, they were against him. So -- Q2: But the Cuban emigres, you mentioned them. Cubans? 11 �JJ: Right, also, yeah, the Cuban -- they had just come from Cuba, and they were totally anti-Castro, and a lot of them had been connected with the CIA in the Bay of Pigs Invasion. You know, some of the Cubans that were there at that church had been involved in the Bay of Pigs Invasion. We knew of that ’cause they had talked about it. And so, they could have been connected with the CIA, with that group -- you know, the CIA recruits gang members. They recruit killers, murderers. They give them breaks, and that’s who their cadre is. [00:23:00] So, we’re thinking that they were part of the cadre of the CIA. They were there. So, that was another group, and, again, we had the Gang Intelligence, the Red Squad. There were a lot of enemies. And then, you had groups, [clear?] white groups that were racist. I mean, these were racist groups, organizations, that were also writing letters at that time to the pastor, and I was getting pictures, pornographic pictures of men having sex with other men in my mail every day. I got that for, like, six months. Somebody was just sending me that. It was a way of harassment. I don’t know if it was coming from the Red Squad, or the police, or whatever, but that’s just one example. Of course, all the times that we were picked up just for wearing the button and harassed. They would come [00:24:00] on the street with a megaphone, out loud, and, “Cha-Cha this,” and, “You punks,” and all that. This is the police, you know, so that the -- they would stop and frisk us when they saw the community, a lot of people in that street, so that the people would look at us as criminals because we’re being arrested by the police or stopped and frisked by the police. And then, the precinct captains, you know, they were clearly telling people that we were communists, that we were with 12 �Castro, we were communist, that kind of stuff. And it didn’t help the fact that we had Che Guevara on the mural on the wall of the church. We painted that. We had Don Pedro Albizu Campos, who was the leader of the Nationalist Party in Puerto Rico and fought for independence. We had Lolita Lebrón, who was one of the nationalists that went [00:25:00] to Blair House in the ’50s. We had her photo up there. We had Adelita, who was a Mexican woman, revolutionary woman. We had Emiliano Zapata on the wall. All this stuff was on the wall outside after we took over the church. It was painted on the wall. So, as you could see, there were -- the congregation would be angry about that, or other people in the community would be, including Puerto Ricans. Not just Cubans would be angry that we would have that, but we didn’t think twice about it. These were our heroes. We didn’t have any heroes, so these became our heroes. There was a lot of discussion in the neighborhood of were the Young Lords -- are they doing good things or bad things? So, you know, we were definitely talked about in the community, so there was some controversy in the neighborhood. Q2: How strong of an area was this Puerto Rican concentration? JJ: We’re talking about from North Avenue to Diversey, Lincoln [00:26:00] Park, from Racine to about Clark Street. So, the lakefront was always the [goalpost?], but the mid-section of Lincoln Park was the Puerto Rican area that was displaced. You know, you’re talking about 65,000 people that were displaced. A good 30 percent of them were Puerto Ricans (overlapping dialogue; inaudible). Q2: [Where did they go?]? In Chicago? 13 �JJ: No, in Lincoln Park. In Lincoln Park. Now, today, it’s sort of like what the Japanese -- they were put in internship [sic] camps, and we were kinda doing the same thing with the research project. We’re trying to document that community, but it’s not just for that community ’cause we’re concerned about -- today, it’s in Humboldt Park. That’s being displaced. Pilsen, the Mexican community on Pilsen was being displaced. So, we’re concerned -- New York, other cities. They’re being displaced. The whole Occupy Wall Street movement that talks [00:27:00] about that housing displacement -- today, they were talking about homelessness. Well, it comes out of that displacement era that we were involved in. And so, people need to connect the dots. We’re trying to connect the dots. Q2: Okay. I’m out of (overlapping dialogue; inaudible). JJ: Okay. Q2: Thank you. (overlapping dialogue; inaudible). You gave me a lot of good information. I have to get your contact info so we can. Q1: Well, I have one great horoscope, which is just what I said in the interview. JJ: What’s it say? What’s your sign? I’m glad that’s not on the interview. What’s your sign? Q1: I’m a double Capricorn with Aquarius rising. JJ: Oh, okay. Q1: And I don’t really know what that means, but I have a strong stomach. Here’s what it said, though. It said, “Capricorn -- a change of locations will [00:28:00] help you determine your next move.” JJ: Okay. 14 �Q1: “Visualize what you want and begin the process of turning a dream into a reality. Refrain from being impulsive. Time is on your side.” JJ: Okay. P3: I say you need to cut that out and put that on your refrigerator. JJ: Yeah, [that would be good?]. Q1: It’s kinda what I said at the end, right? P3: Yeah. Yeah. Q1: I said, “Yeah, I gotta finish up some stuff, and -- END OF VIDEO FILE 15 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/18c866a914e1b2f5351e1fbd60a13863.mp4 38ee91c6402e64e0309efc16ae75b5d5 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Jose Jimenez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 2 Descripción Spanish language Description entry La historia oral de Jose 'Cha-Cha' Jimenez, entrevistado en 7/14/2012 sobre los Young Lords en Lincoln Park. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Mexicano-Americanos--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Mexico-Americanos--Illinois--Chicago--Condiciones sociales Relaciones raciales Conflicto social Identitad cultural Partido Pantera Negra. Illinois Capí­tulo Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Jose_2 Title A name given to the resource Jose Jimenez video interview and transcript,interview 2 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jimenez, Jose Description An account of the resource Oral history of Jose 'Cha-Cha' Jimenez, interviewed on 7/14/2012 about the Young Lords in Lincoln Park. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jimenez, Jose, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Mexican Americans--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Mexican Americans--Illinois--Chicago--Social conditions Race relations Social conflict Cultural identity Black Panther Party. Illinois Chapter Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-07-14 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/206fc9d9721d8ef9a3fadc308f138b24.pdf fff3a4f22823d6cb38b43602616cd5c9 PDF Text Text CIUDADANOS POR JOSE CHA-CHA JIMENEZ PARA MAS INFOBMACION: Angela Lind 11 549-94S7 - Slim Coleman. 275-4778 20 JUNIO 1974 DECLARAC!ON DE CM1>IDATURA Durante los dltimos veinte anos la "Renovaci6n Urbana" ha transformado enormes secciones de -la ciudad de Chic•go 1 derrumbando miles de hoga res y desplazando millares de familias latinas. La raz6n y el resultado de est• actividad es el aumento de las ganancias de los grandee negociantes en bienea rafces. los terratenientes, ayudados por los polfticos vendidos. ,Que efecto ha tenido esto sobre las familias trabajadoras y la gente pobre? Mi familia tuvo que mudarse nueve veces antes de que yo acabara con la escuela primaria. En total, estuve en cuatro escualas diferentes. Estos cambios frecuentes. ast como la pobreza que nos obligaba a vivir en barrios donde las drogas. la prostitucion y el crimen eran comunes, fueron obst!tculos para mi desarrollo. Ahora que yo y los de mi generacion somos padres y ma.drea, ttendremos que sufrir las mismas penas? Me preocupa que mis hijos y los hijos de familias pobres recibirln educacion inferior y crecerSn en ambientea insalubrea. La respuesta a estas preguntas y preocupacioues est! en manos del Consejo Municipal. porque allf reside la respcnsabilidad. LCuales son las metas de la ciudad? LEliminar los arrabales y tugurios o eliminar a los pobres? La soluci6n al problema de la vivienda no es desplazar gente, sino renovar y construir hogares de alta calidad. con rentas m6dicas. La soluciSn a la pobreza no es eliminar a la gente pobre 1 sino ofrecer buen tTabajo 1 servicios adecuados 1 y ambientes sanos. �DeclaraciSn de Candidatura En - 2 - el pasado• organizamos demostraciones. marchamos y piqueteam.os. pero los pol!ticos vendidos no quisieron escucharnos. y nos desplazaron aqut al ~uartel 46. Esta secci6n de la ciudad es singular porque la mayorta de las persona& han sido obligadas a mudarse aqut desde otros barrios. Durante los Gltimos nueve meses he dialogado con latinos, negros, indios. blancos surenos. as1fticos y judtos, muchos de ellos conocidos desde que viv!an en Lincoln Park o en La Clark. Las ticticas de protesta del pasado ya no sirven. Para ser escuchados, necesitamos un representante en el Consejo Municipal, doude hoy no hay siquiera dn latino. Para lograr esto, hemos organizado u~.a coaliciSn de gente comprometida al futuro de nuestra com.unidad 1 capaz de derrotar a "La ~..ac;,uina" de Daley. Per la prese11te me declaro candidato al Consejo Municipal por el cuartel 46. Nuestro pueblo merece una victoria 1 ya, que con esta ca:npeiia la lograrf. Los pol!ticos vendidos podrin seguir sus relaciones !ntimas con los grandee legociantes y los terratenientes; mientras tanto, nosotros trabajamos con. para, y por el pueblo. -30- � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1974-06-20_Declaracion-de-Candidatura Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974-06-20 Title A name given to the resource Declaracion de Candidatura Description An account of the resource Spanish statement of candidacy for alderman of Ward 46, Chicago, Illinois. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource spa Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/b557b3802fafec1172b4959088184e93.pdf 28ff84c9c7cf49bd9a019bec047b17f0 PDF Text Text FROM: Citiz«ms fo i' Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez . FOR MORE IHFORMATION: Angela Lind, 549-9457 - Slfm Coleman, 275-4778 FOR IMMEDIA~"E RELEASE JUHE 20, 1974 STATEMENT OF CANDIDACY It is t·ime to flip the coin and look at the other side of Urban Renewal. The huge profits reaped by private developers -- aided by corrupt politicians -have caused nothing but ·misery to Latinos and other poor people. I myself have been a victim of this abuse. Before I finished the .8th .Grade, I was moved over 9 times by these· developers and forced to attend four · different elE!mentary schools, making it difficult to receive any adequate education. Each time I was forced to live in unstable colllllunities filled with drugs. gangs, prostitution and .other crimes. Fortunately I have survived 1n spite of these conditions. However, today I worry for my son and the sons and daughters of Latinos and other poor people. Will they have to grow up in these same wretched conditions? The City Council must assume respons1bil 1ty for these conditions. because that 1s where . responsibfli1~ lies. The city nust abandon its master plan to systematically and callou~ly remove Lat1nc,s and other poor from the· inner-city and other desirable areas of Chicago. If this city is in fact concerned with ridding itself of slums,· ft should then develop massive high quality 1 low-income housing and provide for jobs in the inner city. The answer to eliminating slums is not to relocate them but to provide decent jobs, a decent standard of living and stable neighborhoods. In the late sixties we marched, picketed and demonstrated for these goals. However, . none of the corrupt politicians wanted to listen. As a result we were pushed out a~tafn and have ended up here in the 46th Ward. The 46th Ward 1s unique fn that it i!; primarily made up of people who have been pushed ot,,t of other areas · MORE �STATEMENT OF CANDIDACY (continued) page 2 of the city. For the last 9 months I have been speaking with Latinos, nlacks, tlative Americans, southern white, Asian Americans and Jewish people; I have known many of these people from the struggles on Clark Street and in the Lincoln Park community. We have concluded that we must dev~lop a different approach and continue the struggle. Ho longer must we beg in protest to a deaf aldennan who ignores our concerns. Council. It i's time that we have our own representatives in the City It is time especially for Latinos, who are represented ne1ther in the city nor the state gove"'nmen·c, to take political power. For these reasons we have put together a. coalition of concerned people who J.ra capable of defeating the Daley machine in the 46th Ward. And today I ar.i announcing that I will be a candidate for Alderman in the 46th Ward. Our people deserve a victory and we are supremely confident that this campaign will give them one. Let corrupt politicians work hand in hand with developers -- we're working hand in hand with the people. JOSE CHA-CHA JIMENEZ - 30 - � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1974-06-20_Statement-of-Candidacy Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974-06-20 Title A name given to the resource Statement of Candidacy Description An account of the resource English statement of candidacy for alderman of Ward 46, Chicago, Illinois. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/6f3ad3a512e889805024fb31ac48481b.pdf 5e8987944d58e751af799aba2a6aa9b1 PDF Text Text 2 Children Killed, Le Moyne Boycott Successful-I 3 lniured at Broadway & Buena On Saturday, November 2nd, two young boys were killed in a tragic accident that left three other young people seriously injured. The boys killed were Adrian Espada, 13, and Michael Jimenez, 12, both of Gordon Terrace. Several youths had been sitting on the steps of the corner building at Broadway and Buena about 7 :30 in the evening when a Yellow cab, hit by another car, crashed uncontrollably over the curb, onto the steps of the building, and into the doorway. Loose pillars fell from the building onto the already injured children, killing two. The hearts of the community united to set up a fund to assist the children's families , most of whom are on welfare and cannot affort the heavy expenses resulting from the accident. These are not the first children who have been the victims of fast moving cars on Broadway and Buena. In fact the entire community is outraged with the politicians and city agencies who have consistently refused the pleadings and demands of hundreds of parents for safe recreational playgrounds in this area. Public meetings, petitions, trips downtown and to the Alderman's office have all fallen on deaf ears or met with endless delays as large real estate interests and the downtown city planners have blocked the development of an acceptable safe play area for the youth. The safety of our children is the most important goal this community must work for . See article page 3 �Another Fire in Kenmore-Leland Area Jimenez calls for investigation The fires in our community are becoming more frequent leaving more families in danger for their lives, without their belongings, and without a stable place to live. Fire destroys building at 4645 N. Kenmore. One recent fire was on October 29, at 1: 20 a .m. in the 15 unit building at 4645 N. Kenmore. The flames shot thirty feet into the air as the building was evacuated . At the time of the fire only 8 units were occupied . Neighborhood residents informed Campaign workers that the entire third floor had been vacated, except one unit, supposedly to remodel it; but work was never started. The fire started on the third floor . On Sunday, November 3rd, the building burned a second time. Sheridan 'l'.' Shooting Raises Questions On Wednesday , October 23, between 4:30 and 5:00 p.m., William " Jugo" Rodriguez, 19, was critically shot by a plainclothes policeman just outside the Sheridan "L" station. Community people insist it was arson. They have seen this pattern before and have heard some people were offered money to set fire to the building. William Rodriguez is a young man from the area of Wilton and Grace. His understanding of English is minimal, and he could not understand police orders . According to reports given to laywers, the police came to the " L" station on a call to check a fight outside the station ; without a warning or identification, officers began shooting, wounding William immediately . They shot directly into the "L" station, through the glass, at rush hour-a grave potential danger to CT A passengers. In addition to the gun shot wound, William was dragged into the station and severely beaten, especially around the head. Mayor Daley's Urban Renewal programs have made it profitable for big landlords to burn their own buildings, collect insurance, and then sell the land to a large real estate developer. The landlord profits from the insurance money and the sale of the land. The real estate developers profit because they will build apartments where rents will be sky high. And the losers are the people who must move from bad buildings to worse buildings, from one unstable community to another unstable community. These changes in our communities happen without consideration for the people. In his call for support of the Community Zoning Board Ordinance now pending in the City Council, Mr. Jimenez states that to "end slums people must be allowed to plan their own communities." He . calls for stable communities with stable institutions and a community free of the deliberate arson that endangers the lives of our families. Mr. Jimenez has asked for a full-scale investigation into landlord arson in the Lakeview-Uptown area. The Campaign Legal Team has begun to move to make sure that justice is done in the case of William Rodriguez. Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez has emphasized that "crime can be controlled when police-community relations improve; the community needs policemen that respect us and that we can respect." 2000 Attend Unity Rally Nearly 2,000 people attended a UNITY RALLY Oct. 5th at the Palacio Theatre, 4040 N. Sheridan, to support a Community Zoning Board ordinance now before the City Council which would put decisions about what type of buildings are put in our area in the hands of community residents . The spirited crowd also pledged full support of the United Farm Workers Union boycott of head lettuce, grapes and Gallo wines. Speakers were Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez, Marcos Munoz, Ald. Dick Simpson, former Ald. Sammy Rayner, and Slim Coleman . After the rally they led an enthusiastic march that stretched for blocks to the National Supermarket demanding that they take the grapes and lettuce off their shelves. Congratulations to the hundreds of community people who worked many long, hard hours to build this successful demonstration of unity in our community . -2- �Le Moyne Parents Organize Successful Boycott As a result of the threatened cut back of 200 public school teachers and special programs around the city, many concerned parent groups and community organizations began to organize against this action of the Chicago Board of Education . The successful boycott forced the School Board to set up a meeting with parent representatives, which took place on Monday, November 4, 1974. During the picketing of Le Moyne School, Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez participated, giving full support to the parents. While parents picketed the School, many of their children attended the Young Lords' Emergency Alternative School set up in their own office at the request of the parents and staffed by certified teachers now working on the Campaign. Le Moyne Elementary School, 851 W. Waveland, was one of the schools most affected: four people on their staff were relieved of their duties. The Parent Council of Le Moyne wanted the Assistant Principal, one teacher, a teacher's aide, and a janitor to be reinstated. The Parent Group asked for a meeting with Superintendent Redmond on Wednesday, October 9, but were met by one of his assistants who failed to satisfy the parents with his answers. The community wants the four people back in Le Moyne School permanently. Education should be a priority in our community. The struggle of the parents of Le Moyne is to maintain and bring the necessary resources to our schools, and most definitely not to allow any of the too few existing resources to be lost to our children. In a meeting attended by 300, the parents agreed to boycott classes until a positive response came from downtown. The boycott was set for October 14 and continued to the end of the week . The first day of the boycott 75 of the 1,200 students attended regular school. Slumlord Brutality on Sunnyside and Magnolia Complaints were voiced to Campaign workers and legal charges were filed against William Strickland, owner of the building on 1251 W. Sunnyside, accusing him of "assault with intent to do bodily harm." The victim of this assault was 11 year old Freddie Stone Jr. who lives in the Sunnyside building with his family and who suffered arm and back injuries. him out of the bedroom . Donna also observed a gun under the arm of Strickland, who then proceeded to threaten to shoot Freddy's father if he saw him on the street. Freddy Jr. was taken to a hospital after he began getting sharp pains in his lower back and was unable to stand up straight and walk freely. Weiss Hospital prescribed pain pills, massages, and bed rest but there was no improvement in Freddy's condition. He was then taken to Columbus Hospital where-he was admitted and remained until the next Friday. A warrant was issued for the arrest of William Strickland. In addition, Cha-Cha Jimenez has asked the Campaign Legal Team to contact the Special Prosecutor of the State Attorney's office to investigate this case of big landlord brutality. The incident occured on Sunday, October 20, between 5:30 and 6:00 p.m., while Freddie Stone Sr. moved his belongings to 4438 N. Racine. Donna, Freddie Jr.'s sister, witnessed the aggressive entrance into the apartment by four men: Strickland, Harold Riffe, Strickland's son, and another man. She saw how William Strickland twisted little Freddy's arm clear behind his back while pushing t t t t t t t The purpose of this newsletter is to help inform the community of events and issues that affect us all. We urge you to contribute information and ideas . The Campaign to Elect Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez Alderman of the 46th Ward has been growing rapidly and moving forward. Everyone in this community is encouraged to volunteer their time, energy, ideas, and skills to this grass roots campaign. Contact the Campaign Information Centers to help or for more information : 935 W. Grace St . 549-9457 1056 W. Lawrence Ave . 275-4778 1046 W. Wilson Ave.-Suite 202 334-3534 --labor donated -3- We look forward to seeing you soon. t t I I I t t � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1974-11-no1_New-Day Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974-11 Title A name given to the resource New Day newsletter, No. 1 Description An account of the resource New Day was a newsletter produced by José "Cha-Cha" Jiménez during his campaign for Alderman 46th Ward, Chicago. Issue number 1, in English. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/780b1189ab5104aa038a82bd62810b31.pdf 07b8a078b3ed8dd09faa9158384a12ac PDF Text Text 0. 1 ENEZ POR ALDERMA iResultado del Boycott 2 Ninos Muertos, de Le Moyne! 3 Heridos en la Broadway y la Buena El Sabado, Noviembre 2, dos mucbacbos fueron muertos en un accidente tragico que dejo a otros tres nifios seriamente beridos. Los nii'ios muertos fueron Adrian Espada, 13 ai'ios, y Miguel Jimenes 12, ambos de Gordon Terrace. Varios jovenes estaba sentados sobre las gradas de la esquina del edificio en la Broadway y la Buena cerca a las 7: 30 en la nocbe cuando un taxi Yellow Cab cboco contra otro auto, y perdiendo el control cboc6 contra la curba y subio sobre las gradas de! edificio basta la misma entrada . Pilares sueltos cayeron del edificio sobre los mucbacbos que y estaban beridos, matando a dos. Los corazones de la comunidad se ban unido para crear un fondo para ayudar a los familiares de los mucbacbos, la mayoria de los cuales es tan bajo el welfare y no estan capacitados para pagar los grandes gastos como resultado de! accidente . Estos no son los primeros ninos que ban sido victimas de carros que corren muy rapido sobre la Broadway y Buena . Como un becbo la comunidad entera esta disgutada con los politicos y las agencias de la cuidad quines ban constantemente recbazado los ruegos y las solicitudes de cienes de padres de familia , por lugares de recreacion que esten protegidos en esta area. Reuniones publicas, peticiones, viajes al centro y a las oficinas de! Alderman ban caido en o{dos sordos o encontrado atrasos sin fin mientras los intereses de las companias de real estate (bienes raices) y los planificadores del centro de la ciudad ban bloqueado los desarrollos de un lugar acceptable para juegos protegidos en el area para la juventud. La seguridad de nuestros bijos es el go! mas importante por la que esta comunidad debe trabajar . Vea el articulo en la pagina 3 �Otro lncendio en la Kenmore y Leland Jimenez llamo para investigaciones Los incendios en nuestras comunidades estan siendo mas frecuentes, dejando mas familias sin SUS pertenencias y sin un lugar estable para vivir. El pasado 29 de Octubre a la 1 :20 de la madrugada se registro un incendio en el edificio de 15 unidades en 4645 Norte de la Kenmore. A la hora del incendio solo habia 8 unidades ocupados. Residentes del barrio le comunicaron a los trabajadores de la campana que todo el tercer piso se habia desocupado, salvo una unidad, con el proposito de remodelar los apartamientos ; aunque el trabajo nunca fue comenzado. William Rodriguez Balacera en la "L' Sheridan Crea Preguntas Personas de la comunidad insisten que el fuego fue causado a proposito. Ellos han visto el mismo patron antes y ademas han oido que se les ofrecio dinero a algunas personas para que quemaran el edificio. El Miercoles, 23 de Octubre, entre las 4: 30 y 5: 00 de la tarde, , William "Jugo" Rodriguez de 19 aiios, fuJ criticamente herido de balazos por un polida sin tiniforme al frente de la estaci6n del "elevado" en la calle Sheridan. El Programa de Alcalda Daley <Renovacion Urbana) en nuestra comunidad ha hecho posible que los grandes duenos de edificios obtengan ganancias al quemar sus edificios. Por un lado reciben el dinero de la aceguaranza, por el otro pueden vender sus lotes a las grandes agencias de Biences y Raices. Bienes y Raices, edificos grandes, apartamientos con rentas demasiado altas, todos ganan menos la gente que se tiene que mudarse de un edificio malo a un edificio peor; de una comunidad inestable a otra comunidad inestable. William Rodriquez es un joven del area de la Wilton y Grace. Su estendimiento del ingl~s es mfnimo y le ha traido problemas con la policfa al no entender sus ordenes. De acuerdo a la informaci&n dada a los lisenseados, la polida acudi& a la estaci6n para investigar una pelea; la polida, sin identificarse y sin sobreaviso dispar& hiriendo de esa forma a William. Adem.1s de la herida de bala, William fu~ arrastrado dentro de la estaci6n y golpeado. En su llamado para apoyar los consejos de Planeamiento Comunitarios, el Senor Jimenez ha dicho que para "terminar con los arrabales" la gente se le debe "permitir planificar sus propias comunidades." El pide una comunidad con instituciones es tables ; una comunidad libre de fuegos provocados que ponen en peligro a nuestros familias. El Equipo Legal de La Campana se ha movilizado para asegurarse que se hace justicia en el case de William Rodriguez. Jos~ Cha-Cha JimJnez ha enfatizado la necesidad de controlar el crimen en nuestro barrio y ha dicho "el crimen se puede controlar cuando las relaciones de la comunidad y la policfa mejoren. La comunidad necesita policias que nos respeten y que a la vez podamos respetar." El Senor Jimenez ha pedido una investigacion del los fuegos provocados por los grandes duenos de edificias. 2000 Atendieron Reunion de Unidad Cerca a 2,000 personas asistieron a la REUNION DE UNIDAD en Oct. 5 en el Teatro Palacio, 4040 N. Sheridan para dar su apoyo al Community Zoning Board, una ordenanza que esta ahora frente al Consejo de la Ciudad el cual va decidir sobre que tipo de edificios seran puestos in nuestra area, en las manos de los residentes de la comunidad. La muchedumbre alentada tambien comprometi6 todo su apoyo a los trabajadores del United Farm Workers en el boycoteo de la lechuga, uvas y vinos Gallo. Los parlamentarios fueron JosJ Cha-Cha Jim~nez. Marcos Muf'ioz, Aid. Dick Simpson, el ex-Aid. Sammy Rayner y Slim Coleman. Despues de la reuni6n ellos dirigieron una marcha alentadora que se extendfa de la cuadras del supermercado National demandando que ellos tomen las uvas y las lechugas fuera de sus estantes de venta. Felicitaciones a los cientos de personas de la comunidad que trabajaron entre muchos por largas y pesadas horas para organizar esta demostraci&n de gran Jxito de unidad en nuestra comunidad. -2- �Boycoteo de Padres de Le Moyne Como resultado de! ceze de maestros v el corte de programas especiales en las escuelas · pJblicas de Chicago, un gran numero de padres y organizaciones comunales comenzar6n a organizar para protestar en contra de las acciones tomadas por la Junto de Educaci6n. primer dia de! boycot solo 75 alumnos asistieron a la escuela regular de un total de 1,200 estudiantes. El exito de! boycot forz6 a la Junta a preparar una reunion con representantes de la Junta y miembros de! Concilio de Le Moyne y se llevaro a cabo el dfa Lunes 4 de Noviembre de 1974. La escuela elemental Le Moyne fue una de las muchas afectadas ; CUatro personas fueron reJevadas de SUS cargos. El Concilio de Padres en Le Moyne quiere que la Asistente a Directora , una maestra , una ayudante de maestra y una afanadora sean vueltas a sus trabajos . El grupo de padres pidi6 una reuni6n con el Superintendente Redmond el Miercoles 9 de Octubre, pero fuer6n atendidos por uno de sus asistentes quien no pudo satisfacer al grupo con sus respuestas . Durante la protesta frente a la escuela hizo acto de presencia Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez quien apoyaba a los padres en su lucha. Mientras los padres protestaban sus hijos atendier6n la Escuela de Emergencia Alternativa de los Young Lords, en sus propias oficinas, alli tubier6n maestros certificados que ahora es tan trabajando con la Campana . En una reuni6n atendia por 300 padres, se decidio a boycotear las clases hasta que se recibiera una respuesta positiva de el centro. El boycot fue organizado para el 14 de Octubre y se continu6 hasta el fin de semana . El La comunidad quiere a las cuatro personas en sus trabajos permanentes. La educaci6n debe ser una prioridad en nuestros barrios . La lucha del Concilio en Le ivroyne es para mantener y traer los recursos necesitados a nuestras escuelas, pero non para perderlos. Caso de Brutalidad en la Sunnyside y Magnolia Los trabajadores en nuestra Campafia recibieron quejas y se hacieron cargos legales en contra de William Strickland, duei'io del edificio localizado en el 1251 Oeste de Sunnyside, acusandosele de "asalto con intensi6n de hacer dai'ros corporales ." La vfctima de este asalto fue Freddy Stone Jr. de 11 afios de edad, quien recibi6 heridas en un brazo y espalda, y reside en ese direccion con su familia. El incidente ocurrio el domingo 20 de Octubre, entre las 5: 30 y 6: 00 de la tarde, mientras el padre de Freddie, Freddie Stone Sr. mudaba sus pertenencias al 4438 Norte Racine. Donna, hermana mayor de Freddie, fue testigo de la entrada agresiva de cuatro hombres al apartamiento; entre ellos estaba William Strickland, su hijo y dos individios m~s. Ella vi6 como Strickland sacudi6 a su hermano menor y como le torcia su brazo a la vez que lo sacaba del dormitorio a empujones . Donna pudo ob- servar un revolver· bajo el brazo de Strickland, quien amenazo de balear al padre si lo veja en la calle. Freddy Jr. fue llevado al hospital cuando empez6 a quejarse de fuertes dolores de espalda y de no poder caminar libremente. El Hospital Weiss le recet6 pastillas para el dolor, masajes y descanso en cama pero no hubo ningun resultado. El padre le llevo en seguida al hospital Colombus donde fu~ admitido y permanecio hasta el viernes siguiente. Una orden de arresto foi expedida en contra de William Strickland. A la vez Cha-Cha Jimenez le ha pedido al Equipo Legal de la Campana que se comunique con el procurador especial del Estado para que investigara el caso de la brutalidad de los grandes dueYios de edificios en contra de los inquilinos. ••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••• I • I I II • •. I • : El proposito de esta carta de noticias es el de ayudar a informar a la comunidad sobre sucesos y problemas que nos afectan.1 a todos. Le pedimos q:;e contribuya con informacion e ideas . La campa11a para elegir Jose Cha-Cha Jim~nez como Alderman del 46th Ward ha estado creciendo rapidamente y moviendo hacia adelante. A cada uno en la comunidad se le solicita a ofrecerse como voluntarios, dar su tiempo, energfa, ideas y su habilidad para esta clase de campa?'la de las bases. Pongase en contacto con el Centro de lnformacion de Campana, para ayudar o para recibir mas intormacion. 