429 24 26018 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7b9acf0d9d60a6eaedcd1eb8606530b7.jpg d969c8d07c3d4c0afb2cb3ebf3a81a4a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X1024 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British fighter, March 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education Slides World War, 1939-1945 Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-03-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/9acec2c8a03976d425dd0454bdcd65a0.jpg 43b461ad870a265318132f2229ea2a55 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X968 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British fighter, September 1, 1953. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1953-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/23e5380728f78d1ada5e128344c36b1d.jpg 9a6180da754bece7764a9d1b028e5b6f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X979 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British fighter, March 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-03-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/8738833dd8816a8382ac69eb0f213cab.jpg 91b87f787146ebefebfdf3370796b63d Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X967 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British fighter aircraft Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British fighter aircraft, September 1, 1953 Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Great Britain Military education World War, 1939-1945 Airplanes, Military--Recognition Slides Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1953-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/5fc71456b146c16b0b033caeec677d07.jpg 2895fc5e62e04fff8bb79df8b0ea7bb0 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X978 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British RAF fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British RAF fighter, September 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/70b97bfb4e6ffff0fb4b7f5864b4ee93.jpg f061a6d3fc954456f889d45e14db6926 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X982 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British RAF fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British RAF fighter, September 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/18ca78f41dea6cf101fe5f157e497b59.jpg 776145f21f07142874a7bbb15fe1cb5a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X989 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British RAF fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British RAF fighter, September 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/ce907aa5305ca14d1d2751e6933e7ff6.jpg 776eb5100f2484e65091893a09253a4c Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X992 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British RAF fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British RAF fighter, September 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/3edd690af722748ab49cacbd86ebb968.jpg 9326d3b567f28365fd2c6585e2b967f2 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_X995 Title A name given to the resource Javelin British RAF fighter Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Javelin British RAF fighter, September 1, 1954. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education World War, 1939-1945 Slides Airplanes, Military--Recognition Great Britain Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1954-09-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/94332295f8c6d0b0b8e87e7185f778fa.jpg 7b5aeda4d7de6ae159c6585322b2b8de Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource GVSU Concert & Event Posters Subject The topic of the resource Posters Events Michigan Universities & colleges--Michigan Description An account of the resource Division of Student Services provides programs, services, and environments that enhance the personal, social, and intellectual growth of undergraduate and graduate students at the University. Events including concerts were managed by the office of Student Life. Posters for music, speakers, poetry readings and other campuswide events are included. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. Division of Student Services Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/106">Student Services concerts, events, and posters files, (GV028-06)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-07-17 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV028-06 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1963 – 1981 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV028-06_tamboo Title A name given to the resource Jazz and then some "Tamboo", October 29, 1977 Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Grand Valley State College Michigan Allendale (Mich.) Universities & colleges--Michigan Events Posters Description An account of the resource Jazz and then some "Tamboo," in the Grand Valley State Colleges Louis Armstrong Theatre, October 29, 1977. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1977 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/106">Student Services concerts, events, and posters files, (GV028-06)</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/c2897a75cd31ab8ecd308ef3867df5b3.mp4 3f3657dfeed9afa38fb826176a7a39ea https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/5549389bc97b38e47ba975a062a606cc.pdf 0df4f78460413454d2ca380352a6f4f5 PDF Text Text William James College Interviews GV016-16 Interviewer: Barbara Roos Interviewee: Jean Doyle Date: 1984 Part: 1 of 3 [Barbara] Okay, Jean. Why on earth did you come to William James? [Jean] Is this the real thing? Are we starting? [Barbara] Yeah. [Jean] Okay. [Sighs heavily] I grew up in Chicago and when I was about twelve, I met a deaf kid. Through meeting him and wanting to communicate with him, I thought I invented the theory of art therapy. [Laughs] And I thought how wonderful it would be if by painting, or reading, or writing poetry, or something that this kid could express or relate to other people what he was experiencing from nature. And so that just became a goal and I call it art therapy in my head, even as a kid. And I just started looking for places that offered coursework in art therapy. A counselor at a high school in Chicago, she wasn't my counselor, it wasn't my high school, she told me about William James. So, my mom and I took a drive up here and we looked at it. I didn't really know what I was looking at or looking for. And I said: "Well, this must be it, you know, this must be where I meant to be." So, in September I started. And, it was, well-- Are we going to get to frustrations right away? [Barbara] Whatever makes you feel most comfortable. [Jean] Okay. It was so strange because once… as soon as I got there, I immediately realized I'd been given misinformation, which I translated to as I was lied to. Because in the in the catalog, you know, it talked about Thomas Jefferson, College IV, William James, and CAS. And when I got there, Thomas Jefferson had just been axed. And there was just no words about it. But I didn’t know enough to get angry yet. That came in time. But I met a lot of people who had been part of Thomas Jefferson and became more acquainted with their frustration and their anger. But we progressed, and then at the end of the first year that I was there Cathleen O'Shaughnessy (?) left. She was a key art therapy person at that time. And she was gone, and that was it. And so, I'll never really understand why I just didn't say: "Well the hell with this. I'm out of here. You know, I came in for something; it's not here. What am I doing here?" But I never left. I just, I don't know, there was something about the community of the place, the friends I was making, and the rapport with professors. That I really felt it was worth sticking around, it was worth waiting, and knowing in my heart someday I �would be an art therapist and I would work in art therapy. But for the present time, I had other things to learn, I had an education to get, and I felt like I was in a good place to get it. Working with good people and that became a priority to me and of great value. [Jean] My father, at the home front, he was questioning greatly what the hell I was doing there when it came out that there wasn't what I was seeking there, and there wasn't, you know, any hope of things getting better in terms of a career-oriented thing. He respected that aspect of liberal education. But he felt that if I just wanted a liberal education that I should continue St. John's, which is where I started my undergrad work. He felt that it would be more sensible to go to a prestigious college, and to have a nice degree at the end of it; especially, if I was going to get something as general as liberal arts. And, as you know, easy to pass off. Or, you know what I mean, people don't really just say: "Oh what are you going to do with that degree?" You know? So, there was a lot of tension there, but I just stuck it out. A sense of loyalty, a sense of connection, and commitment that was felt around me, and so I just want to desert that whole front. [Barbara] Do you know, something that hasn't really come up in the tapes so far is the notion of how new organization happened so many times effected students, and you're talking about it. Do you know people that left school because of reorganization? [Jean] I know one artist in particular that comes to mind. His name was Chris Molane. (?) He's living in New York, and he's doing his work. And he's very happy. I mean, for him actually, the reorganization is a good thing, it released him from the cornfields out to them where things are really happening for him. I'm trying to think who else. Not really, it seemed like people just sort of went, you know, they didn't just accept it but they went through it, and came out the other side to see what was there. [Inaudible] [Jean] Like going through some kind of mill. [Barbara] Please tell me a little bit about Saint Johns. [Jean] Saint Johns was the most beautiful place I ever was at. It was tucked in the mountains in Santa Fe, New Mexico. And it was a drug infested, sexually active, monastery dedicated to learning and loving knowledge. And Socrates was the hero of the school. At four o'clock in the morning, the dorms were really small, about twenty people per dorm. And you could walk in four in the morning and there would be people drunk, or whatever, but they'd be discussing something of common interest. And what's so neat is that it's a very rigid curriculum in terms of all freshmen read Aeschylus, Euripides, Thucydides, and on and on. And they do Euclidean geometry, and then non-Euclidean geometry, and the next year is �Ptolemian, it goes on and so everybody just had the exact same education. So, there's so much to share. And the tutors were more like referees. Or when they would start a seminar, it was like they'd throw up a jump ball and we'd play. [Jean] So, they weren't projecting, or interjecting very much. And in a way, it wasn't until I met Irving Wasserman at Grand Valley that I really was more studied with Socrates and really tried to understand-- just have a broader view, a much broader view, because it was like children playing with these thoughts. And so, we had no background, no framework, to put it in and so, I appreciated having a guide like Irv. But it was wonderful to be given the respect to play with it, you know. Or to engage with it. [Barbara] Okay, but then just the notion of you wanting to go into Art Therapy was enough to tear you away from this? [Jean] I was also in the midst of very strong personal problem that I had to get away from immediately. And so, I had to leave hastily unfortunately. So, when I got home and it was hiding out for a while, I thought: "Well, I think I'll go up to Michigan and check out William James. [Barbara] Okay. Okay. [Jean] Take that path and then maybe go hit… [Barbara] Why alternative anyway though? You had two alternative colleges you were looking for, and why? [Jean] Oh, that's just always been my cup of tea. I originally began my education in straight Catholic schools. And they were fine for me, to an extent. It was sort of like getting a lot of A's and everything for not doing any work. And when I hit about seventh grade, I was with this real tough group. And, you know, standing in the parking lot smoking cigarettes with jackets open in January type of fun and entertainment, really ridiculous. And my mother began to become very concerned about me when I stole her car and went driving around. And so, she knew, in her wisdom, that she couldn't reach me, and she can talk to me. So, she sent me to my sister Barbara, who's twelve years older than me, and who I've always had a very strong affinity with. I stayed there for a month. When I came home my mother said: "Well, Jeanie guess what? There's this wonderful school. It's called Morgan Park Academy. The classes have only like sixteen people in them. And you get to work at your own rate, and it's in the city, and it's real integrated." And I'm like: "Wow, Mom. That sounds real cool. Someday maybe, you know, I'll check it out. She's like: "Well you have your entrance exam Wednesday." And I was like: "Oh..." So anyway, I got into this school and it turned out there was like these real rich, snotty kids there. And I was just like: �"Oh jeez, I don't need this." One day… the first day of school someone asked me what did my father do for a living, and how much money did he make. And I told her that my father was an alcoholic, and we were on welfare. [Jean] Which was absolutely the untruth. But I just like a little bitch. I'm not going to tell her the truth. It's none of her business. But anyway, I got into the faculty there, and I realized what I could learn there. And I realized that I didn't need, oh, just to be told what to do, that learning itself was an incentive enough for me. And that I just couldn't stand, you know, all this worrying about tests, and what did you get on the test and… you know, what do you have to know for the test. That whole attitude… whenever I came across that it just, you know, put my back up. and I was like get me out of here. At that school, I was allowed to get away from that. And at St. John's, there certainly wasn't at all an issue, I didn't even know they gave grades until later. I found out that I did rather well. But, you know, I just didn't need traditional structured education. [Barbara] Do think that's because you got too much of it? Or for other reasons.? [Jean] No, I think it's just the way I'm made. Just me. [Laughter] [Barbara] I went to a school founded by John Dewey, who was a student of James's. And when it hits you, when you hit one school like that it spoils you for anything else. [Jean] Yeah, and it's not spoiled. Well, I mean it's… you don't want to go back. [Barbara] Yeah. [Jean] You don't need it. [Barbara] You become very cynical about traditional education is another way to put it. [Jean] Yes, it's true. [Barbara] Okay, you talk about major frustration. Are there other frustrations you would like to talk about? [Jean] Yeah, I think one is a real general frustration. It's sort of like, I feel in the course of my life I've come at the end of every great wave that I have wanted to be a part of desperately. And it's like I'm, you know, trying to body surf. And it goes right over me, and I'm back there, and then it crashes on the beach, and it's pulled back in, and then I'm just waiting for the next wave or something. When I was six my sister, Barbara again, you know, she was in college. It was nineteen sixty-seven. She was sitting in the rain for her black roommates and, you know, it was all very powerful to me. It really stuck with me. And I thought that's what we �do in college. When I got there, I was all psyched for it, and then I grew up in things where the seventies… [Jean] Where nobody wanted to commit to anything, and everything was the blank generation. and it was a denial of everything that happened in sixties, it seem to me. And so, at that time I think I sort of espoused hippie virtues, you know, or tried to. I made myself and was forced into the position of being a dinosaur. Of being, you know, like this extinct being. Yet walking along the living, but not wanting to be part of what they were doing. And not wanting to fit in, and not wanting to espouse those principles. Because I didn't see any principles in them. So, it was pretty rough. But by the time I got to college, I realized the sixties are gone. Life has changed a lot. There's no hippies anymore, the hippies who are here are clinging to the past. This is a new time, and we need a new kind of people to deal with, you know, the sixties plus the seventies, and now the eighties. You know it's a new world. And one of my frustrations at William James was being considered a hippie even though I wasn't. You know, and you get a lot of flak. But that didn't really bother me, I can sort of laugh that off. [Barbara] What kind of flak? Or you really don't know? [Jean] A lot of times… when you're talking to CAS people. And I hate doing the camp business, you know, I mean our side and their side of the river or whatever. But people want to take it seriously. I mean from the point of a guy not asking you out on a date because you are William James student, to in a conversation…you're just not being taken seriously because you're considered a radical. Even though I'm very… I consider myself conservative liberal. You know, I'm not into radical changes. I'm into reasonable discussion of what's going on and then see what can be done. But not just changing for change's sake. I'm not radical politically, and I'm not a hippie, and I'm not living in the past. And a lot of times… it's hard for me to be specific right now, my mind is not really on it… clearly enough to come up with specific examples of times I felt put down, or rejected for having… [Barbara] The out of tape line is blinking at me, so it's going to stop in a second. So, it’s a good time to just wait anyway. [Jean] Okay. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource William James College Interviews Description An account of the resource Videotaped interviews of William James College faculty, students and administrators by Barbara Roos. William James College opened in 1971 as the third baccalaureate degree granting college for Grand Valley. It was originally designed to be an interdisciplinary, non-departmentalized college consisting of concentration programs, rather than majors. Curriculum was organized around three concentrations that were meant to be interdisciplinary career preparation offerings: Social Relations, Administration and Information Management, and Environmental Studies. The college was discontinued in 1983 during a reorganization of Grand Valley. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1984 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/69">William James College faculty and student interviews (GV016-16)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Michigan Universities and colleges Oral histories Alternative education Interdisciplinary approach in education Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Roos, Barbara (Interviewer) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV016-16 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Language A language of the resource eng Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV016-16_GVSU_06_Doyle Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Doyle, Jean Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1984 Title A name given to the resource Jean Doyle interview (1 of 3, video and transcript) Description An account of the resource Interview with Jean Doyle by Barbara Roos, documenting the history of Grand Valley State's William James College. William James College was the third baccalaureate degree granting college for Grand Valley. It was originally designed to be an interdisciplinary, non-departmentalized college consisting of concentration programs, rather than majors. The college opened in 1971 and was discontinued in 1983 during a reorganization of Grand Valley State. Jean Doyle was a student at William James College and a graduate from Grand Valley's class of 1984. In this interview, Jean discusses the journey that brought her to William James College from her hometown of Chicago, Illinois and how she felt a calling toward alternative education to study Art Therapy. This interview is part 1 of 3 for Jean Doyle. Please note: this interview contains the audio recording in place of the video recording. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Roos, Barbara (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Michigan Universities and colleges Oral histories Alternative education Art therapy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/69">William James College faculty and student interviews (GV016-16)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/8ee39a5b5414d9b1d03c17830572ef79.mp4 3a0edb7fa219c3623c7a772bb7e4894c https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/d74c2ceee996f1cec1384a19e37b7f1b.pdf 601c8e0df1c3bbdf4c60d5bac40065db PDF Text Text William James College Interviews GV016-16 Interviewer: Barbara Roos Interviewee: Jean Doyle Date: 1984 Part: 2 of 3 [Jean] Okay, remember… I believe it was my first year there, and I just met and fell in love with Claire Porter and Sally Labheart (?) I was finding so much strength and joy in the dance department. I was so happy. Dance was my, you know, it was just my thing. It was where I'd go and be away from everything, and just have what I needed, and wanted. I was learning a lot and it was great for my body. I felt real good. Then all of a sudden, I hear: Tom, Sally, Claire. All the people I thought were the highest of the high were being pink slipped, fired, let go! That the Performing Arts Center as a body was being annihilated. I just freaked out. I just I could not believe it. I thought: "Now this is the one thing that I found so far that's outstanding on this campus, that is excellent. Why is the administration, or whoever is responsible for this decision, afraid of excellence? Why are they striving towards mediocrity? What is it that they're afraid of?" And so, they left, and before it was finally finalized, we're going to have sitting around the library. And I thought well this is it, finally. My first sit in, and I'm so excited. We made posters and the day of the sit in it rained. About three or four people showed up, and it was just a real discouraging. PAC just sort of fizzled out, and it was gone. Those fine people left that campus and I still had room one twenty-one where the dance studio was is my retreat, and my sacred space. But you know, I didn't have the golden teachers to bring me to higher things. You know, everything I did had to come from inside myself. Christine is a very good teacher and a very good friend, but she was sick a lot. She just was really involved with a lot of things going on with herself. You just can't have one teacher and who can teach you everything. Because they, you know, she's… her expertise is in a certain kind of modern dance, and there's many kinds modern of dance. There's many kinds of, you know, everything that really need to be dealt with [inaudible]… [Jean] … would leave the profession because they can't make a decent living at it, you know. Tell you… that was excellence. [Barbara] So, why don't talk about the closing of James. [Jean] Okay, that was significant to me and number ways. I really love Barry, Robert, and Steven for the help they gave the students to deal with it. They spoke to us about different languages and that we couldn't just express our needs and our interest in terms of that we were familiar and comfortable in talking with and have that mean anything on an administrative level. That we had to take our terms and translate them into terms that would be understandable and acceptable. When �Stephen and Robert were advocating for this college at those meetings, I just felt like it was a new spirit of seventy-six where you know they were like Thomas Jefferson or something. Fighting for a new nation or a new state that ought to exist, that deserve to exist in its own right. That they were being very reasonable about it. [Jean] That they were passionate but dispassionate at the same time about it and they were at those meetings and they had their thoughts together and they had them organize and they had them put out in a way it could be understood by anyone, in any terms. It still didn't do any good. [Barbara] What meetings were these? [Jean] They were reorganization meetings, I think. They were going on in Zumberge Hall. It was like the year or so before the final verdict came down that we were closed. Do you remember those? [Barbara] Kind of. It all blurs for me. [Inaudible] Blurs. So, what you remember is, you know… [Jane] Yeah, it was, I believe it was there that they'd would, you know. They'd have to cancel class here and there even because the meetings were not arranged for convenience. They would go and come back. They'd look very tired and worn. But I know that they gave it their very best shot you know. [Barbara] But then you were talking about when the closure actually came. [Jean] Well, the closure came with no closure. I guess William James being place a where process was something that was espoused, was appreciated, was reveled in, was maybe drawn out too long, and every decision that was ever made there as a group took so much to do, but it was always worth it. When the closure came its sort of like there was no closure, there was no finishing, and it just sort of dissipated and that was very distressful to me. I really missed that. We had a William James (our last synoptic that while we were still in college) and it was one where a lot of alumni were invited. And Adrian came and I'll never forget she read this poem and I have a copy of it now. It's called "To Be of Use." It's beautiful a poem about, you know, what is the meaning of life? It's to be useful, and to put yourself into a task fully. There's a lot of other alumni who came back and talked about what they felt about the school and what the entire experience it meant to them. And that was the birth to the William James Association from that meeting. And so that was April when we had that synoptic discussion. Then in May, at the end of school, it was last week of classes. There was this meeting of the William James Association the first meeting and I almost cried when I was there because there had been two or three hundred students. And of those two �or three hundred students of the present time, myself, Linda Rogers, Henry Hardy, Mark Zepatowski (?), Ralph, you know there was just a handful of us there. It sort of seem like everybody just went "Well it's over. Okay, onto something else." You know, and that it didn't mean anything to them. [Jean] It probably did, but just at that moment it felt like: "Where are you people? What is your experience here? Where are you coming from?" And there was a lot of alumni there, and people who had really cared, but I think the rest of my fellow students were burnt out from all the haggling and fighting for the right to exist. We just sort of had reached a point of exhaustion and apathy where they just said: "You know, oh well. What are we fighting for? Let's stop fighting, let's go home." So that's, I think, where that boils down to. It was real disappointing and real anti-climactic. [Barbara] What was the funeral like? [Jean] The funeral was a statement made… Mark Zapatowski and his unique way conceived the idea of a film to document this whole experience. Which I really appreciated because it felt like there was someone in fact, a group of people, the [inaudible] who cared. [Barbara] I changed the shot, so you kind of just pick it up. [Jean] Okay. Anyway, Mark had conceived the idea of the system documenting what it happened through the whole devolution of Grand Valley State Colleges. And so, we got all of us together for this one shot. This one idea he had. No actually this is the original idea, and then it evolved into the starch blob (?) the whole documentation. But this is just a commemoration of the death of Thomas Jefferson College, which was the first of the murders on the campus. We all became very… using words like that. Like murder, assassination, annihilation--as if it were human bodies being knocked off because it was sort of death that was happening all around us all the time. And we were just… felt real wounded and so the funeral happened on a summer day. We had a huge box just full of costumes, and musical instruments. We were at the farmhouse, and we got all dressed up and we drove over to Grand Valley. We went to the Lake Huron Hall, which is where Thomas Jefferson used to be, and someone was filming from the balcony and someone from the street. We came around, and this procession formed, oh there was everyone there. There were monks, the barbarian, the sprites. It was a wonderful long procession of different spirits and characters. It was just… do you want me to tell you about the film not being there? [Laughter] [Barbara] [Inaudible] [Jean] The funeral was to sort of… trying to bring some closure to that very [inaudible]. �Nothing was said. There was no announcement made. It just became realities that suddenly this college didn't exist. And then they were doing it to William James, and that was in the works. [Jean] I think that's why Mark got the idea to it to make something about the finishing off of Thomas Jefferson College because nothing had been said. It just ceased to be, and we were realizing that we were in the process of having our school ceased to be. And it was a scary time, and so we wanted to say something. We wanted to point something out to thin air, if nothing else, you know. [Barbara] Do you see that commune, that was historically active closing James, had anything to do with the closing of James? [Jean] Actually, it could. Now, historically it was kind of concurrent. There were several incidences where people from this group, and also with SRX. Where they got silly and wrecked some stuff. And that can't be tolerated, on any form. I mean destruction of property is bad behavior. And writing things on the wall about people who look at it every day, it's not an intelligent move. It was real politically incorrect of them. I'm sure it was innocent; it was naïve, too. I mean they weren't realizing the implications they felt at that moment; that we were eternal and there was nothing that was going to hurt us. So, they could say what they want, and express their anger, and destroy things that belonged to people that, you know, they would like to spit upon. So, they did foolish things in that sort of young silly way. I think some of those things just was like: "Well look at these people!" You know, got generalized everyone. And academics were no longer looked at, and it was just that we were an undesirable element then. A bunch of destructive of brats or something. So, I would imagine it had something to do with the beginning of the process that eventually closed the school. I wouldn't be surprised. It's because it was sort of around the same time. So, I really don't know. Yeah, there was so much tension then. There was so much tension. Always fighting, and… there's a good, I mean, we were all politically aware and active, and we cared. Somehow things got taken too far, and the political activity just turned to destructive behavior. It was no longer political it was tantruming. [Barbara] That's an interesting answer. It hadn't been what I was expecting you to say, because I wasn't talking about trashing. I mean did you guys just go on and live communally? Oops, we're going to run out of tape. Live communally as a... � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource William James College Interviews Description An account of the resource Videotaped interviews of William James College faculty, students and administrators by Barbara Roos. William James College opened in 1971 as the third baccalaureate degree granting college for Grand Valley. It was originally designed to be an interdisciplinary, non-departmentalized college consisting of concentration programs, rather than majors. Curriculum was organized around three concentrations that were meant to be interdisciplinary career preparation offerings: Social Relations, Administration and Information Management, and Environmental Studies. The college was discontinued in 1983 during a reorganization of Grand Valley. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1984 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/69">William James College faculty and student interviews (GV016-16)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Michigan Universities and colleges Oral histories Alternative education Interdisciplinary approach in education Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Roos, Barbara (Interviewer) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV016-16 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Language A language of the resource eng Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV016-16_GVSU_07_Doyle Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Doyle, Jean Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1984 Title A name given to the resource Jean Doyle interview (2 of 3, video and transcript) Description An account of the resource Interview with Jean Doyle by Barbara Roos, documenting the history of Grand Valley State's William James College. William James College was the third baccalaureate degree granting college for Grand Valley. It was originally designed to be an interdisciplinary, non-departmentalized college consisting of concentration programs, rather than majors. The college opened in 1971 and was discontinued in 1983 during a reorganization of Grand Valley State. Jean Doyle was a student at William James College and a graduate from Grand Valley's class of 1984. In this interview, Jean discusses her experience with the closing of William James College, the final WJ Association meeting, and the "funeral" that took place outside Lake Huron Hall regarding the closing of Thomas Jefferson College and William James College. This interview is part 2 of 3 for Jean Doyle. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Roos, Barbara (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Michigan Universities and colleges Oral histories Alternative education Dance Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/69">William James College faculty and student interviews (GV016-16)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/414504e8b2b1a25b691357ee031bcde1.mp4 8b50623872c79a6ed0b59347afe9af58 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/dff76c9144326b8e832dadb1fcaecbcb.pdf a48043e603338a344b6690f614f4e555 PDF Text Text William James College Interviews GV016-16 Interviewer: Barbara Roos Interviewee: Jean Doyle Date: 1984 Part: 3 of 3 [Barbara] Could you think for a minute, if you had to sum up William James education-What's unique about it? In just a sentence. [Jean] One sentence?! [Barbara] Well, two. [Jean] I think the unique… one of the most unique features of William James education is that it was learning as a group project. And that I never heard from any teacher there that: "I have the information, I'm going to put it in your head." I heard from every teacher: "This is subject I really turned on about and if you're have turned on about it right now, I hope by the end of this experience you will be. And let's go!" And that was sort of an adventure spirit that I loved. I felt respected, like my mind was being respected. That I had a place to express my thoughts, think my thoughts, and find out what my thoughts were. And that's more than one sentence. But I think that's a unique feature generally. [Barbara] Actually that was more than one sentence… it's more than one thought. But that's okay. [Inaudible] Okay, I am through with my questions. [Jean] Okay. [Barbara] What do you want to say? [Jean] I really love the people that I met at William James. I think that's a large part of why didn't leave. Robert Mayberry is an incredible teacher. Ros is incredible. I tended to repeat their classes over and over. I mean, or you know, take their different classes because I was just so, you know, just so loving them. And Steven gave me so much. I can't… I wish I could think of how to describe it. Barry, sitting in seminar with him and there was almost a religious sentiment about it. The learning was so important. We were discussing in this one seminar on school and society things that were so important to us in that room. There was only four people in the seminar and it was rich, and it was good. There's just been times and conversation with people that, you know, you just bring them with you for the rest of your life. I loved William James College. I loved the coffee machine in the morning and going there and meeting with all those people who are so good. I can't talk right now. �[Barbara] Okay. Let me turn it off. [Jean] It's hard to… [Barbara] White balance again. [Crinkling paper] [Barbara] It's warming up. Come on thing, do it! [Barbara] First black people felt very close and why that had anything to do with education at all [?]. [Jean] I'm not exactly sure why people felt close there. I know they were feeling close when I got there, so I felt safe to open myself and to feel close to them. And it felt real good and it felt really different from attitudes that I had seen. And I was sort of developing this theory about the nuclear fear, the fear of nuclear holocaust, infecting people's minds to the point where they are driving their life like a car down the road. And they are isolated from other cars on the road, and they're going to this destination. They don't care how they get there, or why they're even going, but they have this point and they're going there, and the hell with everyone else. And at William James it was like we were in a big bus, and we were all going somewhere together. And it mattered where we were going, but it didn't matter how long it took because we were having a good time as we are going. So, we were happy. There was a family feeling and that did within the classroom allow, I think, for more freedom of speech. That you weren't so afraid of speaking your mind or of trying out a new idea because you knew beyond, you know, maybe this intellectual point there was something else you shared with these people. And you weren't going to be disregarded or heated or rejected from the whole group for expressing a weird thought. Now, as far as why community is important in education, I believe that it's because if you sit at home alone and read a book. And it could be a wonderful book, and mean a lot to you. And be doing all kinds of things inside of you to be taking this in, and that's fine. But if you have a book, and you have twenty copies of that book, and everybody's read that book, and everybody has their own view of it. And everybody's view is respected of it, when you bring everyone together to discuss it, there is something about the collectivity of the minds meeting and working together that I believe will open to wider vision. And the Jamesian sense of why we are here to share perspectives. Because having a community in which you feel safe to express yourself is so important if you're going to really do that Jamesian approach to learning, of having people's view of the whole coming together to make a larger vision. And that really seem to have hit William James. It happened for me and I learned a lot from my contemporaries and teachers and I believe we learned it in that way… by turning on each other's minds. And that you know people who are kind of dragging their feet got caught up in it, and it was contagious. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource William James College Interviews Description An account of the resource Videotaped interviews of William James College faculty, students and administrators by Barbara Roos. William James College opened in 1971 as the third baccalaureate degree granting college for Grand Valley. It was originally designed to be an interdisciplinary, non-departmentalized college consisting of concentration programs, rather than majors. Curriculum was organized around three concentrations that were meant to be interdisciplinary career preparation offerings: Social Relations, Administration and Information Management, and Environmental Studies. The college was discontinued in 1983 during a reorganization of Grand Valley. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1984 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/69">William James College faculty and student interviews (GV016-16)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Michigan Universities and colleges Oral histories Alternative education Interdisciplinary approach in education Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Roos, Barbara (Interviewer) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV016-16 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Language A language of the resource eng Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV016-16_GVSU_08_Doyle Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Doyle, Jean Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1984 Title A name given to the resource Jean Doyle interview (3 of 3, video and transcript) Description An account of the resource Interview with Jean Doyle by Barbara Roos, documenting the history of Grand Valley State's William James College. William James College was the third baccalaureate degree granting college for Grand Valley. It was originally designed to be an interdisciplinary, non-departmentalized college consisting of concentration programs, rather than majors. The college opened in 1971 and was discontinued in 1983 during a reorganization of Grand Valley State. Jean Doyle was a student at William James College and a graduate from Grand Valley's class of 1984. In this interview, Jean discusses her overall thoughts on the William James education, in addition to her love of its community and adventurous spirit. This interview is part 3 of 3 for Jean Doyle. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Roos, Barbara (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Grand Valley State University Michigan Universities and colleges Oral histories Alternative education Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/69">William James College faculty and student interviews (GV016-16)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0e28d4aff3586abd9b1fbc9e1da2f0f1.pdf 4af474baea4c664bf04cfbfb71c38fdc PDF Text Text Speaking Out Western Michigan’s Civil Rights Histories Interviewee: Jeanne Englehart Interviewers: Tylenda, Evan, Connor Johnson, Jason, Send, and Philip Joslyn Supervising Faculty: Melanie Shell-Weiss Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 2/22/2012 Biography and Description Jeanne was raised in Atlanta, Michigan. She is a successful business women in the West Michigan area. She discusses how she became the successful woman that she is today. Transcript TYLENDA: We are hoping you will open up and you can talk about what you want. ENGLEHART: You must have some type of prepared questions? GROUP: Oh yeah. ENGLEHART: Just curious, how did you get my name?” GROUP: We knew we wanted to interview a successful woman in business… in Grand Rapids and we came across your name. Basically because of US Diversity we learned how women historically and today are treated differently in business and what not. So we are coming to you to get your view point on that because I’m sure you’ve dealt with that. ENGLEHART: So the premise to really how women how women are treated differently? TYLENDA: Yeah and see maybe any obstacles you have overcome and maybe different viewpoints, if men have treated you differently because you are a women and what not. We will also want some background information and we can go from there. ENGLEHART: It’s probably easier if you just started asking me questions other than ….. GROUP: Give us a detail background not real detail but outline of how and where you grew up. Head into how and when you knew you wanted to start your own business and just kind of transition us into that, college maybe. ENGLEHART: Well actually I grew up in Atlanta, Michigan, which is up in northern Lower Michigan in a small town that graduated 52 kids. That shows you how big it was. A lot of them are Engleharts, so just a large family and very very poor family……. It was not… we had 5 kids and a father who was disabled so it wasn’t a family that was education was important and a family that had the means to provide education. At some point I think I just decided it was… I needed to get out of there. So……I …..How do I Page 1 �start? There’s a really good, should of brought it for you, There’s a really good article that was in the Grand Rapids press about my life. That will give you a wealth of detail that I will be repeating. That will probably be really helpful and would put a lot of things into context for you, but … I kind of ended up in Grand Rapids in 1980 -81. And I came to work at, there used to be a store called computer land over on 28th street and they sold computers, they sold apple they sold big old luggable Compacts. They decided they wanted to offer classes for the customers that bought computers and I happened to be standing in line with the general manager of the store; I didn’t know him at the time. It was an IBM meeting and told me they were looking for someone. At the time I was working up at Mt Pleasant at CMU and then for a company called MoBark Industries. I thought oh gee why not that would be kind of fun to try that. So we moved to Grand Rapids… Sorry I have really bad allergies at this time of the year; I take Zertec and get cotton mouth so I apologize if my I take sips of water. There is also a Cat here at the school and I am allergic to cats, so it’s a double whammy. GROUP: We saw that. ENGLEHART: Oh yeah, it’s a big ole ally cat that the kids adopted. Of course it knows I don’t like it so it comes and finds me… Anyway, I had taken a job at CMU and was working there and then took a different job working for this company called MoBark industries. They were offering me different positions as I learned more about computers. JOHNSON: So that’s how you got to learn about computers? ENGLEHART: Well it was a lot of word processing back then, so I was heading up to the word processing area. TYLENDA: That’s back when you had the punch cards? ENGLEHART: Yeah, oh yeah and the tapes that ran through it. Yeah long time ago. So I took the job and once I was at Computer Land and I was working there for a year or two I thought how it was interesting that people would think, since you were part of a retail store that we were trying to sell them something instead of just educate them. So I noticed this funny little niche for someone who doesn’t sell anything but really knows how to use computers for business applications. So it’s just like this little hybrid piece that I kept thinking I know how to use a computer to increase people’s business efficiencies but they sometimes didn’t believe it because you’re working at a retail store. So I thought, well, there might be a business here. So I went and decided that I would try and start my own business. So I borrowed 5000 on my credit card and started a business. I didn’t go to the bank because I knew I didn’t have anything that anybody would loan against. So I can’t say I was ever discriminated against when it came to banking because I don’t think they would of lent the money to a man either. It wasn’t a female issue at that point. You don’t have to collateral you don’t get the loan. So that’s the way it usually it works and that was 1985. TYLENDA: Did you maybe have anybody telling you it might not of been a good idea or persuading you to do something else in regards to opening the business? ENGLEHART: Well it was my decision, at the time I was still doing work for Computer Land and I was doing work for Grand Rapids Junior college. So I had 2 different income streams and I went to the president at the community college and said I really wanted to do this because again people wouldn’t come to the college to teach them business because they thought you were going to teach them academics. So there was this competing interest. Are you retail or academic? Well I was neither. I’m in Page 2 �the middle. And so I went to him and said I want to do this, I want a sabbatical. I wanted a fallback position if it didn’t work. So he gave me a year to come back. So in part people say you must have been a big risk taker. I guess I didn’t see it as a risk. It was in hindsight. I almost had something I could go back to if it didn’t work. And so I found through Grand Valley, they used to have a computer lab for over flow of obstruction that was down on Division and Fountain. That was a building down on the corner. I don’t think they even own it anymore. They had a computer lab down there and so I worked out an agreement with them that I could use that computer lab for my classes. I started my business and I had a little office right there next to the Grand Valley space and I shared the Grand Valley admin who was part of the lab there. They were gracious enough to let me have a year to pay the rent. In exchange for me helping them maintain their computer lab and helping them with some of the stuff they needed. So it allowed me to have some time to not have to pay rent…It was kind of a unique situation. TYLENDA: Was there a time when you thought your business would not be successful and when did you truly start seeing it grow? ENGLEHART: Well I truly think there are always points when you think it’s not going to work and what was I thinking. I probably, yeah at least one time when I took a project on and then after I got into it I realized the way I had quoted it was wrong. I was losing my shirt on it. But you have to do it. You have to do what you say you’re going to do. It’s a big small town and word gets out very quick and so people were coming to me because of my reputation and my name so it was really important. I mean the company was Englehart training so it wasn’t too hard to figure out who owned it. So that was just a nice way for me to be able to, had to be able to do what I said I was going to do. Grand Valley was nice enough to help me with that. So it was a nice Segway for me, were I really started seeing that it was really going to take off. I always thought it was going to be successful but thought it had limited potential. Because once people are trained then what do they need? I wasn’t seeing how many upgrades, how many upgrades in the software industry. This was before Microsoft, this was back when teaching people Vizocal and WordStar was the word processor. This was before office. So I was doing a lot of training on these products and every time they had an upgrade then people had to be trained. So there were a lot of companies that came to me to do their training for employees. So this wasn’t onesy twosy people coming in. I did have public classes that were published but the majority of my business was corporate work so. JOHNSON: How did you stay up on your training with the changes? ENGLEHART: I would go to the different software companies. I did spend a lot of time in Utah with WordPerfect doing stuff and with Novell spent a lot of time with Microsoft when it became more popular. We became Microsoft Certified. That was the only way to get training was to spend time with the manufacturer. So that was always part of what I had to do. If I didn’t have the expertise I found people who did have it and contract with them. Especially in the areas of networking and open systems architecture, those were beyond my capabilities so I found people I could hire on a contract basis and put together a plan where we could split the profits. He was happy I was happy. TYLENDA: So how long did that go for? How long were you…? ENGLEHART: Oh gosh, well I was in the grand valley building for only a year. The business I sold the business 13 years later. And by then I had owned and built my own building. I had 52 employees and it was part of a franchise and system that I helped start. IT kind of grew really fast. There were a couple interim offices in Detroit. If you go to the lake shore and you go past Fruitridge and 3 mile there’s a Page 3 �building with a pyramid…it’s all glass to the top, that’s the building I built. So I sold the building and the business and then the tech market tanked. ENGLEHART: That was db luck, totally db luck *Continues to laugh* so it grew I think because it just, people again trusted that you can’t be all things to all people but you find people who can. So I was really big on finding the right people and again bring that level of expertise in. Even though it might have been a cost that I couldn’t afford like with those being Novell and Microsoft certification for networks. That’s a totally different animal then teaching people word processing. I had an arrangement with the experts that we split the profits. People would come in for that name because they had all the certifications. It was a really good way to build the business. Those are the cash cows, 5 days and $3000 classes. Those are the systems that engineers need constant training….. And so I figured it was just time to sell. TYLENDA: So is part of that still around today? ENGLEHART: The company I sold to well at the time it was known as Productivity Point International. Which is a, it’s a… TYLENDA: Subserr... ENGLEHART: No. Well it’s actually started by, a group called Knowledge Universe, but anyway. They bought. There were a hundred and some franchises by the time… TYLENDA: Wow. ENGLEHART: I sold and there was 8 individuals who started that franchise. So I was one of the people that started it. So when we sold, it was Chicago, San Francisco, New York, Austin Texas, Me, little old Grand Rapids, and who were the other ones? I can’t remember. But, so those are the ones they bought and then they didn’t do a very good job managing them. TYLENDA: Yeah. ENGLEHART: So, then again the market, the tech market just tanked. So, it’s one of those things, it was the right time for me. I was ready to do something else. I think I’m a serial entrepreneur. ENGLEHART: I have to be doing something different. TYLENDA: So, what is it that made you want to sell the businesses? Then what did you move on to? ENGLEHART: Well what made me want to sell it was the right price. I mean… It’s pretty... the greatest thing. ENGLEHART: It’s pretty basic when someone says, “Here’s a check.” And so it was money. It was also the fact that I was kind of bored with it. I was just kind of tired of doing it. My kids were grown and I thought well maybe it’s time to do that. And, with any business that grows that fast, you’re highly leveraged. I mean you have a lot of debt. You can’t grow a business that fast without having a lot of debt. So some of it is the attraction of not only getting a check, your debts getting paid off. So, how tuff is that? I just thought, well I’ll just go play with my grandkids for a while. I had no intention of doing anything. I left and it was June ’97, I think June ’97, and I, people know, and , when you’re available. Page 4 �And, Congressman Ehlers called me and asked me if I would consider working as his District Director doing some work for him. And I said, I love you Vern, but I hate politics. Why would I do that? And what he really wanted was me to do relations person. Someone who knew the people and the community and had credibility that could represent him in meetings and could really be his eyes and ears on the ground and help him with that outreach that all congressmen have to have because he was in Washington. ENGLEHART:’s Phone Rings ENGLEHART: Sorry, I should turn my phone off. Group Laughter ENGLEHART: So I just said... Told him I would do it and I did it for… I loved it. It was actually a great job. Because I reported to, the chief of staff in Washington, but I was worked here in the federal building. And there was staff here in the federal building that did things like immigration and social security and lots of casework, but my job was really out in the community. So, I didn’t have casework in the same way. It was a great job; I loved it. And then I was there five and a have years. And , someone asked me to apply for the CEO of the chamber of Commerce position. And I thought, hmmm. Do I really want to work that hard or not? And it was the national search and I thought what the heck? So threw my hat in the ring because I just loved what the chamber did. And just, ? They got it down to 30 people, and then they had 10, and then they had 6. And I said I think better tell Vern because somehow, somehow somebody’s going to tell him. Even though they had kept it very quite. So and when they selected me for the position. So, I did that. I took that job in January of 2005. TYLENDA: Okay. ENGLEHART: And stayed seven and a half years. I retired this past April. A year ago April from the chamber. And I was retired for four months and they called and asked me if I would help with the school. TYLENDA: Sounds like you’re trying to get out. ENGLEHART: I am. TYLENDA: And they’re just trying, trying to come back to you. ENGLEHART: I’m done. I’m done. No, they bought this building. Educational everything, great teachers and principle, etc. They uh, but they purchased a building. They had a half million dollar building that all of the sudden they had to pay for. It was a different skill set they needed someone with some operations skills and someone that could help them really put all of the business practices in place so that they could be sustainable. So I gave them a six-month contract to do that. I’m in month seven and I am done. Next week is my last week. ENGLEHART: So, yeah. No, I did what they needed. So... Helped them launch a capital campaign so they can start getting some money. They, they want to build an early childhood center. So… TYLENDA: Okay. Page 5 �ENGLEHART: So. Just. Than I am officially retired. ENGLEHART: Truly. JOHNSON: So, I don’t mean to like back track, but during all of this, when, when did you have your children? And how was that? How was parenting and like owning a business? ENGLEHART: Not easy. JOHNSON: How did that work? ENGLEHART: Well I had my children, let’s see. They’re now, I’m trying to think. They were not... I’m trying to think if they... When I lived in Mt. Pleasant, they were with me, I was divorced at the time. And they were with me in Mt. Pleasant. So I didn’t have the kind of job that was real strenuous. I worked at the college and was a secretary for one of the departments. And I am one of those horrible examples of someone who does not have a college degree. Went a long way on street smarts, but probably one of my biggest regrets. But it just didn’t happen. It didn’t happen for lots of reasons. And so, I kind of… My kids were part of the equation. Then they went to live with their dad for a while. And then they came back to live with me. So they were sort of in and out of the picture. By the time I started my business the oldest one was living with me and the youngest one was living with his father. So I only had, I was only single parent to one at that time. But early on I was, had them both. So they were… It was a challenge. Very much a challenge. But… TYLENDA: So you went into the Chamber of Commerce. What did that, what was kind of your job description? What would you do for that? ENGLEHART: Well, the chamber has 3,000 business members. And so the job was really to, , have services and programs and, and keep the members happy, ? Very strong political aspect to it. We had an office in Lansing. So, I was registered lobbyist. I did a lot of lobbying, which wasn’t my favorite part of the job. I spent a lot of time meeting with the businesses to find out what they needed and how we could help them be more successful. This, the Grand Rapids chamber is one of the 25 largest chambers in the United States. It’s a very large chamber. So we had, there was a lot of programs. We had our, our diversity initiatives, which were very unique in the country. And so we did a lot of work with them. Business that had an interest in how can diversity help your bottom line. We did, started to do a lot of work with sustainability while I was there with Norm Christopher at Grand Valley, who worked with me. So we set up a whole sustainability program so that people could find out more about how they could, their triple bottom line could be affected by sustainability. So the chamber is just always moving target. The job is to meet the needs of the members. Whatever it might be. And they’ll call you when they’re upset with the city commissioner because their sewer problem, or they’ll call you when they’re mad at the governor. So, it’s just a very wide range and so we would advocate on their behalf and try to help them solve their problems. So it’s just, it was, I mean it’s a management job. I mean, that’s what you do. You’re managing people and you’re managing resources. But it’s also very much a public position. You go to a lot of events and represent the chamber. I said if I never have to go to another black tie event in my life, I would be perfectly happy. Perfectly happy. JOHNSON: So now you said you didn’t, you regret not going to college. But yet, you still made it this far. Like how… Do you think that was easy or it’s possible for anybody? Page 6 �ENGLEHART: No. No, not any more. I don’t think so. I think that was probably the time, the era. I think it’s also that as I built my reputation, it became less important to someone where I was education than it was the results they could see that were proven. So, one thing I’ve never been is, never been dishonest about it. I mean, from day, everybody that I would never apply for a job or say, without telling someone. if this is what you want, I don’t have that master’s degree you’re looking for on the piece of paper. So, don’t waste your time, if this is important. So I guess it’s one of those things, now I don’t think you could do that. I don’t think you’d even get your foot in the door. But because again I think it is such a big-small town and I had done so much and I think I could do it because I was so well known. And that’s the bottom line. I don’t think you could do that anymore because people wouldn’t even give you a chance. TYLENDA: Now do you think you had more opportunities than anybody else did back then? Do you think you kind of, or things just kind of fell in place and you almost got lucky? ENGLEHART: No, I made the opportunities. They didn’t fall in my lap. Nooo, no. I think I had a lot of opportunities, but I think it’s because I was always looking for opportunity. I was always saying, if I’m doing this right now, what’s next? What’s next? What’s next? What’s next? And so, , if you, if you can say, gee, well if, , if we’re, if we’re teaching, , Novel was the big, , for years was the big, , operating system for networks. Well, , once you saw Microsoft make a move in that market, it didn’t take a brain surgeon to figure out that you better be getting Microsoft certified because Microsoft eventually was going to knock Novel out. You, you just kind of know that. So, say well then I can see six months from now, we need to be in this niche and we need to own it. Because if we don’t own it, someone else is going to. For me, it is very, it’s probably a very competitive thing. Is that, I would look for the opportunities and say, I know if I don’t do it, someone else is going to. And how do I get there? And then I would look for the resources that could help. TYLENDA: Mhmm. ENGLEHART: So, sometimes it was using my own money, and going further in debt. And sometimes it was finding people like this company I ended up working with that did all the training. But, yea… JOHNSON: So while you were doing this, what sort of role models did you have? Who did you like look up to or want to stride for? ENGLEHART: Well, I wish I could say I had a lot of them, but I really didn’t. I think… I mean from a personal standpoint, my grandmother. But it was such a different era. I hate to say it. It was very competitive and woman weren’t always women’s best friends. I mean women were more competitive than men. I found that it was easier for me to get advice and ask a man, not to be a mentor necessarily, but ask a man to ask than it was to have a woman. Because that’s just the way it was. Because there were so few opportunities. Everybody wanted to be the queen bee, and there could only be one. And so, if you were the queen bee, they had to knock you off in order to get there. ENGLEHART: …Because there are not a lot of opportunities for women. I mean in high level. In the very highest level. There is not a lot. You look around and you see it. You look at board of directors. I'm on a board. A corporate Board. That, a paid board for a bank. But, there are very few women on those types of boards. There is not very many, Page 7 �TYLENDA: So kind of like could you give us like an example of one of those. Something like a dog eat dog situation. ENGLEHART: Well for example. Now a days they have like Infor, which is a big group for women that has 700 or 800 members. it’s all about supporting each other and supporting women. Well, they didn't have anything that was organized back then. So your support group was really those that you made friends with. AND, your friends you hoped wouldn't try to cut you. But, there was a lot of other people out there that I think would just say, well why, it’s another award. Why is she getting one more award? I don’t know if it is a jealousy factor. I don’t know. But, I felt that a lot and I think it was pretty common. Sort of a self-fulfilling prophecy. If you don’t have the high visibility you are not successful. (laughter) So which do you do? Do you continue? At this point in my life I am low profile. I don’t apply to do anything. They just had the 50 most influential women. I've been on it every year. This year I didn't fill out the application. I said, there are other women coming along that should take place (laughter) not me. I was the past, the future is coming, and so, but I was surprised when I saw the list. There was still a n number of women that are women like myself that are way past 60 that were on that list that I thought, well, haven’t you had enough? Do you really need to have your name on one more thing? I mean I guess I'm at a different point. TYLENDA: So you're more humble ENGLEHART: I just don’t care, it’s not important to me anymore. It's really not. I think at some point I just said I need to have my own sense of worth and it can’t come from a plaque on the wall. (laugh) It has to come from spending time with my 6 grandkids. Being with my husband once and a while. The price you pay for some of the success I had is the... it’s tough on your family, it’s tough. And I remember when my oldest son was in high school and I had started my business and it wasn't too old at the time. He was in sports. I remember going to track meets in my heels to watch him race. All these mothers looking at me. I’m like, I had to run in there and watch him run then I had to go back to work. Because I didn't have the luxury to be on the PTA and to help with the school functions. I had to work. So, they paid the price. I said, it’s time for me to change that. TYLENDA: So do you think you really did miss out on some of the important times back then? Like with your kids. ENGLEHART: OH absolutely. There’s no doubt. I mean you can’t do it all. You think you can. At some point you think you can. back in the 60's we were told we could to it all. So we try to do it all. You sort of find out at some point, you can but at what price. TYLENDA: So is that why you transitioned to this job? Because you feel like it’s a lot more fulfilling? ENGLEHART: No. I am doing this for them. I gave them 6 months. I am really kind of doing it. I am getting paid but I am doing it as a favor to some of the people on the board that I knew. They called me and said would you help. I am not looking for, I wasn't looking for a job and I am not looking for one now. TYLENDA: Don’t worry we're not hiring. ENGLEHART: Well my husband is 69 and he is a retired math teacher so he is at an age too that we are kind of saying, if we are going to travel and do some things now is the time to do it if we don't do it Page 8 �now... and the grand kids are in lots of different states. SO, its time. Summer is coming. Can’t wait to be off for the summer right. JOHNSON: So, when you were working at the Chamber, what sort of atmosphere was it like. Because you said there weren’t a lot of opportunities for women. So did you deal mainly with men a lot? ENGLEHART: When I said there weren't opportunities for women I wasn't referring just to the chamber GROUP: right, right... ENGLEHART: I was referring to corporate America. There weren't a lot of women in those high, high leadership positions. So yeah, I mean. When I would go into a meeting of the "business leaders", Whatever that means , in west Michigan. It’s a bunch of white guys sitting around a table. I mean let’s face it. It is what it is. I don’t know that it is a whole lot different now. So yeah I had to deal with mostly, from a leadership standpoint mostly men. TYLENDA: So did you ever see that you were kind of discriminated against? In the sense that if you did speak up your word wasn't as valuable as a male counterparts to yours. Do you have one good example? ENGLEHART: I think from a political standpoint, , when you're sitting in meetings and there are let’s say 12 business leaders around the table and the governor is there. And you are talking about political issues; there is always a tendency, not saying with this governor, I’m just saying that there is always a tendency to look at the man for answers. Or, I won’t use the governor I think I would probably use a senator or someone from the state house. I wouldn't say the governor. You just see that there is always this tendency that when a question is asked they will turn and say, well what do you think? They will turn to men. And at some point I feel like I have to raise my hand, like a little kid and say, the chamber's opinion is... so I would have to insert myself. But I would say that it was mostly, I think it was mostly political. I can't think where it was a big issue otherwise. I just think it was, just the nature of politicians. It’s a good ole boys network. I mean, that’s what it is. I mean chambers are good ole boy networks. There aren't a lot of women that are CEO's of chambers this size. There are more now. I was the first female CEO they ever had at the chamber. I was the first one. So that tells you something, 120 years it took them to get a woman CEO and then they went back to a white man after me. (Laughter) it’s a good ole boys network. Big-time! So... ENGLEHART: And I think that you think differently and you make decisions differently as a woman. And sometimes Men, that was very difficult for them to understand why would I make this decision? I know one that comes to my mind was