935 W. Grace St. 549-9457 '.•• 1056 W. Lawrence Ave. 275-4778 ;•• 1046 W. Wilson Ave. 334-9556 trabajo fue donado •. I I • Esperamos verlo pronto. I I• ••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••• � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1974-11-no1_Nuevo-Dia Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974-11 Title A name given to the resource Nuevo Dia noticiero, No. 1 Description An account of the resource Nuevo Dia was a newsletter produced by José "Cha-Cha" Jiménez during his campaign for Alderman 46th Ward, Chicago. Issue number 1, in Spanish. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource spa Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/3e6335bd2489ea0e1210b00f41c80485.pdf 9b8488bfac7870ee074d6a049f41b789 PDF Text Text Jimenez Calls For Housing Action! "Jose Jimenez puts forth recommendations for safer, healthier housing and citizen participation in decision making." Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez testified and presented specific recommendations to the State's Spanish Speaking Peoples Study Commission, Saturday, November 16, at the Illinois Masonic Hospital auditorium . ~ Mr. Jimenez called for careful monitoring of millions of dollars coming into the city under the new Federal Housing and Community Development Act. He pointed out the city 's past practice of relocating slums instead of rehabilitating them and strongly · recommended full citizen participation in the planning of how the money will be spent. The candidate for alderman of the 46th Ward also outlined a new City Council ordinance which would require that landlords place security deposits with the city to be used for emergency repairs of serious health and safety hazards in their own buildings if the landlord fails to make the repairs on his own. Under this ordinance a landlord would deposit $100.00 per unit with the city with a maximum limit of $20,000 per owner. Landlorgs would receive interest on their deposits. "This," Jimenez said, "will help eliminate health and safety hazards in apartment buildings which the city is all too often powerless to correct. " Jimenez urged the Commission to devise comparable legislation at the state level. .. " We desperately need and want stable communities ," concluded Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez. Be Informed! Take Action! 43.8 Million Dollars in Federal Housing and Community Development Act funds are coming into Chicago in 1975. How will the city spend this money'? 1. 2. These funds can be used for stabilizing our neighborhoods, providing more low and moderate income housing, and improving existing housing. 3. Citizens can have a real voice in deciding how these funds are spent. BUT THIS WILL HAPPEN ONLY if citizens are well informed about this program, demand real citizen control, and elect representatives to the City Council who will keep them informed and take action to see that this and other money is used for people not for big real estate interests. �The Way We Live. • • 919-21/ 925-27 W. Buena 4153-55/ 4157-59 N. Sheridan Concern for the health and safety of tenants in this building is non-existent. Tenants remained without gas from Sept. 30 to Oct. 30, without electricity for 2 days; and the landlord continued to collect rent. Although tenants were forced to live in inhuman conditions, tenants received a letter demanding payment of rent in full on Nov. 14, and the following day were served eviction notices. This ·building is nearly empty now. Where did the people go? According to Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez, "Just last year, in 1973, twice as many housing units were destroyed as were built here in the city of Chicago. And many of those new units were luxury apartments. Where is the low and moderate income housing?" On March 14, 1974, 50 housing code violations were cited on these buildings. In Sept. 1974, a judge ordered demolition. Tenants were not given formal notice. In the mean time the buildings deteriorated from April to November due to the negligence of the landlord who was ordered by the court lo maintain utilities and upkeep of the buildings until they were vacated. At the request of several people, criminal housing prosecution was initialed by the Stales Attorney's Office citing the gross neglect and criminality of Mr. Schwartz in regards to the property at Buena Sheridan. Charges were quietly dropped because he was able to prove he had spent a great deal of money to improve and maintain the buildings in the past. Who is responsible for the fact that the tenants lived in a complex of buildings with 50 serious code violations for nearly a year? ~Jose Jimenez to Introduce New Housing Law .JOSE JIMENEZ TO INTRODUCE NEW LAW TO PROTECT TENANTS 4. If the landlord could not be found or if the landlord did not quickly correct the safely hazard, the city would use the landlord's security deposit to fix it. How this law would work: What this law would accomplish: Each landlord would deposit with the city $100 for every apartment to be rented out-not including his own apartment. Top limit for any rme owner would be $20,000. This money is a landlord security deposit. 2. The city would put the money in a bank so it would . draw interest. At the end of the year this interest would be given to the owner< less a small handling fee). :1. If an emergency health or safety hazard existed in a building, a special city team would inspect it quickly and notify the landlord. 1. I. Serious safety and health violations could be corrected quickly to protect tenants and the general public. Now the city can not see that this is done in many cases. 2. This is a way to help preserve housing. Many buildings 1, could be kept from deteriorating so badly that they have to be condemned and torn down. ~ We need this and many more creative programs to help" stabilize and develop our communities. �Arson Continues -- 2 Seniors Killed SHERIDAN PLAZA HOTEL FIRE Arson cases continue in our communities. The lives of two senior citizens were taken by the fire in the Sheridan Plaza Hotel early Sunday, November 17, and another elderly man was reported seriously injured in the blaze. Campaign workers on the scene reported that the fire had started on the 10th floor where the two women were found burned to death. However, arson is suspected since two other fires started at about the same time on the 7th and 4th floors. The Sheridan Plaza is said to be in receivership and even before the fire tenants were asked to vacate the building by November 30. In a brief interview with Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez, he bitterly said "This is a clear example of the systematic destruction of our neighborhoods. It is also an example of the need to hold landlords responsible for the safety and health of the tenants through a security deposit they would place with the city to be used for the maintenance of their buildings." At the time of the fire 40 units out of 400 were reported occupied. Under the proposed security deposit, Jimenez said, the owner of the Sheridan Plaza would have had $20,000 on deposit with the city which could have been used to make many repairs and possibly avoided the needless loss of two lives. He asked that this case be added to the other arson investigations by the campaign legal team. Campaign Notes Who we are ... The campaign to elect Jose Cha-Cha We need each other ... This campaign needs the Jimenez alderman of the 46th ward is a campaign of volunteers. We are from all parts of our ward. We're young, older (and in between); Black, white, and Latino; some who have never participated in an election and some who are experienced campaign workers. We are committed because we want to see our community thrive, and we want a principled, independent person who will serve and work with all parts of our community and provide active leadership as our representative on the City Council. We're happy to report that the number of volunteers is growing by leaps and bounds. active participation of every concerned citizen in our ward. Your ideas, skills and time can make a significant difference in the future of our area. In a word, this community needs commitment to do whatever you can to organize and inform the people of this ward and to elect Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez alderman of the 46th on February 25th. What we're doing ... We're busy going door-to-door talking about the issues of this campaign and getting people's views on community problems and suggestions for solutions ... We're distributing this regular newsletter to provide news and information ... We're holding lots of home meetings so people can meet Cha-Cha and discuss issues of concern with him and with each other ... We're selling campaign buttons at a fast clip ... We're stuffing envelopes, making calls, listening, talking .. . working hard at a hundrt!d tasks. 935 W. Grace St. 549-9457 1056 W. Lawrence Ave. 275-4778 1046 W. Wilson Ave.-Suite 202 334-3545 I --- Contact the Campaign Information Centers to help or for more information: : --- We look forward to seeing you soon. labor donated . 3. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1974-11-no2_New-Day Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974-11 Title A name given to the resource New Day newsletter, No. 2 Description An account of the resource New Day was a newsletter produced by José "Cha-Cha" Jiménez during his campaign for Alderman 46th Ward, Chicago. Issue number 2, in English. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/232a04fdfba435c4a8383dc5f763164a.pdf c66419225a14b74aad9548398a074e80 PDF Text Text Jimenez Hace un Llamado para Accion en Cuanto a Vivienda Jose Jimenez hace recomendaciones para seguridad, viviendas habitables y la participacion de los ciudadanos en cuanto a deciciones a llevarse a cabo. Jose Cha Cha Jimenez testifico y presento recomendaciones especificas a la Comision de Estudio de la Gente de .Habla Hispana del Estado, este sabado, noviembre 16 en el auditorio de el Hospital Masonico de Illinois. El Sr. Jimenez pidi6 un cmdados de los millones de dolares que otorgaran a la ciudad por medio del Acto Federal de Viviendad y Desarrollo Comunal. Sefial6 a la practica del pasado en que la ciudad realocaba los arrabales en lugar of rehabilitarlos ; y asf recomend6 energicamente las plena participacion del ciudadano en el planeamiento de! gasto de dichos fondos. El candidato a Consejal de! Ward 46 tambien delini6 una nueva ley municipal la cual requirfra que todo duefio de grandes edificios hiciera un deposito de seguridad con la· ciudad para usarse como fondo de emergencia para reparar fallas de seguridad y salud en sus propios edificios si no actuan por si solos. Bajo dicha le)' municipal cada duefio de grandes edificios depositana $100 por cada unidad con un lfmite maximo de $20,000 por duefio. "Esto-agreg6 Jimenez-ayudarfa a eliminar los peligros de seguridad y salud en los edificios de apartamientos en los que la ciudad no puede actuar para corregir." Jimenez ins to a la Comision a desarrollar legislacion parecida al nivel estatal... "Necesitamos y queremos deseperadamente comunidades estables" concluy6 Jose Jimenez. i Inform ante! jloma Accion ! 1. $43,800,000 provenientes de la Ley Federal de Habitaci6n y Desarrollo de la Communidad seran otorgados a la ciudad de Chicago en 1975. i,Como se utilizaran estos fondos? 2. Posiblemente se utilizaran para fortalecer nuestra comunidades, construir habitaciones nuevas al alcance de nuestros sueldos, y mejorar las viviendas existentes. 3. Posiblemente la ciudadania tendra una voz en las decisiones que se tomaran para gastar este dinero. PERO EST AS POSIBILIDADES SERAN REALIDAD UNICAMENTE SI: La ciudadania esta adecuadamente informada acerca de este programa, demanda y ejerce control popular, y elige representantes al Consejo Municipal que informaran al electorado y lucharan para que estos fondos sean utilizados para la gente, y no para los intereses do los especuladores y las conpaftias de bienes raices que construyen rascacielos de lujo junto al Iago. �El Modo en que Vivimos. • • 919-21 I 925-27 W. Buena 4153-55/ 4157-59 N. Sheridan 4032-34 Kenmore En marzo 14 de 1974 se encontraron 50 violaciones en estos edificios. En septiembre del mismo afi.o un juez orden6 la demolici6n de los edificios. Los inquilinos nb recibieron notificacion formal. A la vez, entre abril y noviembre, los edificios se dilapidaba a cause del descuido del duefio, quien fue ordenado por la corte que mantubiera los servicios y cuidado hasta que fuera desocupado. Varias personas de la comunidad pidieron que se iniciara el pr,oceso criminal por medio de la oficina de procurados del Estado acusando a Sr. Schwartz de negligencia y criminalidad por su comp·ortamiento en cuanto de estos edificios. Los cargos fueron retirados silenciosamente despties que pudo probar que habfa gastado grandes cantidades de dinero para mejorar y mantener los edificios. tQuien · es responsable de que los inquilinos vivan en estos edificios con 50 yiolaciones por casi un afio? La seguridad y salud en este edificio no existen. Los inquilinos permanecieron sin gas desde septiembre 30 a octubre 10; sin electricidad por 2 dfas y el duefio continu6 cobrando renta. A pesar que los inquilinos fueron forzados a vivir en condiciones infra humanas, se les demando que pagaran su alquilar total para noviembre 14, y ademas el dfa siguiente recibieron orden de de3alojar el edificio. Este edificio esta casitodo vacio. lA donde se fue la gente? De acuerdo a Cha Cha Jimenez "Solo el afio pasado, 1973, el numero de casas destruidas fue el doble de los que se edificaron en la ciudad de Chicago. Y muchas de estas unidades fueron apartamientos de lujo. 1,p6nde estan las viviendas para familias de bajos y moderados recursos? Jose Jimenez Introduce una Nueva Ley de Vivienda JOSE JIMENEZ PRESENT ARA NUEV A LEY PARA PROTEGER INQUILINOS razonable, la ciudad hara las reparaciones necessarias, ' pagandolas con el deposito de seguridad del propietario. MODO DE OPERACION DE EST A LEY: EFECTOS DE ESTA LEY: ) , 1. Cada propietario de edificios 1 de apartamientos depositara $100. con la cuidad por cada apartamiento alquilado (sin incluir su propio apartamiento). Lfmite de S20,000 por propietario. Esta dinero serfa un dep6sito de seguridad del propietario. 2. La cuidad colocara este dinero en bancos donde recibiria interes. Cada afio, el interes sera devuelto al propietario (menos costos de administraci6n). 3. Donde existan condiciones peligrosas o insalubres, inspectores de la ciudad verificaran las condiciones y notificaran al propietario. 4. En caso que el propietario no pueda ser localizado, o se niege a corregir la situaci6n dentro de un plazo 1. Violaciones del codigo de salubridad y construcci6n serfan corregidas rapidamente, asf protegiendo a inquilinos y el publico en general. 2. Las viviendas existentes serfan proservadas mas eficazmente. Hoy en dfa muchos edificios, por falta de mantenimiento o negligencia del propietario, se deterioran tan rapidamente que tienen que ser tumbados. PROGRAMAS Y LEYES COMO ESTA SON NECESARIOS PARA FORTALECER Y DESARROLLAR NUESTRA COMUNIDAD . . 2. �Arson Continua -Dos Persona de Edad Avanzada Muertos Los siniestros incendios continuan en nuestras comunidades. El incendio en el Hotel Sheridan Plaza cobr6 la vida de dos ancianas y dejo seriamente herido a otro. Los trabajadores de la Campana presentes durante el fuego reportaron que el incendio comenz6 en el decimo piso en donde se encontraron los cadaveres de las dos ancianas. Sin embargo se cree que el fuego fue ocasionado por manos criminales ya que a la vez se descubrieron fuegos simultaneos en el cuarto y septimo pisos. Se dice que el Hotel esta en el proceso de ser entregado a una agencia responsable para su mantenimiento ya los inquilinos se les habfa pedido que desocuparan sus apartamientos para noviembre 30. En una breve entrevista a Jose Cha Cha Jimenez amargadamente se expreso diciendo "Este es un claro ejemplo de la destruccion sistematica de nuestros barrios. Y es tambien un ejemplo de la necesidad de responsabilizar a los duefios de grandes edificios de la seguridad y la salud de todo inquilino por medio de un deposito de seguridad con la ciudad, que se usarfa para el mantenimiento de sus propios edificios." Cuando se registro el incendio 40 de 400 unidades estaban ocupadas. "Bajo el propuesto deposito de seguridad, dijo Jimenez, el dueiio del Sheridan Plaza debio haber tenido $20,000 en fondo para haber evitado la perdida de dos vidas". El pidio que este caso tambien se anada a los otros casos que el equipo legal de la Campafia ya investiga. ~atos"de C~mp":iiia.. ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ "" - - - - - - -r, •• Cha y pueda discutir con el. Vendemos botones a todo el mundo (se venden tan rapido que amenudo hay carestias.) Trabajamos en la oficina (preparando anuncios y folletos para el correo, hablando por telefono, contestando preguntas ... ). En fin, un sin mimero de tareas. 2Que necesitamos? La participaci6n activa de todo ciudadano responsable de la comunidad. Tus ideas, habilidades y tiempo pueden contribufr a determinar el futuro de este barrio. La campafia necesita de ti, en cualquier forma que ayude a organizar e informar a la gente de esta comunidad para elegir a Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez representante municipal del distrito 46. i. Quienes somos? La campafia para elegir a Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez representante · municipal del distrito 46 esta compuesta totalmente de voluntarios. Vivimos en todas partes del distrito; somos j6venes y ancianos; hombres y mujeres; Latinos, Negros y Americanos. Algunos somos nuevos al proveso electoral, otros somos veteranos de muchas campafias y ·1uchas electorales. Nos hemos comprometido a esta campafia porque queremos ver nuestra comunidad florecer, y queremos como representante a una persona honesta, fntegra e independiente que trabajara y servira con todas las agrupaciones de la comunidad. Necesitamos un representante que desempefie un papel decisivo en el Consejo Municipal. Nuestros m1meros crecen diariamente, y mas y mas voluntarios se ban metido en la campafia. --- 935 W. Grace St. 549-9457 1056 W. Lawrence Ave. 275-4778 1046 W. Wilson Ave. 334-3545 . J. --- Esperamos verlo pronto. trabajo fue - -- -- ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ d~ Pongase en contacto con el Centro de lnformacion de Campai'la, para ayudar o para recibir mas informacion. lQue hacemos? Todos los dfas vamos de puerta en puerta, discutiendo los temas de la campafia y escuchando a la gente, sus opiniones sobre los problemas de la comunidad y sus sugestiones para mejorarla. Distribuimos nuestro periodico semanal con noticias e informaci6n. Muy frecuentemente nos reunimos en hogares en pequefios grupos para que la gente conozca a Cha- ~ -,c--:::)1,c--:::)I � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1974-11-no2_Nuevo-Dia Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974-11 Title A name given to the resource Nuevo Dia noticiero, No. 2 Description An account of the resource Nuevo Dia was a newsletter produced by José "Cha-Cha" Jiménez during his campaign for Alderman 46th Ward, Chicago. Issue number 2, in Spanish. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource spa Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/923de2c1815832d508789e13fc665fbe.pdf 58d00401d988a79cc4605244e1edf95f PDF Text Text · ._,se alilJlmctti 11 4SW =CMG tU!,~~!!!!! 8,oadway, Chi<ago, Ill. 60657 (J12, 4n.mo February 18, 1975 Dear Latino Voter, In June of 1974 I, Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez, declared myself a candidate for Alderman in this ward. That was a very important decision. Not only because there has never been a Latino elected to the City Council or to the capitol in Springfield, Ill., but also because for the first time someone was finally bringing out the issues that affect all residents of this area -- especially the Latinos. I was born in the country part of Caguas, Puerto Rico and came to the U.S. when I was two. We settled around Clark St. and Chicago Ave. (La Clark.) Before I reached the eighth grade, I -- and many other families -- were moved 9 times by Urban Renewal. We moved from slum to slum, because we were poor. Because I was young and there were many gangs, I too joined a street gang. However, because my mother taught catechism classes in her own home in the slum, and because she was very religious, she aided me in quitting the gang at the early age of 18 years old. This was also around the time of the large Democratic Convention in '68 and after the death of Dr. Martin Luther King. I decided I would start an organization to help Poor People -- especially Latinos. I started the Concerned Puerto Rican Youth, then, the Puerto Rican Progressive Movement, and later I reorganized the street gang I had been a member of into a Political Organization fighting for Civil Rights. We set up a "Free Breakfast for Children Program", a Free Health Clinic, a Free Day Care Center, a Cultural Program, a Free Clothing Program, and a Free People's Law Office with 10 lawyers to help the community. Because housing was the main reason we got involved, we negotiated many times for low-income housing. For example, we negotiated $600,000 for low-income housing before we were finally pushed out again by Urban Renewal. From "La Clark" they pushed many of us up here to Lakview and Uptown. Each time they made us promises for better housing, schools, jobs, etc., etc., but never kept them. This is why I am running for Alderman. I don't want Latinos and other Poor People to be pushed around anymore. The present Alderman is part of the same group of people that has been pushing us around. He cl.aims that he has built recreation centers, schools, and even a library. When I talked with officials from the library and the recreation centers, they informed me that the present Alderman never helped them but only came to their Open House. And you yourself know that in our area, no schools that will benefit us have been constructed. EL AMANECER DE UN NUEVO DIA THE DAWNING OF A NEW DAY �So far since June my campaign has registered over 5,000 persons to vote, and the preBent Alderman won with only 7,000 votes in the last election. We've also helped over 4,000 families with our legal, welfare, medical and emergency food programs. At Christmas we gave food and toys to over 2,000 families. My campaign is also the only campaign that has come out with the issues. The other campaigns have only spread rumours and slung "mud" at us. We stated we will fight to help small landlords and force the big landlords to fix up their buildings. We will fight for important decisions to be made at the community level, so that we the People can have a voice. We will do anything we can to help the little man. We have a good campaign and for the first time it really looks like a Latino can win. However, WE NEED YOUR SUPPORT. I've aiways said that "individuals don't make change -- only. the People united can make change." This is a non-partisan election; so it doesn't make a difference whether you are Republican or a Democrat. Either way -- you can still vote for me. Vote for whomever you want for Mayor. But remember -- Democrat or Republican -- we are first Latinos and for Alderman VOTE FOR JOSE CHA-CHA JilIENEZ. Sincerely, h Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1975-02-18_en-aldermanic-campaign-ltr Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1975-02-18 Title A name given to the resource José Cha-Cha Jiménez Campaign Letter Description An account of the resource Letter to Latino Voters about José Cha-Cha Jiménez's campaign for 46th Ward Alderman, in English. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/6dc9361a7267c202e205e7010fe8af6b.pdf 4a8ab3a35d2bd124677a2095f2165338 PDF Text Text el 18 de Febrero, 1975 Estimado Votante Latino, En junio de 1974 yo, Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez, declare mi candidac{a por Alderman de este ward. Esta fue una decision muy importante, no solo porque nunca se ha electo un Latino al City Council o a la legislatura en Springfield, pero tambien porque par primera vez uno de nosotros tratara de resolver los problemas que afectan a todos los residentes de esta area, especialmente a los Latinos. Yo nae{ en las afueras de Caguas, P.R., y vine a los EEUU cuando tenia dos a~os. Primera vivimos cerca de la Clark y Chicago Ave. Antes de llegar al . octavo grado •mi familia se hab{a tenido que mudar ya nueve veces, por culpa de "Urban Renewal''. Nos teniamos que mudar de un barrio pobre a otro. Como era joven y habian muchas gangas, yo tambien tuve que entrar en una. Pero mi madre daba clases de catecismo en nuestra sala, pues era muy religiosa. Me influyo lo suficiente para que dejara la ganga, cuando tenia 18 a~os. Esto ocurrio durante la Convencion Dem6crata aqui en 1968, y despues de la muerte del Dr. Martin Luther King. Decid{ entonces comenzar una organizaci6n para ayudar a personas pobres, especialmente a Latinos. Hae! naci6 The Concerned Puerto Rican Youth; despues The Puerto Rican Progressive Movement. Aun mas tarde re-organize la ganga a la cual hab!a pertenecido y la converti en una organizaci6n pol{tica para luchar par las derechos civiles de nosotros. Organizamos un programa de desayunos gratis para los ninos, una clinica gratis, un day care center gratis, programas culturaleb, ropa gratis y una oficina legal gratis con 10 abogados para servir a la comunidad. Mejores viviendas fue la razon principal de nuestro envolvimiento. Negociamos varias veces para proporcionar viviendas para personas de baja entrada econOmica. Por ejemplo, negociamos para que se asignaran $600,000 para viviendas para personas pobres, Pero al final tuvimos que mudarnos una vez mas. Nuestros planes conflijian con los de Urban Renewal. Desde la Clark nos hecharon a muchos de nosotros hasta aqu{ en Lakeview y Uptown, y cada vez con promesas de mejores apartamentos, escuelas, trabajos, etc., etc. Pero las promesas nunca fueron cumplidas. Par eso soy candidato para Alderman. Yo no quiere que se abuse mas de los Latinos y de otros pobres. El Alderman que tenemos ahora pertenece al mismo grupo de personas que nos han estado empujando por anos. El dice que ha construido escuelas y centros de recreo, y hasta una biblioteca. Cuando hable con las personas de la biblioteca y de los centros de recreo ellos me dijeron que nuestro Alderman nunca las ayudo, pero que s! vino al Open House! Y usted mismo sabe queen nuestra area nose ha construido ni una sola escuela para nuestros nii'ios. �Desde junio mi campana a registrado a mas de 5,000 nuevos votantes, y nuestro Alderman actual gan6 en las ultimas elecciones con solo 7,000 votos. Hemos ayudado a mas de 4,000 familias con nuestros programas medicos, legales, de welfare, y de comida para casos de emergencia. En Navidades repartimos comida y jugetes entre 2,000 familias. Mi campana a sido la unica que a traido a la luz los problemas reales. La campana de las otros candidatos solo a regado runores y nos han atacado maliciosamente. Lucharemos por ayudar al pequeno propietario, y forzaremos a las grandes propietarios que reparen sue edificios. Lucharemos par que decisiones importantes se hagan al nivel de la comunidad, par que el pueblo tenga una voz. Haremos todo lo posible por la persona de la calle. Tenemos una buena campana. Por primera vez luce que un Latino puede ganar. Pero NECESITAMOS TU AYUDA. Siempre he dicho que "individuos solos no producen el cambio -- que solo personas trabajando unidas producen cambios." Esta elecci6n n6 es partidaria. N6 importa si eres Dem6crata o Republicano, De una forma u otra puedes votar por m!. Tambien vota par quien quieras para alcalde. Pero recuerda -- Republicano o Democrata -- primero somos Latinos. VOTA POR JOSE CHA-CHA JIMENEZ PARA ALDERMAN. ~- !b-~n Sinceramente, Jose Cha-Cha Jimenez � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_1975-02-18_sp-aldermanic-campaign-ltr Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José "Cha-Cha" Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1975-02-18 Title A name given to the resource José Cha-Cha Jiménez Campaign Letter Description An account of the resource Letter to Latino Voters about José Cha-Cha Jiménez's campaign for 46th Ward Alderman, in Spanish. Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Young Lords (Organization) History Puerto Rican Civil rights Puerto Rican Social conditions Chicago (Ill.) Civil rights movements Community activists Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65) Relation A related resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park interviews Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource spa Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1970s https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0e67381514a680bbff71de5e4eb6115a.pdf 3a57be96d0ff015e74585f129963741c PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Juan Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 6/25/2012 Biography and Description Juan Jiménez is the younger brother of Antonio “Maloco” Jiménez and currently lives in Barrio San Salvador of Caguas, Puerto Rico, in the secluded road behind the tienda, or store, of the Trinidads. His home is newly built and sits on cement blocks like stilts, carved right into the hill but sitting halfway on air. It is difficult to turn your car around the dead end road as there are more hills to the other side. And he has a beautiful view of the center of San Salvador’s Monte Peluche, a tall, rocky mountain covered with vegetation. It is his section of paradise and what Mr. Jiménez worked for all his life when he lived in Chicago’s Lincoln Park neighborhood, on La Armitage. Mr. Jiménez is content, still raising his collegeaged daughter. His son is a proud Illinois State trooper. Mr. Jiménez was part of Council Number 9 of the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María at St. Teresa’s Church on Kenmore and Armitage. He played well and was a proud member of their softball team. It instilled character in the players, kept the community stable, and kept the youth away from hard drugs and off the streets. Each team had their own chanting cheerleaders, coaches, and managers. It was also good for small entrepreneurs who sold pasteles and pastelillos, rice and bean dinners, and T- shirts and flags and banners. The Catholic softball leagues provided the Puerto Rican version of the college town football game for the entire Puerto Rican family. It kept them united and parents knew at all times where they could find their children. It was a cost effective, after school fun that today would have eliminated the few existing after school programs. �And it was a true community program that did not have to be funded by the federal government or by city hall. But the leagues and the Caballeros and the Damas were being weakened and destroyed by discriminatory plans to “cleanse for profit” the lakefront and near downtown areas of Puerto Ricans, other minorities and the poor. And along with their displacement and destruction of neighborhood networks and the disenfranchisement of Puerto Rican and poor voters, breeding grounds for today’s super gangs were created. � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/df06c938618b52fad12039221f98d8b1.mp4 046695338093175c3a4cf9b0f6cf6b62 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Juan Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 1 Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Juan_1 Title A name given to the resource Juan Jiménez video interview and biography Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Juan Description An account of the resource Juan Jiménez is the younger brother of Antonio “Maloco” Jiménez and currently lives in Barrio San Salvador of Caguas, Puerto Rico, in the secluded road behind the tienda, or store, of the Trinidads. His home is newly built and sits on cement blocks like stilts, carved right into the hill but sitting halfway on air. It is difficult to turn your car around the dead end road as there are more hills to the other side. And he has a beautiful view of the center of San Salvador’s Monte Peluche, a tall, rocky mountain covered with vegetation. It is his section of paradise and what Mr. Jiménez worked for all his life when he lived in Chicago’s Lincoln Park neighborhood, on La Armitage. Mr. Jiménez is content, still raising his college-aged daughter. His son is a proud Illinois State trooper. Mr. Jiménez was part of Council Number 9 of the Caballeros de San Juan and Damas de María at St. Teresa’s Church on Kenmore and Armitage. He played well and was a proud member of their softball team. It instilled character in the players, kept the community stable, and kept the youth away from hard drugs and off the streets. Each team had their own chanting cheerleaders, coaches, and managers. It was also good for small entrepreneurs who sold pasteles and pastelillos, rice and bean dinners, and T- shirts and flags and banners. The Catholic softball leagues provided the Puerto Rican version of the college town football game for the entire Puerto Rican family. It kept them united and parents knew at all times where they could find their children. It was a cost effective, after school fun that today would have eliminated the few existing after school programs. And it was a true community program that did not have to be funded by the federal government or by city hall. But the leagues and the Caballeros and the Damas were being weakened and destroyed by discriminatory plans to “cleanse for profit” the lakefront and near downtown areas of Puerto Ricans, other minorities and the poor. And along with their displacement and destruction of neighborhood networks and the disenfranchisement of Puerto Rican and poor voters, breeding grounds for today’s super gangs were created. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Spanish language--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Language A language of the resource spa Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-06-25 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/638df8240d99be75a44efabfbef4a625.pdf e69277df19f11218272a11319045a496 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Juana “Jenny” Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 5/10/2012 Biography and Description English Juana “Jenny” Jiménez is one of José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez’s sisters. She was born while her father, Antonio, worked as a seasonal farm laborer, or tomatero, in the late 1940s for Andy Boy Farms at a migrant camp in Minot, Massachusetts near Concord. They picked vegetables primarily for the Campbell Soup Company. In 1951 the family moved to Chicago to be closer to other relatives who had been living in La Clark since the late 1940s. Jenny grew up in Lincoln Park and in Wicker Park. When she became pregnant, but was unmarried, she was placed temporarily in a juvenile home for girls run by Catholic nuns. It is there that Jenny developed her spirituality and she remains very active in her community to this day, including working on behalf of her husband’s baseball and bowling leagues and running a Boy Scout troop to support her own and other neighborhood children in Puerto Rico. She now lives in Camuy, Puerto Rico. Spanish Juana Jiménez es una hermana de José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Nació en Minot, Massachusetts cerca de Concord donde su padre trabajo como tomatero para Andy Boy Farms en 1940. Aquí recogieron vegetables para la compañía de Campbell Soup. En 1951 la familia se cambio a Chicago para acercarse �con familiares que vivían en La Clark. Juana creció en Lincoln Park Wicker Park. Cuando se embarazo, antes de tener esposo, la mandaron a una casa para mujeres jóvenes que era atendida por monjas Católicas. Aquí es donde ella desarrollo su espirituelidad y todavía sigue muy dedicada en su comunida igual que ayudando los equipos de Béisbol y boliche en que esta su esposo y corriendo el grupo de Boy Scout para sus hijos y los del vecindario. Ahora vive en Camuy, Puerto Rico. �Transcript JUANA JIMENEZ: I didn’t like that name, Cha-Cha. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, you don’t like Cha-Cha. All right, all right. No, that’s good. It was a good answer. Okay, (inaudible), ready? If you could tell me your name, your full name, and where you were born. JUANA JIMENEZ: Okay. My name is Juana Jiménez, and as my mom used to say, I was born in Boston in Massachusetts, but I wasn’t. I was born in Concord, Massachusetts. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. Does it say that on your birth certificate? JUANA JIMENEZ: It says that on my birth certificate. Says Concord, Massachusetts. JOSE JIMENEZ: ’Cause he also said that it was Minot, there was a place called Minot. But your birth certificate says Concord. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, my birth certificate says Concord, Massachusetts. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, and did she say anything else? Where you were born, what was it like or whatever? Or anything? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, she just said -- well, [00:01:00] they lived in like a farm place or something. JOSE JIMENEZ: Like a migrant farm? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. They went down from Puerto Rico to Massachusetts so they could work, and they could at least have some money, and have a better life than what they did have when they were living here. At that time, of course, here 1 �there was no roads, everything dust roads and things like that. So it was really pretty hard for them. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. So they were working like a migrant farm camp? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. JOSE JIMENEZ: And then you were born in the town of Concord? JUANA JIMENEZ: I was born. She said from that town, I guess the owner of the farm or something, they took her to the hospital, and then -- they took her over there, and they kept thinking that the owner of the farm was [00:02:00] the father. Instead of my dad being my father, it would be the boss’s. But that’s because he paid for everything, but it wasn’t true. They fixed that right away. JOSE JIMENEZ: He paid for the insurance? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, he paid for everything. JOSE JIMENEZ: Did they say who the owner of the farm was? JUANA JIMENEZ: I really can’t remember the name. [Dowdry?], or -JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, [Dowry?]. JUANA JIMENEZ: Dowry, something like that. That’s what she says. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, yeah. I’ve heard that name before. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. Well, something like that. So I really don’t know. I always tell everybody the only thing I remember from Massachusetts is the blanket. I was underneath it, (laughs) and then we went down to Chicago because I don’t remember anything. I don’t know, I was just a baby. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you were born -- what year was that, again? JUANA JIMENEZ: Nineteen fifty-one. 2 �JOSE JIMENEZ: So 1951 she was in Concord, Massachusetts. JUANA JIMENEZ: In Concord, Massachusetts. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so after that, then they moved to Chicago? JUANA JIMENEZ: After that, they moved to Chicago, [00:03:00] and -JOSE JIMENEZ: So around ’51 or ’52? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, I think it was really in the same year. Yeah, ’51. JOSE JIMENEZ: Fifty-one? Okay, so they moved to Chicago. Do you know where they moved to? JUANA JIMENEZ: The only place that I remember -- oh, my God. I don’t remember much about names of streets or something, but I know it was a really slum area. And I remember to get into the apartment -- it was a big building -- to get into the apartment, you had to go through the alley and the door was on the side of the alley. It was a bad -JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, that was on Dayton. That was on Dayton -- JUANA JIMENEZ: Way in back. JOSE JIMENEZ: Dayton by North Avenue. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, and I really didn’t like that place. JOSE JIMENEZ: So the entrance was in the alley, I remember that. JUANA JIMENEZ: It was in the alley. JOSE JIMENEZ: It was behind the businesses. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, right. JOSE JIMENEZ: The North Avenue businesses. JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s right. 3 �JOSE JIMENEZ: So there was North Avenue businesses between Halsted and Dayton, and right behind there was an alley, and there was a building there. JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s right, yeah. [00:04:00] And I hated that place. JOSE JIMENEZ: ’Cause there was a cat called kitty that we had or something. JUANA JIMENEZ: No, no. JOSE JIMENEZ: There wasn’t? JUANA JIMENEZ: That was in a different area. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, that was a different -- JUANA JIMENEZ: That was way back later on. But when we were a lot smaller, we lived in that area, and I didn’t like it because they had a lot of roaches, a lot of -JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, so this is still on Clark Street that you’re talking about? It’s not North Avenue, then? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, it must not be. I just don’t know the name of the streets or anything. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, you remember Maple. That was another alley. There was another alley. JUANA JIMENEZ: It was this little small alley I remember, and the other side was busy streets. JOSE JIMENEZ: That was La Salle. La Salle and Maple. JUANA JIMENEZ: You could see drunk people all the time in the streets. JOSE JIMENEZ: Clark Street. That was Clark Street. JUANA JIMENEZ: That was horrible. I hated it. I hated it. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, that was La Salle and Maple. Yeah, I remember that. Okay. 4 �JUANA JIMENEZ: ’Cause I remember that when -JOSE JIMENEZ: So what do you remember about there? JUANA JIMENEZ: The only thing I remember, we never had anything. At least we had food, but not much of anything. [00:05:00] We had to get our clothes was from the secondhand store all the time or from people that gave us clothes. For Christmas, we never had anything. I remember one time really special from school, the police officers, they went around to see the poor families. We were very, very poor. And they came around to our house, and they took you to go to their party and their Christmas party where Santa Claus was and everything, and I stayed home crying because they didn’t pick me to go. But later on, they came back about an hour later on, and they got my shoes, my clothes, and they finished dressing me in their car so I could go with them. And the first thing I saw when I went down there was Santa Claus, the kids running around everywhere, and the table filled with food. And when we got home, you had a great big sack of clothes [00:06:00] and toys, and I had the same. And that was one of the good times, at least I thought. JOSE JIMENEZ: I think that was Catholic Charities. JUANA JIMENEZ: Maybe, I don’t know. I really don’t know. JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, they were located by Superior and La Salle at that time. JUANA JIMENEZ: We had another time -- we had another -JOSE JIMENEZ: But we weren’t living there at that time. We were living -- JUANA JIMENEZ: ’Cause there was another time that we had a good time for the Catholic Charities that they did help us. And we were living -- 5 �JOSE JIMENEZ: It was at St. Teresa’s, I think? From St. Teresa’s (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know, but I know that -- this was in a different place, where we lived, and they came to the house and brought us a big Christmas tree and big presents. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, yeah, that was a different time. JUANA JIMENEZ: Different time. JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, but the first one was Catholic Charities. JUANA JIMENEZ: The first time I was really, really young I remember. But that place that I hated was because of all the rats and the roaches everywhere. [00:07:00] You could see the walls moving. JOSE JIMENEZ: So that was on Maple and La Salle with the rats and the roaches. JUANA JIMENEZ: Okay. I really don’t know, but -JOSE JIMENEZ: It was a basement. It was a basement apartment. JUANA JIMENEZ: It was a basement. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. Actually, there’s a picture of that on Facebook. JUANA JIMENEZ: Is it? JOSE JIMENEZ: I got to show it to you. JUANA JIMENEZ: I hated that place. I hated that place. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you remember that, that place there. That was at La Salle and Maple. Where did you go to school? JUANA JIMENEZ: At that time, we were going to St. Teresa. We were going to a Catholic school, I believe. Or how was that? I’m not sure that we went first to a public school and then we went to a Catholic school, but -- no, we did go to a 6 �public school first because [00:08:00] I remember going to kindergarten and not wanting to go to school, starting to scream because I wanted to go back home. I remember that one. That was in a (inaudible). JOSE JIMENEZ: Was it Newberry? Do you remember that school? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t remember them. JOSE JIMENEZ: Franklin? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know the names of the -- I don’t know. JOSE JIMENEZ: None of the schools you know the name of. You remember St. Teresa. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I remember St. Teresa. And I think it was after that that we did go to St. Teresa’s. And I remember mom working, making pasteles. JOSE JIMENEZ: I think before that we went to Newberry, (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: Just to pay for the tuition. JOSE JIMENEZ: Or at least I was going to Newberry before I went to St. Teresa’s. JUANA JIMENEZ: Okay, could be. JOSE JIMENEZ: [Probably?] you were going somewhere else. JUANA JIMENEZ: But I remember going to that school, and it was nice, but -- but we did go to St. Teresa. But it wasn’t at that time. JOSE JIMENEZ: So what are your first memories of Chicago growing up? JUANA JIMENEZ: Being a girl, [00:09:00] growing up, you only saw the inside of the house because it came with Puerto Rican -JOSE JIMENEZ: Culture. JUANA JIMENEZ: -- cultures and everything. My mom and dad -- 7 �JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so what kind of cultures? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, the women would stay in the house, clean, cook, do whatever they had to do. They wouldn’t go out for anything. The husbands or the men could do whatever they wanted. All the food had to be done for them, clothes had to be fixed, everything had to be ready for them. JOSE JIMENEZ: And mom was comfortable with that? JUANA JIMENEZ: She taught us that’s the way we had to do it. JOSE JIMENEZ: She told you that’s the way you had to do it? JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s the way you had to do it. JOSE JIMENEZ: And you had to behave yourself and -- I mean she actually said that? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. She told us, “When your father comes, the food has to be done, [00:10:00] the house has to be clean, you can’t let them fight,” and stuff like that. The men can go out drinking, and having fun, and whatever and the women had to stay in the house. Of course, she didn’t like that much either because dad would go out drinking and come back really drunk and half the time beat her up because of that. The first apartment -- you said it was Mayberry? By Clark? JOSE JIMENEZ: Maple. JUANA JIMENEZ: Maple, okay. Maple and Clark. JOSE JIMENEZ: La Salle. Maple and La Salle. JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember -- ’cause [Myrna?] was a baby -- my sister, Myrna. She was -- 8 �JOSE JIMENEZ: She was born right there in (inaudible) Hospital, right? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, she was a baby ’cause there were only two bedrooms in that apartment. There was two bedrooms, living room, and kitchen. JOSE JIMENEZ: It was a basement and the entrance was on Maple, on the small street. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. And then I remember my dad going out, and I decided I wanted to sleep out -- I didn’t want sleep with -- I had to sleep -- on one bed, I had to sleep [00:11:00] me, Daisy, and you. All three of us had to sleep there in one bed because there was nowhere else to sleep. And that day, I said, “I’m not sleeping in this bed anymore. I’m tired of being in this room.” So in the living room, there was a little crib, and I asked my mom, “Can I sleep on this crib tonight?” She said, “Fine,” because my sister slept with them. So in the middle of the night, all I did was open my eyes, and all you could see were these roaches, and these rats, and everything, but then they’d run. My dad came in drunk, and I could see him throwing baby food jars, throwing them because he was so drunk he didn’t know what he was doing. He started fighting with my mom, throwing food everywhere on the walls. There was baby food everywhere, everywhere you could see. JOSE JIMENEZ: What was he drunk about? What was he mad about? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know. He was always mad at something. Always mad at something. And he wanted to fight with her. [00:12:00] So I really wouldn’t know. I really couldn’t tell you what they were fighting about. She wasn’t doing 9 �the fighting, he was doing the fighting. She was just running around so that he wouldn’t hurt her. JOSE JIMENEZ: What would happen the next day? JUANA JIMENEZ: The next day he’d either wake up by the bathroom floor throwing up, or half on the floor in the bedroom, or on the bed or whatever. And he would act like nothing, and she would have to get him his coffee, and make him some soup, or get him something cool to drink like 7UP or something because he wasn’t feeling well. But then the next day it was like nothing. He was an alcoholic and he didn’t realize that. And he always had to drink. All weekend he had to keep drinking. The whole weekend. JOSE JIMENEZ: That’s his negative side. What about his positive side? JUANA JIMENEZ: His positive side, he was a great dad. JOSE JIMENEZ: What do you mean? JUANA JIMENEZ: At least with me. [00:13:00] He could talk to me. I would sit on his lap, rub his face, would talk to him -- “Why are you so upset?” “I’m not upset. Go over there.” He’d tell me to get off his lap or go somewhere else. (laughs) But, you know, then he would smile and laugh a lot, make jokes. I liked the way when he would -- he loved movies from cowboys especially. And he would take the chairs, the back ends of the chairs, and turn it around, and sit with his legs spread apart. And since he had a big fat belly, the chairs instead of being straight up, it already had the form of the belly coming to the side. You could see him just kind of fighting, “Come on, you can do it.” And then when they started saying on the TV that that was too much violence, and they were taking all these 10 �movies out because of the violence and stuff, he was so mad. [00:14:00] He didn’t want to watch anymore cowboy and Indian movies (laughs) anymore because he said it was really wasn’t (inaudible). JOSE JIMENEZ: Didn’t he also watch The Honeymooners or something like that? JUANA JIMENEZ: He was what? JOSE JIMENEZ: You remember that show The Honeymooners? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I remember. The Jackie Gleason show. JOSE JIMENEZ: And he reminded me of Jackie Gleason. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, he did. JOSE JIMENEZ: (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s how it was. JOSE JIMENEZ: And that was one of his favorite shows. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. Except the lady was -- Jackie Gleason’s wife -- my mom was more quiet because the one there on TV was a little mouthy. My mother wasn’t. JOSE JIMENEZ: But Antonio liked that. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, he liked that. JOSE JIMENEZ: Your dad. JUANA JIMENEZ: He liked that. Yeah, he did. JOSE JIMENEZ: Except for the lady wasn’t like mom. Mom was more quiet, she was more Puerto Rican. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, that’s it. JOSE JIMENEZ: Would you say Puerto Rican or that’s just the way she -- not really Puerto Rican, but -- were all Puerto Ricans like that or no? 11 �JUANA JIMENEZ: I really don’t know, but mom was because that’s the way she was raised. JOSE JIMENEZ: Were there many other women like that? Other women raised that way [00:15:00] or no? JUANA JIMENEZ: I really wouldn’t know. At least at that time -JOSE JIMENEZ: Why do you think mom was so quiet like that, accepting that? JUANA JIMENEZ: I think she was that way because she was raised and always -when she was younger, she went to a convent, and she learned a lot with the nuns. You have to be quiet, you can’t raise your voice, have to be cleaning all the time. That’s why we did a lot of cleaning on our hands and knees, cleaning and shining floors. But she said that’s the way the women had to be. And I kept thinking, “This can’t be life,” (laughs) you know? But we either behaved or we got punished kneeling in front of the altar. JOSE JIMENEZ: So she was very religious? JUANA JIMENEZ: She was very religious. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, but before we go into very religious, she also threw a few punches. Do you remember, [00:16:00] right in that spot, there was a fight or something? Do you remember that? JUANA JIMENEZ: What street? JOSE JIMENEZ: On Maple and La Salle, there was a fight -- JUANA JIMENEZ: There was a fight? JOSE JIMENEZ: -- with mom, right? You don’t remember that? JUANA JIMENEZ: With mom and who else? 12 �JOSE JIMENEZ: Some lady or something like that. It was a street fight. All the neighbors were outside (laughs) watching the fight. JUANA JIMENEZ: I really don’t remember that. JOSE JIMENEZ: You don’t remember that? JUANA JIMENEZ: I really don’t. And I don’t know why -JOSE JIMENEZ: So you never remember mom ever being aggressive? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, no. JOSE JIMENEZ: Fighting back on anybody? JUANA JIMENEZ: No. JOSE JIMENEZ: You just only remember her in the church. JUANA JIMENEZ: In the church, in the house. JOSE JIMENEZ: Gambling? JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, yes, she did. (laughs) I remember her playing a lotería, but it’s not the lottery like they play now ’cause there was the three small cards. JOSE JIMENEZ: So it was like bingo? JUANA JIMENEZ: It’s like bingo, but it wasn’t. Bingo uses those cards, and straight across and down to the side. These were like three small cards -- [00:17:00] of course, it was illegal. JOSE JIMENEZ: But this was Spanish bingo. JUANA JIMENEZ: Spanish bingo. JOSE JIMENEZ: So why is Spanish bingo illegal and not English bingo? 13 �JUANA JIMENEZ: All bingos were illegal if you went over the limit of the money. You weren’t playing for pennies here. You were playing -- you know, $5.00, $10.00, $50.00, things like this. JOSE JIMENEZ: So it was illegal because they charged too much money? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, it was gambling. It was gambling. JOSE JIMENEZ: So all bingo was illegal at that time. JUANA JIMENEZ: All bingo was illegal at that time. JOSE JIMENEZ: But did a lot of people play it? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. Hiding, yes. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: So it was common. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, it was common especially in the Puerto Ricans ’cause I remember standing -- trying to go to sleep standing up by a wall, “Let me go to sleep, I’m tired. We want to go home.” And we wouldn’t go home until they played their bingos. And the kids had to be quiet -- “Go over there and sit down and watch TV or just be quiet. You can’t be over here because there’s money here.” Half the time it was more [00:18:00] or less more family playing it, but it was still illegal. So as soon as somebody would knock at the door, everybody would stop, I remember, and look out the window, see who it was or whatever. JOSE JIMENEZ: Now, we moved up towards Clark Street by Lincoln Park. Do you remember that place? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I do ’cause there were some Italian people that were the landlords or something, wasn’t that? JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, that wasn’t that. But that was in -- 14 �JUANA JIMENEZ: That was another place. JOSE JIMENEZ: That was on Fremont. The Italian people, (inaudible). I was thinking about right across the street from Lincoln Park on Clark Street. Right there on North Avenue and Clark. Do you remember that or no? JUANA JIMENEZ: What’s that? JOSE JIMENEZ: You remember Fremont Street, though, right? With the Italian gangs? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, I remember that. JOSE JIMENEZ: So what do you remember there? JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember my mom being very superstitious, and she kept saying [00:19:00] that there were ghosts or something that could hear people walking around, or people knocking at the doors, or things like this. And she kept saying that we had to be very quiet because the landlord lived downstairs and he didn’t want any noise or else they were going to throw us out, you know? I can remember a lot of things because we were always in the house, like I told you. We were never outside. We couldn’t go outside to the stairs. In the summertime, maybe, for a little bit with them out in the front, and then back in the house. JOSE JIMENEZ: With who? With mom? JUANA JIMENEZ: With mom, with my dad. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you would go outside? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. I remember there mom made a lot of pasteles so she could take it to Lincoln Park area and sell it. They sold a lot of pasteles. 15 �JOSE JIMENEZ: Pasteles, like Puerto Rican tamales? JUANA JIMENEZ: They’re the Puerto Rican tamales, like they say. A lot better than tamales. A lot more work. So I don’t make ’em, I buy them. (laughter) [00:20:00] I’m too lazy for that. JOSE JIMENEZ: So they went to Lincoln Park and sold them? JUANA JIMENEZ: They went to Lincoln Park and sold them, and they were sold right away. Right away. JOSE JIMENEZ: Why? Were there a lot of Puerto Ricans (inaudible)? JUANA JIMENEZ: There were a lot of Puerto Ricans at that time. There was a hippie stage at that time, there were a lot -JOSE JIMENEZ: This was like ’68, ’70? Around there, ’67-’68? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, around there, I believe. Yeah ’cause I remember her saying, “Don’t go in that area. Stay over there.” Because, of course, they would take off their bras and burn them or something, and mom wouldn’t want me to hang around with that. Of course, I liked that. JOSE JIMENEZ: So there was Puerto Ricans and hippies in the Lincoln Park? JUANA JIMENEZ: In the Lincoln Park. JOSE JIMENEZ: That end of the park. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. JOSE JIMENEZ: Was there like softball games or something? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, they did have a lot of softball games because the Puerto Ricans had a lot of softball games. It was really nice. It was really good. JOSE JIMENEZ: And so mom would go to the softball games to sell. 16 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Just to sell pasteles. JOSE JIMENEZ: Were those softball games part of the church that mom was involved in? JUANA JIMENEZ: [00:21:00] I think they were, but she wasn’t involved with the softball team, that I don’t believe. JOSE JIMENEZ: She was just selling. JUANA JIMENEZ: She was just there to sell pasteles. JOSE JIMENEZ: The pasteles were money for her. JUANA JIMENEZ: Money for her for income ’cause the income was very -JOSE JIMENEZ: Because she also sold for the teams later or something. JUANA JIMENEZ: Later on. JOSE JIMENEZ: Or before (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: But that was a lot later on for the Puerto Rican community. Let’s say they would have raffles and things that would help for the girls that wanted to run like for Puerto Rican queen or something, she did a lot of selling of pasteles. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, for the ones that ran for Puerto Rican queens. JUANA JIMENEZ: Puerto Rican queens. JOSE JIMENEZ: So Puerto Rican queen in Chicago. So this was later on in Aurora or was this in Chicago? JUANA JIMENEZ: She did that later on in Aurora, but she did this in Chicago, too. But in Chicago she did it first because for our income. We didn’t have a lot of money. [00:22:00] At that time, there was no food. I remember dad going one time when we lived there on Bissell Street, he would go out to these farm areas, he would 17 �bring back sacks of potatoes. One week would be potatoes. We’d have potatoes for breakfast, for lunch -- different ways he would make them, but he would make them and bring them. Another time he would bring a sack or corn. We’d have corn different ways. You know, all sorts of fruit, vegetables, or whatever, but he would bring sacks of them because it was a time of depression. There was no money, no jobs, nothing. Nothing. JOSE JIMENEZ: So what year was this about? JUANA JIMENEZ: You’re going to tell me the year. All I remember is we had food in our stomachs. (laughs) I don’t know. I remember being small. It’s really weird because there’s a lot of things that I would like to remember, and I can’t remember them. JOSE JIMENEZ: Was this the hippie time? JUANA JIMENEZ: [00:23:00] That was at the hippie time. That was the hippie time. JOSE JIMENEZ: So ’67, ’66, ’68 -- JUANA JIMENEZ: Around there. JOSE JIMENEZ: Around there. Okay, so that’s when he brought the sacks of food, and that’s when you said it was a depression. People were kind of poor. Yeah, that sounds like that time. JUANA JIMENEZ: He would go out and work on these farms and just come back and bring back sacks. JOSE JIMENEZ: He would work at the farms? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, he would work at farms. He said they would pick him up or something at a certain place, and he would work, and then come back. 18 �JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, so this was west Chicago. This was (inaudible) or something like that. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, something like that. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. (inaudible) was in west Chicago, and people straight from Puerto Rico would come to work there. And, in fact, dad did work that as a migrant work before, so he was used to working that. So he probably went and worked -- from Chicago he went to work -JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, he did. JOSE JIMENEZ: ’Cause he couldn’t find no job. JUANA JIMENEZ: There was no jobs anywhere. JOSE JIMENEZ: But didn’t he work for Armour Food Company? JUANA JIMENEZ: He worked for Armour Food Company. JOSE JIMENEZ: And where was that? Was that the one on [00:24:00] Sedgwick or something? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know. I really don’t know much about -JOSE JIMENEZ: But it was Armour Food. JUANA JIMENEZ: It was Armour Food ’cause I remember also one of our uncles, my dad’s brother -JOSE JIMENEZ: So it was a meat company. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, the meat company. Our uncle would work for the like nuts or something, and he would bring to our house -JOSE JIMENEZ: Peanuts across the street from (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. They were all these different -- 19 �JOSE JIMENEZ: Superior and [Wells?] Street, it was a peanut factory. JUANA JIMENEZ: -- all these sorts of nuts. And then we were really happy for that. JOSE JIMENEZ: So Superior and Wells Street, the peanut factory there. So a lot of us worked there. A lot the family worked there. So you mentioned the Italian gangs on Fremont and Armitage, around there. But then what about Bissell Street and Dickens? Do you remember that? JUANA JIMENEZ: Bissell and Dickens, yes, I remember that. JOSE JIMENEZ: 2117 Bissell. JUANA JIMENEZ: I liked that place. [00:25:00] It was -JOSE JIMENEZ: Why did you like that place? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, it was nice. There was a lot of people, especially during the summertime, there was a lot of people that would come out and, you know, have fun, and talk, and things like that. I remember one time that I really didn’t like that you were looking for a job, and I think that’s the time that the cops beat you up or something. JOSE JIMENEZ: I was coming home from work. JUANA JIMENEZ: You were coming home from work on a Friday. JOSE JIMENEZ: I was working at (inaudible), and I was coming, and (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: You were happy because it was your first paycheck, and you already was drinkin’, but you were just walking down. And I was inside the house cooking with my sisters. And, of course, we had to be cooking all the time, and my mom would either be next door talkin’ to somebody, and we had to be fixing the food and having that ready. And someone told me, “Oh, Joseph’s coming,” 20 �you know, [00:26:00] “José is coming, and he’s arguing with someone on the corner.” So I ran over there to see what was going on, and I heard the man said something that he was gonna kill you or something, and he was going to get his gun, and he went inside to get a gun. I remember saying to you, “Everything is fine, don’t worry. Let’s just go home. Let’s go home.” And you just wanted to keep arguing with the man ’cause you were drunk. But I just kept pushing you towards the house and almost -JOSE JIMENEZ: That’s why I thought he was arguing at you (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, you thought he was arguing and saying something to me, and he wasn’t. JOSE JIMENEZ: He was talking to some other girl. JUANA JIMENEZ: He was talking to somebody else. JOSE JIMENEZ: Some other girl. JUANA JIMENEZ: And you wanted to save me from -- but I kept pushing you away, “He’s okay, he’s okay.” And I guess he went in the house, and he said he was gonna get a gun or something. Somebody called the cops. I don’t know. And as we were walking down to the house, almost right in front of the house, like a house away from our house, the cops [00:27:00] stopped you and asked you if there was any problem. And I said, “No, there’s no problem. He just came home from work, he’s fine. He’s going home.” And they wanted to see your ID or whatever, I don’t know. The next thing I know they had thrown you on the ground, and they were all -- it was like three guys on top of you trying to beat you up, and hitting you, and kicking your head, and slamming it on the sidewalk. And 21 �I didn’t want them to hurt you, so I went and I put my hand under your head so it wouldn’t hurt you. And they just went like this, and slammed their hand against my body and, of course, I was so thin I just flew and hit my back against this fence that was there. And I just said, “Leave him alone. Leave him alone.” But, of course, they just kept kicking you. And all the neighbors were all around trying to find out what was going on. And then mom came out and [00:28:00] they had taken you away. JOSE JIMENEZ: So mom comes out and what happens? JUANA JIMENEZ: Nothing. She started screaming, and telling ’em that that was her son, that you weren’t doing anything, “Let’s just talk about it to fix it.” And I believe they said -- because my mom was trying to stop them from fighting and hitting you -- I think she grabbed somebody or one of the cops by the mouth or something, and they said -JOSE JIMENEZ: She threw a bottle at them. JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know, she did something, and they said that my mom -JOSE JIMENEZ: It broke a tooth. Broke a tooth. JUANA JIMENEZ: -- broke a tooth, yeah. JOSE JIMENEZ: Broke a policeman’s tooth. JUANA JIMENEZ: Broke a policeman’s tooth. JOSE JIMENEZ: ’Cause she just threw a bottle at somebody. Everybody got involved, right? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, everybody got involved. JOSE JIMENEZ: I mean the whole family -- Daisy, you, Myrna. 22 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, everybody. So they were gonna take my mom because she broke the tooth, and I went with her because I didn’t want her to be alone over there. Of course, she didn’t know any English. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you went with her over there? JUANA JIMENEZ: I went with her. JOSE JIMENEZ: Was she in the police car? JUANA JIMENEZ: [00:29:00] She went in the police car. JOSE JIMENEZ: Not in paddy wagon? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, I don’t know if it was a paddy wagon. JOSE JIMENEZ: Paddy wagon is like a truck. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, I know. JOSE JIMENEZ: Or was it a police car that she went? I thought I had seen her in a paddy wagon. JUANA JIMENEZ: It could have been a paddy wagon. It could have been. JOSE JIMENEZ: You know, at least for a little bit. JUANA JIMENEZ: I know they took her and I went with her. JOSE JIMENEZ: ’Cause I was half asleep drunk, but I woke up and I thought I saw her. But you drove in the squad car. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, I probably drove in the -JOSE JIMENEZ: Me and mom drove in the paddy wagon. That’s what it was. JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s what it was because I knew you didn’t do anything, and they told her that she broke somebody’s tooth, and I thought, “How could that little old lady (laughs) chip somebody’s tooth?” But there was my mom defending us. 23 �JOSE JIMENEZ: So how did you feel about that? What was that to you? Seeing your mom and your brother being arrested. JUANA JIMENEZ: I had a lot of mixed feelings. You know, it was really [00:30:00] weird because the police are supposed to be helping us, saving us, but I believe that those cops were drunk themselves because you could smell beer or something, the alcohol from them. And the way they acted. And when I went over there and I told them about it, they had to let my mother go, too, because I was a minor and they hurt me. They threw me against a fence. I kept telling them, “Leave him alone,” and they didn’t say anything to me, they just -- with one hand and I flew away. That was me. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, then what happened later with the case? Do you know? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know what happened to the case later on. I was never told about anything anyway. But I know that you were in jail for a little bit. And I just kept thinking, “How?” You just got yourself a job, trying to get yourself fixed, [00:31:00] go to work and do things good, and the cops ruin it again. It was really hard growing up especially there that you weren’t there the half the time ’cause -JOSE JIMENEZ: Where was I? JUANA JIMENEZ: You were either with your friends or in jail. And it’s like if we grew up without a brother, really, it was just the three girls. Just the three girls always ’cause you were really never really there. JOSE JIMENEZ: So what did the three girls do to live? JUANA JIMENEZ: To live? Clean, cook, wash clothes -- wash clothes by hand in the bath tub because we had no washing machine. Just like if she would be living 24 �over here, “Oh, I did this all the time in the river.” There was no river there, there was a bath tub. JOSE JIMENEZ: So mom would say, “I did it in the river?” JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. So we had to be washing clothes. JOSE JIMENEZ: [00:32:00] In the bath tub water. JUANA JIMENEZ: In the bath tub with one of those -- the boards. JOSE JIMENEZ: Washboards. JUANA JIMENEZ: Washboards. That’s what it was. One of those boards. JOSE JIMENEZ: And where did you dry the clothes? JUANA JIMENEZ: When it was wash day, there was like rope hanging from the living room, dining room, bedrooms, everywhere. You had push away the clothes just to get from one room to the other. That’s the way the clothes were dried because we didn’t even have money to go and wash clothes in the laundromat, or it was too cold to go out to wash the clothes. And then after that, we had to iron all this. And my mother was the type that she would iron t-shirts, underwear, and the bed sheets -- the sheets for the beds, we had to iron the sheets, and pillowcases, and all this other stuff. JOSE JIMENEZ: What about grocery shopping? [00:33:00] Where did you go shopping? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t remember ever going shopping with her -- or with my mom or dad, grocery shopping. We had to stay at home until they bought groceries. JOSE JIMENEZ: Now, you’re living in the best place that you like, 2117 Bissell. What happened? Why did you move from there? 25 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, we moved from there because at that time, my father was always -- “You have to go to work, you have to go to work.” I was going to high school -- “You have to find work.” JOSE JIMENEZ: You were going to high school where? JUANA JIMENEZ: When we were on Bissell Street. JOSE JIMENEZ: What high school? JUANA JIMENEZ: Waller High School in Chicago. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, you went to Waller High School? JUANA JIMENEZ: I went to Waller High School. And I went to Arnold Upper Grade Center, and then I went to Waller High School. And he just kept [00:34:00] saying, “You have to look for a job, you have to look for a job, you have to” -- he just drove me crazy because I had to look for a job because there was no jobs anywhere. Looking for jobs in Chicago -JOSE JIMENEZ: Why would you have to look for a job? JUANA JIMENEZ: Pardon? JOSE JIMENEZ: Why did you have to look for a job? JUANA JIMENEZ: Because there was no money, and, you know, to get to live, and have more bills, and to help my parents out, I had to look for a job and work. I remember my -JOSE JIMENEZ: So he wanted you to go look for work and then give him money. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, and give him money. But I’m slick, I never gave him anything. (laughs) I never gave him anything. But, anyway, the thing was that the very first job that I looked for was with a friend of mine and we both got lost 26 �looking. We went to this nursing home looking for a job, and she says, “Oh, I know exactly where it’s at.” We went from one train to the other, got another train, and then got off of that, got on another train, we got onto the bus. [00:35:00] I don’t know where we were at, but I know we were walking, we were lost. I said, “Well, let’s ask a police officer.” “No.” She didn’t want to ask no police officer. And I said, “Well, okay. Let’s find somewhere where we can call.” She finally called her dad, and in that little car it was her dad, her mom, my mom, my dad, me, and her. We were all squished into one car -- oh, plus my sisters. (laughs) We were all squeezed in one little car when they picked us up and went back. We never got the job, but we looked for the job. My first job that I did finally find was a spot-welding place. Don’t know the name of it, but that’s where I met my neighbor’s cousin. And he offered to take me ’cause he said that he would go that way all the time [00:36:00] so that he could work, so he would offer to take me as a ride. And I would have rather taken the bus, it didn’t bother me. But at that time, things went back and forth, and we just started talking and stuff like that. And he says to me one day, he says, “Let’s go to the movies.” And I had never been to a movie. I never went to the movies before. And he says, “Well, you don’t have to go to work. Nobody will find out that you went to the movies.” I say, “Okay, let’s go to the movies.” Well, we went to the movies, things got a little bit late, he says, “Now you can’t go home because if you go home, your mom’s gonna -- you know, they’re gonna get you because they’re gonna say, ‘Where were you?’” I says, “Well, I’ll tell them that I was with you,” 27 �and stuff like this. He says, “She’s not gonna believe that we didn’t do anything, you with a guy.” So he kinda blackmailed me. JOSE JIMENEZ: Who was this guy? JUANA JIMENEZ: His name is [00:37:00] Michael (inaudible). JOSE JIMENEZ: So Michael. Just say Michael. JUANA JIMENEZ: Mike, yes. JOSE JIMENEZ: And this guy was from the school? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, this guy was not from the school. JOSE JIMENEZ: From the neighborhood? JUANA JIMENEZ: He was the cousin that went to visit -- he would come to visit his cousin next door. JOSE JIMENEZ: From Bissell? JUANA JIMENEZ: From Bissell. That’s how I met him. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you met him like sitting on the stairs? People used to sit on the stairs. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, people used to sit on the stairs. And she said, “Oh, this is my cousin. He can give you a ride.” And things got back and forth, and, well, like I said, he came and he kind of blackmailed me. And I had to stay at this place for a while, and my mom was looking for me. JOSE JIMENEZ: You stayed for a while? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, I had to stay there a few days -- forever almost because -JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so that was a boyfriend you had. 28 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, well, at that time he became a boyfriend. But [00:38:00] he mistreated me, also. JOSE JIMENEZ: But he blackmailed you. JUANA JIMENEZ: He blackmailed me into staying with him. JOSE JIMENEZ: He suckered you in. JUANA JIMENEZ: He suckered me in, yeah. JOSE JIMENEZ: But how can you be suckered in? JUANA JIMENEZ: Because I was a very naïve person. At that time, remember, we didn’t live -- we didn’t know anything about the streets. All we knew was cooking, cleaning, and staying in the house, and that’s -- we didn’t know anything about the outside. And that was the first time that I went to the movies. First time I went to the movies with that guy. JOSE JIMENEZ: With this guy named Michael? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. And so after that, we -- of course, I made him so that I could call my mom and let them know where I was. He went by the house, and my sister had a boyfriend around that area, and Michael knew her boyfriend, they were friends, he told her [00:39:00] that I was with him, and she should tell my mom ’cause my mom was going crazy. And I was already 17, almost going on -that happened like a few weeks before my 18th birthday. Eighteen, and people think, “Wow, 18 and she didn’t have a brain.” Yes because we didn’t know anything about nothing. Things that women should know that I would tell my kids -- that my granddaughter now knows and my granddaughter is nine. She knows all about this. She knows how babies come from -- the real way, and how her 29 �body changes and everything. I never knew any of this because my mother never told me. The first time I ever knew that my body was gonna change and I was gonna get my period or something was from a doctor. And I remember screaming at that doctor saying, “I don’t want it. Take it away. Give me a pill or something. Take that away because I don’t want it.” [00:40:00] And he’s telling me how my body was gonna change and everything because my mother never talked about this stuff to us because that was voodoo, that was stuff that women don’t talk about. As a matter of fact, she would tell us that you could get pregnant by holding hands or a little kiss. What did I know? JOSE JIMENEZ: Your mom? JUANA JIMENEZ: My mom. JOSE JIMENEZ: Mom told you that? JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, yes. We couldn’t even hold hands. Imagine I was so naïve the very first kiss I got from a boy, I ran and told my mom, “Mom, I just got a kiss, this so and so person kissed me.” She says, “He kissed you on your cheek?” “No, he kissed me on my lips.” (laughter) I was such a dummy. I didn’t know anything because she wouldn’t tell us anything about life. And this is how I got suckered into staying with this guy because -- and I believed him. If I go back home, I was gonna get beat up. I was gonna get really, really badly beat up and they were gonna [00:41:00] throw me out because I stayed with a guy. Believing him, I stayed with him. And look who beat me up? He beat me up. My parents didn’t, he did. JOSE JIMENEZ: Your parents never beat you up? 30 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Beat me up? No. Spanked? Yes. JOSE JIMENEZ: Who spanked you? JUANA JIMENEZ: (laughs) My dad every once in a while. I was not a very good girl (laughs) ’cause I had a mouth. Being not a good girl is having a mouth. I would get tired of things. JOSE JIMENEZ: I was gonna say so the good thing about -- looking at the good side of that is that all those years you didn’t know anything about sex and all that. JUANA JIMENEZ: Nothing. JOSE JIMENEZ: So that means you weren’t abused, right? I mean all those years, never being abused. JUANA JIMENEZ: Abused from my parents? JOSE JIMENEZ: From parents or from anybody. Were you abused? I mean you don’t have to answer it. JUANA JIMENEZ: I’m not gonna answer that. JOSE JIMENEZ: [00:42:00] Okay, all right. (inaudible) I mean we don’t have to answer that. JUANA JIMENEZ: No, I’m not gonna answer that. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so now Michael is there, and now you left Michael and you went back home or what happened? JUANA JIMENEZ: Once I was with him, he would lock me in the house ’cause he was afraid I was gonna leave ’cause he was right. If he left the door open, I would leave ’cause I wanted to get out of there. JOSE JIMENEZ: So was Michael Spanish? 31 �JUANA JIMENEZ: He was Puerto Rican. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, he was Puerto Rican? Michael was Latin? Okay. JUANA JIMENEZ: [Algarin?] or something. That’s what he said his last name was, [Algarin?]. So he would lock me -- the door that we had was like one of those skeleton key things. JOSE JIMENEZ: (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: Joey. He would have the little skeleton key. He could lock the door from the inside or lock the door from the outside. So when he went to work, he would lock the door. If there was a fire, I would burn in because I couldn’t get out. [00:43:00] But the neighbors next door could hear me screaming sometimes because he would beat me up. JOSE JIMENEZ: So he lived on Bissell Street? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, he didn’t live on Bissell Street. He lived on Francisco, close to Humboldt Park. JOSE JIMENEZ: But he came over to Bissell. JUANA JIMENEZ: He would go to Bissell because he had his cousin that lived next door to our house. JOSE JIMENEZ: And that’s where you met him on the porch? JUANA JIMENEZ: And that’s where I met him. JOSE JIMENEZ: And then he lied to you -- I mean he tricked you. JUANA JIMENEZ: He tricked me into staying with him which I did. And I remember one time to escape from him, I got out through the kitchen window, opened the window because I couldn’t open the door. I got up through the window, came out 32 �to the ledge, it was like a first floor thing, came out to the ledge, and jumped from that floor all the way down. And I just jumped. When I jumped, and came back up, there was he -- he was standing right there in front of me. [00:44:00] So what happened was that that day (audio cuts out) “I just wanna go home. I want to go back to my parents.” And he says, “Okay, well, let’s go up and get your purse so we can go.” Well, the wrong thing to do ’cause I went back up, he locked the door, and beat me up again. The next day he locked me up real good, locked everything up, I couldn’t go anywhere. But the bed, there was another door -there was the bed and a door right behind the bed. I pulled that bed, and I don’t know how I got my strength, but as soon as he left -- as soon as he left -- I pulled that bed out, and I got the hinges out from the door, and I pulled the door out. And when I went out, the first thing I looked, when I stopped, was the lady next door. And she looked at me, she says, “Don’t be scared. Don’t be scared. Just run and get out.” ’Cause she could hear me every night screaming and crying. She says, “Just run. Just run. He’s not gonna [00:45:00] be around, I won’t tell him anything. Just run and get out.” When I ran, I ran to where the church -JOSE JIMENEZ: The Young Lords church. JUANA JIMENEZ: The Young Lords church was at that corner. JOSE JIMENEZ: This is when the Young Lords were political, they weren’t a gang. JUANA JIMENEZ: No, they weren’t a gang. Not at that time. And I ran down to that section, and I talked to you, and then you said, “What happened?” And I didn’t have to say much because you could see my face, the way I was, anyway. And I also told you what happened, and you said, “Well, just stay here. You’re gonna 33 �stay away. Just stay on this side close by. We’re gonna just see what we’re gonna do.” And you took me, I remember, to my friend’s house, my best friend’s house, and I stayed there. Then you came back for me. When you came back for me, you took me back to where he was at, [00:46:00] and you kinda pushed him. And he was all bruised up, I guess. He got beat up, too. I was never happy for anybody to get beat up, but for him, at that time, I really didn’t care. I was kinda happy he got it, too. I kept telling myself inside, “I told him this was gonna happen. I told him.” (laughs) I’m glad for my brother. He says, “Oh, look what I let him do to me.” And I kept thinking, “Yeah, right. They hold him down while Joseph beat him up. That’s fine with me. I don’t care.” I don’t want to believe anything he said -- “Oh, but I’m sorry. I love you. I love you. I’m gonna marry you.” Didn’t believe anything he had to say. From there, you took me back to mom’s. At that time, I already almost couldn’t even walk because jumping from the day before, jumping from the first story down, I was all bruised up. I was really hurting. [00:47:00] And when you took me back to mom’s house, my bedroom wasn’t mine anymore, it was my sister’s bedroom. My mom says, “Well, you left, we gave your bedroom to somebody else.” And I remember sleeping in the living room on one of those folding -JOSE JIMENEZ: So did she want to take you back? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, she took me back. She took me back. And the next day, my father, we went to Aurora, and -JOSE JIMENEZ: This was on Claremont Street. When you were living on Claremont. We started on Bissell, but by that time -- 34 �JUANA JIMENEZ: No. JOSE JIMENEZ: -- mom was living on Claremont. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, then mom was living already on Claremont. We started on Bissell, and then from there we moved. JOSE JIMENEZ: North Avenue and Claremont. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, then we moved and went down to Claremont. And then from Claremont, that’s where we moved -- when I went back ’cause I didn’t know that they were already there, and they took -- then we went down to Aurora. JOSE JIMENEZ: What happened after that? You had a child from him, right? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I did. [00:48:00] My son. I was pregnant, which I didn’t know that I was pregnant. And I kept thinking, “Oh, my God. How am I gonna have this baby without a father?” Didn’t think about that a woman can do it. I kept thinking, “No, he needs a father, he needs a father.” So I went back with him. And all I did was go back with him, the slapping and the beating up again. I ran out right the next day. I went out, went to this church that was close by, and I talked to the priest there, and he says, “You know, you’re of age, if you want, you can stay living here in this unwed mother’s home that he knew.” And I said, “Fine.” Didn’t bother me. But, of course, there were girls there that were giving up their baby, but I wasn’t gonna give up my baby. So I had to work there for my stay. I worked there. And, well, after that, he kept trying to look for us, [00:49:00] and we moved from where we at in my cousin’s house in Aurora, they found another apartment or another house to rent on Claim. It was on Claim Street. JOSE JIMENEZ: Claim in Aurora. 35 �JUANA JIMENEZ: In Aurora. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. Let’s go on back a little bit. JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s really far back now. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: But we’ll go back a little bit. Did I ask you about mom’s catechism classes or no? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, you didn’t. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, do you remember those? JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember, but she was giving catechism classes -- I think it was even in that one basement. JOSE JIMENEZ: By Dayton Street, right? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, around there. JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, we lived near -- we lived on one side of the street then we moved to the other. JUANA JIMENEZ: Then we [00:50:00] moved the other street. JOSE JIMENEZ: (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: We kept moving from one side to the other, we were like gypsies just moving from one side to the other. JOSE JIMENEZ: Dayton near Willow Street. Near Willow. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. She did a lot of catechism there. And that’s where my sister -JOSE JIMENEZ: What was that about? What was that about? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, I guess she was involved in all this stuff of the church. And one day, she comes up and she says that she’s gonna -- there was some kids 36 �that were gonna be coming in so they could do their communion and stuff. And I had to, of course, be there, too. We were like -- well, I just did what I was told. She says, “Stay here. You gotta learn this and you have to learn about God.” And we just had to do what we were told. JOSE JIMENEZ: That’s where your sister what? You were saying. JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, because Daisy was too small. She was about four, she wasn’t quite five yet. And you had to be a certain age to do your communion. And she wasn’t gonna be [00:51:00] the one in the classes, but since she was close, she was very smart, she learned everything -- everything. And they let her make her first communion ’cause when they were doing the test, and they said that she couldn’t because she was too young, she started to cry. And when they gave her the test to see if she knew it, she knew it better than anybody. Mom didn’t even give her classes, she was just there close by, and she listened to everything. She listened. JOSE JIMENEZ: How were the classes? Do you remember seeing any of the classes? I mean ’cause mom didn’t go to school, so how did she do that? JUANA JIMENEZ: No. She didn’t go to school, but -JOSE JIMENEZ: So how could she teach people if she didn’t go to school? JUANA JIMENEZ: Because she didn’t go to school, but her sister taught her how to read and write. She didn’t know how to write real well, but she -JOSE JIMENEZ: Her sister, (inaudible)? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. JOSE JIMENEZ: So she learned how to write. 37 �JUANA JIMENEZ: She learned how to read. JOSE JIMENEZ: Or write. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, she could read. JOSE JIMENEZ: So how did she run the classes then? JUANA JIMENEZ: [00:52:00] Just by learning by heart all the -JOSE JIMENEZ: Learning by heart? JUANA JIMENEZ: Everything was learned by heart. JOSE JIMENEZ: In other words, the kids had to repeat everything? JUANA JIMENEZ: Everything. Everything. JOSE JIMENEZ: She would say a sentence and they would have to repeat it? JUANA JIMENEZ: And they would have to repeat it. And she would just teach ’em what she knew. She taught them everything that she knew. JOSE JIMENEZ: They had to repeat her with respect, too, right? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, of course. JOSE JIMENEZ: Didn’t they have to say, “Yes, mam,” “No, mam.” JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, (laughs) that was it. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so they would say, “Yes, mam. Christ rose from the dead on the third day.” “No, mam. He didn’t do this, he didn’t do that.” That’s the way she taught it? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. But she would say it in Spanish. It was, “Si, señora.” JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, “Si, señora,” in Spanish. JUANA JIMENEZ: “Si, señora.” JOSE JIMENEZ: But that’s the way she taught? 38 �JUANA JIMENEZ: That’s the way she taught. JOSE JIMENEZ: So everybody had it memorized. JUANA JIMENEZ: And it was the old way of learning and teaching, the way she -JOSE JIMENEZ: Did she graduate a lot of kids? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, a lot of them. A lot of them. JOSE JIMENEZ: How many were in a class at a time about? Thirty? Twenty? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, I think that was [00:53:00] too many. They were a lot. But in one class -JOSE JIMENEZ: Twenty-five? JUANA JIMENEZ: Could be about 25. It was a lot. There was a lot. A lot, a lot of kids. She even taught a lot of kids for the altar boys. JOSE JIMENEZ: To become altar boys? JUANA JIMENEZ: To become altar boys. JOSE JIMENEZ: She’d train ’em? JUANA JIMENEZ: She would train ’em. She did a lot of that, too. JOSE JIMENEZ: You said you went to Waller, and you went to what’s that other school? Arnold? JUANA JIMENEZ: Arnold Upper Grade Center. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. You went for three years there? JUANA JIMENEZ: I went there for -- it was sixth, seventh, eighth -- the two years in Arnold Upper Grade Center. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. And how was that? JUANA JIMENEZ: It was different. 39 �JOSE JIMENEZ: Were there Spanish kids or no? JUANA JIMENEZ: There were a lot of Black people. [00:54:00] There were a lot of Black kids. Some Spanish kids. I didn’t like the Catholic school that we went to. They were all high-class American kids. Out of the whole school there was one Black girl, I remember, and just a few Puerto Ricans. The rest was all white. All white kids which they thought they were in a (inaudible) Catholic School, they were better than anybody. We were very quiet. And I really didn’t like it. And it was really hard for me, and I did fail. I failed to go to sixth grade, I failed there, and I told my mom, “If you don’t take me out of this school, I don’t want to go back to school.” So that’s when she put me in a public school. And I went to a public school in sixth grade, and from there, then I went to [00:55:00] Arnold Upper Grade Center in seventh and eighth grade. JOSE JIMENEZ: So that’s St. Teresa’s where you had all these white kids. JUANA JIMENEZ: All white kids. JOSE JIMENEZ: And when you say white you mean like Italian, Irish? JUANA JIMENEZ: Italian, Irish -- to me, they were all white. Anybody that wasn’t Puerto Rican was white -- or either Puerto Rican or Black. Other than that, everybody else was -- to me, there were just three people: white, Blacks, Puerto Ricans. JOSE JIMENEZ: So that’s all? There was white? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, it was just white, Puerto Ricans, and one Black. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, that was it. Just three races. 40 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, three races to me. That’s the only people that was around until I went to public school. When I went to public school, you see all these different people. And I was very popular, and I loved sixth grade. I was glad I failed. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: At Arnold? This was at Arnold? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, this was not at Arnold. This was the school before Arnold which I don’t remember the name of the school, but I was there just for one year. That was in sixth grade. And then from -JOSE JIMENEZ: [00:56:00] Sexton? Not Sexton. Newberry? JUANA JIMENEZ: It was maybe Newberry School. Newberry School. JOSE JIMENEZ: That was on Willow Street. JUANA JIMENEZ: I think it was Newberry School. JOSE JIMENEZ: Burling and Willow. JUANA JIMENEZ: It had to be because I remember that name, Newberry. But then after that, at Arnold -JOSE JIMENEZ: I remember Newberry before we went to St. Teresa’s, and then St. Teresa -- but you went to Arnold. JUANA JIMENEZ: I went to Arnold Upper Grade Center which was nice. And remember -JOSE JIMENEZ: So you probably went to Newberry. JUANA JIMENEZ: -- at that time, the girls could not wear pants. Of course, at that time, it was like miniskirts, and mini dresses, and stuff like this. But to school, you were not allowed to wear pants at all even in the freezing whether that we 41 �had to walk six, seven blocks down just to go to school -- [00:57:00] below zero weather. You’d go to school freezing until they finally said, “Well, the girls could wear pants, but under the skirt.” As soon as they got in the school, they had to hurry up and take those pants off and put ’em in their locker. They were not allowed to be walking around with the pants. But it was nice. I liked it. I remember graduating from there and everything. JOSE JIMENEZ: Do you remember any of your classmates? JUANA JIMENEZ: One Mexican girl. Oh, God, I can’t remember her name. This one Mexican girl. And another girl which became my best friend, an American girl, her name was [Sandra Morales?] because her father was a Puerto Rican. Her mother was American, (laugher) her father was a Puerto Rican, and she lived close by. It was Sandra Morales, she was my best friend, and that’s why I named my oldest daughter [Sandy?]. It was Sandra, her name. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, this was from Arnold. JUANA JIMENEZ: It was from [00:58:00] Arnold. JOSE JIMENEZ: Were you in gym or anything? What kind of classes? JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, yes, I went to gym class. And, of course, Joseph, Cha-Cha, was very famous there because even the teacher in the gym class knew you. He says, “But your brother did this, and he was a good student, how is your brother?” And I thought, “He’s fine.” (laughs) Just like, “Who is this guy telling me about my brother?” (laughs) He wanted me to be better than my brother because he knew that my brother was always in gangs and stuff like this, and getting himself in trouble, and he didn’t want me to go through that. And gym 42 �class was okay. Never got beat up from anybody in school there, in that school at least. (laughs) [00:59:00] But there were some Black girls that were bothering me one time, but this other group of Black girls said, “Hey, leave her alone, she didn’t do anything.” They were really nice to me, but not in gym. When they played kickball, they kicked that ball and hit your face, hit your arm, hit whatever it was and they did it hard. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: Kickball or dodgeball? JUANA JIMENEZ: Dodgeball. JOSE JIMENEZ: Dodgeball. So you played a lot of dodgeball? JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, yes. And I really got all the bruises at that time for it. But it was okay. After I graduated -- of course, my mother never went to my graduation class -- or my father. Never went to school, I never saw them inside a school for nothing. Nothing. I remember being in Arnold School, and I had to go to my sister’s -- [01:00:00] one of these recital things that she had from school. And I had to go from one -- from my school, skip class to go and see what she was doing so at least a family member could go ’cause my mother wasn’t gonna go. I asked a teacher for permission, the teacher said at least she knows where I was at, but she couldn’t give me permission, but try to get to school as soon as I can. Said at least she knew where I was at. Anything my sisters had for school, I would go. I would skip school just so I could go what my sisters were doing ’cause my mom and dad never -- ’cause in Puerto Rico here, they never went to anything like this. In Puerto Rico, you either go to school, learn what you had to do, come home. You never had to go to the school and find out how your kids 43 �are doing unless they were fighting. That’s about it. So I did all the [01:01:00] going to the school for my sisters. And then from there, when I graduated, then I went to Waller High School. JOSE JIMENEZ: How far did you go at Waller? JUANA JIMENEZ: In Waller, I was a freshman and I didn’t even finish freshman because my father kept fighting -- “Go look for job. Go look for a job.” At that time, it was Blacks against whites. It was the time of just fighting all the time with the Blacks and the whites. All the time pulling down the fire alarm -JOSE JIMENEZ: (inaudible). Pulling the alarm. JUANA JIMENEZ: Pulling the alarm, a lot of riots. So my father would wait for me -JOSE JIMENEZ: A lot of kids would pull the alarm? JUANA JIMENEZ: They would pull the alarm, and everybody had to run outside, and you’d get trampled down the stairs, really hurt bad, just to get out of the building. So my father, he got tired of waiting for me, he would take me to school -- and this is in high school -- he would take me to school, and when [01:02:00] I got out of school at the end of the day, he was out there waiting for me just so nothing would happen until he saw that everything was fine. Then I could go home on my home. Or the times he was working he wouldn’t pick me up, but when he wasn’t working, he’d be there waiting for me to make sure I was gonna get home fine. JOSE JIMENEZ: What did you think about the Young Lords? JUANA JIMENEZ: The Young Lords as a gang or Young Lords -JOSE JIMENEZ: What did you think when they were a gang? 44 �JUANA JIMENEZ: All I could think was, “Oh, wow. My brother’s the head of these guys.” (laughs) I was happy ’cause you were the one -- like the president of the gang. You were the head one there, and I thought that was cool. But then after all this time that they would come to the house [01:03:00] looking for you all the time because someone stole the car, or they look everywhere -JOSE JIMENEZ: Who would come? JUANA JIMENEZ: The police. The police would come to the house with their flashlight going into the bedrooms. And my mother’s over here yelling at the police, “Get out of the girls’ room! Get out of the girls’ room!” I remember -JOSE JIMENEZ: Detectives or regular cops? JUANA JIMENEZ: Both. There were detectives and cops with them, together, because there were some that wore plain clothes and some that had their uniforms. JOSE JIMENEZ: And this was during the gang? JUANA JIMENEZ: During the gang time. JOSE JIMENEZ: They were looking for stolen stuff? JUANA JIMENEZ: They were really looking for you to take you away for stolen things. They had it in for you guys all the time. Whenever anything happened, it was the Young Lords Organization -- or not an organization, the Young Lords gang at that time that did it. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, but I mean I don’t -- JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember that you did go to jail for something. I don’t know if it was for stealing a car or something. I really can’t remember, [01:04:00] but I 45 �know that you were in this institute really far away. I remember driving down just to visit you with mom, and dad, and someone else that they found to take them down. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, Vandalia. Vandalia, Illinois. Southern Illinois. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. JOSE JIMENEZ: So that was for the stabbing. JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, that was for the stabbing. You stayed there for a while. JOSE JIMENEZ: Six months. JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember that you would say, “Oh, they want me to work out here.” And you would do things on purpose so that they can just leave you in solitary so you wouldn’t have to work in the sun. You’d be out away from the sun and stuff like that you would say. JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, 15 days in the hole because I refused to work. But it was better than working in the sun. Okay, so you went with mom to Vandalia to visit me there? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, I remember that. JOSE JIMENEZ: So how did you feel on that trip that you were visiting your brother that’s in jail? JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, I was happy to at least see you. I really didn’t think bad about anything. I thought, to me, it was just part of [01:05:00] life. We’re gonna go see my brother finally, and I hadn’t seen you for a long time, and half the time you were never there. 46 �JOSE JIMENEZ: So that was when it was a gang. So how did you feel when it was a political group? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, when it was a political group, I thought it was really good because you were really helping the Puerto Rican community. You were helping so that at least the parents can go to work and the kids can have a daycare and stuff, they can have good breakfast. You were trying to help the people. JOSE JIMENEZ: You mean there was breakfast for children (inaudible)? JUANA JIMENEZ: There was breakfast for children. JOSE JIMENEZ: And then there was also a daycare center. JUANA JIMENEZ: And a daycare center. JOSE JIMENEZ: And so you thought that the Young Lords were helping at that time. JUANA JIMENEZ: I thought that was helping a lot. JOSE JIMENEZ: Now, did you know some of those Young Lords or no? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, not really because I was not allowed to even associate with any of them. JOSE JIMENEZ: Even the women? You didn’t know the other women? JUANA JIMENEZ: No. I would know them by far away. It’s not like we would stay there, [01:06:00] and stay talking, and have a conversation with them at all. Not at all. (audio cuts out) allowed to. You especially would not want us to have any contact with any of them ’cause you didn’t want us to get in trouble in case something would happen. They wouldn’t blame -JOSE JIMENEZ: What kind of trouble? 47 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, like if they would have any fights, or any stealing, or anything so they wouldn’t start saying, “Oh, they’re also part of a gang,” or whatever. We were never allowed to even associate with anything. And I remember one time there was a party, and one of your gang members picked me out to dance, and when they found out that you were -- I was your sister, right away he stopped dancing and took me back to sit down. JOSE JIMENEZ: But this was in the gang time? JUANA JIMENEZ: That was the gang group. JOSE JIMENEZ: That was the gang time. JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember that part. JOSE JIMENEZ: [01:07:00] I was missing for a few years, right? I had to go underground when it was a political group. Do you recall that? JUANA JIMENEZ: I remember when nobody knew where you were at. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so what happened? Because I think you made a video later, too, or something like that. You sent me a video that you made with the whole family. I mean I still have the video (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: Of the whole family? JOSE JIMENEZ: You just put together like a family video and you sent it to me. From here. You were living (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: From Caguas and stuff? JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. ’Cause you wanted to see some pictures and stuff and I did -- 48 �JOSE JIMENEZ: But that was after I came back. I was hiding. JUANA JIMENEZ: After you came back. After you came back. JOSE JIMENEZ: So where do you think I was? And where do you think people were? JUANA JIMENEZ: Well, I didn’t know where you were. You wouldn’t say anything. At first, I thought you were in jail somewhere. I thought, “Well, maybe he’s in jail, he doesn’t want no one to know where he’s at, [01:08:00] so just leave it alone.” I know mother would cry a lot because she didn’t know anything from you. I just kept saying, “Don’t worry. He’ll be fine. If something was wrong, we would hear something from you or somebody would say something.” My mom, she suffered a lot. JOSE JIMENEZ: Did the police ever come by the house after the Young Lords were political? JUANA JIMENEZ: If they did, I wasn’t around to see anything. JOSE JIMENEZ: Oh, you weren’t living there anymore? JUANA JIMENEZ: No. JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay ’cause you got remarried and that. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, then I got remarried. Once I left Michael, I had a baby, and I kept thinking, “Well, this is not for me. And I’m not going to let this guy kill me or my baby.” So I just left him, and after a while I remarried. Not remarried [01:09:00] because I wasn’t married with Michael, but I got married with Willie. JOSE JIMENEZ: You got married with Willie right around that time. How did you meet Willie? 49 �JUANA JIMENEZ: I met Willie because since I was in the unwed mother’s home, my mom and my dad would go visit me, and Willie was my cousin’s (inaudible) friend. And since they were friends, they would go down in the car, driving down, and sometimes Willie would drive or (inaudible) would drive, they would drive ’em down to where I was at, and we met each other. I got tired of staying there, listening to girls cry because they didn’t want to leave their babies and their parents are making them leave their babies there. And I told my mom, I says, “Mom, I really want to go home. I’m tired of this. [01:10:00] I’m tired of hearing these girls cry. This is horrible.” And, “Do you think dad will let me come home?” “I don’t care what he says. I’m gonna pick you up right now.” And she got somebody and they went to pick me up. And I believe that was in March. The month was March, and the next day when my cousin came, he brought Willie also. And all I kept thinking was, “Oh, cute guy. Cute guy.” (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay, so now you’re with Willie and then you’re raising the kids. You were involved in different community stuff, no? I mean what kind of community stuff were you involved in? JUANA JIMENEZ: In which community? JOSE JIMENEZ: I’m wondering about with the scouts or something? What was that about? JUANA JIMENEZ: With the boy scouts, that’s when my oldest son, Joey, [01:11:00] he was a lot older -- well, he went to boy scouts from St. Joseph’s church here in Aurora. And then he just kept going, and we helped out a little bit. That wasn’t too bad. But we helped out more with boy scouts after we came back to Puerto 50 �Rico to live. And my youngest, Danny, he was with the boy scouts, and we did a lot of stuff there with them. JOSE JIMENEZ: What do you call your position? Didn’t you become a member of it? JUANA JIMENEZ: There, once, I was a secretary for them for just a little bit. And we were always just involved with it. If they had anything -- like for their 50-mile hike, we’d be walking with them. Or if they had camping, we’d be camping out with them. Of course, the parents on one side and the scouts on the other side. JOSE JIMENEZ: And this is in [01:12:00] Puerto Rico? JUANA JIMENEZ: This is in Puerto Rico. But in Aurora, no, Joey just went down to the boy scouts, but we weren’t that involved. And then I tried at one time to be with the cub scouts, but it really didn’t work out. I guess I didn’t know what I was doing really, so I just gave it up. It was very different so I didn’t really know what I was doing. JOSE JIMENEZ: Some of the stuff that the Young Lords were fighting for -- they were fighting against police brutality, they were fighting for self-determination for Puerto Rico, they were fighting for ex-offenders, they were fighting for free breakfast for children, like you said, the daycare center. How did you feel about those things? JUANA JIMENEZ: [01:13:00] Well, I thought that that was good that they were helping finally instead of being a gang. Instead of beating up on people, or stealing, or doing bad things, all of a sudden they changed and were -- they turned their whole -JOSE JIMENEZ: Did you see a change or were they just saying it? 51 �JUANA JIMENEZ: No, I did see a change. JOSE JIMENEZ: What kind of a -- JUANA JIMENEZ: You could see the change in the people. The way the people would talk about it -- more of the people around, that was around saying and talking about it. And I kept thinking, “Is it the gang they’re talking about?” Because I wasn’t sure about the organization and the gang part. To me, at that time, it was the same thing except I just kept thinking, “They’re just better. They’re not being bad anymore. They turned good.” (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: So you’re saying they turned good. [01:14:00] But you couldn’t see the difference that much. JUANA JIMENEZ: I saw a little difference but not too much because remember we were always inside. If people were talking, we were always taught not to get into conversations. Never. You were always behind, go to the room, go somewhere else. “We’re talking here. Can’t listen.” JOSE JIMENEZ: There was a community right there in Lincoln Park. Let’s say from Larrabee all the way to Racine, from North Avenue to Diversey. There was like a Puerto Rican community there, too. So have you been to Chicago lately? JUANA JIMENEZ: Have I been to Chicago lately? JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, when was the last time you were in Chicago? JUANA JIMENEZ: Last time I was in Chicago was last year, I believe. JOSE JIMENEZ: Have you seen that there’s -- at Lincoln Park, that neighborhood. JUANA JIMENEZ: I didn’t go down to Lincoln Park, around there. 52 �JOSE JIMENEZ: [01:15:00] Have you heard that there’s no more Puerto Ricans living there? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I did hear. And the last time I went was many, many, many, many years back. We just kinda passed by just to see what the old neighborhood looked like. It looked nothing -- nothing. And I kept thinking, “Wow, it must be like rich people now or something,” because it didn’t look like it before. You would go before, the stairs -- like you just on there and there was no plant life or something. And now it’s like big old fences. JOSE JIMENEZ: Did you care that all those people moved out? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I did care because it kinda bothered me. I kept thinking, “Wow, it’s not like that anymore.” It would have been nice to bring back memories about how it looked before. It looked too clean. (laughs) [01:16:00] I don’t know. JOSE JIMENEZ: But I mean a lot of Puerto Ricans moved out of there. JUANA JIMENEZ: A lot? I think everybody moved out. I don’t think there’s any of them in there. I really don’t know. I really can’t say if they are living there or not, but it didn’t really look like that. JOSE JIMENEZ: So how do you feel that they were kinda pushed out? JUANA JIMENEZ: Didn’t really like it because it seems like you’re pushing us away from things -- “Let somebody else come in because you guys can’t afford this place. Just by looking at you, you can’t afford this place.” And you feel bad about it. And I’ll give you an example. I went to Chicago once, and I went to a store, and I said, “Well, I want to get this.” And, “Well, this costs so and so.” 53 �“So? Like I don’t have money for it [01:17:00] because I’m a Puerto Rican or am a Latin person or something? I’m asking about it because I know I could afford it.” I was at that store because I knew I could afford whatever they had there, or whatever it was that I wanted to buy. You feel like they’re degrading you. JOSE JIMENEZ: This was where? Where was this at? JUANA JIMENEZ: This was -- oh, God. It was a women’s store. JOSE JIMENEZ: In Lincoln Park? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, not in Lincoln Park. Not in Lincoln Park. I can’t remember, but that wasn’t even that long ago either. And I just kept thinking -JOSE JIMENEZ: Well, this neighborhood changed, everybody moved away, and so - JUANA JIMENEZ: Everybody moved away. JOSE JIMENEZ: Was it a choice? Did they have any choice to make? JUANA JIMENEZ: I think they didn’t have a choice because they just kept raising the rent always. Kept raising the rent, kept raising the rent, and then we couldn’t afford it. So we would have to look for [01:18:00] somewhere else to live, you know? And then after they were raising the rent, the person that had their homes there, they were obligated to sell their homes to -- (phone rings). (break in audio) JOSE JIMENEZ: How do you feel because, you know, the Young Lords, they were a gang and then they changed. Then they wanted to help the community. But they were attacked by the government because they were also fighting against people being kicked out of their homes, displaced, like the city. So they were 54 �fighting with Mayor Daley and they were fighting the government because they wanted Puerto Rico to govern themselves whether you agree or not. But because of that -JUANA JIMENEZ: At that time -JOSE JIMENEZ: At that time what? JUANA JIMENEZ: At that time, to me, I really didn’t think anything of it because I had nothing to do with [01:19:00] political stuff. I just kept thinking, “Why does he keep attacking” -- I think they’re doing fine, politics or whatever. I’m never into anything of politics. Never because I don’t like politics. But now, you think back and you think, “Wow, why would they want Puerto Rico to govern itself?” Thinking, “Wow. Why would they want to go back to the stone ages?” You’re trying to move ahead, and Puerto Rico’s not moving ahead. It’s in a standstill, just like moving back a little bit -- inch by inch, but moving back just a little bit. They try, but they move back a little bit, and that’s all just government. JOSE JIMENEZ: But still, the Young Lords had a right to kinda -- JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, you had a right. JOSE JIMENEZ: -- make their choices. JUANA JIMENEZ: They had to make their choices and that’s their choice. JOSE JIMENEZ: But they were attacked real rough by the government. [01:20:00] In fact, remember Bruce Johnson got killed and all that? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. JOSE JIMENEZ: How do you feel about that time when you heard about that? 55 �JUANA JIMENEZ: First, I thought it was just a plan that the police themselves made up so that you guys could get in trouble because I kept thinking, “Why would they kill” -- because they were blaming you guys for doing that killing, or the organization or somebody in that organization for killing him. And I kept thinking, “How can anybody do that if he’s the one that’s helping these people? And the organization knows that he’s helping them, why would they kill him?” So I believe that, to me, it was just like a set up, and it was like the police themselves that did it or something there because never would I believe that it would be -even to this day, [01:21:00] I wouldn’t believe that it was anybody from the Young Lords. Not to kill the Reverend because he was the one helping the Young Lords there. Letting them use the church, letting them -- and everything. And I don’t think nobody would -JOSE JIMENEZ: Did you ever participate in any of the marches or anything? JUANA JIMENEZ: Never. We were never allowed to. Never allowed to. JOSE JIMENEZ: And most of the family didn’t agree with the Young Lords, did they? JUANA JIMENEZ: No. Not at all because they just kept thinking it was just a gang -“It’s a gang.” The organization to them was just like nothing. It was just a gang. JOSE JIMENEZ: So it was like the Puerto Ricans putting each other down, basically. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, they were putting each other down. JOSE JIMENEZ: In other words, “They can’t make it, they’re just a gang.” JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah. JOSE JIMENEZ: Or, “They’re just a gang, they’re nothing.” 56 �JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, “They’re a gang.” Or, “They’re just doing that -- it’s just a set up. They’re trying to do it -- being good, doing good things for other people so [01:22:00] people can see that they’re doing nothing wrong, but they’re really a gang.” So the police wouldn’t blame the organization for anything. JOSE JIMENEZ: And did I ask you how many kids you had? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, you didn’t. I have four kids. JOSE JIMENEZ: What’s their names? JUANA JIMENEZ: My eldest is Joseph, and, of course, I named him after you. I don’t know why, but I did. (laughs) The next one was Sandy, then Margie -- about four years later, Margie came along. And after Margie, about eight years later, Danny came along. So four kids, three with Willie and one with -- the first one with -JOSE JIMENEZ: And now you got some grandkids, too? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes, I have about six grandkids. I had eight and two of my grandkids are not with us anymore. They were babies. JOSE JIMENEZ: Sorry about that. JUANA JIMENEZ: [01:23:00] They were sick babies, but it’s fine. JOSE JIMENEZ: Anything that you want to add? Otherwise, we’ll just finish it up. JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t know. I could say that now I’m happy. I keep telling my husband, “Now, I’m in Puerto Rico, but I’m dying -- I am dying to sell my home and leave to the states,” because I am tired of Puerto Rico. I am tired of Puerto Rico. JOSE JIMENEZ: How long have you been here? 57 �JUANA JIMENEZ: We’ve been here -- let me see. I’ve been here for about 26 -Danny’s 30 -- about 26 years. And that’s 26 years, all I could see is nothing really good for Puerto Rico and I’m tired of it. [01:24:00] You don’t get a job unless you have one of these family member or somebody -- like they say, you scratch my back, I scratch yours or whatever. (Spanish) [01:24:11], they say in Spanish, (Spanish) [01:24:14]. Someone in the political view so they can help you find a job. If not, you’re not gonna get a job here unless it’s in a store or something. But not at all. No jobs here at all. I’m tired of not having water. I’m tired of the light leaving whenever it feels like it and out for days. We have to live. We have to live. And I don’t like the cold weather, but if there was a place that I could stay that it was not expensive, I’d move out of here because I cannot -- I’m tired of this place. I’m tired of people [01:25:00] being so nosy. You’re too close to the family, too close to people next door. And at this age, you just want to relax. And the government is not getting any better. Not at all. It’s not gonna become a state. You either become a state -- the commonwealth, they don’t want to keep it as a commonwealth. Become a state, be independent, or something. And independence is not gonna work, let me tell you. It’s not gonna work. I think it would be a great idea if there was some way that there would be good jobs that they could do something. It’s not gonna work. Nobody really wants it independent. And being a state, we’re paying taxes anyway. JOSE JIMENEZ: How about like the Young Lords say? They’re not talking about independence, [01:26:00] they’re talking about people determining their own life, their own destiny. What do you think about that? 58 �JUANA JIMENEZ: People already determine their own destiny, their own life. People already do that. You don’t have to have anybody tell you. That was before -JOSE JIMENEZ: In Puerto Rico, people determine their own government. That’s what they mean, (inaudible). JUANA JIMENEZ: Oh, their own government? JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, people make decisions that affect their own government. For example, in Chicago, when they had the urban renewal and kicked everybody out, none of the Puerto Ricans were able to make a decision for their own neighborhood. JUANA JIMENEZ: Over there, no. At that time. JOSE JIMENEZ: So in Puerto Rico, it means the same thing. It means just like Puerto Ricans should have been allowed to make decisions about what type of neighborhood they wanted to live in, they need to be able to make a decision in terms of [01:27:00] what type of nation they need to be living in. How do you feel about that? JUANA JIMENEZ: I think everybody -- of course, you want to live in a nation -- let’s say Cuba, they move to Cuba. That’s the way I feel. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you feel that the Young Lords are more closer to Cuba. That’s what you’re saying? In their thinking? JUANA JIMENEZ: In their thinking. JOSE JIMENEZ: And that’s not good? JUANA JIMENEZ: And, also, like Santa Domingo. They’re thinking like that, too, because they want to be apart on their own, but, see, Cubans -- what I know a 59 �little bit of, I don’t know much -- but they don’t want help from the United States, they don’t want help from anybody, but on their own. And for the Dominican Republic, [01:28:00] they’re just a republic, but they’re on their own also. They just get a little bit of help. They don’t get a lot of help. But you look at both of them, they’re both really very poor places. And in Puerto Rico, nobody here is really, really poor. You see people in the streets asking for money and stuff because they want to be that way. You don’t really see people that are really, really, really poor unless you don’t ask for the help. The government usually helps you, but you have to ask for the help. And a lot of times, they’ll show them on TV -- “Oh, look at this poor old lady. Look at the way she’s living in her home.” But, of course, they give them the help and they use the money for other things instead of really helping themselves. I don’t know. [01:29:00] You have to look for help. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you’re saying the homeless, it’s all their fault, basically? JUANA JIMENEZ: No, I’m not saying -JOSE JIMENEZ: Yeah, I think it’s probably their fault if they’re drinking -- JUANA JIMENEZ: If they’re drinking and doing their stuff, but I don’t think it’s all their fault either because drinking is a sickness, and you need to get help from it. But if you don’t take the help, if you don’t want the help -- an example. There is a man I know down right on Route 129 he stands there by the light, and he goes like this so you can give him some money. We give him change, sometimes I give him a dollar or whatever. But I heard if you give him pennies, he throws it. A penny is money. One hundred of those pennies is gonna give you a dollar. 60 �That could get you a cup of coffee, [01:30:00] but he throws money away. He chooses not to take that. So he’s that way because he wants to be, because the government does help him. He does get help. He’ll ask for money for food, go down and sit and drink his coffee, or donut, or whatever, read his newspaper, and walk back to wherever he lives. Down the road or whatever. Pennies? He throws away. I would never throw away pennies. I’m sorry. That’s money. You choose what you want. And if you want to live that way, that’s the way you’re gonna live. If you don’t ask for the help, you’re not gonna get it. JOSE JIMENEZ: Do you also believe that -- and we’re just kind of -- ’cause we don’t want to get into the philosophy, we’re just trying to tell the history and stuff like that. So do you think the Young Lords [01:31:00] did anything to help the community at all or what do you think? It’s a loaded question. JUANA JIMENEZ: It is a loaded question. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: So what do you think? Did they do anything or were they just worthless? JUANA JIMENEZ: I don’t think they were worthless because some of those people that I did see that -- even in the newspapers that you would see -- you would see pictures of them helping other people. And they probably didn’t help, let’s say, for many, many years or stay at the thing for many, many years because they didn’t -- other people wouldn’t let them. Like the government wouldn’t let them or the police wouldn’t let them. They were always trying to get them to separate and break everything apart. Let’s say the daycare center. They went in there and they tore everything out. The police went in there and tore everything out. 61 �And they would look for a way [01:32:00] so that -- you know, let’s say they looked for something wrong to say, “Okay, you’re not -- there’s a fire hazard here you have to close the place down because it is wrong. You don’t have this, you don’t have that.” They would always look for something. JOSE JIMENEZ: The building inspectors. They came to the daycare center to try to close it down. They did close it down. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, they did close it down. JOSE JIMENEZ: So you felt that that was wrong? JUANA JIMENEZ: I thought that was wrong because you guys were doing something really good at that time. I thought it was really great. When they had that daycare center, I thought, “Oh, God. Thank God. Finally, something good is coming out of this.” I thought it was very unfair. Very unfair the way they would go hunting you guys down and treating you -JOSE JIMENEZ: [01:33:00] Hunting the Young Lords down? JUANA JIMENEZ: Yes. They would -JOSE JIMENEZ: The police was hunting them down? JUANA JIMENEZ: Wherever you guys would be, do anything good, they would find something negative about what you were doing, a lot of times. I remember one time walking down the street with my mom going -- I don’t know where we were going, but just walking down with her, and some guy came out, “Oh, you spics, go back to your home.” And, of course, me with my big mouth, “Why don’t you shut the mm out?” And my mom’s grabbing me, “Come on. Come on.” Well, I was learning to defend myself at that time. I was tired of being pushed around. 62 �Speaking of pushing around, let’s leave that. (laughs) I got pushed around sometimes till I got myself [01:34:00] defended by somebody in my brain. (laughs) JOSE JIMENEZ: Okay. Who pushed you around? JUANA JIMENEZ: You. (laughs) You did a lot of pushing around. You pushed Daisy a lot, and I would have to be there trying to defend her. I thought, “I can’t take this. I don’t mind if he’s hitting me, but not her.” Yeah, I had -JOSE JIMENEZ: I didn’t want to leave it at that point, but we’re gonna have to leave it there. JUANA JIMENEZ: Yeah, let’s leave it at that point. (laughter) It’s past. END OF VIDEO FILE 63 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/22e09bbc070228d6d1829942d05abe52.mp4 794fbfc364021e71b25841bcf3f8229e Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Juana Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía Descripción Spanish language Description entry Juana Jiménez es una hermana de José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Nació en Minot, Massachusetts cerca de Concord donde su padre trabajo como tomatero para Andy Boy Farms en 1940. Aquí recogieron vegetables para la compañía de Campbell Soup. En 1951 la familia se cambio a Chicago para acercarse con familiares que vivían en La Clark. Juana creció en Lincoln Park Wicker Park. Cuando se embarazo, antes de tener esposo, la mandaron a una casa para mujeres jóvenes que era atendida por monjas Católicas. Aquí es donde ella desarrollo su espirituelidad y todavía sigue muy dedicada en su comunida igual que ayudando los equipos de Béisbol y boliche en que esta su esposo y corriendo el grupo de Boy Scout para sus hijos y los del vecindario. Ahora vive en Camuy, Puerto Rico. Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Narrativas personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Puertorriqueños--Illinois--Chicago--Vida social y costumbres Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Juana Title A name given to the resource Juana “Jenny” Jiménez video interview and transcript Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Juana Description An account of the resource Juana “Jenny” Jiménez is one of José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez’s sisters. She was born while her father, Antonio, worked as a seasonal farm laborer, or tomatero, in the late 1940s for Andy Boy Farms at a migrant camp in Minot, Massachusetts near Concord. They picked vegetables primarily for the Campbell Soup Company. In 1951 the family moved to Chicago to be closer to other relatives who had been living in La Clark since the late 1940s. Jenny grew up in Lincoln Park and in Wicker Park. When she became pregnant, but was unmarried, she was placed temporarily in a juvenile home for girls run by Catholic nuns. It is there that Jenny developed her spirituality and she remains very active in her community to this day, including working on behalf of her husband’s baseball and bowling leagues and running a Boy Scout troop to support her own and other neighborhood children in Puerto Rico. She now lives in Camuy, Puerto Rico. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puerto Ricans--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Puerto Ricans--Illinois--Chicago--Social life and customs Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-05-10 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/b79328206530ed61af8bd8099fbabd9d.pdf 24611a3bf384fddb08ba23281efcd23d PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Marcelo Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 5/12/2012 Biography and Description Marcelo Jiménez, or “Chelo,” is one of the younger sons of Cristina (Tino) and Gregorio Jiménez. Mr. Jiménez grew up in San Salvador, Caguas, Puerto Rico and did work in that mountain barrio like the others, laboring on different farms or helping to construct neighbors’ homes, and migrating back and forth to the United States to work in fields, factories, and hotels. Mr. Jiménez also worked in a foundry on Armitage Avenue by the Chicago River branch in Lincoln Park for many years. Back in Puerto Rico he continued to help his father plow or turn the soil on the farm, using two bulls and a small plow. He also hung tobacco to dry in the tall rancho that they made from the bamboo that grew next to the creek. The creek served as the boundary of the farm in the 1940s through the 1980s when some of the plots were sold by some of the family. Mr. Jiménez would load the produce in his truck, or a cow when money was needed, and head to La Plaza Mercado in Caguas, near La Salida, or exit, to Aguas Buenas. When José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez lived in Puerto Rico in 1963-64, he became Mr. Jiménez’s assistant in his cow feed distribution business. Each morning they would fill up Mr. Jiménez truck with 100 lbs. bags of cow feed. They would then drink their coffee with cow’s milk from the can, a few soda crackers and butter and Tino and Don Goyo would wave them on. The two of them would leave in darkness and travel to nearly every town on the Island, delivering and selling the bags of feed, and would not return until late. When business was slow Mr. Jiménez and Cha-Cha would hang out with the Titeres de La Plaza, or the �Huckleberry Finns clique, of San Salvador, sometimes even barefoot. The youth clique is centuries old. No one is excluded. It is like a life passage that exists today in a varied fashion. There was rarely any harm done. Everyone knew them, and then there was no police to bother them. But back In Chicago Mr. Jiménez would sometimes hang out with his cousins of the Hacha Viejas. Most of the time they did the same thing but in a rougher manner. In Chicago the neighborhood was unstable and transient. There was prejudice and hunger (poverty). The culture in Chicago was “everyone for themselves,” as Mr. Jiménez recalls. And then there was police intimidation and many times unnecessary arrests that served to served as bragging points and hardened the group. For Mr. Jiménez, he was lucky to join with other groups for support, like the Caballeros de San Juan. And most of the time he just worked long hours and enjoyed his children and family. His relatives were also part of the Caballeros and Damas de María. He became one of the first immigrants to Chicago during what some called the Great Migration of Puerto Ricans, between 1950 and 1960. This was the era when Puerto Ricans were going back and forth from Puerto Rico to Chicago. Mr. Jiménez built a mansion in San Salvador and today lives content in the town of Caguas. � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/ce63e47b2950c0dd9d380a41a9d3ed46.mp4 fc32d0fbb486c60edce5f0d3faab69e9 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Marcelo Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Marcelo Title A name given to the resource Marcelo Jiménez video interview and biography Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Marcelo Description An account of the resource Marcelo Jiménez, or “Chelo,” is one of the younger sons of Cristina (Tino) and Gregorio Jiménez. Mr. Jiménez grew up in San Salvador, Caguas, Puerto Rico and did work in that mountain barrio like the others, laboring on different farms or helping to construct neighbors’ homes, and migrating back and forth to the United States to work in fields, factories, and hotels. Mr. Jiménez also worked in a foundry on Armitage Avenue by the Chicago River branch in Lincoln Park for many years. Back in Puerto Rico he continued to help his father plow or turn the soil on the farm, using two bulls and a small plow. He also hung tobacco to dry in the tall rancho that they made from the bamboo that grew next to the creek. The creek served as the boundary of the farm in the 1940s through the 1980s when some of the plots were sold by some of the family. Mr. Jiménez would load the produce in his truck, or a cow when money was needed, and head to La Plaza Mercado in Caguas, near La Salida, or exit, to Aguas Buenas. When José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez lived in Puerto Rico in 1963-64, he became Mr. Jiménez’s assistant in his cow feed distribution business. Each morning they would fill up Mr. Jiménez truck with 100 lbs. bags of cow feed. They would then drink their coffee with cow’s milk from the can, a few soda crackers and butter and Tino and Don Goyo would wave them on. The two of them would leave in darkness and travel to nearly every town on the Island, delivering and selling the bags of feed, and would not return until late. When business was slow Mr. Jiménez and Cha-Cha would hang out with the Titeres de La Plaza, or the Huckleberry Finns clique, of San Salvador, sometimes even barefoot. The youth clique is centuries old. No one is excluded. It is like a life passage that exists today in a varied fashion. There was rarely any harm done. Everyone knew them, and then there was no police to bother them. But back In Chicago Mr. Jiménez would sometimes hang out with his cousins of the Hacha Viejas. Most of the time they did the same thing but in a rougher manner. In Chicago the neighborhood was unstable and transient. There was prejudice and hunger (poverty). The culture in Chicago was “everyone for themselves,” as Mr. Jiménez recalls. And then there was police intimidation and many times unnecessary arrests that served to served as bragging points and hardened the group. For Mr. Jiménez, he was lucky to join with other groups for support, like the Caballeros de San Juan. And most of the time he just worked long hours and enjoyed his children and family. His relatives were also part of the Caballeros and Damas de María. He became one of the first immigrants to Chicago during what some called the Great Migration of Puerto Ricans, between 1950 and 1960. This was the era when Puerto Ricans were going back and forth from Puerto Rico to Chicago. Mr. Jiménez built a mansion in San Salvador and today lives content in the town of Caguas. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Spanish language--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Language A language of the resource spa Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-05-12 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d84e090228651be9efc7c279456114c5.pdf 4432c12379a61b6df25c4eb325890351 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Melisa Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 7/15/2012 Biography and Description Melisa Jiménez is the youngest daughter of Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Like his other children she was not able to grow up with Mr. Jiménez. But she has always maintained a close relationship with him, even though they live miles away from each other. Ms. Jiménez’s other siblings are Jackie, Jodie, Sonia, and Alex. Ms. Jiménez lives not far from Mrs. Iberia Hampton, Fred Hampton’s mother, and they have maintained a close personal relationship for many years. Ms. Jiménez was born in the Lincoln Park neighborhood hospital, via the use of the La Maze childbirth method. Her father reminds her that he was the first to hold her. Ms. Jiménez lived in Lincoln Park for the first years of her life until the rent became unbearable for her mother. Only a couple of months after she was born, her father was incarcerated for a year, awaiting trial because his bond was too far out of range for his income. He later explained to her that he was doing, “volunteer work, supporting the Puerto Rican Freedom fighters.” When Mr. Jiménez won the case, Ms. Jiménez was living in Logan Square and they were once again united. This time Jackie, the oldest of Mr. Jiménez’s daughters from another relationship, moved in with them briefly. Teenage Jackie had a young boyfriend who was extremely polite, but very persistent. So Jackie’s mother, frustrated, dropped her off for Mr. Jiménez “to take responsibility and to take care of her.” He gladly agreed. And It was a way for Melisa and Jackie to get to know each other. Each sibling plays a role and Ms. Jiménez has played the role of sibling unifier in a world of divorce and separations. �She graduated from Oak Park River Forest High School in 1998 and attended some college. She loves photography and is an accomplished artist. Some of her jobs have included child care, marketing research and mortgage broker sales. �Transcript JOSE JIMENEZ: [00:00:00] Okay, we were talking about the substance abuse and the neighborhoods being filled with drugs and all that as part of sociology. MELISA JIMENEZ: It’s my personal opinion that that is why my generation lost fathers in the household because you have soldiers who came back traumatized from war. Whether they’re physically okay or not, they were not able to be part of the family the way that families were used to having the man of the house. You have people who were very hard-working who became a part of the Civil Rights Movement and were extremely passionate and had their souls crushed, watching everything around them be destroyed. You know, the movement starts with this anger and it turns into this excitement and this purpose, and then you watch people who [00:01:00] finally understand you be destroyed and killed or discredited. JJ: And so people were talking about that among that group of people, your family, that you call the extended family? Around Angie and -- MJ: I still feel -- and I wasn’t even born then -- I feel it as if it was part of my history, part of a memory I’ve had, and it’s the feeling of it. It’s not the times and dates and, oh, so-and-so did this. It’s something that still affects my generation. I’m getting older now so it may not affect the people who are a little bit younger than me, but it crushes your spirit to think that you can finally have a voice that’s the American dream. Everybody has the right to their own freedom of speech and freedom of opinion, and if you do, you might be destroyed by it. You know, that’s 1 �not really freedom. That’s a trap. And to be able to believe in something [00:02:00] and then have it torn apart is not something that affects one person. It affects everybody. Everybody feels it. JJ: What do you mean, torn apart? Do you believe in something that is torn apart? What do you mean? MJ: To have people, you know, like Malcolm X or Martin Luther King or Fred Hampton or the Reverend -- JJ: Bruce Johnson? MJ: -- Bruce Johnson. People who love their people, but not because it’s a cause. Because they really love people, and they have felt this and they’ve lived through it and they’re finding a way to talk to other people -- JJ: Now, you’re only reading about these people, right? MJ: I’m not reading about just these people. I’m knowing the people that they affected. I grew up with the people that they affected. I just happened to be born in the middle of this, and everybody I know was personally touched, knew these people individually, and -- JJ: I mean, did you know anybody that knew Fred Hampton? MJ: I do. I mean, [00:03:00] you worked with Fred Hampton. You know, you as ChaCha Jiménez, then Fred Hampton created along with the Brown Berets the Rainbow Coalition. JJ: Along with the Young Patriots. MJ: The Young Patriots. JJ: Yeah. That’s all right. 2 �MJ: I know them as -- JJ: Okay, no, no, the Brown Berets were on it too. MJ: I mean, and later in my life, my mother, after she retired, she still did community work but she does it with children. You know, she doesn’t do it -- JJ: Didn’t you know Fred Hampton’s mother? MJ: Yes, that’s what I’m saying. She was doing community events with the children, my mother was, and at a community event, she happened to bump into this other woman and they had a great conversation and that was it. They were at different community events and they kept bumping into each other and they became friends. JJ: Which other woman? MJ: Just because of who they are, how they are a part of the community, they just got along. Their personalities matched. And it wasn’t until months after that that she found out that was Fred Hampton’s mother, and Mrs. Hampton found out that my mother [00:04:00] used to be involved with you, or married to you. So these two women had already developed a friendship without knowing their connection to the movement because it is a neighborhood thing. It’s just a neighborhood feeling. It’s who you are as a person, to take care of each other, that they were involved in activities that was taking care of the whole community and they kept bumping into each other and they really got along and they really started spending time together. They didn’t pass each other’s resumes to each other. They’re just normal women who have loved through this and lost through this and they had a lot in common. 3 �JJ: So what did she say Fred Hampton’s mother was doing? Iberia Hampton. MJ: Iberia Hampton, Mrs. Hampton, she’s been in a number -- her other son, Bill Hampton, is very involved in the community and he works a lot with the children. He sets up incredibly programs with the children and he runs -- JJ: Back in Oak Park? MJ: In Maywood and he [00:05:00] does a lot of work in the city and he runs the Fred Hampton Legal Scholarship Fund to help students become lawyers. But he I think put together a lot of the different events, and because he found out through other parents about my mom and different things she was doing, he came to where she was working at the time and invited her to come to some of these events and she thought that was really nice. She thought some of the kids’ parents invited her. She really didn’t know. And it was months later that they figured out together, we’ve pretty much been running in the same circles all these years, and they’re very good friends. They feel more like family. JJ: So did Fred Hampton’s mother know about the Young Lords? MJ: Oh, sure. I think she’s met you a couple times. We didn’t all know each other at the same time. I wasn’t born yet, but you know, my mother and you and Mrs. Hampton [00:06:00] all had different time periods that you were connected to each other, and it just so happened that even years later, without being an activist or protesting, but just doing things for the kids in the neighborhood, that they were brought together and met each other as two people, normal people. JJ: And so how long as their relationship existed? 4 �MJ: Between my mother and Mrs. Hampton, they’ve been friends for now, like, seven or eight years. JJ: Seven or eight years? MJ: Yeah. JJ: So have you gone there yourself? MJ: I have. I haven’t been there lately and I’m probably in trouble for it, but I need to call her pretty much today. (laughs) I’m a little late. But yeah, no, she actually, my mother and she just talked to each other two days ago. JJ: So you’re consistent. MJ: Yeah, they’re friends. They are good friends. She’s a wonderful person. Her husband was a wonderful [00:07:00] person. He passed away. JJ: What’s his name? MJ: I don’t call them by their first names. I call them Mr. and Mrs. Hampton. But he passed away. JJ: (inaudible). MJ: I went to his funeral. It was sad but they both have beautiful, beautiful spirits. JJ: Did you go to his funeral? Okay. MJ: Yeah. I don’t like people saying funerals are beautiful because it seems painful, but he had a beautiful funeral and it was sad to say goodbye to him, to his spirit. JJ: So how is Mrs. Hampton? How is she? What type of person? MJ: She’s very funny. She can be very quiet but she knows exactly what’s going on and she’s just letting other people do their thing. She allows other people to 5 �express themselves, but she does not miss a second of it. She’s very, very quick and very funny and very loving. [00:08:00] Super sweet. JJ: Okay. Well, what do you mean, she lets them speak? MJ: Well, you know, you almost think that she’s not paying any attention and she’s in the other room doing her own thing and she is not missing a beat. She is on it. Someone says something and she gets excited about it. She’s been paying attention the whole time and she’ll tell you exactly what she feels and it’s obvious she’s been paying attention the entire conversation, not just that minute. Very, very smart. JJ: But you said Ginger called her a couple days ago? MJ: Well, she missed her call. She called back, returned a phone call. No, Bill Hampton’s birthday was last week and they just threw him a surprise party. Then there was a different event this week. It was fun stuff. JJ: So you visit also to the house or just call? MJ: I mean, I [00:09:00] did. I haven’t lately because I’ve been busy working, but I’ve missed seeing a lot of people. (laughs) Don’t be mad at me. JJ: No, no, I’m not mad. I was happy to find out that you knew her, Mrs. Hampton. MJ: Oh, yeah. But it was a complete coincidence, if you believe in them. You know, a lot of people don’t believe in coincidences. But it was very special. I think they were meant to be friends. They just had never met before. They have a good friendship. JJ: And each accepts each other without hesitation or whatever? 6 �MJ: Oh, no, as if they’ve known each other forever, almost sisters. They’re very natural and honest with each other. JJ: ’Cause I know your mother’s a little religious. But she doesn’t call it religion. MJ: No, she’s a spiritual person too. She was raised Catholic. But she’s very spiritual. JJ: And is Mrs. Hampton the same way or similar? MJ: Mrs. Hampton, I know she believes. [00:10:00] They talk about God all the time. They talk about life. They talk about love and pain and they’re just girlfriends. They’re just not teenagers, but you know, it’s like they’re teenagers when they’re around each other. They’re just friends. They have a good relationship. JJ: Okay, so their connection is not just Young Lords or Panthers. MJ: No. It’s more surviving that, losing someone you love -- JJ: Surviving that? MJ: In the movement. You know, there are real people involved in this. This is not just about political heads or people with motives. There are real families that survive it. They lose people or -- I don’t know the word for that. It’s not a negotiation that they get to participate in, but they have to feel all of. You know, Mrs. Hampton lost her son. That’s not [00:11:00] a public thing for her. That’s real personal. Being the wife of someone involved in this and the mother of their child, watching someone’s child -- not legally married, but in our family when you are in a committed relationship, you are basically each other’s husband and wife. You’re each other’s partner. But having a child with that person and watching your child, you know, grow up and have different questions and having to figure 7 �out -- you know, you have your own memories of living through it and then you have to figure out how to help your child get through something normal that they can’t have. You know, these are not things that are part-time and they don’t last for a certain month that there’s a campaign or a certain year that there’s a campaign. This is the everyday forever and the rest of our lives, living through. [00:12:00] It becomes a part of you. It’s something that you grow from. It becomes something you make it through. JJ: What do you know of the death of Fred Hampton? What do you know about that? What happened? MJ: I don’t really know it through newspapers and media. I know it through family stories, like it was someone close to our family, this happened to them. And I know it as -- JJ: Family stories. Who told you? MJ: Both my mother and my father. JJ: Oh. MJ: But my mother had an incredible amount of respect for Fred Hampton. She knew him before she ever met you. She went to school. He spoke at the school she went to several times. JJ: At Roosevelt. MJ: At Roosevelt. JJ: He spoke a lot at Roosevelt, yeah. MJ: And she had a tremendous amount of respect for him. [00:13:00] He was incredibly intelligent and he was in no way violent. He was in no way -- 8 �JJ: Well, he spoke of armed struggle and revolution. MJ: He did speak of those things, but he was more about education and sharing education with other people and not just seeing whose back he can climb up to get there himself, but for everybody to rise up, for everybody to be able to elevate to a new level together. He wanted to be a lawyer. He didn’t wanna be a gangster. He wasn’t a gangster. He wanted to teach everybody around. He wanted everybody to want to learn. He loved learning. He was very respectful. He didn’t come from the street life. He came from the country life. He came from a family life. You know, you came from a family life. You came from a religious home. You’re not people that were out there hustling, trying [00:14:00] to get over and see how much you could get. There’s such a different mentality now of “Screw the person next to me. Whatever I can get. We have to worry about us. We can’t think of anybody else.” And that’s not what either one of you came from or spread. That wasn’t your message. There was no agenda of personal propriety. But no, he was an intellect who wanted to share that wealth. That was the wealth that he wanted to share with other people and that’s what I mean about not violent. You know, he wasn’t out there trying to be the hardest thug on the corner. He was out there trying to spread this information, this knowledge, and that was a very scary threat to government, I guess, to certain government. There’s different [00:15:00] levels of government. There’s city government, state government, national government. And he was murdered for it because he was too loud. He was talking too loud. Too many people were able to hear his message and I believe they, in terms of government -- the government in that 9 �time period. I’m not saying all government. I’m saying that particular regime of government -- did not want people to stay thinking. They didn’t want them to start noticing how things could be different or better or that everybody had a voice. They wanted to have the voice that everybody followed and he was talking too loud for them. So, I mean, in my own words, they assassinated him and that’s still a very special word, a very big word. They killed this man who was about education and fairness, who everybody could relate to and [00:16:00] looked up to, that they maybe could be like that too. “Wow, we could do something for ourselves instead of everything being the same and out of our hands. We could have some sort of power ourselves and be responsible and active ourselves.” That was the opposite of what this particular government regime was interested in and they killed this man. It’s very personal. Assassination is just a big word. That’s a personal thing. They took this man from people ’cause they didn’t agree with him. JJ: Was there any other, like, repression that you were familiar with at that time? Like, even the Young Lords or the Panthers? You know what I mean by repression, right? MJ: I’m not sure what you- JJ: Like trying to stop the movement, trying to repress it, trying to stop it. MJ: I think they were -- JJ: [00:17:00] Were there any, you know, plans to try to do that? Or did they do that? MJ: I think there were just a few moments at the beginning of the Civil Rights Movement where -- 10 �JJ: I mean, that you experienced, I mean. MJ: That I experienced? I was born after the movement was disembodied. JJ: Let me ask you this. When did you first hear about the Young Lords? MJ: I’m sure I heard about it from being four years old or younger, being in the house and hearing about it all the time. But the first time I was aware of it was probably after I asked my mom why we didn’t have any family. It was just the two of us. And part of her telling stories about my family, she also was telling stories about the Young Lords. So I learned at the same time. So from about seven, eight, nine [00:18:00] years old, that’s when I started hearing about the Young Lords. JJ: So how did you feel about that? I mean, you know, what did you hear and how did you feel about it? MJ: I was so proud. I was so tiny and so empowered. (laughs) This itty-bitty little eight-year-old walking around like, “Wow,” you know? This is pretty amazing. First of all, it was very sad to know that people were treated horribly. It was heartbreaking to know that people were not all treated with the same amount of respect, and how could you look at somebody struggling this way and not go and help them? You don’t teach your kids to be mean like that. You teach your kids to be polite and to help people out. So a child is full of kindness and caring for the person in front of them, and to hear that there is people in the [00:19:00] world that are being treated horribly, disrespected constantly, and being not treated as an equal but treated, like, dismissive -- JJ: Who was not being treated as an equal? MJ: Well, I was taught about the whole Civil Rights Movement. 11 �JJ: Okay, it was the Civil Rights Movement and then it was, like, our movement there afterwards, the Panthers and the Young Lords. MJ: But I was taught about the whole history of it. Why was there ever Young Lords or Black Panthers? It’s because of the Civil Rights Movement. Why was there ever a Civil Rights Movement? Because of all this history of pent-up aggression building and building until it bursts. This oppression is overwhelming until there’s got to be a crack in it at some point. I was [layered?] in history, talked about all of it. JJ: Well, who was [the narrator?]? Your mom? MJ: Well, she did teach me about it. She was the first introduction to it because [00:20:00] at eight years old, you’re in second grade. You know, I’m talking about watching movies on TV and not understanding what’s going on and she’s like, “Well, this is related to this part of the country,” or “This part of history.” She was very topical with it, very objective. You know, she would only answer the question I asked. She wouldn’t paint a whole picture for me. It was like, “I don’t understand what that sentence is, Mom. What did she mean?” Or “What did he mean?” And it’s like, “Oh, well, why don’t you go get the encyclopedia? In the 1800s, this is what they used to do.” So it would start a conversation and in second grade, you’re not talking about history. You’re talking about addition and cursive and spelling tests. So we just started those conversations. But that’s how it is all connected and that’s how I was introduced to the Young Lords. It started a doorway of, “Well, why would that happen?” “Because this was happening.” “Well, why did that happen?” “And this bigger thing was 12 �happening.” And so [00:21:00] I don’t remember the original question you asked me, but how I heard about the Young Lords was around seven or eight years old. There was a layering to it. There is something that happened to create this situation, these circumstances that Young Lords was born from, why it was happening. There was a lot going on. JJ: And you said you felt some pride in that? MJ: I was very proud. Once I understood that people would ever be treated that way, then it was like, well, somebody has to do something about it. That’s just the natural thing. When you get in trouble in school, it’s like somebody’s responsible. Aren’t you going to tell the teacher to help? You don’t just let somebody sit there and bleed, you know? Somebody has to help. Somebody has to do something. And so even as a child, you have the mentality of, “Well, what happened next? Didn’t somebody do anything?” And it was like, “Well, yes. In our area, you know, people in this area were the ones that were bleeding and [00:22:00] they got tired of watching their parents bleed and they would be hurt, be stifled by all their efforts. They’re trying just to make a home for their family and everything they’re doing keeps being undone or undercut and their children got tired of watching it. They got tired of being pushed around and watching their parents being knocked over and they stood up and spoke back and said, we have rights and we deserve respect and this is what we need and you cannot ignore our voices.” And in this area, that was the Young Lords. That was happening all over the country, but the thing that is so significant about the Young Lords is it didn’t start as an organized program or an organization. It started as a street 13 �gang and it is still to this point in history the only street gang that turned into a political organization. It did not manhandle its way into papers [00:23:00] and thug out the neighborhood or steal from people. It was for the people and it didn’t start off in a classroom. It started in the streets, protecting their own homes, and what I’m aware of, that’s the only group that has started out as a street gang and become a political organization. JJ: So protecting their own homes, was that an issue that they were, you know, attacking? MJ: I mean, from what I’m told. JJ: Yeah, from your understanding. MJ: From what I understand. JJ: Well, what were the main issues? MJ: People were getting -- JJ: It had to do with Puerto Ricans ’cause it had to do with Puerto Rico. MJ: Well, that whole area was mainly -- even though there were different ethnic backgrounds, it was mainly Puerto Rican at the time. That was the Puerto Rican neighborhood of the city and it happened to be lakefront property as well and it was more valuable monetarily to people [00:24:00] in power at that time, whether it was corporate or government. And so they were coming in and telling people, “It’s time to move.” JJ: They were telling people to move? MJ: They were raising people’s rents from 80 dollars to 400 in a month or 120 dollars to 800 dollars the next month. Well, you can’t pay? You gotta go. This is how I 14 �was told. As I was told, there were times as well that people were being manhandled directly out of their homes. Someone would just come in and kick all of their things out onto the ground and say, “You don’t live here anymore. Go. You guys can move over.” JJ: [The share?], basically, [’cause it was the candles?] (inaudible). MJ: But that’s gotta be quite an experience to know you’re doing everything you can to pay your bills and you’re paying them and you come home from work one day and someone just told you, “You moved today, in case you didn’t know.” [00:25:00] And you can’t do anything about it. There’s nobody to go to. JJ: But even while you were growing up, you’re saying the neighborhood was still changing, no? MJ: When I was growing up? JJ: Yeah. Or you didn’t notice? I mean, you weren’t living there anymore, but I mean, you went back there ’cause the neighborhood is completely changed, right? MJ: It has completely changed. They kept the shape of it, but they changed everything in between. I guess when I was growing up, it did change. It was much more human before. You could just walk down the street and know somebody and everybody was happy to just wave and say hello, and now it’s just a tourist spot and the people who live there are not very welcoming. (laughs) But mostly it’s a tourist area. And [00:26:00] no, before it was, like, going to visit your cousin’s house. JJ: So do you remember before? 