the decision that I had to make that had to do with (pause...UH) it was for small market reform which was an insurance issue. And I was. The majority of our members that would have benefited from our supporting this legislation. But I knew that spectr hospital was opposed This is where I probably should have remained anonymous - I knew they were very opposed. And I, the decision, finally. Somebody had to finally make the decision and I made the decision in the interest of our members. Which 80% of those 3,000 members are small businesses. . With less than 10 employees. This was important. Well, I mean, you can imagine the stuff rain down on me big time. That I didn't support, the big dog on the hill. So, to this day there’s, I mean, he would, he wanted my neck, he wanted my job. He was adamant I was going to be fired. But he didn't get me fired... But. . That’s the kind of thing I'm not sure, I’m not sure how. I don’t know how a man would have responded. I just, my sense would have been that they might have caved into the good ole boys pressure. Page 9 �TYLENDA: Especially what you see today too. ENGLEHART: That’s just my, that’s my guess. Not based on anything. Just based on my observation of how, mm, how much pressure these guys can put on people. It's relentless. And I think as a woman you kind of go (hmmm) OK. Been there done that. Had babies. Can’t put pressure on me. (laughter) TYLENDA: So a woman's intuitions... ENGLEHART: Well I think it’s having the interest in the bigger picture. Having an interest in. (trails off) This isn't about, my reputation or about whether I'm the one that’s going to get slammed for making this decision, this is really about what is best for everyone. That’s a tough, tough job to have. Because there is a lot of pressure. So yeah. JOHNSON: So now that you are like, past that you say (inaudible), who do you surround yourself with? What kind of people do you want in your life to... ENGLEHART: Hmmm well I have a group of women friend that are... we used to tap dance together many many years ago. And the tappers are probably from a women’s friend group there is still 10 of us that get together every couple of months and drink wine, eat and drink more wine. So that group I surround myself with those. I surround myself I think with family more. m I have a, my youngest son is disabled. He had a stroke at 29 and he is paralyzed on one side and he can’t speak so I spend time. He's not living with us but I spend a lot of time with those kinds of issues. My oldest grandson lives here in town. He'll be 16 (sigh) and he's driving. So, I just spend a lot of time with, the grandkids and stuff. Because that is positive energy. And I can still make an impact. I can still help them with what they're going through. I don’t know, so, it’s pretty simple these days. I don’t do anything too exciting (laughter). TYLENDA: So would you say... What are you r biggest regrets throughout your whole life? You talked about not spending enough time with your kids, or anything else. Name something you wish you would have done differently. Maybe pursued a different area... ENGLEHART: I mean I certainly regret that I didn’t finish college. That is an obvious one. But mm, I think probably, regret that I, my personality is such that I'm very mm, I'm very focused. And so there's a good aspect to that and there's a bad aspect to that. . The good thing is, is when I am focused on something it is going to get done. I am very good at compartmentalizing and getting it done. The bad news is, is that when I am that focused there are a lot of other things that are going on that I am not paying attention too. Whether that’s is personal friendship that I have lapsed because I haven’t spent enough time. It's a two way street if you want to have friends you have to reach out now and then. It can’t always be the other way. So there’s some of that I regret that I haven’t, I haven’t done a really good job of keeping up with my friends. JOHNSON: So if you were going to give advice to somebody that might be like living in a small-town or having a poor family that wants to become successful what would you tell them? ENGLEHART: Don’t do what I did. (Laughter) mm... (Thinking) I would just say don’t take no for an answer. part of what has gotten me here is, if someone said no, I just figured out another way to do it. . I'm very determined and so I’m also very stubborn. So if somebody would tell me no, it would just, I was just that much more determined to prove them wrong. , and so it’s like just because one person says no or puts up a road block doesn’t mean you can find another way to drive around it and you have to be Page 10 �creative sometimes to drive around it. But you also have to be honest, you have to be ethical, all those things that are really core values I think. If what your core values are and you stick with your core values you will be successful Its just determining I think saying how far you want to push the rock uphill. Some people don’t have the personality that, that they want to keep pushing. I mean I had a family of 5 and all my brothers and sisters still live up in northern Michigan. Not one of them ever left. One has at least gone on to college and came back. Bu they all live there and they are all happy in this little isolated world. Here I would go nuts. But, their kids. they had their kids and their kids went away to college and came back and lived there. I mean its nuts. It’s like O.K. (laughter) To me that wouldn’t be, something I would be very good at, but they're happy. So I guess it’s all in knowing what you want to do. I just knew that I wanted to be someplace else and that I wanted to be. I knew I wanted to be in a city. I didn’t want to be in a town. . And to me Grand Rapids was a huge city. It’s like WOW. And then you go to New York or Chicago and you come back to Grand Rapids and you go this really is a small town. ENGLEHART: But, their kids, they have their kids and their kids went away to college and came back and lived there. I mean its nuts. It’s like to me that would be something that I’d be very good at but their happy so I guess its knowing what are doing what you want to do. I mean I just knew I that I wanted to be someplace else and that I wanted to be, I knew I wanted to be in a city, I didn’t want to be in a town and to me Grand Rapids was a huge city : but wow then you, you go to New York or Chicago and you come back to Grand Rapids you go this really is a small town...but I think that I just knew that I wanted to do something different I did not want to be, I didn’t want to be in Atlanta, Michigan the rest of my life. I was absolutely sure of that. TYLENDA: So I mean do we have any other questions? JOHNSON: Yeah how, what’s time like? TYLENDA: We got about fifty minutes I’d say. Jason: 46...yeah. ENGLEHART: We can finish early...hahaha. TYLENDA: Yeah I mean that’s fine with us just hope our teacher doesn’t get mad at us. ENGLEHART: Oh I see, ok. GROUP: Laughter. TYLENDA: So I mean is there any, I guess if do you guys have any other questions...... Jason: Not really. TYLENDA: I mean if not is there anything else you’d kinda like to say...any last. ENGLEHART: Well I’d like to hear a little more about your project. TYLENDA: Oh ok perfect......do we have the, the consent mm. Page 11 �ENGLEHART: The consent mentions the… TYLENDA: What it, what it is JOHNSON: Its TYLENDA: The group were split up into say five groups total six, six groups total with about four in each group and what it was is we went to go look out someone in society who is kinda viewed as different and so instead of most people went to the African community, African American community maybe like a teacher professor they went to LGBT member and kind of asked ‘em their point. We kind of wanted to do something different. See how a women in business is viewed cause even today that’s still a big topic and pay… ENGLEHART: mhmm. TYLENDA: Pay differences and everything like that. So that’s where we did our research and we, we saw that the 50 influential most, most influential women in Grand Rapids and then we found your name so that’s kinda how we got here. ENGLEHART: Ok. The…the…the focus is though civil rights? TYLENDA: mmm ENGLEHART: Histories, is that western Michigan civil rights histories? TYLENDA: I mean she didn’t give us…she didn’t make it…she didn’t tie us down too much and we even asked her if this was ok and she loved the idea. ENGLEHART: hmmm k TYLENDA: of going out to you so it kind of just worked out and we just wanted to be different. ENGLEHART: Yeah...well… it is interesting when you say civil rights obviously that when I talked about the diversity initiatives, the chamber…… it brought to mind that our chamber was very abnormal. It was the only chamber in the United States that had full time staff dedicated to diversity problems, training and education programs, and it was interesting. At one point when I was very early on in my chamber tenure, there was a major company in town that came to the chamber and asked to have a meeting, so it’s… there are a couple of VP’s. He said they thought we were spending too much time on diversity. TYLENDA: Really? ENGLEHART: Initiatives and programs. TYLENDA: Geez ENGLEHART: and we should be spending more time and interest on political activities and that was what they paid their membership for and if we didn’t make some adjustments they would be cutting back on how much they donated to the chamber and they did. Page 12 �TYLENDA: Unless they changed ENGLEHART: Cause I didn’t change my mind. TYLENDA: Yeah JOHNSON: What sort of a impact did you see your diversity initiative ENGLEHART: Having? JOHNSON: Yeah ENGLEHART: Well they had this program called "Facing Racism" that is just a tremendous 12 week program and the impact I saw was that people that would say to me years after they had gone through it what a change it made in their life because it’s facilitated and it puts you...first of all the makeup of the classes are always intentional to be diverse and you learn a lot about yourself you learn a lot about other races but you learn how… you’re put in situations so how it… it’s a feeling you… TYLENDA: mmhhmm. ENGLEHART: How someone feels and…and there’s… it’s hard to explain it…it’s a very experiential project. I’m trying to think of an example, something they do... TYLENDA: Kinda put people in that. ENGLEHART: We… they do different scenarios but then…but there’s like one they have… they’ll have extra questions like...it’s called packy or back pack. I don’t know, it’s been years since I’ve gone through it but they would a ask question and if you could answer yes then you… then you could step back or, or forward, whatever it was and then this one and they…they ask about when you go to the… if you were to walk into the office or yard you say I need a band aid I cut my finger I mean what color is the band aid? TYLENDA: Yeah...it’s true. ENGLEHART: Now they do have clear band aids and now they… TYLENDA: uh huh ENGLEHART: do have...but typically I mean it’s just those kinds of things and you think will…how would I feel if every time...ah...every…, its…it’s like one more time someone’s pointing out to me I’m different. TYLENDA: mmhhmm ENGLEHART: I’m not the same I mean it’s those little tiny. TYLENDA: and they go Page 13 �ENGLEHART: examples TYLENDA: like some dolls stuff you look at. ENGLEHART: Exactly...exactly. TYLENDA: Cabbage Patch dolls. ENGLEHART: So, so I think that I saw that it made an impact because companies including Grand Valley have put a lot of people through these programs. I think they see it as a way to begin to educate. TYLENDA: mmhhmm ENGLEHART: That begin to tell people that you need to be aware it’s creating that awareness. It’s creating just some of the words that you use and the phrases that you use. I mean one person said this guys in the white hat and this guys and the white hat black hat ...good guy bad guy. Well that wasn’t acceptable because if you think about it the black hat was always the negative and the black was always being associated as the negative piece. And so again those are small examples but you start to think about how you speak and you start to think the language you use and how someone else hears that and I spent a lot of time with the different groups getting to know them whether they were African American or… Bing is a good friend of me who owned Eastern Florrals so the Asian community and so just learning that other people’s viewpoint is ok its different but its ok. And then so then in the workplace the more you do that the more productive companies become because you’re more open to and more creative ideas. TYLENDA: Exactly. ENGLEHART: because if you look at the most successful companies, they are companies that have embraced diversity not just by saying we embrace diversity TYLENDA: they actually… ENGLEHART: but by actually doing it and incorporating it and having people in leadership positions that are different. TYLENDA: mmhhmm ENGLEHART: Power and different backgrounds and whether it’s at the chamber…one of my VP’s was a lesbian woman and she was black. It’s like two strikes. TYLENDA: uh huh ENGLEHART: Haha TYLENDA: Haha ENGLEHART: Ok she’s qualified and she’s good. Page 14 �TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: but again that’s not always seen, you don’t see that very often. JOHNSON: So…so that’s like what you told the company that came to you and said that they think you shouldn’t be spending as much money on that and you’re like well its… ENGLEHART: It’s good for the community, it’s good for the bottom line of the chamber, and it’s good for Grand Rapids. JOHNSON: mmhhmm ENGLEHART: To see that not everybody’s homogeneous, not everybody is, I used to jokingly……not everybody is white, Dutch, Christian reformed TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: They’re not; look on the streets in Grand Rapids… a little different than it used to be. Now the leadership may still be… but I was a woman and I’m Jewish. I mean…so I didn’t fit in any of the categories. TYLENDA: ah huh. ENGLEHART: So TYLENDA: So did you find a lot of companies embracing it then from… ENGLEHART: They’re starting to more and more… TYLENDA: Do you? ENGLEHART: Just starting to TYLENDA: Do you see still a lot of… kinda do as we say not as we do? Where they do kind of... say there embracing it yet they still treat people ENGLEHART: I think there’s a lot of religious discrimination… TYLENDA: Really? ENGLEHART: Still. TYLENDA: mmhhmm JOHNSON: Do you think that that might be like a west Michigan thing or is that…is that everywhere? Page 15 �ENGLEHART: I think it’s more prevalent in west Michigan. I’m not…I don’t know that it’s just west Michigan but it’s certainly something that you go to a cocktail party and people always say well what church do you go to? TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: It’s just…that’s part of the vernacular. That’s part of what they say and so when people are talking and there having casual conversation that’s part of what they ask in west Michigan. It’s…what church do you go to? JOHNSON: huh ENGLEHART: And when you tell ‘em you don’t… TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: They don’t quite know what to say....well I go to Temple Emmanuelle and I’m Jewish and its down on Fulton and yeah…it…and you…and simple things like…eh , the Jewish holidays which are different than the Christian holidays. So for me I……one time there was huge meeting that was planned and nobody had asked about my calendar and it happened to be on a Passover… TYLENDA: Wow ENGLEHART: And I said I can’t be there and they said well why not and I said its Passover and I said there’s not very many days I miss but I’m go to Temple...it’s like you guys with Christmas and Easter I go. TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: A couple of ‘em I go to and tried to make light of it and they were really upset that I didn’t come. TYLENDA: hmm ENGLEHART: They didn’t understand it and I said well you didn’t ask me TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: You just assed that because I was blonde and that… that I was probably Christian well you didn’t ask so those kinds of things… I think that it’s harder for a woman…I think if a man had been in that situation… I think that they would have probably understood more. I think cause if a man said now it’s a religious holiday. TYLENDA: Yeah ENGLEHART: I have to go to the Temple I think that would have been ok because people respect that. I think with a woman it’s almost like well… you couldn’t. Page 16 �TYLENDA: Break a rule and… ENGLEHART: Yeah or I don’t know I just… it I definitely felt minimized. TYLENDA: Ok ENGLEHART: By that TYLENDA: And was that for the… was that the chamber you said? ENGLEHART: No it was a meeting that somebody had that I was supposed to go to and represent the chamber TYLENDA: Oh, ok. ENGLEHART: So it wasn’t a chamber meeting. We would have never have scheduled something on a holiday. JOHNSON: I’m curious more hearing about this Jewish church that you go to and that community. ENGLEHART: Well there’s the Jewish community in Grand Rapids. There’s actually…three...really two major temples. One is Temple Emmanuelle on Fulton right by Aquinas College TYLENDA: Oh, ok. ENGLEHART: And then there is a Ahavas Israel which is on Michigan St. which is over almost by Michigan at the beltline that far over and then there’s another one that’s called the Chabad house. And the difference is that there is reformed Jews and there’s conservative Jews… and then there’s the Chabadnics which are the ones that are the black hats and they only walk and so. TYLENDA: mmhhmm. ENGLEHART: There is a very small group of them in Grand Rapids, but the temple I belong to is a reformed temple so people who are in the reformed Jewish community are sometimes ......intermarriages…not both…maybe not both Jewish and… its more liberal… Ahavas Israel is very conservative… on Michigan all of their services are in Hebrew. TYLENDA: mmhhmm. ENGLEHART: A lot of the services are in Hebrew at temple Emmanuelle as well but it is much more liberal and habab and some of the more conservative temples women aren’t even allowed to sit with the men TYLENDA: Wow. ENGLEHART: It’s that it’s still very divided…so…but there’s… I don’t know…I’d say maybe…it’s really small. There’s less than a thousand families in… Page 17 �TYLENDA: Right. ENGLEHART: In west Michigan…really in Grand Rapids. TYLENDA: ah huh. ENGLEHART: So not a very big…not a very big community. TYLENDA: I mean… yeah cause I live back home, right by West Bloomfield. My cousins are Jewish so I’m really familiar. ENGLEHART: Yeah. TYLENDA: That’s a really big area. ENGLEHART: A big area. TYLENDA: yeah ENGLEHART: Yeah…here your definitely a minority... to be Jewish... its…I think there’s a lot of……again a lot of stereotypes that people have that are not accurate and… TYLENDA: mmhhmm ENGLEHART: So it’s also a good opportunity as visible as I have been to also educate people. TYLENDA: You’re certainly in the position to do that…that’s good. ENGLEHART: Yeah it’s been interesting...deep breath...no I don’t want a Christmas present thank you… JOHNSON: You get Christmas cards and stuff? ENGLEHART: Oh yeah, all the time. TYLENDA: aagghh ENGLEHART: Yeah I mean I’m not easily offended I just think it’s interesting because people … TYLENDA: Assess so much ENGLEHART: Well and they just…even if they know they still send your Christmas card. TYLENDA: Man. ENGLEHART: It’s like ok, whatever, hahaha. I’m on your list. Ok. JOHNSON: Alright. Well thank you so much. Page 18 �ENGLEHART: I hope you have some information and if there is anything else…I can’t think what else I could tell you my gosh. TYLENDA: That was perfect. ENGLEHART: My life is kind of like an open book. TYLENDA: We’ll certainly reference that article too you have online ENGLEHART: Yeah, I think that’s a good article to really like…aagghh...I sign here it looked like you guys are supposed to sign down here, is that right? JOHNSON: I mean I can fill that out but yeah…I just need your signature. ENGLEHART: Oh JOHNSON: And then you can keep this one ENGLEHART: oh ok JOHNSON: Is that right? TYLENDA: Yeah one of them is for her, I think. ENGLEHART: oh ok the interviewer’s name. You want my address here? TYLENDA: Ah you can just put the school if you want. ENGLEHART: No I… cause Grand Valley…I know… I get all of their… are you kidding once you give money to Grand Valley TYLENDA: You can’t get away. ENGLEHART: I’m on every one of their lists. Kind of hard to get away from Grand Valley. There the best at fundraising there is. JOHNSON: Should we now do the introduction that we kind of skipped over in the beginning? ENGLEHART: Oh JOHNSON: That we’re TYLENDA: What do you mean? JOHNSON: That we’re meeting here with… ENGLEHART: oh ha. Page 19 �JOHNSON: Jeanne Englehart at the Grand Rapids Child Discovery Center TYLENDA: And I’m Evan Tylenda. Jason: I’m Jason Send. Phil: I’m Phil Joslyn. JOHNSON: I’m Connor Johnson. TYLENDA: And that concludes our interview. END OF INTERVIEW Page 20 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/3b4d04bd9ddba33dfe3b5cc287342370.mp3 4159a964c2d604688e02418cbd4965e9 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral Histories Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Personal narratives Oral histories African Americans--Personal narratives Gays--Personal narratives Lesbians--Personal narratives Bisexual people--Personal narratives Transgender people--Personal narratives Veterans--Personal narratives Women--Personal narratives People with disabilities--Personal narratives Muslims--United States--Personal narratives Hispanic Americans--Personal narratives Homophobia Discrimination Islamophobia Stereotypes (Social psychology)--Upper Penninsula (Mich.) Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history recordings documenting the history of civil rights and social justice advocacy in Western Michigan. The collection was created by faculty and students as a project of the LIB 201 (formerly US 201): "Diversity in the U.S." course from 2011-2012. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. Brooks College of Interdisciplinary Studies Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project (GV248-01) Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-05-02 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1930-2011 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01_Englehart_Jeanne Title A name given to the resource Jean Englehart audio interview and transcript Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Englehart, Jean Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Evan, Tylenda Johnson, Connor Send, Jason Joslyn, Philip Description An account of the resource Jeanne was raised in Atlanta, Michigan. She is a successful business women in the West Michigan area. She discusses how she became the successful woman that she is today. Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Relation A related resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-02-22 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/85ed6d6d19a399c67a172f3d484f47cc.pdf 5f38e2eaff18f7d645b6908f77222460 PDF Text Text Conversations on Loving Your Body Week Presents: Jean Swap MONDAY, FEBRUARY 27 through THURSDAY, MARCH 1 10 AM -4 PM in the Women's Center Lobby (1201 Kirkhof Center) Celebrate your body by swapping out old denim for a "new-toou" pair. Bring a pair of old jeans that no longer fit and you will be able to swap them out for a pair that fits you! � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource GVSU Sexuality and Gender Flyers Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource The Rainbow Resource Center Women and Gender Studies Department Women's Commission Gayle R. Davis Center for Women and Gender Equity Description An account of the resource Digitized posters, flyers, event notices, and other materials relating to gender expression and sexuality at Grand Valley State University, with materials spanning from 1974 to 2019. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1974/2019 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Digitized from collections at the Rainbow Resource Center (formerly the Milton E. Ford LGBT Resource Center), Women and Gender Studies Department, Women's Commission, and Gayle R. Davis Center for Women and Gender Equity. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Subject The topic of the resource Gender identity Gender expression Sexual orientation Women's studies Queer theory Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections and University Archives. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-09 Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Language A language of the resource eng Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-09_SGF_2012_Conversations-on-Loving-Your-Body_Jean-Swap.pdf Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Women's Center Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-02-27/2012-03-01 Title A name given to the resource Jean Swap Description An account of the resource Flyer inviting people to bring in their old pairs of jeans to swap them with other students' old jeans. Subject The topic of the resource Community centers Pants Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Women's Center Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/0ddf34117183630198601de254db2183.mp3 a289f21bfa455dc1f89be5333f785cd4 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/92dddc6b5bd6489d989989cc151a9f99.pdf 995546d8fa3da6386ac14d963392493e PDF Text Text Jean Hays Arnold- Interview by Eric Gollaneck October 4, 2018 0:03 EG: This is Eric Gollaneck, and I’m here today with 0:07 JA: Jean Hays Arnold. 0:09 EG: At the old school house in Douglas, Michigan, on October the 4th, 2018. This oral history is being collected as part of the Stories of Summer Project which is supported in part by a grant provided by the National Endowment for the Humanities common heritage program. Thanks, Jean for taking the time to meet with us today. I’m interested in learning more about your family history and experiences of summer in the Saugatuck Douglas area. Can you say your full name again and spell it for us? 0:40 JA: Ok. Jean Marie Hays Arnold. J-E-A-N M-A-R-I-E H-A-Y-S A-R-N-O-L-D. 0:52 EG: Fantastic. Thank you. Uh, and any special accents when spelling your name? 0:58 JA: No. 0:59 EG: Ok. Great. So, jumping right in. Tell us a little about growing up in Saugatuck Douglas, and your experiences here. 1:09 JA: Ok. Wow. That leaves it wide open. All right. Um, I guess what I wanted to do also is tell where I grew up. That’s my reference for my memories, which is my address at 177 St. Peters Drive. And we moved there in about 1964. So that is where I spent my childhood and 1:35 EG: And this is in, this is in Saugatuck? 1:38 JA: Douglas actually 1:39 EG: Or in Douglas. Ok. 1:40 JA: Yeah, so, um, some of my earliest memories just in the general area are that, um, I would like to play in the area what’s now West Shore Court, Hamilton, which connected to St. Peter’s Drive, and there was a military tower at one time, that’s gone now, that I would climb up to and look out, and it was very fun. It was like my own little personal fort. And um, had a lot of fun there, and it happened to be right next to where the famous root beer barrel was. 2:20 EG: Right. Right 2:21 JA: But, at the time it was closed in the sixties already. When, when I knew of it, but I had fun running around, and sneaking and peeking into the little 2:34 EG: [laugh] �2:35 JA: There was a little, there was a little associated house to the barrel 2:38 EG: yeah 2:39 JA: And so I had fun there, and before all the warehouses and the boat storage was the Hamilton, West Shore Court, um area, it was very open. I did a lot of kite flying in that area believe it or not. You could not fly a kite there now. And, um, also the Parish family sticks in my mind as having a house and a very distinctive tower, which I don’t know if that was the tower or the military tower was behind the name of Tower Marine. Which is the marina 3:19 EG: Ok. Sure 3:20 JA: Down below the hill. And um, on the hill, just is where we would park or we would sit and watch fireworks over Lake Kalamazoo. 3:33 EG: Right 3:34 JA: When I was a child, so that kind of covers that general area 3:40 EG: Right. Right, and just to back up, it was really interesting about the military tower. We’ve done other interviews and uh, young, young people being up there has come up, and during World War two, watching, and this is the same tower, and observation tower. 3:56 JA: Oh. Observation tower. Yes 3:59 EG: For plane spotting. For watching military aircraft. So how old would have been when you were flying kites and climbing the tower and exploring this area. 4:07 JA: Oh this, this was, probably 8,9,10 4:14 EG: mmhm 4:14 JA: In that time period 4:15 EG: yeah. 4:17 JA: Young, but not real 4:18 EG: Independent 4:19 JA: Yeah exploring the area. 4:19 EG: out there, doing your own thing, exploring the 4:22 JA: Yeah. It was fun. Um, also in that area, um, in the mid 1960’s the Keewatin came into the area. And I, I pretty much had the Keewatin pretty much as the backdrop of my �childhood and where I lived, because we were on a bit of a bluff on St. Peter’s Drive, there. Um, down below they had pulled the Keewatin up. So, um, that’s been, that’s always kind of been the backdrop for me as I said. And when I became, was approaching thirty years old, I said, “Either I’m going to be married, or I’m going to have one whale of a party.” So I thought, what better place to have a birthday, uh, 30-year-old birthday party than the Keewatin? 5:20 EG: Yeah 5:20 JA: So, so, I did that 5:24 EG: [laugh] 5:25 JA: It was a party for 50. Prime rib dinner. Catered by, get this, the Terra restaurant. 5:32 EG: wow 5:32 area. JA: Where I worked when I worked when I was 16, in the back, in the salad and dessert 5:38 EG: Right 5:38 JA: So I thought, oh, they must cater my event 5:42 EG: Right. 5:43 JA: I shall have my event right next to where I lived practically 5:48 EG: Right 5:48 JA: Um. We had a 6 pieced band in the ball room area. And the dinner, and it was all videotaped at the time 5:58 EG: Yeah 5:59 JA: So that was a really grand event. I had a ball gown and the whole thing so. 6:05 EG: Right? You did this in style 6:07 JA: Yeah. So 6:07 EG: And this is your life moment with the Keewatin and Terra and 6:08 JA: [laugh] yeah. It was really perfect. 6:13 EG: All this history. Yeah. �6:14 JA: So, little did I know 24 years later I would get married. But, at the time, I thought I’m going to do this and do it right, so. I’ve actually had two receptions in my life, so that was fun. Ok. I think that is kind of the area, um 6:32 EG: Let me, let me ask you a little bit. Do you remember when the Keewatin arrived? Is that a memorable. 6:38 JA: That was 1964, 5, or 6. Very soon after we moved in. I think we moved in first and then, and then the Keewatin came along 6:52 EG: What was the reactions to people, or your reaction to that then when this ship, you know lake, lake steamer just arrives in town? 6:57 JA: Oh, I mean you can imagine. Yeah. Well, we, for sure, had to have a tour and had more than 1, 2, 3, tours because it was a very special landmark, of course, for the Saugatuck, Douglas area 7:13 EG: Yeah. Yeah. 7:14 JA: Huge and really kind of a loss. Kind of a piece of Saugatuck, Douglas missing now, because it had been here for so long. I think just recently in the last, maybe five years 7:21 EG: Right. Yeah. A number of decades. 7:28 JA: It was, uh, removed 7:28 EG: I think it was, yeah. Within that time frame. 7:31 JA: Yeah. It’s been significant to the area and to me, for sure in particular 7:37 EG: Right. So changing, changing eras 7:41 JA: Yeah. Definitely 7:42 EG: yeah. 7:44 JA: So, um, otherwise, I would, I tried to think of some of my earliest memories of, and trying to keep it focused on summer. 7:52 EG: Yeah. And we can, we can talk about other things as they come as well. So that’s fine, but, uh 7:58 JA: ok, um, 7:59 EG: Did you have something else specific, or you could talk about school. Did you go to the Douglas school? �8:06 JA: Oh, Douglas Elementary School. Of course, yeah. Um, some of my classmates went to St. Peter’s, to the Catholic school for a while, and then eventually we all joined up during the elementary years because the St. Peter’s closed down. And it’s funny St. Peter’s Drive, we lived on St. Peter’s drive. We lived right next to the school and the church, but I did go to the public school. So, um, yeah. I don’t know so many memories having to do with Douglas Elementary School. Um. 8:44 EG: Did you walk to school, or get rides, or bike, or? 8:49 JA: I remember the bus. I did take the bus, but good heavens. I could have taken the bike. Uh, the biking was, very significant, I think for me and the Saugatuck Douglas area to um, get to your destination. I never really needed transportation or a car later on because Saugatuck and Douglas was really bike riding easy distance. So you’d bike ride wherever you needed to go. Which was really fun. And then thing about biking from Douglas to Saugatuck, you cross the bridge, there’s kind of swampy land on either side. And I had a bit of a traumatic experience every time I went from Douglas to Saugatuck sometimes. I would be waving my arms above my head like this as I’m speeding, speeding like the Wicked Witch of the West on the bike because there are red winged black birds 9:48 EG: Ok yeah. 9:48 JA: That took up residence, uh particularly on the, what would I say? The west side. And they would dive bomb my head. 9:56 EG: Sure 9:58 JA: Land on my head. So it was a bit traumatic, and I’m waving my hands above my head wildly to try and to veer the blackbirds away, so that sticks in my head, of course, because the, the blackbirds were terrorizing me, so a bit of a downside to biking. But still 10:16 EG: Right, er, passers. I’ve not heard that story, but that’s a great description of passing the bridge 10:20 JA: [laugh] yeah. So. 10:23 EG: Did, primarily bike in the summer I guess then 10:29 JA: Oh yeah. Absolutely. Biked. Yeah. That’s the way to get around, and it gives you independence as a kid to 10:38 EG: For sure. 10:39 JA: That was fun. Parents provided me with a five speed. I don’t know if they even have five speeds anymore, but that was big at the time �10:50 EG: Definitely. That’s good for these hills, good for the, good for some of these hills getting around as well. 10:50 JA: Yeah. Around late 60’s [laugh] yeah 10:54 EG: If you go down to the beach, then you can make it there and back. Yeah 10:59 JA: Uh, one other thing, backing up to the Keewatin, I remembered was at one point, probably pretty early, probably late 60’s they had, they used the life boats off the Keewatin in life boat races. And my mom was on a crew of one of the life boats, and I believe you even tried to, or it was requested if you could try to dress in period type costume if I’m not mistaken. I’m not sure about that. 11:32 EG: I think, I think we have photos that are mentioning it 11:36 JA: Do you? Yes! 11:37 EG: Because I’ve seen those boats, and I’ve wondered what are, what are those? What’s going on? 11:41 JA: Yeah. 11:42 EG: That must what those are, yeah. 11:44 JA: I wonder if it, if it was for a significant Saugatuck event maybe. I’m not, I’m not sure if it was 11:50 EG: Yeah. The centennial 11:52 JA: Centennial, or something like that. So, uh, yeah. My mom was in that along with Carol Frikengust (?) and Frey Whiteman (?), that I remembered. So. Ok. I’m just kind of looking here to see, um, real young memories, I guess anytime in the summer, um, I took swimming lessons when I was maybe 5 or 6 so at Goshorn Lake. Pottawattamie Beach. In that area. So. Um, I don’t know if they do that anymore, but I remember jumping off a dock, and it was sink or swim basically. 