15 �MJ: Yeah. JJ: Okay. MJ: You knew everybody on the block and you just got off the bus or came off the train, and walking to the person’s house you’re going to, you see five different people you know. You stop and you have a conversation, like a neighborhood. Like home. And you don’t know anybody there now. They don’t do that with each other. JJ: Okay. So that made you feel proud in everything. You had some proud moments. What about some painful moments when they talked about the Young Lords? With you, since your father was involved in it. Did you ever have any painful moments? MJ: Painful moments, I think that we all did. JJ: Did anybody talk [00:27:00] negative about the Young Lords? MJ: Sure. I mean, I have bumped into people and I tend not to introduce myself first if I’m in an area where people still talk about the Young Lords, not because I’m not proud, because I’d rather get an honest reaction to what they think. I am always absorbing information and I love to get a lot of different perspectives and I don’t take it personal because that was their experience, so I wanna hear it. JJ: What are some of the negative things that you heard? MJ: (laughs) I remember walking into a building once and I was with someone who could not wait to introduce me and I was like, “Shh. Just say hello. Give this person a chance to get up in their chair.” And this person was very polite and shook my hand and I said, “I’m Melisa,” and he told me his name. And the 16 �person I was with said, “Oh, do you remember that guy? You know the Young Lords. Do you remember that guy, Cha-Cha?” “Oh my God, that thug. He used to --” [00:28:00] I mean, I was laughing ’cause he’s sitting there, he’s like, “He used to just make so much trouble around here. He was such a headache and I can’t believe --” And I guess the person I was with gave him a look because all the sudden, he stopped talking and he looked at me, and then I was introduced as Cha-Cha’s daughter and he just went completely pale and he was like, “I’m so sorry.” I said, “Why would you be? Maybe he was mean to you. (laughs) Maybe you guys didn’t like each other. That’s your experience and I’m not taking anything away from that.” And he was like, “No, but I’m so sorry,” and I said, “That was your experience. That’s your history. But I happen to like the guy so I’m okay with it. So don’t worry about it.” And he just couldn’t catch his breath for a long time. I felt bad. But I don’t introduce myself first, and it’s not to set anybody up. I just wanna know what they really think, what their real memories were. I wasn’t older at that time period, so I like to know what people went through. JJ: Actually there’s a similar experience that my mother [00:29:00] had with somebody from the church. So you know, that’s kind of a pretty good -- because it was like 50-50 real controversial. MJ: It wasn’t controversial. I’ve bumped into people that just said, like, I was royalty, like you were royalty, and “Oh my God, you’re his daughter.” And that experience is much more common than the other. But, like, I didn’t do anything. You know, I’m glad that you had a positive experience. And they’re like, “No, no, this was so 17 �important. He did this and he did this.” I’ve had people treat me wonderfully because of how much it meant to them and I’ve had people be very nasty because they don’t agree with the politics and I personally -JJ: I know you’re joking but it must hurt. MJ: No, it doesn’t hurt because I like to see how people think. I like to see through other people’s eyes. JJ: That’s now, but when you were growing up. MJ: No. JJ: [00:30:00] Never? MJ: Because I was a child and there was more of a filter on them. I was prepared for it, but they had more of a filter because they were looking at a child, and I mean, you shouldn’t attack a child. But when they were honest about what they said, I appreciated it. I want to know all of the story. I don’t wanna know just the things I like or I agree with. And I need to understand. That’s how I’ve learned about it, by being open about it and not expecting someone to agree with something that I think. That’s not gonna work. JJ: I’m gonna kind of wrap it up a little bit, but I just wanted to -- MJ: Am I a talker? (laughs) JJ: No, no, no. No, I was just trying to -- MJ: I am, it’s all right. JJ: -- just because of the schedule. MJ: Okay. No, I have had painful moments, though. JJ: You had painful moments? 18 �MJ: I didn’t lose my father like Angie’s kids did or like Fred Hampton [00:31:00] Junior did, but I still lost my father, having a father in my home. My brothers and sisters still lost having a father while they were growing up. And we’ve had the opportunity to still get to know you, which they didn’t, but we still lost the possession of, “That’s my dad. He just belongs to me and everybody else doesn’t get a piece of him. He’s just ours.” We didn’t get that opportunity. And maybe that had something to do with it. When my mother and I left when I was four and a half during the height of your substance abuse, very shortly after, you disappeared. [00:32:00] You were just gone and nobody knew where you were and I think some people even blamed my mom. Like, if you hadn’t left him, he wouldn’t have just disappeared, you know? What did you do? Nobody can find him. No one even knows where he is. And that went on for a little while, and then a couple years passed and then -- JJ: So that went on for a few years. MJ: It went on for a little while. JJ: Like, five years, something like that. MJ: A little while. A couple years later, people started trying to prepare themselves that you just were never coming back, and so they started saying, you know, “I don’t wanna say the thing that you’re not supposed to say, but I think he’s dead.” And they would try not to say it around me but I heard them talking about it and I knew it wasn’t true. And more time passed. Then it finally got to being five years, you were gone and nobody knew where you were. Everybody [00:33:00] had accepted that you were just dead. 19 �JJ: You’re talking about family members? MJ: Family members were at the point -- five years after my mother and I left, five years almost to the day, everybody for at least the last six months had been trying to figure out how do we tell Melisa that her father is dead? Because she walks around here like -- she’s just so happy and she’s gonna talk to him one day, and we have to figure out how to tell her. And they were whispering about it over and over and I know that I went up to them one day. I was nine years old at the time. And I put my hand on Angie’s hand and I put my other hand on my mom’s hand and I said, “Don’t worry, he’s not dead. I know he’s not dead. You guys don’t have to worry about how to talk to me about it.” And they just couldn’t believe that I even knew what they were talking about, but I seriously said, “I can [00:34:00] feel him. I know he’s okay. He’s just not ready to be with us right now. But don’t worry.” And Angie seriously was like -- they never talked about it again, and within a month -- I’m gonna tell you -- that particular month I prayed for two things, and never in my life, I have never prayed to ask for something back. I pray to thank God for things. I don’t pray to ask for things in return. But that month, I prayed for two things, and one of them was just for my dad to let everybody know he was okay. Even if he’s not ready to come back, can you just please -- they’re starting to really worry. Can you just let him know or have him let everybody know that he’s okay? And then I prayed for something else. And that particular month, not even a week later, my mom got a call from Angie and said, “You will not believe. He’s alive. He’s gonna be here on Friday. He wanted to know if you would bring Melisa because he really wants to see her.” 20 �[00:35:00] And they just couldn’t believe. And I told my mom, I said, “I’m not supposed to tell you what I talked to God about because that’s between us, but I knew he was going to --” And maybe that sounds mystical and spooky or whatever, but those are the only two things in my life that I ever asked for, and that month, they both came true. Not that I’m saying I had any effect on that, but I’m saying the timeframe, when I was four and a half and we left you, soon after, you left, and the whole family went through an experience where they grieved your loss. They really believed you were gone. Everybody was certain of it because by that point, five years had passed. They tried for years to just deal with the fact that you were probably underground or something or maybe just doing drugs and not in a good place. And they finally got to the point where they accepted that you were gone and they really went through a hard time trying to figure out how to tell your kids that we would never see you again. But [00:36:00] your mother -- my grandmother -- and I knew that you were alive because we both could feel you and we talked about it. Everybody else was really broken, trying to figure out how to help us deal with it ’cause they thought we were in denial. And lo and behold, you showed up in Chicago (laughs) within the same month and you were okay and you had changed your life in a big way and you were in a good place. And everybody was just shocked. They really thought you were gone. And that was not an easy time. It was sad. But I knew that you were okay. I just knew that I didn’t know when I would ever talk to you again. I didn’t know. At that time, I had no picture of your face in my mind. I just remembered loving you and you loving me. But I could not remember your face. And then 21 �everybody around me is so sad, thinking you’re gone. That was hard to watch everybody I loved so sad. JJ: So do you remember where -- MJ: [00:37:00] I don’t remember when you left the city but I know that you moved to Michigan. By the time you came back, you were living in Michigan and you came back just to see us. JJ: Right. I was trying to get myself together. MJ: You did. You did a very good job. JJ: I was going a little downhill by that time and I didn’t have the [will?] or money or anything like that (inaudible). And my perfectionism, I had to make sure everything’s perfect. MJ: You are, and I missed a lot of times spending time with you because you were afraid you didn’t have anything to give me and I didn’t want anything but you. And that took a few years for you to accept that. JJ: I keep that in mind now. MJ: All right, good. (laughter) That’s good. You don’t need to give me anything. No. But we missed more time later. JJ: What did you want? What did you want to tell your father? What was the most important thing that you wanted people to know? Not just [00:38:00] your father. Maybe the world or -- about you. MJ: About me? That’s a loaded question. You have layers to that. 22 �JJ: Okay, (inaudible). I mean, what’s the main thing that you want people to know about you? This is an oral history (inaudible) but I [shouldn’t be so formal?] after what you just said. MJ: (laughter) No. I don’t know that there’s anything I need the world to know about me. JJ: Or me, maybe I don’t -- ’cause I was underground. I’m just trying to go with [that?]. MJ: I think people don’t know that you are hilarious unless they know you. They don’t know that you’re hilarious. You have an incredible sense of humor and you are always cracking jokes at moments that everybody thinks you’re gonna be serious, just come out of nowhere and everybody’s cracking up because it’s a surprise. JJ: But I was talking about you. MJ: [00:39:00] I know. JJ: Okay. MJ: I’m just saying I don’t think anybody knows -- and I’m not sure if you’re ready for anybody to know -- that you’re very sensitive. JJ: What do you mean? MJ: (laughs) You’re very sensitive. You’re very loving. You love your children very much. You may not always know how to share that with them or they don’t know how to receive it from you, but I don’t think there’s a way to measure how much we mean to you, and it’s obvious. It’s just there’s other things that go with it, other emotions that go with it. But you are very sensitive and things hit you. 23 �People are a little rough with you. People are used to you being hardcore and determined and focused, and you’re human. You’re very caring. About me? I don’t really think that -- [00:40:00] maybe we have not discussed fully, you know, all of my opinions. We don’t need to have all my opinions. But all the things we have talked about, I’m very passionate about. They mean a lot to me. They’re the majority of the rest of what makes up me. You know, my mother and father and the rest of my family are the core of me and all of the things we talked about are very much the rest of me. They mean a lot to me. It seems real basic and yet it’s lost on our culture now to treat people with care and respect and look out for each other, not to cover for each other when you’re doing something you shouldn’t be doing. Look out that you are all doing well, that you are healthy, that your needs are met, that you’re not alone in this world, that we’re each other’s, you know, keeper. It’s real simple. It’s in all the religions. [00:41:00] It’s not one religious belief. It’s how you treat each other, and I don’t think that any of these issues would be real if we had that, if that was happening, if people were treating each other equally or respectfully. There may never have been a Civil Rights Movement. What would we talk about? I don’t know. JJ: So you feel like the Young Lords were like a civil rights movement. MJ: Yeah. JJ: ’Cause some people don’t look at -- I mean, like when we were talking about, they still think it’s a gang or whatever. MJ: You’re taking care of basic needs. JJ: To you, why do you look at it like a civil rights movement or a movement? 24 �MJ: What I know of what they actually accomplished, what they were involved in, what people were participating in, it’s taking care of basic needs in an entire community that should have been leveled. Everybody [00:42:00] everywhere should have these basic things. You should be able to have clean water and food to eat and healthcare and education and immunizations, and civil rights is the basic line of saying we all have these basic human rights and they’re fair for everybody, and if somebody slips, we just have to remind them, “No, no, no, you might have crossed the line with somebody. Come back. This is where your mistake was made.” But it’s for everybody. They’re real simple. It’s not complicated. It’s not like trigonometry or something. It’s real basic human needs and rights and respect, and when people slip up, they get so lost in their personal greed and hunger for power, they are willing to destroy anything in their path, and sometimes it’s entire cultures. And [00:43:00] that’s not acceptable. Everybody should be enraged by that or at least passionate enough to say something. It should matter. It’s real simple. I don’t know how else to -- JJ: That’s good. I know that your father was attacking Mayor Daley a lot because of the displacement of the Puerto Rican community and he was Irish and you have a little Irish -- MJ: I’m half-Irish, yes. JJ: You’re half-Irish. How did you feel about that? You know, we’re attacking -- MJ: I don’t take it as a cultural attack. I take it as two men who have very clear opinions and they do not agree with each other. (laughter) Point blank. And 25 �they’re in different positions and they both speak until they’re heard. Both of them. So there’s different repercussions to that, though. JJ: And it’s never about the Irish. It’s about -- MJ: [00:44:00] No, I never -- JJ: -- the policy. MJ: I don’t think that has anything to do with that, no. JJ: Because I’m just joking. It’s about the wrong policies of the mayor. I never had an attack personally on him. But it’s an attack on his policies, basically. We just felt they were corrupt and incorrect and we didn’t agree with that. Any final thoughts? Any final thoughts? MJ: Educate yourselves. (laughs) Don’t take somebody’s word for it because you’ve known them for a long time or because they’re someplace in the world that you wish you could be. Educate yourself. You know, if you hear something that’s different from anything you’ve ever heard before, look around. Get different perspectives. Don’t just open a textbook because they all come from the same publishing company. Read different sources. Talk to different people and be open to different perceptions. Everybody has a different place they’re standing from. They [00:45:00] get a different view of what’s happening even in the same moment. So learn. Just learn. That’s real important. Otherwise you’re gonna let somebody else decide your destiny. JJ: Thank you. END OF VIDEO FILE 26 �27 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/1cd08aeb94045f6ef044cfd8712af775.mp4 bff0c6395edef45230efab1f9ce9e558 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Melisa Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 1 Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Melisa_1 Title A name given to the resource Melisa Jiménez video interview and transcript, interview 1 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Melisa Description An account of the resource Melisa Jiménez is the youngest daughter of Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Like his other children she was not able to grow up with Mr. Jiménez. But she has always maintained a close relationship with him, even though they live miles away from each other. Ms. Jiménez’s other siblings are Jackie, Jodie, Sonia, and Alex. Ms. Jiménez lives not far from Mrs. Iberia Hampton, Fred Hampton’s mother, and they have maintained a close personal relationship for many years. Ms. Jiménez was born in the Lincoln Park neighborhood hospital, via the use of the La Maze childbirth method. Her father reminds her that he was the first to hold her. Ms. Jiménez lived in Lincoln Park for the first years of her life until the rent became unbearable for her mother. Only a couple of months after she was born, her father was incarcerated for a year, awaiting trial because his bond was too far out of range for his income. He later explained to her that he was doing, “volunteer work, supporting the Puerto Rican Freedom fighters.” When Mr. Jiménez won the case, Ms. Jiménez was living in Logan Square and they were once again united. This time Jackie, the oldest of Mr. Jiménez’s daughters from another relationship, moved in with them briefly. Teenage Jackie had a young boyfriend who was extremely polite, but very persistent. So Jackie’s mother, frustrated, dropped her off for Mr. Jiménez “to take responsibility and to take care of her.” He gladly agreed. And It was a way for Melisa and Jackie to get to know each other. Each sibling plays a role and Ms. Jiménez has played the role of sibling unifier in a world of divorce and separations. She graduated from Oak Park River Forest High School in 1998 and attended some college. She loves photography and is an accomplished artist. Some of her jobs have included child care, marketing research and mortgage broker sales. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-07-15 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/446554776fc9ec5d991921873cb28c80.pdf 31bed162ba5db06c903c3326fe5530f7 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Melisa Jiménez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 7/15/2012 Biography and Description Melisa Jiménez is the youngest daughter of Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Like his other children she was not able to grow up with Mr. Jiménez. But she has always maintained a close relationship with him, even though they live miles away from each other. Ms. Jiménez’s other siblings are Jackie, Jodie, Sonia, and Alex. Ms. Jiménez lives not far from Mrs. Iberia Hampton, Fred Hampton’s mother, and they have maintained a close personal relationship for many years. Ms. Jiménez was born in the Lincoln Park neighborhood hospital, via the use of the La Maze childbirth method. Her father reminds her that he was the first to hold her. Ms. Jiménez lived in Lincoln Park for the first years of her life until the rent became unbearable for her mother. Only a couple of months after she was born, her father was incarcerated for a year, awaiting trial because his bond was too far out of range for his income. He later explained to her that he was doing, “volunteer work, supporting the Puerto Rican Freedom fighters.” When Mr. Jiménez won the case, Ms. Jiménez was living in Logan Square and they were once again united. This time Jackie, the oldest of Mr. Jiménez’s daughters from another relationship, moved in with them briefly. Teenage Jackie had a young boyfriend who was extremely polite, but very persistent. So Jackie’s mother, frustrated, dropped her off for Mr. Jiménez “to take responsibility and to take care of her.” He gladly agreed. And It was a way for Melisa and Jackie to get to know each other. Each sibling plays a role and Ms. Jiménez has played the role of sibling unifier in a world of divorce and separations. �She graduated from Oak Park River Forest High School in 1998 and attended some college. She loves photography and is an accomplished artist. Some of her jobs have included child care, marketing research and mortgage broker sales. �Transcript JOSE JIMENEZ: [00:00:00] Okay, we were talking about the substance abuse and the neighborhoods being filled with drugs and all that as part of sociology. MELISA JIMENEZ: It’s my personal opinion that that is why my generation lost fathers in the household because you have soldiers who came back traumatized from war. Whether they’re physically okay or not, they were not able to be part of the family the way that families were used to having the man of the house. You have people who were very hard-working who became a part of the Civil Rights Movement and were extremely passionate and had their souls crushed, watching everything around them be destroyed. You know, the movement starts with this anger and it turns into this excitement and this purpose, and then you watch people who [00:01:00] finally understand you be destroyed and killed or discredited. JJ: And so people were talking about that among that group of people, your family, that you call the extended family? Around Angie and -- MJ: I still feel -- and I wasn’t even born then -- I feel it as if it was part of my history, part of a memory I’ve had, and it’s the feeling of it. It’s not the times and dates and, oh, so-and-so did this. It’s something that still affects my generation. I’m getting older now so it may not affect the people who are a little bit younger than me, but it crushes your spirit to think that you can finally have a voice that’s the American dream. Everybody has the right to their own freedom of speech and freedom of opinion, and if you do, you might be destroyed by it. You know, that’s 1 �not really freedom. That’s a trap. And to be able to believe in something [00:02:00] and then have it torn apart is not something that affects one person. It affects everybody. Everybody feels it. JJ: What do you mean, torn apart? Do you believe in something that is torn apart? What do you mean? MJ: To have people, you know, like Malcolm X or Martin Luther King or Fred Hampton or the Reverend -- JJ: Bruce Johnson? MJ: -- Bruce Johnson. People who love their people, but not because it’s a cause. Because they really love people, and they have felt this and they’ve lived through it and they’re finding a way to talk to other people -- JJ: Now, you’re only reading about these people, right? MJ: I’m not reading about just these people. I’m knowing the people that they affected. I grew up with the people that they affected. I just happened to be born in the middle of this, and everybody I know was personally touched, knew these people individually, and -- JJ: I mean, did you know anybody that knew Fred Hampton? MJ: I do. I mean, [00:03:00] you worked with Fred Hampton. You know, you as ChaCha Jiménez, then Fred Hampton created along with the Brown Berets the Rainbow Coalition. JJ: Along with the Young Patriots. MJ: The Young Patriots. JJ: Yeah. That’s all right. 2 �MJ: I know them as -- JJ: Okay, no, no, the Brown Berets were on it too. MJ: I mean, and later in my life, my mother, after she retired, she still did community work but she does it with children. You know, she doesn’t do it -- JJ: Didn’t you know Fred Hampton’s mother? MJ: Yes, that’s what I’m saying. She was doing community events with the children, my mother was, and at a community event, she happened to bump into this other woman and they had a great conversation and that was it. They were at different community events and they kept bumping into each other and they became friends. JJ: Which other woman? MJ: Just because of who they are, how they are a part of the community, they just got along. Their personalities matched. And it wasn’t until months after that that she found out that was Fred Hampton’s mother, and Mrs. Hampton found out that my mother [00:04:00] used to be involved with you, or married to you. So these two women had already developed a friendship without knowing their connection to the movement because it is a neighborhood thing. It’s just a neighborhood feeling. It’s who you are as a person, to take care of each other, that they were involved in activities that was taking care of the whole community and they kept bumping into each other and they really got along and they really started spending time together. They didn’t pass each other’s resumes to each other. They’re just normal women who have loved through this and lost through this and they had a lot in common. 3 �JJ: So what did she say Fred Hampton’s mother was doing? Iberia Hampton. MJ: Iberia Hampton, Mrs. Hampton, she’s been in a number -- her other son, Bill Hampton, is very involved in the community and he works a lot with the children. He sets up incredibly programs with the children and he runs -- JJ: Back in Oak Park? MJ: In Maywood and he [00:05:00] does a lot of work in the city and he runs the Fred Hampton Legal Scholarship Fund to help students become lawyers. But he I think put together a lot of the different events, and because he found out through other parents about my mom and different things she was doing, he came to where she was working at the time and invited her to come to some of these events and she thought that was really nice. She thought some of the kids’ parents invited her. She really didn’t know. And it was months later that they figured out together, we’ve pretty much been running in the same circles all these years, and they’re very good friends. They feel more like family. JJ: So did Fred Hampton’s mother know about the Young Lords? MJ: Oh, sure. I think she’s met you a couple times. We didn’t all know each other at the same time. I wasn’t born yet, but you know, my mother and you and Mrs. Hampton [00:06:00] all had different time periods that you were connected to each other, and it just so happened that even years later, without being an activist or protesting, but just doing things for the kids in the neighborhood, that they were brought together and met each other as two people, normal people. JJ: And so how long as their relationship existed? 4 �MJ: Between my mother and Mrs. Hampton, they’ve been friends for now, like, seven or eight years. JJ: Seven or eight years? MJ: Yeah. JJ: So have you gone there yourself? MJ: I have. I haven’t been there lately and I’m probably in trouble for it, but I need to call her pretty much today. (laughs) I’m a little late. But yeah, no, she actually, my mother and she just talked to each other two days ago. JJ: So you’re consistent. MJ: Yeah, they’re friends. They are good friends. She’s a wonderful person. Her husband was a wonderful [00:07:00] person. He passed away. JJ: What’s his name? MJ: I don’t call them by their first names. I call them Mr. and Mrs. Hampton. But he passed away. JJ: (inaudible). MJ: I went to his funeral. It was sad but they both have beautiful, beautiful spirits. JJ: Did you go to his funeral? Okay. MJ: Yeah. I don’t like people saying funerals are beautiful because it seems painful, but he had a beautiful funeral and it was sad to say goodbye to him, to his spirit. JJ: So how is Mrs. Hampton? How is she? What type of person? MJ: She’s very funny. She can be very quiet but she knows exactly what’s going on and she’s just letting other people do their thing. She allows other people to 5 �express themselves, but she does not miss a second of it. She’s very, very quick and very funny and very loving. [00:08:00] Super sweet. JJ: Okay. Well, what do you mean, she lets them speak? MJ: Well, you know, you almost think that she’s not paying any attention and she’s in the other room doing her own thing and she is not missing a beat. She is on it. Someone says something and she gets excited about it. She’s been paying attention the whole time and she’ll tell you exactly what she feels and it’s obvious she’s been paying attention the entire conversation, not just that minute. Very, very smart. JJ: But you said Ginger called her a couple days ago? MJ: Well, she missed her call. She called back, returned a phone call. No, Bill Hampton’s birthday was last week and they just threw him a surprise party. Then there was a different event this week. It was fun stuff. JJ: So you visit also to the house or just call? MJ: I mean, I [00:09:00] did. I haven’t lately because I’ve been busy working, but I’ve missed seeing a lot of people. (laughs) Don’t be mad at me. JJ: No, no, I’m not mad. I was happy to find out that you knew her, Mrs. Hampton. MJ: Oh, yeah. But it was a complete coincidence, if you believe in them. You know, a lot of people don’t believe in coincidences. But it was very special. I think they were meant to be friends. They just had never met before. They have a good friendship. JJ: And each accepts each other without hesitation or whatever? 6 �MJ: Oh, no, as if they’ve known each other forever, almost sisters. They’re very natural and honest with each other. JJ: ’Cause I know your mother’s a little religious. But she doesn’t call it religion. MJ: No, she’s a spiritual person too. She was raised Catholic. But she’s very spiritual. JJ: And is Mrs. Hampton the same way or similar? MJ: Mrs. Hampton, I know she believes. [00:10:00] They talk about God all the time. They talk about life. They talk about love and pain and they’re just girlfriends. They’re just not teenagers, but you know, it’s like they’re teenagers when they’re around each other. They’re just friends. They have a good relationship. JJ: Okay, so their connection is not just Young Lords or Panthers. MJ: No. It’s more surviving that, losing someone you love -- JJ: Surviving that? MJ: In the movement. You know, there are real people involved in this. This is not just about political heads or people with motives. There are real families that survive it. They lose people or -- I don’t know the word for that. It’s not a negotiation that they get to participate in, but they have to feel all of. You know, Mrs. Hampton lost her son. That’s not [00:11:00] a public thing for her. That’s real personal. Being the wife of someone involved in this and the mother of their child, watching someone’s child -- not legally married, but in our family when you are in a committed relationship, you are basically each other’s husband and wife. You’re each other’s partner. But having a child with that person and watching your child, you know, grow up and have different questions and having to figure 7 �out -- you know, you have your own memories of living through it and then you have to figure out how to help your child get through something normal that they can’t have. You know, these are not things that are part-time and they don’t last for a certain month that there’s a campaign or a certain year that there’s a campaign. This is the everyday forever and the rest of our lives, living through. [00:12:00] It becomes a part of you. It’s something that you grow from. It becomes something you make it through. JJ: What do you know of the death of Fred Hampton? What do you know about that? What happened? MJ: I don’t really know it through newspapers and media. I know it through family stories, like it was someone close to our family, this happened to them. And I know it as -- JJ: Family stories. Who told you? MJ: Both my mother and my father. JJ: Oh. MJ: But my mother had an incredible amount of respect for Fred Hampton. She knew him before she ever met you. She went to school. He spoke at the school she went to several times. JJ: At Roosevelt. MJ: At Roosevelt. JJ: He spoke a lot at Roosevelt, yeah. MJ: And she had a tremendous amount of respect for him. [00:13:00] He was incredibly intelligent and he was in no way violent. He was in no way -- 8 �JJ: Well, he spoke of armed struggle and revolution. MJ: He did speak of those things, but he was more about education and sharing education with other people and not just seeing whose back he can climb up to get there himself, but for everybody to rise up, for everybody to be able to elevate to a new level together. He wanted to be a lawyer. He didn’t wanna be a gangster. He wasn’t a gangster. He wanted to teach everybody around. He wanted everybody to want to learn. He loved learning. He was very respectful. He didn’t come from the street life. He came from the country life. He came from a family life. You know, you came from a family life. You came from a religious home. You’re not people that were out there hustling, trying [00:14:00] to get over and see how much you could get. There’s such a different mentality now of “Screw the person next to me. Whatever I can get. We have to worry about us. We can’t think of anybody else.” And that’s not what either one of you came from or spread. That wasn’t your message. There was no agenda of personal propriety. But no, he was an intellect who wanted to share that wealth. That was the wealth that he wanted to share with other people and that’s what I mean about not violent. You know, he wasn’t out there trying to be the hardest thug on the corner. He was out there trying to spread this information, this knowledge, and that was a very scary threat to government, I guess, to certain government. There’s different [00:15:00] levels of government. There’s city government, state government, national government. And he was murdered for it because he was too loud. He was talking too loud. Too many people were able to hear his message and I believe they, in terms of government -- the government in that 9 �time period. I’m not saying all government. I’m saying that particular regime of government -- did not want people to stay thinking. They didn’t want them to start noticing how things could be different or better or that everybody had a voice. They wanted to have the voice that everybody followed and he was talking too loud for them. So, I mean, in my own words, they assassinated him and that’s still a very special word, a very big word. They killed this man who was about education and fairness, who everybody could relate to and [00:16:00] looked up to, that they maybe could be like that too. “Wow, we could do something for ourselves instead of everything being the same and out of our hands. We could have some sort of power ourselves and be responsible and active ourselves.” That was the opposite of what this particular government regime was interested in and they killed this man. It’s very personal. Assassination is just a big word. That’s a personal thing. They took this man from people ’cause they didn’t agree with him. JJ: Was there any other, like, repression that you were familiar with at that time? Like, even the Young Lords or the Panthers? You know what I mean by repression, right? MJ: I’m not sure what you- JJ: Like trying to stop the movement, trying to repress it, trying to stop it. MJ: I think they were -- JJ: [00:17:00] Were there any, you know, plans to try to do that? Or did they do that? MJ: I think there were just a few moments at the beginning of the Civil Rights Movement where -- 10 �JJ: I mean, that you experienced, I mean. MJ: That I experienced? I was born after the movement was disembodied. JJ: Let me ask you this. When did you first hear about the Young Lords? MJ: I’m sure I heard about it from being four years old or younger, being in the house and hearing about it all the time. But the first time I was aware of it was probably after I asked my mom why we didn’t have any family. It was just the two of us. And part of her telling stories about my family, she also was telling stories about the Young Lords. So I learned at the same time. So from about seven, eight, nine [00:18:00] years old, that’s when I started hearing about the Young Lords. JJ: So how did you feel about that? I mean, you know, what did you hear and how did you feel about it? MJ: I was so proud. I was so tiny and so empowered. (laughs) This itty-bitty little eight-year-old walking around like, “Wow,” you know? This is pretty amazing. First of all, it was very sad to know that people were treated horribly. It was heartbreaking to know that people were not all treated with the same amount of respect, and how could you look at somebody struggling this way and not go and help them? You don’t teach your kids to be mean like that. You teach your kids to be polite and to help people out. So a child is full of kindness and caring for the person in front of them, and to hear that there is people in the [00:19:00] world that are being treated horribly, disrespected constantly, and being not treated as an equal but treated, like, dismissive -- JJ: Who was not being treated as an equal? MJ: Well, I was taught about the whole Civil Rights Movement. 