12:40 EG: [laugh] 12:44 JA: Um, after you had your little, you know, floating on the shoreline and head in the water and all that, so, uh, but Goshorn Lake and Pottawattamie Beach and course near to that the Dune Scooner (?) rides, taking a Dune Scooner (?) ride. Now those have been around huh, my whole life probably 13:04 EG: A long time, for sure. Yeah. 13:05 JA: [laugh] yeah. So all in that area is a big memory to me. �13:10 EG: Was that something that you did on a regular, like did you do it once a summer basis or if people came to visit or with friends or tell me a little bit about that experience as you remember it. 13:20 JA: Yeah. I think, oh. I, I, was really young at the time, but it really made an impression on me. And, um, the whole mystery surrounding the Singapore. Um, yeah, and a few things about that area. And just going through the dunes at fast speed and sand, so it was really exciting and really fun. I don’t know if we did it so much, but I remember it being pretty significant in my little child 13:50 EG: Yeah 13:50 JA: mind, so 13:53 EG: Yeah. It’s such a strange experience that’s right there. 13:56 JA: yeah 13:57 EG: I mean you wouldn’t know driving through the area that that there’s this lunar landscape almost. This other worldly place 14:03 JA: Yeah. So really interesting. So. That is a little bit of, oh and also I remember, when I was very little, like that age too, my dad took me to Funk’s News Stand, on Butler to get a newspaper and get me a little stretch candy necklace. And so that was a big treat. 14:30 EG: Yeah 14:31 JA: And, um, Funk’s News Stand is no longer there. I recently run into the son of Roscoe Funk, and I forget the wife’s name. Paula. I’m not sure. 14:43 EG: And that was a regular stop. 14:44 JA: Yeah 14:48 EG: What newspaper? The Holland Sentinel? Or Grand Rapids or 14:52 JA: Yeah. Or even the Commercial Record, um possibly too, but I think it would be, my dad would read The Sentinel, the Holland Sentinel, or Grand Rapids Press for sure. So, that was a regular visit. 15:05 EG: You drove over there? From home? 15:08 JA: Yeah. Yup, yeah. So yeah �15:12 EG: How did you, what was the, one thing that is interesting in our interviews is people, the kind of separation, or distinct identities between Douglas and Saugatuck. 15:25 JA: Oh yeah 15:26 EG: Which is true somewhat today, but describe a little bit about that. How often did you go to Saugatuck, uh, what was that? How did you see the differences between those two places 15:38 JA: Yeah. It’s funny, in my organization of thoughts I started putting Saugatuck Douglas Douglas Saugatuck on, on, um topics that were in my mind. So that’s interesting. I should say that, um. And, and thinking about classmates, the classmates that lived in Saugatuck vs the classmates that lived in Douglas, and, um, yeah. That’s kind of a neat thing. Saugatuck was more flashy and, you know, Douglas was a little bit more subdued and, you know reserved like and, not fancy. But you know, Saugatuck was the big place where everything happened. And that’s, that’s what I kind of remember a little bit. We’d go to Saugatuck. It felt almost like I lived in Douglas, but Saugatuck and Douglas were all one as well. We just went to Saugatuck like it was our downtown 16:40 EG: Yeah. Was that on a, would you say on a daily basis. On a couple times a week, or weekly basis. 16:47 JA: Oh, all the time 16:48 EG: Yeah 16:49 JA: Yeah 16:49 EG: Yeah 16:50 JA: It was just like where we lived 16:52 EG: Yeah. 16:52 JA: So yeah. It was pretty neat. Um, I, I have. Let’s see. Some things. Oh. Another young memory was, of course, boating is so huge in the area, with, uh Kalamazoo Lake, and my dad had a small boat. It was a motor boat which could be converted if you put the rudder in and put the mast up and the sail, it could be a sail boat. And we had our little orange life jackets, you know, they were all little orange life jackets back then. And, um, my mom, my dad, myself, and my brother. We’d have our little outing around the lake. So that was a special memory too, and on that side, also Mt. Baldhead of course is big in any Saugatuck and Douglas mind. Uh, going up the stairs. Running down the other side. Walking back to the area. And we’ve had more than one family picnic there, with roasting hot dogs and um having a little picnic by the water at the bottom of Mt. Baldhead’s stairs. So 18:05 EG: yeah. �18:06 JA: That was fun too. Yeah, 18:12 EG: Ok 18:13 JA: I, leading up to jobs that I had in the summer, because once I hit maybe 13, 14, 15, 16, um, jobs came about. Oh, I’m seeing that you had an elementary school thing. Douglas Elementary was very close to a little place called the Tasty Freeze. And that was a big destination of course. And that’s where I found I loved, uh, dipped top cones. Oh baby. That was, that was a treat. So I don’t want to forget Tasty Freeze. 18:50 EG: That’s great. Did you have a favorite? Did you have a favorite combination that 18:56 JA: Well, I always got the dipped top cone. I thought that was amazing how you could have milk chocolate 18:58 EG: Milk chocolate 18:59 JA: On your vanilla ice cream 19:02 EG: Yeah. 19:04 JA: That was fun, um, ok. Let me see what else here. I have memories, think. Uh, oh, I was baptized in the United Methodist Church on Mason and Griffith. So that is a little. It’s still there. So. I know about that. Um 19:27 EG: What, was church a regular, regular routine regular part of life? 19:30 JA: Oh my gosh. Yes. And we had to have gloves and a little purse, and possibly a hat, and little shoes, little Mary-Jane, patent leather probably. Oh. The biggest thing. This is not summer, but in winter time, I had a muff. You know the muff? Where you have a furry little tunnel where you can warm your hands. That, that was for Sunday, so, yeah. It was, that was when I was very young 5, 6. That kind of thing. So. 20:06 EG: And regularly went to church. Whole family? 20:08 JA: Yeah. Pretty much. Yeah. We started in the Saugatuck United Methodist Church. Moved eventually to (?) but up until I was 12, which would have been early 70’s, it was church every Sunday 20:23 EG: Yeah 20:24 JA: That’s how it was 20:24 EG: Yeah. �20:25 JA: Not anymore. So then after that it was not so much, so. Um, yeah. Let’s see. I guess I will go into jobs. Oh wait. There used to be a tennis court in Douglas. I’m kind of jumping all over 20:50 EG: You talked about that today 20:53 JA: yeah 20:53 EG: That’s all right. There’s no, uh, formula for this. There was the conversation we had this morning with another person about the tennis courts that were 20:54 JA: Um, oh did you? Yeah. My sister and I were there. Now there’s just a play park where it used to be I think, but my sister and I would go there and just lob, volley, whatever you call it, back and forth and that was a fun thing to do in the summer too, is the tennis court. 21:17 EG: Yeah. Tell us a little bit about for the folks listening to this down the line about your family, so your mom, you mentioned your mom and dad, your sister 21:27 JA: Yup 21:27 EG: Kind of say a little bit about that 21:29 JA: Ok. Uh, I’m the oldest, um, 3 years later was my brother, Dave, and then ten years later, or seven after my brother was my sister, Laura. And my brother was, um, mentally handicapped you could say or developmentally challenged, or however you want to word it. So that was a big impact on our family. My sister, she also went to Douglas Elementary and Saugatuck High School, and she graduated ten years after I did in 1989, so, yeah. So that’s kind of the makeup of our family, and a lot of the focus on my brother, which impacted the family quite a bit too. And he like to escape, run, drive his little car, or walking on foot, and I remember people in the area guiding him back home again, so. Um, that was kind of what was happening with us at the time 22:42 EG: yeah. But it, it sounds like a supportive community. Through all that 22:28 JA: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah 22:51 EG: That kind of village culture. 22:52 JA: Yeah. Yeah. Pretty much. I mean, we didn’t have a lot of neighbors at the time, but yeah, there were some helpful ones there so yeah. So, ok. I think maybe I will just touch on some jobs I had. My first job, very significant landmark in the area, I worked at Anchor Park. Have you heard of Anchor Park and the Island Queen? 23:28 EG: Yes. 23:30 JA: I was, that was that was the first of the paddle wheel, paddle wheel boats of the area. �Um, owned by Dick Hoffman, Dick and Debbie Hoffman and their kids, Tom, Annie, who was in my class, and Kate. And I was a crew. I think I was the one person crew for the island queen for pushing off and docking, so that was a big thing, going out into the lake 24:06 EG: Yeah. So you were on the boat. 24:08 JA: Yeah the whole time. I, I would even steer a little, bit so that was fun 24:10 EG: Yeah. 24:12 JA: I thought the world of Dick Hoffman. 24:13 EG: And you were about 14? You said. 24:15 JA: 13 and 14 I did it two years. The second year I had a little lemonade stand on the top deck. So that was fun [laugh] 24:24 EG: [laugh] 24:25 JA: And I remember, um, there were charter trips where big groups would rent the boat, and we’d go out to the basin, the area just before the lake, and go out into the channel. And they would get off the boat and have their parties or whatever, and Mr. Hoffman and I, there were mosquitoes galore. This was summer time 24:49 EG: yeah 24:50 JA: Beach water. 24:50 EG: It’s a marsh 24:51 JA: We’d hide under his military olive green wool blankets to keep from the mosquitoes. While everyone else was having a high old time we were trying to take a nap until they would all come back. So that sticks in 25:05 EG: Oh my goodness 25:07 JA: My mind, um, also with anchor park, they had not only the Island Queen, but they had mini golf. They had paddle boat rentals. Canoe rentals. I don’t know that they even had kayaks at the time. That’s probably a newer thing from the sixties 25:21 EG: Yeah. Probably 25:22 JA: Early seventies. They had darts and, um, Debby Hoffman, she was a wild one, and there was a boat, a large yacht that had a mermaid on the bow, that, they, you know the owners of this boat, they didn’t care. The mermaid was wide open in all her chest full glory and Debbie Hoffman didn’t really think that that was appropriate. And she got an idea that we were going to �take a bucket of red paint, a paint brush, myself and her daughter Kate, in the night with a flash light. We paddled all out to the mermaid on the front of this yacht and painted a bra on the mermaid. [laugh] So the mermaid was now acceptable, and we paddled back and Kate still remembers that. And that was oh, we were very stealthy, and we thought “Oh my gosh, is anybody going to catch us?” But you know nobody caught us. We got away with it, and the mermaid had a bra, so all was well with the world 26:40 EG: Was there, that’s an amazing story. Was there, was there any reaction to that? Did you wake up, this was in the night time? Was there, was there moon light so you could navigate across the water? 26:51 JA: Well we brought a flashlight. It wasn’t too far away from the park so we just paddled in the night and did our thing and that’s a memory 27:01 EG: Right. No reaction, no reaction. At the dis, at the discovery of this 27:02 JA: No, not, no. No. Unfortunately, it would have been good because I would have known we did that, so. 27:09 EG: yeah. Yeah. 27:11 JA: But it was fun. Um, so yeah. That was one of my jobs. That was my first job. And, uh, learning about 27:20 EG: How, how did you get that job? Was that just through, through your friend? 27:23 JA: Oh, no. I got that job, my mom and dad played volleyball at Saugatuck High School. I believe it was with Dick and/or Debbie Hoffman. And they must have gotten the word out that they had a need for the Island Queen and I remember my mom coming home and saying “Jean, how would you like a little job? I’ve heard that they could use somebody to help with the Island Queen.” And voila 27:55 EG: Yeah. That was it. That’s how it happened. 27:56 JA: That was it. And that really taught me a love for water, for boats, um, to this day I love it, so, um, you know, what you’re close to in your childhood. Just goes to show you what a long lasting impact it has. So, the area, the water, the boats. So yeah. It’s part of me. Yeah. So, um a little bit about Douglas, speaking of fun little stories, Douglas Beach, we went to Douglas Beach more than we went to the Oval Beach. Um, living in Douglas in particular, and just because it’s a little quieter, little more serene and, um, my dad chose Douglas Beach. And if you go to Douglas Beach there is usually a big rock. Huge rock. Either on the shore or in the water a little bit depending on the year and, um, the circumstances. But my dad proposed marriage to my mom on that rock. 29:10 EG: [laugh] �29:11 JA: So that is very significant too. So I always look at that rock and think about that. And later down the road I, I had my little swimming suit on and my mom, I think, took a little photo shoot, and I was on the proposal rock, um, getting pictures that I was there too, and so, that’s fun. Something like that, that will always stand there. Go to the Douglas Beach, see the rock and remember that 29:40 EG: Right. Right. Proposal Rock 29:42 JA: Yeah. Yeah. 29:43 EG: That’s a good name for that, that spot 29:44 JA: I don’t know anyone else that did that but, um, 29:48 EG: Yeah. They should. 29:50 JA: Yeah. 29:50 EG: Great idea. 29:51 JA: Um, we didn’t go to the beach in Saugatuck, but when we did, I loved to, or it was kind of a tradition to walk out to the pier and back from Oval Beach. That was a big thing, um, and I don’t know if it’s still, um, that way, but when I was younger, childhood time, I didn’t want to look to my right because there may be nude gentlemen in the dunes that don’t care whether someone sees them or not. So I remember not wanting to look to my right as I was going north along the shoreline 30: 35 EG: Right. Yeah. 30:36 JA: To the pier. That was, that was a little significant memory. Because that was already the gay population kind of staking their claim at the time to that area and doing what they wanted to do. 30:48 EG: Do- do finding out about that? I mean do you remember being warned about that? Or was it kind of self-evident when you went out there? 30:56 JA: Yeah 30:56 EG: Were there signs and things and tents and things, right? 30:59 JA: Oh there were bodies 31:02 EG: Yeah. You couldn’t miss it is what you’re saying? 31:02 JA: [laugh] �31:04 EG: [laugh] 31:08 JA: So then that’s uh, a little memory that stands out 31:10 EG: What was, what was some of the reactions to that among your, among your friends or family or neighbors? Or what was your recollection of that? 31:18 JA: Yeah. It, it was kind of well known. It was just kind of a given, but I felt a little embarrassed. 31:25 EG: It wasn’t hostility toward them from other people necessarily 31:30 JA: I guess there might have been some, but I think as a rule we here in Saugatuck and Douglas—yeah! 31:34 EG: Said live and let live. Yeah 31:38 JA: Why not? That’s one of the great things about this area 31:40 EG: just avert your avert your eyes. 31:41 JA: Yeah! Right! If you don’t like it don’t look 31:41 EG: If you don’t like—there—there’s other beaches you can go to. Yeah. 31:47 JA: [laugh] but or just carry on with your own business. And they’re free to do what they want to do was kind of the attitude 31:52 EG: Yeah. 31:53 JA: Yeah. It’s good. I like it. I did, as matter of fact, work at the beach house on a summer. Speaking of going into jobs 32:04 EG: Ok. Yeah. 32:05 JA: So, um, in the concession stand with the hotdogs and the hamburgers and the chips. 32:10 EG: Right. 32:10 JA: and pop and, um, did that, um, I happen to remember that, um, nothing 32:15 EG: Was, was that a fun job? 32:18 JA: It was a fun job. Of course. I mean, you see everybody and all the beach goers, and that’s a lot of fun �32:27 EG: Yeah. What were your hours like when you worked out there? Was it part of the day? The whole day? Sun up to sundown? Late at or 32:34 JA: Oh, um, yeah, it wasn’t extensive hours. It seems like maybe it was 11-4 or something like that 32:43 EG: Mmhm. Kind of a lunch. Kind of a lunch 32:44 JA: Yeah. 32:45 EG: Crowd. Afternoon snack. 32:46 JA: yeah. So that was kind of fun. And that was the beach house before the current one. Now we have the nice modern one. This was the old, maybe there are pictures of the old beach house out there so, yeah. The beach house. That was 33:05 EG: What did you —how many people worked there with you? 33:08 JA: Um, a couple I think. Don Treckingust (?) I remember worked, um, he was just a class below me. We worked together and, another one. So someone as at the front and someone was doing the burgers and it was a lot of fun. 33:25 EG: How, how old were you at that point? 33:27 JA: Oh, I think I was around 16, 15, 16, in there. Maybe 15. So, just a teenager 33:35 EG: Yeah. That sounds like a great teenaged job 33:38 JA: [laugh] I know! There were great jobs! 33:42 EG: Good nostalgia for them 33:43 JA: One that was not so great, or a couple of jobs actually. One job, uh, Timberline Motel, which I think is now the Starlight or something crazy like that. But Timberline Motel was owned by, um, parents of a classmate of mine. Debbie Clem. Her parents. And I thought I was going to be a maid at the Timberline Motel with my girlfriend and her family. Well, I found out very quickly I don’t want to clean bathrooms and make beds during a summer. That is not my idea of fun. So we crossed that off, 34: 24 EG: [laugh] 34:24 JA: And I think that might have been a week. My duration of maid at Timberline Motel. [laugh] Also, uh, waitress, when I was about 16 at a place called the Cousin’s Kitchen. Oh my word. I’m not cut out for top organization and you need pancakes, and you need a muffin, and you need butter over there, and syrup over there. This was probably a six table restaurant, and it just blew my 16-year-old mind. �34:55 EG: Yeah. 34:56 JA: This Cousin’s Kitchen, I think was in the, um, Peder Gallery. In the southern most section of the Peder Gallery they had a little breakfast lunch place. I should have been able to handle it but I, j, oh. It’s painful to this day, and I, I have had nightmares of waitressing the Cousin’s Kitchen restaurant 35:23 EG: Sounds like a humbling experience [laugh] 35:26 JA Yes. No waitressing, but that was another job trial. Um, of a teenager in the Saugatuck Douglas area. Um, got that, then when I was older, moved out after graduating. I worked at a little shop called Brigadoon. This was probably 1979, 80. And it was at the height of preppy-dom. And we specialized in monogramed sweaters. And I think they might even be coming back now decades later. So yeah. Polo Shirts. You know, um, whales on your pants, um, patchwork, madris (?), and all that. And we had customers interestingly enough that we would send products out to Chicago, to St. Louis, to Kansas City, um, just shows you how far reaching the visitors were that came to Saugatuck, shopped, and wanted things sent out to, back to their homes. So, that was interesting. Um, also, I worked at Carl Gables as a coat check girl for the old Crowe during the height of Disco time. So I thought I was born a little too late. I should have been born a few years earlier because there were all the Disco dresses and Disco suits going through, and I was missing it. I was a coat check girl, being 18. 37:10 EG: yeah 37:10 JA: I don’t, I couldn’t, I don’t believe I could get into the bar. But I could check coats 37:16 EG: Right 37:17 JA: So yeah. That was another little stint of mine. Coral Gables. 37:23 EG: Yeah. Now was this, was this a summer job? Was this, yeah. 37:26 JA: Oh, summer job, and July? 37:30 EG: Yeah 37:30 JA: Packed. Woo. Coral Gables was the kind of center of everything. Boats 37:37 EG: Even in, even in the late 70’s? I should say even, but in this moment we’re talking the late 1970’s or early 1980’s. Yeah 37:45 JA: Mm. Oh yeah. 37:47 EG: This was a dis- And Disco �37:48 JA: Yeah 37:49 EG: Disco. Disco came 37:50 JA: [laugh] can you believe it? 37:51 EG: In, in Saugatuck 37:52 JA: I know 37:53 EG: Yeah 37:54 JA: Hard to believe. It was really fun 37:55 EG: Well, do you have any particular customers or people, or types of people you saw coming and going in, in those places? 38:04 JA: Oh, well, of course. The few that were especially inebriated, but I don’t know any names. There weren’t any celebrities 38:11 EG: Oh, you don’t have to name names 38:14 JA: [laugh] 38:14 EG: just, I’m just thinking what, what people wore or or, 38:17 JA: Oh yeah 38:18 EG: Or kind of just the dynamics. The vibe 38:21 JA: Oh. Well, I mean, there were long lines to get in, and it was just, fun. People watching and seeing what they wear and the music blaring. And you know, visitors all over, and boats and people coming off their boats, and oh my gosh, it was just, it was the place. You know. El Forno (?) if you wanted fine dining, Old Crowe downstairs, the Rats kellar (?). So, um, it was fun to work there. 38:54 EG: It was kind of resort. Studio 54 38:56 JA: [laugh] 38:56 EG: On the Kalamazoo River 38:58 JA: Exactly. Yes. It was a lot of fun. Loved it, so, um, yeah 39:04 EG: Did you just work there the one summer? �39:06 JA: The one, the one summer 39:08 EG: Yeah. 39:08 JA: Yep. Yup. Um. Oh, another fun thing that people do at that time, in the summer, is play golf. At the time, at one time we had 3 golf courses. We had the Myro (?) which went with a motel, which had a huge, larger than life, very memorable, horse on its back two legs. Reared up. A white horse. I’ll never forget it. That was quite a landmark. 39:35 EG: This was at, this was the Myro Hotel? 39:37 JA: Myro Motel. Yeah 39:40 EG: OK 39:41 JA: At the intersection of the Blue star high way and the 130th or Wiley Road. And there is, there is still. I think it’s the Dunes Inn. 39:50 EG: Ok. So that same area 39:51 JA: Yeah. Same area. So there was an associated small golf course there, and of course the west shore, I believe it’s the West Shore golf course. Uh, with the Wick’s family ran that. And now that’s done and houses are going up and uh, and of course Clear Brook. So. Golfing, golfing is a big thing, and with friends 40:16 EG: Did you, did you spend time golfing then 40:20 JA: I did, but this was kind later on, but a fun summer activity that people gravitated back to Saugatuck for, even when I moved from the area to the Holland area um, I’d come back with my friends to the Saugatuck and Douglas area to hit the golf courses. So that was another draw to the area. Which was fun. Oh, and another big draw to the area which I’m sad to see go is Red Barn theater. Did anyone talk about Red Barn Theater? 40:48 EG: A fair amount. Yeah. Yeah, but tell us, tell us some of your experiences there. 40:49 JA: Yeah. That was, that was special. Yeah, in the summer time, uh, seeing a production there was, was, great, and we had big names coming from Chicago, and maybe New York even, uh, as guests. 41:04 EG: Yeah 41:05 JA: And seeing the production. And it was like our own Broadway, right here in Saugatuck Douglas and 41:13 EG: Such a unique setting I understand as well. Describe it, a little bit of that. Of the experience of going to the theater itself �41:18 JA: Oh. 41:19 EG: What the theater was like 41:20 JA: Yeah. I mean it wasn’t fancy. Just a barn. But, um, you know, you go in and they have little tables set up. They’d usually have little drinks, little snacks available, and um, oh, so, you’d go in and, um, it’s rather rinky dink. Right, but it’s magical because there it is. It’s a stage and production, and I wonder if I saw Harvey there. I think I may have seen Harvey, as one, but I have seen probably a handful of productions over my lifetime and that was always very special, and I’m sorry to see it go. Like, oh, darn. But a really good memory. Um, so, um, but going back to Saugatuck, um, the women’s club in Saugatuck was, I like, I like dancing. Hence I was by the Coral Gable’s Old Crowe. I liked dancing. And in the women’s club, the summer of 79 probably or 80, George and Joanne Gallis (?) who were famous for their dancing, held dance lessons in the women’s club in Saugatuck, and I, that’s where I first, uh, got exposed to ballroom dancing. And loved it. Loved them. I think Nicky, their daughter, is still in the area, and um, dancing’s always kind of been a thing with me and my name is also kind of known as Jean, Jean, the dancing machine. So that was part of it [laugh] 43:11 EG: [laugh] 43:11 JA: My teen years I loved to dance at the high school and then ballroom dance. And the dancing at the Coral Gables well, bi-curiously 43:23 EG: Right. You really did. I can understand the context for your comment about the disco 43:23 JA: yeah... [laugh] yeah. It was like oh 43:32 EG: That, and that moment passed as well 43:34 JA: yeah 43:34 EG: Disco didn’t live, didn’t last long enough 43:38 JA: yeah 43:39 EG: It sounds like. 43:40 JA: Exactly. 43:41 EG: yeah 43:42 JA: Um, also in Saugatuck I remember Lloyd J. Harris Pine company. My dad, every Christmas, ordered mince pies, which are kind of an unusual pie. Not your standard. And, uh, always Lloyd J. Harris and of course, now that’s the location for the Center of the Arts. So, um, �memories about that and having a manufacturing plant right in Saugatuck was kind of like whoa. Wow. So. 44:14 EG: Did you have any family or friends that worked there? 44:18 JA: Uh, no. Not, not anyone I knew. It seemed like it was more, almost, I’m not sure if this is right, but my impression of it was that it was more of uh, almost like a migrant or Hispanic, you know Mexican, kind of population that worked there. Maybe from Fennville area or something like that. It seemed to me. It didn’t seem to me like very many locals worked there. 44:48 EG: Like friends from high school or recent graduates. Not those people at all 44:52 JA: mm mm. Nobody I really knew or knew of worked there. And so my impression of it was that people outside of Saugatuck Douglas worked there. So that was interesting. Um. Yeah. Um, oh, another thing I don’t know if anyone else has mentioned, but there used to be a teen center that was open in the summer time where the Douglas Library is right now. 45:24 EG: So at the center across the street you mean? Or the 45:28 JA: yeah 45:29 EG: Yeah? Ok. 45:30 JA: Yea. So. Um, we had basketball in there. And just games and, um, Margaret Longshore was the one that kind of spearheaded that. And I always remember that, and I still see her at, uh gatherings of friends. 45:45 EG: Yeah. No kidding. What were, what were some of the other things you enjoyed doing there? Specifically. Hanging out with friends. Meeting with people 45:54 JA: Just kind of hanging out. Yeah. It was a place to call our own. And for teens that’s that’s kind of a big thing 46:00 EG: Did they have music there? Or TV? 46:02 JA: Oh music. There was dancing. We have a theme here 46:03 EG: Yeah. Ok. There we go [laugh] 46:07 JA: [laugh] So it was funny. It was called The PITS. And that was an acronym. P-I-T-S. And I cannot for the life of me remember what that stood for, but I’m going to have to ask Margaret when I see her next 46:23 EG: Yeah. Was that open year round? Or mostly summer? 46:27 JA: No. It was more of a summery thing �46:30 EG: Yeah. Ok. 46:30 JA: So, and it was like a big gymnasium inside before they turned it into a library so. It was, it was fun for the kids to hang out. Friends and so, yeah. Ok. Wow. Believe it or not my gosh, we’re, I think I’m out of time. I 46:52 EG: You must, you had some great material here 46:54 JA: I’m out. yeah. 46:54 EG: For sure. 46:57 JA: Believe it or not I think I hit on, on most of it 46:58 EG: Some uh, some great memories there. Few, a few things kind of tying that together or coming out of that, some of the things you said, so you had these jobs. You worked at the beach. You worked at the Coral Gables. On the Island Queen. What was it like growing up here as someone who lived their whole life in Douglas, and then this kind of influx of people from other places. What was that, what was the experience like? 47:25 JA: Oh. Yeah. It, it kind of felt like an invasion in the summer time actually. And, you know the store, which was Taft’s at the time would be bombarded. And grocery items would disappear because we have an influx of, of purchasing going on and, oh, there’s no parking which also led the benefits of biking, and um, just a big onset of hustle and bustle uh, in the summer time. Which has its fun aspects. The bustle and the people and the fun, but also it took away from, our being local and living there, took away our peace and our calmness of living in this relatively small village at the time. Um, locale, so it wasn’t always a welcome feeling. It was “Oh, here they come from Chicago, and Missouri, and Indiana, and Ohio,” and you at Douglas Beach, uh cars parked and um, people in for the summer, and you just look at all the license plates and see where everyone’s from. You know, all over. But primarily Indiana, Illinois, Ohio. Rounding Wisconsin. That kind of thing 48:57 EG: Did, did you have friends? Or did your friends living here have friends, family that they knew came back on a regular basis? Did you develop friends over, you know, that came seasonally? Or not so much? 49:08 JA: Oh. Um, gosh. I, what comes to mind is Brigadoon. And I don’t, I think I was only there one year, but there were familiar faces who were visitors, um, and we catered to them and knew them by name. Um, and they were not local. A lot of non-locals that, because I worked in local business, I was friends with them of course. And they were regulars and got to know them a little bit. Yeah. 49:46 EG: So yeah. So it was part of the excitement, but also brought its own baggage 49:51 JA: Yeah, pluses and minuses really but, like with anything. �49:57 EG: Do you have any sense of change over your childhood? This is kind of maybe a difficult thing to understand, because you’re developing see the world differently, but any sense of change in the community around that? Over the time period 50:10 JA: Oh my gosh. 50:11 EG: As you were growing up? 50:12 JA: Yes. What was sad to see was the unstoppable development going on in the past few decades as I’ve been away to, and just as I was leaving. Condos, condos, condos, condos, development and really taking away our quaint, small town, um, feel. With all these condos, that, to me in my mind, came to outsiders. Not really to locals as much and, so of course that was disheartening, and of course the struggle over the Dennison property and the Dunes and the Padnos, I, in-interest in that land and the development. As locals, I think that generally we could say we like our, our, our peace, and our calm and our small time feel, and we, I feel, resistant to any invasion of development and, um, it seems like it’s, of course it’s greed for money. It seems like and we suffer for it. They build and hopefully people will come. And it’s all about money, um, we suffer because it, losing what we want for ourselves and our environment. 51:44 EG: Yeah. So something you mentioned, you mentioned about the Keewatin and just the visible landscape right, and just the visible landscape of looking out there. And certainly the development just looks, to see that the development of those condos and things. 51:56 JA: Oh, yeah. 51:58 EG: It really has changed the visual landscape. 51:59 JA: Oh, big time. Yeah. Unfortunately 52:00 EG: Other, other changes. Just think about, you know as you were talking about Disco in the late 1970’s and high school and into the 1980’s. Uh, and you mentioned the dunes earlier, that area of town. What do you remember about the reaction to, uh, LGBT folks in Saugatuck Douglas? And maybe the dunes specifically which opened right in, right in those years? 52:35 JA: Hm. 52:37 EG: If, if anything. If anything stands out to you. 52:38 JA: Yeah. You know, there the first inkling of that type of thing, way back when, it must have been early 60’s is probably what others have talked about, I hope, is a place called the Blue Tempo or something like that 52:57 EG: Yeah �52:59 JA: I remember that, and that was a little bit of, I don’t know. Would you call it den of iniquity maybe? Or something going on. I knew that was something, woo, outside of the norm a little bit out there. Um, unusual things going on. I was very young. In the 60’s 53:17 EG: Right 53:17 JA: I was just a young child, but I remember that place 53:20 EG: Or people talking about it at least 53:21 JA: Yeah. 53:22 EG: Having reactions to that 53:23 JA: Yeah. That, that, that was hmm. And um, so I don’t have a lot of clarity on that because I was so young when that was happening. That’s my first exposure to something alternative to your normal, accepted, uh, standard lifestyle going on, so. But I think, I think it gave me, it opened my mind. That this is ok. Because of Saugatuck Douglas and its acceptance and that group, um, feeling comfortable in this area. Coming to this area and putting, frankly, a lot of money in this area. And improving the area. And, uh, embracing the arts. And embracing class and elegance, and really kind of doing good things for the area I think. So. That’s been a good thing. Live and let live and they have made a lot of contributions to the area, which I appreciate. 54: 37 EG: Yeah, yeah for sure. Yeah. I was just interested, thinking about the, the kind of timing of that. The reaction and being in high school 54:44 JA: Yeah 54:46 EG: And one way or another. But not really 54:49 JA: No 54:49 EG: Not all that remarkable 54:51 JA: Not, not 54:51 EG: Like the beach, it’s kind of like the beach story. Let people do their thing right? 54:55 JA: [laugh] yeah! It’s, it’s a good thing 54:48 EG: Do you remember much of being, just being a teenager, being a high school student. Were there, yeah, what was that like? What was the culture of high school, Saugatuck High School like in the 1970’s, late 1970’s? �55:10 JA: mm. Well, I what really stands out, one big thing is there was the old high school, and then there was the new high school. And the old high school, I was, um able to go. I was, um, 7th grade, which it was a 7th, 8th, and up high school, I went to 7th grade in the old high school. I was the last class to come in and to go there before they, they built the new high school. So um, I was really glad to have that experience. And there’s still cement steps that were put in place for the students to go back and forth to that high school yet. So that’s kind of a nice remnant of what was. Um, and the new high school was 8th through 12th. And that was where I spent most of the time, and it was very exciting to be in a brand new high school. Very modern, uh, lots of sports going on. I did track, I, I was a little bit of an outsider. I, I got along with other groups, but I kind of had a group of outsiders in a way, um, Wendy Strum. Steve Wa, and myself, and, so, um, I was the MC for the pep rallies. I was actually, strangely enough and maybe not, the senior class president for my class. So. What do you know? [laugh] 56:53 EG: How is this just coming up now? You should have started right there. 56:54 JA: I know. Yeah 56:57 EG: Yeah 56:59 JA: Yeah, so I, I was, I usually ran the dances at high school. You know. Because I was Jean, Jean the dancing machine, and the music, and we’d have music in the cafetorium. That was a new catch phrase at the time. We ate there, we had dances there, we had 57:19 EG: How, how often were those? How often did, every week or? 57:20 JA: Yeah. With the football season, it was at the time and um, pep rallies in the gymnasium. That was me on the microphone 57:29 EG: Firing up the crowd 57:30 JA: [laugh] Fired up and ready to go. Woo 57:37 EG: All the, all the, all of that. 57:39 JA: Yeah. Making posters. The whole thing 57:42 EG: What, what kind of dances? What kind of music were you all listening to? 57:48 JA: Oh yeah. Well 57:52 EG: Was Disco, was there any tension, was there a disco vs. 57:54 JA: Yeah, vs Rock. You know, we had Boston, and the Cars, and Led Zeppelin, and but what I liked was Michael Jackson, and I could pretty much cut a good robot in my day, so um, so, we had a variety. Had to have a variety of music, but I was more of the dancey, discoy, �because I was trying to get in on that. Because at the time, that was the disco time when I was in high school. So I’m trying to recreate that on a high school level. The dances 58:34 EG: yeah. Was that successful? Did you have followers? 58:36 JA: Yeah, somewhat. I mean, we had a variety of music. But there were a lot of hard rock people too, so. Yeah. So there you go 58:50 EG: So high school life. Um, graduated 58:57 JA: Yeah 58:58 EG: Left, left the area 58:59 JA: Senior trip we should say 59:00 EG: Senior trip. Talk about that. Yeah 59:03 JA: Senior trip. That was a summery deal. We went to Daytona Beach, Florida. [laugh] so 59:07 EG: [laugh] 59:08 JA On a bus, on a school bus with, I don’t know how we had music playing, but we did. And that’s where I remember the Cars and Boston and that type of music 59:20 EG: So you took a school bus from Saugatuck, Michigan to Daytona, Florida 59:21 JA: Yes. Can you believe it? 59:25 EG: How long did that take? 59:27 JA: Way long. Really long. 59:29 EG: Really, I mean that would by car that would be like 20 plus hours. Days. 59:34 JA: Yeah. So, I don’t know. We were on a budge obviously. 59:39 EG: Clearly 59:39 JA: Yeah. Yeah. 59:40 EG: No air conditioning? 59:41 JA: No. No you know we were �59:44 EG: This was in, this was in May or June when school got out 59:47 JA: Yeah. Yeah. So, um, at, well, oh boy that was fun. Um, once we were down there on the beach in our bathing suits, and the, the gift shops, and oh probably a little, you know, less than ideal behavior happening. Um, I was pretty, pretty goody two shoes you could say, but I know there was an all, not everyone was. 1:00:18 EG: This is in a, to compare with some earlier time periods we asked people too, and I’ll ask you, you know what sort of shenanigans were pulled? Did people get into? Maybe not yourself, but other people that you were high school with? I mean, what was, or didn’t they much, was there much, was there much issues with, and you don’t have to name any names or say anything you don’t want to share, but, uh, you know. Parties. Run ins with the law. 1:00:49 JA: [laugh] yeah. Oh no. 1:00:50 EG: Pranks. 1:00:50 JA: I guess I don’t know a whole lot of that because that was, that was not my circle. I wasn’t a real bad girl. I was kind of a good girl, which, eh, so that doesn’t lend to a whole lot of exciting, stories, but that’s what I got. 1:01:05 EG: all right. That’s totally fine. Yeah. Um, thinking kind of, you commented on a little bit on things that since have changed over time that you really valued about the community. Hopes for, hopes for the future of, of the community; looking ahead 1:01:30 JA: Oh, well, probably just continuing with the thought of, um, guarding against more development and preserving the quality of the area. And the, um, oh. What, oh, how do I want to say it. Preserving the good parts, the best things about the area. Not losing that to the greed and the development that I think probably continually pushes in on the area from someone trying to make a buck from our wonderful little Saugatuck Douglas area. We want to, we want to keep it wonderful. And, and the dunes area, and the environment, and preserving that because that is a real treasure. So yeah. Those are the two biggest things, I think. 1:02:30 EG: yeah. For sure. So, last, last question I like to ask, penultimate question, uh, we’re doing these interviews so they’ll be saved for a long time. Uh, imagine someone listening to this 50 plus years from now. That’s a long time. 2068 1:02:48 JA: [gasp] wow. 1:02:48 EG: You know, uh, what would you like them to know about your life and about the community, as you’ve experienced it? 1:02:58 JA: Hm. Yeah. Well, wow. Yeah. Somebody in the future. What do they need to know? Well, I, I would hope that it would still be similar. That they, the water would be a big aspect of it, the, the work of the area, and the inspiration of the area on artists. That’s really, I hope that is still going on. And that was a big part of it now. Um, and hopefully they can enjoy �the dunes. And enjoy the water, and still, I’m hoping that the elements that make Saugatuck Douglas so special are still intact and still able to be enjoyed and treasured. It’s like, oh, I’m getting, [laugh] 1:03:56 EG: [laugh] It’s powerful, it’s powerful stuff right? The sense of place here is so strong. I’ve got to ask you one more question to kind of follow up on that. Thinking about art, we didn’t touch on this at all, but growing up here, all of your experiences, kind of on the Kalamazoo and in this area, uh, what was your awareness of or any interaction you had with Oxbow or artists that came here? Uh, yeah 1:04: 24 JA: Well that’s a significant place is Oxbow, and it’s kind of a secret society art place, art school in a way. I mean, it’s not main stream. I mean, everybody kind of knows about it. Although they always have a wild representation in the parades for holidays, but, um, yeah. That’s pretty significant that that was established here in this area. Which accounts for the inspiration of this area to artists 1:04:57 EG: Yeah, do, do you remember much out of it, I mean what did you notice growing up. Particularly different states, as someone who grew up here, from childhood through adolescence and teenaged years. Do you have, do you have early memories of it, or was it just kind of always mysterious place? 1:05:17 JA: Yeah, memories but also you could drive through it and see some of the buildings, went through it. I don’t know that I knew anybody that attended there. It seemed like it was kind of an outsider um thing, that came locally to study there and be a part of Saugatuck in that way. So, um, but art has been a big part of this area. And here we are, sitting in a room full of artwork and watching dunes, so it’s kind of perfect, but um, art fairs, art shows. Always a big part of Saugatuck, and um, artists in the area. I mean, that’s huge. That’s how you, that’s a big descriptive of Saugatuck. So. 1:06:08 EG: Yeah. Anything, anything else in your notes that’s come up that you want to share that I haven’t asked you about? 1:06:15 JA: Yeah, well, one thing I mentioned last night, um, that just speaks kind of to the pride of being from here as a fact, like I said last night, when somebody asks where are you from, and I say Saugatuck, and they say “oh, wow? You’re from Saugatuck? That’s great. That must have been wonderful to group up in a place like that,” So the reputation of Saugatuck wherever I go, and they find out where I’m from, they have a positive, um, impression of Saugatuck. That it is a wonderful place to be, to visit, and someone at the time said she had responses of “You actually live there?” Because I think it’s a lot of understanding that this is a resort town, and we just have visitors come in, but, um, yeah, there are locals. There are native Saugatuck and Douglas people. And I was born in Douglas Community Hospital. So I am truly of the area 1:07:31 EG: Legitimate. Exactly legitimate Douglas, Doug, Douglas person �1:07:36 JA: Yeah, and Dad delivered me actually. Dr. Hayes is my dad. I should mention that. He was a prominent physician in this little area so 1:07:48 EG: Right, yeah, we didn’t, somehow skipped over that. Family connections. I can’t believe I didn’t circle back to that. 1:07:49 JA: Well you did ask me. I didn’t mention that so yeah. He set up a practice I think in 19, 1959, 1960. In that area. In Douglas actually. 1:08:00 EG: Is that, is that how your family came to this community? Was he from here? 1:08:07 JA: No. He wasn’t from here, but he went to Flint for his residency, I believe, and um, came to explore Michigan and really appreciated the coast line and the water. Considered Petoskey and maybe a couple others. And settled on Saugatuck Douglas, so. 1:08:30 EG: Where had he gone to school before coming to Flint? 1:08:33 JA: Uh, he was in Ohio. Ohio State. That, that system in, originally born in Kansas, so completely out of the Michigan area, but his residency took him here and he fell in love with Michigan, so. And my mom is an RN, and they met at Holland Hospital, and they settled here and the rest is history. [laugh] 1:09:02 EG: yeah. [laugh] Well this has been a wonderful interview. It was so great 1:09:05 JA: Oh, well thank you, Eric. I appreciate you having me, and your time 1:09:09 EG: That’s great 1:09:09 JA: I appreciate. Thank you 1:09:10 EG: That’s wonderful, well, all right. Thanks so much for, for your time, and, uh, this concludes the interview. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Summers in Saugatuck-Douglas Collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. Kutsche Office of Local History Description An account of the resource Collection contains images and documents digitized and collected through the project "Stories of Summer," supported by a National Endowment for the Humanities Common Heritage Grant. The collection aims to document the twin lakeshore communities of Saugatuck and Douglas, Michigan, as they transformed through the state's bustling tourism industry and acceptance of minorities. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1910s-2010s Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Various Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/UND/1.0/">Copyright Undetermined</a> Subject The topic of the resource Michigan Saugatuck (Mich.) Douglas (Mich.) Michigan, Lake Allegan County (Mich.) Beaches Sand dunes Outdoor recreation Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries. Allendale, Michigan Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Saugatuck-Douglas History Center Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Stories of Summer (Common Heritage project) Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg application/pdf Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Text Language A language of the resource English Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2018 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context DC-07_SD-ArnoldJ-20181004 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Arnold, Jeanmarie Hays Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2018-10-04 Title A name given to the resource Jeanmarie Hays Arnold (Audio interview and transcript), 2018 Description An account of the resource Jean Arnold describes growing up Douglas with many memories of various jobs she held as a teenager. She also describes her encounters with the LGBT community in the 70's Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Gollannek, Eric (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Michigan Saugatuck (Mich.) Douglas (Mich.) Allegan County (Mich.) Outdoor recreation Beaches Sailing Oral history Audio recordings Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Documenting the Histories of Summers in Saugatuck-Douglas, Kutsche Office of Local History Relation A related resource Stories of Summer (Common Heritage project) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7c4f1bd856785c5559aaa3071b5b60ce.jpg b3a009bb35f88993386b513e120ea600 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Naval Recognition Training Slides Subject The topic of the resource Slides Military education Airplanes, Military--Recognition Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Description An account of the resource Slides developed during World War II as a training tool, for top-side battle-station personnel on board ship and for all aircraft personnel, by the US Navy. In 1942 a Recognition School was established by the Navy at Ohio State University where the method of identification was developed. In 1943 the school was taken over by the US Navy. The importance of training in visual recognition of ships and aircraft became even more evident during World War II. Mistakes resulting in costly errors and loss of life led to an increased emphasis on recognition as a vital skill. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides (RHC-50)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-04-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource image Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1943-1953 Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Source <a href="http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/477">Naval recognition slides, RHC-50</a> Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-50_1453 Title A name given to the resource Jeanne D'Arc French light cruiser, destroyer Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource United States. Navy Description An account of the resource Jeanne D'Arc French CL-DD (light cruiser, destroyer), October 1, 1947. Subject The topic of the resource United States. Navy Military education Warships--Recognition World War, 1939-1945 Slides France Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Naval recognition slides (RHC-50) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1947-10-01 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/701d72bb521d7dd482e0b9bd5bca0f61.mp4 b2de105e582bb5a20fd9effbe1e4acb5 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/8325d5cfbd4525d7a48a928bbbb47519.pdf 3420f92c7e1a26e3c9b1c0434452208a PDF Text Text Jedlowski, Ray Grand Valley State University Veterans History Project Interview Name of War: Vietnam War Interviewee’s Name: Ray Jedlowski Length of Interview: (1:10:31) Interviewed by: Steve Hammond Transcribed by: Maluhia Buhlman Interviewer: “Hello, my name is Steve Hammond and I’m here representing the Grand Valley State University's Veterans History Project and today we have the privilege of sitting here interviewing Mr. Ray Jedlowski. He’s from Caledonia which is actually kind of close to Kentwood but anyway, Ray thank you for letting us interview you and–” Well thank you Steve. Interviewer: “We’ll start out right away with when you were born and where you were born.” (00:32) I was born in 1942 in Portsmouth, Virginia and at that time my dad was a chief in the Navy so I’m kind of a Navy brat and this kind of disappointed when I chose the Air Force versus the Navy. I just told him “Dad it’s too much water, I don’t want to do that, I want to fly.” So anyway that’s kind of how that happened, went to Fordson high school in Dearborn, Michigan, graduated 1962 and at that time you couldn’t find a job cutting a lawn, cleaning gutters and there were really no opportunities for me when I graduated from high school and I recall having an old car that my dad got a good price on and it would hurt me very much that I had to ask him for gas money time and time again, and what made it worse is he’d always give me that $10 with a smile and at that time I decided, you know it’s time for me to do something else because I couldn’t find a job. So I decided that I would go down to the recruiting office to see what was available. Interviewer: “So, I’m gonna just stop you right there for just a second because I want to go back further.” �Jedlowski, Ray Okay. Interviewer: “Okay, you were born in Portsmouth, Virginia? What was your mother’s and father’s names?” Raymond and Helen Jedlowski. Interviewer: “Did you have any brothers or sisters?” No, only child. Interviewer: “Okay, good and you said your dad was a Navy man? What’d he do 20 years in it, 30 years in it?” He spent ten and a half years in the Navy and oftentimes he’d always assign a sailor to me on the destroyer while he was attending a function or something and dad would tell him “Make sure he’s here when I get back.” Interviewer: “You were actually on a destroyer?” (2:30) Oh yeah. Interviewer: “Oh, would you go out to sea or were you just at port?” No, in port. Yeah, he was stationed in Virginia Beach, the naval center there and so yeah been on a lot of ships. I don’t remember a lot of it but I remember some of it. Interviewer: “What– Was your dad in during the Korean war?” Second world war. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “He was in the second world war? Oh okay, was he in any battles at all?” Oh yes, but dad didn’t like to talk about it much, so. Interviewer: “Do you know which ones they were or what ship he was on?” I had to pull things out of him and every time I would ask him things about that he would become sad, so I just stopped, I decided if he wanted to tell me then he would. So I didn’t press him anymore than that. Interviewer: “Did he ever tell you before he passed away? No he didn’t? Okay, was he at Pearl Harbor at all or was he–” No, he was out to sea– I don’t know where but it was not near Pearl Harbor at the time. Interviewer: “Okay, well we can all say thanks to your dad for his service, I mean I know he’s not here or anything.” (3:44) It just seems like the whole family was, I mean my dad’s uncle was in the Army and all his brothers were and all my cousins were all in the service and it brings me to the point of these draft dodgers. These ones that would want to go to Canada and not serve the country, well if you can live with that the rest of your life I guess that’s your choice, I can’t. I thought it was my duty as it was my dad’s to do whatever it takes to protect the freedom of this country because as we all know freedom is not free. Interviewer: “That is true, and thank you very much too I appreciate that.” You’re very welcome, I’d go again if they needed me. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “I would too, I don't blame you. You mentioned an uncle that was in the Army during World War II?” Yes and he was under Patton. Interviewer: “Oh what was his name?” Walter Jedlowski, he was a tank commander and when they went to Sicily and Palermo– Interviewer: “Okay, now we come up to– You’re born in ‘42 you said, and okay you were stationed in– Your dad was stationed in Virginia and you were living in Virginia. What made you come up to Michigan?” Well my dad at that time just told us all he wanted a place to call home and didn’t want to be out to sea all that length of time, especially just when he had a son and so he just decided to get out of the Navy and then we moved from Virginia Beach to Dearborn Heights, Michigan and bought a home there. Interviewer: “Well I mean did you have family up in Michigan?” (5:30) Yes, yes his brothers and sisters were in Dearborn in the Garden City area. Interviewer: “Okay, alright cool. Alright so what did your dad do for work after he got out of the service?” He– In the service he was in diesel, in the engine room was his job there he oversaw the running and keep the ship going and keeping it running properly, and then after that he decided he wanted to become a mechanic and went to mechanic school. Interviewer: “Wow and what did your mother do?” �Jedlowski, Ray My mom worked at Burroughs Corporation in Livonia, Michigan and they made things for the cars and things like that, circuit boards and things. Interviewer: “Were they like a subsidiary like the big three automakers or were they just–” Not at that time, no. I’m glad she worked there because they had a beautiful resort for the employees only called “Burroughs farm” where you could play golf, swimming, you could camp out there and really, really cool. Yeah in Kensington Park area, Michigan. Interviewer: “Okay, and you said you graduated at Portsmouth High School?” Yeah, Fordson in Dearborn. Interviewer: “In Dearborn, okay how was that down there, growing up in Detroit?” When I was there? Interviewer: “Yeah.” (7:00) Great, ask me what it is now. Interviewer: “No, I won’t, I know about Detroit so– But anyway, were you a big sports fan?” Yes. Interviewer: “Any of those teams down there?” Well I played football. Interviewer: “Oh did you?” �Jedlowski, Ray Yes. Interviewer: “What’d you play?” Running back. Interviewer: “Okay, alright.” I was as fast as I appear, I didn’t weigh much so we did well. Interviewer: “So you a big Tiger fan, Lions fan, Red Wings?” I like the Red Wings and disappointed in the Tigers but [unintelligible] Interviewer: “How about back then did you go to any games at old Tiger Stadium with your dad?” (7:40) Yes, I did yeah. My god those were such enjoyable memories. Interviewer: “Wasn’t it though?” Yeah. Interviewer: “Who did you see playing, anybody famous?” I saw Al Kaline and Norm Cash, Freehan the catcher, Northrup and Mickey Lolich. Interviewer: “Good ‘68 crew.” Yeah. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Then of course I see you’re a big Michigan fan, was your family all into Michigan football back then?” My whole family’s just crazy Michigan, they just bleed blue I’m telling you, and then my dad’s aunts and uncles of course State. So here we go, that lit the candle, so here it goes, here it goes. Interviewer: “Yeah, I am the same way mom’s a State fan and brother’s a Michigan fan so yup.” Yeah, but you know what we have to be opposites because there wouldn’t be a rivalry would there? Interviewer: “There you go.” It’s gotta happen. Interviewer: “But it’s better than Notre Dame and Ohio State right?” (8:40) I’m for anybody that beats Ohio State. Interviewer: “Anyway we’ll get back to that stuff but anyway– Okay, so you graduated high school ‘62 and then you decided to enlist in the Air Force?” Yes. Interviewer: “Okay, and then you mentioned before but go over again why you decided that instead of any other branch.” Well, actually just a vivid– When I walked to the recruiter’s office a long hallway and I seen signs that said “Navy, Marines, Coast Guard.” And I saw just walking straight down the hallway �Jedlowski, Ray was the Air Force recruiter, I said “I guess I’m meant to go there.” So I just walked in the Air Force recruiters office and here I am. Interviewer: “So and then you said your dad had comments about that?” Yeah, I didn’t even tell my dad so I come home I said “Dad guess what I did.” He says “What?” I said “I enlisted.” He says “Oh, in the Navy?” “No.” He says “No?” I said “Too much water Dad, I’ve been there done that, you know with you. No, Air Force, I want to fly.” So– But he was just messing with me, whatever I chose to do he was always supportive but he was surprised. Interviewer: “Sure, well it was the same with me, my dad was in the Navy too and I wanted to sign up in the Army Guard. So we’re in the same boat here, well the same plane whatever you want to call it.” Well it was cool on Halloween, I didn’t have any outfits so I’d wear his Navy clothes, you know with the 13 buttons, and the shirt, and the white nice T-shirt. (10:25) Interviewer: “While you were growing up that’s what you did on Halloween? Yeah, well that’s pretty neat. Okay, so then you sign up there in Detroit right?” Yes, Fort Wayne. Interviewer: “Okay, now at that time– I can’t remember my history of that time but there was a draft right at that time, but your number probably wasn’t coming up quite yet was it?” No, I enlisted. I did not get drafted at all, I wanted to go. I think there was a draft at that time, yes. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Now at this time President Kennedy was in office in 1962 when you enlisted and Vietnam was still pretty fairly early at that time. What did you know about Vietnam before you went over there, when you enlisted in the Air Force? Did they tell you anything or did they–” No, not really but just before that when we had the Cuban Missile Crisis, I was involved in that baby. Interviewer: “How was that?” Well because on our base we had B-52s, they were all gone and we were convinced that we were going to war. Interviewer: “Against Cuba or Russia?” Russia, at that time and so they called us in and we had, you know, debriefing about what to expect, what we’re gonna do, so that was a little scary. Interviewer: “I bet, well we’ll get back to that later but we got to back to your basic training at Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas. Alright tell me about that.” (12:00) Hot, very very hot, and you know it just– I can remember the kids on the bus, I call them kids because that’s how they run the process, you’re a kid when you get off the bus and you’re a man when you walk out of there. You know they taught responsibility, everything had to be just so, wake you up in the middle of the night, run 5-10 miles, just doing campaign, just policing the area– The same area day after day after day and then one day we found a jack rabbit there so we all surrounded them and the jack rabbit surrendered he just laid down flat like “No, I can’t, I’m too scared to do anything.” But yeah it wasn’t bad, I mean we would have a three day pass once in a while and went to town, do what most guys do had a couple beers– That’s another story, wanna hear about that one? �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Sure, this is all after basic training or during your basic training?” This is tech school. Interviewer: “Okay, oh you went up to Amarillo after that right?” Yeah. Interviewer: “Okay tech school, let us know what tech school’s about.” Administration, you know everything we need to do, all the particulars, learn the regulations and then 6/14 the form and just, you know everything that you need to know to make it run. So we graduated from– That night on a Friday so we went to town, well unfortunately we weren’t 21 so we– The elevator operators that needs to have operators that took them up and down offered to get us some beer. So we paid an absorbent amount of money for beer and we’re enjoying the cocktails in the room and then in turn he calls the Texas rangers on us. Yeah, so we had to go back to the air base and in an open air pick up truck and riding in the back in December, cold. Interviewer: “Even down in Texas that’s pretty cold.” (14:15) Oh yeah, very cold. Interviewer: “Did you have snow down there at that time?” No just bitter, bitter cold, but that didn’t stop the parades every Saturday though. We were out there every Saturday passing in review. Interviewer: “Oh, every Saturday huh? How long did you have to stand there, in formation?” �Jedlowski, Ray Felt like eternity but probably about an hour and a half, would give you awards and decorations and that kind of stuff, and drill pad every day. Why is it you always get one guy that’s got two left feet, you know and just– You know we’re out there extra time because he don’t get it. Interviewer: “It always happens no matter what branch you’re in.” I know. Interviewer: “Okay, so you got your administrative training at tech school there in Amarillo, then where were you stationed after that?” My work is to go to Washington, D.C Andrews Air Force Base, that’s the home of the Air Force 1 and went to the American Society of Civil Engineers. Interviewer: “Okay, and let us know what– I know what civil engineers are but let everybody else know what civil engineers are in the Air Force.” (15:30) Alright, civil engineers is your plumbers, electricians, carpenters, just all the skilled trades that are necessary and great bunch of guys, really hard working guys. Knew their stuff that this was a trade they could take out on the outside and immediately begin working anywhere. Interviewer: “Oh definitely, kind of like the Navy Seabees really.” Yeah, actually yeah, so it was really cool. Interviewer: “Now you mentioned about the Cuban Missile Crisis, what– Tell us about that right from the beginning. What you heard then all of a sudden– You mentioned the bombers too, mention everything about that if you can.” Well, we didn’t hear it formally, I mean you know we would hear it from our peers or lieutenants or captains openly talking about it, you know and rushing around when we see all the B-52s are �Jedlowski, Ray gone and all you have is your T-33 trainers on the pad and that’s all you got on the base, something’s up, you know and that’s when we heard Kennedy make a speech that we’re not backing down. Russia you want to bring it, what you had to do we were gonna have missiles 90 miles from us, yeah that’s not happening. Interviewer: “Yeah and now did he go on the nation and do it or did he address just the armed forces? I think he went on the nation didn’t he?” Nation, yeah but that’s when Khrushchev was in charge and backed him down. Interviewer: “What did you all think when you finally got the word that they’re gonna move the missiles?” We were– We were delighted we thought that that was great stuff because, you know in nuclear war there’s no winners so– And there will never be winners it’s gonna be total chaos so– Interviewer: “What– Do they have a plan in case unfortunately a missile did come your way for you guys to go?” (17:33) There were bunkers, yeah we were okay. Interviewer: “Have you been– Did you see any of them or go in them?” No, if they were to launch we would’ve immediately been evacuated to the bunkers. Interviewer: “Especially in D.C area too I mean–” Yeah, there was bunkers everywhere . Interviewer: “Now Air Force 1, that’s their home like you said, did you see it a lot?” �Jedlowski, Ray Yes. Interviewer: “Did you ever get to see President Kennedy or his family or the vice president Johnson or any of them?” No, not a big fan of Johnson either. Interviewer: “Alright, we can talk about that later.” Oh I won’t talk about it. Interviewer: “But anyway–” But no I did not. Interviewer: “Okay, then when did you actually go to Vietnam?” (18:15) 1965. Interviewer: “Okay before that you mentioned to me– Before I started interviewing you, about when Kennedy was shot. Tell me about that day that he was shot and when you guys heard it and how everybody felt and you too of course.” Oh it– I was just at my desk and when we heard the news it’s like your body is drained and you got no interest in working anymore. It was just like you just amble out of there and just walk to try to process it, you know it was just unbelievable. Interviewer: “Now was it like that for the high NCOs and officers, did they feel the same way?” �Jedlowski, Ray Oh yeah, everybody was just like “What?” You know “What just happened?” So yeah it was total shock and it was just amazing how that news like that just drains your energy, just numb trying to process that. Interviewer: “So were you there when they brought his casket and body?” Yeah. Interviewer: “How was that?” I was down the flight line. Interviewer: “Okay, when Air Force 1 came in with Johnson and Mrs. Kennedy and them? Okay, did you know that was them there?” No doubt. Interviewer: “So tell me about that if you want to.” (19:40) Well, I just wanted to see for myself, you know just to validate it that that was true. Interviewer: “Historians have said many times and even include a couple professors at Grand Valley State that said the two worst days in American history is when President Lincoln and President Kennedy were shot, would you agree with that?” I do, Kennedy was a good man, a good man. Interviewer: “I know Lincoln was way before our time but do you think that still holds together today?” �Jedlowski, Ray I do because he meant what he said. No, I mean I guess I could have made that call, I mean that cannot happen you cannot– He’s putting missiles 90 miles from our home land, no you’re not gonna do it. I mean you do what you have to but we’re not gonna allow it. Interviewer: “Sure yeah, okay now after did you have to do any security thing for Kennedy’s funeral or was things all tight and locked down when all that happened that week?” Oh yeah the bases locked down absolutely, yeah if you weren’t on the base you weren’t– Nobody was getting in and they had dignitaries of course for when the body was brought and unloaded and put into a hearse. Interviewer: “Did you– Anybody on the base provide security when he was lying in state in the Capitol or anything like that during the funeral?” (21:12) I’m sure that happened, yeah I’m sure that happened. Interviewer: “Did you all get to watch his funeral at all?” No, I guess I knew enough didn’t want [unintelligible] So sad, good man. Interviewer: “We’ll get back to Kennedy later and then of course Johnson took over. Now we’ll get back to you, when did you actually go to Vietnam?” 1965. Interviewer: “Okay and what– When did you get the orders to go to Nam?” Well it’s interesting because my job was to process volunteer statements to go to Vietnam, I didn’t put– I didn’t process myself at all but those guys that filled out volunteer statements to go �Jedlowski, Ray to Vietnam– They didn’t go! It just seemed like the ones that did not volunteer were the ones that went. So I was very surprised when I got my orders to do that. Interviewer: “I’m gonna have to stop it just for a second here. Alright we’re back, go ahead you just got your orders for Vietnam.” Yes and so– Which I was pretty shocked because I certainly didn’t volunteer to go but I certainly would go and I had approximately 21 days before the deployment and– Can I back up one more part from before? Interviewer: “Sure go ahead, yeah.” Alright when I went to Fort Wayne to– You know they’re supposed to fly us Lackland, well some of us took the– Had to be put on a train and took the train to Texas, air conditioning went out two or three times, the food was awful, I just got the air conditioning working and the next station went out again. That was one horrible ride to Texas, anyway. (23:25) Interviewer: “No it’s fine you can go back and let us know, fill in the gaps as soon as you remember.” Most of them got to get flown there but no this little segment here took the train and why? I don’t know, okay I’m done. Interviewer: “Okay, so now obviously did they activate the whole unit or did they just parts of the unit?” All civil engineers went, our whole group everybody, the plumbers, electricians, everybody went, everybody was gone. Interviewer: “And how many was that?” �Jedlowski, Ray About 45. Interviewer: “Okay, alright okay so you got your orders to go to Vietnam, how did you feel, did you tell your parents you were going there?” Yes. Interviewer: “What’d they say?” Well, mom cries, dad shakes your hand, that was kind of “I gotta do this dad, just like you did it’s my turn.” Interviewer: “Did he give you any advice or anything to say to you? No, nothing at all?” No pep talk, no. Interviewer: “Okay, now at that time, and you said 1965 you went? Okay, at that time they were just starting– We were just starting to get into it, what did you hear about Vietnam up to that time you got your orders?” (24:45) That we were just sending advisors, trying to help them train their military. We weren’t painting a war picture at that time, maybe you hear a skirmish or something but not what was really there but no wasn’t anything. Interviewer: “Nothing like that?” No. Interviewer: “Okay so you took off from Andrews Air Force Base, where’d you go from there?” �Jedlowski, Ray Hawaii. Interviewer: “Hawaii. Straight from– All the way to Hawaii or did you land in the west coast first?” All the way to Hawaii. Interviewer: “B-52?” 141 Starlifter I think it was called, it’s a great, great big plane. Oh we didn’t get seats like this we got the leather straps. Interviewer: “The cargo seats.” Cargo seats. Interviewer: “Yeah, I had that too.” (25:44) Yeah, so we get to Hawaii everybody said “You ever been to Hawaii before?” Sort of, I was on the ground for an hour while they refueled and then we took off again. So never forget I think I had a quarter on the counter for a cup of coffee, she says “You know it’s 35 cents.” Back in ‘62 that’s big money, for coffee? Yeah, so they– Interviewer: “Yeah, so how long do you stay in Hawaii?” An hour. Interviewer: “An hour, okay. Right at Hickam Air Force Base?” Yup. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Yup, then off to Vietnam?” There we went. Interviewer: “Alright so then when you got there, you mentioned to me earlier, was there some kind of skirmish just outside your base– Oh but name the base you were at in Vietnam.” It was called Pleiku Air Base. Interviewer: “And where was that at in Vietnam? Near Saigon or some other place was it?” About an hour to Saigon. Interviewer: “North?” North. Yeah so and then when the pilot landed he said “You know you guys are earning combat pay now?” I said “Oh yeah why’s that?” He said “Cause we got bullet holes in the wing.” Interviewer: “Did they shoot while you were in the air?” (27:00) Sure, oh yeah they always did. Interviewer: “They shot you while you were in the air?” No, they shot our plane. Interviewer: “Oh they shot your plane, okay. Alright so– But did you know about it at the time?” �Jedlowski, Ray Only when he landed and told us. Interviewer: “You couldn’t feel the bullets hit?” No, it was a big plane. I don't think we were in any danger but just make it more aerodynamic is all. Interviewer: “Yeah, well so how did you feel after you found that out?” I didn’t– Actually I thought it was kind of humorous because, you know I’m pretty darn young and “It’ll be alright, no big deal I don’t care.” But the guys would never plan for tomorrow. We always did what we did today and plan something for tomorrow, well we’ll see, that kind of attitude. Interviewer: “So you mentioned to me earlier there was like a skirmish or battle near the base?” (27:58) Yes, yes there was, nothing that we were involved in. We got there but we had the– The A1E jets were at that base and they would drop bombs in the jungle on the perimeters, you know just trying to thin the out some and then next to my boots we had a 105 howitzer that would go off at eight o’clock every night and if you can get used to sleeping– From me to the wall and there’s a howitzer over there going off you can still sleep, good for you but you get used to it. Interviewer: “Wow, must have been pretty loud.” Yeah, it was, yeah it was and then so they would change commands and one of the bone heads forgot to pass on the firing pin. So they’re sitting out there with the campfire and everything, just one of the silly things that happened. Interviewer: “But you got to have a lot of humor and laughs and all that.” �Jedlowski, Ray Oh yeah, or you won’t make it, and then we’re out in the field we’re building billets for the 1st Cav that’s pushing their way through. Well we got the monkeys coming out of the trees and stealing our hammers and went up the tree and throw them. Interviewer: “Real monkeys?” Yeah, oh yeah very real. Interviewer: “What kind of monkeys, they weren’t chimpanzees were they?” No, the– Interviewer: “Spider monkeys?” Spider monkeys, yeah or they’d take the nails they thought that was great fun. So then we all had to wear the hard hats because they’ll dunk you with those hammers. Interviewer: “Did anybody get hurt?” (29:30) No, and then the guys made the mistake of feeding them, well you start doing that then you make a mistake. Interviewer: “Yeah you don’t feed wild animals like that even though they seem pretty tame, still. Well they always want to be with you cause you’re the food source now. Interviewer: “Sure, what other animals did you have contact with out there? Any dangerous ones?” No. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Cause you hear all kinds of stories about snakes and other things out there.” Fortunately not, there could’ve been some in that trench that was around our perimeter. We had lights that would show into the trench and out in the field so in event of an alert we would all go in there, and we were still upset because they shine the lights on us. Well that’s like shining it on the ducks in a gallery, you put your lights out there not on us. So we swore the next time we get hit, those lights are coming out. Interviewer: “So did you hear that battle that was going on near the base at all?” Oh yeah, well you can hear it every day. Interviewer: “Oh yeah?” Yeah, I mean I wasn’t involved in it at that time but you can hear them. Interviewer: “Was it the– So it was the Viet Cong trying to infiltrate the base basically.” (30:50) Right. Interviewer: “Now obviously– Was it the 1st Cav that drove back, was it?” They– At that time the 1st Cav was pushing through so that’s what all the problems– All the noise was, it was because they were out there. So our job was to go in and to build quarters for them which was made out of wood and then the canvas top. So that was our job to build– I don’t know how many we built, 100 or so I’m not sure. Then we had an on base guy who wanted to be a barber so some of the engineers said “Look it, we’ll build you this barber shop but you gotta give us a good deal.” “Oh yeah I’ll give you a good deal.” So they build a nice one, this thing is nice, two weeks later it burnt down because of the hot plate on there. They said “We’re not �Jedlowski, Ray building you another one.” So and then we had a house mamasan who did our washing and take care of our clothes and stuff. They had the best inside information about what’s going on everywhere because they’re women and they’re washing clothes just at the well when y’all scrub and use the washboard and then she’d come back and say “No go to town, trouble in town tonight.” Don’t go, stay, stay on base, sure enough. Interviewer: “They had the information I’m sure.” She shared it with us because, you know, we were a meal ticket, we paid her handsomely so she wanted to take care of her job. Interviewer: “What was the name of the town you were close by, do you remember?” Well the town of Pleiku but it wasn’t much of a town, no they had thatch huts and dirt floors but I’ll tell you what’s cool, they asked us to take a load of gravel off the Montagnard villagers and take these– About four dump trucks out there full of gravel. (33:00) Well– So I’ve never drove a dump truck before but, oh well here’s the keys figure it out. So we go out there and Steve it was like going– Jumping into a history book, like a page of thatch huts, women weaving baskets on the side of the road, and you know the mountain yard people. They have an interesting wedding ceremony, they– The groom knocks out her front teeth to signify that she is married, truth. Interviewer: “Wow, her front teeth?” Yeah, that’s the signal that she’s spoken for and then the chief invited us to drink rice wine and he would have a line and “You drink down the line or you a baby.” Well we weren’t big drinkers, we were kids. So I’m rolling around in the back of the dump truck with two grenades, two clips of M-16s and I don’t feel good. So anyway, but that turned out alright cause the Montagnard– Montagnard and Vietnamese people have never gotten along, never ever ever, centuries never gotten along. Interviewer: “Really?” �Jedlowski, Ray Really, always come back. Interviewer: “Think they still are?” Oh yeah for certain, I don’t think it’s ever gonna quit– And hygiene for them, limited, got to go to the bathroom you go. Interviewer: “Right out in public?” Wherever you are. Interviewer: “Male or female?” (34:50) Yup, and the Montagnard women didn’t have bras, saw sleight of their under breast they don’t care. Edit that one out. Interviewer: “Sure, your bathrooms or latrines weren’t there.” Yeah. Interviewer: “And you had a dining facility there too did you, or basically a tent like mesh or something like that?” We just had a room and all the meals were C rations, not MREs, no, packed in 1942. Interviewer: “Wow.” Yeah, Beanee Weanees, ham and egg, you take the lid off the only thing you want to eat, even if you’re gonna shit dice for it, is Beanee Weanees. The rest of it they can keep, grease was this thick. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Wow, anybody get sick off that?” No, but you had a lot of skinny guys because we wouldn’t eat the stuff, it was awful, you know so when we’d write home “Don’t send cakes or cookies cause it’s all gonna be broken when we get it, send us canned goods please.” You know something that we knew was edible and then on, you know Christmas day, you know we had C rations and really always had beer. Interviewer: “You had alcohol?” (36:28) Oh yeah, yeah we couldn’t get toothpaste but we could get alcohol and I went to work for a major castle airline and the commander he says “I’m gonna get a combination safe.” I thought to myself “Oh sure you are, we can't even get the basics and you’re gonna get that.” Well sure enough he got it. So I had to set the combination, I said “Well you want me to tell you what’s the combination?” “No, you just keep the combination if I need to get in there I’ll call you.” That was a mistake, he must’ve had insomnia two o’clock in the morning rookie runners coming to get me because the major wants to get in the safe. So I gotta get up, get dressed, go unlock it for him, open the drawer, and then I gotta go back. So somewhere in southeast Asia there’s a safe that nobody can open. Interviewer: “You think it’s buried somewhere?” It could be but I’ve got the combination. Interviewer: “You’ve got the combo, okay. Anything valuable in there you think anymore?” Probably special orders or probably secret stuff but you know. Interviewer: “So anyway lately I’ve seen on the travel channel and the Food Network they have on cable TV some– Not veterans, I know veterans who have gone back to Vietnam but �Jedlowski, Ray people in food they go to Vietnam specifically Ho Chi Minh City which used to be Saigon, and they say on there that there’s over like 200 different fruits and vegetables in Vietnam. Did you see any of them out there at all?” You know the saddest part of that war? 535– Something like that 548,000 men, are you serious? That’s too much. Interviewer: “It is.” And we didn’t win, to me you owe us– First one of our guys that drops we’re expected to win at all cost, there’s no such thing as ties in war. Interviewer: “I agree, but anyway did you ever do any fishing out there or anything like that?” (39:05) No– Interviewer: “Were you even near a river or a lake that you could do that?” Well we went swimming on Christmas day. Interviewer: “Where the Mekong delta or?” No, we found a lake. Interviewer: “Did you?” Yeah, of course the Viet Cong swim in there too but anyway– Interviewer: “Did you see any over there?” �Jedlowski, Ray No way we had on– Here we had 40 guys right, okay and there’s 20 on the perimeter of the lake and 20 swim with– Our stuff was real close to us and everything. Okay when we’re done swimming we get out, get dressed, and they go in and swim but no fortunately we didn’t– We must have got our schedules okay because they didn’t come in then but if they did it would’ve been a mess, we’d have been in it but it was so hot there. That’s the poorest piece of real estate, they didn’t get their rainy season man it rains every day, mildew, mosquitoes that could probably beat you up. Interviewer: “Did you guys get any bug spray that helped you out?” Well we had netting, each bunk had nets but, you know still you’re out in the field, out in a construction area I mean you gotta deal with it. Interviewer: “Anybody catch the malaria or any kind of–” No, other guys coming back did, that’s it. Interviewer: “Okay so when did you leave Vietnam? Actually before we do that, did you ever go to Saigon?” (40:30) No. Interviewer: “Did you see the Mekong delta or anywhere else like that?” No, we were pretty much confined there because our job was construction so we didn’t get to– We didn’t get to go anywhere or do much of anything other than– Oh we had that– Told you about that day room? We had one movie, Annette Funicello in Bikini Beach Party, we saw that– I could almost recite the dialogue, I mean that was the only movie we had. We watched it 30 times or something and tried to– Interviewer: “In the whole year that’s all you saw?” �Jedlowski, Ray Yeah and we’re trying to trade movies with others. “No, we don’t have any.” Or “No, we’re not trading.” So that was it, and we didn’t have chairs in there either, you sat on the floor. Yeah, and then Christmas day we got our C rations, sit on the floor. Interviewer: “Christmas day of ‘65?” Yes. Interviewer: “Okay, what– You said there was a mamasan that did your laundry right?” Mhmm, Interviewer: “Is that the only contact you had with any civilians or?” Yeah, you know– And supposedly all the on base Vietnamese are screened, I doubt it, I don’t think that’s true. I mean– See that’s just the problem with that war, you didn’t know a good guy from the bad guy. (42:00) I mean there’s good Vietnamese and bad Vietnamese, it’s not like shirts and skins, I mean you don’t know. So you watch everything and everybody. Interviewer: “Did anybody ever come on base that the kids– Bombs on them or anything like that?” No, that’s why I stayed out of Saigon cause they’d walk in the restaurant and blow it up, and then we had a Vietnamese guy who would run our lawn mower and the lawn mower got clogged with weeds so he put his hand in there to unclog it. So we had to rush him over to the hospital cause half of his hand was missing cause he put it in the blades, he didn’t turn it off. Interviewer: “Well, did he save his hand in the end?” Yeah. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “That’s good.” You know, teach them– It was probably the first time he ever saw one. Interviewer: “Probably, yeah.” But can they make crossbows, those folks are carpenters I’ll tell you they can really, really make things. I tried to bring mine back but they wouldn’t let me [unintelligible] Interviewer: “Okay, so you didn’t go to Saigon you basically stayed on Pleiku whatever and stuff.” One of the things about– We had the club that we went to, whether– Americans are pretty cool people because when you get into a situation like that, they don’t care how much money you got, they don’t care what branch of service you’re in, you’re American we’re together and we’re on the same team. (43:35) I mean nobody was a stranger any time you went in there whether you knew them or not, you know and I’ve had 1st Cav guys switch T-shirts just for luck and just, amazing, amazing camaraderie, it’s just it’s a wonderful friendship. Interviewer: “Do you still keep in touch with any of them today?” No, I started to do that and I found out some were gone so I said “I’m not doing it.” Oh I went to the wall in Washington, D.C and I didn’t use the book because I want to remember what I remembered last and I didn’t want to change that. Interviewer: “Sure, before we get into your trips after the war like the wall, we’ll get back to the wall again.” Okay. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Okay, when you got your orders to leave Vietnam how did you feel?” Oh I was happy, well just before then I got the reenlistment– Spill “You gotta stay in we’ll make you major, captain, everything. Make you staff sergeant within six months.” I wanna go home, I wanna go home so yeah I was very very happy and very happy to get back. Interviewer: “So they tried to convince you otherwise.” Oh yeah, they want me to stay. I said “I am so not– No, I’m going home.” But now going home, no one talked about the chip. Interviewer: “Sure, real quick I think there’s something I ain’t asked about, about Vietnam. Did you know how the war was going? Did anybody tell you anything, what was going on?” No, because we were so busy doing our jobs that we really– That didn’t really– I guess I didn’t want to know at that time cause I had my job to do, you always had to do it for the war effort. (45:30) So I would hope we were, I mean you know, no I didn’t say what the score you know I was in it but– Interviewer: “Did you have any like– You could listen to any music over there at all?” We made our own with some guys who could sing, play the guitar. Interviewer: “Did you? Yeah, did you have any favorite music back then or favorite bands, songs or whatever?” I’m gonna have to think on that one. Interviewer: “Okay, if you think later that’s fine. There’s a lot of talk of drugs over there, did you see any of that?” �Jedlowski, Ray No and you know what? That’s what ticks me off about that movie Full Metal Jacket, that’s bullshit it wasn’t that much going on and boy did they sensationalize that for the audience. Interviewer: “How about Platoon? That was another one.” Yeah, no I could tell you we had our beer and we had whiskey but there was no– And I ran with all the guys there was no pot and nothing else going on. That’s why I would never watch that movie again, that was a travesty, that did not depict them at all. There was no stoners on there stumbling around. Interviewer: “We’ve had some vets say there was but as you know Hollywood likes to–” Sensationalize. Interviewer: “Big time, yeah.” (46:53) Well all I can say is for our group, civil engineers, it was not. Interviewer: “Just alcohol.” Yeah we had beer, well beer was a quarter, shot of whisky was a quarter so, you know. First of all we didn’t have a place to get it, I mean other than on the construction site or you’re taking a shower or going to the chow hall to eat and then you don’t get a lot of free time to do much, remember we worked 12-13 hours a day. Yeah I mean there was no– And you’re tired. Interviewer: Did you have any time off, like weekends off? Even Sundays?” Sundays we got off and the only we had that we could play was horseshoes and we had one base football and someone kicked it in the minefield and one of the Vietnamese that used to work on the base tried to get it, blew himself up, so that left us with the horseshoes and that was it. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Did you see that happen?” No, no I heard it though. Interviewer: “You heard it go off?” Yeah, so– Interviewer: “But it was a Vietnamese that went out there?” Yeah, he thought that he could get the football and keep it or sell it back to us, that was a mistake. Interviewer: “Okay, so then when you went home did you fly out of Saigon or right off the base you were at?” (48:15) I flew out of Pleiku, yeah the 141 Starlifter again. Interviewer: “Okay, then you went back to Hawaii did you?” Yes. Interviewer: “Okay, and then back where after that?” Back home to Dearborn, Michigan. Dearborn Heights, Michigan. Interviewer: “Okay, you didn’t have to go back to Andrews Air Force Base?” Oh yeah I’m sorry, yeah Andrews– Yeah we had to fly back to Andrews fist and then I got discharged but when people– Is it time for the chip yet? �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “What’s that?” Time for the chip part? The chip is when you come home and you’re still there. Interviewer: “Okay, go ahead.” Okay, you know physically you know you aren’t but man I had a hair trigger temper. My mom and I went out to dinner at this lounge and then the bartender wouldn’t serve me because he told, you know told me I was too young to have a beer and I showed him an I.D– My I.D, a military I.D and he still wouldn’t and I’m not proud of it but I punched him and my dad of course defended me and my mom saying “Just get the hell out of here.” And so we got up, threw over some tables, he was out taking a nap and same as my daughter, she got back from Afghanistan and she’s an MP in the Army and I stood behind her. She asks me to be in front of her even though clearly she knows I’m dad but you’re not– It takes a while for that to go away. (50:15) I mean I had that for about six months, I mean just hair trigger, you know we’d fight over the drop of a hat because I was just wired I guess but it got better, I mean in time. Let me say just cause they’re back don’t mean they’re really back. Interviewer: “So you got back, you got discharged in ‘66 you said? And at that time Vietnam really started to kick off.” Yeah. Interviewer: “You saw the protests obviously around the country, Johnson and McNamara escalating the war big time. How did you feel about that when you got out? Did you feel you should go back in or did you just feel– Knowing what those guys are probably heading to, how did you feel?” I think we could’ve done a better job, I know it– First of all the French were there and they got their ass kicked, there’s a statue of the French– For the French because they couldn’t win there �Jedlowski, Ray and so we’re there I mean I got no issue with McNamara, yeah okay. We– It wasn’t our war, you know but be that as it may we were told to go, we’re going. So you know I see the draft dodgers and burning their draft cards or going to Canada, you know this is your country. You don’t want this anymore, you don’t want to pay the price for freedom? Well good luck in Canada. Interviewer: “Then when– What was that– Did you even watch the news when the war really got going?” No, I figured it was out of my hands. I did what I could while I was there and, you know that’s all I could do. I had a clean conscience and I felt good about what I did. Interviewer: “Now Johnson wouldn’t run again and probably because of–” The lame duck? (52:22) Interviewer: “Well yeah, because of the pressure from protestors and the Vietnam war very escalating that him and McNamara did. Then Nixon won the election though, how’d you feel about that, did you think he’d do something well over there, did you think– What did you think?” No, I didn't think that Nixon was gonna change anything. I just, you know he was in politics and with him in the Watergate thing and I’m sure there’s other– He’s very political just do whatever will pacify you and play the game, so no I don’t think so. Interviewer: “I know he ordered some strikes against Cambodia because of supply lines there from the Viet Cong.” Well you know what they bombed Hanoi twice, there was a Viet Cong general that said “If you had bombed us one more time we were gonna surrender.” And then they stopped the bombing after two bombing runs. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Wow, and then all of a sudden, you know Nixon resigned, Watergate and then our local man Gerald Ford took over.” Good man. Interviewer: “Yep, he was, I even had the chance to meet him once too.” Did you? Interviewer: “Yes I did, but anyway did you feel Ford was– Did you feel sorry for Ford with the mess that was given to him?” I did. Interviewer: “Did you think there was any way out of Vietnam at that time or did you think he had to just go right through with it and continue the evacuation, anyway how did you feel?” (54:05) I don’t think we should have evacuated anything, I think if we would’ve followed through and quit having it be a political war than a real war we wouldn’t have had to evacuate. They would’ve been gone, Hanoi would’ve surrendered, everything would’ve been different but no, that’s on us. Interviewer: “But was there anything you think Ford could’ve done, he got denied Congress any aid to solve Vietnam but by that time pretty much the war was probably over with, don’t you think?” Yeah, and then when we got back you know the cat calls we got. Interviewer: “Did you get any people say anything to you when they knew you was in service?” �Jedlowski, Ray Mhmm, I reacted to it. Interviewer: “I mean you’re good to share with me, if not if you don’t that’s fine. A lot of veterans have told me what they did to so.” I punched him, I did and I’ll punch every god damn one of them that does that. How dare you, how dare you spit on me, how dare you call me a name. Were you there? Did you put any skin in the game? No, you did not, that's why I’m gonna knock you on your ass, that’s just the way I feel about it too. Interviewer: “Well it’s a normal reaction, you know.” Yeah and then– I gotta– 580,479 I just remembered what we lost, are you kidding me? I mean God bless desert storm, desert shield and all those, and they got ticker tape parades and then they have the audacity to take us down to Fifth Third Ballpark and honor us? (55:45) That’s like, Steve if I forgot your birthday and 30 years later “Hey Steve come on out listen about your birthday, here.” No stick it, you know I don’t– What? That’s even [unintelligible] I mean that’s crazy and– Interviewer: “But anyway, what did you feel about the Vietnamese refugees that Ford helped get over here, get them homes? Did you think– Did you think that was a good thing he did, Cambodian refugees too?” I don’t know how I feel about that, I got a neighbor who’s Vietnamese, I got trouble with that. I hear them talk in Vietnamese and I speak a little Vietnamese. I’m not comfortable you know not that they’re bad people, nothing to do with them at all I just– Interviewer: “Does it bring back memories?” It takes me back, I don’t want to go back. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Yeah I don’t blame you.” So yeah, that bothers me. Interviewer: “One thing I have to tell you though, this is coming from a couple of them I know, one’s a friend of mine he’s a cop at Grand Valley, another they helped run the First Wok restaurant there on Alpine, they wanted me to tell you and all the Vietnam veterans thank you very much for helping them.” And God loves them, yeah I would help them again but let’s do the job. Interviewer: “Yeah, so anyway Vietnam war ended and stuff and all this ridicule and stuff like that, then of course you’ve told me how you felt about those that dodged the draft. Now there’s different types of draft dodgers back then there’s all the ones that went to Canada, those that went to college and then those that joined the National Guard. How did you feel about all that?” (57:55) I’m okay with two out of the three, the ones that went to Canada stay there. Yeah if you’re in college, you get a deferment for college God bless you, National Guard God bless you, but don’t go to Canada and run out on your country, don’t do that. Interviewer: “Yeah, so anyway you mentioned the Vietnam wall, when you found out they were gonna build something like that, and it was by a woman named Maya Lin I think she was Vietnamese that designed that really great design, fantastic–” It’s gorgeous. Interviewer: “Anyway how did you feel about the wall when it went up finally?” �Jedlowski, Ray When I went there, again I told you I didn’t look for my friends in the book, but I did kneel down for about 20 minutes and just reflected and said prayers for those that aren’t here, some because they were my buddies and God bless you guys. Interviewer: “Definitely is something worth seeing in D.C right there that was a long time coming.” But I’d recommend, even though you think you would want to see if your friends were on the wall, just remember them the way that they were and then you won’t be disappointed. Interviewer: “Exactly. Did you leave anything at the wall?” Yes. Interviewer: “What’d you leave?” (59:22) A Rose, yeah they had vendors on the street. Interviewer: “Good location too, right by the Lincoln Memorial.” Yeah. Interviewer: “Very good location. Alright now we're back up past ‘82 cause that’s when the wall was put up and stuff, and– Anyway your personal life again, when did you get married?” First time 1968 and that lasted for 17 years but alcohol got the best of her so we divorced. Interviewer: “Okay, any children from that?” Yes, three sons and a daughter. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Okay, what are their names?” Jeff, Cheryl, Wayne, and Trey and Wayne’s a police office in Westminster, Maryland, my daughter’s an x-ray tech, and my other two work for a couple factories there,so doing well. Interviewer: “Now you mentioned up comes Desert Storm when it started– When it came up, I mean we were building forces and stuff over there to stop Saddam Hussein and kick him out of Kuwait. President Bush, first President Bush, H.W Bush being a World War II vet himself he promised the nation this is not gonna be another Vietnam. Do you think he fulfilled that promise after we did victory in Desert Storm or how do you feel?” I think he did because we went in there and took care of business, we did not finish Vietnam, that was never finished. Yes I think he did, now it’s not Colin Powell but who was that other– Interviewer: “Schwarzkopf.” (1:01:17) Yes, smart man and he said that this won't be a Vietnam, we’re gonna do this. Interviewer: “Colin Powell said that too.” Okay. Interviewer: “A couple good generals there.” Yeah, no kidding and no one like since. Interviewer: “And Vietnam veterans too, cause I think they were like either majors or captains during the Vietnam war and stuff.” Schwarzkopf was no dummy, he was very smart. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Very good.” So yeah, I do remember that when our tank was assaulted they were holding up their hands and surrendering and one of them said “What took you so long?” They didn’t want no part of this. Interviewer: “You mean over at Desert Storm?” Yeah. Interviewer: “Yeah I got some friends that was an MP unit from Owosso and they said that they were surrendering in droves coming to their plant.” Yeah like “Hey over here!” Interviewer: “Yeah they were given– My friends that were there as MPs they were giving them money and stuff and ‘Here you can have this.’ You know.” (1:02:15) Yeah just take me away. Interviewer: “Yeah, but anyway then of course came the Iraq war and the Afghanistan, did you– You said you had a daughter that was there?” Yes. Interviewer: “Okay, what branch was she in?” Military police. Interviewer: “Army?” �Jedlowski, Ray Yes. Interviewer: “She active duty was she?” Oh yeah, very active duty. Interviewer: “She wasn't guard or reserve?” No, she was there. Interviewer: “How was it for her?” Well, she to straighten them out I guess she told me she’s tired of hearing, this is Afghanistan the folks go “Well why are you here, you’re supposed to make babies.” And you know just that condescending stuff. So, her name is Liza, Eliza straightened them out very quickly and then she was on patrol with an Afghanistan soldier but there was a dog underneath a tree trying to stay cool. (1:03:10) Well this Afghanistan soldier is throwing rocks at him, my daughter turn the saw– You know what a saw is, that machine gun that just throws out a thousand rounds a second or something, she turn it on him said “You throw one more rock I’m taking you out.” They have no– Everything is defined women are low as can be, dogs are– Interviewer: “Even lower?” Yeah, even lower. Interviewer: “Yeah a lot of middle eastern countries are like that, I noticed that when I was in Saudi and Kuwait, same thing. Not the dogs but I noticed the women, our women got treated pretty bad, not by us but by them.” Yeah, and if any of the other MPs notice that she’s having a bad time with one of the Afghanistan soldiers, well it’s not good something’s gonna happen, but no she did good. �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “Did you give her any kind of talk when you found out she was going over there or did you just wish her well, give her a hug and a kiss.” I actually wanted to break her leg so she wouldn’t have to go. She’s tough, she’s got good genes in her she’ll be fine, but stubborn, God she’s stubborn. Nope, she did good and she’s an NCO now. Interviewer: “Oh is she still active duty?” Yeah, still active, she’s at Fort Knox. Interviewer: “Oh Kentucky.” Yeah, Elizabethtown, Kentucky. Interviewer: “Is that still the Armored Division is it or is it just– Is it something else now.” (1:04:50) No, there’s tanks there but I don’t think– As a matter of fact I think it is, right outside the base is Fort Knox. So she’s doing well. Interviewer: “Oh good, yeah.” But I guess she had a– When she got promoted to NCO her duties changed and all of a sudden she’s got people looking for her, well she never had the experience before. So she got a little flustered with the beginning you know, I said “Just like having kids.” I said “You just gotta see what they need, take care of their needs, get them to do what you want to do.” I said “It’ll be an investment.” So, she’s fine. Interviewer: “You remarried again I take it after–” �Jedlowski, Ray Yeah. Interviewer: “Okay and just tell me about that briefly. How’d you meet her– I mean how’d you meet your first wife, first?” Met her at a USO dance and went together and just things clicked and we got married and I was in the military then too. Interviewer: “And what was your second wife?” That’s the one that liked the alcohol. Interviewer: “You mean your second wife, the one you’re married to now?” Both of them did. (1:06:15) Interviewer: “Okay, what’s your wife’s name now?” Christie. Interviewer: “Christie?” Yup, she’s wonderful. Interviewer: “Where’d you meet her at?” I used to work for Grabber [sounds like] in Grand Rapids and I worked there for years and she worked there and I did too. We were friends for 10 years, 15 years so finally did it right. Interviewer: “And that’s your second marriage?” �Jedlowski, Ray Third. Interviewer: “Third okay, alright third marriage okay. Alright then real quick we’ll mention the presidents cause I feel your commander in chief is basically how a military runs pretty much.” Yeah. Interviewer: “We’ll start with Kennedy there, how do you feel he ran the military?” Excellent, I do. Interviewer: “Cause he was your commander in chief then.” Yes. (1:07:10) Interviewer: “There was a interview by Walter Cronkite a few months before he was assassinated and he asked him straight out about Vietnam and he says– I don’t know how much, whatever you can get it on Youtube or something like that the interview itself and he pretty much said it’s going to have to be up to south Vietnamese to take care of this war. “I don’t want to send more troops there or back them up” And all that stuff, do you feel if Kennedy would’ve lived on do you think Vietnam would’ve ended the way it did or you didn’t think it made any difference?” I think it would have made a difference because again as great a president as he was he was no nonsense, if he saw a need “Okay the south can’t handle this they need some help.” Maybe because they’re out gunned or something we’d been in it but if he did call that, make that call we’d have won it, oh yes, oh yes. Interviewer: “Real briefly on Johnson.” �Jedlowski, Ray Pass, [unintelligible] Interviewer: “Okay, no problem. Nixon?” Tricky Dicky? Interviewer: “Yeah, same thing? How about Ford?” Yes, good man. Interviewer: “Okay, I’ll briefly go through the next few presidents and then that’ll be it. Carter?” Pants were good. Interviewer: “Okay, Ronald Reagan?” (1:08:33) Great actor. Interviewer: “Alright, you think he did good with the military?” Yes. Interviewer: “George H.W Bush?” Yes. Interviewer: “Okay, I don’t know if I want to mention the next one or not, should I?” Start with a T? �Jedlowski, Ray Interviewer: “No, Mr.Clinton.” I think him and Hillary are the two crookedest beings walking the Earth, there’s so much– If they dug up all of the real dirt, are you kidding the people wouldn’t believe it. Interviewer: “I was referring to how do you think Clinton ran the military?” He was too busy with– Interviewer: “Other things, we’ll leave it at that. Okay well we’ll stop right there as far as– ” How about Trump? Interviewer: “Well Trump’s still young yet in the office we’ll put it that way.” (1:09:25) Okay. Interviewer: “How about George W. do you think he did alright?” Yes, he did. Interviewer: “Okay, how about Mr.Obama what about him?” I think he was trying to make everybody happy, you know he wanted to be all things to everybody, yeah I think that was– Interviewer: “He didn’t do too bad actually.” �Jedlowski, Ray No, no I’m not– But I think he’s a little short in the spine area where I think he could, I mean could’ve been more decisive. Interviewer: “Sure, alright anyway thank you very much for your service Ray, I appreciate it.” You’re very welcome. Interviewer: “And I’m glad to meet you, I’m glad you let us have this interview and basically anything else you’d like to add, like to say?” Just God bless America. Interviewer: “Okay, are you– You mentioned a little bit earlier, before we end this interview, that you’re finally getting recognition and it’s like salt in the wound. It’s turned around now how people are viewing the Vietnam war, especially veterans.” (1:10:25) Yeah. Interviewer: “How do you think– Why do you think that is?” You know what, I don't have an answer. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Veterans History Project Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. History Department Description An account of the resource The Library of Congress established the Veterans History Project in 2001 to collect memories, accounts, and documents of U.S. war veterans from World War II and the Korean War, Vietnam War, and conflicts in the Middle East and elsewhere, and to preserve these stories for future generations. The GVSU History Department interviews are part of this work-in-progress, and may contain videos and audio recordings, transcripts and interview outlines, and related documents and photographs. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1914- Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource Afghan War, 2001--Personal narratives, American Iran Hostage Crisis, 1979-1981--Personal narratives, American Korean War, 1950-1953--Personal narratives, American Michigan--History, Military Oral history Persian Gulf War, 1991--Personal narratives, American United States--History, Military United States. Air Force United States. Army United States. Navy Veterans Video recordings Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Personal narratives, American World War, 1939-1945--Personal narratives, American Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smither, James Boring, Frank Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-27 Language A language of the resource eng Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/455">Veterans History Project interviews (RHC-27)</a> Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context JedowskiR2181V Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Jedlowski, Ray Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2018-02 Title A name given to the resource Jedlowski, Ray (Interview transcript and video), 2018 Description An account of the resource Ray Jedlowski was born in Portsmouth, Virginia, in 1942 before his family moved to Michigan where he graduated high school in Dearborn in 1962. Jedlowski’s father was in the Navy during the Second World War and gave his son plenty of exposure to military life in port even though he was not fond of the seas. Since he could not find steady work after high school, he went down to the recruitment office and decided to enlist into the Air Force. He was then sent to Lackland Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas, for Basic Training before graduating onto Amarillo Air Force Base for technical school and administrative training. Jedlowski was then stationed at Andrews Air Force Base in Maryland as a Civil Engineer. He recalled how the base went into lockdown following the assassination of President John F. Kennedy in 1963. In 1965, he was deployed to Vietnam and was stationed at Pleiku Air Base near Saigon. Shortly after his arrival, the base experienced a small skirmish, but the new arrivals were not overly concerned for their safety. Jedlowski’s unit was tasked with constructing billets and lodging for the First Cavalry Division after its arrival near Pleiku. At the end of his tour, Jedlowski was relieved to go home and was flown to Hawaii and then back to Andrews Air Force Base where he was formally discharged in 1966. Back home, Jedlowski described the ‘chip’ effect where he was physically at home, but his mind was still as paranoid, wired, and irritable as he was in Vietnam. Disappointed with how the war was escalating and how some Americans looked to dodge the draft, he refused to watch the news, but was still proud of his contribution to the war effort. He was disappointed that presidents Nixon and Ford abandoned the war so quickly and that, combined with the intensified anti-war protests at home, the U.S. war effort fell apart. He was also conflicted by the construction of the Vietnam “Wall” Veterans Memorial in 1982 in Washington D.C. since he thought the sincerity of the project was mixed. After the end of Operation Desert Storm in 1991, Jedlowski thought the U.S. military and government did a far better job of handling the war effort than during Vietnam. However, Jedlowski is grateful that the general, domestic attitude toward veterans of the Vietnam War has changed for the better. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Hammond, Steve (Interviewer) Subject The topic of the resource Oral history Veterans History Project (U.S.) United States—History, Military Veterans Video recordings Korean War, 1950-1953—Personal narratives, American Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Veterans History Project collection, (RHC-27) Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University Libraries, Special Collections & University Archives, 1 Campus Drive, Allendale, MI, 49401. Relation A related resource Veterans History Project (U.S.) Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Type The nature or genre of the resource Moving Image Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource video/mp4 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/f2881f24948ee500c6f2a93e7b2dd439.jpg 8317ee728d66081f3da39972caac934a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource F. W. Beasecker collection Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Beasecker, Helen Starr, 1912-1994 Beasecker, F.W. (Francis Wallace), 1917-1971 Description An account of the resource Photographs of Lt. (later Capt.) F.W. Beasecker, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers. Photographs of training at Camp Edwards, Massachusetts; visit to the Gibbon Boat Works in New Orleans, manufacturer of parts for the LCVP; housing in Carabelle, Florida; and Signal Corps and Engineer Amphibian Command photographs taken in Cairns, Australia. Images taken in Australia include construction of the landing craft boat assembly plant, production and testing of the LCVP and snapshots taken by Beasecker during his active duty with the 411th Engineer Battalion during WWII. Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant World War II Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1942/1946 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/457">F.W. Beasecker papers (RHC-29)</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Subject The topic of the resource World War, 1939-1945 World War, 1939-1945 -- Engineering and construction World War, 1939-1945 -- Pacific Ocean United States Boatbuilding Landing craft Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-29 Language A language of the resource eng Still Image A static visual representation. Examples include paintings, drawings, graphic designs, plans and maps. Recommended best practice is to assign the type Text to images of textual materials. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-29_Beasecker_02 Title A name given to the resource Jeeps movng a fieldgun at Camp Edwards Subject The topic of the resource World War, 1939-1945 United States--History, Military Michigan--History, Military United States. Army. Camp Edwards Military life Soldiers Photographs Description An account of the resource Soldiers moving a fieldgun at Camp Edwards, Massachusetts, 1942. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Beasecker F.W. (Francis Wallace), 1917-1971 United States Army. Signal Corps. Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1942 Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived F. W. Beasecker papers, RHC-29 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant World War II Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/InC/1.0/?language=en">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/9aa2d6441443b4c771e133be82fbf84c.pdf 439e624e384f0d104825ff4bdc473c0d PDF Text Text Speaking Out Western Michigan’s Civil Rights Histories Grand Valley State University Special Collections Interviewee: Jeff Lichon Interviewers: Grace Faoro, Cody Holtrop, Eli Rytlewski and Michael Vallentine Supervising Faculty: Melanie Shell-Weiss Location: Grand Valley State University Special Collections Date: 3/3/2012 Biography and Description Jeff Lichon was born and raised in West Michigan. He discusses his struggles with disability after being in a car accident at age 15. Transcript FAORO: All right to get started. Jeff how old is you and where are you from originally? LICHON: I am 33 years old and I am originally from Saginaw. FAORO: Okay so from around here. LICHON: Yes, I’m a local. FAORO: Now, what was it like growing up in Saginaw, and this area? LICHON: I personally, Michigan I think is the greatest place in the world. I love it. We got the if this is about diversity Michigan is a perfect example of that only in a different way, I think its we have the change of the seasons and we’ve got fresh water that you don’t have to worry about getting eaten by sharks. But honestly it was, its home. I mean I’m comfortable here and I think I’ll always come back here or relocate back here. if I move away or anything like that for a period of time or whatever. There is a lot out there to see but in the big little world, this is still home and I grew up with mom dad and an older sister. she did the normal sibling rivalry and everything and I always tried being the peacemaker and stuff in the family. FAORO: Was she much older than you? LICHON: Two and half years. FAORO: Okay so you guys were pretty close in age. LICHON: Yeah and we are very close still. She’s lives in Grand Rapids as a matter of fact, and has been there for close to 10 years. So yeah. FAORO: Have you ever lived anywhere else but this area or have you always lived kind of stuck around? Page 1 �LICHON: I’ve lived in right out of my undergrad I lived in the Metro Detroit area for a total of 5 years. Two different companies and then eventually I started at Dow in the rotational program and my second rotation was in Washington D.C and I spend 6 months out there. FAORO: Now what is a rotational program just out of curiosity? I don’t really know. LICHON: It’s a where I started at Dow, its kind of an entry level position I’m Public affairs its called Public Affairs Developmental Program and Mike’s dad hired me into Dow actually. So but at any rate you do typically you do three 4-6 month rotations. And each one is kind of you typically you stick with the one project area like my first one I worked on sustainability communications and when I was out in D.C I handled the Government Affairs Communication in PR and what not so and then I ended up actually coming out of rotation because a position became available and it was a good fit. FAORO: Now where did you go to school and what did you study? LICHON: My undergrad was at Central Michigan University and I double majored in logistics and marketing and a Journalism minor. I did two years at Delta College too actually. I got my associates in Business. It took me while, starting out I didn’t know what I wanted to do . FAORO: That’s pretty common. LICHON: Well yeah like anybody, what do you want to do the rest of your life? well okay, that’s easy… not its not. FAORO: You’re 19 choose now. LICHON: Exactly, no pressure so I started out in psychology and when my dad asked me what I wanted to do with that, I said that was a good question. I think teaching would be natural for me and somewhere down the road maybe I could retire I’ll teach or something. I have actually been a substitute teacher, taught for a little while in local high schools in Saginaw. and So then between my first and second years at Delta I went from within a two week period I changed my mind starting with Psychology to Pre-Med to Pre-Law to Business. So I got my associates in Business at CMU and did the Marketing Logistics, I knew I wanted to do something to take advantage of my creative side and what not, so Marketing was kind of an -natural fit. I joined the co-ed Business Fraternity there so I wanted to do something social but also help be a good rese builder too. FAORO: Right connections and working. LICHON: Exactly. So everybody in the business Fraternity, not everybody, but several people were doing this double major logistics and marketing and I was like what the heck is logistics? So I looked into it and it seemed like a growing field a lot of opportunity and what not and its funny I get to maybe a little bit about what I’m doing with Dow actually. I kind of came full circle with the logistics thing, it actually helped me further down the road and I wouldn’t even know about it back then. so at any rate, I ended up, the 5 years I spend in Detroit were in international logistics operations and like the first company was CH Robinson. If I’m getting too much detail or something stop me. Page 2 �FAORO, VALLENTINE, and RYTLEWSKI: No! You’re good. LICHON: Okay, it was a little over two years with CH Robinson shipping Scott’s fertilizer via the ocean and airfreight around the world. by the container load, the big ocean containers in the large ocean vessels. and it was good experience but it was not I didn’t really see myself doing, and I didn’t feel it was a great use of my talent and all of that. so I left CH Robinson and got a job at Chrysler and was a contractor there with eagle global logistics. I was doing a similar thing only, Chrysler vehicles around air and ocean freight it was, it was, special operations. It wasn’t high vole, getting the production company. like thousands of cars around the world and stuff like that. But, there were cars used in commercials when the Jeep Commander came out with the little roller, frozen in a block of ice? That was actually filmed at the southern hemisphere proving ground in New Zealand; I shipped that vehicle there. FAORO: Wow LICHON: Yeah, so it was kind of cool. it was a step up from, it was kind of moving in the right direction. Its still not exactly what I wanted to do. I spent three years there. While I was there I got my MBA from Michigan State. I did the weekend MBA program and felt that that would help me, go that next level. FAORO: Get you where you wanted. LICHON: Exactly. And I would’ve come to find out that it did. I was able to; I interviewed with Dow and it. I was not only able to switch companies but to switch fields. because I wanted to get into circling back to my undergrad, the journalism minor that I got. I also, do some freelance outdoor travel and like disability writing and for various magazines. You just send inquiries in; my dad has also done on the side as a kind of hobby. And I always enjoy writing, and enjoy the outdoors, and traveling and what not, so it was a natural fit, and so I’m like I wanted that I could behind me to give me some more credibility for my writing. So I go the Journalism minor. I could come to find out that it helped me get into Dow. I didn’t have any communications experience per say, besides the minor, I have done some public speaking, to various groups nationally, local and what not, for my injury. so all of those things kind of came together and helped me, along with the MBA, to get into Dow, to change fields from logistics to communications, which are pretty, you can imagine, there are many difference between the two. FAORO: I’m really interested in the writing you do for the outdoors, and the public speaking you do. Can you elaborate on that a little? LICHON: Gosh when did that start? FAORO: Like how did you get into it, like the opportunities kind of thing? LICHON: I’ll start with the writing. That’s easier. As I mentioned my dad always did that on the side. we always used to go hunting together, pheasant hunting, duck hunting, go out on the Saginaw Bay and he did this boats and blinds column for Wild Flower Magazine. He did this for 15-17 years and wrote for other Magazines. So I said I wanted to do that. The contact, connections and I said hey I’m interested in writing, and I submitted an inquiry. My first article was in the Michigan Outdoors on how to preserve Page 3 �your game after you shoot a deer or a duck or something. If you want to get it mounted. So pretty basic, but helpful right. And I just started from there; it was easy for me because it’s like what do you like to do? And write about it. So so I just started from there. I did my own LLC access outdoors (Limited Liability Company). And what else? I have written for some national publications now. I’m still kind of in the name building thing because over the years I have had gaps where I haven’t consistently kept my name out there so I have written for regional reports for Great Lake Fishing and Hunting News, on the Saginaw Bay Region, I did that for about a year or so. what’s going on in fishing and hunting and stuff, and where the hot spots, things like that. It was interesting, and then I would find when I would go on a trip somewhere, it would line up different activities adventures and stuff like that because I’m an adventurous guy I like those things. Every year I would try to do an in state and out of state trip and do different things. I mentioned I’m going down to Florida tomorrow. I work on lining up a fishing trip for Goliath grouper. They can get up to 600 pounds. So something like that. I am also trying, disabled water skiing for my first time down there. A week from today I’ll be on some inland lake. Hopefully no alligators are out there and I’ll be water skiing. So that will be fun, I hope. Hopefully not to overly adventurous. FAORO: How do you do disabled water skiing? I just like… LICHON: I down hill ski too, so I’m guessing that the fall in the water isn’t as hard but. Your basically, I’ve seen different ones. I mean there are some that are narrower skis and they have a bucket seat on it and your legs are secured in, your feet are strapped in. VALLENTINE: Pulls you up? LICHON: It pulls you up. Yeah. VALLENTINE: So that’s essentially the same thing as snow skiing too, right? LICHON: Yeah. VALLENTINE: Cause I’ve seen that. LICHON: I love it. It’s a good time. So I’m trying to get back to what I was leading into here. Hum, so… so always try and do in state out of state trips. I find a couple things to do that are non-typical for someone with a disability and then write about it. And maybe open up people with other disability, whether it’s physical or mental, open up their perspectives and hopefully their options and actually get out and do the things they want to do. So, I went to the National Cherry Festival in Traverse City and Mackinaw Island. Okay, and you just write about different things and how easy it is to get around and things you can do. In Traverse City I went to, I went on the tall ship Manitou out in West Grand Traverse Bay and went Parasailing. So, I wrote about those and I tried getting up with the Blue Angels that year but it didn’t pan out. They take up members of the media every year, I can guarantee you, just about guarantee that I will have been the first person with a spinal cord injury to ride in a fighter jet. That would have been cool. That would’ve been good publicity for them, wouldn’t it? Page 4 �FAORO: Now when you write, do you find that like any people in the disabled community are like really inspired or have you heard from anyone about your writings or anything? LICHON: No. Well the thing is people, I mean sports and spokes and paraplegic news are sister publications from the paralyzed veterans of America and I’ve written for both of them. FAORO: Are you a Veteran? LICHON: No. I wish it was that honorable. No, car accident. And s I can talk about that too if you’d like? FAORO: Are you comfortable? LICHON: Yeah, absolutely. … losing track of what I was saying. RYTLEWSKI: You were talking about writing for the association… LICHON: Oh yeah. The PBA and stuff. So they’re a national publication so they have good reader ship and if it helps one person or 2 people, whatever, I think that’s making a difference there. But I always look to, for meaning in things I do. What’s going to make an impact on lives of people? Not just people with disabilities but anybody. FAORO: Open the eyes of people who aren’t disabled maybe… LICHON: Yea, yea. The perspective of people with disabilities now has changed a lot since, I mean there was a huge movement back in the 60s and 70s and following Vietnam. With people coming back with these injuries and from war and having these types of injuries. Whether its post-dramatic stress, spinal injuries, head injuries and stuff like that. There was a big movement because they were coming back and even though; the country was very anti-war and anti-veteran and treated everyone bad, it was probably that much worse for those who were coming back with these catastrophic injuries. These life changing things that could actually, probably do more good for society and helping facilitate better back in the normal word, sort of speak. But it didn’t. There were big fights through those years. early in the 90s we ended up getting the American Disabilities Act from President Bush. that has been a hug step and has really opened up opportunities and the ability of people with, probably in a lot more respect of physical disabilities than mental. To get out because more things are accessible. Well new buildings are instructed; they now have to incorporate burrier free design and things like that. All public buildings have to be accessible. Anytime an old building is modified in anyway it has to be retrofitted with accessible designs as well and things like that. So, coming back to the present I think that the awareness of people with a disability has increased significantly and just over the things that have been leading over the years but there is still a ways to go. I mean no one thinks of himself or herself of wanting to have a disability; I was thrown into it when I was fifteen. It was something that happened to me, I spent 15 years walking and all of a sudden… You are either born with one, you sustain one somewhere. As people age different things come up, whether it’s dementia or whatever. So, no one ever think of themselves as having a disability. There are a lot of challenges of raising the awareness and I think now with the war and Iraq, the technology we have today there is going to be more people surviving their injuries at war cause of technology and these soldiers are going to come back and they are going to Page 5 �want to work and live a normal life and so you are going to see a lot more people in society with different types of injuries and disabilities, mental or physical or whatever. So, that’s definitely going to, I mean that’s unfortunate that it happens, but it is what it is and I think it is definitely going to help increase that awareness level and you’ll see just more; I think what that ultimately leads to is people have a different perspective on life. They see things differently right? FAORO: Yeah. LICHON: So, case in point, myself. I played football, baseball, basketball, soccer, skied, track, everything. It was April 26 of 1994, which will be 18 years next month since my accident and I got home from baseball practice and instead of doing my homework, like I probably should have, I ended up walking over to my buddies house to play basketball with another buddy. It was a few blocks from my house and I got there and I remember playing horribly and I don’t know, it’s just something you remember. So, was playing horribly and I had just gotten the first Rage Against the Machine CD and I wanted to play it on my buddy’s stereo because he had these big speakers. These box speakers. I remember getting ready to leave and that was it. What happened beyond that was a kid in my class had just got his drivers license, we weren’t close friends but we were friends of friends. We didn’t hang out all the time. So, he had just gotten a new truck and my buddy and me were about to walk home. The kid said hop in the bed of the truck and ill give you a ride home. So, we’re 15 years old, so of course. We were invincible then. FAORO: Yea, free ride. LICHON: Yea why not. Might be cool, whatever. So, there were 3 guys in the cab so we hopped in the bed and when we took off, I laid down in the bed cause I didn’t want to get thrown out and so that’s what I was told. So, the driver was messing around, lost control and went up a curb. On the same street that the kid’s house was that we were playing basketball at. And he hit a tree going about 50 and the driver had a concussion, the kid in the middle seat had 15 stitches across his knees, the kid in the passenger seat had a few stitches across his lip. Had we hit on the passenger side instead of the driver side, the kid in the passenger seat would have been killed because the hood came up through the wind so far it would have sliced his head open. It was bad. When I first saw the truck post-injury it was surreal. I called it the eight wonder of the world cause I was amazed anyone survived it. So, my buddy was in the bed of the truck with me and ended up getting 2 stitches in his finger cause he was holding on when we hit. I had a broken back. Which your spine has your cervical, which is in your neck, Your thorax, which I think has 7 vertebrate there. So they measure it like C1,C2,C3. So you have 12 thoracic, which are all your, which is the bulk of your back, your spine. there are 12 of those. Then you got your lumbar, which is your lower back, your sacru, and your praxis. I broke 3 vertebrate, T5,T6,T7. Which is just chest level here. had I broke my spinal cord one or two higher I probably would have lost some function in my arms and hands and stuff. I am very fortunate for as severe as it was and that I didn’t get some sort of head injury from bouncing around the bed of the truck. excuse me. So I had a broken back, a bruised heart, collapsed lung, and 3 broken ribs. Short term memory loss for 2-3 days pretty mild fortunately. I guess it was good that I didn’t get a head injury, though I guess some of my friends would argue against that, sometimes I may have one. (Laughing) Joking, ok. so I spent 3 weeks in St. Marys Page 6 �Hospital in Saginaw. had surgery where they put titani rods in my back to stabilize the spine. they took a bone chip out of my hip and fused the 3 veribrate together. They pulled bone chips out of my spinal cord, which caused that and the swelling from the traa caused the injury. So basically your spinal cord is about the diameter of your pinky and if theres, think about the diameter of a internet cable or something like that, or wifi; how intricate is some of the cables if you just break one of those it breaks the signal so that’s how the nerves are going through, they are just so tight together and any type of damage or shifting of the spine, swelling, can cause permanent disability. And if ya just tweak it. I hope I am not making anyone quezy if you are gonna be eating after this or anything (Laughes) FAORO, VALLENTINE, and RYTLEWSKI: (laughing) No we are alright LICHON: I spend three weeks, they fused 3 vertibrate together and pulled bone chips out of the spine. After that I went to grand rapids and spent 2 months in rehab for at Mary Free Bed by the hospital there, right on Wealthy St. FAORO: Oh I have seen stuff for that. LICHON: Kinda near the gaslight district? Or something? VALLENTINE: Something like that LICHON:I don’t think it’s a redlight district (Laughes) LICHON: Anyways, well I spent 2 months there and I had to relearn pretty much everything we take for granted. I had to relearn how to reach down and tie my shoes, I could not reach my feet right after my injury to put on shoes and socks, to get dressed, I had to relearn all that. But like I said, I had to relearn to transfer from the wheelchair to a real chair or a vehicle. Initially I was using what was called a sliding board. It’s just a very thin, solid board, about this long. That you slide under one hip then ya put it into the vehicle or onto the chair or something like that. I never thought I was never going to not have to depend on that just because it was that difficult to do. I had to relearn getting around the house, taking a shower, , bladder/ bowel considerations come into play. I mean everything was different. and so. After my, after I spent two months there, I came home, started my junior year in high school, no sports. Looked into getting back into hunting and fishing, because those we like my nber one passions. worked with my family and friends into getting back into doing the things I used to do as much as possible. yeah it was hard, it was an adjustment. Especially, as you can imagine for a 15 year old, it’s such a critical time in your life, in high school, in your development. Emotionally and all that. But I had awesome friends and family who were very supportive. I got right back that fall into hunting. there were some things I was kinda resistant to like, like I didn’t wanna be identified by my injury, by the disability or anything like that. I still wanted to be jeff FAORO: Right LICHON: ? And i think that was one personal battle that anyone who goes through anything like that would have. That you ultimately find out that you are only fighting yourself (laughs) and everyone still Page 7 �sees you for who you are in the end. but still it’s such a significant change. Going back to now, the idea that people with disabilities have a different perspective on life, because of a significant life challenge. I think. (bing noise) (laughing) RYTLEWSKI: Is it dying on me? (laughing) LICHON: See everyone has a different outlook on life and everything because of the challenges that you have gone through. So, that all ties into your work ethic, ties into your outlook on life. My motto is you only live once doesn’t mean that you have to be wild and reckless, it just means life’s short. It’s very short, I can’t believe I am 33 now; it’s hard to believe that 18 years have gone by since my accident, since that accident. But it’s just been an incredible 18 years. The opportunities I have had with people I have met, who knows where I would be today? Maybe the injury, I believe things happen for a reason. Maybe had the injury not happened, something would have happened where I would have died? You never know right? So I take every moment, I try to live in the moment. Do what it, what I feel is going to be a positive impact to people and doing the things also that I wanna do. Where when I get 50 60 years old whatever, and i look back and say man I wish I did that. I think regrets are hard for anybody. But now I think I have that perspective where people think about that and go, they think that they don’t like regrets and they think that they don’t wanna miss out on a opportunity in life. So I am actually going one step further and actually trying to do those things that I wanna do. traveling, and whatever down the road, getting married, having a family. Whatever is important to you, its personal to everybody. What they wanna do in life and stuff. So, my ultimate goal is to achieve greatness. (laughing) FAORO: I like it (laughing) LICHON: Yeahh RYTLEWSKI: You’re on your way there LICHON: Yeah! A long way there, I don’t ever think I’ll reach like dali llama status or anything like that (laughing) LICHON: Which is fine FAORO: Hey, don’t knock yourself down, you never know (laughing) FAORO: Dalli llama might be right here in midland Page 8 �LICHON: Yeah right! (laughing) LICHON: I’d rather be in the mountains (laughing) LICHON: So do you have any questions? FAORO: Maybe wrapping it back to Dow and now, with your disability are you involved in Dow in any way? RYTLEWSKI: DEN right? It’s called den? LICHON: Yeah right, RYTLEWSKI: Talk about that a little bit, my dad told me about it LICHON: Yes, ok so when I started at Dow I was in the rotational program, I had god what was the, trying to think of the timeline of everything cause it happened so quickly. Your dad gave me a lot of opportunity real fast. (Laughing). And so, yeah, DEN is the Disability Employ Network and I am the global chair no pun intended (Laughing). All right. OK. And Rob, Mike’s dad of course who hired me in, got me involved with the network, when I started. within like 2 or 3 months I was co-chair with Brenda Keeler, who at the time was the chair. And so then, that was with the understanding that eventually I would become chair. I was like ok, a year down the road or something, I’m at a new job and a new company. Nope, 2 months later I’m the chair. That opened up a lot of doors for me, but through that I’ve gone and spoke to, the, what was it? Allegiance of State Employees with disabilities, which is State of Michigan employees, that have disabilities. I have gone to national conferences for students with disabilities, I have had speaking opportunities, I’ve gotten to travel around a little bit and meet a lot of people, it was an awesome networking opportunity just for me for a personal standpoint. that wasn’t the only thing like, I a lot of people think, its kinda like the jeep syndrome, you drive a jeep everyone thinks everyone who has a jeep waves to everybody who has a jeep. OK, you’re in a wheelchair people think so and so, you work at Dow, do so and so? Well, there’s like 2 or 3 thousand people I’ve met with. You never know it’s a small town. So, people think because you have some sort of disability people think everything about every disability. Which is, isn’t further from the couldn’t be further from the truth. I was able to meet a lot of different people who have different disabilities, who who’s children have disabilities, or who know someone with a disability. And I have been able to go and speak to people with new disabilities injuries and stuff like that. Spinal injuries around the area, stuff like that. So it was a huge learning for me to be involved with them. I mean it opened up my eyes a lot ? I was able to I’m kind of a focal point for corporate center accessibility. So anytime, our facilities, is looking to put in automatic doors, or whatever I work with them. in doing that. Well I have to take in consideration for other disabilities, people who are blind, people who are deaf, things like that. So, again its my scope was just spinal cord injury, physical disabilities, using a wheelchair right. So that kind of helped me open up my perspective more and see a broader, aspect of disabilities I guess scope. Page 9 �Excuse me, and it was also and this is one of my favorite parts because, I like to give back to, people or anyone or anything that gives me an opportunity, so the opportunities I’ve had a Dow and with Den and with my career, with my growth and the people I’ve been able to work with, and meet through the company and through Den, have been awesome. And I naturally want to give back. So, by being visible around the company and having trying to fill the high profile and whatnot, I think opens up other people’s eyes, right . And helps them to learn, and maybe and however way in everyone is personal but a source of inspiration for them in some way. and everything whether I’m going on a business trip seeing what I do on a daily basis to get around and do the things I do, I think people have a greater appreciation for what they have. I hope so, ? because it’s a workout everyday, both physical and mental. And yeah I’m in pretty good shape (laughing) upper body ? (Laughing) So, you’re transcribing this right? FAORO: Yeah (laughing) LICHON: And but I mean getting up in the morning, is a lot more work than falling out of bed I could actually hurt myself. Falling in bed for you is probably just because your really tired or something, (Laughing) I have to really, I have to take care of myself that much more, to be able to go on to the things I want to do in life. so its it takes longer in the morning to get ready, somewhat. And especially like, however busy the last day or several days were, my upper body, I mean my arms are my legs ? Arms are not built to do the work that legs are built to do. So, if I’m going the halls in Dow are ridiculous in length. they have even though its not 70’s shag carpet, they have a carpet down through the halls and stuff, and that adds to the drag, I mean just little things like that make it a little more difficult to get around. But, I’ve conditioned myself to do that, but still, over the course of a day a busy day, your doing meeting after meeting, and your not only exercising yourself mentally your taxing from that perspective. But, you’ve got the physical aspect in there too. how many times a day I think man, I’m exhausted mentally or something you just had a busy day of classes, or its hot. You get tired right? Your ready to cash out, so being physically and mentally exhausted, when you get up in the morning the last thing you want to do is get up. Even though my mind isn’t mentally exhausted, my arms might and my shoulders and stuff. So, I still have to take care of myself, I mean, if I sprain a wrist, or tear a rotator cuff or something like that. I mean that will have a massive effect on my ability to do things, ? Just I go to physical therapy still, 18 years later I’m going twice a week, as a maintenance program, because of my injury I get muscle spasms. If I have a stressful day my legs are going to be like super tight, I’m always trying to stretch them out and move them around, and stay active just to keep them limber, things like that. So, I’m going to physical therapy, weekly massage which I always feel kind of snooty saying that but it’s important because it helps the skin integrity because you can get skin break down with spinal cord injury because your sitting down all the time, ? That’s another consideration I’ve taken account, if I get a pressure sore, where your sit bones are, because I have muscle atrophy your not using your legs like you used to. I mean just think if you stopped working out, or having your hockey practice and things like that, your probably not going to be in serious shape, if you not using them. LICHON: So at any rate, there’s a lot of different considerations, that I have to take into account, and but, where I tie this all back to, or I always try to tie this my injury my disability back to is that, every Page 10 �single person people with disabilities don’t want to be seen as, as different as being identified by their disability. FAORO: Like you said you don’t want to be defined by it. LICHON: Right, right, yeah, and so how I tie it back I say that everybody is the same well (laugh) there not, ok. I mean you two are as different from each other as you two are everybody does things in their own way. so, no people don’t want to say ok, your disabled, they don’t want to hear that. Or that you have a disability or anything, so so, we want to identify that we have an injury. I don’t think of myself as having a disability, I do things differently because I have to, because I have what I call an injury, right. It’s classified as a disability right? so is I think addiction to coffee or something, I don’t know, some weird things like, in the American medical association. So, people may be born with, who end up being like multiple sclerosis or muscular dystrophy or things like that, that’s a genetic thing, and fortunately with spinal cord injury, its not debilitating like some of those conditions or what not. its with spinal cord injuries its like something you acquire throughout the course of you life, so I identify it as my injury, I know its classified as a disability, and I’m not saying that people can’t say it’s a disability or anything like that, because it doesn’t bother me right. And so, when people ask like “Well aren’t you mad?” or “Aren’t people with disabilities mad, angry at life and this and that?” I’m like “Alright buddy,” people think that, they think they were dealt an unfair hand in life. I say it was such a po, I mean, if I had the choice being on my feet or not, yeah I’d be walking, just the opportunities I’ve been given, and the people I’ve met that I’ve mentioned have been just so incredible over the past 18 years. How can you say its been disabled? So, when people say are you mad, or aren’t people with disabilities angry at life, if you were an angry person before an injury or disability than you will probably be the same after. You are who you are right? And, yeah I’ve had my challenges of trying to figure out, especially when all of my friends were going away to college I was going to Delta. I had a challenging time of trying to figure out like “Man this Is kind of scary now, its getting real,” Your so busy in high school and everything that its you don’t really pay attention, I mean you just always go, go, go. And then when things maybe start to slow down, and you have to kind of choose a direction, what’s that direction you want to choose? I didn’t like the alternatives not going forward, and people are like, “Have you ever thought, considered a thought of committing suicide?” No, frankly it scares me, so no, I’m like, “That’s not in me,” what I mean? and so, the people who think that or, or, think its OK to go go shoot up a school, you see it in many different aspects of life not just disabilities, people’s attitudes are, I know this might sound cliché, but peoples attitudes are the biggest disabilities ? What people choose to do with their life is their choice, people don’t take enough accountability for themselves, responsibility for themselves, and its your own fault if you don’t make of yourself what you want to do in life. With me, I have this opportunity in my injury to get out and make something of it, and to go, achieve greatness (laughing). I mean kind of tongue and cheek, but there is a lot of seriousness to that ? And so, again it goes back to when I, when I get old and grey, or older and grey, then I don’t want to look back and say “ man I wish I did that, or gosh I’m ticked I didn’t do that, or make something of myself,” because its fun being here (laughing) ? And having life we don’t know what comes after. But, your still why not have fun while you’re here and take the most to seize every opportunity that you can, and and when you get to the end of say, “alright I did my best.” Page 11 �FAORO: I have a question more about like, now I know you said about your physical rehabilitation and your very obviously comfortable, but was it always that way? Or was there like a mental rehabilitation you kind of had to go through first? Like to get comfortable and get acceptance? LICHON: Yeah, absolutely, the same magazines that I said I wrote for, “paraplegic news and spokes in sports” I didn’t want anything to do with them when I got home from rehab in Grand Rapids, I thought they were the same thing I didn’t want to identify with, and now I end up writing for them and I have subscriptions to them for years. FAORO: Do you think it had to do with maturity to? as you got older, or just kind of you were young and it was just kind of a different mindset then. LICHON: Sure, yeah absolutely, yeah your 15 years old how mature are you really? We think we are but its just like so and I’ve always, I guess been told that I have a higher maturity level which I guess is maybe contributed to handling it the way I did when I was at Mary Freebed in Grand Rapids I had to see a social worker like starting out for a few weeks once or a couple of times. And she said to me, “Don’t you think that your taking this a little too well?” And that was the last appointment I had with her, because it ticked me off that she would ask such a thing, I’m like, “How could you take this too well?” There’s a difference between being what’s the word? like between oblivious to something or ignorance is one thing, I mean you could, ignorance you could learn and correct that. but denial I think is another thing, and I wasn’t denying because in the story I tell people and I’ll get to my struggle here in a minute but the story I tell people that I’ve kind of kept as my attitude throughout is that the next morning following my accident I woke up, tubes coming out of me everywhere, monitors up keeping track of my heartbeat, my mom and my dad and a nurse. And I’ve just gotten contact lenses and was having a heck of a time getting used to them and putting them in and everything. So, I woke up and there were like a lot of friends out in the lobby and my sister was out there and stuff. But there was just the 4 of us in the room and I started looking around and I felt that I could see clearly and I’m like looking at the monitors and like “this is kind of weird ” I was conscious throughout the entire night but I don’t remember it, they did all sorts of tests throughout the night to figure out what happened and stuff. but, so I knew what had happened, I kind of knew, OK, this sucks or something pretty serious had happened. That’s about all I needed to know at that particular point. To figure out that some things are going to have to start to change. So I’m looking around and its clear and I’m like, I’m looking at everybody my mom and dad, I just woke up and there just like, “Oh hey Jeff,” and I’m like, “Hey, are my contacts still in?” And they all just looked at each other like I was nuts. Whats this kid worrying about his contacts for? (Laughing) FAORO: My contacts (Laughing) LICHON: Yeah, because that, at 15 those are some of the things your, your worried about I guess right? so I always say to people, “My first thought was OK, what’s next? Life goes on and what’s next, what do I have to do here? There’s still things that I have to worry about besides figuring out what the next step is.” I didn’t know what would come next, I didn’t know I would have to start learning again how to get into a car and get dressed, and shower and all that stuff, but I guess I was going to find out . But at any Page 12 �rate, I mentioned earlier that at out of high school some of my friends stuck around and also went to Delta or FSU and some of my friends went away, and then after like the first year some of my other friends went away and I started figuring out I was going to have to make some choices . Be a big boy, get grown up and determine what the next however many years of my life were going to be. Or even the next day sort of thing. So, started kind of freaking me out, I’m like, “I’m not quite feeling myself here,” it’s a little scary I mean that’s intimidating for anybody to figure out what they want do, let alone someone at 15, 16, 17 or 18 who just has an injury like I had or some sort of disclosure. So, at that point I’m like, “OK I think I need to start maybe talking to somebody, and sorting through these things,” so I started going to counseling for, I don’t know a year and a half maybe, it started out once or twice a week or so, and basically all that amounted to or people say, “ Oh your seeing a shrink,” Ok that’s there perspective or attitude. But the thing was I needed to figure things out, and what that allowed me to do was to unravel what I had wound myself up into, through my 15, 16 years of life, and actually disconnect myself from qualities that I felt were not gonna be beneficial to me not just from a personal perspective but from my injury perspective, what I mean? so, I mean there were a lot of things I found like the more negative I am the more tone I get in my legs the more stress I feel, and the more toll it takes and so the more I can figure out how to work around those moments or situations the better off I’m going to be in the long run. The more longevity I’ll be able to have because I think, a small part of me I think I have a self destructive personality in some (laughing), I like to have fun and party, get a little wild skiing or whatever stuff like that. Well but, at the same time your those things are going to be that much more detrimental to me if I were to get injured like I mentioned earlier, like if I injured my arms or my shoulder or whatever. And so, same thing mentally is that I had to kind of deconstruct myself a bit and not only did I relearn physical things like getting dressed and showering etc. but I also started to have to relearn myself, and why do I behave certain ways? maybe I’m upset or angry about my parents being divorced when I was in the 8th grade ? Well, OK, let go of that. Or maybe I’m angry because my friend didn’t let me sit shotgun (Laughing). Honestly, we store so much of that in our selves that we don’t even realize and I mean I literally no, I guess its not literally, but I pick myself apart to figure out what was going to be in my best interest to be as a person going forward, and so that was one of the most helpful and transformational periods in my life . I didn’t like start going to the top of the hill screaming hallelujah or anything like that or become like, I was born and raised Catholic and stuff I have very deep values and faith and what not and definitely there’s the aspect I feel that God helped me through a lot of the stuff but it wasn’t that fanatical. FAORO: You didn’t like see the light; you kind of had to way your way through it. LICHON: Yeah, I think we all have to help ourselves here and still like I mentioned have that accountability and responsibility for yourself, and I just wish that a lot more people could go through, go through that who maybe were heading or are heading in a direction that they may not want to see themselves going things like that, so yeah so it was definitely that was the most challenging mentally, but it was the best I think thing for me to go through because I was able to, it was like a rebirth in a lot of ways, and yeah so now as they say “the rest is history,” I mean I still now have, I mean I’m still the same person I was then, I just like I said I changed a lot of things about the way I act, react or how I Page 13 �respond to things or different situations and stuff like that. Which, I still get ticked off if I have a hard day at work (Laughing). FAORO: Yeah, like anyone. LICHON: Yeah my boss is so, getting on my case and stuff (Laughing). Sorry Eli (Laughing), no I challenge back (Laughing) but I choose my battles more now than I probably would have what I mean? So, yeah, I think a lot of where I am now is just kind of a testament to that period that I went through ? so, RYTLEWSKI: It really seems like with this injury it really hasn’t limited you at all, I mean not at all, I mean you still do things, your kind of like proving to people that look you has a disability. LICHON: I do things the way I have to do them, which are different from the way Mike does them, or you do them, or you do them, I mean I play hockey sled hockey. RYTLEWSKI: I want to play that sometime. LICHON: Dude, you have to come out its awesome, I’m trying to get a team together. RYTLEWSKI: I gotta do it sometime, you told me about it. LICHON: Yeah, they have a sled there so, I have my own hockey sled I have my own hand cycle, so I still go biking, I’m working on getting my own down hill sit ski for snow, and like I mentioned I’m going water skiing in a week, in a week from today because I want to get my own water ski, so I’ll have my own equipment so that when I go up with friends I don’t have to depend on an adaptive sports association, which is who I learned to ski with Michigan Adaptive Sports, I won’t have to depend on the weekends and the places that they go, I can go with friends now, skiing places, I can go water skiing when my friends get boats (Laughing). Or when I get one but things like that and I guess the hunting and fishing thing there’s still like my nber one passion there, and with hunting its water, and that’s kind of the hardest thing to do your going out in the marsh, your going out in a cut corn field, or your taking boats with lots of equipment, your setting decoys you’ve got your retriever with you, not your buddy your dog (Laughing) and things like that so I mean your pulling the canoe off your truck or off your trailer. I had a jet ski and I managed that completely by myself independently while I had it. loved it (Laughing) I miss it so much! I want it back (Laughing) and things like that so but I think when I get a house I’ll be able to get everything set up. Right now I have a condo, and its difficult like I want a dog so bad, we grew up with female black labs and that’s exactly what I’m going to get, but I’m not going to get it at a condo. Why did I get a condo? Well I came back from D.C. and I was starting a new position, I wanted I’ve been renting for ten and I wanted to not have to worry about exterior and keeping up with the lawn and stuff because I’m pretty meticulous like, I guess I’m anal about that stuff ? Its like, so I didn’t want to necessarily want to focus on that stuff, I had enough challenges but I want to get a house eventually. get my female black lab and then I’ll start acculating more stuff and all my hunting and fishing trust me I’ve thought through a lot of it already too. I need a pulley system to store boats up canoes and stuff like that up in the ceiling of the pull barn or in the garage, tie it to the wall and lower it down things like that. So, I’ve thought through a lot and now a lot more equipment is Page 14 �coming like I want to get an Argo, which is a six or eight wheel all-terrain but they are completely hand controlled. The thing is though the one I’m looking at is like $23,000 (Laughing) outfitted. RYTLEWSKI: Oh boy. LICHON: But, somewhere down the road but then like a lot more equipment like lawn mowers, riding lawn mowers are hand controlled now. I cut my dads grass with his Exmark, hop on that and go buzz around. It’s a feeling of freedom still being on a four-wheeler; I’ve had that since ‘97. I keep it up at my dads because he has a pull barn and lives out on the base so I can go out riding around there and stuff. But, I’ll have to figure all of that out myself eventually. (Ring) FAORO: Well we hit the hour mark at least. LICHON: So who do you have to turn this into now? RYTLEWSKI: Well we have to type it up and give it to our teacher. LICHON: Good luck with that, I was all over the place. FAORO: We do 20 minutes each, so we will break it up. RYTLEWSKI: We get to talk about you to the entire class. FAORO: Yeah LICHON: Sweet FAORO: Well we will be nice LICHON: Should I come in at the end with like a superman cape on or something (Laughing) Your gonna blow me up that big or something or Dahli Llama outfit or something (Laughing). RYTLEWSKI: You hungry? VALLENTINE: Some food LICHON: You want to eat, grab some grub, yeah I mean anymore questions or anything that comes up just I’ll give you my cell if you need to clarify or something. FAORO, VALLENTINE, and RYTLEWSKI: Thank you for doing all of this LICHON: No problem RYTLEWSKI: I’m going to come play hockey with you sometime, all right? LICHON: Yeah, there you go. END OF INTERVIEW Page 15 � https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/61583fa63500093ada3dbcd8f2d47c3a.mp3 a0f7107fd8c92cd698c24a5631501254 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral Histories Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History Personal narratives Oral histories African Americans--Personal narratives Gays--Personal narratives Lesbians--Personal narratives Bisexual people--Personal narratives Transgender people--Personal narratives Veterans--Personal narratives Women--Personal narratives People with disabilities--Personal narratives Muslims--United States--Personal narratives Hispanic Americans--Personal narratives Homophobia Discrimination Islamophobia Stereotypes (Social psychology)--Upper Penninsula (Mich.) Description An account of the resource Collection of oral history recordings documenting the history of civil rights and social justice advocacy in Western Michigan. The collection was created by faculty and students as a project of the LIB 201 (formerly US 201): "Diversity in the U.S." course from 2011-2012. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Grand Valley State University. Brooks College of Interdisciplinary Studies Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project (GV248-01) Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-05-02 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01 Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1930-2011 Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context GV248-01_Lichon_Jeff Title A name given to the resource Jeff Lichon audio interview and transcript Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Lichon, Jeff Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Faoro, Grace Holtrop, Cody Rytlewski, Eli Vallentine, Michael Description An account of the resource Jeff Lichon was born and raised in West Michigan. He discusses his struggles with disability after being in a car accident at age 15. Subject The topic of the resource Civil rights--Michigan--History People with disabilities--Personal narratives Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/vocab/InC/1.0/">In Copyright</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Text Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 application/pdf Relation A related resource Speaking Out: Western Michigan Civil Rights Oral History Project Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2012-03-03 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7abee621c61a14441d78e24eca676909.jpg 78d3c2cf0a3c2a72ef828af651dfbbf9 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/511606409b3e5ff2c6bdc0cf38c2e320.jpg 81c9958133fe77ef5fc49120bc04c638 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Civil War and Slavery Collection Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 Slavery--United States African Americans United States--Politics and government--19th century Description An account of the resource A selection of correspondence, diaries, official documents, photographs related to the American Civil War and to the institution of slavery, collected by Harvey E. Lemmen. The collection includes a selection of documents from ten states related to the ownership of slaves and abolition, correspondence and documents of soldiers who fought in the war and from family members and officials, diaries and letters of individuals, and a collection of mailing envelopes decorated with patriotic imagery. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Lemmen, Harvey E. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/472">Civil War and Slavery Collection (RHC-45)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/470">John Bennitt Diaries and Correspondence (RHC-43)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/471">Nathan Sargent Papers (RHC-44)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/478">Theodore Peticolas Diary (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/476">Civil War Patriotic Envelopes Collection (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/479">Whitely Read Diary (RHC-52)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1804-1897 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg; application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Image; Text Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1804-1897 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Jeff the dictator Description An account of the resource Design shows rope in a figure-8 with Jefferson Davis the Dictator "As he is" in uniform with skull and crossbones flag and "As he should be--Jeff the Dig-tater-er" hoeing potatoes in the hot sun with a well-dressed black man standing over him. D. Murphy's Son, Print. 65 Fulton & 372 Pearl Sts. N.Y. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-49_PE019 Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 Postal service--United States--History Covers (Philatety)--United States--History Patriotic envelopes Davis, Jefferson, 1808-1889 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/476">Civil War patriotic envelopes, (RHC-49)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/14f8dc5c3842ddadab7ad16227a16b73.jpg b9cc52659c4351550b00e6de9d2448c9 https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/56d77a516059a42848fd2f9fe9319e48.jpg d49fbfd70e6a383a15d43fa9b44e8e05 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Civil War and Slavery Collection Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 Slavery--United States African Americans United States--Politics and government--19th century Description An account of the resource A selection of correspondence, diaries, official documents, photographs related to the American Civil War and to the institution of slavery, collected by Harvey E. Lemmen. The collection includes a selection of documents from ten states related to the ownership of slaves and abolition, correspondence and documents of soldiers who fought in the war and from family members and officials, diaries and letters of individuals, and a collection of mailing envelopes decorated with patriotic imagery. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Lemmen, Harvey E. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/472">Civil War and Slavery Collection (RHC-45)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/470">John Bennitt Diaries and Correspondence (RHC-43)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/471">Nathan Sargent Papers (RHC-44)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/478">Theodore Peticolas Diary (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/476">Civil War Patriotic Envelopes Collection (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/479">Whitely Read Diary (RHC-52)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1804-1897 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg; application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Image; Text Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1804-1897 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Jefferson Davis stamp Description An account of the resource Confederate cover with Jefferson Davis stamp. Envelope is address, stamped and cancelled. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-49_PE149 Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Type The nature or genre of the resource Image Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 Postal service--United States--History Covers (Philatety)--United States--History Patriotic envelopes Davis, Jefferson, 1808-1889 Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/476">Civil War patriotic envelopes, (RHC-49)</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpeg Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/e546363cafb3926455df381ed6db9765.pdf 90f7e1eb865b9de24249f693b72d14d9 PDF Text Text �� https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/7860aa962174e78da31864e838e3c058.pdf e40be6b7bc13ae9405efd8c184c51ca4 PDF Text Text Forwarded by the Adams Express Company. Harper’s Ferry, Va. Soldier’s Package. Said to Contain, $30.00 For Mr. Smith, D, Godfrey Sent By Jefferson H. Godfrey 6 Mich Cavl Lowell, Kent Co Michigan �Consignees will please open this package on the end, so as to preserve all the seals, and observe whether they are in good order. [?] of Adams Express Company are instructed not ot forward this package without its being sealed as directed. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Civil War and Slavery Collection Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 Slavery--United States African Americans United States--Politics and government--19th century Description An account of the resource A selection of correspondence, diaries, official documents, photographs related to the American Civil War and to the institution of slavery, collected by Harvey E. Lemmen. The collection includes a selection of documents from ten states related to the ownership of slaves and abolition, correspondence and documents of soldiers who fought in the war and from family members and officials, diaries and letters of individuals, and a collection of mailing envelopes decorated with patriotic imagery. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Lemmen, Harvey E. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/472">Civil War and Slavery Collection (RHC-45)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/470">John Bennitt Diaries and Correspondence (RHC-43)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/471">Nathan Sargent Papers (RHC-44)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/478">Theodore Peticolas Diary (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/476">Civil War Patriotic Envelopes Collection (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/479">Whitely Read Diary (RHC-52)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1804-1897 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg; application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Image; Text Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1804-1897 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-45_CW1-4852-1 Title A name given to the resource Jefferson H. Godfrey correspondence Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1862 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Godfrey, Jefferson H. Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 United States. Army. Michigan Cavalry Regiment, 6th (1862-1865) Description An account of the resource Correspondence from Jefferson H. Godfrey, company M of the 6th Michigan Cavalry to his family, 1862 Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Civil War and slavery collection (RHC-45): http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/472 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/09bd8dfcdb892c74e6577a9573d4a1e7.pdf fc1b9c85de4296d8de727f7c63c03172 PDF Text Text ���� https://digitalcollections.library.gvsu.edu/files/original/96d03d18287032738e58685c574c8477.pdf caf8f5502cbf3d60f60c114fe3656654 PDF Text Text March the 21 62 Dear Mother, As I hav a fre mints[minutes] to spar I will ancer you leter I got yeter I was glad to hear that you was well but was vary sary to hear that Pa was afaid that I had gamble my mony away I thot he no me beter than that it mad me feail vary bad to I can tel him how the boys in the 25 Com to send so much home tha dad not git thar bonty before the left tel him that I hav ben musterd for pa I think that whe shel get it before long I will send him no more if he want it I haf to ceap som omny with me I shal new[?] all I can spar for I no that he neades it tel Pa to not wart for I shel sav al of myy mony I will stop ritin a bout that for it sean that he was vary harsh with me I will tell you whar I am I am in marlin at rockwil about 18 mils from Washing whe ar [?] whe hetch[?] thre that had a bout six thouas dolers with them tha was rebels that thot to by som clothing for the rebel [?] I hav ben vary helty sean I nlist i hav ben able to do duty evry day last weak I rod 40 mils won day whe hav sent nin rebels to Washing to Jail the rest of our rigment is after old sturt [J.E.B. Stuart] tha hav got him [?] i hop that tha will ketch himthe boys stool by thar horses all won nit about thre o clock in the morna [?] old sturt ran by 2 gey[?] that tha will ketch him when you rit a gain tel me whar Eliyva[?] is and whar she is a gont stay if she is thar tel hear to rit to me tel [?] that I will [?] To hear [?] drow my leter to a close for this[?] rit often and I will direct to Washing [?] and it will com to me so God by [?] � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Civil War and Slavery Collection Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 Slavery--United States African Americans United States--Politics and government--19th century Description An account of the resource A selection of correspondence, diaries, official documents, photographs related to the American Civil War and to the institution of slavery, collected by Harvey E. Lemmen. The collection includes a selection of documents from ten states related to the ownership of slaves and abolition, correspondence and documents of soldiers who fought in the war and from family members and officials, diaries and letters of individuals, and a collection of mailing envelopes decorated with patriotic imagery. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Lemmen, Harvey E. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived <a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/472">Civil War and Slavery Collection (RHC-45)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/470">John Bennitt Diaries and Correspondence (RHC-43)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/471">Nathan Sargent Papers (RHC-44)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/478">Theodore Peticolas Diary (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/476">Civil War Patriotic Envelopes Collection (RHC-51)<br /></a><a href="https://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/479">Whitely Read Diary (RHC-52)</a> Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Special Collections & University Archives Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1804-1897 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource image/jpg; application/pdf Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Image; Text Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1804-1897 Text A resource consisting primarily of words for reading. Examples include books, letters, dissertations, poems, newspapers, articles, archives of mailing lists. Note that facsimiles or images of texts are still of the genre Text. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context RHC-45_CW1-4852-2 Title A name given to the resource Jefferson H. Godfrey correspondence Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1862-01-09 Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Godfrey, Jefferson H. Subject The topic of the resource United States--History--Civil War, 1861-1865 United States. Army. Michigan Cavalry Regiment, 6th (1862-1865) Description An account of the resource Correspondence from Jefferson H. Godfrey, company M of the 6th Michigan Cavalry to his family, 1862 Language A language of the resource eng Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource <a href="http://rightsstatements.org/page/NoC-US/1.0/?language=en">No Copyright - United States</a> Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived Civil War and slavery collection (RHC-45): http://gvsu.lyrasistechnology.org/repositories/2/resources/472 Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Grand Valley State University. University Libraries. Lemmen Library and Archives