11 �JJ: Okay, it was the Civil Rights Movement and then it was, like, our movement there afterwards, the Panthers and the Young Lords. MJ: But I was taught about the whole history of it. Why was there ever Young Lords or Black Panthers? It’s because of the Civil Rights Movement. Why was there ever a Civil Rights Movement? Because of all this history of pent-up aggression building and building until it bursts. This oppression is overwhelming until there’s got to be a crack in it at some point. I was [layered?] in history, talked about all of it. JJ: Well, who was [the narrator?]? Your mom? MJ: Well, she did teach me about it. She was the first introduction to it because [00:20:00] at eight years old, you’re in second grade. You know, I’m talking about watching movies on TV and not understanding what’s going on and she’s like, “Well, this is related to this part of the country,” or “This part of history.” She was very topical with it, very objective. You know, she would only answer the question I asked. She wouldn’t paint a whole picture for me. It was like, “I don’t understand what that sentence is, Mom. What did she mean?” Or “What did he mean?” And it’s like, “Oh, well, why don’t you go get the encyclopedia? In the 1800s, this is what they used to do.” So it would start a conversation and in second grade, you’re not talking about history. You’re talking about addition and cursive and spelling tests. So we just started those conversations. But that’s how it is all connected and that’s how I was introduced to the Young Lords. It started a doorway of, “Well, why would that happen?” “Because this was happening.” “Well, why did that happen?” “And this bigger thing was 12 �happening.” And so [00:21:00] I don’t remember the original question you asked me, but how I heard about the Young Lords was around seven or eight years old. There was a layering to it. There is something that happened to create this situation, these circumstances that Young Lords was born from, why it was happening. There was a lot going on. JJ: And you said you felt some pride in that? MJ: I was very proud. Once I understood that people would ever be treated that way, then it was like, well, somebody has to do something about it. That’s just the natural thing. When you get in trouble in school, it’s like somebody’s responsible. Aren’t you going to tell the teacher to help? You don’t just let somebody sit there and bleed, you know? Somebody has to help. Somebody has to do something. And so even as a child, you have the mentality of, “Well, what happened next? Didn’t somebody do anything?” And it was like, “Well, yes. In our area, you know, people in this area were the ones that were bleeding and [00:22:00] they got tired of watching their parents bleed and they would be hurt, be stifled by all their efforts. They’re trying just to make a home for their family and everything they’re doing keeps being undone or undercut and their children got tired of watching it. They got tired of being pushed around and watching their parents being knocked over and they stood up and spoke back and said, we have rights and we deserve respect and this is what we need and you cannot ignore our voices.” And in this area, that was the Young Lords. That was happening all over the country, but the thing that is so significant about the Young Lords is it didn’t start as an organized program or an organization. It started as a street 13 �gang and it is still to this point in history the only street gang that turned into a political organization. It did not manhandle its way into papers [00:23:00] and thug out the neighborhood or steal from people. It was for the people and it didn’t start off in a classroom. It started in the streets, protecting their own homes, and what I’m aware of, that’s the only group that has started out as a street gang and become a political organization. JJ: So protecting their own homes, was that an issue that they were, you know, attacking? MJ: I mean, from what I’m told. JJ: Yeah, from your understanding. MJ: From what I understand. JJ: Well, what were the main issues? MJ: People were getting -- JJ: It had to do with Puerto Ricans ’cause it had to do with Puerto Rico. MJ: Well, that whole area was mainly -- even though there were different ethnic backgrounds, it was mainly Puerto Rican at the time. That was the Puerto Rican neighborhood of the city and it happened to be lakefront property as well and it was more valuable monetarily to people [00:24:00] in power at that time, whether it was corporate or government. And so they were coming in and telling people, “It’s time to move.” JJ: They were telling people to move? MJ: They were raising people’s rents from 80 dollars to 400 in a month or 120 dollars to 800 dollars the next month. Well, you can’t pay? You gotta go. This is how I 14 �was told. As I was told, there were times as well that people were being manhandled directly out of their homes. Someone would just come in and kick all of their things out onto the ground and say, “You don’t live here anymore. Go. You guys can move over.” JJ: [The share?], basically, [’cause it was the candles?] (inaudible). MJ: But that’s gotta be quite an experience to know you’re doing everything you can to pay your bills and you’re paying them and you come home from work one day and someone just told you, “You moved today, in case you didn’t know.” [00:25:00] And you can’t do anything about it. There’s nobody to go to. JJ: But even while you were growing up, you’re saying the neighborhood was still changing, no? MJ: When I was growing up? JJ: Yeah. Or you didn’t notice? I mean, you weren’t living there anymore, but I mean, you went back there ’cause the neighborhood is completely changed, right? MJ: It has completely changed. They kept the shape of it, but they changed everything in between. I guess when I was growing up, it did change. It was much more human before. You could just walk down the street and know somebody and everybody was happy to just wave and say hello, and now it’s just a tourist spot and the people who live there are not very welcoming. (laughs) But mostly it’s a tourist area. And [00:26:00] no, before it was, like, going to visit your cousin’s house. JJ: So do you remember before? 15 �MJ: Yeah. JJ: Okay. MJ: You knew everybody on the block and you just got off the bus or came off the train, and walking to the person’s house you’re going to, you see five different people you know. You stop and you have a conversation, like a neighborhood. Like home. And you don’t know anybody there now. They don’t do that with each other. JJ: Okay. So that made you feel proud in everything. You had some proud moments. What about some painful moments when they talked about the Young Lords? With you, since your father was involved in it. Did you ever have any painful moments? MJ: Painful moments, I think that we all did. JJ: Did anybody talk [00:27:00] negative about the Young Lords? MJ: Sure. I mean, I have bumped into people and I tend not to introduce myself first if I’m in an area where people still talk about the Young Lords, not because I’m not proud, because I’d rather get an honest reaction to what they think. I am always absorbing information and I love to get a lot of different perspectives and I don’t take it personal because that was their experience, so I wanna hear it. JJ: What are some of the negative things that you heard? MJ: (laughs) I remember walking into a building once and I was with someone who could not wait to introduce me and I was like, “Shh. Just say hello. Give this person a chance to get up in their chair.” And this person was very polite and shook my hand and I said, “I’m Melisa,” and he told me his name. And the 16 �person I was with said, “Oh, do you remember that guy? You know the Young Lords. Do you remember that guy, Cha-Cha?” “Oh my God, that thug. He used to --” [00:28:00] I mean, I was laughing ’cause he’s sitting there, he’s like, “He used to just make so much trouble around here. He was such a headache and I can’t believe --” And I guess the person I was with gave him a look because all the sudden, he stopped talking and he looked at me, and then I was introduced as Cha-Cha’s daughter and he just went completely pale and he was like, “I’m so sorry.” I said, “Why would you be? Maybe he was mean to you. (laughs) Maybe you guys didn’t like each other. That’s your experience and I’m not taking anything away from that.” And he was like, “No, but I’m so sorry,” and I said, “That was your experience. That’s your history. But I happen to like the guy so I’m okay with it. So don’t worry about it.” And he just couldn’t catch his breath for a long time. I felt bad. But I don’t introduce myself first, and it’s not to set anybody up. I just wanna know what they really think, what their real memories were. I wasn’t older at that time period, so I like to know what people went through. JJ: Actually there’s a similar experience that my mother [00:29:00] had with somebody from the church. So you know, that’s kind of a pretty good -- because it was like 50-50 real controversial. MJ: It wasn’t controversial. I’ve bumped into people that just said, like, I was royalty, like you were royalty, and “Oh my God, you’re his daughter.” And that experience is much more common than the other. But, like, I didn’t do anything. You know, I’m glad that you had a positive experience. And they’re like, “No, no, this was so 17 �important. He did this and he did this.” I’ve had people treat me wonderfully because of how much it meant to them and I’ve had people be very nasty because they don’t agree with the politics and I personally -JJ: I know you’re joking but it must hurt. MJ: No, it doesn’t hurt because I like to see how people think. I like to see through other people’s eyes. JJ: That’s now, but when you were growing up. MJ: No. JJ: [00:30:00] Never? MJ: Because I was a child and there was more of a filter on them. I was prepared for it, but they had more of a filter because they were looking at a child, and I mean, you shouldn’t attack a child. But when they were honest about what they said, I appreciated it. I want to know all of the story. I don’t wanna know just the things I like or I agree with. And I need to understand. That’s how I’ve learned about it, by being open about it and not expecting someone to agree with something that I think. That’s not gonna work. JJ: I’m gonna kind of wrap it up a little bit, but I just wanted to -- MJ: Am I a talker? (laughs) JJ: No, no, no. No, I was just trying to -- MJ: I am, it’s all right. JJ: -- just because of the schedule. MJ: Okay. No, I have had painful moments, though. JJ: You had painful moments? 18 �MJ: I didn’t lose my father like Angie’s kids did or like Fred Hampton [00:31:00] Junior did, but I still lost my father, having a father in my home. My brothers and sisters still lost having a father while they were growing up. And we’ve had the opportunity to still get to know you, which they didn’t, but we still lost the possession of, “That’s my dad. He just belongs to me and everybody else doesn’t get a piece of him. He’s just ours.” We didn’t get that opportunity. And maybe that had something to do with it. When my mother and I left when I was four and a half during the height of your substance abuse, very shortly after, you disappeared. [00:32:00] You were just gone and nobody knew where you were and I think some people even blamed my mom. Like, if you hadn’t left him, he wouldn’t have just disappeared, you know? What did you do? Nobody can find him. No one even knows where he is. And that went on for a little while, and then a couple years passed and then -- JJ: So that went on for a few years. MJ: It went on for a little while. JJ: Like, five years, something like that. MJ: A little while. A couple years later, people started trying to prepare themselves that you just were never coming back, and so they started saying, you know, “I don’t wanna say the thing that you’re not supposed to say, but I think he’s dead.” And they would try not to say it around me but I heard them talking about it and I knew it wasn’t true. And more time passed. Then it finally got to being five years, you were gone and nobody knew where you were. Everybody [00:33:00] had accepted that you were just dead. 19 �JJ: You’re talking about family members? MJ: Family members were at the point -- five years after my mother and I left, five years almost to the day, everybody for at least the last six months had been trying to figure out how do we tell Melisa that her father is dead? Because she walks around here like -- she’s just so happy and she’s gonna talk to him one day, and we have to figure out how to tell her. And they were whispering about it over and over and I know that I went up to them one day. I was nine years old at the time. And I put my hand on Angie’s hand and I put my other hand on my mom’s hand and I said, “Don’t worry, he’s not dead. I know he’s not dead. You guys don’t have to worry about how to talk to me about it.” And they just couldn’t believe that I even knew what they were talking about, but I seriously said, “I can [00:34:00] feel him. I know he’s okay. He’s just not ready to be with us right now. But don’t worry.” And Angie seriously was like -- they never talked about it again, and within a month -- I’m gonna tell you -- that particular month I prayed for two things, and never in my life, I have never prayed to ask for something back. I pray to thank God for things. I don’t pray to ask for things in return. But that month, I prayed for two things, and one of them was just for my dad to let everybody know he was okay. Even if he’s not ready to come back, can you just please -- they’re starting to really worry. Can you just let him know or have him let everybody know that he’s okay? And then I prayed for something else. And that particular month, not even a week later, my mom got a call from Angie and said, “You will not believe. He’s alive. He’s gonna be here on Friday. He wanted to know if you would bring Melisa because he really wants to see her.” 20 �[00:35:00] And they just couldn’t believe. And I told my mom, I said, “I’m not supposed to tell you what I talked to God about because that’s between us, but I knew he was going to --” And maybe that sounds mystical and spooky or whatever, but those are the only two things in my life that I ever asked for, and that month, they both came true. Not that I’m saying I had any effect on that, but I’m saying the timeframe, when I was four and a half and we left you, soon after, you left, and the whole family went through an experience where they grieved your loss. They really believed you were gone. Everybody was certain of it because by that point, five years had passed. They tried for years to just deal with the fact that you were probably underground or something or maybe just doing drugs and not in a good place. And they finally got to the point where they accepted that you were gone and they really went through a hard time trying to figure out how to tell your kids that we would never see you again. But [00:36:00] your mother -- my grandmother -- and I knew that you were alive because we both could feel you and we talked about it. Everybody else was really broken, trying to figure out how to help us deal with it ’cause they thought we were in denial. And lo and behold, you showed up in Chicago (laughs) within the same month and you were okay and you had changed your life in a big way and you were in a good place. And everybody was just shocked. They really thought you were gone. And that was not an easy time. It was sad. But I knew that you were okay. I just knew that I didn’t know when I would ever talk to you again. I didn’t know. At that time, I had no picture of your face in my mind. I just remembered loving you and you loving me. But I could not remember your face. And then 21 �everybody around me is so sad, thinking you’re gone. That was hard to watch everybody I loved so sad. JJ: So do you remember where -- MJ: [00:37:00] I don’t remember when you left the city but I know that you moved to Michigan. By the time you came back, you were living in Michigan and you came back just to see us. JJ: Right. I was trying to get myself together. MJ: You did. You did a very good job. JJ: I was going a little downhill by that time and I didn’t have the [will?] or money or anything like that (inaudible). And my perfectionism, I had to make sure everything’s perfect. MJ: You are, and I missed a lot of times spending time with you because you were afraid you didn’t have anything to give me and I didn’t want anything but you. And that took a few years for you to accept that. JJ: I keep that in mind now. MJ: All right, good. (laughter) That’s good. You don’t need to give me anything. No. But we missed more time later. JJ: What did you want? What did you want to tell your father? What was the most important thing that you wanted people to know? Not just [00:38:00] your father. Maybe the world or -- about you. MJ: About me? That’s a loaded question. You have layers to that. 22 �JJ: Okay, (inaudible). I mean, what’s the main thing that you want people to know about you? This is an oral history (inaudible) but I [shouldn’t be so formal?] after what you just said. MJ: (laughter) No. I don’t know that there’s anything I need the world to know about me. JJ: Or me, maybe I don’t -- ’cause I was underground. I’m just trying to go with [that?]. MJ: I think people don’t know that you are hilarious unless they know you. They don’t know that you’re hilarious. You have an incredible sense of humor and you are always cracking jokes at moments that everybody thinks you’re gonna be serious, just come out of nowhere and everybody’s cracking up because it’s a surprise. JJ: But I was talking about you. MJ: [00:39:00] I know. JJ: Okay. MJ: I’m just saying I don’t think anybody knows -- and I’m not sure if you’re ready for anybody to know -- that you’re very sensitive. JJ: What do you mean? MJ: (laughs) You’re very sensitive. You’re very loving. You love your children very much. You may not always know how to share that with them or they don’t know how to receive it from you, but I don’t think there’s a way to measure how much we mean to you, and it’s obvious. It’s just there’s other things that go with it, other emotions that go with it. But you are very sensitive and things hit you. 23 �People are a little rough with you. People are used to you being hardcore and determined and focused, and you’re human. You’re very caring. About me? I don’t really think that -- [00:40:00] maybe we have not discussed fully, you know, all of my opinions. We don’t need to have all my opinions. But all the things we have talked about, I’m very passionate about. They mean a lot to me. They’re the majority of the rest of what makes up me. You know, my mother and father and the rest of my family are the core of me and all of the things we talked about are very much the rest of me. They mean a lot to me. It seems real basic and yet it’s lost on our culture now to treat people with care and respect and look out for each other, not to cover for each other when you’re doing something you shouldn’t be doing. Look out that you are all doing well, that you are healthy, that your needs are met, that you’re not alone in this world, that we’re each other’s, you know, keeper. It’s real simple. It’s in all the religions. [00:41:00] It’s not one religious belief. It’s how you treat each other, and I don’t think that any of these issues would be real if we had that, if that was happening, if people were treating each other equally or respectfully. There may never have been a Civil Rights Movement. What would we talk about? I don’t know. JJ: So you feel like the Young Lords were like a civil rights movement. MJ: Yeah. JJ: ’Cause some people don’t look at -- I mean, like when we were talking about, they still think it’s a gang or whatever. MJ: You’re taking care of basic needs. JJ: To you, why do you look at it like a civil rights movement or a movement? 24 �MJ: What I know of what they actually accomplished, what they were involved in, what people were participating in, it’s taking care of basic needs in an entire community that should have been leveled. Everybody [00:42:00] everywhere should have these basic things. You should be able to have clean water and food to eat and healthcare and education and immunizations, and civil rights is the basic line of saying we all have these basic human rights and they’re fair for everybody, and if somebody slips, we just have to remind them, “No, no, no, you might have crossed the line with somebody. Come back. This is where your mistake was made.” But it’s for everybody. They’re real simple. It’s not complicated. It’s not like trigonometry or something. It’s real basic human needs and rights and respect, and when people slip up, they get so lost in their personal greed and hunger for power, they are willing to destroy anything in their path, and sometimes it’s entire cultures. And [00:43:00] that’s not acceptable. Everybody should be enraged by that or at least passionate enough to say something. It should matter. It’s real simple. I don’t know how else to -- JJ: That’s good. I know that your father was attacking Mayor Daley a lot because of the displacement of the Puerto Rican community and he was Irish and you have a little Irish -- MJ: I’m half-Irish, yes. JJ: You’re half-Irish. How did you feel about that? You know, we’re attacking -- MJ: I don’t take it as a cultural attack. I take it as two men who have very clear opinions and they do not agree with each other. (laughter) Point blank. And 25 �they’re in different positions and they both speak until they’re heard. Both of them. So there’s different repercussions to that, though. JJ: And it’s never about the Irish. It’s about -- MJ: [00:44:00] No, I never -- JJ: -- the policy. MJ: I don’t think that has anything to do with that, no. JJ: Because I’m just joking. It’s about the wrong policies of the mayor. I never had an attack personally on him. But it’s an attack on his policies, basically. We just felt they were corrupt and incorrect and we didn’t agree with that. Any final thoughts? Any final thoughts? MJ: Educate yourselves. (laughs) Don’t take somebody’s word for it because you’ve known them for a long time or because they’re someplace in the world that you wish you could be. Educate yourself. You know, if you hear something that’s different from anything you’ve ever heard before, look around. Get different perspectives. Don’t just open a textbook because they all come from the same publishing company. Read different sources. Talk to different people and be open to different perceptions. Everybody has a different place they’re standing from. They [00:45:00] get a different view of what’s happening even in the same moment. So learn. Just learn. That’s real important. Otherwise you’re gonna let somebody else decide your destiny. JJ: Thank you. END OF VIDEO FILE 26 �27 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7bbcf72cd601369e2df52710367f8510.mp4 56592d6e98c121620fc07c59c69d51d9 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Melisa Jiménez vídeo entrevista y biografía, entrevista 2 Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Melisa_2 Title A name given to the resource Melisa Jiménez video interview and transcript, interview 2 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Melisa Description An account of the resource Melisa Jiménez is the youngest daughter of Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez. Like his other children she was not able to grow up with Mr. Jiménez. But she has always maintained a close relationship with him, even though they live miles away from each other. Ms. Jiménez’s other siblings are Jackie, Jodie, Sonia, and Alex. Ms. Jiménez lives not far from Mrs. Iberia Hampton, Fred Hampton’s mother, and they have maintained a close personal relationship for many years. Ms. Jiménez was born in the Lincoln Park neighborhood hospital, via the use of the La Maze childbirth method. Her father reminds her that he was the first to hold her. Ms. Jiménez lived in Lincoln Park for the first years of her life until the rent became unbearable for her mother. Only a couple of months after she was born, her father was incarcerated for a year, awaiting trial because his bond was too far out of range for his income. He later explained to her that he was doing, “volunteer work, supporting the Puerto Rican Freedom fighters.” When Mr. Jiménez won the case, Ms. Jiménez was living in Logan Square and they were once again united. This time Jackie, the oldest of Mr. Jiménez’s daughters from another relationship, moved in with them briefly. Teenage Jackie had a young boyfriend who was extremely polite, but very persistent. So Jackie’s mother, frustrated, dropped her off for Mr. Jiménez “to take responsibility and to take care of her.” He gladly agreed. And It was a way for Melisa and Jackie to get to know each other. Each sibling plays a role and Ms. Jiménez has played the role of sibling unifier in a world of divorce and separations. She graduated from Oak Park River Forest High School in 1998 and attended some college. She loves photography and is an accomplished artist. Some of her jobs have included child care, marketing research and mortgage broker sales. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-07-15 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/5d59a66cca1ef41b7c75d39a77b44bf3.pdf 26d56871775dfaa728683b644f0f2fb3 PDF Text Text Young Lords In Lincoln Park Interviewee: Ramonia “Monin” Jiménez Rodríguez Interviewers: José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 6/25/2012 Biography and Description Ramonia “Monin” Jiménez Rodríguez came to live in the La Clark barrio of Chicago on La Salle near Division Street in the mid 1950s. The La Clark barrio once encompassed the area between Grand Avenue on the south and North Avenue on the north, bounded by Dearborn Street on the east and continuing west to Halsted Street, and in some sections along Chicago Avenue to nearly Ashland. La Clark was chosen by Puerto Ricans because it was the location of many service jobs, including domestic work, waitressing, dishwashing, and other hotels. The neighborhood was also close to a number of factories along Wells, Franklin, and Orleans Streets and along the Chicago River. Ms. Jiménez Rodríguez attended mass at Holy Name Cathedral and St. Joseph. She became involved early in the Council Number Three Damas de María at St. Michael’s Church. There she helped other Damas to cook the arroz con gandules dinners regularly. The dinners would be sold to raise money in the gymnasium after mass. There was usually a live band playing and many neighborhood people dancing. Ms. Jiménez Rodríguez later joined St. Teresa’s Church Council Number Nine, as the Puerto Rican community expanded to encompass the streets of Lincoln Park west of Sheffield to Ashland Avenue. The Caballeros and Damas used St. Teresa’s Hall for many of their activities.Her brothers were also active in community life and civic affairs. Antonio “Maloco” Jiménez Rodríguez was vice-president of the Hacha Viejas in these early days. Angel Luis Jiménez became president of Council Number Nine; they opened up their own social club across from St. �Teresa to hold meetings and throw smaller parties to raise funds for the Caballeros and the Damas. Through the 1960s these affairs grew as they strove to cater more to the youth groups. St. Teresa had some of the best dances using the new bilingual youth bands that were spreading everywhere throughout Lincoln Park, Lakeview, Wicker Park and the new, expanding Puerto Rican community in Humboldt Park. Ms. Jiménez Rodríguez worked hard volunteering for the Chicago’s Puerto Ricans at St. Michael’s and at St. Teresa. She was also part of the movement to try to get mass held in Spanish. In later years, Ms. Jiménez Rodríguez moved back to Puerto Rico to retire which is where she now lives. � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/391b782be2a7f5e89a3be549c541c827.mp4 cbde9e9f4512aa121c09cd7048508759 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Young Lords in Lincoln Park Collection Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history interviews and digitized materials documenting the history of the Young Lords Organization in Lincoln Park, Chicago. Interviews were conducted by Young Lords' founder, José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, and documents were digitized from Mr. Jiménez' archives. The Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection grows out of the ongoing struggle for fair housing, self-determination, and human rights that was launched by Mr. José “Cha-Cha” Jiménez, founder of the Young Lords Movement. This project is dedicated to documenting the history of the displacement of Puerto Ricans, Mejicanos, other Latinos, and the poor from Lincoln Park, as well as the history of the Young Lords nationwide. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park collection (RHC-65)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-25 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng spa Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 2012-2017 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Título Spanish language Title entry Ramonia “Monin” Jiménez Rodríguez vídeo entrevista y biografía Sujetos Spanish language Subject terms Young Lords (Organización) Puertorriqueños--Estados Unidos Derechos civiles--Estados Unidos--Historia Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puertorriqueños--Relatos personales Idioma español--Relatos personales Justicia social Activistas comunitarios--Illinois--Chicago Puertorriqueños--Illinois--Chicago--Vida social y costumbres Juventud--Illinois--Chicago Source <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/491">Young Lords in Lincoln Park (RHC-65)</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-65_Jimenez_Ramonia Title A name given to the resource Ramonia “Monin” Jiménez Rodríguez video interview and biography Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jiménez, Ramonia Description An account of the resource Ramonia “Monin” Jiménez Rodríguez came to live in the La Clark barrio of Chicago on La Salle near Division Street in the mid-1950s. Ms. Jiménez Rodríguez attended mass at Holy Name Cathedral and St. Joseph. She became involved early in the Council Number Three Damas de María at St. Michael’s Church. There she helped other Damas to cook the arroz con gandules dinners to raise money after mass. There was usually a live band playing and many neighborhood people dancing. She was also part of the movement to try to get mass held in Spanish. In later years, Ms. Jiménez Rodríguez moved back to Puerto Rico to retire which is where she now lives. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Jiménez, José, 1948- Subject The topic of the resource Young Lords (Organization) Puerto Ricans--United States Civil Rights--United States--History Lincoln Park (Chicago, Ill.) Puerto Ricans--Personal narratives Spanish language--Personal narratives Social justice Community activists--Illinois--Chicago Puerto Ricans--Illinois--Chicago--Social life and customs Youth--Illinois--Chicago Language A language of the resource spa Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-06-25 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives